| video_url |
https://h264media01.ly.gov.tw:443/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1M/bfaf9b39ac01a68524e6619f7e9d11f80a73ccf8a48a7092b104c5adbfed68f78e4a16cfe9c46cf35ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8 |
| 會議時間 |
2024-11-21T09:00:00+08:00 |
| 會議名稱 |
立法院第11屆第2會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第10次全體委員會議（事由：審查中華民國114年度中央政府總預算案關於衛生福利部主管預算（公務預算及基金）。（僅詢答，113年12月6日下午5時截止收案）） |
| 委員名稱 |
完整會議 |
| 影片長度 |
22763 |
| 委員發言時間 |
08:31:37 - 14:51:00 |
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委員會主席 |
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1820.643 |
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1831.901 |
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好我們出席委員已足法定人數現在開會請議事人員宣讀上次會議議事錄 |
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1833.55 |
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1841.637 |
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立法院第11屆第2會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第9次全體委員會議議事錄時間113年11月20日星期三9時2分至16時41分地點群賢樓801會議室出席委員陳委員趙姿等15人列席委員吳委員秉瑞等35人列席官員勞動部部長何佩珊等相關人員 |
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1854.269 |
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1871.024 |
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主席蘇趙及委員清泉報告事項宣讀上次會議議事錄決定確定邀請勞動部部長權需部國防部內政部警政署內政部消防署行政院人事行政總處考試院公務人員保障及培訓委員會教育部及國家科學及技術委員會就 |
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1872.685 |
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1898.093 |
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職場霸凌防治與處理作業進行專題報告並被質詢本次會議由勞動部部長報告後委員陳昭之等33人提出質詢軍經勞動部部長考試院保訓縱規處處長黃振榮公務人員保障暨培訓委員會保障處處長黃秀琴行政院人事行政總處綜合規劃處處長陳月春教育部人事處處長王崇斌衛生福利部心理健康司代理司長鄭淑欣 |
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1899.313 |
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1925.674 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].text |
全序部法規司司長雷辰國防部常務次長楊基榮及內政部消防署副署長馮俊義及各相關主管等及其答覆委員林國成張家俊柯智恩及萬美玲所提書面質詢列入記錄刊登公報決定一報告及詢答完畢二委員質詢未及答覆或請補充資料者請相關機關於二周內書面答覆委員令要求期限者從其所定通過臨時提案四項宣讀完畢 |
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1934.453 |
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1962.963 |
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請問委員會上次議事錄有無錯誤或遺漏之處沒有那議事錄確定今天的議程會議議程審查中華民國114年中央政府總預算案關於衛生福利部主管預算公務及基金預算今天只有詢答那我現在介紹在場的委員及列席官員 |
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1964.232 |
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1991.864 |
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第一位是陳昭芝委員林業勤委員王振旭委員好等一下如果委員來我再補介紹那我們介紹行政官員齁我們衛務部部長邱太元綜合規劃司司長廖坤富 |
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1996.109 |
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2023.598 |
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會計處處長張玉珍社會保險司組密劉玉娟社會救助及社工司司長蘇昭如保護服務司司長張秀淵護理及健康照護司司長蔡淑鳳 |
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2027.33 |
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2054.32 |
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醫事師師長 劉業平口腔健康師師長 張永敏中醫藥師師長 蘇益璋長長照師師長 祝建芳心理健康師代理師長 鄭淑欣秘書處處長 許朝成 |
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2059.053 |
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2065.98 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].text |
人事處處長李玉慧統計處處長李秋晏資訊處處長李建章政風處處長紀家珍 |
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2079.794 |
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2104.325 |
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國際合作司主任施鈞水護屬醫療及社會福利機構管理委員會執行長林慶豐前名健康保險會執行秘書周淑婉 |
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2107.27 |
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2132.336 |
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前民健康保險爭議審議會執行秘書張玉霞國民年金監理會執行秘書石美春衛生福利人員信念中心主任楊惠芬 |
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2137.356 |
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2142.822 |
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國民年金監理會副執行秘書 劉碧珠科技發展組紀監 劉明勛國民健康署署長 吳釗鈞 |
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2166.77 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].end |
2195.858 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].text |
執管署署長莊仁祥石耀署署長莊生宏石耀署我這下午的齁中央健保署署長石崇良社交署代理署長周道軍國家衛生研究院院長司徒惠康 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].start |
2200.066 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].end |
2208.749 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].text |
勞動部勞工保險局組長 吳維揚勞動基金應用局組長 蘇嘉華行政院主計總處公務預算處專門委員 張嘉瑜基金預算處科長 劉亞文 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].start |
2228.706 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].end |
2244.606 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].text |
今天我們衛務部全員到齊我們在邱部長說明之前做以下宣告 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].start |
2246.306 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].end |
2271.261 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].text |
114年衛生福利部公務及基金預算案委員針對審查之書面提案請於12月6日下午5點以前書面送交本委員會辦公室那今年的那個會期我們是確定延到元月21日所以大家心裡有準備那接下來我們請邱部長來說明時間6分鐘 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].start |
2280.051 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].end |
2300.272 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].text |
主席、各位委員、女士先生今天大院第11屆第2會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會早開全體委員會議選查本部主管114年度預算案本部呈邀列席報告自感榮幸本人僅提出檢要報告報告大綱請參閱 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].start |
2303.956 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].end |
2313.644 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].text |
本部114年的施政計畫是基於促進全民健康與福祉的使命建構健全福利服務體系等八大施政目標 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].start |
2315.502 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].end |
2329.568 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].text |
為達到施政目標本部結合公務及基金預算支援推動各項未設政業務擬定各項工作及業務計劃其中公務預算稅入編列31.7億元稅出編列3701.8億元基金預算部分總收入為1兆1500.3億元總支出1兆1640.9億元 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].start |
2343.635 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].end |
2364.305 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].text |
先說明本部公務預算編列情形稅率預算編列31.7億元以歸會收入24.6億元最高約佔78%只要是食藥署的藥材、藥品、衣材、化妝品、食品、茶宴、檢驗等審查會收入稅數預算編列3701.8億元以補助社會保險等法律義務支出 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].start |
2372.15 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].end |
2380.777 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].text |
2506億元約佔68%最高其次為本市推動各項為修正業務所需要的基本需求1044.1億元約佔28%本部稅務預算大部分為社會 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].start |
2388.001 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].end |
2390.042 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].text |
基金預算部分本部主管的基金 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].start |
2416.178 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].end |
2424.065 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].text |
具有4個作業基金和1個特別收入基金均編列護士單位預算其中醫療藥品基金下設26個部立醫療機構的分預算 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].start |
2428.431 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].end |
2450.228 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].text |
衛生福利部特別收入基金只有11個分預算各基金名稱及主要辦理業務如簡報請委員參列本部4個作業基金主要辦理醫療業務、管制藥品、滯銷以及健保與國保等業務共編類收入一兆510.2億元以支出一兆488.4億元收支付抵後 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].start |
2456.345 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].end |
2475.074 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].text |
本期剩餘計21.8億元其中憲保基金及國保基金無疑錯適應憲保基金原收支差距459.9億元以收回安全準備應應那國保基金原收支皆以338.8億元則悉數提存為安全準備 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].start |
2480.41 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].end |
2494.154 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].text |
衛生福利特別收入基金編列基金來源990.1億元本年度應用基金可用財源用以辦理長期照顧及各項衛生保健及社會福利業務估計投入1152.5億元故預計產生短促162.4億元將用於前年度的剩餘填補 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].start |
2505.509 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].end |
2518.095 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].text |
本部配合行政院施政方針為執行實現健康臺灣的願景推動長期照顧服務因應少子化問題及健全社會安全網等重要政策114年度預算編列情況說明錄下為實施健康臺灣願景本部114年度預算 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].start |
2525.299 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].end |
2533.067 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].text |
預計投入607億辦理健康臺灣生根相關措施國家癌症防治計畫推動8.888計畫確保健保永續經營等多項作為以及持續優化醫療環境與資源普及 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].start |
2540.495 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].end |
2563.516 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].text |
癌症篩檢與慢性病預防．擴大辦理心理健康支持措施．加速引入癌症診療．使國人享有更完善及做前的健康照顧．除了健康臺灣所推動的醫衛措施以外．本部為照顧弱勢、營養高齡化及少子化議題．亦提出長期照顧強化社會安全網．少子齡化對策計畫． |
| transcript.whisperx[31].start |
2565.27 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].end |
2587.121 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].text |
以及部件身心障礙照顧服務支援等重要社福預算首先為了落實政府長照長期照顧政策114年度本部長照經會共編884.6億只要系系辦理長期照顧給互及支付制度社區整體照顧服務體系及機構及社區預防性照顧服務等 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].start |
2588.699 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].end |
2617.388 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].text |
其逐步建構完整長壽體系實現在地老化目標此外為助年輕一代怨婚感生感癢編列少子化對策計畫358.5億減輕家庭照顧者負擔擴增及多元化身心障礙福利機構服務編列身心障礙照顧服務支援部件計畫70.6億元實施編列社安網第二期計畫67億以完備社會安全體系本部公務及 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].start |
2618.713 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].end |
2637.86 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].text |
基金預算．執行．與國民健康福祉息息相關為實踐提高高品質醫療衛生保健與福利服務並達成健康臺灣福利全民的政策目標懇請各位委員支持本部預算謝謝謝謝部長的說明 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].start |
2649.932 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].end |
2677.595 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].text |
今天看起來沒有像昨天那麼多人了昨天實在太累了我們現在開始詢答做以下的宣告本會委員詢答時間8分鐘列席的委員4分鐘委員花園登記10點半截止如果有書面質詢請以上會請提出預期不受理 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].start |
2679.276 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].end |
2691.441 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].text |
暫定10點半前後休息10分鐘本次會議不處理臨時提案好那我們現在開始詢答我們請地會委員陳昭芝有言質詢好謝謝主席有請邱部長部長請 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].start |
2707.705 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].end |
2712.591 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].text |
委員長部長你有關注昨天的在未還委員會的質詢嗎有沒有因為我昨天在財政委員會集管署報紙是已經沸沸揚揚集管署有傳出有土皇帝組長霸凌組員這件事您知道嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[37].start |
2726.877 |
| transcript.whisperx[37].end |
2755.604 |
| transcript.whisperx[37].text |
有這樣的新聞出來我們立即再處理請問部長那除了集管署之外衛福部內有沒有其他的單位有類似的情形只要有任何的一個信息我們一定如果你收到檢舉你會不會處理當然會處理你卓院長昨天說了要徹查那部長你要怎麼查你要被動嗎還是要先主動的去了解 |
| transcript.whisperx[38].start |
2756.311 |
| transcript.whisperx[38].end |
2784.07 |
| transcript.whisperx[38].text |
如果有信息我們一定先去瞭解它的來源以及我們會用最嚴格的規定來進行基本上都會像機關署這個我們會用好部長 機關署署長請回沒問題你們再進行部長某個FB的匿名粉專公開貼文提到貴部的他用市長某市長霸凌所屬的無良長官不分平假日下屬要安扣我也收到類似的檢舉 |
| transcript.whisperx[39].start |
2785.271 |
| transcript.whisperx[39].end |
2801.959 |
| transcript.whisperx[39].text |
部長你要不要查這件事情我等一下把這張給你就是在捲舉衛福部的我們立即來瞭解你要不要來處理這件事情當然要處理麻煩劉玉娟主秘請上台謝謝玉娟主秘 |
| transcript.whisperx[40].start |
2812.884 |
| transcript.whisperx[40].end |
2830.261 |
| transcript.whisperx[40].text |
請問是不是真有此事你有沒有自己早早下班讓下屬幫你看門要求下屬24小時安扣以及跟類似這個霸凌下屬的行為請您自己說明我沒有請過同仁要加班或是假日要來上班沒有一次都沒有過 |
| transcript.whisperx[41].start |
2832.148 |
| transcript.whisperx[41].end |
2835.452 |
| transcript.whisperx[41].text |
報告委員因為我裡面有看一下他好像是說最近才調來的司長我們的司長沒有新任的 |
| transcript.whisperx[42].start |
2851.791 |
| transcript.whisperx[42].end |
2870.518 |
| transcript.whisperx[42].text |
我們的司長,像劉一堅司長已經...部長,坦護是不會有好結果的,我們想瞭解一下,可能...我想說部長,那您就回去調查,但是我想聽主秘,您說您完全沒有這個類似的...他說此人空降司長數月 |
| transcript.whisperx[43].start |
2874.143 |
| transcript.whisperx[43].end |
2889.735 |
| transcript.whisperx[43].text |
我收到的檢舉是這樣的我收到檢舉立委這兩天每個立委都收到一堆檢舉每個立委都收的太多檢舉了因為蜜兔事件延燒了那請你說明一下沒關係只要有任何的信息我會交人事處 |
| transcript.whisperx[44].start |
2893.038 |
| transcript.whisperx[44].end |
2911.28 |
| transcript.whisperx[44].text |
主席不能講話嗎你就是說沒有對不對你就是一句話就是沒有提到執政黨空降愛將你覺得你自己有沒有讓部主被霸凌的感覺我沒有請同仁過來你沒有覺得你有被讓屬下有被你霸凌的感覺我瞭解 |
| transcript.whisperx[45].start |
2912.581 |
| transcript.whisperx[45].end |
2926.546 |
| transcript.whisperx[45].text |
我們的這些主管其實都是長久的部長這個是兩回事部長請讓公務員你會去調查請讓公務員願意講真話的方式去調查你有智慧來了解我們在調查的程序有這樣的一個匿名的好 |
| transcript.whisperx[46].start |
2932.248 |
| transcript.whisperx[46].end |
2961.808 |
| transcript.whisperx[46].text |
那我當然覺得說不只是衛福部啦我希望所有的行政機關都能夠這個主管都沒有在職場類似霸凌的行為讓員工們能夠好好的做事安心有錢的人為國家付出嘛這也是我們追求的目標我們追求的目標跟委員一樣部長那就是請你記得這件事是部長我們來談百億癌藥基金現在預注了50億元到健保基金叫做癌症心要暫時性支付款項專款專用部長您知道請您回答這個基金這個專款的目的是什麼 |
| transcript.whisperx[47].start |
2963.589 |
| transcript.whisperx[47].end |
2988.358 |
| transcript.whisperx[47].text |
目的其實就是希望這個部份我們希望能夠來我意思是說專管的目的就是加速嘛加速 該用的藥嘛那這樣子的話但是我要我瞭解現在新藥的審查方式就是經過專家會議然後再共鳴會嘛那這當中還有很多要處理的事來回的意見跟意見 |
| transcript.whisperx[48].start |
2989.818 |
| transcript.whisperx[48].end |
3006.288 |
| transcript.whisperx[48].text |
是那要不少時間那據我瞭解本週一提出的這個作業在癌症性要暫時性支付款的過程審查過程跟現在一模一樣現在是要審查一模一樣那這樣真的能加快嗎部長這樣真的能加速嗎你如果步驟跟以前都一樣真的能加速嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[49].start |
3007.233 |
| transcript.whisperx[49].end |
3022.304 |
| transcript.whisperx[49].text |
我想我們不只步驟我們有成立更多的一個怎麼加速步驟一模一樣啊經過的過程這個關卡都一模一樣啊那如果沒有辦法加速那這個專款就是虛晃一朝啊委員可不可以容許我請那個署署長跟你說明一下 |
| transcript.whisperx[50].start |
3023.271 |
| transcript.whisperx[50].end |
3048.63 |
| transcript.whisperx[50].text |
跟委員報告這裡面有幾個加速的關鍵第一個就是說我們就啟動了這個平行審查機制就是他可以在那個申請我知道你瞭解但是我們現在要等著看他的結果啦好不好就是說我有一些建議因為這個是公務特別預算嘛部長是不是特別編出來的嘛特別目的嘛那他一定要經過共你會討論嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[51].start |
3051.156 |
| transcript.whisperx[51].end |
3071.185 |
| transcript.whisperx[51].text |
跟委員報告當然這一關卡很麻煩的對但是呢因為這個預算的本身還是在健保基金裡面那我們當然是還是尊重啦不過我們可以加速因為他的預算比較多了那主導您進來回答那我們可不可能把它當報告案報告過去就好了因為這是特別的 |
| transcript.whisperx[52].start |
3071.886 |
| transcript.whisperx[52].end |
3086.125 |
| transcript.whisperx[52].text |
就不需要再討論了另外我想就這個時間剛好跟兩位署長建議我認為共理會應該要直播啦我是不是從衛福部開始先進國家任何重要的會議有關人民權益的會議其實包括疫苗審查的時候 |
| transcript.whisperx[53].start |
3087.186 |
| transcript.whisperx[53].end |
3108.582 |
| transcript.whisperx[53].text |
我們覺得是應該考慮要直播現在是片片斷斷剪來剪去不是真相這是第一個就是請你們快速研議夠你會直播的可能性讓大家每個人為他自己講話負責任真的有困難就讓大家知道這個都是大家都可以做還有病人練習的部分可不可能成為正式代表就是病人代表的部分那一次是這樣做的 |
| transcript.whisperx[54].start |
3109.342 |
| transcript.whisperx[54].end |
3120.649 |
| transcript.whisperx[54].text |
我們現在有徵詢這個請健保會推薦屬於這個非醫療服務提供者的代表來加入到這個共理會議正式代表部長你還記得這本書嗎健康達人125 |
| transcript.whisperx[55].start |
3124.631 |
| transcript.whisperx[55].end |
3130.493 |
| transcript.whisperx[55].text |
我們兩個是第一第二作者這本書當時出版的目的就是回歸健保只是要不給付當時侯署長是先把維他命類的跟這個胃藥民眾說胃藥我們說致酸劑先排除但是要處理一些一般感冒藥的時候遇到一些障礙 |
| transcript.whisperx[56].start |
3149.02 |
| transcript.whisperx[56].end |
3165.778 |
| transcript.whisperx[56].text |
當時侯署長交代說我們要先做民眾的教育自我健康的照顧所以要先有一本類似這樣的書所以我們是這樣做出來的自我用的部分那4個月前我們的附帶決議當中有這個部分只是要這個推出健保給付等等 |
| transcript.whisperx[57].start |
3167.219 |
| transcript.whisperx[57].end |
3195.462 |
| transcript.whisperx[57].text |
那時候我們講好3個月啊,現在4個月過去了,怎麼樣程度啊?有言議你一定實懲,因為這個要盡量我們是站在保護民眾健康的一個,這是最高原則之下,我們去爭取大家的意見,類似實懲這個公文上面寫說,取消只是要給付實懲,這是違法給付不是叫取消啦,是要回歸啦 |
| transcript.whisperx[58].start |
3196.002 |
| transcript.whisperx[58].end |
3221.944 |
| transcript.whisperx[58].text |
要回歸了那部長這個我就講一下只是要看起來只有一二十億啦但是我們現在每人每年看病是17到18次啊你應該都說過啊說大家檢看一次其實我沒有要全面讓大家說欸就是說欸都回到立刻回到這個社區但是如果每個人每年少一次看病你們自己說的啊可以少300億啊啊這個錢就拿來處理心要處理重大疾病現在大缺口的部分都可以處理啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[59].start |
3222.905 |
| transcript.whisperx[59].end |
3240.577 |
| transcript.whisperx[59].text |
所以是不是說這個有關在附帶決議的部分那再請你處理一下主席再給我一點時間因為現在很多這個我們衛福部努力在推動這個居家安寧照護計畫居家安寧照護計畫那透過疼痛的控制減緩身體不適可以讓末期的病人的生命品質 |
| transcript.whisperx[60].start |
3241.577 |
| transcript.whisperx[60].end |
3246.818 |
| transcript.whisperx[60].text |
部長您知道現在病人或家屬要取得這個管制藥品有多困難嗎?是怎麼取得的嗎?就是居家安寧照護計畫您知道他怎麼取得? |
| transcript.whisperx[61].start |
3263.863 |
| transcript.whisperx[61].end |
3290.016 |
| transcript.whisperx[61].text |
我想我一個安寧的老兵這三十年來就是在處理這件事情他是透過社區健保特約藥局來做的很感謝藥局來協助但是他們做準備跟交付藥品才能順利做但是這個現在有一些問題我簡單跟部長講部長現在這個特約藥局大概有7600家您可以猜想嗎有多少家加入了這個這麼重要的計畫呢 |
| transcript.whisperx[62].start |
3292.381 |
| transcript.whisperx[62].end |
3303.343 |
| transcript.whisperx[62].text |
大概有多少家?7600家當中有多少家加入的呢?大概有100家左右啦!不定有57間而已啦!連1%都沒有啦!這麼低的原因跟很多的問題有關啦!大概就幾個問題!健保給付的點數是有改進空間的!第二個這個因為這個管制藥品管理非常嚴格嘛!違反這個銷毀程序!罰額很高喔!在15到75萬!那要是在回收的過程當中如果不小心破損了 |
| transcript.whisperx[63].start |
3321.607 |
| transcript.whisperx[63].end |
3332.752 |
| transcript.whisperx[63].text |
他至少也要罰15萬以上不合比例啊而且那個食藥署的管制藥品管制工廠轉嫁成本到藥局導致藥局在執行這個成本過高譬如說藥局跟這個製藥工廠訂定這個這個管制藥品的時候油費手續費匯費廢片記錄管理管制藥品廢棄物清潔費過期報銷費等等都有藥局來承擔啊你這樣叫他們你做功德就算了你還讓他額外付出 |
| transcript.whisperx[64].start |
3350.1 |
| transcript.whisperx[64].end |
3356.342 |
| transcript.whisperx[64].text |
所以這個部分是不是可以一個月內做一個檢討因為你要鼓勵居家安寧照護那你要讓社區藥局能夠配合你又管這麼嚴讓他嚇死了對不對疼痛的共識對居家安寧的病人是非常重要的這個社區藥局不斷的來跟我澄清這件事已經有一段時間了我們管治藥品當然要嚴格怎麼樣嚴格之下 |
| transcript.whisperx[65].start |
3373.729 |
| transcript.whisperx[65].end |
3383.564 |
| transcript.whisperx[65].text |
最合理的比較符合比例的讓民眾能夠得到最好的照顧也不應該都轉嫁到社區藥局嗎當然當然現在這是配合國家計畫來處理好那謝謝部長我把這張交給您好謝謝謝謝陳昭志委員謝謝部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[66].start |
3389.434 |
| transcript.whisperx[66].end |
3409.807 |
| transcript.whisperx[66].text |
那個那個那個疫苗的施打部長,也是一樣啊,都叫美医叫金獸自己負擔所有的管銷、冷氣、空調、冰,壞掉都要自己賠一起一起一起一起研議啦,趙志偉都提金獸公關委,我也要提金獸公關委 |
| transcript.whisperx[67].start |
3414.977 |
| transcript.whisperx[67].end |
3419.798 |
| transcript.whisperx[67].text |
好 接續我們請林業勤委員質詢要補介紹我們盧憲宜委員盧憲宜委員到場主席麻煩我們的邱部長委員長 |
| transcript.whisperx[68].start |
3437.605 |
| transcript.whisperx[68].end |
3465.836 |
| transcript.whisperx[68].text |
部長早今天要跟部長討論三個我很關心的議題第一個就是我們現在預算最多的也是最重要的社安網的部分明年度是社安網第二期計畫的最後一年你的預算也編列了大約66億9千萬可是近期發生的重大惡劣事件裡邊想問部會間我們支援網絡的部件狀況是什麼社安網真的連起來了嗎叫做網絡嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[69].start |
3467.316 |
| transcript.whisperx[69].end |
3490.615 |
| transcript.whisperx[69].text |
還是仍然充滿了破洞這其實是我們一直在努力的目標也感謝委員一直關心這個部分網路的串聯的確是社安網一個很重要的關鍵那這個部分其實我們衛福部社家屬這個部分可以說是也是很多的策略在進行 |
| transcript.whisperx[70].start |
3491.907 |
| transcript.whisperx[70].end |
3507.737 |
| transcript.whisperx[70].text |
真的有在徹底在做進行嗎因為從近年重大的惡虐事件當中跟監察院的報告都指出跨網絡的合作機制仍然是沒有很順暢的讓色安網一再落入的色證的色安網 |
| transcript.whisperx[71].start |
3508.677 |
| transcript.whisperx[71].end |
3525.214 |
| transcript.whisperx[71].text |
