| IVOD_ID |
163014 |
| IVOD_URL |
https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/163014 |
| 日期 |
2025-07-07 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼 |
委員會-11-3-26-19 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼:str |
第11屆第3會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第19次全體委員會議 |
| 會議資料.屆 |
11 |
| 會議資料.會期 |
3 |
| 會議資料.會次 |
19 |
| 會議資料.種類 |
委員會 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼[0] |
26 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼:str[0] |
社會福利及衛生環境委員會 |
| 會議資料.標題 |
第11屆第3會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第19次全體委員會議 |
| 影片種類 |
Clip |
| 開始時間 |
2025-07-07T11:55:30+08:00 |
| 結束時間 |
2025-07-07T12:07:17+08:00 |
| 影片長度 |
00:11:47 |
| 支援功能[0] |
ai-transcript |
| video_url |
https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/e6eee8dab835150d5de3d5d07a4367010e5ab0c0921fe9069629626a979700a8f0154244ba07af355ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8 |
| 委員名稱 |
黃國昌 |
| 委員發言時間 |
11:55:30 - 12:07:17 |
| 會議時間 |
2025-07-07T09:00:00+08:00 |
| 會議名稱 |
立法院第11屆第3會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第19次全體委員會議（事由：審查
一、委員楊曜等17人擬具「社會救助法第十六條條文修正草案」案。
二、委員范雲等17人擬具「社會救助法部分條文修正草案」案。
三、委員謝衣鳯等16人擬具「社會救助法部分條文修正草案」案。
四、委員黃秀芳等20人擬具「社會救助法第二條、第四條及第十四條條文修正草案」案。
五、委員翁曉玲等18人擬具「社會救助法第十一條條文修正草案」案。
六、委員黃捷等16人擬具「社會救助法第十六條條文修正草案」案。
七、委員蔡其昌等17人擬具「社會救助法第四條、第四條之一及第五條條文修正草案」案。
八、委員徐富癸等17人擬具「社會救助法第十一條條文修正草案」案。
九、委員王鴻薇等26人擬具「社會救助法第十五條及第十五條之一條文修正草案」案。
十、委員邱若華等20人擬具「社會救助法部分條文修正草案」案。
十一、台灣民眾黨黨團擬具「社會救助法第十一條條文修正草案」案。
十二、委員伍麗華Saidhai Tahovecahe等18人擬具「社會救助法第五條之二、第十一條及第二十一條條文修正草案」案。
十三、委員楊瓊瓔等21人擬具「社會救助法第十一條條文修正草案」案。
十四、委員萬美玲等20人擬具「社會救助法第四條及第十一條條文修正草案」案。
十五、委員林月琴等19人擬具「社會救助法部分條文修正草案」案。
十六、委員楊曜等24人擬具「社會救助法第十六條條文修正草案」案。
十七、委員馬文君等20人擬具「社會救助法第十一條條文修正草案」案。
十八、委員葉元之等21人擬具「社會救助法第十一條條文修正草案」案。
十九、委員羅智強等18人擬具「社會救助法第十一條及第十六條條文修正草案」案。
二十、委員何欣純等17人擬具「社會救助法部分條文修正草案」案。
二十一、委員劉建國等18人擬具「社會救助法部分條文修正草案」案。
二十二、委員林楚茵等18人擬具「社會救助法第十六條條文修正草案」案。
二十三、委員羅廷瑋等16人擬具「社會救助法部分條文修正草案」案。
二十四、委員邱若華等17人擬具「社會救助法第十一條條文修正草案」案。
二十五、委員陳亭妃等16人擬具「社會救助法第二十四條條文修正草案」案。
二十六、委員吳沛憶等16人擬具「社會救助法部分條文修正草案」案。
二十七、委員邱鎮軍等24人擬具「社會救助法第五條之二條文修正草案」案。
二十八、委員游顥等17人擬具「社會救助法第五條之一及第五條之二條文修正草案」案。
二十九、委員翁曉玲等16人擬具「社會救助法第五條之二條文修正草案」案。
三十、委員馬文君等16人擬具「社會救助法第五條之二條文修正草案」案。
【僅詢答】） |
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| transcript.whisperx[0].start |
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今天討論有關於社會救助法的修正 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].start |
19.963 |
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那其實支持問題的核心也就是我國目前社會救助法有關於對於低收入戶世界上面一般所講的貧窮線的定義的檢討跟反省部長知不知道我國目前在貧窮線以下的人口佔全部人口的百分之多少2.56來我們來看一下 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].start |
51.471 |
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76.152 |
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全世界最大的笑話台灣的貧窮率世界最低不同的組織有不同的公布但公布出來的結果台灣貧窮率世界最低不僅僅是超越美國、英國連韓國、日本跟我們都看不到台灣的車尾燈 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].start |
77.93 |
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99.609 |
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部長,你覺得這個有反映現實的狀況嗎?非常感謝黃國昌委員的一個指教我跟委員報告,委員你現在所引用的從美國到日本基本上都是相對貧窮率台灣的部分是社會救助法的領取這兩個是不一樣的概念 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].start |
100.65 |
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126.366 |
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如果說以日本為例 日本的話15.7但是日本的社會救助領取是1.58而台灣的部分 報告委員 這個部分可能有點問題1.3是屬於低收如果再加計中低的話 那台灣是2.58以上報告 謝謝對啊 那從1.5到2.5 我的問題一樣嘛所以我剛剛跟你講嘛 不同的人不同的單位那他們採集的標準可能不太一樣嘛 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].start |
