| IVOD_ID |
165238 |
| IVOD_URL |
https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/165238 |
| 日期 |
2025-11-12 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼 |
委員會-11-4-26-9 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼:str |
第11屆第4會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第9次全體委員會議 |
| 會議資料.屆 |
11 |
| 會議資料.會期 |
4 |
| 會議資料.會次 |
9 |
| 會議資料.種類 |
委員會 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼[0] |
26 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼:str[0] |
社會福利及衛生環境委員會 |
| 會議資料.標題 |
第11屆第4會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第9次全體委員會議 |
| 影片種類 |
Clip |
| 開始時間 |
2025-11-12T09:15:50+08:00 |
| 結束時間 |
2025-11-12T09:27:29+08:00 |
| 影片長度 |
00:11:39 |
| 支援功能[0] |
ai-transcript |
| video_url |
https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/a35f0de19abcdbe3d9f2366e0f6eee09b62a46119727b9b94cf7b889f21dc7b794876b56de8f8c9f5ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8 |
| 委員名稱 |
陳昭姿 |
| 委員發言時間 |
09:15:50 - 09:27:29 |
| 會議時間 |
2025-11-12T09:00:00+08:00 |
| 會議名稱 |
立法院第11屆第4會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第9次全體委員會議（事由：邀請勞動部部長列席報告業務概況，並備質詢。） |
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謝謝主席我想在質詢之前我想向服務本組的議事人員蔡豐如女士表達哀悼之意她在星期天過世我祝福她往生淨土 得享永恆安樂謝謝主席 那有請洪部長來 有請部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].start |
28.269 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].end |
46.072 |
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陳委員早部長早剛剛您的報告當中因為有提到薪資的部分那你念的平均薪資沒有念到中位數薪資你知道這兩個字數字向來差了將近一萬塊所以我主張我們在醫學上也都是用中位數來表達因為有些人極端的數字會影響這個判讀 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].start |
47.754 |
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67.494 |
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這讓大家民眾的感受會是比較靠近那第二個就是生育補助部分也是一樣當陳時中政委公佈的時候他說一胎十萬大家都一胎十萬好像可能會有感也不見得會有感可是事實上不是那您剛剛念的是對的只是說他是補助至十萬本來就有兩個月的補助津貼 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].start |
68.235 |
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82.359 |
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所以我覺得政府在做這個不管是你覺得福利式的或是說一個惠民式的一個措施的時候我覺得要講清楚因為誤解是更不好您剛剛是念對啦但是我是說政委在公布的時候不是這樣的標題都是十萬塊 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].start |
85.461 |
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103.541 |
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我想在當時在這個生育給付加上生育補助其實這個是好事啦我只是說有時候讓民眾的感覺要真實一點部長謝謝你那兩週前行政院通過勞動部的一個跨國勞動力精進方案那我今天想跟部長討論一下這個方案的執行 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].start |
104.702 |
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跨國勞動力的這個精進方案其中一個政策就是製造業每加薪一位2000元本勞2000元那就可以增加一位移工的這個名額那這項政策是希望同時能夠舒緩低薪還有缺工的一個問題出發點非常好但是這個執行細節上我覺得還是要小心恐怕有時候會有一些本末倒時問題請問部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].start |
128.314 |
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假如企業為了增加移工名額做了表面的加薪增加本薪2000元但原本的工作獎金或福利卻減少了或是取消了請問勞動部會允許嗎如果企業這麼做你還會同意給他新的移工名額嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].start |
145.54 |
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我想我們基本上我們就是希望企業能夠落實加薪尤其是我要強調這個是給相對低薪的本國勞工加薪我們知道那如果企業有相關的這些不誠實的規避的行為或者是就像說這個假加薪的這個狀況的話我想我們就會取消他的名額你們可以查核嗎你們有辦法查核嗎如何去認定可以嗎你們查核得到嗎我們通過勞保資料可以 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].start |
174.618 |
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你們如果說有辦法查核 那是最好的我們希望這是一個實質的 實質下薪那這個政策也提到增額的那個移工期滿續聘必須幫本國勞工再次的加薪如果要續聘 請問這個再次的加薪薪資是多少 有規定嗎其實一樣 也就是說 我跟委員說明 |