社政的社安網的困境所以什麼叫社政社安網我就引述專家學者說的大家看到社安網還是會覺得是歸屬於社政變成社政孤立無援所以我們社工做得非常辛苦還沒有網絡的資源最後網絡就是只剩下通報的功能現在整體的網絡功能被惡化 |
| transcript.whisperx[72].start |
3527.276 |
| transcript.whisperx[72].end |
3527.657 |
| transcript.whisperx[72].text |
衛生福利部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[73].start |
3542.976 |
| transcript.whisperx[73].end |
3545.137 |
| transcript.whisperx[73].text |
委員會委員會委員會委員會委員會委員會委員會委員會委員會委員會委員會委員會委員會委員會委員會委員會 |
| transcript.whisperx[74].start |
3568.67 |
| transcript.whisperx[74].end |
3576.656 |
| transcript.whisperx[74].text |
今天我們的預防針只要打到兩歲三個月然後最後就是告訴我們的社政告訴社政之後呢那 |
| transcript.whisperx[75].start |
3577.757 |
| transcript.whisperx[75].end |
3598.855 |
| transcript.whisperx[75].text |
社政去訪說小孩子被其他情人帶走那有沒有去查證然後再來就是去通知警政部長如果你對於自己鄉下的衛政都管不了然後你要去通知警政警政如果也不去查訪然後最後才知道說孩子已經因為已經要念書了孩子走了 |
| transcript.whisperx[76].start |
3599.375 |
| transcript.whisperx[76].end |
3623.887 |
| transcript.whisperx[76].text |
多年前就走了那他還領育了今天這不是覺得很荒謬嗎所以我想問一下你的網絡到底有串接嗎你的網絡的連結到底衛福部有沒有幫社工看到你要怎麼去做不要讓我們的各部會政府部門不能說講好聽叫各司其職講難聽叫各自為政最後你能處理內政嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[77].start |
3625.248 |
| transcript.whisperx[77].end |
3653.574 |
| transcript.whisperx[77].text |
到底網絡真的有連結嗎?還是真的是社政的社安網?好,謝謝委員那我兩個部分,第一個部分就是那個其實衛政這個部分,我們全國的其實醫療院所過去幾年來在像我們蘇昭偉以前當過前院會理事長也很重視這一塊,所以我們其實跟醫療院所都有跟社會安全網在結合在各個 |
| transcript.whisperx[78].start |
3654.814 |
| transcript.whisperx[78].end |
3664.742 |
| transcript.whisperx[78].text |
議事公會在推廣給所有的醫療院所在做希望真的部長這有牽扯到不是只有衛生有教育警政勞政都有關聯性我們也有在串聯是請那個 |
| transcript.whisperx[79].start |
3669.685 |
| transcript.whisperx[79].end |
3693.667 |
| transcript.whisperx[79].text |
是跟委員報告謝謝委員關心基本上在今天談的這個議題都已經在入法而市場裡頭都有規定因為過去我在民間就常碰到類似這種狀況然後進來還是碰到這種狀況表示你的網絡線還是沒辦法你一個保護師可以去跟教育溝通嗎甚至有些現在社工人員都撥補到教育體系或是警政體系那有用嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[80].start |
3694.949 |
| transcript.whisperx[80].end |
3704.119 |
| transcript.whisperx[80].text |
有些家庭教育中心的社工人員都還沒補齊在中央在行政院在衛福部在中央以及到縣市都有網絡的不同層次的會議事實上已經達到這個目標當然 |
| transcript.whisperx[81].start |
3711.647 |
| transcript.whisperx[81].end |
3740.54 |
| transcript.whisperx[81].text |
所以我們在系統上面資訊系統也有做勾結所以這個部分都已經逐漸邁向他是一個網路如果這些解決了不會今年度又發生同樣的問題然後你最後就是去跟媽媽去追那個他預的那個育兒津貼而已嗎還是早就走了是在制度建構上面通常都是透過個案來檢驗我們會希望你的預算編了可是要真的能夠防堵孩子不要再 |
| transcript.whisperx[82].start |
3741.46 |
| transcript.whisperx[82].end |
3755.937 |
| transcript.whisperx[82].text |
施去我覺得這是國家的責任在部長這邊也要再跟你提醒你自己來自醫療體系那今年3月的總諮詢的時候我就已經提過死因回溯應該要擴大來全面執行 |
| transcript.whisperx[83].start |
3756.657 |
| transcript.whisperx[83].end |
3775.476 |
| transcript.whisperx[83].text |
為什麼因為過去我們的法定沒有錯0到6歲可是我覺得政府如果在法沒有改當中為保護孩子不應該去考慮嗎你的1到14歲事故傷害事實上是死亡的第一名欸始終都沒有去解決一直要去處理惡虐我不是不贊成可是最大死因是在事故傷害這一塊 |
| transcript.whisperx[84].start |
3777.057 |
| transcript.whisperx[84].end |
3799.413 |
| transcript.whisperx[84].text |
所以在那3月的時候我就質詢那那時候曾經人院長也有承諾答應是說至少兩個東西要做這也是符合我們2022年國際委員來省CRC的時候他提到交通事故還有呢自殺交通的確我們的交通部跟國土署那邊編了4年400億要去改善交通環境自殺也編了1.6億要來做 |
| transcript.whisperx[85].start |
3802.535 |
| transcript.whisperx[85].end |
3802.735 |
| transcript.whisperx[85].text |
主席 |
| transcript.whisperx[86].start |
3830.757 |
| transcript.whisperx[86].end |
3854.669 |
| transcript.whisperx[86].text |
我們就是不斷的讓自殺一直維持在第二名那交通維持在第一名那想問一下因為英國的做法他本來是3595人死亡下降到2724人那可以透過這樣的回溯讓可修正的問題事實上成長到37%所以想問一下你們到底要怎麼來執行 |
| transcript.whisperx[87].start |
3856.472 |
| transcript.whisperx[87].end |
3882.491 |
| transcript.whisperx[87].text |
謝謝委員的關心其實委員上次執行隨行以後我們一直在演繹要演繹到什麼時候因為為什麼上次就說你們編的經費太少了根本都沒辦法達到結果到現在我看114年的預算還是依然入庫其實我們都有委託專人在分析部長先講大概什麼時候為什麼因為我3月執行的時候那時候就已經有承諾可是我再看114年預算還是這樣 |
| transcript.whisperx[88].start |
3885.707 |
| transcript.whisperx[88].end |
3905.556 |
| transcript.whisperx[88].text |
委員這兩個部份阿 二樓死因回顧的部份目前6歲以下要不要做到我們的至少這兩個交通跟自殺已經是最嚴重自殺心理健康是已經委託臺大團隊在做研究分析如果等到你們研究分析不知道又有多少孩子傷亡因為我們今年生的 |
| transcript.whisperx[89].start |
3907.202 |
| transcript.whisperx[89].end |
3907.802 |
| transcript.whisperx[89].text |
交通事故也是一樣嗎? |
| transcript.whisperx[90].start |
3931.711 |
| transcript.whisperx[90].end |
3945.857 |
| transcript.whisperx[90].text |
我想這個死亡死因的分析是非常重要,任何一個年齡層都需要就好像我們在醫院病人如果有狀況的話我們都會做很分析來減少來避免這樣的悲劇 |
| transcript.whisperx[91].start |
3946.997 |
| transcript.whisperx[91].end |
3961.08 |
| transcript.whisperx[91].text |
那部長是講說你現在會做明年會執行嗎尤其是我剛剛講的那兩個議題也符合我們的國際委員審查的時候的要求否則你2026年怎麼去交第二第三次的國家報告 |
| transcript.whisperx[92].start |
3962 |
| transcript.whisperx[92].end |
3983.067 |
| transcript.whisperx[92].text |
據我了解我們國內大概二三十年前一直發展青少年醫學在這個部分他們也做了很多的努力我想我們衛福部把相關的資訊收集我相信所有的相關部門都一直在努力我沒有說不努力可是要切中要害好嗎要知道死亡原因才能夠去減少傷亡不是嗎而且那個每一個時 |
| transcript.whisperx[93].start |
3986.568 |
| transcript.whisperx[93].end |
4005.699 |
| transcript.whisperx[93].text |
每一個可能時代是不太一樣的所以我們一直要做一直要做一直改善一直改善可是我們自殺已經是一直往上飆高交通事故今年也是沒有再下降我們的青少年的那樣子的一個交通事故並沒有再下降所以是不是應該明年要針對這一塊我們會更積極請委員放心 |
| transcript.whisperx[94].start |
4010.441 |
| transcript.whisperx[94].end |
4033.152 |
| transcript.whisperx[94].text |
我希望不是分析喔我覺得要確實去執行最後就是10月9號我就執行過的特殊需求孩子不得已要到安置一個是緊急安置因為家暴的關係一個事實上是一般型安置可是你特殊需求的孩子的安置竟然安置在護理之家安置在不當的場所10月9號我就執行過期待你們能夠去執行 |
| transcript.whisperx[95].start |
4036.173 |
| transcript.whisperx[95].end |
4063.353 |
| transcript.whisperx[95].text |
因為當時我就主張你一定要提出短中長期的計畫來對於特殊需求因為在民間那時候我就質疑這一塊那時候才144位就一進來之後你們反而更多變成174位那到現在還是沒有去改善結果你們的回文是這樣子所以我想問一下回文你的短中長期要這樣做沒有任何期程也沒有任何相關計畫而且明年也沒有看到任何編列預算的經費要去推展那我不知道 |
| transcript.whisperx[96].start |
4064.053 |
| transcript.whisperx[96].end |
4087.857 |
| transcript.whisperx[96].text |
到底這10月30號回我的文到底回的是什麼報告委員我們短期是指今年中期是指大概明年上半年對那你明年也沒編列經費預算的話你怎麼讓特殊需求的孩子回到兒少安置機構而不是在護理之家在老人的長照的機構裡面在現有的預算裡面我們會把這些事情做好 |
| transcript.whisperx[97].start |
4088.934 |
| transcript.whisperx[97].end |
4089.395 |
| transcript.whisperx[97].text |
主席有請部長委員長 |
| transcript.whisperx[98].start |
4118.308 |
| transcript.whisperx[98].end |
4137.106 |
| transcript.whisperx[98].text |
我們看到我們前章基礎建設第5期有特別編列大概2億8千萬是補助地方政府辦理原住民主及離島地區衛生所的耐震補強評估跟補強工作那感謝我們召委蘇星群召委安排18號我去那馬下看了我們 |
| transcript.whisperx[99].start |
4139.159 |
| transcript.whisperx[99].end |
4165.767 |
| transcript.whisperx[99].text |
衛生所所在地距離人民居住最遠的一個衛生所因為那個是他們在莫拉克15年前發生的時候因業廢時的把衛生所搬離了離人民所在的地方3.2公里而且是波度非常陡一般年輕人還要特殊技巧才可以開上去的用摩托車才能夠開上去那個衛生所然後如果是一般汽車的話大概十幾分鐘才會到達 |
| transcript.whisperx[100].start |
4166.874 |
| transcript.whisperx[100].end |
4191.938 |
| transcript.whisperx[100].text |
那當然這經過10年他們希望能夠搬下來那我們召開的一個區長的一個召開的一個會決議希望能夠搬到現在原來的舊圖書館也就是說舊圖書館是堪用的大概是30年的一個建屋的一個年齡那希望衛福部能夠去參考他們在地的一個規劃然後去把他們實現他們的夢想好不好 |
| transcript.whisperx[101].start |
4192.338 |
| transcript.whisperx[101].end |
4207.598 |
| transcript.whisperx[101].text |
好的因為當時謝謝蘇貞文安排考察那我們的次長也有參與那回來也有報告這類事情我們非常積極去瞭解那據瞭解是說也有人說那裡還是土石流方面 |
| transcript.whisperx[102].start |
4208.138 |
| transcript.whisperx[102].end |
4232.424 |
| transcript.whisperx[102].text |
有,所以那天我有請水保來評估,他們認為...有有,我們會持續評估對,如果說他有持續做每年的輸進的話,那個地方是還是可以用的好,我們一定在...第二個就是需求就是洗腎室,因為那馬下距離最近的岐山醫院要大概一個半小時,到高雄要兩個半小時所以他當地的洗腎的人口大概24人 |
| transcript.whisperx[103].start |
4233.524 |
| transcript.whisperx[103].end |
4233.684 |
| transcript.whisperx[103].text |
委員會主席 |
| transcript.whisperx[104].start |
4248.564 |
| transcript.whisperx[104].end |
4248.644 |
| transcript.whisperx[104].text |
委員會委員會委員會 |
| transcript.whisperx[105].start |
4276.095 |
| transcript.whisperx[105].end |
4304.213 |
| transcript.whisperx[105].text |
主導的角色來幫忙因為目前大概是停在土地的取得他現在大概是利用衛生所附近的周遭的土地然後變更以後看能不能籌建醫院因為目前蘭嶼的人口是5000多人那如果就一般的假日的話他可以湧入5000人一天就湧入5000人那7月份的旅客人數大概將近3萬人這樣一個旅島那個醫療需求是迫在眉睫 |
| transcript.whisperx[106].start |
4305.794 |
| transcript.whisperx[106].end |
4307.806 |
| transcript.whisperx[106].text |
可以嗎你可以做一下你現在的想法嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[107].start |
4310.262 |
| transcript.whisperx[107].end |
4336.592 |
| transcript.whisperx[107].text |
林執行長相當清楚是不是委員謝謝那就是說委員非常關心蘭嶼這個我們的醫療的資源那當然15塊的15個土地的取得其實都已經透過部落會議在那邊在做整合那現在就是碰到就是我們要跟縣府那特別是對當地的醫療資源人力還有我們也碰到一個叫醫療法規設置標準那因為這個部分會牽涉到我們的 |
| transcript.whisperx[108].start |
4338.052 |
| transcript.whisperx[108].end |
4363.026 |
| transcript.whisperx[108].text |
好那我希望我們林執政長能夠努力的把這件事情完成我有聽到一個消息說15年臺東可能會成立護理專班這護理專班的時候你能不能就蘭嶼的這個需求也劃進去把學生也納入他們的公費的一個培訓或者是偏遠地區比如說嚴平啊海端啊達人這些他的長照跟護理專班能夠一起來設置可以嗎都會包括一起來討論 |
| transcript.whisperx[109].start |
4363.826 |
| transcript.whisperx[109].end |
4392.387 |
| transcript.whisperx[109].text |
我們特別註重這一點當然醫院的事情還很遠那我們先講現在他們的需求他們希望有一些非侵入性的醫療設備還有汰換衛生所的老舊才有的那個發電機第二個也就是強化他現在的後送機制希望他的直升機或者是定義機能夠是常駐在蘭嶼機場如果你發生一些緊急的事情的話他才可以馬上的來運送我們的傷患或者是病患 |
| transcript.whisperx[110].start |
4393.067 |
| transcript.whisperx[110].end |
4393.948 |
| transcript.whisperx[110].text |
衛福部主導．經濟部． |
| transcript.whisperx[111].start |
4414.926 |
| transcript.whisperx[111].end |
4444.447 |
| transcript.whisperx[111].text |
好 謝謝委員我想你提的都是關心我們男女主人的關心我們會來努力先肯定目前衛福部對原住民平均移民的一個縮短的努力現在按照如果每10年縮短1歲的話我們確實是有達到我們現在這個平均移民是差了6.19歲講平均的話不過男性的話也是要加油在7.12歲這裡所以我們在去年有成立原住民主健康法公告了 |
| transcript.whisperx[112].start |
4444.827 |
| transcript.whisperx[112].end |
4473.077 |
| transcript.whisperx[112].text |
那我們一直說要專責機構專責機構目前還是沒有目前是有原住民主健康政策會還有原住民主健康研究中心我希望這個都都在我們專責機構的一個下面也就是說他應該是附在那個組織裡面而不是你又再去找了一個原住民主健康中心原住民主健康政策會結果這些沒有辦法提供給衛福部適當的一些建議或者是政策的一個方向可以嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[113].start |
4474.482 |
| transcript.whisperx[113].end |
4487.021 |
| transcript.whisperx[113].text |
我想我們在謝謝我們在研議這個部分那個我相信我現在問你說原住民主健康中心提供哪些研究計畫是成果給你參考你你可以提的出來嗎應該還沒有吧 |
| transcript.whisperx[114].start |
4491.905 |
| transcript.whisperx[114].end |
4517.49 |
| transcript.whisperx[114].text |
我會不會請國衛院來我去做這個謝謝我想要謝謝委員那我們原民的健康研究中心是在去年12月在部裡面的支持之下成立那我們自己院內做了系統性的這個整合那目前請的是我們的許惠恆許副院長他非常有經驗他過去在臺中總統臺北總統對我非常期待 |
| transcript.whisperx[115].start |
4519.391 |
| transcript.whisperx[115].end |
4519.991 |
| transcript.whisperx[115].text |
法定人數不足 |
| transcript.whisperx[116].start |
4541.189 |
| transcript.whisperx[116].end |
4568.828 |
| transcript.whisperx[116].text |
中東歐國家畢業的醫學系或牙醫系學生可以到偏鄉及離島去完成醫療臨床實作的資格大多數只是為了拿到參加國考第二階段考試的資格罷了最終這些同學也大多不會留在原鄉或者是離島地區依然會留在都市地區病患人數較多且集中的地方本席要特別點名衛福部醫事師、口腔衛生師、健康師 |
| transcript.whisperx[117].start |
4569.668 |
| transcript.whisperx[117].end |
4569.788 |
| transcript.whisperx[117].text |
委員會主席 |
| transcript.whisperx[118].start |
4591.025 |
| transcript.whisperx[118].end |
4607.819 |
| transcript.whisperx[118].text |
會是更提高該本地區的健保點值去引導醫療資源的有效分配才是而不是利用優化邊鄉醫療經濟方案的錢去補助你們部立醫院辦理臨床實習解決撇撇留學生的臨床實作培訓 |
| transcript.whisperx[119].start |
4608.92 |
| transcript.whisperx[119].end |
4631.855 |
| transcript.whisperx[119].text |
政府的請示要解決醫療資源欠缺醫生不願意去的原鄉及離島服務的問題而不是提供他們去實習然後去提取得資格去報考第二階段國考這是我看到偏鄉24億的那個優化的那個政策後面的含義希望部長能夠理解我的想法可不可以容我報告一下 |
| transcript.whisperx[120].start |
4633.536 |
| transcript.whisperx[120].end |
4653.624 |
| transcript.whisperx[120].text |
我們偏鄉的一個計畫偏鄉醫療的計畫其實都一直在實行而且它是很多元化的那在去年覺得開始為何不接受到很多鄉鎮沒有牙醫師缺乏老人照顧其實很重要所以在後來就加進去在 |
| transcript.whisperx[121].start |
4654.884 |
| transcript.whisperx[121].end |
4671.13 |
| transcript.whisperx[121].text |
盡量去補充偏鄉地去亞裔這個部亞裔的人力那這個計畫其實在今年的年初方面就已經核定那後來我們就任以後就是意見很多啦所以我們就 |
| transcript.whisperx[122].start |
4672.15 |
| transcript.whisperx[122].end |
4694.537 |
| transcript.whisperx[122].text |
好好就把這個案先暫緩來討論所以目前是暫緩嗎現在說偏鄉計畫不能暫緩但是在牙醫的偏鄉牙醫的這部分我們現在就是政府現在的策略就是政策就是只有針對我現在再講清楚一點針對現在沒有牙醫師的55個鄉鎮 |
| transcript.whisperx[123].start |
4699.138 |
| transcript.whisperx[123].end |
4699.238 |
| transcript.whisperx[123].text |
以本國醫師優先 |
| transcript.whisperx[124].start |
4712.261 |
| transcript.whisperx[124].end |
4715.783 |
| transcript.whisperx[124].text |
現在就是就是這樣子我們不會讓這樣的一個計劃這麼好的一個計劃來補償變成大家爭議的我還是要告訴你的24億如果剛才那個補償 |
| transcript.whisperx[125].start |
4734.552 |
| transcript.whisperx[125].end |
4742.776 |
| transcript.whisperx[125].text |
我希望是做整體的第一個一定要有醫師執照第二個我們現在是以本國醫師為優先所以也不會去實行什麼實習以後再去做那些 |
| transcript.whisperx[126].start |
4761.065 |
| transcript.whisperx[126].end |
4767.47 |
| transcript.whisperx[126].text |
現在不會做這些事情所以我想請那個社會要了解啦我們這個衛福部絕對是站在維護人民健康為優先來解決這個長久的爭議同時希望能夠創造三眼讓偏鄉友醫師和牙醫師包括醫師嘛然後也大家能夠都能夠了解接受 |
| transcript.whisperx[127].start |
4785.742 |
| transcript.whisperx[127].end |
4787.823 |
| transcript.whisperx[127].text |
關於偏鄉醫療經濟部份我希望我跟部長能夠有共識我們一起努力謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[128].start |
4811.637 |
| transcript.whisperx[128].end |
4820.263 |
| transcript.whisperx[128].text |
謝謝盧憲毅委員等一下我質詢的時候這個問題我會深入跟你討論那接下來我們請陳清威委員質詢主席謝謝各位官員那就邱部長謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[129].start |
4840.253 |
| transcript.whisperx[129].end |
4861.007 |
| transcript.whisperx[129].text |
委員好部長昨天我在財政委員會其實下午就發出這篇文章嘛在催上面的文章說除了勞動部昨天是矚目的焦點以外呢也有籍管署的同仁上網陳情那當時呢您說調查報告大概兩個月會出來 |
| transcript.whisperx[130].start |
4861.747 |
| transcript.whisperx[130].end |
4884.457 |
| transcript.whisperx[130].text |
但昨天晚上行政院院長道歉並且規定大家要一週內完成調查報告的時候呢很晚的時候集管署又重新發了一個新聞稿說一週內會完成那這邊也想在這邊跟部長說其實勞動部最為人詬病的就是第一他的調查小組不夠公正不夠超然裡面很多就自己人 |
| transcript.whisperx[131].start |
4885.017 |
| transcript.whisperx[131].end |
4913.829 |
| transcript.whisperx[131].text |
所以最後呢很多調查報告不管是在其他的單位或是在勞動部都不了了之變成一個壓力鍋的燜燒導致於有不幸的親身事件所以你有沒有辦法在這邊承諾因為昨天其實不瞞您說下午回去有人就打電話匿名電話進來然後又有寫簡訊的等一下會給你一封信的證本但我們都會一一的經過查證那也希望您可以審慎的處理您可以在這邊承諾 |
| transcript.whisperx[132].start |
4914.969 |
| transcript.whisperx[132].end |
4940.032 |
| transcript.whisperx[132].text |
不要有這個要不要請外部的人或是公證超人的立場來成立所有衛福部相關的調查小組嗎我想我們一定按照規定來處理那時程因為大家關注所以我們把整個兩個月的時程縮成一個禮拜要來完成那這個裡面是相當的詳細是不是請機關署莊署長來報告一下 |
| transcript.whisperx[133].start |
4940.892 |
| transcript.whisperx[133].end |
4964.203 |
| transcript.whisperx[133].text |
報告委員 因為本來規定是兩個月內 因為要做非常多的事情 比如說我們要延展外部的委員還有就進行匿名問卷的調查 根據調查結果 我們要去選取面談的對象 進行面談跟寫報告所以我們大概是用比較寬裕的時間 希望能夠把它完成但是你沒有選外部的人 |
| transcript.whisperx[134].start |
4964.363 |
| transcript.whisperx[134].end |
4965.484 |
| transcript.whisperx[134].text |
我接下來就要告訴第二件事情 |
| transcript.whisperx[135].start |
4983.754 |
| transcript.whisperx[135].end |
5007.762 |
| transcript.whisperx[135].text |
這邊是昨天呢下午有收到電話電話打進來澄清說請我們本辦公室要相信脆上面的留言因為他就是在疾管署其他單位工作的同仁那他是親眼看著這個組長曾經對著同仁罵豬啊等等的那再來呢昨天晚上好晚的時候又接到一封澄清信他是在講說 |
| transcript.whisperx[136].start |
5009.122 |
| transcript.whisperx[136].end |
5009.582 |
| transcript.whisperx[136].text |
他說不只是這個組長 |
| transcript.whisperx[137].start |
5026.89 |
| transcript.whisperx[137].end |
5049.947 |
| transcript.whisperx[137].text |
上刑下校庫立整備組組長是聯合底下的科長檢記集體的霸凌壓榨同仁逼的大家不得不離職掉職降調退休甚至請育嬰假等等的逃離現場不管是工作負荷量大身兼數職人力嚴重不足流動率過高入罵同仁能力差 |
| transcript.whisperx[138].start |
5050.567 |
| transcript.whisperx[138].end |
5050.767 |
| transcript.whisperx[138].text |
委員會委員會委員會委員會 |
| transcript.whisperx[139].start |
5077.128 |
| transcript.whisperx[139].end |
5079.752 |
| transcript.whisperx[139].text |
部長來幫他們陳情陸陸續續一直都有email進來啊簡訊進來等等的 |
| transcript.whisperx[140].start |
5096.098 |
| transcript.whisperx[140].end |
5115.763 |
| transcript.whisperx[140].text |
謝謝委員剛剛提到調查小組一定要公開透明再來昨天其實勞動部違反了一個很大的行政瑕疵中午的時候在這邊告訴我們說他要把分署長免職後來想一想又說可是他沒有這個權限必須要先召開懲戒委員會要召開這個調查會他才有辦法 |
| transcript.whisperx[141].start |
5116.903 |
| transcript.whisperx[141].end |
5143.878 |
| transcript.whisperx[141].text |
搞了一個小時嘛考機會搞了一個小時他說他沒有這個權限後來院長出來道歉了以後晚上他又開始召開這個考機會馬上召開了三小時然後說喔好他要宣布他記兩個大過免職這是嚴重的違反行政瑕疵更慘的是最後這位分署長的律師信就出來了他的律師信是告訴大家說根據我們勞動部的調查報告啊他沒有 |
| transcript.whisperx[142].start |
5145.21 |
| transcript.whisperx[142].end |
5174.27 |
| transcript.whisperx[142].text |
這個直接霸凌的事實但他有霸凌這位不幸往生者的主管然後最後他的律師居然是用勞動部的報告來幫他辯護所以這一點我也希望您之後在處理衛福部的時候可以借勁勞動部千萬要公正超然第二不能有任何的行政瑕疵好嗎你有沒有什麼方向可以告訴我們說一周的調查報告出來以後您大概多久要召開這個考機會因為算一算 |
| transcript.whisperx[143].start |
5175.052 |
| transcript.whisperx[143].end |
5178.647 |
| transcript.whisperx[143].text |
10月28號您應該就會有疾管署的初步報告出來了 |
| transcript.whisperx[144].start |
5180.526 |
| transcript.whisperx[144].end |
5206.916 |
| transcript.whisperx[144].text |
好謝謝委員的指教我非常清楚我再重申我們不容許有任何職場的霸凌所以只要有任何相關的信息我們一定嚴加調查嚴加辦理我想這是那個一定這是最大的原則而且所有相關的部門如果是哪個部門像機關署我們要求最快的適度那後續所以你的考機會你考機會 |
| transcript.whisperx[145].start |
5208.917 |
| transcript.whisperx[145].end |
5222.669 |
| transcript.whisperx[145].text |
就是我們預定下禮拜四會有報告啦那我們會盡量在當天看是不是可以就舉辦考試好那今天也請您參考一下這個陳秦涵因為不只是組長一個人好下一個想要請這個石署長 |
| transcript.whisperx[146].start |
5226.707 |
| transcript.whisperx[146].end |
5256.39 |
| transcript.whisperx[146].text |
這是近期內許多人民關心的議題因為石署長因為邱部長曾經在之前新聞的採訪說到兩年是部長見保費要用三支劍拼改革但是石署長在最近又公開的說在研擬補充保費的三項調整與一般保費來做溝通並且說針對六大類比如說許許多多很辛苦在爭取獎金的這些壽星階級他要分別制定不同的 |
| transcript.whisperx[147].start |
5256.51 |
| transcript.whisperx[147].end |
5256.89 |
| transcript.whisperx[147].text |
立法院第11屆第12會議 |
| transcript.whisperx[148].start |
5287.051 |
| transcript.whisperx[148].end |
5305.108 |
| transcript.whisperx[148].text |
可以給大家一個進程嗎?為什麼會有這樣子不同調的出現?報告委員我想沒有不同調所謂的部長保惠就是我們那個惠利一般保惠啦一般保惠因為這個比較影響層面比較大那至於調整 |
| transcript.whisperx[149].start |
5306.289 |
| transcript.whisperx[149].end |
5324.368 |
| transcript.whisperx[149].text |
補充保費這件事情一直都是我們的策略之一那現在健保署提出一個很可是調整補充保費您要修健保法所以您是意思是說您要左手開始修健保法嗎我們現在都演你我是不是請署署長報告一下 |
| transcript.whisperx[150].start |
5324.788 |
| transcript.whisperx[150].end |
5340.557 |
| transcript.whisperx[150].text |
跟委員報告因為目前健保法的規定那麼補充保費的調漲是跟隨一般保費的費率調動的他是連動而且在補充保費裡面有6項的補充保費費率一樣那這個確實你要把它6項分不同的費率 |
| transcript.whisperx[151].start |
5340.677 |
| transcript.whisperx[151].end |
5365.46 |
| transcript.whisperx[151].text |
所以我們現在研議說是不是應該要脫鉤處理因為這6項補充保費的本質還是有差異有些是比較偏向資本利得有些是勞務所得那目前的話是都綁在一起的那同時它的調動也要跟著一般保費費率調整的時候才能夠調整所以這個我們是希望您是預計什麼時候要開始著手修這個健保法 |
| transcript.whisperx[152].start |
5365.84 |
| transcript.whisperx[152].end |
5381.217 |
| transcript.whisperx[152].text |
目前都內部都已經在研議這個修法的方向那到一個階段會再跟外界做溝通之後再進入到修法的所以你的意思是說等你們調整完以後大概也就是部長講的兩年內啦所以大概是兩年後啊也需要一點時間 |
| transcript.whisperx[153].start |
5382.438 |
| transcript.whisperx[153].end |
5394.165 |
| transcript.whisperx[153].text |
那我們會再繼續跟你一起研擬這件事情那最後一題最後一題是想問說邱部長今天你有列在公務預算中用醫政業務這個執行的韌性國家醫療整備計畫看起來是114年編列了17.52 |
| transcript.whisperx[154].start |
5401.63 |
| transcript.whisperx[154].end |
5430.289 |
| transcript.whisperx[154].text |
總數其實是4年啊他是從113年連續4年總數是76.6億那我們不管是透過電話詢問或是詢問主計總處等等的都說是不能公開的一個機密那如果是機密的話我也想請您稍微講一下是你們採購合約的機密還是機密的預算還是涉及機密的事項因為我們對於你這個任性國家醫療準備計畫是一無所知 |
| transcript.whisperx[155].start |
5431.59 |
| transcript.whisperx[155].end |
5459.693 |
| transcript.whisperx[155].text |
好謝謝那我是不是先請醫事師回答一下這個任性醫療國家的計畫其實是主要是針對大型或特殊災難事件的時候我們重新檢視過我們自己的應變的量能從921之後其實剛開始是天然災害可是隨著極端氣候然後甚至是說我們看到的那個天然災害也變得嚴峻加劇了所以在這個地方上面做一個強化 |
| transcript.whisperx[156].start |
5460.213 |
| transcript.whisperx[156].end |
5475.623 |
| transcript.whisperx[156].text |
您說天然災害但是你很快的113就開始招標你在招標的上面是寫因應複合式災難還有全球軌跡多變的局勢未來台海衝突事件以及不可預期的災難災害必須加強戰場的災難醫療整備這個是你們招標的對於這個計畫講的 |
| transcript.whisperx[157].start |
5484.448 |
| transcript.whisperx[157].end |
5505.04 |
| transcript.whisperx[157].text |
對 因為就是說所有的應變裡面其實這幾個都是我們過去比較沒有經驗的所以您的意思是說在113 114之前您覺得我們國家醫療韌性對於戰爭的支撐比較短那經過這個計畫你們想要再把它拉長讓我們韌性再更久一點 |
