| IVOD_ID |
166152 |
| IVOD_URL |
https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/166152 |
| 日期 |
2025-12-03 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼 |
委員會-11-4-35-20 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼:str |
第11屆第4會期外交及國防委員會第20次全體委員會議 |
| 會議資料.屆 |
11 |
| 會議資料.會期 |
4 |
| 會議資料.會次 |
20 |
| 會議資料.種類 |
委員會 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼[0] |
35 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼:str[0] |
外交及國防委員會 |
| 會議資料.標題 |
第11屆第4會期外交及國防委員會第20次全體委員會議 |
| 影片種類 |
Clip |
| 開始時間 |
2025-12-03T12:05:34+08:00 |
| 結束時間 |
2025-12-03T12:13:51+08:00 |
| 影片長度 |
00:08:17 |
| 支援功能[0] |
ai-transcript |
| video_url |
https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/d5a4ce084af309d6fbef3c036d1593ca82f8c8e0c6b9e8ae7a6b5dab78894310ab3cf16057514ebe5ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8 |
| 委員名稱 |
洪孟楷 |
| 委員發言時間 |
12:05:34 - 12:13:51 |
| 會議時間 |
2025-12-03T09:00:00+08:00 |
| 會議名稱 |
立法院第11屆第4會期外交及國防委員會第20次全體委員會議（事由：邀請外交部部長林佳龍、國家安全局局長蔡明彥報告「美中領導人再次電話通聯後對國際秩序及區域情勢之發展」，並備質詢。） |
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SPEAKER_01 |
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SPEAKER_01 |
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SPEAKER_02 |
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| transcript.whisperx[0].start |
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| transcript.whisperx[0].text |
主席謝謝 麻煩請外交部林部長跟我們國安局副局長國安局副局長 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].start |
11.176 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].end |
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| transcript.whisperx[1].text |
部長好 副局長好 部長身為中華民國一份子對外我們一定是以中華民國的主權為最高優先國內我們可以有政黨競爭 政黨合作但國外一定我們對外都是以中華民國我想不管是執政黨 不管是在野黨都是一樣的方向 對吧 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].start |
33.451 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].end |
57.581 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].text |
不管是我們今天的專案報告有講說美中領導人或者是說最近不管是高市早苗首相他的一些談話等等的部分其實也都讓外界更關注中華民國未來的一個發展那我們真的不希望說台灣未來在美中台三角關係裡面變成是一個被測試或被試驗的一個方向所以我先請教一下國安局 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].start |
59.144 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].end |
75.246 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].text |
管局今天有提到你的報告我也特別看了一下在美中兩大強權的領導人他們的一個對話會談完之後其實有講到一個後續的發展就是明年四月川普總統承諾是說他會再回訪北京 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].start |
75.868 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].end |
95.064 |
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那以及外界大家也看明年2026年有兩次重大的國際會議有可能兩位總統領導人以及其他各國元首都會在碰面所以外界就推估如果以合理的判斷來講的話也許明年會有三次美中兩大強權領導人會在碰面 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].start |
95.825 |
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115.796 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].text |
那我們針對到明年至少最近的一個半年的左右時間明年四月以前這樣子的一個密集見面對於中華民國到底是更加安全還是更加危險跟國連報告我想美中的領導人密切的見面事實上我們看到他們是在管控爭議事實上 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].start |
117.398 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].end |
137.578 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].text |
我們的判斷是在管控爭議但是他的競爭本質事實上是難解尤其在地域的一個區域安全還有相關的一個關鍵稀土礦產這樣的一個競合下事實上各自都看到在減輕對方的依賴所以說這個戰略的本質事實上是 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].start |
139.4 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].end |
151.385 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].text |
他的立場是不一樣的但是風險管控是要做的避免誤判所以美中兩國領導人密集的互動事實上對於我們認為這是一個比較有助於穩定的一個現象 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].start |
154.787 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].end |
168.669 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].text |
所以對於我們中華民國的主權也好或者是我們2350萬人的安全來講其實相對會安全因為美國政府從川普總統也好或者是他們 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].start |
170.291 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].end |
196.233 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].text |
國務院相關的一個官員都表達對台的一個立場跟支持是不變的而且關切台海的一個核穩所以這個部分來講美國目前那個立場府會還有那個行政部門事實上對台海核穩這個立場是相當堅定好 所以我們國安局的你們也有做過研判就認為是說如果明年有那麼密集的他們的會面的話其實對台灣來講是相對來講是安全 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].start |