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199.555 |
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基本上比方說你如果幫10個本國勞工加薪2000塊你可以取得10個移工的名額但是在續聘的時候要維持這10個名額你還必須要再加薪一次就是一樣是10個本國勞工再加薪一次那才能夠保持這10個名額 |
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221.525 |
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現在很清楚 謝謝你那這個方案 跨國勞動力經濟方案還有另外一個政策是放寬外國技術人力的流用上限這應該是這個移工留才久用方案的一個延伸但是從2022年到現在移工團體認為這是失敗 為什麼呢因為本來是希望說資深移工那他可以升階到這個中階技術人才技術人力長期留在台灣但是三年半了 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].start |
247.944 |
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254.439 |
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部長 李耿澤生中間移工僅佔男女移工總數的百分比多少 您知道嗎目前5萬多人 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].start |
256.742 |
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282.01 |
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4.5%這5萬多人 這很少 也有4.5%那這個不到一成的轉換率那明顯應該無法達到這個流財的目標那過去也有一些移工因為他們要身為這個中階人力的時候需要繳交更高的仲介費而且部分仲介甚至趁此去哄抬那個收費所以部長對於這麼低的轉換率還有這個仲介可能從中剝削勞動部知道嗎你們怎麼處理這件事 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].start |
284.831 |
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300.1 |
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跟委員說明吼其實的確很多中小企業他的那個可能中小型的工廠他用的移工數比較少所以他們都來跟我們反映他們想要把他轉成中階技術人力已經到達那個原本25%的天花板了是 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].start |
301.004 |
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就是他們還想要再轉更多可是因為達到已經達到25%的天花板了所以就限制住他們能夠轉換的數字所以這是為什麼我們把它打開我們現在把這就是為什麼我們把這25%打開的原因 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].start |
316.129 |
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344.83 |
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那當然接下來針對仲介費因為現在國際上面都非常非常關注仲介費的這個問題我們會在整體的強迫勞動整體的來思考裡面包括我想這幾天大家也知道我們會做相關的法規的檢討裡面希望能夠更大程度的去面對這個事情我再請教你一個問題因為這個移工團一直訴求的廢除燃領移工工作的年限請問你們的想法是什麼有往這個方向去做的可能性嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].start |
345.27 |
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362.076 |
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其實的確現在我們為什麼在這次的方案裡面更加的重視這個外國技術人力其實很重要包括外國技術人力的權利因為透過外國技術人力的工作年限是沒有限制的那我們也希望把這個通道打得更開 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].start |
364.517 |
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384.444 |
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那部長 勞動部明年就是說要在菲律賓設置跨國勞動力延展中心那我就請教 這個是好事那我請教部長為什麼選擇菲律賓是基於什麼評估是原能力 人力供應 市場關係還是外交考量還有另外就是說在做選擇的時候有沒有跟其他的東南亞國家做一個比較麻煩部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].start |
388.081 |
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411.378 |
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第一個先謝謝委員的肯定那我們其實要設置延展中心其中一個很重要的目的其實就是希望能夠強化這個國對國的職併的能量大家期待很久那這也是我們很實質的作為那第一個當然也有考慮菲律賓目前跟我們的外交關係是很好的 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].start |
412.499 |
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也包括其實菲律賓也一直有來跟我們表達希望大家在人才上面能夠有更多的合作所以我們也在這個理由之下菲律賓現在是先做的選擇第一個選擇是菲律賓但是我們也在評估其他的選擇 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].start |
429.394 |
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441.903 |
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也不只縣 菲律賓我想請教這個延攬中心招募對象是中階技術人員還是一般的初階的藍營移工因為我看到預算書你們的目標是15000人那主要又放在哪些產業 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].start |