| transcript.whisperx[158].start |
5505.8 |
| transcript.whisperx[158].end |
5517.065 |
| transcript.whisperx[158].text |
不是是我們所有對創傷這一塊的處理的量能然後跟經驗其實相對上面都需要做提升所以才會是說這個我們寫的是一個最嚴重的可能會是戰爭可是對於就是說我們看到了極端氣候產生的包括了 |
| transcript.whisperx[159].start |
5525.269 |
| transcript.whisperx[159].end |
5525.289 |
| transcript.whisperx[159].text |
委員長 |
| transcript.whisperx[160].start |
5555.51 |
| transcript.whisperx[160].end |
5570.687 |
| transcript.whisperx[160].text |
他們還是把它一項一項的寫出來了對 所以環境部那邊的話其實是透過最近其實像COP29就在講的是氣候調節的這一塊增加體系的韌性不是不是 他們內容其實也跟你們差不多 |
| transcript.whisperx[161].start |
5571.689 |
| transcript.whisperx[161].end |
5571.709 |
| transcript.whisperx[161].text |
委員會議 |
| transcript.whisperx[162].start |
5586.65 |
| transcript.whisperx[162].end |
5587.11 |
| transcript.whisperx[162].text |
委員指教 |
| transcript.whisperx[163].start |
5613.632 |
| transcript.whisperx[163].end |
5630.481 |
| transcript.whisperx[163].text |
好 謝謝陳委員 謝謝部長繼續我們請王一鳴委員質詢好 謝謝主席 我們是不是有請邱部長委員長 |
| transcript.whisperx[164].start |
5637.557 |
| transcript.whisperx[164].end |
5643.9 |
| transcript.whisperx[164].text |
部長好首先我要問你有關於食安的問題部長你有在吃薑黃粉嗎你有吃咖哩嗎我很喜歡吃咖哩很喜歡吃咖哩我要跟你講的就是我們蘇丹紅的食安問題報不完從辣椒粉到咖哩粉到現在最新的是薑黃粉 |
| transcript.whisperx[165].start |
5662.571 |
| transcript.whisperx[165].end |
5684.563 |
| transcript.whisperx[165].text |
一直都出現問題完全都沒有在市面上蘇丹紅沒有在市面上完全消失11月4號我才質詢有關於咖哩粉的事件然後你們才去查查了這個薑黃粉的業者然後查了22家現在爆發出來德和公司的薑黃粉有蘇丹紅 |
| transcript.whisperx[166].start |
5686.144 |
| transcript.whisperx[166].end |
5704.066 |
| transcript.whisperx[166].text |
一萬公斤已經售出五千七百多公斤．你們下架回收的才一千八百六十一公斤．很多人都吃下肚了．你們現在的查法就是委員報到哪裡．你們才查到哪裡都沒有超前部署 |
| transcript.whisperx[167].start |
5705.628 |
| transcript.whisperx[167].end |
5722.558 |
| transcript.whisperx[167].text |
這個薑黃粉現在有非常多的長輩他們覺得是很好的養生食品所以都買這種大瓶的回來加在飯裡面或者是沖泡來喝他覺得吃越多越健康是養生的 |
| transcript.whisperx[168].start |
5723.098 |
| transcript.whisperx[168].end |
5738.285 |
| transcript.whisperx[168].text |
所以越是這樣子的一個標榜養生的食品你就應該要更仔細的把關啊但是到目前為止你們現在薑黃粉你們去查的是印度的公司進口 |
| transcript.whisperx[169].start |
5739.164 |
| transcript.whisperx[169].end |
5763.382 |
| transcript.whisperx[169].text |
對不對你們現在邊境姜黃粉你們目標對象是印度但是你看看這個報關資料只有印度進口姜黃粉嗎沒有喔目前包括越南中國馬來西亞印尼西班牙斯里蘭卡我們所看到的報關資料這6個國家也都有進口姜黃粉 |
| transcript.whisperx[170].start |
5764.102 |
| transcript.whisperx[170].end |
5781.329 |
| transcript.whisperx[170].text |
那你們之前因為印度的出問題你們就只監控印度那現在越南變成是最大宗我就問你那越南進口的薑黃粉你能確保他的品質是100%沒有問題你們有逐批查驗嗎有或沒有 |
| transcript.whisperx[171].start |
5782.691 |
| transcript.whisperx[171].end |
5797.392 |
| transcript.whisperx[171].text |
包委員我們當然印度的從這一年來就前面監視查驗蘇丹紅我問你越南現在有沒有監視我不是請莊署長回答一下有嗎我看是沒有吧 |
| transcript.whisperx[172].start |
5800.557 |
| transcript.whisperx[172].end |
5824.805 |
| transcript.whisperx[172].text |
報告委員剛剛委員有提醒我們其實上次那個查到第一剛開始薑黃出問題的時候是因為那個特調咖啡特調咖哩粉然後後來我們去清查它裡面的所有原料才發現是薑黃粉那薑黃的時候跟委員特別報告一件事情是我們那天查出來以後我們就回溯了3年之內所有進來的印度的薑黃粉 |
| transcript.whisperx[173].start |
5825.845 |
| transcript.whisperx[173].end |
5846.646 |
| transcript.whisperx[173].text |
然後我們查了22批中間只有一批實際上是出現問題所以我們就開始回溯他們的這些東西對我現在問你就是你回溯的是印度那越南現在又變成你的大宗從10月份的資料看起來越南比印度進口的還要多那請問越南你們就只監控印度越南你們現在有去抽驗嗎越南的有沒有問題 |
| transcript.whisperx[174].start |
5848.927 |
| transcript.whisperx[174].end |
5877.906 |
| transcript.whisperx[174].text |
我們現在同仁正在確定我們現在如果如果他現在進來的時候我們都會開始加強抽菸批先從會從後市長這邊開始查起所以你現在還沒有掌握嗎好我就是要提醒你們就是不要委員問一件事情你們查一件你們應該要有全面性的這樣子去監控跟整頓我要再次強調目前薑黃粉是很夯的這個對於老人家來講他認為在保健方面他們是很相信的 |
| transcript.whisperx[175].start |
5878.266 |
| transcript.whisperx[175].end |
5899.347 |
| transcript.whisperx[175].text |
所以他不應該再去添加不必要的添加包括蘇丹紅在裡面你知道才能確保這一些長者很重視養生人的健康我要求的是你們應該要全面像這樣子的一個產品你已經有查出第一批你就應該要全面性的這些進口的來源你通通都要查清楚要嚴格的把關做不做得到 |
| transcript.whisperx[176].start |
5899.747 |
| transcript.whisperx[176].end |
5928.156 |
| transcript.whisperx[176].text |
做得到報告委員我們現在現在會列多少所有的薑黃粉不同不管哪一國進口我們現在已經全力列入監視查驗好全面的去監視查驗我們要確保這個是大家吃的是沒有問題的接下來我要問有關於這個輸液的問題這個部長我讓你看一張很誇張的班表這個是某一家藥廠他9月份跟地方政府提出來他的加班需求 |
| transcript.whisperx[177].start |
5929.757 |
| transcript.whisperx[177].end |
5956.317 |
| transcript.whisperx[177].text |
這當中你知道嗎我看到最驚悚的是有人加班時數要高達150.5到160小時他跟地方政府申請他有員工需要加班150到160小時有一個人是這樣子超過100人的總共有6個人你知道一個勞工如果加班超過150小時是什麼概念嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[178].start |
5957.037 |
| transcript.whisperx[178].end |
5971.9 |
| transcript.whisperx[178].text |
每天工作要長達12個小時加上週休二日都不要休都要上班是這樣的狀態就等於他變成機器人就是整整一個月都不能休息的狀態 |
| transcript.whisperx[179].start |
5973.407 |
| transcript.whisperx[179].end |
5997.372 |
| transcript.whisperx[179].text |
你有掌握嗎有藥廠9月份跟地方政府申報他需要的是勞工這麼過勞超時的加班來趕輸液但是你們對外說輸液通通夠沒有問題但是有藥廠是用這樣子的方式在幫忙趕工而這個是你們自己去要求勞動部幫你們解套 |
| transcript.whisperx[180].start |
5998.132 |
| transcript.whisperx[180].end |
6001.833 |
| transcript.whisperx[180].text |
請勞動部放寬條件運用的是在這種天災事變突發事件勞基法第32條第4項跟第40條的特殊加班幫你們開一個後門讓藥廠可以打破天花板然後要求勞工不斷加班只為了趕你們的輸益 |
| transcript.whisperx[181].start |
6024.341 |
| transcript.whisperx[181].end |
6040.066 |
| transcript.whisperx[181].text |
那你們對外又宣稱說輸液是夠的但是有藥廠提出這麼誇張的一個加班時數這個到底是為什麼部長你有掌握嗎其實這整個過程我們相關的部門都非常的努力我也都有掌握狀況那我們當然嚴格的就是說加班只能 |
| transcript.whisperx[182].start |
6044.697 |
| transcript.whisperx[182].end |
6066.41 |
| transcript.whisperx[182].text |
為了人工輸液我們當然就是一定要在勞動部合可的情況之下這是我們基本的要求自己說這樣的一個努力之下的確是度過了一個困難的艱苦的一個時期雖然現在的使用上有些醫療驗手還是因為包裝大小的問題 |
| transcript.whisperx[183].start |
6068.051 |
| transcript.whisperx[183].end |
6076.136 |
| transcript.whisperx[183].text |
還是有一些困擾但是至少量方面是夠的啦那至於說是不是有這樣的掌握我們超過這麼多是不是莊市長有沒有 |
| transcript.whisperx[184].start |
6077.661 |
| transcript.whisperx[184].end |
6100.375 |
| transcript.whisperx[184].text |
這個有啊這個我調到資料就是這樣報告委員這一次因為那個輸液的問題我們請那個臺灣的那個生產的藥廠加班那這件事情我們也請勞委會勞動部同意加班但是我們那個整個文來的時候我們是希望他在符合勞基法的要求之下那這幾家的他特使操作加班這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[185].start |
6101.195 |
| transcript.whisperx[185].end |
6126.722 |
| transcript.whisperx[185].text |
我們那時候是因為勞動部下去做勞檢的時候發現他們的時數過高那現在才開始裁罰那其他的因為這次所有的加班的時數其實我們那時候都有跟廠商講希望他還是符合勞基法的情況之下那你要符合勞基法你就不應該去運用天災事變突發事件這一條啊你知道這一條是太上皇條款你只要運用了之後他是沒有上限的 |
| transcript.whisperx[186].start |
6128.513 |
| transcript.whisperx[186].end |
6136.187 |
| transcript.whisperx[186].text |
那所謂你們的上限你們希望符合勞基法是多少按照現行勞基法最高一個月如果工會同意的話才到54小時 |
| transcript.whisperx[187].start |
6138.786 |
| transcript.whisperx[187].end |
6164.311 |
| transcript.whisperx[187].text |
那你們這一個你們用的是天災事變所以是等於是沒有天花板當然就會變成是這個樣子啊所以你們勞動部難死其救啊你們造成是基層的這一些藥廠的勞工過勞的一個情況而你們通通都沒有把關他們這麼的辛勞就是為了應付你們輸液的問題當時的一個處置不大你們後知後覺9月份這個頒表你有看過嗎你們知道嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[188].start |
6167.967 |
| transcript.whisperx[188].end |
6175.732 |
| transcript.whisperx[188].text |
也渾然不知你還說你們有監督那你們根本我要求你們去看實際的狀況我只關心這一個勞工一個月150小時以上的加班他現在人還好嗎有沒有爆肝你們作為衛福部好好去關心一下我們馬上來關心來瞭解 |
| transcript.whisperx[189].start |
6188.221 |
| transcript.whisperx[189].end |
6204.761 |
| transcript.whisperx[189].text |
對啊 這個就是一個非常誇張嘛但是一切都是因你們而起嘛你們輸液就是缺乏然後你們又讓勞動部去發了一個文而且還持續到10月31號你們當時發出的文它可以運用突破勞基法的這一個第32條第4項第40條 |
| transcript.whisperx[190].start |
6207.684 |
| transcript.whisperx[190].end |
6212.329 |
| transcript.whisperx[190].text |
還到10月31號所以這當中我要你們去回溯去關照到底有多少勞工在這個過程其實是爆肝的幫你們去趕輸液看你們要怎麼去去這個勞工你們他的身體健康你們衛福部好好去關照一下我覺得這個問題其實是蠻誇張的另外一個 |
| transcript.whisperx[191].start |
6226.483 |
| transcript.whisperx[191].end |
6249.102 |
| transcript.whisperx[191].text |
既然輸液問題已經解決了你們現在在預算裡面輸液的預算從2.5億要暴增到11億為什麼你們說現在輸液已經沒有問題了9月永豐也已經開始恢復供應了那為什麼你還要暴增11億你這個是要打算要大量還必須從國外進口嗎你們原來只需要2.5億為什麼暴增 |
| transcript.whisperx[192].start |
6253.15 |
| transcript.whisperx[192].end |
6281.053 |
| transcript.whisperx[192].text |
我想這有兩個原因就是因為我們當然沒辦法完全掌握到國內或國外進口這個量的一個數目第二個就是我們必須因為過去的價錢的確是太低那經過供應會議還是討論調整嘛調整了以後就會那個預算當然就會那我就問你我們現在國內供應輸入的量到底夠不夠嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[193].start |
6284.928 |
| transcript.whisperx[193].end |
6306.556 |
| transcript.whisperx[193].text |
你們對外都說夠那我就問你到底現在足不足夠應該還是有穩定的一個國外的輸入加上國內的那我們一直在輔導國內的趕快恢復所以現在即使永豐加入生產之後也還不夠他還沒有量產現在已經11月了還不夠 |
| transcript.whisperx[194].start |
6309.62 |
| transcript.whisperx[194].end |
6326.582 |
| transcript.whisperx[194].text |
跟委員報告目前還是需要仰賴那個專案輸入到目前為止還是這樣那能夠供應到這個第一線的使用還沒有辦法完全有國內國產像過去都是國產供應沒有這個專案輸入現在還仍然需要專案輸入 |
| transcript.whisperx[195].start |
6327.654 |
| transcript.whisperx[195].end |
6340.623 |
| transcript.whisperx[195].text |
好如果是這樣子的話這一筆預算我會嚴格監督喔因為你們從今年最迫切需要是2.5億那你明年照道理來講我們國產的應該加入不需要那麼大的量結果你還暴增經費變成11億顯然這個是有浮邊的嫌疑喔 |
| transcript.whisperx[196].start |
6344.606 |
| transcript.whisperx[196].end |
6363.655 |
| transcript.whisperx[196].text |
這個我們一定會嚴格把關喔最後我要提醒部長的就是不可以因為你的趕工去壓迫這些藥廠基層的勞工甚至讓他爆肝我看到這種超過100小時的加班我覺得是不可思議而如果你們都沒有出面去處理我覺得這個就是失職 |
| transcript.whisperx[197].start |
6364.555 |
| transcript.whisperx[197].end |
6389.542 |
| transcript.whisperx[197].text |
我們會出面處理我跟委員再報告一下那個11億那個原來其實是在健保裡面那因為政府體諒到說讓健保不要太壓力太大所以才特別讓11億變成公務預算但這是輸液啊對就是輸液這件事情所以你原本輸液就需要11億嗎原來我們11億是要在健保的總額裡面到預算的時候我們會再來填好這個要先說清楚 |
| transcript.whisperx[198].start |
6390.362 |
| transcript.whisperx[198].end |
6406.589 |
| transcript.whisperx[198].text |
然後政府先生很好意就是想說不要就是播出那個我沒有意見但是如果你過度去膨脹你的輸液進口的這個預算我有意見我想那個所有的價錢都一定經過供你會議的專家大家同意我們預算的時候會嚴格來監督謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[199].start |
6413.117 |
| transcript.whisperx[199].end |
6437.484 |
| transcript.whisperx[199].text |
好謝謝黃委員那接下來我們請邱振興委員質詢那我們在林淑芬委員花園完畢後休息10分鐘好主席好我們還是有請我們的邱部長委員好部長好 |
| transcript.whisperx[200].start |
6440.005 |
| transcript.whisperx[200].end |
6461.019 |
| transcript.whisperx[200].text |
這個昨天勞動部勞動力發展署北分署霸凌的事情昨天河北山部長辭職負責但今天又傳出我剛剛看了很多委員也在提這個案子就是機管署某組長也有霸凌的同仁的情形情況與謝宜龍的狀況非常相同你知道這件事嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[201].start |
6465.689 |
| transcript.whisperx[201].end |
6467.671 |
| transcript.whisperx[201].text |
為什麼要改?你為什麼要改我的指令?為什麼要改? |
| transcript.whisperx[202].start |
6491.574 |
| transcript.whisperx[202].end |
6510.71 |
| transcript.whisperx[202].text |
他其實已經有他原本就已經你寫的可以嗎你有這個時間嗎我會這樣做我是神經病嗎你沒有去開幾組的會你怎麼看做指令下次我不要跟你們開會了什麼意思 |
| transcript.whisperx[203].start |
6517.363 |
| transcript.whisperx[203].end |
6517.663 |
| transcript.whisperx[203].text |
好,部長這您聽一下,這聲音你認得嗎? |
| transcript.whisperx[204].start |
6537.315 |
| transcript.whisperx[204].end |
6539.737 |
| transcript.whisperx[204].text |
你會不會依照勞動部來處理? |
| transcript.whisperx[205].start |
6554.059 |
| transcript.whisperx[205].end |
6557.482 |
| transcript.whisperx[205].text |
一定會啊,我們已經馬上啟動調查我們一個禮拜內會有調查,這個莊署長剛剛已經有我請部長要加快啦,因為我認識部長也沒有多久我希望你能夠留下來好不好 |
| transcript.whisperx[206].start |
6570.231 |
| transcript.whisperx[206].end |
6594.241 |
| transcript.whisperx[206].text |
我們一定不容許有職場霸凌的現象這跟個人不是個人的問題是說整個國家就應該要這樣子我們才是一個幸福好啦那我們就回到今天的主要的議題那昨天本土小牙醫聯盟跟海外牙醫的家長在高等法院外面為了你吵架你知道嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[207].start |
6596.413 |
| transcript.whisperx[207].end |
6600.298 |
| transcript.whisperx[207].text |
報告委員跟我應該我只是代表在把過去長期的爭議 |
| transcript.whisperx[208].start |
6606.249 |
| transcript.whisperx[208].end |
6625.42 |
| transcript.whisperx[208].text |
然後到我這階段我當然是用最大的誠意最大的努力來解決一直以來我們台灣社會對於撥撥醫生不只是牙醫的部分直接一點就是說拿錢去波蘭醫學店洗學歷之後回來考照的醫生大家普遍都會覺得害怕 |
| transcript.whisperx[209].start |
6626.3 |
| transcript.whisperx[209].end |
6643.523 |
| transcript.whisperx[209].text |
那部長你認為臺灣人民的健康守護者還是波波醫生的你認為你是臺灣人民健康的守護者還是波波醫生的守門員你的立場跟態度是什麼我必須要再重申我完全沒有特定的對哪一個 |
| transcript.whisperx[210].start |
6644.404 |
| transcript.whisperx[210].end |
6660.22 |
| transcript.whisperx[210].text |
群組的一個部長那你可不同意中間有非常非常多的我也不曉得包括111年6月我們在這邊用心的來通過一個議事法的修法那個是我前程在這邊讓他那個法通過 |
| transcript.whisperx[211].start |
6661.141 |
| transcript.whisperx[211].end |
6661.301 |
| transcript.whisperx[211].text |
好的醫療品質 |
| transcript.whisperx[212].start |
6684.565 |
| transcript.whisperx[212].end |
6696.223 |
| transcript.whisperx[212].text |
有嚴格的教育養成我相信部長也認同吧那台灣的醫生的養成跟波蘭醫生的養成哪一個更嚴謹你覺得雖然我們有修法的沒有錯 |
| transcript.whisperx[213].start |
6699.386 |
| transcript.whisperx[213].end |
6727.908 |
| transcript.whisperx[213].text |
但你覺得臺灣的臺灣的比較嚴謹還是國外的比較嚴謹我們所有讓他在臺灣行醫的醫師不管他從哪個醫學院畢業我們基本要求都要讓他有有有品質能夠照顧人民的健康這是基本要求那至於說要比較良因為我我家裡的第二代齁那個也很多人當醫師年輕了一輩有11個11億個當練醫學系通通是本土醫 |
| transcript.whisperx[214].start |
6729.74 |
| transcript.whisperx[214].end |
6748.111 |
| transcript.whisperx[214].text |
所以我沒有立場去特別要支持我們來討論一下啦就是醫生的考試我一個臺大的醫學院的老師我當然覺得我們臺灣的品質非常的嚴謹我們的教育品質非常的嚴謹那我們來討論一下醫生的考試111年你剛剛講的修了醫師法第四之一條從112年開始用國外學歷參加考試 |
| transcript.whisperx[215].start |
6756.196 |
| transcript.whisperx[215].end |
6782.036 |
| transcript.whisperx[215].text |
要先經過教育部學歷徵試通過才能參加醫師考試那國內要念醫學院門檻本來就比較高一點通常念到大三大四就會參加第一階段的國考那經過實習之後畢業後再考第二階段的國考才有考試及格證書號申請到衛福部的醫師證書之後才能夠算一個合格的醫師這樣沒錯吧 |
| transcript.whisperx[216].start |
6786.193 |
| transcript.whisperx[216].end |
6810.338 |
| transcript.whisperx[216].text |
但是現在的問題裡面就是事之一裡面也有說兩個條件不用經過教育部學歷增試通過第一個就是在當地取得合法資格且實際執行臨床業務5年以上第二個112年12月31日前入學的也不用現在的問題是怎麼確認他在當地實際這個臨床服務這個業務5年以上 |
| transcript.whisperx[217].start |
6815.322 |
| transcript.whisperx[217].end |
6830.506 |
| transcript.whisperx[217].text |
還有一千多名的波波醫生不用不適用心法你們準備讓這些一千多位這個波波醫生快速通關嗎好我想這個醫事師師長很清楚是可不可以請他回報告跟大家報告 |
| transcript.whisperx[218].start |
6831.124 |
| transcript.whisperx[218].end |
6858.914 |
| transcript.whisperx[218].text |
委員好對於就是說在這個考試制度的把關的部分的話過去在還沒修法之前是一個裁認的原則所以其實對於就是說我們把裁認原則修在議事法實行細則這也近日快要將要公佈所以才會是說在把關的部分其實不裡面這邊我們的方向程度之前部長就對外宣誓的是說其實我們本來就是採取嚴格的方式來做處理 |
| transcript.whisperx[219].start |
6859.914 |
| transcript.whisperx[219].end |
6887.076 |
| transcript.whisperx[219].text |
我覺得這樣子啦就是舊法不是用學歷來徵是不用學歷來徵試那他們就應該用106年頒布的學歷認證去共識去認證我覺得是這樣不管用新法還是舊法都應該有兩道門檻我覺得應該這樣子會比較嚴謹那我也看到我們這個在當初我們修醫師法的時候民進黨委員一共通過七個附帶決議 |
| transcript.whisperx[220].start |
6888.357 |
| transcript.whisperx[220].end |
6900.488 |
| transcript.whisperx[220].text |
那其中有5個部長都是連署人有一個提案其中有一個提案就是我們波波媽的委員部長還記得連署什麼嗎因為我全程在 |
| transcript.whisperx[221].start |
6902.324 |
| transcript.whisperx[221].end |
6924.231 |
| transcript.whisperx[221].text |
互代決議是提供多元化的一個意見我想大家委員都很清楚那我當然就是要三個委員才能成案所以我們當然是說如果有意見就提出來會議討論要到成案我只是連署讓他這個意見可以來討論而已我並沒有去提案 |
| transcript.whisperx[222].start |
6925.291 |
| transcript.whisperx[222].end |
6928.333 |
| transcript.whisperx[222].text |
但我發現我們現在有一個優化偏鄉醫療的計畫我怎麼看都感覺到你這個跟這個就是為了撥撥牙醫開的一個很順暢因為這個優化偏鄉其實是長久的事情 |
| transcript.whisperx[223].start |
6943.743 |
| transcript.whisperx[223].end |
6958.913 |
| transcript.whisperx[223].text |
那委員可能看到就是有關於牙醫這個部分其實他其他部分是非常多要做的包括醫療轉後送等加強量能那這個部分我們政府經過這段時間的討論已經在這裡面上禮拜重申我想總統也有提到每年不會超過50名第一個每年50名那個結論不會提高 |
| transcript.whisperx[224].start |
6972.821 |
| transcript.whisperx[224].end |
6997.651 |
| transcript.whisperx[224].text |
我們一定按照112年6月通過的醫師法的修法去嚴格執行那第三個就是有關於偏鄉計畫的話我們在牙醫只限你55個沒有牙醫師的鄉鎮因為他們那個地方的確真的是需要你現在提到我們預算是不是要調整因為預算來處理這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[225].start |
6999.281 |
| transcript.whisperx[225].end |
7000.362 |
| transcript.whisperx[225].text |
這些偏鄉本來醫療資源就比較少 |
| transcript.whisperx[226].start |
7026.061 |
| transcript.whisperx[226].end |
7041.887 |
| transcript.whisperx[226].text |
那我不希望我們部裡面拿這些偏鄉的我們的這個國人來當實驗的一個地方讓我們這些伯伯牙醫能夠順利的拿到這個醫師執照我希望衛福部能夠更嚴謹的來看守這樣可以嗎我們這個計畫會做調整 |
| transcript.whisperx[227].start |
7044.008 |
| transcript.whisperx[227].end |
7062.023 |
| transcript.whisperx[227].text |
那另外我們苗栗這個9個衛生所也非常缺醫生那真的這個醫生也非常的不足非常需要部裡面的資源請部長多多協助也希望我們會跟縣政府這邊來一起來討論看怎麼一起來解決好的謝謝謝謝部長謝謝好謝謝邱委員謝謝部長包委員會我們在抒情前執行完後休息10分鐘 |
| transcript.whisperx[228].start |
7079.953 |
| transcript.whisperx[228].end |
7092.142 |
| transcript.whisperx[228].text |
接下來我們請朱新泉委員謝謝 謝謝前委員部長還有醫事司長還有口腔師司長部長辛苦了我看你在回答問題非常小心非常好我昨天問那個勞動部部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[229].start |
7109.961 |
| transcript.whisperx[229].end |
7121.165 |
| transcript.whisperx[229].text |
昨天就任滿半年昨天11月12日你自己打幾分我從來不會為自己打分次我只知道要繼續努力這樣子 |
| transcript.whisperx[230].start |
7129.744 |
| transcript.whisperx[230].end |
7154.863 |
| transcript.whisperx[230].text |
你也知道衛福部很忙的,忙到沒什麼忙衛福部加大越大,人又那麼多部立醫院就只有所屬,怕死人太多所以不會出事我才奇怪出事才剛剛好而已所以我還是跟大家一起戰戰兢兢那我現在今天要跟你延續講這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[231].start |
7156.984 |
| transcript.whisperx[231].end |
7182.692 |
| transcript.whisperx[231].text |
國外醫師啦我們不要講波波啦講波波有點鄙視還有看不起人家我深深的不油然我今天在這邊很震動的講我不偏袒本土的牙醫啦還有波波回來的牙醫講這樣是很難聽這個問題是從馬英九時代到現在都一直延續那我現在請問你一個問題你們去年修改 |
| transcript.whisperx[232].start |
7183.992 |
| transcript.whisperx[232].end |
7194.462 |
| transcript.whisperx[232].text |
醫療法之後那今年出去念書的念醫學跟牙醫他們要報備嗎有沒有減少不用報備 |
| transcript.whisperx[233].start |
7195.994 |
| transcript.whisperx[233].end |
7213.151 |
| transcript.whisperx[233].text |
補充一下因為就學是個人自由所以這個地方是不用報備是回來考試的時候申請這邊會從那個考選部跟教育部這邊學歷認證這邊到底有沒有問題可不可以考試是從那邊開始有資料以上 |
| transcript.whisperx[234].start |
7213.892 |
| transcript.whisperx[234].end |
7239.702 |
| transcript.whisperx[234].text |
所以你沒有在關 你要去哪裡不管就對了但是從今年入學的我跟大家報告從今年入學到國安院醫生回來都必須要考鑑定考試鑑定考試及格力鑑定對Pretest不管你是從九大地區從美國英國回來都要嘛那我是覺得台灣有點開倒車啦 |
| transcript.whisperx[235].start |
7241.653 |
| transcript.whisperx[235].end |
7260.808 |
| transcript.whisperx[235].text |
以前在馬英九時代是九大地區回來的不用考pre-test直接可以考第一階段Part 1嘛對不對啊Part 1考過之後就可以當實習實習一年之後再臨床醫學考過OSCE考過就可以考Part 2嘛 |
| transcript.whisperx[236].start |
7261.67 |
| transcript.whisperx[236].end |
7268.093 |
| transcript.whisperx[236].text |
趴住之後就拿到醫師證書就進入PGY現在兩年以後做過全年醫師全年律師隊部長也做過管道要比較高全世界的議員這麼多以前九大地區的時候是包括歐盟 |
| transcript.whisperx[237].start |
7286.909 |
| transcript.whisperx[237].end |
7293.673 |
| transcript.whisperx[237].text |
包括歐盟那舊的歐盟是有15個國家後來有新的歐盟加進去像 |
| transcript.whisperx[238].start |
7294.827 |
| transcript.whisperx[238].end |
7323.337 |
| transcript.whisperx[238].text |
波蘭、匈牙利、羅馬尼亞、保加利亞、加勁、捷克等等有10個國家所以現在才有15加10有25個國家那我們不能認定什麼舊歐盟跟新歐盟歐盟是一體的所以才搞成現在這個問題嘛不然這樣就對了阿中華民國的國民只要他中華民國籍他就要受憲法的保障 |
| transcript.whisperx[239].start |
7324.568 |
| transcript.whisperx[239].end |
7347.447 |
| transcript.whisperx[239].text |
他因為婚姻遷徙或者是父母親我認識的很多外交官很多那個外貿協會的他們父母親派出在國外啊 孩子就一定在那裡讀書啊啊 帶他回來他如果有讀什麼學他回來可不可以說他如果在法律學要回來課就輸你可不可以不要去課 |
| transcript.whisperx[240].start |
7348.368 |
| transcript.whisperx[240].end |
7349.189 |
| transcript.whisperx[240].text |
臺灣的本土的醫生畢業的當然很強啊因為 |
| transcript.whisperx[241].start |
7375.663 |
| transcript.whisperx[241].end |
7399.707 |
| transcript.whisperx[241].text |
大家都這樣說過來,很累但是,有沒有你就是世界第一名不是耶我在考選部那邊也當過委員那個國外,像美國紐約大學回來的牙醫系的他想回來我看他的學歷、成績非常好啊這種不能讓他回來也限制他不能實習胡說八道所以我們講事情要講,大家聽得下去 |
| transcript.whisperx[242].start |
7404.946 |
| transcript.whisperx[242].end |
7412.953 |
| transcript.whisperx[242].text |
你也只剝剝剝剝,一天到晚都剝剝,這樣被人鄙視,獵巫,說不值一提,禮拜天又要遊行,然後我們黨團一直表演表示意見,我們,我也沒有在這邊,也沒有在那邊,我們比較公正,我們酒酥冷酥嘛,對不對,那你回來的, |
| transcript.whisperx[243].start |
7427.635 |
| transcript.whisperx[243].end |
7446.155 |
| transcript.whisperx[243].text |
從今年在國外不管你是在美國在英國在哪裡你念醫學院醫學系回來台灣都要考鑑定考試嘛PRE-TEST是很難過的呢及格率我看還沒有到10%喔有一年我給他查才6%啊牙醫是6%嗎牙醫是6%嘛那很夭壽我告訴你齁 |
| transcript.whisperx[244].start |
7450.762 |