198.375 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].end |
216.424 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].text |
這是你們的研判我們認為對於兩國之間的一個穩定是有幫助但是會不會這樣子反而更加深了台灣變成是他們談判過程之中有可能被操弄的議題而導致於我們未來的走向不是由2350萬人決定而是由美中兩大強權來決定 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].start |
218.326 |
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237.044 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].text |
這個部分目前我們看起來美國我剛剛跟委員報告了他們不管是聲稱或者行動我們看起來都朝向就是台海而聞的立場所以就這部分後續的美中的一個互動跟觀察我們本局還會持續在做掌握好 但是本時要先提醒 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].start |
237.745 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].end |
259.497 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].text |
不管美中兩大強權他們要怎麼見面怎麼談但是我們的聲音跟意見絕對不能忽視而且台灣從過去到現在大家講台灣未來的走向發展一定是由台灣2350萬人共同來決議這是無庸置疑來 那外交部長林部長本席今天白日滿地紅 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].start |
260.94 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].end |
284.922 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].text |
11月的時候也跟我們江副院長還有我們幾位包括外交部優秀的同仁也都有前往我們的前往美國以及我們到我們的友邦巴拉圭來做一個訪問國會外交三天的一個成果可說非常的豐碩因為跟他們的總統以及參眾議院議長以及國會議員都有做密切的交流那我想請教一下在過去我們也看到 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].start |
286.189 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].end |
297.354 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].text |
巴拉圭的這個總統他就自己有講過說賴清德總統會前往巴拉圭那到目前今年已經快要年底了到底賴清德總統有沒有相關的出訪計畫 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].start |
300.019 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].end |
326.776 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].text |
目前並沒有定案什麼樣出訪的計畫但是一切我們都在評估規劃林佳龍部長帶團前往巴拉圭的時候巴拉圭的總統是有在他的社群媒體平台上面講嘛那我講說我還是再次強調對外我們都是一致中華民國所以如果說我們友邦的總統居然有發布說我們賴清德總統要前往出訪但是到八月到現在已經 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].start |
327.256 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].end |
334.751 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].text |
快半年的時間了今年就要過完了那到底賴清德總統沒有辦法出訪的理由是我們沒有要過去 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].start |
335.88 |
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358.545 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].text |
還是我們想過去但是中間有環節出了問題還是過境美國的時候我們沒有辦法接受出訪都涉及到各方包括我們跟邦交國或過境那也涉及到當地國的包括內政外交所以我是覺得很多的評估規劃是一定要進行可是到決定 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].start |
359.385 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].end |
378.193 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].text |
評估規劃有沒有包含要宣布才算是成立嘛總統府他們一向都會有針對出訪的事情在適當時候會對外宣布我們的評估規劃有沒有包含美中兩大強權的領導人明年四月可能會再見面 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].start |
380.795 |
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397.795 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].text |
這個已經是公開他們川普總統也講了我們當然會把他納入未來在外交上面的一個重要的因素所以因為他們兩大領導人明年可能會有三次的碰面變成是我們要去我們的友邦還要看人家的臉色 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].start |
398.581 |
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426.556 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].text |
不只 我想關鍵是說我們跟我們友邦之間是適當的時機我想我們這次前往的時候因為我們是跨黨派的委員一起去所以我們也感受到我想大家都很期待包括台巴之間可以透過元首外交來深化關係嘛我們去訪問或他來訪問也都是選擇嘛這個都是雙邊在推動邦誼的時候的一個安排可能的方案這次我們前往是跨黨派的委員 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].start |
427.556 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].end |
451.746 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].text |
民進黨三位 國民黨三位 民眾黨一位效果非常好 而且真的引起鞏固邦交跟拓展邦誼起很大的貢獻也因此我們才會更想要確認的是外交部你們積極有在安排我們都是隨時我們對像我們這幾個邦交國的關係都是很緊密那適當的時機 如有出訪的安排緊密是您說的 我們也希望真的緊密 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].start |
452.506 |
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471.443 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].text |
那因為巴拉圭也是我們南美洲很重要的一個邦交對也是現在唯一的邦交那我們想請教另外聖露西亞這個邦交國到目前為止因為這兩天我相信也有媒體問到因為他們的執政黨又去勝選而且增加了國會的席次有沒有鬆動的可能我們目前掌握的狀況沒有 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].start |
472.924 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].end |
496.204 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].text |
我們跟聖路西亞的關係都很穩定中成長因為既有的這個現任的總理PA他這一次在國會的席次又增加跟我們邦誼鞏固好 我們還是希望對外一致中華民國立場所以在國內我們可能有政黨立場的不同但對外就是中華民國這點是我們一起努力的目標好 謝謝謝謝委員 謝謝 |