| IVOD_ID |
164016 |
| IVOD_URL |
https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/164016 |
| 日期 |
2025-10-13 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼 |
委員會-11-4-26-3 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼:str |
第11屆第4會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第3次全體委員會議 |
| 會議資料.屆 |
11 |
| 會議資料.會期 |
4 |
| 會議資料.會次 |
3 |
| 會議資料.種類 |
委員會 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼[0] |
26 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼:str[0] |
社會福利及衛生環境委員會 |
| 會議資料.標題 |
第11屆第4會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第3次全體委員會議 |
| 影片種類 |
Clip |
| 開始時間 |
2025-10-13T10:30:29+08:00 |
| 結束時間 |
2025-10-13T10:41:41+08:00 |
| 影片長度 |
00:11:12 |
| 支援功能[0] |
ai-transcript |
| video_url |
https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/5d6d14916e595edcc5e3a3e49a3f6c57eadaba87319979828b7b742ce678790014b82059455edac95ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8 |
| 委員名稱 |
邱鎮軍 |
| 委員發言時間 |
10:30:29 - 10:41:41 |
| 會議時間 |
2025-10-13T09:00:00+08:00 |
| 會議名稱 |
立法院第11屆第4會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第3次全體委員會議（事由：邀請衛生福利部部長及行政院食品安全辦公室就「重大食安事件處理之檢討與食安稽核人力不足問題」進行專題報告，並備質詢。） |
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| transcript.whisperx[0].start |
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主席好 我們請部長來 有請部長就委員好部長好 我看好幾位委員都非常重視這個案子那最近這起百味食品漂白豬大腸的案件你開罰了五千四百萬那民眾吃進去的可能是工業用雙氧水那我想請問一下這樣的案子算不算重大的食安事件 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].start |
30.271 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].end |
55.649 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].text |
跟委員報告這個目前在當然這個是我們不允許雖然說這個雙氧水算不算重大你只要回答是不是就好了以目前我們這個查驗到因為這個使用的普遍性很廣所以是大還是不大這是等於日常的這個大還是不大嘛所以我們很重視這件事情所以又啟動所有的專案那目前查起來呢那麼目前的 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].start |
57.971 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].end |
85.263 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].text |
在市面上的食品都還是符合這個大腸我問你它算不算重大的這個食安案件嘛你講那麼多我們很重視這個案子但是目前來講不算大就對了 這還不算大所有的食安都是重大這個是人民的健康這麼嚴重的事情怎麼會不大呢所有的食安我們來看都是一樣大那為什麼我們今天在專報裡面一個字都沒看到 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].start |
86.97 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].end |
106.29 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].text |
您的意思是你今天的兩份專報 食安辦這份報告雖然有寫跟沒寫差不多但是他們至少還有提那衛福部是一個字都沒有現在是工業用的化學品跑進食物裡面民眾吃下去會危害身體健康你們不用跟民眾說清楚嗎還是財閥單開完就好了 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].start |
107.631 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].end |
119.619 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].text |
沒有 所有的食安事件我們都是認為都是一樣的重大為什麼這裡面沒有為什麼沒有寫啦為什麼沒有說明呢沒有輕重之分所有的食安事件我問你有沒有說明你跟我講輕重幹什麼 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].start |
122.301 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].end |
136.187 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].text |
所以都不用寫就對了你不用跟國會交代你不用跟人民交代啊這麼嚴重的事情你不用跟國會交代嗎不用跟立法委員交代嗎我們是民意代表耶對啊 你為什麼裡面不說呢 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].start |
140.382 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].end |
162.086 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].text |
我們都是看媒體啊看其他東西來的我們都是有一樣的重大沒有什麼輕重之分行政程序法裡面明確規定司法偵查中的案件若涉及公共利益或重大食安風險主管機關仍可適度的公開這個相關的資訊你不要告訴我剛剛有講說不要說因為剪掉介入之後然後你就把這事情蓋牌都不講對不對那這麼這麼 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].start |
165.807 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].end |
187.05 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].text |