| transcript.whisperx[244].end |
7463.247 |
| transcript.whisperx[244].text |
好啦那今天這樣也是唸了然後回來趴萬也考過了然後現在在那邊等待實習然後你就說我一定要一年只能50個我前幾天到離港有一個在賣牛肉麵的阿嬤桑 她女兒就是去波蘭塔亞裔回來結果也趴萬課過了 |
| transcript.whisperx[245].start |
7477.022 |
| transcript.whisperx[245].end |
7480.523 |
| transcript.whisperx[245].text |
所以說那波蘭那波蘭特赤都好惹人好笑 錯啦 不一定是這樣那小孩子有意願 媽媽就站在那裡去託 要考過囉我說你現在在幹嘛 他說現在在賣化妝品我說怎麼了 他說在等啊 等實習啊我說你要等多久 他說他算成要等8年 |
| transcript.whisperx[246].start |
7504.546 |
| transcript.whisperx[246].end |
7517.301 |
| transcript.whisperx[246].text |
請你備你所以這個也沒道理啦所以這個是人家考過在那邊等待實習的那你把他踐踏把他汙名化然後讓他不能實習 |
| transcript.whisperx[247].start |
7519.045 |
| transcript.whisperx[247].end |
7536.963 |
| transcript.whisperx[247].text |
部長阿你要怎麼說你也很小心要回答阿我想這個都有歷史的一個演變阿我想剛剛召委真的我已經非常了解到整個脈動阿那我們都是在解決這些長期的爭議那當然以大家的 |
| transcript.whisperx[248].start |
7538.751 |
| transcript.whisperx[248].end |
7549.975 |
| transcript.whisperx[248].text |
我想國際牙醫這邊當然是不滿意50名非常的限額那我們的本土牙醫這邊當然是覺得希望降低我想這個一直多年來一直在爭議這個問題我講兩個例子 |
| transcript.whisperx[249].start |
7553.656 |
| transcript.whisperx[249].end |
7568.538 |
| transcript.whisperx[249].text |
我們馬來西亞的臺灣人喔欸 華僑回來臺灣念書念高雄醫學院念完在我們醫院在長庚然後到長衛科專科醫師然後帶娶臺灣老婆回到馬來西亞 |
| transcript.whisperx[250].start |
7570.22 |
| transcript.whisperx[250].end |
7579.473 |
| transcript.whisperx[250].text |
當然這在台灣唸書也是國外嘛馬來西亞就承認台灣的意識之道 免課但是這條路你要去偏鄉給他六年所以他就乖乖的從某處走到東馬 |
| transcript.whisperx[251].start |
7586.503 |
| transcript.whisperx[251].end |
7610.098 |
| transcript.whisperx[251].text |
去沙羅園 去端麥 去做醫生 現在正在做 現在做第三年他覺得放棄臺灣的常委和專科醫師 臺文也不錯他照顧他 一直去 他更加有前途 去發展所以各國的 不一樣的平和制度 考試制度 或者是認定制度 我們都尊重 |
| transcript.whisperx[252].start |
7611.301 |
| transcript.whisperx[252].end |
7626.974 |
| transcript.whisperx[252].text |
所以不同的國家的認定方式我們自己有自己的方法這個在當市長的時候你們都通過了嘛市長的時候另外一個我講更嚴肅的我們的中醫市長以前中醫 |
| transcript.whisperx[253].start |
7632.413 |
| transcript.whisperx[253].end |
7653.357 |
| transcript.whisperx[253].text |
中醫師沒考的時候中醫師是用特考捏特考是什麼意思我們年輕人可能都忘光了搞不好你們要出生啦中醫師可以去考檢定考試考完檢定考試就等於是高等檢定考試考過之後你就有資格去考中醫師特考結果呢會念書都考得上欸 那種會有幾個中醫特考會有幾個幾千個 |
| transcript.whisperx[254].start |
7665.458 |
| transcript.whisperx[254].end |
7681.703 |
| transcript.whisperx[254].text |
中醫特考過的人數目前大概是佔整個中醫職業人數的4成多4成多 聽好 以前更多還要扣到都什麼種的 書磚壁咬不下 或是軍裝壁咬不下因為他那要背 要托 背到要死 中醫的東西 要我托不下來 這樣扣過 |
| transcript.whisperx[255].start |
7690.932 |
| transcript.whisperx[255].end |
7701.335 |
| transcript.whisperx[255].text |
課過後他課高等檢定考試課過後他就課中醫特考課過後他就中醫書了喔對不對那十尊比較的老師都教他讀書喔這樣他真的要做中醫書請問他的醫學的訓練夠嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[256].start |
7707.799 |
| transcript.whisperx[256].end |
7735.736 |
| transcript.whisperx[256].text |
所以我們中醫中醫衛生部才把他們一個一個都找去中國醫藥大學去專門做醫師養成教育基礎醫學上都在幫忙這個就是時代的產物那現在呢要考沒有中醫特考了對不起現在只有中醫系政科的才可以考對不對這樣對不對是是是所以中藥三也一樣頂頂所以我是覺得這一件事情 |
| transcript.whisperx[257].start |
7736.476 |
| transcript.whisperx[257].end |
7758.097 |
| transcript.whisperx[257].text |
國際議員議員 |
| transcript.whisperx[258].start |
7758.652 |
| transcript.whisperx[258].end |
7765.195 |
| transcript.whisperx[258].text |
在排隊的6、4、56、8幾個6、4、5排隊的6、8幾個要怎麼解決你也不能幫6、9所以是一個高難度的問題連總統也要怕死賴總統你本身是好意思的 |
| transcript.whisperx[259].start |
7776.909 |
| transcript.whisperx[259].end |
7779.752 |
| transcript.whisperx[259].text |
臺灣的護衛醫系還是臺灣的護衛醫系獲得到國外訓因為婚姻遷徙什麼什麼什麼一大堆因素我不知道啦 |
| transcript.whisperx[260].start |
7798.189 |
| transcript.whisperx[260].end |
7810.315 |
| transcript.whisperx[260].text |
反正只要他們有學歷回來,我們就要面對啦,就全部排斥,我不為誰啦,但是我們還是要解決問題啦 |
| transcript.whisperx[261].start |
7812.335 |
| transcript.whisperx[261].end |
7838.629 |
| transcript.whisperx[261].text |
我們會勇於面對勇於認罪勇於面對勇於面對這樣的長久下來的一個這就是我們政府跟專業團體的責任因為希望真的在提供民眾最好的一個醫療品質跟環境以外怎麼樣解決長期的紛爭如果舊的問題我們是不是用更好的方法更新的方法來解決 |
| transcript.whisperx[262].start |
7840.551 |
| transcript.whisperx[262].end |
7857.753 |
| transcript.whisperx[262].text |
其實這一段期間我們也跟本土小孩做了最公開坦誠的一個互動也修改了它的內容所以譬如說偏鄉者現在就不會去做任何實習的這個部分這個有一點違反剛剛蘇昭偉所提的 |
| transcript.whisperx[263].start |
7858.615 |
| transcript.whisperx[263].end |
7874.769 |
| transcript.whisperx[263].text |
一個那個但是沒辦法因為這個這個我們為了減少爭議趕快大家好好的去洗衣去行衣那個不要讓讓社會更加的平和民眾需要的是我們大家的照顧偏鄉需要的是好的醫師願意下去照顧他們 |
| transcript.whisperx[264].start |
7875.976 |
| transcript.whisperx[264].end |
7891.338 |
| transcript.whisperx[264].text |
我最後講一個就是你今年開始全世界不管先進國家中等國家或怎麼樣這些醫學院的學生要來台灣畢業要來考台灣的證照都必須要考鑑定考 |
| transcript.whisperx[265].start |
7892.139 |
| transcript.whisperx[265].end |
7905.917 |
| transcript.whisperx[265].text |
而且鑑定考試很難考我不曉得臺灣接下來這樣是會進步還是會退步你只有全部都是本土的本土的美國的也回不來英國的也回不來這樣不好進行結婚 |
| transcript.whisperx[266].start |
7910.761 |
| transcript.whisperx[266].end |
7938.257 |
| transcript.whisperx[266].text |
報告委員其實像我們仿照美國好了美國的那種國際學程很多有名的大學也是有國際學程但是他們的訓練是蠻扎實我們台灣的醫學院畢業也是要進入國際學程經過一個嚴格的訓練然後也可以考照那這個percentage大概也差不多是我們現在8%左右8到10%所以這個50個名額其實是看起來是以國際比較起來是還算合理 |
| transcript.whisperx[267].start |
7939.137 |
| transcript.whisperx[267].end |
7953.434 |
| transcript.whisperx[267].text |
因為國際像美國的名大學也都是大概這個percentage最後我跟大家報告這個因為我有去研究美國的本土的美國人要簽他們的議案他也沒有在外面簽約的簽不對了喔有推掉喔 |
| transcript.whisperx[268].start |
7958.683 |
| transcript.whisperx[268].end |
7965.186 |
| transcript.whisperx[268].text |
全無料他就去加拿大選 選議員或是美國的屬地波多黎各 格羅納達因美國的議員會去他設婚校美國人就直接跑到那邊去念那念是不是比照美國的學歷那當然啊因為他有一段時間實習是回美國那是美國的屬地 |
| transcript.whisperx[269].start |
7984.056 |
| transcript.whisperx[269].end |
8012.507 |
| transcript.whisperx[269].text |
再申請不到的就跑到波蘭東歐去所以他們也會開一個英文班的專班那是要迎合美國這麼大的核心要去的我們台灣人去那邊是在教育的隨班戶讀的全程英文教學所以你說那些人到西班牙到哪裡去念的醫生去那邊受訓很差很差很差 |
| transcript.whisperx[270].start |
8013.467 |
| transcript.whisperx[270].end |
8036.944 |
| transcript.whisperx[270].text |
不要這樣講啦不過站在我們一起維護的人民的醫療品質我們還是會從嚴來審查他的學歷以及相關的考試我們一定是從嚴來保障品質也當然謝謝委員的很多寶貴的指教好 部長加油謝謝好 謝謝我們蘇新前委員接下來我們休息10分鐘 |
| transcript.whisperx[271].start |
8046.772 |
| transcript.whisperx[271].end |
8047.673 |
| transcript.whisperx[271].text |
法定人數不足 |
| transcript.whisperx[272].start |
8076.418 |
| transcript.whisperx[272].end |
8077.58 |
| transcript.whisperx[272].text |
法定人數不足 |
| transcript.whisperx[273].start |
8098.073 |
| transcript.whisperx[273].end |
8099.174 |
| transcript.whisperx[273].text |
委員會主席 |
| transcript.whisperx[274].start |
8805.455 |
| transcript.whisperx[274].end |
8808.377 |
| transcript.whisperx[274].text |
好我們繼續開會我們請林淑雯委員質詢好謝謝主席我們是不是還是請邱部長部長請委員好 |
| transcript.whisperx[275].start |
8831.368 |
| transcript.whisperx[275].end |
8844.437 |
| transcript.whisperx[275].text |
部長好這個職場霸凌的這個案件鬧得沸沸揚揚的那因為我們集團署也被爆料那我首先要先在這裡跟大家講根據111人力銀行的這個調查報告職場霸凌裡面的產業別除了傳統製造業的18%最高以外 |
| transcript.whisperx[276].start |
8860.406 |
| transcript.whisperx[276].end |
8865.668 |
| transcript.whisperx[276].text |
公務部門的職場霸凌比例,雖然排名第4,但第2名是13%,第4名是12%,相差無幾 |
| transcript.whisperx[277].start |
8873.112 |
| transcript.whisperx[277].end |
8882.28 |
| transcript.whisperx[277].text |
意思就是說公務體系公家機關教育部門這些公部門裡面的職場霸凌的問題這個是僅次於製造業這樣子是非常嚴重的這是人力銀行的調查報告職場霸凌在公務體系很嚴重 |
| transcript.whisperx[278].start |
8894.295 |
| transcript.whisperx[278].end |
8922.768 |
| transcript.whisperx[278].text |
那我再來講第二個問題是說這種事情我們不是有正規的管道嗎當受到不法侵害不是有正規管道嗎為什麼這些議題都是透過爆料然後報導出來然後機關才去重視甚至出人命了只包不住火了才要去面對通常都是因為內部的正常的管道被冷處理被壓建 |
| transcript.whisperx[279].start |
8924.642 |
| transcript.whisperx[279].end |
8930.205 |
| transcript.whisperx[279].text |
這是基本上整個事件的本質一定是這樣子這樣你知道我在說什麼嗎我們對於相關的事件一定讓他絕對要預防跟不允許他有這樣的發生那今天署的整備組組長的事件兩年內你知道你們署內離職的人員高達幾成嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[280].start |
8955.641 |
| transcript.whisperx[280].end |
8959.242 |
| transcript.whisperx[280].text |
整備組整備組我講是署內整備組呢37%這個這是正常人員的流動正常的嗎37% |
| transcript.whisperx[281].start |
8982.85 |
| transcript.whisperx[281].end |
8996.773 |
| transcript.whisperx[281].text |
那現在離職後的空缺多數也補不到人補不到人以後其他的業務啊其他的公務人員要分擔更多所以這種狀況裡面顯然因為這個組長的作為讓人家待不住然後呢很多人離職了那沒有離職的人還要做更多所以這個單位是高壓狀態喔高壓狀態所以難怪有人在講說欸真的不要再逼死人了 |
| transcript.whisperx[282].start |
9012.336 |
| transcript.whisperx[282].end |
9013.657 |
| transcript.whisperx[282].text |
那這個組長被人家投這個被人家爆料缺乏耐性每天緊逼進度更新要創新要亮點卻不顧本業務本業的業務無法運作 |
| transcript.whisperx[283].start |
9027.739 |
| transcript.whisperx[283].end |
9028.38 |
| transcript.whisperx[283].text |
一分鐘的錄音聽起來還好可是 |
| transcript.whisperx[284].start |
9056.616 |
| transcript.whisperx[284].end |
9067.642 |
| transcript.whisperx[284].text |
如果這個組長在對他們組裡面的工作同仁是天天這樣說天天這樣子罵這裡面的人天天都要聽到組長這樣霸凌和羞辱情緒會好嗎?士氣會好嗎?一定會影響你看我的公文當時發給你的我發給你的公文一星期 |
| transcript.whisperx[285].start |
9084.489 |
| transcript.whisperx[285].end |
9100.428 |
| transcript.whisperx[285].text |
這個是我發的公文11月15號這個事情我就講你們內部有沒有人檢舉有沒有人爆料有沒有人陳情過我們今天中午機關會送我現在在問你們啊你就在這裡回答我就好了啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[286].start |
9102.522 |
| transcript.whisperx[286].end |
9116.04 |
| transcript.whisperx[286].text |
跟委員報告那這位組長他是應該說都沒有被事先有被申訴過完全都沒有沒有那為什麼我會知道為什麼會出這張公文 |
| transcript.whisperx[287].start |
9116.921 |
| transcript.whisperx[287].end |
9136.609 |
| transcript.whisperx[287].text |
那個應該是說在15號12月上面是有人爆料啦崔上面爆料你有沒有聽過網路當時你有沒有聽過網路上的錄音檔當時崔上面爆料說今天署長你本人知不知道15號當時你知不知道15號當時所以PO出來我就知道了你就知道以後你怎麼處理 |
| transcript.whisperx[288].start |
9137.409 |
| transcript.whisperx[288].end |
9164.572 |
| transcript.whisperx[288].text |
那當時我們大概就召開了應變的會議那也應變會議幾月幾日開15號15號當天就開當天也針對這個案因為他沒有一個主要的一個聲訊他爆料之前都沒有投訴沒有澄清沒有嗎完全沒有我們那為什麼人家沒有尋正常管道你們有沒有受不法侵害的正常SOP管道人事行政總處有規定喔報告委員你們有沒有訂出那一個正常作業流程 |
| transcript.whisperx[289].start |
9166.174 |
| transcript.whisperx[289].end |
9179.595 |
| transcript.whisperx[289].text |
職場霸凌的一個作業辦法你們機關署的職場霸凌的人如果出問題那哪一個機關首長就是你嘛是你要負責處理我負責都沒有人提出 |
| transcript.whisperx[290].start |
9180.962 |
| transcript.whisperx[290].end |
9199.756 |
| transcript.whisperx[290].text |
之前其實有另外一件其實我們有按照那個程序去處理了投訴的是組長嗎不是不是另外一件那現在我15號就跟你們講了但是呢我們希望就是說你們本來是說兩個月之後要提供調查報告啦你們私底下這樣回答我們啦要兩個月喔 |
| transcript.whisperx[291].start |
9201.617 |
| transcript.whisperx[291].end |
9222.289 |
| transcript.whisperx[291].text |
結果現在我也是雖然你們院長現在已經下令了要一個禮拜內調查好但我也不會苛責你多久時間因為調查報告要呈現真實客觀不包庇才是最重要而不是只是求急那我再請教你你這一份未來的行政調查報告會不會包括去問已經離職的前職員 |
| transcript.whisperx[292].start |
9228.969 |
| transcript.whisperx[292].end |
9245.022 |
| transcript.whisperx[292].text |
報告委員那這個我們今天已經開始針對這個離職的部分個別致電了那瞭解他們是不是願意受訪你知道這個問題是什麼嗎因為昨天我也詢問過勞動部的那個勞法署的 |
| transcript.whisperx[293].start |
9245.743 |
| transcript.whisperx[293].end |
9257.896 |
| transcript.whisperx[293].text |
那個 署長 因為那署長本人也被人家認為有霸凌不是只有分署長 包括蔡孟良本人都有涉及霸凌還有這個副署長想要降級請調出去了那署長回答我是說他是家庭因素啦 他不是因為被霸凌啦 |
| transcript.whisperx[294].start |
9266.075 |
| transcript.whisperx[294].end |
9266.655 |
| transcript.whisperx[294].text |
我請教你正規正辦的事情 |
| transcript.whisperx[295].start |
9294.672 |
| transcript.whisperx[295].end |
9298.535 |
| transcript.whisperx[295].text |
今年年初這個看守臺灣臺灣的環保團體看守臺灣公布了全球的調查報告指出全球性的環保組織國際污染物消除網絡就是IPEN它在2022年有一個跨國的調查計畫總共檢測17個國家119種食品包材樣本有64個品項驗出PFAS |
| transcript.whisperx[296].start |
9320.109 |
| transcript.whisperx[296].end |
9336.694 |
| transcript.whisperx[296].text |
撤出率高達54%而直掀餐盒我們覺得說植物纖維餐盒好像很棒但是偏偏直掀餐盒檢出PFAS的濃度最高所以我們台灣看守台灣團體就把台灣的採樣送到iPen去檢驗他送了17個最後只有8個被檢驗了他們有篩選 |
| transcript.whisperx[297].start |
9347.717 |
| transcript.whisperx[297].end |
9368.764 |
| transcript.whisperx[297].text |
8個品項受驗有7個品項測出含有PFAS5件的TOF超出用來判斷是否刻意添加PFAS的丹麥標準6件超出比丹麥標準更寬鬆的歐盟草案標準就是50ppm超過 |
| transcript.whisperx[298].start |
9371.925 |
| transcript.whisperx[298].end |
9396.404 |
| transcript.whisperx[298].text |
8件裏面就有6件超過比較寬鬆的標準就歐盟草案的標準PFAS的測出率和超標狀況都比國際調查計劃他們去監測其他17個國家的平均檢測值還要更嚴重那結果計劃包裁我現在要公佈了計劃包裁分類說明檢測如下他們有公佈在他們網頁你那個書店有沒有看過我看書店你有去看過嗎看守台灣的公佈品項你有沒有看過 |
| transcript.whisperx[299].start |
9401.789 |
| transcript.whisperx[299].end |
9407.034 |
| transcript.whisperx[299].text |
莊市長市長沒有看過哦報告委員我還沒有去看你沒有看過我跟你報告 |
| transcript.whisperx[300].start |
9408.288 |
| transcript.whisperx[300].end |
9422.279 |
| transcript.whisperx[300].text |
但是那個批法這個說我們會跟環境部合作那個進行源頭的金融品項的來我跟你講我跟你報告你沒看過跟你報告防有紙袋不用忘了台灣人的第一餐從早餐開始蔥油餅蔥抓餅餡餅還有什麼早餐袋三明治都從防有紙袋開始的摩斯漢堡的紅豆派紙袋 |
| transcript.whisperx[301].start |
9435.891 |
| transcript.whisperx[301].end |
9437.613 |
| transcript.whisperx[301].text |
台灣沒有標準 各位 台灣沒有標準 |
| transcript.whisperx[302].start |
9456.189 |
| transcript.whisperx[302].end |
9459.113 |
| transcript.whisperx[302].text |
對食品安全的最大的疏忽和最大的縱放就是沒有任何標準沒有標準就不違規都不用受罰這反有指代接下來我講 |
| transcript.whisperx[303].start |
9473.224 |
| transcript.whisperx[303].end |
9475.447 |
| transcript.whisperx[303].text |
維波爐爆米花的內裝紙袋7-11賣的啾哩啾哩 |
| transcript.whisperx[304].start |
9497.506 |
| transcript.whisperx[304].end |
9497.866 |
| transcript.whisperx[304].text |
法定人數不足 |
| transcript.whisperx[305].start |
9520.421 |
| transcript.whisperx[305].end |
9524.403 |
| transcript.whisperx[305].text |
直掀參核﹐台灣某容器生產商的參核檢測出PFAS﹐它的含量是歐盟草案標準﹐57倍PFAS﹐ |
| transcript.whisperx[306].start |
9550.774 |
| transcript.whisperx[306].end |
9567.422 |
| transcript.whisperx[306].text |
再生紙包材 臺灣終於有一個法規還可以臺灣的再生紙包材是不能夠跟食品直接接觸的也不能使用再生紙的所以這類能收集到的不跟食品直接接觸的但是有風險的就是裝彈的彈盒其中有兩個品項進行檢測 一個是 |
| transcript.whisperx[307].start |
9572.885 |
| transcript.whisperx[307].end |
9595.983 |
| transcript.whisperx[307].text |
全聯賣的勤益式好雞能蛋勤益式好雞能蛋它的蛋核檢測出PFAS同樣的主婦聯盟的快樂主婦雞蛋的蛋核沒有沒有檢出這樣 部長你知道PFAS它的風險在哪裡嗎部長 你要聽過PFAS嗎阿姨的風險在哪裡 |
| transcript.whisperx[308].start |
9604.417 |
| transcript.whisperx[308].end |
9609.362 |
| transcript.whisperx[308].text |
這很誤會,這已經大家沸沸揚揚說很久了,這幾年都在說PFAS,PFAS部長,不知道沒關係,沒關係雖然你是醫生的,但是你可能不知道雖然這個議題很夯啊,大家討論的,不管從環境或是食品安全來講,討論得沸沸揚揚 |
| transcript.whisperx[309].start |
9627.154 |
| transcript.whisperx[309].end |
9651.828 |
| transcript.whisperx[309].text |
我是知道這個最近大家都有在談這個啦因為PFAS是工業和消費產品當中應用最廣泛的化學物質包括防油防水抗汙所以他很廣泛的在利用連包括衣服上都也有連那個鍋具都有連那個化學消防泡沫都有連防水衣料食品包材一次性的杯具在台灣人吃那個紅茶啦 |
| transcript.whisperx[310].start |
9653.969 |
| transcript.whisperx[310].end |
9654.61 |
| transcript.whisperx[310].text |
八位委員我想那個 |
| transcript.whisperx[311].start |
9679.843 |
| transcript.whisperx[311].end |
9701.285 |
| transcript.whisperx[311].text |
雖然明年食藥署有一個計畫 我覺得我會請他們喔 現在準備要來這次叫明年有一個計畫來 我跟你講 它是永久性的化學物質 不易被分解 生物環境的蓄積累積性的毒物它遠距離的環境傳輸 而且它持久性而且因為累積 不但累積再累積 所以它有生物的放大性 |
| transcript.whisperx[312].start |
9701.906 |
| transcript.whisperx[312].end |
9701.966 |
| transcript.whisperx[312].text |
李慧琼議員 |
| transcript.whisperx[313].start |
9726.254 |
| transcript.whisperx[313].end |
9727.235 |
| transcript.whisperx[313].text |
每天吃便當、喝咖啡 |
| transcript.whisperx[314].start |
9747.21 |
| transcript.whisperx[314].end |
9752.834 |
| transcript.whisperx[314].text |
對人體的危害有肝臟受損、心血管疾病、甲狀腺、透過母體傳輸給胎兒的慢性腎臟病、睪丸癌等等在這種狀況裏面PFAS經由食品、飲用水、日常用品、空氣中的粉塵、食品包裝這個是很嚴重的它對於免疫系統、肝臟系統和甲狀腺性的功能影響很大我就不要說這麼多我講比較簡單 |
| transcript.whisperx[315].start |
9772.088 |
| transcript.whisperx[315].end |
9780.614 |
| transcript.whisperx[315].text |
他在安全性的數據上面大部分都可以通過腸胃道吸收進入人體人體中的濃度與血液肝臟腎臟較高短鏈的PFAS容易經由尿液排除 |
| transcript.whisperx[316].start |
9789.019 |
| transcript.whisperx[316].end |
9801.436 |
| transcript.whisperx[316].text |
常戀的PFAS由糞便排除但是對人類短戀的估計半衰期從幾天到一個月不等但是對常戀的PFAS要需要好幾年好來 |
| transcript.whisperx[317].start |
9804.656 |
| transcript.whisperx[317].end |
9831.476 |
| transcript.whisperx[317].text |
引用水裡面的這個PFAS濃度因為我經常在環部環境部質詢那他們也預告今年8月預告引用水水質標準要納管要納管PFAS了終於了啦以確保引用水水質安全和品質而且今年年底就完成公告而你們你們作為在哪裡你們做了哪些事關於PFAS的 |
| transcript.whisperx[318].start |
9834.881 |
| transcript.whisperx[318].end |
9842.844 |
| transcript.whisperx[318].text |
國際監視商會定有批發值的一個你清楚的說說不要亂說喔你再說得比較清楚的喔還沒有定出限量食品容器的現在人家說食品容器我告訴你國際我認不認識你聽你說國際到現在都沒有人有聽我告訴你聽喔 |
| transcript.whisperx[319].start |
9863.852 |
| transcript.whisperx[319].end |
9873.219 |
| transcript.whisperx[319].text |
對施德哥爾摩公約他在2009年起禁止生產和使用PFOS及其言類因為PFOS是很多類很多類的總和的名稱PFOS包含很多東西 |
| transcript.whisperx[320].start |
9878.783 |
| transcript.whisperx[320].end |
9892.275 |
| transcript.whisperx[320].text |
那其中PFOS包含了很多東西PFOS的裡面的PFOS他2009年就禁止了2020年禁止使用PFOA2022年起計劃要將PFHXS及其顏內納入條約而且在2023年要生效 |
| transcript.whisperx[321].start |
9902.023 |
| transcript.whisperx[321].end |
9917.557 |
| transcript.whisperx[321].text |
2023年1月去年 荷蘭 德國 丹麥 瑞典 挪威 已經向歐洲化學管理局提交了限制提案 而且這個生效也要將禁止在消費品當中使用PE法是全禁 |
| transcript.whisperx[322].start |
9918.749 |
| transcript.whisperx[322].end |
9923.799 |
| transcript.whisperx[322].text |
他是全進的 但是之前是進了P4是P4BFHXS 並不是沒有他是沒有全進而已 |
| transcript.whisperx[323].start |
9931.038 |
| transcript.whisperx[323].end |
9949.434 |
| transcript.whisperx[323].text |
我們環境部的確也禁了PFOA啦、PFA 我在說你啦然後呢依照歐盟2023年3月資料 歐盟執委會我們當然就不能用了歐盟 人家是禁他們 歐洲不能用 不是我們不能用啦我們都本地生產本地使用我們毫無標準 我們連基礎調查都沒有你們來這裡還敢講說 |
| transcript.whisperx[324].start |
9955.598 |
| transcript.whisperx[324].end |
9971.625 |
| transcript.whisperx[324].text |
美國在6月美國參議院通過防止食品容器受到PFAS危害法案從今年開始他們就禁止銷售任何含有PFAS的食品包裝你現在跟我說世界各國都沒有人給你是在爭笑的你這個書中跟你說的為你相信喔 |
| transcript.whisperx[325].start |
9976.107 |
| transcript.whisperx[325].end |
10002.133 |
| transcript.whisperx[325].text |
美國今年去的全部都不能有還有PFAS的食品包裝欸你不要講這麼多啦,我問你,你有做過調查嗎?尤其環境部已經在112年就委託人家去調查所有的營用水的水質和新興污染物的調查和管理計劃讓他們的調查所有有的水庫,已經做了很久的這樣 |
| transcript.whisperx[326].start |
10003.752 |
| transcript.whisperx[326].end |
10006.735 |
| transcript.whisperx[326].text |
結果水庫也沒有每天使用免洗的紙餐盒也沒有用咖啡杯也沒有用紙袋結果水庫裏面他們抽樣發現PFOA 37個樣品徹職大於室內客的佔了74% |
| transcript.whisperx[327].start |
10022.808 |
| transcript.whisperx[327].end |
10032.913 |
| transcript.whisperx[327].text |
PFOS 13個樣品 測值大於4個耐克1公升的 佔抽樣%是26%這兩年測量水 因為水質就是高山 這樣老外的就赤鹽中啊 啊我們每天在吃的人要怎麼做 |
| transcript.whisperx[328].start |
10042.711 |
| transcript.whisperx[328].end |
10046.813 |
| transcript.whisperx[328].text |
我最好問你啦我們有沒有食品安全監測計畫這幾年來有做過嗎當然也沒有你什麼都不知道喔來相關的那邊給我聽報告委員我們食品要務曾經在100年及112年辦過食品中PFAS的含量的調查那我們這次大概在114年還會再做一次 |
| transcript.whisperx[329].start |
10069.529 |
| transcript.whisperx[329].end |
10083.557 |
| transcript.whisperx[329].text |
來你把調查報告給我看我要講相較於水質調查台灣PFAS食品風險評估有沒有做過有112年有做過什麼你們調查報告叫什麼名字我講風險評估剛剛是講監測計畫調查報告這是兩件事 |
| transcript.whisperx[330].start |
10089.383 |
| transcript.whisperx[330].end |
10107.311 |
| transcript.whisperx[330].text |
報告委員這個是叫食品中持久性有機汙染物全服碗機化合物質調查及風險評估好調查報告送來調查完成了好那歐盟2022年發布了2022及1431規章建議成員國和食品業應該在2022到2025間監測食品中的這些PFAS家族監測期間如果發現人家是這樣講喔如果發現蔬果 |
| transcript.whisperx[331].start |
10118.616 |
| transcript.whisperx[331].end |
10125.661 |
| transcript.whisperx[331].text |
訓類、乳品及嬰兒食品含量高於指定濃度時要進一步的調查原因那請問你們這個計畫裡面有沒有同時跟上如果你發現蔬果、訓類、乳品、嬰兒食品含量高於指定濃度的時候你要進一步調查為什麼?污染的風險來源是什麼?原因在哪裡?你們有沒有這樣子做?我們會在114年這個計畫中做 |
| transcript.whisperx[332].start |
10147.119 |
| transcript.whisperx[332].end |
10160.232 |
| transcript.whisperx[332].text |
那你們還執行一個食品中污染物質及毒素暨包裝包裝容器器具的檢驗方法開發和精進研究你們剛剛講的是你們研究的是這些持久性的化學風品對人的影響 |
| transcript.whisperx[333].start |
10161.872 |
| transcript.whisperx[333].end |
10168.579 |
| transcript.whisperx[333].text |
那我現在講的是那台灣各種食品安全的監測的研究有沒有沒有那你們有一個食品中污染物質在包裝容器上的這個PFAS的風險評估有沒有沒有 |
| transcript.whisperx[334].start |
10180.39 |
| transcript.whisperx[334].end |
10197.573 |
| transcript.whisperx[334].text |