126.886 |
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151.838 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].text |
但我最關心的事情是什麼我最關心的事情是從不同採集的標準從各個不同相關的調查呈現出來的台灣的貧窮線以下人口的比例是不是有反映現實這件事情不是只有我說非常多的學者非常多的NGO都拿出來檢討了我們就從具體的案子來看來 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].start |
157.482 |
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182.424 |
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這個是台灣曾經發生過的悲劇包括了一個女失業,10年20在家中,皮膏骨剩下30公斤包括張化商兄弟,受到皮膏骨老大小五昏迷離世這個都是一個又一個我不願意把它稱之為社會新聞這個是發生在台灣各個角落的悲劇 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].start |
183.975 |
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205.621 |
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這個悲劇的發生從政府的角度上面來講第一個該反省的我們的政府說社會安全網現在已經到2.0了嘛不管是社會安全網幾點幾你要問的第一個問題是說他們明明是應該被接住的人為什麼沒有接住部長你知道他們符合提收入戶的條件嗎你知不知道 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].start |
210.629 |
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235.534 |
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你知道嗎?他們有沒有符合低收入戶的條件?因為這個比較是在2022跟2017的事情所以我不是很了解他們當時是符合我問你社會救助法有關於低收入戶我們對於所謂最低生活上面的需要給他援助的法律上面的基準最後一次修正是什麼時候? |
| transcript.whisperx[9].start |
239.233 |
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267.864 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].text |
最後一次修正是什麼時候十年前為什麼我要拿過去這幾年的例子拿出來看2015年界定的基準後來一而再再而三發生這個悲劇告訴我們政府就是什麼這些是該接住沒有被接住的人等到悲劇發生了以後媒體大肆報導大家看了都很難過捐款 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].start |
269.347 |
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296.278 |
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湧入但人都已經走了這些例子難道不應該成為我們痛定思痛要不要檢討貧窮線基準的參考依據嗎從2015年到現在喔我再進一步給你看當初賴清德總統下一頁這是他2023年公益社會五大方案 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].start |
298.285 |
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298.346 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].text |
與時減跑劇就 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].start |
302.03 |
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323.539 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].text |
與時俱進檢討貧窮線這不是我講的這賴清德說的證件開了然後呢有然後嗎 部長有 報告委員因為這個謝謝您的垂詢那這個的確是在我們的社會救助法的演繹當中是一個重要的議題還要研議多久需要研議多久請理事報告一下報告委員我現在兩點說明第一個 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].start |
332.284 |
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361.244 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].text |
委員現在所說的台灣的舊貧窮線我必須要在這邊很負責任的說就OECD國家來說我們是高於他們為什麼因為我們是可支配所得的60%而OECD國家是50%這第一點更正你講的啦是形式上面嘴巴講的基準嘛相關的所謂可支配所得到底是怎麼定義的這是按照我們那個再回去仔細看清楚啦德國是這樣定義的嗎跟台灣定義一樣嗎包委員德國就是這樣 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].start |
362.385 |
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389.311 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].text |
進收入欸對沒錯對啊我可以在這邊很負責任的說就是所謂的可支配所得這是第一個說明台灣現在目前最大問題並不是貧窮限路問題而是我們現在目前的三個一個是動產不動產還有設算所得這點我承認那所以我們現在目前也會根據這個部分現在還需要多久包圍我們現在目前我們現在之前我們也預告了我們現在目前來收集各方還需要多久 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].start |
390.672 |
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399.644 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].text |
我們就會趕快來提出啊現在目前就是各方有很多很多我再說一次啦要檢討貧窮線不是我說的是賴清德說的報告委員這個裡面對啊我們就與時機我有說錯嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].start |
407.369 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].end |