這麼重大的事情怎麼不算是食安的重大風險呢還是你覺得網上有公佈大概然後記者有問再回答就算交代了沒有這個跟委員報告我們就是認為他很重大所以呢在檢調雖然還在偵查當中但是我們就公佈了流向然後他到哪個地方去我們就公佈了有很多問題啊你那個話太多了而且講的都不是我要問的 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].start |
187.831 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].end |
196.703 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].text |
那今天兩份報告在補強食安稽查人力的部分理論上數字應該是要一致的嘛但是食安辦寫報告報告裡面寫說本願於114年同意合爭食藥署預算員額大概20名 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].start |
205.555 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].end |
220.281 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].text |
那衛福部說於2月27號霍仁市總署同意核增邊境查驗這個預算員24名所以我要問我要問一下這是以誰的為準還是你們各講一半還是合起來加起來是44人 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].start |
222.902 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].end |
246.416 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].text |
我來做個說明 跟委員說明因為這個時額20人 4人是要就現有的去調整的這20還是24 總共是44就對了不是 總共是20人從院來看新增的是20人 4人是工作內容去調整的所以他是24人就對了 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].start |
248.896 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].end |
275.496 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].text |
20人 新增的20人那另外的4人是希望食藥署就現有工作的內容去調配他需要24嘛我們合20但是我們只能夠所以你們還是新增20人就對了那你們兩份報告隔一天送進來結果連這個基本人數這個看都看不太懂那我想這個光這麼簡單的事情我們都可以寫得不太一樣我想問一下這些人力何時到位 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].start |
278.854 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].end |
304.915 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].text |
我們現在24個人力的目前就是積極在爭取現在在已經陸陸續續都已經進入我們的北區的那加入之後我們的食安就可以安心了嗎我們針對上面的人力我們跟地方其實共同因為我看到每一次食安的事情發生的時候我們都先檢討人力啦 對不對所以我們認為只要把人人事人員安排好就可以解決食安的問題是這樣嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].start |
306.238 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].end |
315.723 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].text |
跟委員說明當然不全然只是人力的問題還有包含我們制度上的檢討還有運用一些科技的執法方式這個都要一併做檢討 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].start |
316.906 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].end |
343.515 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].text |
好 我現在再講啦 回到這個今天的問題根據目前的資料我們立泰肉店從6月份跟百威食品進豬大腸嘛那目前資訊是在8、9月間百威食品涉嫌用低價購買的有問題的豬大腸再用工業用漂白水去去味那10月2號食藥署接貨通報然後會同檢調去搜查所以這件事是民眾檢舉才發現的嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].start |
345.627 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].end |
367.459 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].text |
對這一個案子是民眾檢舉的好那我今天要講就是說我們很多事情都要靠民眾檢舉那就表示我們食安五環裡面的前四環都失效了那強化源頭沒做到重建生產沒落實加強茶葉沒抓到加重責任等檢舉這花幾百億打造的食安五環結果還是要靠民眾來檢舉 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].start |
369.795 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].end |
387.296 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].text |
第五環是靠全民監督你們應該改成全民救援吧跟委員報告其實前幾環他有他的角色因為他的整個登錄系統的完備那麼一方面讓業者不敢亂蠢動因為這個上下可以勾擊 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].start |
388.177 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].end |
401.466 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].text |
那第二個呢我們從這個大數據裡面也可以發現及時的發現一些高風險然後進行中央跟地方的聯合稽查它還是有它的功能可是還是會有像這樣的漏網之類的請問一下 食安辦我們的許主任 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].start |
404.537 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].end |
422.113 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].text |
你是行政院層級的負責跨部會的這個統整的單位屏東這次百威食品漂白豬大腸農業部說土體都有合格證明但檢方卻查到便便的這個豬大腸被漂白後販售那請問到底這是哪個地方出錯應該這樣來 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].start |
424.952 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].end |