因為你們講的是檢驗方法開發和經濟研究結果2022年做的要2025年才公布2023年2024年都有做結果你們要2025、2026、2027年才要公布您的其中報告各送一份到我們辦公室來可以嗎其中報告不要倒翻喔 |
| transcript.whisperx[335].start |
10199.497 |
| transcript.whisperx[335].end |
10227.224 |
| transcript.whisperx[335].text |
所以我要要求食品安全監測計畫我不是講持久性PFAS的物質對人體的風險而已台灣各種食品台灣環境裡面或是各種包裝他的監測計畫要做長期全面性的監測你了解問題有多嚴重才知道要怎麼管制和解決你可以不做你不做的前提是全部都管制直接禁止使用你有辦法嗎保定 |
| transcript.whisperx[336].start |
10228.072 |
| transcript.whisperx[336].end |
10254.965 |
| transcript.whisperx[336].text |
你若沒有做監測計畫不瞭解問題多嚴重你比照美國全面禁用可以嗎有辦法全面禁用嗎PFAS我們這幾年來最重要的一個工作那如果一定把它做到最好所以委員所提示的指教的我們馬上都來進行我在問你說阿拉伯戶阿不中部金融食品容器食品包裝全部禁用PFAS有辦法馬上全禁嗎我們馬上來研議 |
| transcript.whisperx[337].start |
10257.899 |
| transcript.whisperx[337].end |
10258.72 |
| transcript.whisperx[337].text |
謝謝主席,我們請部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[338].start |
10293.908 |
| transcript.whisperx[338].end |
10309.935 |
| transcript.whisperx[338].text |
委員好部長好部長我今天想要請教就是有關這個兒童這個因為我們知道說少子化這個議題真的非常的嚴重那我在前兩兩三天參加一個兒科醫學會的一個研討會 |
| transcript.whisperx[339].start |
10311.475 |
| transcript.whisperx[339].end |
10339.516 |
| transcript.whisperx[339].text |
那其實大家都非常的擔心就是少子化的問題然後我們所有的兒科醫師的人力的短缺那我想請教就是說我們知道說這個兒童困就是兒童如果要這個比較困難的這個疾病其實這個我們所有的兒科醫師他可能要診斷這個疾病可能也許要花更多的時間去做判斷然後去做診斷 |
| transcript.whisperx[340].start |
10342.518 |
| transcript.whisperx[340].end |
10355.889 |
| transcript.whisperx[340].text |
確實在這幾年當中就是這個額克醫師投入在這個比如說在醫學院也好那這個人力不足所以有很多的醫師即使他已經在 |
| transcript.whisperx[341].start |
10356.569 |
| transcript.whisperx[341].end |
10381.316 |
| transcript.whisperx[341].text |
這家醫學中心也好他已經很久工作很久了也這個五六十歲了那他還是要值班所以最近我聽到是這樣子而柯醫師真的他們還要值班所以有的人就會覺得說那我就直接轉到就是原本醫學中心或醫院他就不想然後就直接轉到診所就自己到診所去 |
| transcript.whisperx[342].start |
10382.216 |
| transcript.whisperx[342].end |
10400.397 |
| transcript.whisperx[342].text |
所以我們發現就是說兒科醫師這個人力短缺的議題非常的嚴重那我們也知道說少子化這個問題是國安問題那我們的這個兒童的這個死亡率也高於其他國家高於美國高於日本 |
| transcript.whisperx[343].start |
10401.138 |
| transcript.whisperx[343].end |
10415.166 |
| transcript.whisperx[343].text |
所以我今天想要請教我們部長就是說我們一直希望說能夠優化這個兒童的醫療照護那其實我也看到國會院底下有一個兒童醫學及健康研究中心 |
| transcript.whisperx[344].start |
10417.267 |
| transcript.whisperx[344].end |
10440.336 |
| transcript.whisperx[344].text |
我認為就是說其實這個國衛院底下這個這個健康研究中心其實沒辦法去很實際上的去照顧到我們這些兒童的這個醫療那我想請教就是說我們現在全臺灣的這個兒童醫院從北到南好從北到南那其實感覺也沒有多少家 |
| transcript.whisperx[345].start |
10441.676 |
| transcript.whisperx[345].end |
10443.739 |
| transcript.whisperx[345].text |
臺大兒童醫院成立10年與其他世界先進國家比較起來 |
| transcript.whisperx[346].start |
10462.121 |
| transcript.whisperx[346].end |
10487.573 |
| transcript.whisperx[346].text |
衛福部或中央的資源挹注其實還是有限那我想請教就是說第一個未來這個部長你在這個位置上面你要怎麼樣讓我們的這個兒童的醫療人員短缺或者是分配不均的這樣的一個問題你要去做什麼樣的努力另外一個就是我們這個兒童醫院確實很多 |
| transcript.whisperx[347].start |
10488.533 |
| transcript.whisperx[347].end |
10488.834 |
| transcript.whisperx[347].text |
委員會主席 |
| transcript.whisperx[348].start |
10505.816 |
| transcript.whisperx[348].end |
10526.45 |
| transcript.whisperx[348].text |
這個兒童醫院的這種類似兒童醫療的一個研究中心我覺得這樣子會不會比較比較好而不是分散到其他的這個兒童醫院那我是不是可以先請教部長未來我們有關這個兒童醫療專業人力的這個短缺或者是分配不均的這個議題你要怎麼去做處理 |
| transcript.whisperx[349].start |
10528.88 |
| transcript.whisperx[349].end |
10552.847 |
| transcript.whisperx[349].text |
謝謝委員對這個兒童健康以及兒童兒醫的人力還有困境現在的困境提出了非常精闢的一個提出來的一個見解來提出了這些問題的確這個就是我們現在兒科面臨的問題那我首先講特別著重因為委員很難得來關心我們一起來關心這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[350].start |
10554.327 |
| transcript.whisperx[350].end |
10573.528 |
| transcript.whisperx[350].text |
兒童及重男罕症這個部分的確這個部分其實我想各個醫學中心尤其是像北部這些醫學中心發在這邊的醫院發在這邊投入的人力跟經費其實都是 |
| transcript.whisperx[351].start |
10574.489 |
| transcript.whisperx[351].end |
10585.775 |
| transcript.whisperx[351].text |
值得肯定的這個我們首先要了解但是這個部分畢竟是要發揮比較多的是沒有什麼盈利盈盈盈盈盈盈盈盈盈盈盈盈盈盈盈盈盈盈盈盈盈盈 |
| transcript.whisperx[352].start |
10597.961 |
| transcript.whisperx[352].end |
10625.209 |
| transcript.whisperx[352].text |
一個是兒科有些科都還可以翻身兒科就是很難經營所以醫院其實都是很努力在維繫這樣的一個資源來照顧兒童的健康所以我想我們政府當然是有必要在人力跟資源方面給予最大的支持那你要怎麼做你要給這些做支持那你要怎麼做 |
| transcript.whisperx[353].start |
10626.274 |
| transcript.whisperx[353].end |
10642.711 |
| transcript.whisperx[353].text |
好,我想我們有一些優化整個兒童照顧的一個計畫,剛剛委員有提出來,其實裡面就很多來改善這樣的一個環境,但是我還是強調這是非常重要的那是不是請議事司司長跟委員報告一下 |
| transcript.whisperx[354].start |
10643.391 |
| transcript.whisperx[354].end |
10661.882 |
| transcript.whisperx[354].text |
報告委員就是就兒童人才的部分的話我們大概就會希望是說有兒童醫院跟醫學中心帶其領頭羊那也因為這樣所以我們在優化兒童依賴網的計畫裡面有八家核心醫院這個就是人才培育然後網絡連結的部分因為你一定要有產出 |
| transcript.whisperx[355].start |
10662.382 |
| transcript.whisperx[355].end |
10680.298 |
| transcript.whisperx[355].text |
像委員剛剛特別在這個地方講的是說那幾乎都在基層這一塊的職業部分所以我們才會利用就是說把人才集中在訓練的部分透過核心醫院來帶動跟去網絡做連結的時候才有人才不斷的流 |
| transcript.whisperx[356].start |
10680.658 |
| transcript.whisperx[356].end |
10680.898 |
| transcript.whisperx[356].text |
委員會委員會委員會委員會 |
| transcript.whisperx[357].start |
10709.893 |
| transcript.whisperx[357].end |
10726.028 |
| transcript.whisperx[357].text |
106年開始就透過國衛院這邊來合作因為長期的政策合作對人力的分布這一塊我們覺得對兒科的醫師的發展所以你們現在政策的研究就交給國衛院那臨床的研究就交給現在目前的這些有兒童醫院的這些醫院嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[358].start |
10726.869 |
| transcript.whisperx[358].end |
10751.494 |
| transcript.whisperx[358].text |
包括醫學中心因為兒科的發展這一塊的科技研究部分主要的經費來源會來自科技部國科會然後以國科會這邊的話其實他會鼓勵各個學門然後那以這個部分來說的話我們大致上面衛福部這邊是支持人員出國進修所以我們在我們的優化兒童醫療網裡面是鼓勵我們這邊的人才出國去進修 |
| transcript.whisperx[359].start |
10752.094 |
| transcript.whisperx[359].end |
10752.374 |
| transcript.whisperx[359].text |
4年提供135億 |
| transcript.whisperx[360].start |
10776.146 |
| transcript.whisperx[360].end |
10799.165 |
| transcript.whisperx[360].text |
來協助這個相關歐同醫療照護的發展我補充一下就是部長剛剛講的就是第二期行政院這邊特別加碼因為第一期的時候是4年28億發現在第三年執行過程當中就發現這樣的預算是遠遠不夠超出我們之前的估算所以今年113年有加碼加碼到20億 |
| transcript.whisperx[361].start |
10800.426 |
| transcript.whisperx[361].end |
10824.38 |
| transcript.whisperx[361].text |
以這個預算的那個度來預估所以行政院這邊特別就是已經通過了優化兒童醫療網第2期的計畫這邊也希望委員能夠支持優化兒童醫療網4年135億以上那部長我想再請教一下就是說賴總統在2025年健康台灣的政策當中有提到一個就是希望將新生兒的死亡率降到4% |
| transcript.whisperx[362].start |
10826.281 |
| transcript.whisperx[362].end |
10852.252 |
| transcript.whisperx[362].text |
就是說要達到這樣的一個成效那如果要這樣子的話其實有需要大量的可能資源投入那或者是要有一些大數據或預防的方案那我想請教就是說我們這邊剛剛有特別提到就是說可能政策方面是交給國衛院這邊去做一些研究那應該也要進行各單位的資源整合才有辦法完成要不然 |
| transcript.whisperx[363].start |
10853.332 |
| transcript.whisperx[363].end |
10865.804 |
| transcript.whisperx[363].text |
臺灣的這個新生兒的死亡率其實跟其他鄰近國家比起來其實是比較高的對的因為我們目前來講是我們的統計用我們的統計方式是千分之五點二那我們希望在 |
| transcript.whisperx[364].start |
10868.646 |
| transcript.whisperx[364].end |
10890.164 |
| transcript.whisperx[364].text |
我們的健康台灣的目標是要把它降到前文字4以下那這個的確第一個我們要釐清data的一個的算法跟國家國際間的一個標準化的一個算法那這第一個第二個當然我們就是要加強到從印產相關的照顧那我想這個部分當然 |
| transcript.whisperx[365].start |
10891.645 |
| transcript.whisperx[365].end |
10916.613 |
| transcript.whisperx[365].text |
兒童兒醫這個部分的團隊給他鼓勵是更重要部長最後因為時間的關係那個那個趙偉可能會希望我準時一點那我就盡量準時我這最後一個題目我想請教就是說這個目前我們希望就是說這個兒童盡量不要生病盡量不要生病那應該也是要從預防方面去著手 |
| transcript.whisperx[366].start |
10917.153 |
| transcript.whisperx[366].end |
10939.86 |
| transcript.whisperx[366].text |
而不是說生病之後我們才從這個醫療方面應該是要不讓他生病就是用預防的方式那我不知道說像這樣子的話如果說要以預防就剛剛部長有特別提到如果說有家醫師兒科醫師可能也需要有一些讓爸爸媽媽有一些 |
| transcript.whisperx[367].start |
10940.52 |
| transcript.whisperx[367].end |
10958.712 |
| transcript.whisperx[367].text |
響鐘 |
| transcript.whisperx[368].start |
10958.792 |
| transcript.whisperx[368].end |
10959.132 |
| transcript.whisperx[368].text |
法定人數不足 |
| transcript.whisperx[369].start |
10984.288 |
| transcript.whisperx[369].end |
10999.114 |
| transcript.whisperx[369].text |
我照顧多少的孩子那這些孩子都不生病都是健康那這樣子我覺得是不是也可以朝這樣的一個方向來來發想謝謝委員的指教我們現在在推兒童專者醫師就希望給他一個從疫房是 |
| transcript.whisperx[370].start |
10999.574 |
| transcript.whisperx[370].end |
11026.066 |
| transcript.whisperx[370].text |
然後包括整個他環境的一個關心來下手預防剩餘治療當然有任何問題也給他最好的一個處理所以現在已經開始做了嗎有在做而且是各縣市現在都積極在運作是也蠻多醫師參與的也非常感謝他們好我希望就是說因為我們一直在講嫂子話我們每一個小孩都是寶貝所以一定是給他最好的一個照顧 |
| transcript.whisperx[371].start |
11027.607 |
| transcript.whisperx[371].end |
11043.401 |
| transcript.whisperx[371].text |
那剛剛講的新生老那個部分那個也是重點對更多的小孩出生安全的出生平安的長大對這都是我們每一個歷程我們都要努力來做是好我希望就是說這個區塊應該應該也是就剛剛講的這個這個家醫科跟兒科可能是比較不會 |
| transcript.whisperx[372].start |
11050.447 |
| transcript.whisperx[372].end |
11051.168 |
| transcript.whisperx[372].text |
接下來我們請廖偉祥委員質詢 |
| transcript.whisperx[373].start |
11083.733 |
| transcript.whisperx[373].end |
11109.296 |
| transcript.whisperx[373].text |
謝謝主席有請邱部長委員好部長你好部長有關新冠跟流感混打的事宜根據美國醫學會的雜誌刊登的文獻研究發現同時接種COVID-19疫苗跟流感疫苗後中風的風險會增加 |
| transcript.whisperx[374].start |
11110.693 |
| transcript.whisperx[374].end |
11135.347 |
| transcript.whisperx[374].text |
那美國食品藥物管理局的專家分析了醫療保險所賠的數據也得出相同的結論那同時CNN在去年的10月26日也報導混打會提高中風的風險那請問部長現在這些研究有出來對於風險的部分是持相反的意見那會不會考慮停止左流右行的這個這項做法 |
| transcript.whisperx[375].start |
11137.188 |
| transcript.whisperx[375].end |
11158.254 |
| transcript.whisperx[375].text |
好 協議委員的指教齁 那我想我們所有的疫苗怎麼打 要打什麼 都是由ACIP齁 或者是相關的一個專家齁 經過很嚴謹的考的一個 當然他們每一個都是 應該都是這一方面的專家對 我相信是專家那 所以應該會 這樣的打法齁 那個應該是專家所 |
| transcript.whisperx[376].start |
11158.934 |
| transcript.whisperx[376].end |
11183.576 |
| transcript.whisperx[376].text |
但部長我去查了一下因為左流右心的這個施打方法是在依據111年的2月25日傳染病防治諮詢會的流感防治組預防接種組的聯席會議定定的所以是在111年的2月25號可是這些是後來美國學界在去年做出病打會增加風險的研究 |
| transcript.whisperx[377].start |
11184.932 |
| transcript.whisperx[377].end |
11201.367 |
| transcript.whisperx[377].text |
所以我要跟你講的你懂我的意思嗎了解在這部分疾管署跟ACIP的會議是不是要重新檢討雖然說有很多的這種醫學的研究或許都有正反兩面的意見但是是不是應該要重新檢討而且要把這種各種風險明確的告訴我們的國人是 |
| transcript.whisperx[378].start |
11205.362 |
| transcript.whisperx[378].end |
11231 |
| transcript.whisperx[378].text |
是的那是不是我請署長莊署長報告委員那有關這個報導的部分那容我們再去看因為每一個研究它有不同的一個證據等級那這個部分我們也會收集這些研究然後再去跟我們的ACIP的委員會來做這方面的一個對因為當初你們設定的時間點跟後來出來的研究是有落差的不過應該是說 |
| transcript.whisperx[379].start |
11232.801 |
| transcript.whisperx[379].end |
11256.237 |
| transcript.whisperx[379].text |
當初是這樣但是我們陸續也有看到其他是正面的一些結果你說左流右心對所以我們也會好那我就接下來就繼續講國外目前主要討論就是有關混打兩種疫苗後老人心血管啊腦中風的病患機率提高的問題那所以日前在基隆也出現左流右心一次接種之後就有民眾不幸死亡的案例 |
| transcript.whisperx[380].start |
11257.657 |
| transcript.whisperx[380].end |
11272.591 |
| transcript.whisperx[380].text |
上個月在臺東也有接種5天後身亡的案例那對此 疾管署你們的回應是什麼回應是說通常都是接種一小時後發生的副作用那一般就不會被認定跟疫苗相關的副作用 |
| transcript.whisperx[381].start |
11273.635 |
| transcript.whisperx[381].end |
11300.697 |
| transcript.whisperx[381].text |
是有關係但這樣的風險是不是存在民眾如果知道有這樣的風險而且接種後的副作用的保固卻只有一個小時部長你認為民眾對於這樣左流右行同時混打的接受度會提高還是會降低我想如果媒體這樣的消息當然會影響到接種的意願所以以臺大意願而言在 |
| transcript.whisperx[382].start |
11302.503 |
| transcript.whisperx[382].end |
11317.373 |
| transcript.whisperx[382].text |
你們應該要再一次的深入去了解重新召開然後因為他有風險應該是要讓民眾可以明確明白自己有風險之後再自行評估他要不要參與施打 |
| transcript.whisperx[383].start |
11331.584 |
| transcript.whisperx[383].end |
11343.136 |
| transcript.whisperx[383].text |
我之前也幫我之前也幫很多疫苗受害家屬開過這個記者會討空到因為你們發生這件事情之後你們後續就在自己審議委員會裡面每一個案例只花了80秒的時間 |
| transcript.whisperx[384].start |
11345.225 |
| transcript.whisperx[384].end |
11345.325 |
| transcript.whisperx[384].text |
報告委員 |
| transcript.whisperx[385].start |
11369.571 |
| transcript.whisperx[385].end |
11379.696 |
| transcript.whisperx[385].text |
那像這一例他會做這個解剖啦所以會做進一步的查證這個之前開會記者會很多細節就是你們就是不夠嚴謹那另外這個剛剛說這個開會80秒那個我想有些誤會因為其實我們每個案子都會 |
| transcript.whisperx[386].start |
11386.78 |
| transcript.whisperx[386].end |
11414.599 |
| transcript.whisperx[386].text |
這沒有誤會有三個委員他們至少三個委員他們會先看過上次都已經講過了這個我們在這裡就不繼續說數我在這個這已經打過很多次新冠疫苗國內目前的品牌也只有現在就是這種混打式的就是莫德納一直傳聞說有要雙打的原因是因為莫德納要推出雙效疫苗也是同一支疫苗可以達到新冠跟流感的效果那是否真的有這個事情若沒有的話可不可以請部長在這裡澄清跟保證 |
| transcript.whisperx[387].start |
11415.78 |
| transcript.whisperx[387].end |
11416.021 |
| transcript.whisperx[387].text |
我相信 |
| transcript.whisperx[388].start |
11426.201 |
| transcript.whisperx[388].end |
11452.16 |
| transcript.whisperx[388].text |
所有的專家疫苗專家我不曉得是誰啦齁但是一定都是各全國各地的醫療相關的精英以從我擔任在醫界這麼多年我相信沒有一個醫療的專家會站在任何所以部長你保證就不會是嗎我只是要你曾經保證一下嘛保證不會因為這種原因來做這種事情好所以我還是要強調一下我是希望提高接種率我還是要強調一下我並沒有反對疫苗施打的推行 |
| transcript.whisperx[389].start |
11452.6 |
| transcript.whisperx[389].end |
11480.883 |
| transcript.whisperx[389].text |
但是你們應該要誠實而且非常公開透明的讓小心的告訴我們的民眾這應該是衛福部的責任而不是只是負責花錢去為了提升疫苗的打氣然後後續發生了又不管什麼副作用然後你們的整個整個審理這些疫苗受害的過程非常的狹隘讓這些人為了公衛去願意打這個疫苗可是發生問題之後卻得不到賠償 |
| transcript.whisperx[390].start |
11482.486 |
| transcript.whisperx[390].end |
11506.806 |
| transcript.whisperx[390].text |
另外部長這個有關衛福部的這個霸凌的事情公務體系今天也很多人都有問但是昨天賴總統終於在事發17天後在臉書上檢討這件事情他強調每一位每一名員工都是政府機關重要的議員都是人才要加強對於他們關懷跟保護那但是昨天勞動部核部長對於這個霸凌的調查報告說 |
| transcript.whisperx[391].start |
11510.209 |
| transcript.whisperx[391].end |
11522.343 |
| transcript.whisperx[391].text |
他有他的惡可是這樣的惡是不是普遍存在官僚體制中就像是德國哲學家漢納厄蘭所說的平庸的邪惡請問部長你認同這句話嗎平庸的邪惡 |
| transcript.whisperx[392].start |
11526.583 |
| transcript.whisperx[392].end |
11540.673 |
| transcript.whisperx[392].text |
我沒有那麼哲學家那麼有那個瞭解但是我只是堅持著像這樣的資產霸凌的情況我們一定要努力來預防部長我告訴你我是很認同何部長引述漢娜二蘭所說邪惡的平庸 |
| transcript.whisperx[393].start |
11541.454 |
| transcript.whisperx[393].end |
11561.358 |
| transcript.whisperx[393].text |
因為那是在批判那些在納粹希特勒威權領導下社會集體的思考無能所以他是不是在影射這幾年的民進黨政府的執政我想這就用大家去解讀我就不評判但是我要強調即使他說這個平庸的邪惡但絕對沒有目的良善的霸凌所以我想問一下上週這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[394].start |
11566.263 |
| transcript.whisperx[394].end |
11595.581 |
| transcript.whisperx[394].text |
部長啊上週在社群媒體的這個有關爆料疾管署整備組組長也有這方面的問題請教部長啊罵人是豬啊是求好行妾目的良善情緒失控公然侮辱還是平庸的邪惡哪一種啊罵人只要是在職場上有罵人都是不對的不管你用什麼言辭這樣子好所以這件事情啊霸凌的事件你們是不是也認知到這件事情不能再拖有我們一個禮拜之內會你是因為行政院 |
| transcript.whisperx[395].start |
11596.041 |
| transcript.whisperx[395].end |
11623.3 |
| transcript.whisperx[395].text |
被行政院長罵了才趕快改還是行政院長道歉了因為你們本來說兩個月現在變一個禮拜院長是指示指示大家任何這有寫嘛以備媒體最後或者討論的是案件全部要在一周內完成調查追責責任這件事情啊能夠帶來讓相關霸凌事件的重視跟加速的調查我想是我們在不幸中的這個事件要學到的其中一個教訓會很謹慎 |
| transcript.whisperx[396].start |
11626.189 |
| transcript.whisperx[396].end |
11654.238 |
| transcript.whisperx[396].text |
好再來目前我們看到整備組的異動37%是確實是偏高的但是也高於機關署的13%所以幾個調查重點要特別提醒一下我們的部長第一個這個委員會的組成要合理該避免的人士就要迴避外部委員的人數也比例也應該要提高相關人士的邀約談還有包含主管基層 |
| transcript.whisperx[397].start |
11655.114 |
| transcript.whisperx[397].end |
11657.865 |
| transcript.whisperx[397].text |
然後也要確保中間到底有沒有人吃案、押案 |
| transcript.whisperx[398].start |
11658.888 |
| transcript.whisperx[398].end |
11687.059 |
| transcript.whisperx[398].text |
然後LINE也沒有要查核然後現在時代也不是只是用公文在下命令所以這些媒介都應該要去掌握那另外我是希望這個調查請部長我也有看到你有保證應該要公正超然不要有行政瑕疵是不然我們一定會追究到底當然當然對我想這個該辦就要辦公務體系不應該成為這個官場現行記的舞台應該是穩定國家發展的基石主席不好意思我還有還是有一點點問題要問 |
| transcript.whisperx[399].start |
11689.96 |
| transcript.whisperx[399].end |
11710.154 |
| transcript.whisperx[399].text |
好我直接跳下一題好了有關於日前食藥署發布公告將這個藥放寬六項標準標準放寬從一倍到三倍都有事實上減少農藥等化學物質在蔬果上提倡無農藥的種植都是趨勢我想要問一下 |
| transcript.whisperx[400].start |
11711.471 |
| transcript.whisperx[400].end |
11723.687 |
| transcript.whisperx[400].text |
為什麼現在會反其道而行放寬標準你看這裡面阿福平調高2.5倍其他3倍2.8倍這些都有高於歐盟3倍高於歐盟5倍都有我想要請問一下 |
| transcript.whisperx[401].start |
11725.01 |
| transcript.whisperx[401].end |
11750.758 |
| transcript.whisperx[401].text |
為什麼會有這樣的原因是其他他國要求嗎還是是有其他的原因呢是不是是那個請莊市長跟委員報告一下因為這些農藥的放寬的標準主要的原因是我們那時候是依據農業部的要求有的是因為他在各個地的依據農業部的要求那農業部為什麼要要求這件事情犧牲國人的食品安全健康 |
| transcript.whisperx[402].start |
11753.132 |
| transcript.whisperx[402].end |
11767.063 |
| transcript.whisperx[402].text |
過去就已經討論過草莓農要標準放寬經過激烈的討論之後並沒有通過為什麼現在又要放寬呢是因為要因應日本的要求嗎還是有誰在下指導旗要犧牲國人的健康 |
| transcript.whisperx[403].start |
11768.666 |
| transcript.whisperx[403].end |
11775.07 |
| transcript.whisperx[403].text |
以前就已經討論過為什麼現在要突然放寬明明就是往沒有農藥的方向去走就是趨勢那你現在放寬的背後的邏輯到底是什麼而且這也有寫日本草莓今年又新增開放了使用七種農藥 |
| transcript.whisperx[404].start |
11795.356 |
| transcript.whisperx[404].end |
11819.11 |
| transcript.whisperx[404].text |
我要提醒你們不應該把人民的健康把人民的食安放在風險之中所以我反對把這個放款為了守護人民的食品安全好謝謝主席好謝謝六委員謝謝我們一定會守護人民的健康請放心來接續我們請黃國昌委員質詢 |
| transcript.whisperx[405].start |
11835.482 |
| transcript.whisperx[405].end |
11854.491 |
| transcript.whisperx[405].text |
謝謝主席,麻煩有請部長委員好部長好,上次質詢的時候提到專科護理師他們夜間津貼獎勵的問題你也在這邊做出了很莊嚴的承諾那也感謝衛福部 |
| transcript.whisperx[406].start |
11855.816 |
| transcript.whisperx[406].end |
11877.403 |
| transcript.whisperx[406].text |
到我辦公室來說明了以後就依照我的要求有發函讓大家知道專科護理師只要落入在你們那個範圍有夜間服勤的事實大家都可以領得到錢沒有大小眼沒有差別對待這個很重要這個事情我先謝謝部長但問題是下一個問題是函是發下去了 |
| transcript.whisperx[407].start |
11879.784 |
| transcript.whisperx[407].end |
11890.117 |
| transcript.whisperx[407].text |
大家現在在擔心是醫院是不是會真的按照你發的函來辦理所以你可不可以跟大家宣示一下醫院就是應該要切實遵守 |
| transcript.whisperx[408].start |
11893.582 |
| transcript.whisperx[408].end |
11917.554 |
| transcript.whisperx[408].text |
宣示一下醫院要按照衛福部的喊切實遵守我現在在著求給你我在這邊希望所有的醫院一定要按照我們的衛福部的規定確實去發放OK好非常好來我們接下來這個禮拜天我們那個本土小牙醫聯盟一些民間團體他們要 |
| transcript.whisperx[409].start |
11920.199 |
| transcript.whisperx[409].end |
11928.885 |
| transcript.whisperx[409].text |
提出他們具體的訴求第一個撤回24億甲偏鄉計畫衛福部不得開後門衛福部知不支持我跟委員報告這個20億甲偏鄉這樣的名詞是錯誤的 |
| transcript.whisperx[410].start |
11938.666 |
| transcript.whisperx[410].end |
11963.522 |
| transcript.whisperx[410].text |
那個這的確就是偏鄉計畫因為這偏鄉計畫已經是從第一題所以沒有啦那我們不要受限於標題啦因為內容我其實也別給你看了嘛我直接再度回答就是我們的偏鄉第二優化偏鄉醫療計畫第二期現在要針對現在在牙醫這個部分只是針對55個現在沒有牙醫的鄉鎮 |
| transcript.whisperx[411].start |
11967.324 |
| transcript.whisperx[411].end |
11983.543 |
| transcript.whisperx[411].text |
我們鼓勵本國的醫師當然是有執照的是所以絕對不會沒有執照嗎絕對第一個絕對沒有執照沒有執照我們醫師還不會讓他去執OK好非常好第二個保留啊國外學歷採任原則贊不贊成 |
| transcript.whisperx[412].start |
11987.604 |
| transcript.whisperx[412].end |
12011.938 |
| transcript.whisperx[412].text |
這個我們保留國外協議裁判當然我一再重複我們絕對採用最高的要求絕對採用最高的標準來做國外協議的裁判現在問題來了因為這件事情考選部非常的困擾為什麼考選部非常的困擾2017年1月1號我們開始加嚴管制 |
| transcript.whisperx[413].start |
12016 |
| transcript.whisperx[413].end |
12043.485 |
| transcript.whisperx[413].text |
結果到2022年6月22日上一屆國會依司法公布了三項附帶決議要放寬引發軒然大波所以在2022年6月22日三讀通過那三個附帶決議的時候在考試院發生什麼事情在考試院發生的事情是衛福部派去的代表我不確定他是不是受到附帶決議的影響 |
| transcript.whisperx[414].start |
12045.336 |
| transcript.whisperx[414].end |
12073.559 |
| transcript.whisperx[414].text |
他跑去考選部開會的時候他開會因為考選部基本上他們的立場是他尊重主管機關衛福部的政策立場考選部把整個嚴格都寫得很清楚了結果你們2022年6月30號第43次的審議會議以後你們同意不再適用國外大學或學院醫學系科學歷採認原則 |
| transcript.whisperx[415].start |
12076.26 |
| transcript.whisperx[415].end |
12103.665 |
| transcript.whisperx[415].text |
從這個時候開始放寬部長這個基本的事實你有沒有掌握首先跟委員報告我們不會根據互待決議是啦是啦我知道嘛所以我在一樣一樣放給你看嘛按照醫師法修法的以後的一個應該進行的據我了解是我的掌握是這樣子 |
| transcript.whisperx[416].start |
12104.065 |
| transcript.whisperx[416].end |
12127.603 |
| transcript.whisperx[416].text |
要回到2017年那時候的標準嘛就是你剛所講最嚴格的標準嘛但我今天為什麼要藉由這個機會去質詢我怕部長人事情忙啊沒有辦法掌握這些基本的事實啊所以我特別上來跟院長報告啊2022年6月30號的時候你們派去考選部的代表說什麼啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[417].start |
12128.724 |
| transcript.whisperx[417].end |
12153.17 |
| transcript.whisperx[417].text |
說沒有再要用那個財政原則阿要放寬阿結果來來來部長你看一下2022年11月23號行政院韓立法院復旦決議我們不執行喔這個是行政院直接回韓立法院因為那時候引發軒然大波大家都來抗議了嘛抗議完了以後阿接下來就看不懂了 |
| transcript.whisperx[418].start |
12154.249 |
| transcript.whisperx[418].end |
12168.218 |
| transcript.whisperx[418].text |