443.347 |
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467.241 |
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其實因為我們這次開放的旅宿業的技術人力跟三崗碼頭的技術人力其實他們會透過延展中心進來但是延展中心也會協助蘭嶺移工的職聘所以蘭嶺移工的職聘跟中階技術人力的這個相關的引進都會透過我們的延展中心來擴大協助的能量 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].start |
468.041 |
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部長您剛剛提到了好不容易聽到一個國對國的這個職聘那我還是在問請教如果他們進來後會有仲介介入嗎那在菲律賓會不會被收取這個仲介費我的意思說因為如果你要去設個海外延攬中心的話那我們應該要保護這個勞工在母國或在台灣都不要再有仲介業者穿梭其中不然就失去你在海外設立這個延攬中心的這個意義你有做過這個部分的考量嗎或是管理 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].start |
497.682 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].end |
517.855 |
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跟文說明的確現在我說國際上也非常非常關注這個仲介費相關的問題那我們會一步一步來做檢討那包括國外包括國內但是我想我們這一次的計劃的內容是很明確的我們往前跨了一步 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].start |
518.996 |
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531.765 |
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部長因為要聽到您的一個勞動部長講出國對國的職聘是不容易的那我還是請教 之前問過你那個Giant巨大他被指控強迫勞動也被美國發出這個戰扣令請問目前的進度是什麼 有解除了嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].start |
533.138 |
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554.385 |
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還解除了嗎跟委員說明因為當然這個現在巨大公司也正在跟美國的CPP他們在做直接的討論還在努力直接討論就目前我們看到巨大公司也做出了改善的承諾我先確定一下就是說他是不是違反勞動的勞動法令還是另外一個我們剛剛你談到的仲介費問題這兩個都有嗎我先確認一下 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].start |
559.008 |
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575.75 |
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確實 因為勞動部去檢查說沒有啊沒有違反那個台中市勞工局去檢查說沒有那我就說勞動法令這是等一下我再跟你稍微討論一下仲介費因為本來就很容易被國外嘛歐美國家認為這個仲介費就是剝削勞工我想你現在也知情了嘛了解這樣的事情我不是現在才知情 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].start |
576.25 |
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596.749 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].text |
好謝謝你很久之前關心勞工就知道了那現在有自行車的大廠說台灣的法規這是天家雜誌報導移工可以自行因為我們的法規有明定移工可以自行負擔一定比例的仲介費保險啊這個裡面包括機票仲介費保險等等但是歐美期待是零付費所以我的意思是說排除那個一般的我們所謂勞檢這個不合格台灣的法規跟不上國際的要求因為我們允許 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].start |
601.733 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].end |
624.512 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].text |
所以企業界覺得他們按照台灣的法規去做可是會被可能在國際上會被懲罰所以這個問題就落在這個勞動部身上了他即使合規和我們勞檢但是他因為還有這個仲介費的部分跟我們說明我們第一個我們會先來做一個行動的指引來跟經濟部一起合作輔導企業但是我們同時也正進行法規的盤點 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].start |
625.993 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].end |
653.844 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].text |
那我們也會在輔導的同時來去檢討那這個法規跟國際要求上面之間是不是還存在著落差那是不是要來後續在什麼樣的期程之下來去思考要不要做檢討甚至改善謝謝您今天的那個回答因為您今天就是有談得很清楚你知道你先做指引但我們知道指引是行政行政的指引它是沒有約束力的那你剛剛有提到說在法規面你要盤點就是往法規面走 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].start |
654.304 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].end |
678.016 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].text |
這個方向是我們期待的會往法規面盤但的確因為台灣的中小企業比較多那所以其實我們也會需要考慮到不同規模之間的調適能力16家企業其實也被點名吧對所以我跟委員說因為台灣的企業的規模從大到小有很多所以也必須幫比較小型的企業去設想他可能需要的調適的能力 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].start |
678.756 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].end |
689.721 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].text |
據瞭解我隨便這樣 被扣要在總供應鏈有2.7兆2.7兆這麼多 所以部長這個腳步要快要用這樣的方式來 影響太大了好 謝謝部長 謝謝主席好 謝謝陳偉 謝謝部長 |