454.355 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].text |
是農業部誤判合格土地還是那些病變豬場根本就不是從合法屠宰場出來的他不是一個病變的情況那我讓我講一下從頭農業部在合法的屠宰場經過獸醫師的檢查之後屠宰出來出場的都是一個合法的並不是說從病死的然後從場外進來的所以在這一案裡面他的這個豬場的來源是正常的那因為豬場他算是一種 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].start |
455.056 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].end |
461.975 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].text |
排內臟裡面是很髒的它可能還有糞便還有別的所以要經過清洗之後那為什麼檢方會這樣講 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].start |
464.231 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].end |
491.047 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].text |
檢方為什麼會這樣講檢方為什麼會這樣講他可能有一點誤會因為這裡面那個腸子內外一開始的時候是要經過一個各種很多次的去清洗的然後還有味道所以雙氧水很可能是用來除味道的這個措施所以整個它過程是這樣子那審計部報告講得很清楚政府為了控管化學物質的 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].start |
492.368 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].end |
500.717 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].text |
這個流向從105年開始建立化學園那到113年8月底你們有沒有跟勞動部的化學品報備平台這個比對過 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].start |
503.522 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].end |
525.461 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].text |
有沒有比對過委員好 這邊跟委員做進一步的說明針對我們現在化學署裡面建置的所謂跨部會化學物質的資訊平台食藥署這邊我們有化學物質流向鏈接跨部會的資訊系統跟化學雲選定化學物質我們做了串接所以我們化學雲的部分選擇了19項化學物質 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].start |
527.543 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].end |
551.801 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].text |
另外跟食品可疑的部分有62這個漂白水算嗎 有沒有含在裡面漂白水 雙氧水它用途極廣所以原先我們從來沒有發生過這樣的議題所以它沒有被列入所謂的化學那未來會不會列入我想這部分我們在積極在研議當中是否因為它牽涉的因為它在購買 我這樣講它今天是用我們這一家公司叫什麼 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].start |
552.721 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].end |
557.488 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].text |
百威嘛 百威 他是用百威食品去購買這個工業用漂白水嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].start |
559.135 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].end |
586.585 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].text |
應該是 他是用他的這個有確定是嗎那我們這樣 我在這邊建議啦就是說當他有這種 他是食品公司嘛他買這種東西 買工業用漂白水的時候這個時候我們的系統就要自動示警就要示警 然後讓我們的人員去查嘛這個能夠注意到有這樣的事情是不是他買這麼大量他到底用在哪裡 對不對是不是要進一步的了解我想這個 我希望你們繼續努力啦 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].start |
587.205 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].end |
607.663 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].text |
不要說我們食安 各位委員報告就是說我們跟這個環境部那個化學雲有合作的關係那因為這個雙氧水等於是第一次發現這個狀況所以我們會考慮把它列入在我們這其實很多東西很多食物我認為很多人都會之前也聽到很多用漂白水洗過的吧對不對 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].start |
608.684 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].end |
623.742 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].text |
他為了賣相 漂白鹹是可以用的只是不能夠用工業級的他明明知道不可用才用是錯在這裡對所以我想他所以你工業用的漂白鹹本來就要管控嘛不是嗎對不對食品的級的我們都有積極的管理 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].start |
624.588 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].end |
647.464 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].text |
好啦 最後我這樣講啦 因為時間的關係我要求這個執行是你們食藥署跟地方稽查人員那第一請食安辦在一個月內提出跨部會整合這個時程表現在三個系統各做各 就算有串聯啦我希望你們把一些該列入的都把它列入 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].start |
648.444 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].end |
671.857 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].text |
如果讓我們這個稽查人員在這個稽查的時候能夠直接跳出警示不要全部都人工在核對那第二請你們建立預警的機制啦就是說剛剛我們講了就是說這些東西只要跑到這個食品鏈裡面我希望你們自動把它這個警示出來讓我們底下人好做事好不好好 謝謝好 謝謝邱委員 謝謝部長 |