行政院跟立法院講這附帶決議我們不會執行意思就是什麼學歷的採任不會放寬但問題是你們到44次會議的時候你們衛福部為什麼沒有派人去考選部開會跟有關於醫師考試採任原則這麼重要的事情衛福部竟然一個人都沒有去 |
| transcript.whisperx[419].start |
12183.12 |
| transcript.whisperx[419].end |
12184.082 |
| transcript.whisperx[419].text |
部長這件事你知道嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[420].start |
12189.819 |
| transcript.whisperx[420].end |
12216.43 |
| transcript.whisperx[420].text |
這是2022的時候因為我不在部裡面沒關係部長你回去查一下一個禮拜之內書面回覆為什麼那時候沒有派人去沒有派人去的結果是什麼我跟院長報跟部長報告沒有派人去的結果就是啊之前放寬了44次喔雖然附帶決議不執行喔繼續放寬到第45次有派人去了有派人去一句話都沒講 |
| transcript.whisperx[421].start |
12217.728 |
| transcript.whisperx[421].end |
12235.394 |
| transcript.whisperx[421].text |
一句話都沒有講沒有跟考試院考選部講說那個附帶決議沒有要執行欸結果又按照43次的繼續放寬從43、44、45附帶決議都已經不執行了結果衛福部去考選部完全沒有表達這樣的意見導致繼續的放寬違反部長剛剛所講一定用最嚴格的標準 |
| transcript.whisperx[422].start |
12249.006 |
| transcript.whisperx[422].end |
12268.127 |
| transcript.whisperx[422].text |
這個是在玩兩面手法嗎明著講一套背後在放水嗎部長可不可以回去了解一下為什麼會發生這種狀況接下來呢接下來要不要回復到2017年那個時候的嚴格採任標準這個是現在大家關心的事情 |
| transcript.whisperx[423].start |
12269.096 |
| transcript.whisperx[423].end |
12280.944 |
| transcript.whisperx[423].text |
這部分的意思是可以說明一下我們把那個原則已經修到醫師法施行細則阿最近會公布所以就會用醫師法施行細則是現在你們公告的醫師法施行細則一之一嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[424].start |
12281.772 |
| transcript.whisperx[424].end |
12299.631 |
| transcript.whisperx[424].text |
不是 那個是公告的草案那個草案的部分我們要在那等於是預告程序所以我們要公告的部分的話會採認那個已經把那個原則的部分修到我們預計修的疑似法施行細則第12年就維持2017年一模一樣的標準嘛 |
| transcript.whisperx[425].start |
12300.071 |
| transcript.whisperx[425].end |
12314.742 |
| transcript.whisperx[425].text |
文字有一些些的微調因為那個原則裡面有一些些文字不基本那個文字啊會後可不可以給我因為有的時候魔鬼就藏在細節裡啊你微調以後的文字是不是有維持之前的標準這個是大家現在在關心的嘛 |
| transcript.whisperx[426].start |
12316.192 |
| transcript.whisperx[426].end |
12332.19 |
| transcript.whisperx[426].text |
那一個在程序中所以我們會覺得是說我們如果要公告之前我們其實是公告的那個同時可以送到委辦因為這是程序問題對 這個你們的行政程序我尊重我最後只講一句話 |
| transcript.whisperx[427].start |
12333.474 |
| transcript.whisperx[427].end |
12346.28 |
| transcript.whisperx[427].text |
拜託這次不要再引發軒然大波了吵了好幾年了從2017年2022那時候在立法院偷渡那個附帶決議引發軒然大波搞到行政院發函說附帶決議不執行這很嚴重的事情 |
| transcript.whisperx[428].start |
12350.495 |
| transcript.whisperx[428].end |
12377.448 |
| transcript.whisperx[428].text |
那已經產生了這麼大的爭議希望這一次要慎重維持部長剛剛的承諾維持最嚴的嚴格那同時文字在你們程序上面可以的時候給所有的委員大家都知道好的不要再產生這樣的爭議可以嗎一定我們一定會最大的誠意來解決剛剛委員所講的長期的一個爭議OK好謝謝最嚴格的方式來審查最嚴格嘛大家都聽到了OK謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[429].start |
12379.837 |
| transcript.whisperx[429].end |
12384.163 |
| transcript.whisperx[429].text |
好 謝謝王委員 謝謝部長那接下來我們請賴思寶委員質詢謝謝主席 有請衛福部的邱部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[430].start |
12400.188 |
| transcript.whisperx[430].end |
12425.4 |
| transcript.whisperx[430].text |
委員好你好這個外界也在高度質疑說衛福部啊其實你來之前啊其實官僚非常官僚土房店一堆啦你什麼時候可以清一遍你自己親自清一遍說不要讓勞動部的事情發生在衛福部因為你現在點名了啊機關署裡面就有啊還有可能還有其他單位啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[431].start |
12426.4 |
| transcript.whisperx[431].end |
12430.385 |
| transcript.whisperx[431].text |
委員會主管委員會主管委員會主管委員會主管委員會主管委員會主管 |
| transcript.whisperx[432].start |
12445.834 |
| transcript.whisperx[432].end |
12460.968 |
| transcript.whisperx[432].text |
我一切都是以人民的健康為資質一生的資質你都這樣麻吉就是人家怎麼捏你的部主怎麼欺負你沒關係跟委員報告一下我到部裡面來深深的覺得我們部裡面的所有的官僚很足啊官僚很足啊真的是非常的努力啦我派你石耀俗聽說你吳署長我有官威始祖啊那東西大家都知道啊出到這個部長就 |
| transcript.whisperx[433].start |
12469.696 |
| transcript.whisperx[433].end |
12474.458 |
| transcript.whisperx[433].text |
現在大家最...現在來講喔你不要在笑啦一個是波波一一個本土一啊現在來講的話 |
| transcript.whisperx[434].start |
12498.41 |
| transcript.whisperx[434].end |
12499.131 |
| transcript.whisperx[434].text |
國外醫學院畢業了 |
| transcript.whisperx[435].start |
12528.15 |
| transcript.whisperx[435].end |
12544.695 |
| transcript.whisperx[435].text |
國外的有的 比如說哈佛的你把哈佛的John Hopkins的跟波波擺在一起這個東西炒到多多的放在一起要怎麼議這個東西就是大家混這個在111年我們在這邊的時候修法就變成這樣子來 這個大家混我跟你講現在來說嘛 |
| transcript.whisperx[436].start |
12553.464 |
| transcript.whisperx[436].end |
12563.537 |
| transcript.whisperx[436].text |
其實有些人同情你啦這個始作俑者叫陳時中啦結果你就會爛 邱太元你就那麼麻煩 怎麼不去批評陳時中主要陳時中現在牙醫快要崩盤你知道嗎請問一下牙醫多少人 |
| transcript.whisperx[437].start |
12572.981 |
| transcript.whisperx[437].end |
12585.368 |
| transcript.whisperx[437].text |
一萬七左右來來來我們看一萬六一萬七我們現在疫病比大概一千三百五十一個牙醫服務一千三百五十個人每一年增加五百位我這數字對吧不對請指教 |
| transcript.whisperx[438].start |
12594.576 |
| transcript.whisperx[438].end |
12612.088 |
| transcript.whisperx[438].text |
每年台灣喔391個新生那可能還會加僑生或等等所以依照研究齁420個畢業阿如果說加上原來的不是每次都有50吧大概470個可是還要想一下考照率對考照率怎麼樣考照率95%的鬼阿 |
| transcript.whisperx[439].start |
12615.435 |
| transcript.whisperx[439].end |
12638.046 |
| transcript.whisperx[439].text |
9層9層9層9層9層9層 |
| transcript.whisperx[440].start |
12638.186 |
| transcript.whisperx[440].end |
12656.373 |
| transcript.whisperx[440].text |
我們就會幾年後跟日本一樣一比一千人一個牙醫服務一千人就變成牙醫就崩盤東京是一比八百六十一福岡一比九百五十一大阪一比一牙醫師下班以後還去看Uber還要做外送員主席都知道啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[441].start |
12665.237 |
| transcript.whisperx[441].end |
12685.298 |
| transcript.whisperx[441].text |
有些人說我去本黨來喔 抱歉你不去找我人 以前對台灣外戰有扣就中了 這個部長你都知道囉請問邏輯你現在怎麼解本土意義跟國外意義怎麼取得平衡 你告訴我怎麼做 |
| transcript.whisperx[442].start |
12687.653 |
| transcript.whisperx[442].end |
12709.418 |
| transcript.whisperx[442].text |
是這樣子啦我們當然臺灣也是國際化的一個國家所以我跟委員報告就是像即使像哈佛或像那個大學他們都有國際學成他說的國際學成大概是他們的比例大概8到10%所以我們如果一年有400位111的本土生那乘以我們目前5大概8% |
| transcript.whisperx[443].start |
12711.198 |
| transcript.whisperx[443].end |
12721.43 |
| transcript.whisperx[443].text |
比例上是跟國際間是接軌的啦你現在告訴我怎麼解因為時間差不多到了齁這個馬上人家上街頭訴求你怎麼樣解讓 |
| transcript.whisperx[444].start |
12723.891 |
| transcript.whisperx[444].end |
12746.333 |
| transcript.whisperx[444].text |
本土小洋衣也能夠吞進去讓國外的洋衣也能夠吞進去你該怎麼處理你該告訴我怎麼處理我想我們還是第一個我們還是重申我們維持每年50個這是國際性的這1到10年來都沒有變我們也不會去增加第二個我們在學歷的認定就按照110年6月通過的法的修法 |
| transcript.whisperx[445].start |
12746.894 |
| transcript.whisperx[445].end |
12746.914 |
| transcript.whisperx[445].text |
偏鄉計劃 |
| transcript.whisperx[446].start |
12769.085 |
| transcript.whisperx[446].end |
12791.648 |
| transcript.whisperx[446].text |
他的確需要去補足現在限定是55個沒有牙醫師的鄉鎮我們給阿你偏鄉機會就是為波波來開門的沒有沒有沒有完全沒有實習現在已經不去做實習這邊是來我就問你一句話我們用本國的而且是有執照的24億裡面是不是絕對沒有波波是不是請問一下請問一下目前沒有目前沒有以後也沒有啊不要目前你 |
| transcript.whisperx[447].start |
12792.869 |
| transcript.whisperx[447].end |
12809.81 |
| transcript.whisperx[447].text |
沒有那種為了潑潑實習那一套當然如果說他是國外的學歷我們是以本國優先嘛那如果說譬如說他是雪梨大姐畢業然後就下這個國外預先其實他有執照啦其實這個應該目前也被排除掉現在我們以國 |
| transcript.whisperx[448].start |
12811.994 |
| transcript.whisperx[448].end |
12834.983 |
| transcript.whisperx[448].text |
國內畢業的優先喔不是優先啦一定啦百分之百啦現在問題是這55個偏鄉真的就是需要牙醫是所以還是有可能撥撥嘛那是沒有現在不會用撥撥大家所擔心的是開放實習名額那我們現在又做的完全沒有這回事 |
| transcript.whisperx[449].start |
12836.492 |
| transcript.whisperx[449].end |
12849.496 |
| transcript.whisperx[449].text |
最後一個我就請問你喔面對這個爭議我提供一個建議來個總量管制大家的科技可以嗎總量管制管理是國內國外的科技考試你們定考試你們定 |
| transcript.whisperx[450].start |
12855.093 |
| transcript.whisperx[450].end |
12867.421 |
| transcript.whisperx[450].text |
總量管制!就是不管你國內國外的總量管制!這樣子的話!柏坡跟本土營就可以取得平衡點!大家考試來評實力!沒有啦!你現在總量管制!你現在沒有總量管制啦!總量管制落實!確實落實!不要專門為柏坡開後門!你才有解啦! |
| transcript.whisperx[451].start |
12884.433 |
| transcript.whisperx[451].end |
12889.217 |
| transcript.whisperx[451].text |
謝謝主席我也謝謝侯孟愷委員願意跟我換順序我請一下邱部長還有石耀署跟醫師司長 |
| transcript.whisperx[452].start |
12903.209 |
| transcript.whisperx[452].end |
12924.858 |
| transcript.whisperx[452].text |
委員好部長好部長這個我們從當同事到現在第一次來質詢您我想還是要先謝謝這個衛福部跟立法院還有朝野黨團共同合作來通過再生醫療法的這個案子那再生醫療法母法通過了以後其實我們還有9項的執法還有待進行我想請教一下現在9項執法的進度是怎麼樣 |
| transcript.whisperx[453].start |
12926.54 |
| transcript.whisperx[453].end |
12941.182 |
| transcript.whisperx[453].text |
委員這邊我們在生醫療法的9項執法規目前就是出稿的部分的話我這邊已經走完大概7個執法規然後那預計就是12月 |
| transcript.whisperx[454].start |
12942.108 |
| transcript.whisperx[454].end |
12945.17 |
| transcript.whisperx[454].text |
．9個執法的第一次出稿討論．然後再進行後續的各項的討論．跟部長報告完之後其他的討論我相信明年 |
| transcript.whisperx[455].start |
12961.742 |
| transcript.whisperx[455].end |
12982.375 |
| transcript.whisperx[455].text |
明年年中以前都出不來這9項執法都出不來應該不會你這麼樂觀嗎我曾經跟你們周志浩次長討論過這件事情他說因為你們內部的同仁尤其法規的同仁對於執法的制定非常的嚴謹他說一定要定到大家都沒有意見才會送出來 |
| transcript.whisperx[456].start |
12983.436 |
| transcript.whisperx[456].end |
12983.676 |
| transcript.whisperx[456].text |
法定人數不足 |
| transcript.whisperx[457].start |
13014.296 |
| transcript.whisperx[457].end |
13039.985 |
| transcript.whisperx[457].text |
推動再生醫療法也是我一生的信念再生醫療法還沒有通過之前有一個叫恩慈療法這個我相信您也很清楚恩慈療法就是要來適應緊急醫療的現在的藥物無法治療的或者是病人有緊急需要的他就會透過恩慈來申請這樣的一個治療方式部長你知道你們的恩慈療法每一個申請大概要經過多久的審核時間你知道嗎你知道嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[458].start |
13042.796 |
| transcript.whisperx[458].end |
13057.394 |
| transcript.whisperx[458].text |
每一個病人來申請恩慈要經過多久的審核時間不過我是希望愈快愈好因為你跟我講你希望愈快愈好但是你這個希望下不去嘛部長我跟您報告每一個恩慈最少要經過3個月以上 |
| transcript.whisperx[459].start |
13059.241 |
| transcript.whisperx[459].end |
13085.736 |
| transcript.whisperx[459].text |
緊急醫療的病人危急的病人血癌的病人多發性骨髓瘤的病人都已經在緊急了來申請恩慈他還要審查3個月以上一關又一關一關又一關我最近接到一個病人的請求他親自寫了一封信給我他跟我說委員你可不可以幫幫我跟衛福部說讓我接受恩慈的跨梯治療 |
| transcript.whisperx[460].start |
13087.844 |
| transcript.whisperx[460].end |
13102.183 |
| transcript.whisperx[460].text |
他送件三次現在是第三次了前兩次被食藥署駁回駁回到這個病人已經沒有辦法了他來求救他希望食藥署能夠救他他希望食藥署能夠早日審核他的 |
| transcript.whisperx[461].start |
13103.004 |
| transcript.whisperx[461].end |
13126.4 |
| transcript.whisperx[461].text |
他的申請報告能夠讓他接受咖啡的治療部長如果人民的健康是你一生的職質的話你應該要正視這個結果是了解你們的審核如果這個藥廠過去送的件過去治療的case過去他的所有的文件都在衛福部裡頭有備案的話為什麼不能加快腳步呢 |
| transcript.whisperx[462].start |
13127.501 |
| transcript.whisperx[462].end |
13147.308 |
| transcript.whisperx[462].text |
為什麽不能讓病人得到他應該有的治療呢為什麽不能讓病人的right to try能夠實際的進行呢這是我今天為什麽還特別來質詢衛福部一個很重要的原因如果執法不能早日通過他們現在只能仰賴恩慈恩慈審核要三個月你叫這些病人怎麽辦 |
| transcript.whisperx[463].start |
13148.388 |
| transcript.whisperx[463].end |
13159.094 |
| transcript.whisperx[463].text |
我時間已經到了但是部長我希望你能夠回去好好的盯緊這件事情好不好一定一定我覺得我們旁邊太多眾今天需要緊急來處理謝謝謝謝邱委員繼續我們請黃孟凱委員質詢好謝謝請麻煩邱太元部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[464].start |
13183.615 |
| transcript.whisperx[464].end |
13200.58 |
| transcript.whisperx[464].text |
委員好邱部長這兩天因為勞動部的這個霸凌事件那也有爆料是說這個疾管署也有類似的狀況那當然已經講說一個禮拜內會調查完畢是那但是我想請教一下您知道疾管署裡面有幾個組或幾個中心嗎7個組5個組兩個中心5個組兩個中心嘛齁那其中這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[465].start |
13210.552 |
| transcript.whisperx[465].end |
13229.082 |
| transcript.whisperx[465].text |
調職率或是離職率最高的是哪一個組?整備組就是被爆出來的這個組總共有37%那平均籍管署過去去年一年內調職率多少?12%會不會覺得很奇怪?為什麼? |
| transcript.whisperx[466].start |
13231.872 |
| transcript.whisperx[466].end |
13260.162 |
| transcript.whisperx[466].text |
部長其實這件事情大家在講是說就如同勞動部為什麼我們會看到那個北區分署會有說兩年內這個分署長在那邊結果有81位員工寧願降調寧願平調我也要趕快逃離那個地方他就是明顯高於其他的這個單位不正常的離職狀況那一樣的道理整備組在過去這五月到現在平調其他單位六人 |
| transcript.whisperx[467].start |
13260.962 |
| transcript.whisperx[467].end |
13262.348 |
| transcript.whisperx[467].text |
跳到其他機關6人 辭職1人 調職或辭職總共13人 達37% |
| transcript.whisperx[468].start |
13267.438 |
| transcript.whisperx[468].end |
13296.549 |
| transcript.whisperx[468].text |
不覺得這樣子高於平均是很奇怪的事情嗎異常的數據出來我們就要趕快來是系統性的部長你是醫學出身嗎醫學看到的很多時候我們是要用儀器用數據來去監控這個病人身體狀況有沒有其他反應那一樣到如果說把衛福部當成是一個人體的話是不是各個數據出來發生異常的時候指數是異常的我們要去了解一下應該是不是是部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[469].start |
13297.429 |
| transcript.whisperx[469].end |
13324.521 |
| transcript.whisperx[469].text |
本席真的希望這個可能不第一件但是我們希望是最後一件我們也不希望說有任何人在我們機關裡面要虎揚威或者是說把公天下變成是家天下一個禮拜大家都會看你的報告請一定要如實秉公處理可以嗎絕對是絕對是秉公處理好那部長秉公處理另外一個部分本席上一次在這邊質詢你什麼議題你記得嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[470].start |
13329.38 |
| transcript.whisperx[470].end |
13353.032 |
| transcript.whisperx[470].text |
沒關係啦 電子菸啦我們明年的機關稅出稅入的這個增加預算本期看了一下 300多億我們多增加衛福部多增加300多億元其中國民健康署增加了55億原本113年的預算只有56億國民健康署一次增加一倍變111億 |
| transcript.whisperx[471].start |
13357.714 |
| transcript.whisperx[471].end |
13384.567 |
| transcript.whisperx[471].text |
111億其中最大中為什麼有這個癌症篩檢的部分41億所以整個提升了一倍是好瞭解要錢給錢但是重點在於是我們當然是會審查預算可是有沒有做到我們關心的議題我上個禮上一次我們直覺說已經三個禮拜過去了我講是說我們怎麼會放任電子煙那麼明明不是 |
| transcript.whisperx[472].start |
13385.632 |
| transcript.whisperx[472].end |
13397.712 |
| transcript.whisperx[472].text |
合法的東西指煙算合法喔可是他必須要有身份證件18歲以上才能購買到超商我還會看你的身份證件結果電子煙完全不合法 |
| transcript.whisperx[473].start |
13398.891 |
| transcript.whisperx[473].end |
13426.429 |
| transcript.whisperx[473].text |
我們居然可以容忍讓他在網路上可以搜尋的到然後還可以購買購買完之後還來到這個超商他外包裝還沒有包裝就是還可以把他遮蔽所以你根本不知道說他裡面內容物是什麼所以也沒有檢查身份證件你說不能容忍我也看到了我們國建署新聞稿講說112年開始加強網路取締那我想請教三個禮拜過去了 |
| transcript.whisperx[474].start |
13428.086 |
| transcript.whisperx[474].end |
13448.468 |
| transcript.whisperx[474].text |
部長現在google還是搜尋的到第一頁打電子煙三個字我都已經我今天其實有點哀莫大於心死三個禮拜前我滿腔熱血我想說罵了之後你可能你不知道說那麼嚴重我罵完之後趕快是不是能夠比照其他違禁品 |
| transcript.whisperx[475].start |
13449.489 |
| transcript.whisperx[475].end |
13450.51 |
| transcript.whisperx[475].text |
包委我們其實一直在努力包括 |
| transcript.whisperx[476].start |
13464.637 |
| transcript.whisperx[476].end |
13486.058 |
| transcript.whisperx[476].text |
包括各個地方政府都有說我們現在的NI防治法抓到以後沒辦法跟他默入跟銷毀所以我們最近也在研究來給他更大的力量部長我真的完全沒有感受到我要不要借一下我的ipad給你你現在搜尋一下電子煙三個字我們要不要看一下說現在google搜尋電子煙三個字出來會是什麼還是他們的官網 |
| transcript.whisperx[477].start |
13490.362 |
| transcript.whisperx[477].end |
13510.598 |
| transcript.whisperx[477].text |
怎麼處理我講了三個禮拜了所有委員在上一次的專案報告裡面罵了那麼多結果到現在我今天如果我是打什麼很奇怪的特殊的暗號密碼拐彎抹角才搜尋到那可能大多數人已經搜尋不到了 |
| transcript.whisperx[478].start |
13511.926 |
| transcript.whisperx[478].end |
13525.09 |
| transcript.whisperx[478].text |
但是現在不是現在是你搜尋網站一打開電子菸三個字大辣辣直接就搜尋到官網就出來了三天就到貨了便利商店就拿到了我們一點辦法都沒有嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[479].start |
13528.985 |
| transcript.whisperx[479].end |
13554.326 |
| transcript.whisperx[479].text |
來來來來來來來 |
| transcript.whisperx[480].start |
13554.506 |
| transcript.whisperx[480].end |
13569.646 |
| transcript.whisperx[480].text |
抱歉喔 占用一些時間喔來剛剛署長我其實都很客氣啦可是剛剛署長講說有針對跨平台跨國開罰這是你10秒鐘前講的來過去對於這些跨平台開罰你罰了多少錢罰了誰罰了誰 |
| transcript.whisperx[481].start |
13573.857 |
| transcript.whisperx[481].end |
13583.422 |
| transcript.whisperx[481].text |
之前不是告訴我們說那個是外國的公司網站設在外面所以你根本不知道人在哪裡他的地址在哪裡你的罰單要寄給誰啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[482].start |
13584.844 |
| transcript.whisperx[482].end |
13608.598 |
| transcript.whisperx[482].text |
我們對於像臉書在臺灣的混國書我現在不是講臉書不要混淆不要委員不是那好糊弄的啦拜託一下我現在從頭到尾沒有講臉書不是臉書上面我現在直接講google你打開google搜尋關鍵字不用什麼特殊技能電子煙就搜尋到他們官方網站了結果 |
| transcript.whisperx[483].start |
13609.522 |
| transcript.whisperx[483].end |
13633.273 |
| transcript.whisperx[483].text |
之前質詢你們講說因為那是跨國公司跨國企業他的IP機房設在國外所以我們抓不到沒辦法那時候我們講是說我沒有辦法抓到他們因為那可能涉及跨國犯罪那我們能不能跟速發部大家討論就至少在我們境內臺灣境內擋IP要求Google臺灣境內不能搜尋到因為他在臺灣就是不合法有些國家也許合法 |
| transcript.whisperx[484].start |
13633.993 |
| transcript.whisperx[484].end |
13634.533 |
| transcript.whisperx[484].text |
我剛提到的我們是對這些平台開罰 |
| transcript.whisperx[485].start |
13655.182 |
| transcript.whisperx[485].end |
13661.348 |
| transcript.whisperx[485].text |
那剛剛提到的遮蔽的部分我們也跟樹化部跟那個NCC一起討論那就是現在都還沒有遮蔽那各部會必須要來強力一起來合作部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[486].start |
13671.893 |
| transcript.whisperx[486].end |
13686.535 |
| transcript.whisperx[486].text |
為什麼會那麼的語重心長就是因為我知道這個世界不完美但我們能夠做到除了法令的完整以外我們讓犯罪成本提高讓一般的民眾不會那麼容易取得違禁品 |
| transcript.whisperx[487].start |
13687.296 |
| transcript.whisperx[487].end |
13705.488 |
| transcript.whisperx[487].text |
因為現在的狀況是如果說連一個12歲15歲的小朋友他只要會搜尋Google一打三天下訂便利商店就買的到了我們怎麼樣防止電子煙禁校園我們怎樣防止我們青少年不去接觸這才是最大的問題 |
| transcript.whisperx[488].start |
13708.524 |
| transcript.whisperx[488].end |
13709.225 |
| transcript.whisperx[488].text |
這個我沒有辦法接受好不好好 謝謝好 謝謝紅門改委員 謝謝部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[489].start |
13736.206 |
| transcript.whisperx[489].end |
13737.749 |
| transcript.whisperx[489].text |
那接下來我們請吳立法委員質詢 |
| transcript.whisperx[490].start |
13753.891 |
| transcript.whisperx[490].end |
13780.82 |
| transcript.whisperx[490].text |
委員好部長好請教您一個問題您衛福部那邊有沒有資料或者你知不知道原住民族我們洗腎的人數您大概知道嗎所有原住民我們剛剛突破60萬人口60萬人您知道原住民洗腎人口多少嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[491].start |
13784.397 |
| transcript.whisperx[491].end |
13797.003 |
| transcript.whisperx[491].text |
我們洗腎的時候不用申報豬群所以要另外再查部長您之前很謝謝您跟我們一起推動原住民族健康法是 |
| transcript.whisperx[492].start |
13797.662 |
| transcript.whisperx[492].end |
13815.657 |
| transcript.whisperx[492].text |
原住民族健康法為什麼要設立就我們講的嘛原住民的健康資料嘛要建立嘛要不然我們要解決健康不平等的現象連最基本的資料都沒有我們在談論的時候都不知道根據什麼好那我再請教部長您一個問題假設你有聽過納馬下鄉吧 |
| transcript.whisperx[493].start |
13821.119 |
| transcript.whisperx[493].end |
13822.64 |
| transcript.whisperx[493].text |
算比較高喔 |
| transcript.whisperx[494].start |
13848.557 |
| transcript.whisperx[494].end |
13850.399 |
| transcript.whisperx[494].text |
法定人數不足 |
| transcript.whisperx[495].start |
13864.847 |
| transcript.whisperx[495].end |
13890.183 |
| transcript.whisperx[495].text |
那個時候有開一個叫做安心上工可是那個時候我爭取是因為我們原住民部落不約而同每個部落都有自主防疫站所以當時希望給他們一些安心上工的一些費用好現在我有告訴原民會原民會有一個原住民就業基金我說啊我們這一些洗腎的人一個禮拜洗三天 |
| transcript.whisperx[496].start |
13890.964 |
| transcript.whisperx[496].end |
13919.094 |
| transcript.whisperx[496].text |
他根本沒有辦法就業但是他又不是沒有能力工作我說能不能夠比照這種安心上工的概念一個禮拜能夠有20個小時讓他起碼有個15000塊不要讓他成為部落家裡的依賴人口讓他也能夠就他的能力去做事所以原民會已經有幫我做一個規劃原地及時就業協助那些洗腎人口就業我現在也想問 |
| transcript.whisperx[497].start |
13920.194 |
| transcript.whisperx[497].end |
13940.74 |
| transcript.whisperx[497].text |
我們的偏鄉醫療部長我們就是因為醫療不足的問題造成我們常常吃成藥亂吃成藥加上一些其他的因素我們的洗腎人口很多啊很辛苦啊能不能夠例如有個行動醫療行動洗腎車這樣的概念來幫助我們偏鄉可以嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[498].start |
13946.209 |
| transcript.whisperx[498].end |
13969.23 |
| transcript.whisperx[498].text |
我想解決偏鄉這個問題是我們不可逃不可避開的責任當然這個可能要跟專家討論洗聖車這樣的一個特性性我其實我也關心過我也問過次長之外願意支持 |
| transcript.whisperx[499].start |
13970.305 |
| transcript.whisperx[499].end |
13988.564 |
| transcript.whisperx[499].text |
如果專家覺得這樣的效益或者成果是不錯我覺得我們應該要支持偏鄉行動洗車可以嗎好那我接下來我要問另外一個問題你知道嗎我們的原建法已經通過一年 |
| transcript.whisperx[500].start |
13989.645 |
| transcript.whisperx[500].end |
14007.026 |
| transcript.whisperx[500].text |
去年的12月29號在國衛院那邊基於原建法有一個原住民健康研究中心正式揭牌我只剩不到兩個禮拜就要投票選舉我還特別去參加揭牌啊我只是為了傳達一個概念啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[501].start |
14007.927 |
| transcript.whisperx[501].end |
14027.124 |
| transcript.whisperx[501].text |
可不可以我們好不容易爭取到的這個是當時主條審查最後協商10秒我爭取到的四個字把文化安全四個字寫入法條中可是我說我們連這個原住民族健康研究中心難道這個主任不可以是我們原住民嗎一年了沒消沒息 |
| transcript.whisperx[502].start |
14033.154 |
| transcript.whisperx[502].end |
14046.463 |
| transcript.whisperx[502].text |
部長文化安全的概念要從這個地方做起為什麼我這樣講你去看原住民族健康研究中心的網站空白一片連組織什麼都沒有因為他是用堅韌的給副院長堅韌的這樣對待我們原住民族健康研究中心好不容易等了十幾年的法 |
| transcript.whisperx[503].start |
14061.55 |
| transcript.whisperx[503].end |
14089.11 |
| transcript.whisperx[503].text |
我們要從人開始做起我們的資料也沒有過去以來都是原民會拜託國衛院做這個原住民的健康統計年報那原住民健康統計年報是我們原住民族健康研究中心很重要的工作所以這個部分我拜託部長你們幫忙一下好不好然後最後一個議題我知道我沒有時間我講但是到我辦公室來談就是我講的 |
| transcript.whisperx[504].start |
14090.293 |
| transcript.whisperx[504].end |
14115.509 |
