| IVOD_ID |
166161 |
| IVOD_URL |
https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/166161 |
| 日期 |
2025-12-03 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼 |
委員會-11-4-15-14 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼:str |
第11屆第4會期內政委員會第14次全體委員會議 |
| 會議資料.屆 |
11 |
| 會議資料.會期 |
4 |
| 會議資料.會次 |
14 |
| 會議資料.種類 |
委員會 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼[0] |
15 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼:str[0] |
內政委員會 |
| 會議資料.標題 |
第11屆第4會期內政委員會第14次全體委員會議 |
| 影片種類 |
Clip |
| 開始時間 |
2025-12-03T11:55:34+08:00 |
| 結束時間 |
2025-12-03T12:03:01+08:00 |
| 影片長度 |
00:07:27 |
| 支援功能[0] |
ai-transcript |
| video_url |
https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/d5a4ce084af309d643d5d692d72a1ebcc7cefddca96be5007a6b5dab7889431066bd7c4c758768765ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8 |
| 委員名稱 |
李坤城 |
| 委員發言時間 |
11:55:34 - 12:03:01 |
| 會議時間 |
2025-12-03T09:00:00+08:00 |
| 會議名稱 |
立法院第11屆第4會期內政委員會第14次全體委員會議（事由：一、行政院函請審議「詐欺犯罪危害防制條例部分條文修正草案」案。二、繼續審查委員王定宇等18人擬具「詐欺犯罪危害防制條例第五十四條條文修正草案」案。三、繼續審查委員廖先翔等18人擬具「詐欺犯罪危害防制條例第四十三條條文修正草案」案。四、繼續審查委員張宏陸等30人擬具「詐欺犯罪危害防制條例第四十七條條文修正草案」案。五、繼續審查委員林宜瑾等27人擬具「詐欺犯罪危害防制條例第四十七條條文修正草案」案。六、繼續審查委員王義川等16人擬具「詐欺犯罪危害防制條例第四十七條條文修正草案」案。七、繼續審查委員陳素月等18人擬具「詐欺犯罪危害防制條例第四十七條條文修正草案」案。八、審查台灣民眾黨黨團擬具「詐欺犯罪危害防制條例第四十六條及第四十七條條文修正草案」案。九、審查委員王美惠等18人擬具「詐欺犯罪危害防制條例第四十七條條文修正草案」案。十、審查委員蘇巧慧等22人擬具「詐欺犯罪危害防制條例第四十六條及第四十七條條文修正草案」案。十一、審查委員黃捷等21人擬具「詐欺犯罪危害防制條例第四十六條及第四十七條條文修正草案」案。十二、審查委員李柏毅等16人擬具「詐欺犯罪危害防制條例第四十六條及第四十七條條文修正草案」案。十三、審查委員李坤城等20人擬具「詐欺犯罪危害防制條例第四十七條條文修正草案」案。十四、審查委員翁曉玲等25人擬具「詐欺犯罪危害防制條例第四十三條及第四十四條條文修正草案」案。十五、審查委員翁曉玲等24人擬具「詐欺犯罪危害防制條例第四十六條及第四十七條條文修正草案」案。十六、審查委員吳沛憶等17人擬具「詐欺犯罪危害防制條例第四十三條條文修正草案」案。十七、審查委員賴瑞隆等17人擬具「詐欺犯罪危害防制條例部分條文修正草案」案。十八、審查委員李坤城等23人擬具「詐欺犯罪危害防制條例部分條文修正草案」案。十九、審查委員羅智強等19人擬具「詐欺犯罪危害防制條例第四十六條及第四十七條條文修正草案」案。二十、審查委員洪孟楷等17人擬具「詐欺犯罪危害防制條例第四十三條條文修正草案」案。二十一、審查委員黃捷等16人擬具「詐欺犯罪危害防制條例第三十一條、第三十一條之一及第四十條條文修正草案」案。【第一案、第十七案至第十九案如經復議則不予審查；第二十案至第二十一案如未經各黨團簽署不復議同意書則不予審查。】
【12月3日及4日二天一次會】） |
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| transcript.whisperx[0].start |
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謝謝主席我們先請這個法務部的政務次長徐次長加政務次長委員好來 次長好今天我們要來審查這個詐欺犯罪危害防治條例部分條文的修正草案那本席也有提案然後在第43條的部分就是說我將提高高額詐欺的刑責 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].start |
33.235 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].end |
52.75 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].text |
將要件從詐欺獲取之財物或財產上的利益修正為使人交付之財物或財產上的利益擴大本罪的適用範圍這個在你們說明的第22頁裡面目前法務部的態度如何 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].start |
58.632 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].end |
75.889 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].text |
目前跟委員所提出來的版本那委員是一百萬然後一千萬跟一億成績化是這樣那跟我們現在願版出來的是一樣的所以我們就是希望說本來是說那個獲取 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].start |
78.184 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].end |
107.101 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].text |
財務上的或是利益上的利益嘛我們把它擴大成交付嘛對要放在被害人那一端不可以在行為人這一端行為人這一端就有解釋的空間但是被害人交付是一個客觀的比較精確的事實所以會比較準一點好那這方面應該是沒有應該是有構思的謝謝委員支持好那不過現在我就要問一個就是說因為我看這兩天新聞都有在討論的就是一位 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].start |
108.015 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].end |
119.095 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].text |
台北市一個清潔隊員他撿到一個一個丟棄的電鍋然後就轉送給一個死荒的婦人然後遭遇貪污自罪條例起訴那當然 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].start |
120.47 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].end |
142.722 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].text |
士林地方法院12月2號宣判那處這一位親協隊員三個月的徒刑緩刑兩年此多公權一年這其實對我們來講就是說因為他是善意好心然後也是一個廢棄的一個電鍋也不是具有很大的一個價值那針對這件事情法務部強調說 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].start |
143.837 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].end |