433.128 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].text |
那你當初賴清德提政見的時候你就講啊報告賴總統總統參選人問題不是貧窮縣的問題你提的解方講錯了為什麼該接住的人沒有接住不是貧窮縣的問題賴清德當初就不是這樣講的啊啊你們說要檢討沒有關係啊所以我現在問你進度到哪裡什麼時候會提出來啊今天如果是2024年5月20號 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].start |
435.441 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].end |
458.189 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].text |
我問這個問題可能給你們準備的時間太短了上任一年多咧上任一年多我問你什麼時候要提出來然後你跟我講說你們要繼續研議那我能不能具體請教你要研議到什麼時候可以嗎還是要研議到2028年需要研議到什麼時候才會提出來因為這裡面我剛剛也說了嘛涉及到的問題很多嘛 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].start |
459.321 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].end |
474.83 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].text |
所以還要延續多久盡量 盡快 盡速全部都是形容詞來 部長 下一個問題不要說你們不敢承諾的啦即使是你們承諾的 下一頁有做到嗎有做到嗎非常多婦女的朋友大家關心的有關於狼醫的資訊平台 在下一頁 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].start |
489.005 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].end |
513.448 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].text |
你們一再飄飄這個是醫改會講的人家講的沒有錯我們一個月讓大家看下一頁去年年底你說要延續公布啊信心的名單就是12月30號你做的承諾嘛對吧還記得吧下一頁今年1月衛福部允諾三個月內完成有完成嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].start |
515.274 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].end |
542.611 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].text |
我們都一直在內部跟不斷的在研議嘛來看一下當初決議的內容是怎麼講的衛福部要啟動並完成揭露平台建置作業這是社福二環委員會在今年1月2號通過的臨時提案你們答應三個月內要完成 有完成嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].start |
545.12 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].end |
556.707 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].text |
所以我剛才說嘛不要說沒有押日期的啦沒有押日期的就不敢講了嘛持續研議看你要研議到什麼時候嘛阿有押日期的都跳票了部長 是這樣對嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].start |
561.735 |
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590.177 |
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有沒有需要檢討需要我們會加緊腳步還需要多久一個月之內就把那個如果一個月之內這次又跳票了不會跳票確定不會跳票確定用你部長的位置擔保確定不會跳票這是應該要做的應該要做的對啊今年1月2號就知道應該要做了因為的確有在研究委員報告真的一直在研究因為他牽涉到比較 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].start |
591.438 |
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618.604 |
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我們要考慮到他的法律的根據我就請教部長這件事情是今天才知道嗎當然我們一直在做今年1月初不知道嗎你去年做承諾的時候不知道嗎法規的狀態是什麼法律有沒有充分的授權在目前法規的狀態之下可以做到什麼程度如果不夠的話要推動什麼樣子的修法這個是早就知道的事情這不是今天才知道的事情 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].start |
620.182 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].end |
632.953 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].text |
如果今天才知道這個事情我今天逼你要你給個答案是我不對從去年就承諾的事情1月又做了決議搞到現在7月了還持續在研議這樣對嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].start |
637.253 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].end |
666.169 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].text |
我們一直都在努力在研議都有進度啦那因為現在就是也跟司法院這邊來討論怎麼樣來先把在法律上可以的我們先做非常多我這樣說啦我對於醫界的前輩我在這邊質詢過很多次我對於所有的醫護同仁他們的辛勞我都是感念在心而且對他們權益的保障 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].start |
667.233 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].end |
687.589 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].text |
對於他們權益相關勞動權益的增進台灣民眾黨立法院黨團是從來沒有停下腳步我們都全力支持但是如果是這種事情的話台灣社會沒有人可以容忍台灣也沒有一個婦女可以容忍我不希望因為衛福部的怠惰 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].start |
688.703 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].end |
700.486 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].text |
又增加了更多的被害人我這樣講部長應該聽得懂我希望今天部長所做的承諾一個月之內要兌現好謝謝 |