| transcript.whisperx[504].text |
文件站對原住民太好了做得太好了過去蔡英文8年從以前不到1億的經費竟然現在一年可以超過13億也有我們的長照基金來做文件站做得太好了但是多少年來我們做詬病一直在唸在罵的就是沒有照顧到我們的重度失能老人 |
| transcript.whisperx[505].start |
14116.601 |
| transcript.whisperx[505].end |
14136.622 |
| transcript.whisperx[505].text |
沒有沒有好不容易今年8月有一個原鄉住宿市長照機構在台東開幕平原你知道嗎光是三元平原平均餘命就差三歲結果呢你們也有一個獎勵補助的計劃竟然沒有例如像屏東縣這種大縣 |
| transcript.whisperx[506].start |
14138.644 |
| transcript.whisperx[506].end |
14159.298 |
| transcript.whisperx[506].text |
原住民大縣也沒有任何一個原鄉因為你們說不需要床位足夠你就沒有文化安全的概念了嘛怎麼會認為這樣子呢所以我覺得這個部分不要用捕破網的方式你們說不需要床位 |
| transcript.whisperx[507].start |
14160.558 |
| transcript.whisperx[507].end |
14186.845 |
| transcript.whisperx[507].text |
然後用了一個多元發展計畫沒有納入山地園鄉我們要住宿室你們給我社區室然後呢你們的方法叫做多元結果呢創新我也不知道在創新什麼你們所謂的多元就是日照加夜照我告訴各位加拖連夜照都不要做他說很危險我又沒有醫生我重症患者我怎麼處理而且我也要喘息啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[508].start |
14187.825 |
| transcript.whisperx[508].end |
14202.853 |
| transcript.whisperx[508].text |
沒有不需要他們不要所以到最後我們的重症患者我們的重度失能還是需要住宿型的安養中心結果遠離部落排不到公費床位然後也沒有能力去就在家裡 |
| transcript.whisperx[509].start |
14204.249 |
| transcript.whisperx[509].end |
14230.251 |
| transcript.whisperx[509].text |
所以很辛苦我希望賴總統已經長照3.0了他也講了不能不包含原鄉住宿型的機構不要用一般的模式我們既然有原建法既然大家承認文化安全文化敏感就是表示要積極性的差別待遇我們不能用一般的標準去看這件事所以呢因為時間的關係我希望這個部分可以到辦公室我們一起討論可以嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[510].start |
14231.072 |
| transcript.whisperx[510].end |
14231.552 |
| transcript.whisperx[510].text |
主席主席主席 |
| transcript.whisperx[511].start |
14258.683 |
| transcript.whisperx[511].end |
14262.024 |
| transcript.whisperx[511].text |
好謝謝主席那請我們邱部長好部長部長在上個月底我們中國大陸福建省有公布了他的最新的政策措施就是拋出漳州市5年內要向臺灣的護理人員 |
| transcript.whisperx[512].start |
14288.905 |
| transcript.whisperx[512].end |
14289.205 |
| transcript.whisperx[512].text |
當然有當然有 |
| transcript.whisperx[513].start |
14310.592 |
| transcript.whisperx[513].end |
14330.88 |
| transcript.whisperx[513].text |
那針對這部分因為我們護理人員其實現在已經非常缺乏那像澳洲美國其實也都一直有在像我們在挖角那現在又中國大陸又加入這個行列那不知道我們衛福部針對這部分有沒有什麼措施來因應謝謝委員的關心關心護理人才的 |
| transcript.whisperx[514].start |
14332.901 |
| transcript.whisperx[514].end |
14359.811 |
| transcript.whisperx[514].text |
的一個培育跟留任那這個部分我們國家本來就就是設定了一個三大方向的時候策略一直在積極進行希望不管是越多人來念然後考照率能夠提高留任的工作場域能夠更好薪水能夠更高對我知道有我們像我們針對這部分有推一些措施比如說剛剛有提到那個 |
| transcript.whisperx[515].start |
14360.871 |
| transcript.whisperx[515].end |
14382.207 |
| transcript.whisperx[515].text |
大陸提的價錢我們這裡已經都比他高了我們這裡的薪水都比他高了所以大概那個不太可能可是你有沒有覺得說因為我知道我們部裡當然有一些措施那像有沒有一些比較具體的措施能夠留住這種護理人才其實 |
| transcript.whisperx[516].start |
14383.408 |
| transcript.whisperx[516].end |
14403.145 |
| transcript.whisperx[516].text |
像八大醫治團體其實他們都有一直來提出聲明說要優化更好的護理工作環境以及為辛苦的護理人員加薪其實最好的方式還是保障我們的健保點值那針對這部分部長你的看法呢 |
| transcript.whisperx[517].start |
14406.311 |
| transcript.whisperx[517].end |
14422.344 |
| transcript.whisperx[517].text |
我想給醫護人員能夠加薪更好的一個薪資我覺得是現在政府一直在努力的包括我們現在希望提高健保電子投入這個更多的健保資源 |
| transcript.whisperx[518].start |
14423.084 |
| transcript.whisperx[518].end |
14443.243 |
| transcript.whisperx[518].text |
其實重點就是改善一個工作環境讓我們的醫療人員能夠更好的薪水能夠留得住來照顧人對所以針對八大醫事團體針對說他們覺得這個最好最落實的政策方式就是保障健保點子0.95那這部分部長你同意嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[519].start |
14445.545 |
| transcript.whisperx[519].end |
14465.618 |
| transcript.whisperx[519].text |
在政府這個部分不只其實只要大家我們現在投入的健保的資源其實有700多億所以明年度會有更多很多的讓大家醫療工作整個國家的醫療工作人員能夠有更有量能來照顧保障健保點子0.95基本上 |
| transcript.whisperx[520].start |
14470.311 |
| transcript.whisperx[520].end |
14487.29 |
| transcript.whisperx[520].text |
他們提出這個應該是最有效的方法這部分部長你認不認同我們一致支援只要大家管理得當的話我相信甚至可以超過0.95對所以保障健保點值對於我們 |
| transcript.whisperx[521].start |
14488.482 |
| transcript.whisperx[521].end |
14511.421 |
| transcript.whisperx[521].text |
對於留住這護理人員也是一個具體措施的方法嘛對不對保障護理人員有更多啦我們直接跟他加薪直接跟他獎勵金這個可能跟點子就沒關係我們現在用公務預算保障健保點子也是一個很有效的方法那是一部分啦那但是直接像現在是用公務預算直接給他獎勵 |
| transcript.whisperx[522].start |
14512.102 |
| transcript.whisperx[522].end |
14528.11 |
| transcript.whisperx[522].text |
所以保障健保點值也是一個有效的方法嗎?你應該不反對吧?不反對嘛對不對?好,那我們衛福部跟立法院在這次保障健保點值協商什麼時候通過這組決議?部長記得嗎?上次是9月吧? |
| transcript.whisperx[523].start |
14534.98 |
| transcript.whisperx[523].end |
14547.475 |
| transcript.whisperx[523].text |
好沒關係他是在113年7月16號7月16號那可是我看你們健保署網站最新公布的預估點值在113年第二季 |
| transcript.whisperx[524].start |
14550.498 |
| transcript.whisperx[524].end |
14568.371 |
| transcript.whisperx[524].text |
那我們看到他這個浮動點值居然退回到108年的水準只剩下0.8847那不但沒有執行我們幾個月前的主決議居然這個健保點值還退步到5年前的水準這部分部長你有沒有注意到 |
| transcript.whisperx[525].start |
14572.233 |
| transcript.whisperx[525].end |
14593.303 |
| transcript.whisperx[525].text |
我的意思是說不但沒有到0.95而且還退到108年的水準所以這部分我是認為部長之前不管在委員會還是在總質詢在媒體之前你都承諾會努力在明年6月我們達成健保點子保有0.95的目標 |
| transcript.whisperx[526].start |
14594.884 |
| transcript.whisperx[526].end |
14609.059 |
| transcript.whisperx[526].text |
沒有錯吧這個部長在媒體也說過我一再重申我們會努力而且在努力之下以及現在行政院挹注的支援之下我相信應該會在有應該是會所以部長你也是設定這個目標嗎對對對 |
| transcript.whisperx[527].start |
14611.121 |
| transcript.whisperx[527].end |
14633.668 |
| transcript.whisperx[527].text |
那可是我們現在看到不但沒有往這個目標前進而且還倒退到108年0847你現在提的這個部分是第二季啦對103年第二季就是4到6月啦那是自從大家的鼓勵之下那所以我們現在降勢用命支援益助希望 |
| transcript.whisperx[528].start |
14635.052 |
| transcript.whisperx[528].end |
14654.009 |
| transcript.whisperx[528].text |
一直有提升其實像第三季在幾個區的一個點子就相當都有成長的不錯對我今天提出就是希望部長你不要忘記你的承諾跟自己說過的話要在明年6月達成那因為你現在 |
| transcript.whisperx[529].start |
14654.73 |
| transcript.whisperx[529].end |
14679.985 |
| transcript.whisperx[529].text |
我看沒有往這目標前進還反而倒退我們是非常憂心部長說的一定是往前進的啦我怕部長說的這個會變成空頭支票大家會一起努力但是一定會前進部長你說會朝這方向努力那可是我看到衛福部這次提出的公務預算只有300多億那裡面300多億還包含了撥補 |
| transcript.whisperx[530].start |
14681.466 |
| transcript.whisperx[530].end |
14699.516 |
| transcript.whisperx[530].text |
國民年金的130多億那如果以這種預算你認為衛福部明年6月有辦法達到0.95嗎根本沒有看到你的預算你要怎麼做那個是公務預算因為其實所有的部門就只有衛福部 |
| transcript.whisperx[531].start |
14700.736 |
| transcript.whisperx[531].end |
14728.175 |
| transcript.whisperx[531].text |
增加最多增加了300多億那你看喔你這個健保署提供的點子的數據再加上你的預算部長你明年6月底有信心達成嗎我們是很憂心看不到我們要單獨來看看那個健保這個部分就是說從公務很多從原來是應該在健保我們移出公務預算這個就100多億那部長你有信心達成嗎然後加上總額總額我們 |
| transcript.whisperx[532].start |
14731.598 |
| transcript.whisperx[532].end |
14742.695 |
| transcript.whisperx[532].text |
這次最高推估也到達5.5我們會往這方面來努力那如果照你現在這樣的預算你認為明年6月你有信心達成嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[533].start |
14744.076 |
| transcript.whisperx[533].end |
14770.955 |
| transcript.whisperx[533].text |
我想大家一起努力應該很有機會達成你有沒有保證你有沒有辦法保證這種點子是一種各區管理的事情有時候可是你在委員會總質詢還有媒體訪問之前你都一直說要朝這個目標可是我們現在看你這個編列預算我們覺得像空口支票我們是另外還有健保健保這次的總額增加非常多所以部長你還是朝這個目標在邁進嘛對不對 |
| transcript.whisperx[534].start |
14774.057 |
| transcript.whisperx[534].end |
14795.108 |
| transcript.whisperx[534].text |
當然一定全力以赴好那針對以上的部分我們希望針對我們衛福部一個月內之內可以把護理人員流失到國外醫院任職的人數能夠提出這個數據還有檢討報告這部分有辦法做到嗎以利我們後面護理流財的政策 |
| transcript.whisperx[535].start |
14796.277 |
| transcript.whisperx[535].end |
14819.043 |
| transcript.whisperx[535].text |
怎麼去進行我們委員所隨時的我們來瞭解好麻煩你把這個數據做出來應該我們現在國內的護理條因為我們現在是非常憂心啦現在護理荒啦然後而且也看得到我們現在各國都在挖這個護理人員所以把這個數據統計出來然後再提出這個檢討報告還有針對我們健保點子0.95的部分 |
| transcript.whisperx[536].start |
14824.824 |
| transcript.whisperx[536].end |
14850.644 |
| transcript.whisperx[536].text |
也希望提出這個計畫因為從這個預算真的看不出怎麼樣子去進行也讓我們能夠追蹤衛福部保障健保點值施行的進度然後讓我們能夠估這個預期的成效可以嗎好那這部分請部長要來讓我們來完成還有針對我們一直之前有提出部桃新屋分院 |
| transcript.whisperx[537].start |
14851.755 |
| transcript.whisperx[537].end |
14873.534 |
| transcript.whisperx[537].text |
我現在看不到我們部桃新屋分院的進度捏部長記不記得我們還要去考察過這個一直有進度這個謝謝委員齁非常關心我也是關心那邊海線那邊真的非常感動也非常重要啦齁所以我們義務會在這邊一直努力那現在的進度呢現在已經準備在接受第二次的審查這林市長講 |
| transcript.whisperx[538].start |
14874.835 |
| transcript.whisperx[538].end |
14893.542 |
| transcript.whisperx[538].text |
委員跟報告委員就是我們那個135床那其實是他的一般病床還包含的是6床的特殊病床還有8間的手術房因為這部分是我們經過我們的外部委員特別是在義工在另外的我們的整個建設的裡面我們要把他的設置標準弄得最符合我們現在的規定那 |
| transcript.whisperx[539].start |
14893.962 |
| transcript.whisperx[539].end |
14909.142 |
| transcript.whisperx[539].text |
已經經過第二次的這個審查了在11月中旬大概一個禮拜多那委員有提出一些這個修正的意見那等部立桃園醫院這邊會把修正意見給我們我們就會再進入部裡面再送到行政院去 |
| transcript.whisperx[540].start |
14909.642 |
| transcript.whisperx[540].end |
14927.853 |
| transcript.whisperx[540].text |
部長因為這個我們也去考察過你知道沿海醫療品質這些資源真的是非常匱乏可是你說這個有進度可是我看114年這醫療藥品基金會的預算書上面我沒有看到有關於我們部桃新屋分院 |
| transcript.whisperx[541].start |
14929.124 |
| transcript.whisperx[541].end |
14948.201 |
| transcript.whisperx[541].text |
大樓動工的所有任何的預算都沒有看到他的預算因為要先經過我剛講的就是說我們的建這個蓋醫院的委員看了以後那要報行政院行政院這邊因為他們要去爭取公建計畫那經過國防會這邊同意以後我們才會編列預算那預估這個19.3億的經費我們會分5年來編列 |
| transcript.whisperx[542].start |
14953.726 |
| transcript.whisperx[542].end |
14976.483 |
| transcript.whisperx[542].text |
那有關新聞分院的預算大概什麼時候會編列我們大概是會在115年就是明年如果行政院這邊通過我們就會所以明年會編列就是列到115年好因為我看114年是沒有你說115年會編列因為他的行政流程還沒有完成好那希望針對這部分我們大家都非常關切那趕快進度 |
| transcript.whisperx[543].start |
14977.023 |
| transcript.whisperx[543].end |
15001.883 |
| transcript.whisperx[543].text |
一定要來按照這個進度來進行那115年會編列我們把那個行政流程趕快完成那還有針對我們部桃樂生療養院樂生療養院從日記時代1930年創立到現在他之前也是收容麻風病患可是他現在已經轉型成為地區型的綜合醫院那針對這部分 |
| transcript.whisperx[544].start |
15003.504 |
| transcript.whisperx[544].end |
15023.717 |
| transcript.whisperx[544].text |
因為他一直掛上療養院地方的鄉親很多民眾說一直都還被誤解成他這是精神病院的療養院那民眾還有很多地方鄉親都希望是不是能夠證明為衛生福利部熱身綜合醫院是不是有這個證明的可能機會 |
| transcript.whisperx[545].start |
15026.911 |
| transcript.whisperx[545].end |
15050.497 |
| transcript.whisperx[545].text |
公務委員報告陸森醫院當然就是說已經是非常年代已久那從日據時代到現在那他其實是已經是地區的教學醫院他已經評鑑通過所以他有將近20個科別那188床的健身床剛剛您提到他非常正確就是我們現在漢森月明慢慢的就越來越現在只剩下56名的漢森月明他原本有一個漢森的病房那邊是135床這 |
| transcript.whisperx[546].start |
15052.017 |
| transcript.whisperx[546].end |
15075.306 |
| transcript.whisperx[546].text |
後面那邊是不是要來做改建這是一種方向阿第二個是您剛關心的那個要改名字因為會牽涉到這個熱身療養院的定位因為還是有一些所謂過去對文資文史這一塊那我們當然也是會責成熱身療養院一起來評估相關的醫療資源那特別是他所在的地方將近有10%的桃園願民桃園的民眾有來熱身療養院 |
| transcript.whisperx[547].start |
15078.387 |
| transcript.whisperx[547].end |
15101.362 |
| transcript.whisperx[547].text |
好我今天會提出就是因為有很多的學生的家長跟學子他們有時候去那邊看病看診可是他拿一些藥帶回去是熱身療養院他說有時候會造成他們的困擾有時候其他的同學學生看到之後會有一些隱憂所以才會提出這個是不是直接 |
| transcript.whisperx[548].start |
15102.122 |
| transcript.whisperx[548].end |
15111.011 |
| transcript.whisperx[548].text |
他居然已經是綜合醫院是不是就可以把他改名為樂森綜合醫院這樣子是不是能夠解決地方的一些困擾跟疑惑 |
| transcript.whisperx[549].start |
15113.346 |
| transcript.whisperx[549].end |
15137.909 |
| transcript.whisperx[549].text |
好 我們會再質詢齁 這個可能也不是叫中衛院比較我們部立的比較少用的就是樂生醫院好 沒關係 他就是能夠證明 然後因為他現在是地區型的綜合醫院那就請我們衛福部這邊怎麼樣來給他一個證明好不好好 這個我們因為已經有提出這個疑惑跟誤解了那我也希望說能夠解決地方鄉親居然有提出 而且 |
| transcript.whisperx[550].start |
15138.77 |
| transcript.whisperx[550].end |
15163.163 |
| transcript.whisperx[550].text |
覺得改圍醫院也是實至名歸因為它現在確實是地方型的綜合醫院好 這個當然剛剛執行長有講要多方考量那我希望這個因為我們有提出真的是地方的需求那我相信說這個改圍醫院應該也是適得其所是好 那請部長這邊來跟我們協助幫忙好 了解好 謝謝好 謝謝圖委員 謝謝部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[551].start |
15167.952 |
| transcript.whisperx[551].end |
15187.362 |
| transcript.whisperx[551].text |
接下來我們請吳春成委員質詢報告委員為我們在羅志強委員質詢完畢後休息20分鐘好謝謝主席我們有請部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[552].start |
15196.806 |
| transcript.whisperx[552].end |
15212.357 |
| transcript.whisperx[552].text |
委員好部長好看到你就很開心像笑面佛一樣的謝謝現在這樣的環境很需要你這樣子謝謝帶給大家信心剛才那個圖委員講那個樂生療養院為什麼要改名 |
| transcript.whisperx[553].start |
15220.902 |
| transcript.whisperx[553].end |
15237.208 |
| transcript.whisperx[553].text |
這要證明啊,證明很重要對不對,所以這個部長就是你有很開放的那種思維,不會僵死在那個地方,所以你有同意說改成熱身醫院嘛,這真的好聽多方考量啦,因為文資文史的歷史 |
| transcript.whisperx[554].start |
15241.77 |
| transcript.whisperx[554].end |
15251.137 |
| transcript.whisperx[554].text |
他本身現在就是醫院嘛,有醫院的功能他本來就有醫院的功能嘛,所以證明很重要所以部長你認同把老人引髮族也證明為壯世代嗎?嗯 |
| transcript.whisperx[555].start |
15261.075 |
| transcript.whisperx[555].end |
15261.415 |
| transcript.whisperx[555].text |
當機是不是 |
| transcript.whisperx[556].start |
15291.656 |
| transcript.whisperx[556].end |
15318.024 |
| transcript.whisperx[556].text |
有阿強的陰謀阿強的陰謀你現在時間上幫我停一下這一個有不是這一個是嗎OK好那你呢下一頁呢不對啊你弄到舊的是不是是不是你檔案剛才為什麼會跑掉 |
| transcript.whisperx[557].start |
15321.363 |
| transcript.whisperx[557].end |
15325.726 |
| transcript.whisperx[557].text |
對這樣來臨的一個社會你覺得它是一個悲慘世界 |
| transcript.whisperx[558].start |
15349.504 |
| transcript.whisperx[558].end |
15375.736 |
| transcript.whisperx[558].text |
還是一個美麗新世界我們可以創造美麗新世界所以你認為他可以嘲笑美麗新世界一定要這樣做為什麼一定要這樣子嘛對不對沒得選擇一定要這樣子嘛齁因為為什麼要問這個問題喔這一個的你的信心跟你的想像會決定你的政策你的解方是如果你把它當作是悲慘世界你提出來的都是悲慘解方 |
| transcript.whisperx[559].start |
15376.815 |
| transcript.whisperx[559].end |
15390.826 |
| transcript.whisperx[559].text |
是嗎?對不對?哪一種思維就會往哪一方面對哪一種思維?那你覺得我們現在政府普遍的大概都把他當作什麼?悲慘世界 |
| transcript.whisperx[560].start |
15392.014 |
| transcript.whisperx[560].end |
15392.875 |
| transcript.whisperx[560].text |
先在這裏 |
| transcript.whisperx[561].start |
15416.943 |
| transcript.whisperx[561].end |
15434.564 |
| transcript.whisperx[561].text |
OK因為這個少子高齡化社會定型影響層面很多那這個衛福部在這裡面扮演非常重要的角色不管是少子化不管是高齡化都是你們衛福部的事情因為其他部位都不想管 |
| transcript.whisperx[562].start |
15436.939 |
| transcript.whisperx[562].end |
15463.136 |
| transcript.whisperx[562].text |
大家一起努力啦都沒有在管啦我剛才質詢文化部回來他們就整個就變一千萬而已啊而且還是做什麼那個就是各部會就是覺得60歲以後就沒辦法啦青菜應付就好了啦我60幾歲了所以基本上你也是現在要自求多福自求多福 |
| transcript.whisperx[563].start |
15464.216 |
| transcript.whisperx[563].end |
15478.656 |
| transcript.whisperx[563].text |
政府沒人在理你但是這個越來越多問題越嚴重衛福部若繼續這樣子一定會崩潰你也是承受不住的所以 |
| transcript.whisperx[564].start |
15483.564 |
| transcript.whisperx[564].end |
15505.133 |
| transcript.whisperx[564].text |
總之呢是不是要請衛福部我們現在整個基本上的認知就把這高齡者視為叫引法族為什麼要證明因為引法族每天包括大家討論的就是臥床的問題就是醫院的問題就是一種社會負債的問題安養晚年特殊對待 |
| transcript.whisperx[565].start |
15506.84 |
| transcript.whisperx[565].end |
15513.367 |
| transcript.whisperx[565].text |
那衛福部可不可以把它翻轉成為你就停留在那邊我時間快到了你不要再變來變去了 |
| transcript.whisperx[566].start |
15517.723 |
| transcript.whisperx[566].end |
15541.361 |
| transcript.whisperx[566].text |
那個變成壯世代想像他有30年的健康餘命這叫做美麗新世界30年健康餘命我們現在可以為他們做什麼我們應該要怎麼設計包括整個社福的一個的機構他們需要只脫離生理安全的需求而渴望自我實現他們希望能夠促進世代的循環 |
| transcript.whisperx[567].start |
15543.411 |
| transcript.whisperx[567].end |
15557.191 |
| transcript.whisperx[567].text |
需要精彩的第三人聲OK這個就是OK所以呢好我前面我也跟那個講一下就是上個禮拜資訊月 |
| transcript.whisperx[568].start |
15558.533 |
| transcript.whisperx[568].end |
15587.237 |
| transcript.whisperx[568].text |
我壯世代跟速發部合作辦了一個因為資訊院通常都是年輕人在玩電腦的地方我今年跟速發部合作辦了一個叫壯世代董資樂園董資訊的樂園而且你那個名稱要活潑一點董資董資因為他們有董資券嘛政府都有發董資券所以叫董資樂園你知道創造了什麼爆發壯世代人潮 |
| transcript.whisperx[569].start |
15588.88 |
| transcript.whisperx[569].end |
15609.744 |
| transcript.whisperx[569].text |
所謂的你們所謂的銀髮族大批的銀髮族大概有幾萬人進入資訊業每一個人玩得不亦樂乎所以呢你看抒發部都可以這樣做衛福部可以這樣做嗎系各部會為什麼如果你過去都叫做樂齡什麼資訊區有人要去啦 |
| transcript.whisperx[570].start |
15613.769 |
| transcript.whisperx[570].end |
15613.909 |
| transcript.whisperx[570].text |
委員會主席 |
| transcript.whisperx[571].start |
15633.035 |
| transcript.whisperx[571].end |
15645.6 |
| transcript.whisperx[571].text |
改變一點身份改變一點思維這就叫美好的新世界這叫做美好新世界它會創造很多我以前衛福部我們是不是可以一起努力來推動所以最後 |
| transcript.whisperx[572].start |
15653.612 |
| transcript.whisperx[572].end |
15663.44 |
| transcript.whisperx[572].text |
最後一點就是我現在在推動撞促法撞失在政策的產業發展促進法我們要重要的一點 |
| transcript.whisperx[573].start |
15665.047 |
| transcript.whisperx[573].end |
15684.827 |
| transcript.whisperx[573].text |
就是要做一個雙軌制雙軌制的一個現在除了照護性的政策之外是不是需要一個發展性的政策因為照護性的政策大概只能現在照顧16%的這個失能需要健康長照護的但是我們有84%龐大的這一些 |
| transcript.whisperx[574].start |
15687.549 |
| transcript.whisperx[574].end |
15698.256 |
| transcript.whisperx[574].text |
你完全沒有政策是不是可以發展壯世代的政策成為一個在我們未來不管在做社福的思維當中一個雙軌的一個制度這個請問部長你贊不贊成 |
| transcript.whisperx[575].start |
15700.9 |
| transcript.whisperx[575].end |
15724.734 |
| transcript.whisperx[575].text |
創世代您的任期是相當的大那相關的年齡層其實我們每一個年齡層其實從出生以後到安老到善終所有的生命歷程我們都有需要照顧的任務所以請放心在創世代所包圍的範圍其實相關的一個健康照顧的政策都會有 |
| transcript.whisperx[576].start |
15725.114 |
| transcript.whisperx[576].end |
15744.123 |
| transcript.whisperx[576].text |
因為這個思維不一樣照顧者就是一個要支援狀態是要給支援只要你政府的政策方向的引導不要都從社福的思維都是大家都好像是社福支援的一個爭奪戰事實上狀態可以減少很多的社福的支柱這個非常好的方向好謝謝部長謝謝謝謝吳委員 |
| transcript.whisperx[577].start |
15751.973 |
| transcript.whisperx[577].end |
15752.453 |
| transcript.whisperx[577].text |
主席有請部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[578].start |
15770.663 |
| transcript.whisperx[578].end |
15796.791 |
| transcript.whisperx[578].text |
委員好部長好近年屢屢爆出各種層出不窮的食安事件那今年尤其今年就是剛開始的時候爆出很多件沸沸揚揚那但是最近我在追蹤後續關於食安的問題有些問題可能要就教一下部長那食藥署在顯示比方說顯示香辛料的抽驗不合的這個比例 |
| transcript.whisperx[579].start |
15799.092 |
| transcript.whisperx[579].end |
15817.501 |
| transcript.whisperx[579].text |
從111年的5.9%暴增到112年的16.5%那今年也甚至還有所謂的蘇丹紅事件你認為現在目前為什麼會有這麼大幅度的暴增呢那這是反映我們的邊境的一個查驗的一些遇到的一些問題呢 |
| transcript.whisperx[580].start |
15819.466 |
| transcript.whisperx[580].end |
15841.756 |
| transcript.whisperx[580].text |
當然是報告委員我們當然是社會比較關注到食安所以在查緝的量能就必須增加去查如果有任何違反食安的問題就會呈現出來所以是不是這樣子他的事件就會比較呈現我想把 |
| transcript.whisperx[581].start |
15842.916 |
| transcript.whisperx[581].end |
15856.054 |
| transcript.whisperx[581].text |
事件呈現出來然後去把它解決它應該是一個正面的方向重要的是我們有沒有大家一起努力來落實我們食安五環來保障我們人民食安的健康 |
| transcript.whisperx[582].start |
15857.6 |
| transcript.whisperx[582].end |
15879.995 |
| transcript.whisperx[582].text |
那我跟部長說當然你可以講說這個查驗我支持查驗的那個量要大那這樣子那個涵蓋面就比較夠可是我今天也是要提醒一下說目前來看真的我覺得我們的食品安全的那個問題跟威脅其實越來越大這點希望衛福部能夠多加注意比方說國際食品安全的警訊食藥署 |
| transcript.whisperx[583].start |
15881.296 |
| transcript.whisperx[583].end |
15883.439 |
| transcript.whisperx[583].text |
紅黃綠燈資訊的發布量從109年的414則到112年是大增為1849則 |
| transcript.whisperx[584].start |
15891.892 |
| transcript.whisperx[584].end |
15917.646 |
| transcript.whisperx[584].text |
今年截止到7月到了1353則推估全年會到2300則甚至首次會出現紅燈的警訊我在想說現在這個問題坦白講你如果從414到所謂的2300那已經是將近5倍多了那這麼嚴重的一個狀況不知道現在目前衛福部的因應的狀況是怎麼樣 |
| transcript.whisperx[585].start |
15924.778 |
| transcript.whisperx[585].end |
15943.096 |
| transcript.whisperx[585].text |
報告委員 第一個是先回復委員剛剛在問部長的說說為什麼我們檢查的那個比例持續升高那跟委員報告的是我們現在第一個就是我們透過AI的系統我們增加那個抽查率抽查的高危險性的抽查率所以 |
| transcript.whisperx[586].start |
15943.776 |
| transcript.whisperx[586].end |
15962.253 |
| transcript.whisperx[586].text |
後來抽中的率比例就會比較高第二個件事是因為現在有實案我們有很多都是逐批查驗那逐批查驗以後後來就會檢查的比較高這是第一就是要回復委員為什麼最近的抽查的比例有涵那個實案問題的越來越高第二個就是剛剛委員在問這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[587].start |
15963.814 |
| transcript.whisperx[587].end |
15983.404 |
| transcript.whisperx[587].text |
紅黃綠燈 |
| transcript.whisperx[588].start |
15983.464 |
| transcript.whisperx[588].end |
16005.624 |
| transcript.whisperx[588].text |
那我就提醒現在其實不只台灣內部啦這國際環境上食品安全問題其實也在變得比較我覺得環境面變得比較更嚴峻你就發現這個食品安全問題其實但我也跟你講我覺得跟我們的環境變化包括現在科技發展還是有點關係所以食品安全的那個問題也變得更加的複雜所以希望我們的衛福再努力一下 |
| transcript.whisperx[589].start |
16006.024 |
| transcript.whisperx[589].end |
16029.389 |
| transcript.whisperx[589].text |
那最後一個根據食藥署統計110年到112年有2220批次的食品不合格但是只有1.04%的批次被要求銷毀其他都是採退運處理那這種退運的方式是一個合適的方式嗎請教部長我想應該按照我們現在的法規來落實 |
| transcript.whisperx[590].start |
16033.119 |
| transcript.whisperx[590].end |
16039.596 |