161.729 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].text |
小兒貪污案的修法在2024年已經呈報行政院審查將配合相關修法事宜推動修法那我請教一下法務部目前的這個修法的這個狀況包委員現在在行政院審查中那你們所提出來的重要的內容在哪裡 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].start |
162.731 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].end |
175.161 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].text |
最主要是以前是減輕畸形現在可以免除畸形就是說它的會減到三分之二不過這個這樣的行為還是要就是有緩行的機會來 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].start |
178.118 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].end |
202.069 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].text |
這個其實我們的法院也是做了很多的處理它是在貪污治罪條例第六條第一項第三款最輕本刑五年以下有期徒刑的這個框架之下運用多項減刑規定達到一個極限的操作其實可見法官也知道第一個它的財產的價值極低定過殘存才32.56塊 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].start |
204.34 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].end |
231.832 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].text |
動機單純然後比例原則的權衡因為它過去都是非常清白的然後如果它只是因為這樣子轉送了一個價值32.56塊的這個老舊的電鍋會判處五年以上的有期徒刑違反罪行相當原則那這個情節輕微與社會的通念那這個跟法院我們的判決也強調說情節輕微與否應與一般社會通念審酌 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].start |
233.325 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].end |
246.54 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].text |
那所以說這個才會有說你們自己也發現到了這個問題所以你們才會從這一個貪污治罪條例裡面你們針對這個小額貪污的這部分有做出了一個處理吧能不能請次長再說得更清楚一點謝謝委員我想 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].start |
251.226 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].end |
273.038 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].text |
就是因為其實這個貪污之類條例我們訴貪這是本部還是堅持的一個立場當然訴貪大家都支持所以我們在審酌這些事情當然就會非常的謹慎那當然就會有時候會遇到這種情形法重的時候那我們才會想到說我們在貪污之類條例第12條我們就試著把它修改成如果是極輕微的這個案子我們應該可以 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].start |
279.461 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].end |
305.5 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].text |
减轻或免除骑行如果符合相关的条件的话最多可以减到三分之二那法院也可以因为个案的可以免除骑行的判决所以这个对于那种情境法重的情况之下就可以适用那因为这个是地方法院的判决吧那如果说法务部的这一个这个修正案通过的话应该也没办法回溯适用到这一位清洁队员吧 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].start |
309.038 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].end |
329.743 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].text |
對被告有利的話可以適用但是如果確定就沒有了因為現在地方法院啊可以回溯嗎不行不是我說案子如果沒有確定法律修改的話就上訴的話就有可能就有機會對就有機會那所以說因為現在是地方法院嘛對對啊所以他可以可以可以到這個高等法院嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].start |
330.848 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].end |
356.952 |
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這個案子可以 他的刑度是可以就是說他的本刑是可以的那所以就是說我第一個強調的是比例原則啦大貪那跟這一個我們所講的這一個情節比較輕微的這個小兒貪污那第二個就是你講到就是說我們要避免這一個情輕法重的一個荒謬的一個現象那當然我們也要注意就是說這一個 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].start |
357.887 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].end |
385.412 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].text |
要明确去区分违俄的善意的行为跟实质贪污那贪污我们当然就是要研办但是呢我们也不要让人家觉得说好像是违俄的贪污除罪化这也要避免那就是说你怎么可以让这个违俄贪污除罪化就是说这个的界限大家要分清楚有关于贪污这部分的话那当然一定要法办要研办但是像这一种 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].start |
386.721 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].end |
408.706 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].text |
這個清潔隊員他本身是基於善意他死荒老人他覺得說那如果有個電鍋可以讓他吃點比較溫熱的東西的話他就轉贈給他價值也很低三十幾塊那結果你就這個我們用這一個貪污治罪條例最輕就五年那這樣顯見不合理嘛那所以這個案子你說送到這個行政院那這個進度勒 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].start |
413.427 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].end |
434.983 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].text |
我們8月15號最後一次審查完卷就等行政院院會如果通過的話就可以送過來我是覺得剛好利用這個機會來審視就是說你們所提出來這一個修改的這個法案比方說因為這件事情因為就我們常人來講的話這個不是一個最大惡極的一個貪污 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].start |
436.415 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].end |
446.442 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].text |
但是用到這個貪污治罪條例五年的處刑其實是過重了但是也要避免就是說好像這個違行的貪污我們把他處罪的話也不是這個用意不可以這樣謝謝 |