| transcript.whisperx[590].text |
因為過去你也知道曾經發生退運之後他又換一個方式又跑回來嘛有發生過在蘇安紅事件上就曾經遇過 |
| transcript.whisperx[591].start |
16045.38 |
| transcript.whisperx[591].end |
16065.904 |
| transcript.whisperx[591].text |
報告委員那個是如果現在是查出蘇丹色素我們一律是銷毀是不得推運對但我是講蘇丹因為蘇丹紅鬧得很淡這麼做那代表其他部分基本上為什麼不這麼做呢你蘇丹紅可以這麼做其他部分為什麼不這麼做我們再回去研究一下跟委員報告 |
| transcript.whisperx[592].start |
16068.598 |
| transcript.whisperx[592].end |
16068.618 |
| transcript.whisperx[592].text |
好 謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[593].start |
16096.076 |
| transcript.whisperx[593].end |
16123.746 |
| transcript.whisperx[593].text |
羅智祥委員,謝謝部長你兩個要挖不挖?挖啦,你挖不挖?你先講,我說你講了要吃飯啊你還在挖?好,我們請羅智祥委員質詢對不起,我已經準備好了,不好意思,衛福部部長,謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[594].start |
16130.256 |
| transcript.whisperx[594].end |
16155.064 |
| transcript.whisperx[594].text |
誰要署署長一起好不好好來署長齁昨天我們談了很多啊部長對於我生理食鹽水進口專案錯誤的法條引用還有我點出了三項人事案有問題你們在第一時間開記者會要打臉我然後現在呢我想你已經查清楚了沒沒有要打臉啦我們只是說明清楚了查清楚了沒你有沒有引用錯誤法條 |
| transcript.whisperx[595].start |
16158.332 |
| transcript.whisperx[595].end |
16169.716 |
| transcript.whisperx[595].text |
原來引用的法條可能不是那麼周全經過討論不是那麼周全所以你現在有私底下在修其他的法條希望能夠周全對不對對不對對不對所以你引用錯誤法條在第一時間開記者會打臉我你要不要跟我道歉 |
| transcript.whisperx[596].start |
16184.759 |
| transcript.whisperx[596].end |
16196.668 |
| transcript.whisperx[596].text |
石耀署署長有沒有開記者會以及第三項人事案你們現在私底下請他走人因為他是哲學系這個部分查清楚了沒回答 |
| transcript.whisperx[597].start |
16197.689 |
| transcript.whisperx[597].end |
16211.54 |
| transcript.whisperx[597].text |
你是不是有提供錯誤資訊給部長,讓部長不太知道的情況之下回答我,有沒有?對,所以是不是當時我所舉證的都是事實?你已經浪費了我一分多鐘,有沒有?部長,你要不要直接跟我道歉? |
| transcript.whisperx[598].start |
16225.796 |
| transcript.whisperx[598].end |
16248.142 |
| transcript.whisperx[598].text |
報告委員因為那個時候是我們的還在收集資訊的時候當時而且我有跟委員報告說我們當時最早請用55條的原因是有那一個時空背景但是發現你們去請示了其他的部會說這樣子不適宜所以你們現在修整法條對不對跟全國百姓講一下你們是不是引用錯誤 |
| transcript.whisperx[599].start |
16252.085 |
| transcript.whisperx[599].end |
16280.541 |
| transcript.whisperx[599].text |
是就是不是就不是嘛對我們現在就是這件事情我發生了以後我們消息檢討就是說我那個55條法條引用事實上是不正確的那我們現在就開始用27我不是說要讓你丟臉只是說你第一時間回答委員的東西是錯誤的你想要打臉我但事實上你們內部去檢討以後發現自己有錯趕快改進但是你們開記者會去打臉委員對每個委員來說公平嗎你們是不是應該加以去佐證 |
| transcript.whisperx[600].start |
16281.946 |
| transcript.whisperx[600].end |
16310.515 |
| transcript.whisperx[600].text |
所以部長我再講一次進出口輸出役專案引用錯誤法條以及人事案你是不是應該跟全民道歉我想我們在10號時可以說是在發生事件以後非常緊急來這是有關於人民生命跟醫療用品所以你引用錯誤法條導致要害基金不賠所以要打消保法所以你要去逛百貨公司要記得累積點數然後還可以滿千送百 |
| transcript.whisperx[601].start |
16311.824 |
| transcript.whisperx[601].end |
16329.593 |
| transcript.whisperx[601].text |
這就是錯誤所以我一直在講我也一心一意啊我擔心你做錯了然後讓我們要害經濟部賠償最後受害的是人民啊所以你的目的良善我的目的就不良善還是你要感受一下目的良善所以是不是有錯就更正 |
| transcript.whisperx[602].start |
16337.552 |
| transcript.whisperx[602].end |
16362.104 |
| transcript.whisperx[602].text |
因為這是整個過程那也是我看起來你要跟我拖到最後30秒整個過程的一個用最適當的一個沒關係後續我還有很多的料沒關係我們繼續來竟然看不出你的誠意看不出你願意改正我想全民都在看那部長最近勞動部一個職場的霸凌事件全國震驚現在各個立委都收到了這封信我們一一看一下 |
| transcript.whisperx[603].start |
16362.924 |
| transcript.whisperx[603].end |
16388.308 |
| transcript.whisperx[603].text |
就是集管署的組長霸凌屬下的一個事件請問現在調查結果是如何我們昨天啟動調查一個禮拜之內會查清楚究責相關的流程到底要怎麼做誰要負責調查會不會立場偏薄我告訴你昨天已經一個勞動部他調查出來的結果大家全民能夠接受嗎他開的記者會全民能夠接受嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[604].start |
16389.289 |
| transcript.whisperx[604].end |
16407.099 |
| transcript.whisperx[604].text |
不要再有立場偏頗不要再為自己找藉口內部的調查全民都失望這就是為什麼我們需要聽證權為什麼要國會改革讓我們來調查才能夠找出事實而不是你們的內部調查全民都已經不相信了可是現在呢 |
| transcript.whisperx[605].start |
16407.859 |
| transcript.whisperx[605].end |
16419.822 |
| transcript.whisperx[605].text |
又有這樣子的一個土皇帝就在你們衛福部集管署昨天我在這邊也一直講各個部位請注意把你們內部有相關案例都應該如實的找出來 |
| transcript.whisperx[606].start |
16421.479 |
| transcript.whisperx[606].end |
16446.074 |
| transcript.whisperx[606].text |
昨天說兩個禮拜今天變一個禮拜我現在要通知你立場有沒有偏頗誰要來調查你要不要講清楚說明白絕對不偏頗我請事由機關署機關署委員好那我們現在是有找兩位外部的專家就是一個是法律專家一個是心理諮商的專家另外我們署內有兩個委員但是都跟這位組長不熟會組成委員會那會 |
| transcript.whisperx[607].start |
16447.435 |
| transcript.whisperx[607].end |
16468.075 |
| transcript.whisperx[607].text |
主要就是說我們會先今天開始其實我們已經有一個匿名的問卷給這個我們的主員來同仁來填那根據那個問卷收來之後我們會去請這個委員來決定要來面談的一個同仁那這個部會也會找那個之前有離職的一個同仁來做詢問以上 |
| transcript.whisperx[608].start |
16468.635 |
| transcript.whisperx[608].end |
16485.547 |
| transcript.whisperx[608].text |
我想事情已經發生已經有潛力了齁今天他開記者會不開還好一開全民爆炸相信你們應該有智慧不要重蹈覆轍最後我要提醒你中興大學申請了複設醫院案共499創你知不支持部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[609].start |
16486.687 |
| transcript.whisperx[609].end |
16488.708 |
| transcript.whisperx[609].text |
目前教育部還沒回溫因為他是教育部體系的學校所以會有雙重主管 |
| transcript.whisperx[610].start |
16506.721 |
| transcript.whisperx[610].end |
16522.98 |
| transcript.whisperx[610].text |
我想雙重主管的問題交一步我會再來今天難得來到衛福部我希望部長你可以支持在台中這樣子醫療量能夠提升這是我們台中市民還有民意代表該做的這部分麻煩你了解可以嗎我想我們會非常客觀的來評估來 |
| transcript.whisperx[611].start |
16524.963 |
| transcript.whisperx[611].end |
16542.582 |
| transcript.whisperx[611].text |
來協助整個臺中的一個醫療資源能夠充分好最後我想波波醫生最近很多的報導都指出有這樣子的900個波波醫生我想請問你你的管控要如何你知道他們都在哪裡職業嗎這部分你們有登記嗎有醫事人員的系統可以追查到醫事登錄的一個職業場所嗎有嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[612].start |
16546.775 |
| transcript.whisperx[612].end |
16555.942 |
| transcript.whisperx[612].text |
你第一個委員所寫的這個波波醫生900個是報載指出有900個波波醫生在等那個等牙醫嗎不只是牙醫波波醫生對不起你沒有在狀況內報載登載的這麼大900個波波醫生網路都在討論我知道900個那個名單那個 |
| transcript.whisperx[613].start |
16575.785 |
| transcript.whisperx[613].end |
16582.353 |
| transcript.whisperx[613].text |
所以你有沒有相關的這些系統能夠追蹤這些人的疑似登錄職業場所有沒有 |
| transcript.whisperx[614].start |
16589.552 |
| transcript.whisperx[614].end |
16606.824 |
| transcript.whisperx[614].text |
委員我補充一下我們只要是中華民國合格的醫師我們其實有醫事管理系統會知道他在哪裡執業可是血力這件事情並不在我們登錄系統裡面以上 |
| transcript.whisperx[615].start |
16607.384 |
| transcript.whisperx[615].end |
16629.969 |
| transcript.whisperx[615].text |
我想名單牽涉到各支我們都尊重但是部長要怎麼增加民眾的信任度本席這才是真正在乎的臺中市民有資的權利就醫的選擇權所以我想請問部長在臺中地區有哪幾家醫療院所是有波波醫師牙醫師職業看診你可以告訴我們嗎這我們手頭上應該沒有這種資料 |
| transcript.whisperx[616].start |
16631.351 |
| transcript.whisperx[616].end |
16657.722 |
| transcript.whisperx[616].text |
所以就是沒有掌握嗎你要就是承認你跟全民承認你沒有這樣的資料沒有我們無法掌握我們是說好第一個就是醫師的考試要一定要有執照然後他的繼續的教育訓練包括他的專科醫師的訓練還有他執業以後的繼續教育我想時間有限喔我會去追蹤這些案子我也跟你告訴我們今天所講的這三個案子麻煩你後續有相關的資料請給我們知道一下好的是好謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[617].start |
16662.306 |
| transcript.whisperx[617].end |
16678.562 |
| transcript.whisperx[617].text |
好 謝謝謝謝何委員繼續我們請張雅玲委員質詢要不要戴鴨尾 鴨尾可以先吃沒關係啦不要不要 要善待自己齁一直拖啦 梁祥銘講話還要讓你們吃飯啦 真夭壽 |
| transcript.whisperx[618].start |
16685.674 |
| transcript.whisperx[618].end |
16686.014 |
| transcript.whisperx[618].text |
首先我們先來邀請部長 謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[619].start |
16707.19 |
| transcript.whisperx[619].end |
16731.237 |
| transcript.whisperx[619].text |
委員好我想在開始之前我剛剛有聽到委員在講說這一些的霸凌事件非常需要來秉公處理要有第三方的介入來完整的呈現因為這一條人命離去之後應該要留給我們的是教訓以及改革我想部長也是非常認同那我也要反駁一下前一位羅廷偉委員說的就是 |
| transcript.whisperx[620].start |
16732.958 |
| transcript.whisperx[620].end |
16757.237 |
| transcript.whisperx[620].text |
國會聽證權已經被大法官判定為違憲不要再拿這一件事情來趁機作亂這是一個違憲的事件不需要再拿聽證權所以我希望衛福部一定要來徹底的調查這件事情那剛剛也有講到一個禮拜要提出調查報告這個我們也非常的期待我們也會持續的來關注那接下來我就回到我今天原本要來質詢的題目 |
| transcript.whisperx[621].start |
16759.684 |
| transcript.whisperx[621].end |
16759.744 |
| transcript.whisperx[621].text |
國建署長 |
| transcript.whisperx[622].start |
16775.199 |
| transcript.whisperx[622].end |
16796.137 |
| transcript.whisperx[622].text |
我想要針對於找聊預算的部分因為其實我們在講找聊是非常非常重要的一件事情那我們現在其實找聊的量能其實都還不足沒有達到一個世界應該有的一個標準但是我卻看到在我們人數上升的時候我們找聊的預算卻跟去年相比少了1500萬 |
| transcript.whisperx[623].start |
16798.908 |
| transcript.whisperx[623].end |
16806.232 |
| transcript.whisperx[623].text |
那我有點不太了解就是說明明人數就在增加啊我們量能根本都還沒到為什麼我的預算會少1500萬可不可以請署長做個說明 |
| transcript.whisperx[624].start |
16811.201 |
| transcript.whisperx[624].end |
16829.873 |
| transcript.whisperx[624].text |
我想我們在找來的部分分成兩個部分一個是聯評中心的部件的部分那另外一個是我們今年7月要開始推行的6次的一個成長評估的部分那這兩個加起來我們總共的建位應該是在5.5到6億之間 |
| transcript.whisperx[625].start |
16832.857 |
| transcript.whisperx[625].end |
16859.334 |
| transcript.whisperx[625].text |
對所以所以應該是說我們是有增加嗎跟去年來說我們增加多少呢大概增加了1.73億左右1.73億就是來做剛剛講的部件對不對跟6次的部分好那我想再確認一件事情就是說我知道我們現在在做找療的時候呢如果他今天是透過這個兒童找療的特別門診的話其實我們是會有通報跟追蹤的機制對嗎我理解是這樣子 |
| transcript.whisperx[626].start |
16860.114 |
| transcript.whisperx[626].end |
16879.811 |
| transcript.whisperx[626].text |
但是如果今天家長是透過一般復健門診的話我們其實就沒有通報了對嗎也沒有辦法去追蹤他還是可以走原來的通報系統但是我確認過醫院現在是這個一般的復健門診進來的是沒有進入通報系統 |
| transcript.whisperx[627].start |
16880.834 |
| transcript.whisperx[627].end |
16895.042 |
| transcript.whisperx[627].text |
因為通報系統在中央是社交組在地方的話是在社政我們來瞭解一下好那這部分是不是可以跟社政一起來瞭解一下因為我想喔因為現實上就是這些孩子有可能因為我們家長 |
| transcript.whisperx[628].start |
16896.222 |
| transcript.whisperx[628].end |
16920.184 |
| transcript.whisperx[628].text |
家長的一些覺得這是貼標籤的行為或是他家族壓力不希望自己的小孩有狀況或者是說關於保險所以造成了這些孩子最後沒有進入這個系統來去協助他那這會造成什麼樣子的問題就是等他到上學了之後跟人際衝突那開始就會產生我們所謂的這些學校的衝突霸凌事件都非常有關聯 |
| transcript.whisperx[629].start |
16921.525 |
| transcript.whisperx[629].end |
16936.92 |
| transcript.whisperx[629].text |
所以這個變成是早期的對家長的教育非常的重要所以我想社家屬也責無旁貸一定要來積極的積極的來協助做更多的溝通跟瞭解為什麼他們不願意通報以及該如何協助他們通報 |
| transcript.whisperx[630].start |
16938.792 |
| transcript.whisperx[630].end |
16955.032 |
| transcript.whisperx[630].text |
這部分社家署跟國建署是不是可以一起來合作呢我們來研議看看竟然當然先導鼓勵還有怎麼樣來強化兩邊的一個連結因為這個通報系統能夠更完整好那這個署長呢社家署 |
| transcript.whisperx[631].start |
16956.536 |
| transcript.whisperx[631].end |
16981.132 |
| transcript.whisperx[631].text |
有關通報的部分其實不管是在門診或者是在找療藥系統他其實都是可以去通報但是我問了我問的是大型醫院他們是說一般是沒有通報的那沒關係因為我想你的理解跟現場執行上面出現了落差那就變成說因為我詢問的還是超大型醫院 |
| transcript.whisperx[632].start |
16981.832 |
| transcript.whisperx[632].end |
16998.737 |
| transcript.whisperx[632].text |
他都沒有通報可是他這邊是接收到最多的嘛那到底發生了什麼事情那這部分就請社家署跟國健署一起來了解好嗎那我想齁盤點一下我們現在的各大型醫院縣市到底有沒有做一般的門診的通報這部分可以做個盤點嗎我們來調查一下啦好那大概什麼時候可以給我調查結果一般的福建門診 |
| transcript.whisperx[633].start |
17011.946 |
| transcript.whisperx[633].end |
17037.247 |
| transcript.whisperx[633].text |
這大概什麼時候可以給我一個調查結果大概多久因為我想這是回到兒少最佳的話利益原則所以這大概什麼時候可以給我兩個禮拜好不好好兩個禮拜謝謝那再來就是我要請我們謝謝國建署署長可以請回謝謝那我想要在社家署也可以請回接下來我想要請教部長就是說 |
| transcript.whisperx[634].start |
17039.79 |
| transcript.whisperx[634].end |
17055.446 |
| transcript.whisperx[634].text |
我們在我想學生自殺率、智商率節節上升而且昨年增加大幅度的增加我想這是不爭的事實我想部長也非常非常的清楚那尤其是在國中端的部分可以幫我按下一頁嗎?他沒有反應 |
| transcript.whisperx[635].start |
17057.343 |
| transcript.whisperx[635].end |
17079.869 |
| transcript.whisperx[635].text |
我們現在是有一些心理的我們國家是有提供一些心理諮商的服務在15到45歲所以我看這張表我想部長你可以看一下在國中的這一條黃色線10到14歲它裡面其實包含的是國中端的部分這一段其實也是在增加可是我們現在其實並沒有提供相關的青壯世代的心理健康支持方案 |
| transcript.whisperx[636].start |
17080.729 |
| transcript.whisperx[636].end |
17110.203 |
| transcript.whisperx[636].text |
那我在想我們是不是可以針對國中端的這個部分一起來提供來研議啦是不是可以提供這個免費心理諮商的補助之前我其實也有質詢過教育部了那希望他們可以來跟衛福部一起來努力這個部分我想要聽聽看衛福部的意見針對國中端延伸到國中端這一部分好我們會跟教育部來一起協同努力那新建室要不要看狀況報告一下 |
| transcript.whisperx[637].start |
17111.689 |
| transcript.whisperx[637].end |
17140.226 |
| transcript.whisperx[637].text |
謝謝委員關切這個呃國中生的一個呃自殺的一個問題喔那因為現在學校呃在教育部的部分是有呃學校三級輔導的一個機制那興建師這邊主要是在社區這邊做資源的部件但是針對國中生的心理健康我們也非常的關心所以我們會跟教育部這邊一起來演繹如何在呃國中這個階段能夠加強他們的心理健康那我希望可以在一個月內跟教育部討論好嗎呃好那結束之後各位的書面報告謝謝謝謝主席 |
| transcript.whisperx[638].start |
17140.686 |
| transcript.whisperx[638].end |
17141.086 |
| transcript.whisperx[638].text |
請楊雄英委員質詢 |
| transcript.whisperx[639].start |
17160.362 |
| transcript.whisperx[639].end |
17186.15 |
| transcript.whisperx[639].text |
委員好部長本週日11月24號呢反波波大遊行的三大訴求那這個方向呢我想你在這個衛福部在上個禮拜五你也宣布你就說暫緩海外醫學生赴偏鄉實習規定是嗎對然後接下來呢這個你本週二也又表示是不是 |
| transcript.whisperx[640].start |
17187.056 |
| transcript.whisperx[640].end |
17187.356 |
| transcript.whisperx[640].text |
同樣的立場,同樣的狀況 |
| transcript.whisperx[641].start |
17217.652 |
| transcript.whisperx[641].end |
17226.141 |
| transcript.whisperx[641].text |
應該是增加因為這55個我們加強他的設備鼓勵本國的牙醫師這55個但是你說是要以本國的學歷優先嗎資深醫師也可以去啊我們是鼓勵資深醫師能夠去嘛 |
| transcript.whisperx[642].start |
17236.992 |
| transcript.whisperx[642].end |
17253.628 |
| transcript.whisperx[642].text |
鼓勵那但是人家願不願意來所以我們現在會用各種辦法第一個我們譬如說他願意到衛生所去執業然後我們就跟他買相關的所有的設備儀器馬上當地的無牙醫的問題就解決了 |
| transcript.whisperx[643].start |
17254.249 |
| transcript.whisperx[643].end |
17269.834 |
| transcript.whisperx[643].text |
我希望做好社會的共識也就是說對醫界的聲音你希望他去他不一定要去他條件不一條件不符他當然不去這是你方的想法所以本席非常希望能夠落實 |
| transcript.whisperx[644].start |
17270.774 |
| transcript.whisperx[644].end |
17295.689 |
| transcript.whisperx[644].text |
你把你的方案你要去我把你設備都做好那這是現在你的理念理想條件要怎麼做我可以給你怎麼樣我希望部長你也是來自意見你應該去盤點那這55個偏鄉裡頭那到底會怎麼樣去落實不影響到民眾的權益這是本席今天跟你討論的我跟委員報告一下 |
| transcript.whisperx[645].start |
17296.67 |
| transcript.whisperx[645].end |
17298.433 |
| transcript.whisperx[645].text |
我當總醫師當完以後就到群體醫療臺大派我到群體醫療之類的中心金山那個時候是沒有醫師你現在已經是部長了你現在是部長的立場不是公告啦不是講你的歷程啦你要講 |
| transcript.whisperx[646].start |
17312.692 |
| transcript.whisperx[646].end |
17314.193 |
| transcript.whisperx[646].text |
你現在要怎麼樣讓這55個無牙醫的偏鄉他能夠有牙醫啦因為你的編列預算裡頭呢你編列了24億啊要優化偏鄉的醫療這個計畫第二期嘛對不對當然嘛好就這個議題請你請你 |
| transcript.whisperx[647].start |
17334.759 |
| transcript.whisperx[647].end |
17363.943 |
| transcript.whisperx[647].text |
沒問題我希望很快可以看到說我們每一個地方沒有再無牙醫的這個偏鄉嘛那也希望我們也希望多一點牙醫師願意來下鄉這是你你要拿出你的對應方案嘛有有有我們給我們給他設備給他保障師來你把方案給本席我希望達到55個無牙醫偏鄉的這個能夠彌平這個我們非常希望趕快來解決這個問題對你把方案給本席 |
| transcript.whisperx[648].start |
17365.784 |
| transcript.whisperx[648].end |
17392.58 |
| transcript.whisperx[648].text |
接下來本席要請教你那個0.95我們立法院大家決議過了那我也很感謝你在院會的時候我們在討論你也打胸部說我一定會達成這個是對的因為這個是最公平的這個人民納稅錢的一個軍用就是每一家每一戶都有那你這明年的預算怎麼來呢 |
| transcript.whisperx[649].start |
17397.725 |
| transcript.whisperx[649].end |
17419.057 |
| transcript.whisperx[649].text |
719億嘛0.95我們把很多增加了不少那個增加了大概有兩三百億的公務預算然後再加上那個我們這次的健保總額這個很重要健保總額我們用高推估大概5.5%所以我們如果高推估的話預計可以增加了大概500億嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[650].start |
17425.701 |
| transcript.whisperx[650].end |
17431.786 |
| transcript.whisperx[650].text |
500多億那這樣加起來大概會增加712億增加的一個健保的資源你講的這兩項來源會有這個712億這個有部分是這個健保應該是在健保的基金裡面不是在公務預算這邊 |
| transcript.whisperx[651].start |
17446.198 |
| transcript.whisperx[651].end |
17469.848 |
| transcript.whisperx[651].text |
所以換句話說明年有9000多億的健保總額所以換句話說也就是114年健保點值補助到1.0.95元那這個金額你已經有來源是OK沒問題的也不是說補啦我是說我們大家一起工作自然就到0.95這樣子部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[652].start |
17473.81 |
| transcript.whisperx[652].end |
17482.236 |
| transcript.whisperx[652].text |
什麼大家一起公佈公佈公佈就自然達到0.95你現在給人家到0.82欸怎麼可以講話你現在是部長你不是立法委員你不是議事會你不只這個身份你是部長你要政策告訴人家明年的1.0.95是沒問題的你來源沒問題我們要聽的是這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[653].start |
17495.026 |
| transcript.whisperx[653].end |
17516.881 |
| transcript.whisperx[653].text |
對不對因為這個牽涉到疾病的形態的一個變化還有管理的情況如果這個都穩定的話我們就可以達到0.95應該是沒有問題最後這一句話算數我還是聽最後這一句話部長所以務必要達到這是立法院商黨決議當然當然行政部門就是遵照決議大家來努力最後一個議題 |
| transcript.whisperx[654].start |
17523.544 |
| transcript.whisperx[654].end |
17533.111 |
| transcript.whisperx[654].text |
2030年你要減少癌症死亡率三分之一2030年我們看到你醫療保健支出是315.7億那比這個113年你是增加了128.46% |
| transcript.whisperx[655].start |
17540.896 |
| transcript.whisperx[655].end |
17560.535 |
| transcript.whisperx[655].text |
那你公布了癌症從71年到112年都是全國十大死因之首而且108年到112年你是排行榜前五名主要就是癌症那當然他的醫療費用是一直在增加所以部長你說要從 |
| transcript.whisperx[656].start |
17561.355 |
| transcript.whisperx[656].end |
17585.36 |
| transcript.whisperx[656].text |
要到2030年減少癌症死亡率三分之一來達到對國人生命健康的一個重視這是對的方向要怎麼做呢比如說臺灣的肺癌那麼多那你這個肺癌篩檢你是不是從預防重於治療這樣你可以減少後端很多的醫療支出我們是不是應該要讓這個肺癌的篩檢 |
| transcript.whisperx[657].start |
17588.018 |
| transcript.whisperx[657].end |
17613.875 |
| transcript.whisperx[657].text |
委員的指教非常正確檢查這樣子你看以往我們推動的子宮頸啊這一些啊現在大家成效都出來也保障國人安全那肺癌的部分呢肺癌的部分我們一直在推啊所以早出所以肺癌突然他那個除了預防跟治療也精進了不少在預防我們推出的那個低劑量的篩檢以後呢 |
| transcript.whisperx[658].start |
17617.278 |
| transcript.whisperx[658].end |
17619.761 |
| transcript.whisperx[658].text |
答到那個條件就免費阿 |
| transcript.whisperx[659].start |
17633.097 |
| transcript.whisperx[659].end |
17640.585 |
| transcript.whisperx[659].text |
對阿 達到那個條件就來不及了 拜託本期告訴你的是預防的這一塊怎麼做我所謂的 那是 我現在在講預防 我們現在在講預防阿誰有條件去做篩檢嘛 不是說我想去做就是當然我們就會設定在比較高危險群我們去叫 請他去做篩檢 這樣比較早的出來啦阿這個效果相當好 |
| transcript.whisperx[660].start |
17655.96 |
| transcript.whisperx[660].end |
17677.201 |
| transcript.whisperx[660].text |
對高危險群的你們是不是可以做一個方案我覺得這個已經在做了對已經在做但是有一些人還是我都沒辦法我都沒錢可以去賺錢所以你那個範圍你到目前還是第一名你那個範圍你已經有成效你那個範圍是不是可以怎樣再擴大 |
| transcript.whisperx[661].start |
17677.882 |
| transcript.whisperx[661].end |
17692.038 |
| transcript.whisperx[661].text |
好好好我們希望這個能夠需要的人都能夠被塞到塞到以後我們好好地給他治療需要的人都能夠被塞到要怎麼樣讓需要的人可以塞到一定一定一定你把它擴大好不好 |
| transcript.whisperx[662].start |
17695.522 |
| transcript.whisperx[662].end |
17702.184 |
| transcript.whisperx[662].text |
會演繹阿,因為這個要實證好不好,對對對對,你演繹嘛好不好,演繹方案出來嘛好不好,謝謝好,謝謝原委員,謝謝部長,現在休息20分鐘 |
| transcript.whisperx[663].start |
18949.656 |
| transcript.whisperx[663].end |
18962.145 |
| transcript.whisperx[663].text |
好大家坐好啦繼續開會啦我們剩下我們四個本委員會的齁保護時間好我們現在請楊耀文質詢好謝謝主席主席請一下邱部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[664].start |
18979.096 |
| transcript.whisperx[664].end |
18983.843 |
| transcript.whisperx[664].text |
委員好部長好部長我還是想要就 |
| transcript.whisperx[665].start |
18986.124 |
| transcript.whisperx[665].end |
19009.935 |
| transcript.whisperx[665].text |
建保的幾個問題跟部長先做個探討原因是什麼呢?原因是在未完委員會已經處理了一個勞保的大洞一直補不滿所以我們在建保還沒有很大的問題之前必須要先有妥善的規劃 |
| transcript.whisperx[666].start |
19013.317 |
| transcript.whisperx[666].end |
19037.051 |
| transcript.whisperx[666].text |
那現在是這樣子就是因為你有承諾說行政部門有承諾在明年6月底之前健保點值要保障1.0.95元那我想要知道一下衛福部的預算大概打算從哪裡來 |
| transcript.whisperx[667].start |
19039.903 |
| transcript.whisperx[667].end |
19045.286 |
| transcript.whisperx[667].text |
謝謝委員,我想那個是大家各黨的決議,我們行政部門會全力往這個目標來努力 |
| transcript.whisperx[668].start |
19052.401 |
| transcript.whisperx[668].end |
19074.785 |
| transcript.whisperx[668].text |
大概分兩個部分一個是公務預算邊的增加這個部分大概增加了100多億這從原來在健保裡面我們把它挪出來做公務預算部長我想要請問一下從健保裡面挪出來是什麼意思 |
| transcript.whisperx[669].start |
19076.52 |
| transcript.whisperx[669].end |
19089.998 |
| transcript.whisperx[669].text |
因為公務預算這是公務預算嘛有些公共衛生的啦那本來應該由公務預算來支出這次相聲量很好就把這些 |
| transcript.whisperx[670].start |
19091.426 |
| transcript.whisperx[670].end |
19119.061 |
| transcript.whisperx[670].text |
所以變成由公務預算來支出這樣健保就不用去支付那些公共衛生的支出這其實我們清除不少啦就是原本就不應該是由健保來給付的那就是表示之前收的保費有問題啦不是收的保費有問題收的保費就是照顧人民健康啦你這些原本不應該由健保來給付嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[671].start |
19121.443 |
| transcript.whisperx[671].end |
19136.396 |
| transcript.whisperx[671].text |
那你是用給付跟收費是一個平衡的狀態嗎?部長現在講的意思是說現在的公務預算是之前原本有健保給付的嗎? |
| transcript.whisperx[672].start |
19140.539 |
| transcript.whisperx[672].end |
19163.81 |
| transcript.whisperx[672].text |
原來沒有公務預算這現在提出來當然是要變公務預算啊對啦對啦他可以提出來而且部長的意思是說這可以提出來就是感謝行政院願意來公務預算來處理這一塊啦這樣讓那個健保就有更多的空間嘛 |
| transcript.whisperx[673].start |
19165.071 |
| transcript.whisperx[673].end |
19176.194 |
| transcript.whisperx[673].text |
那這個部分大概政府就多撥了100多億然後我們其實很大的很重要的一件事情就是那個我們的健保總額336億 |
| transcript.whisperx[674].start |
19190.003 |
| transcript.whisperx[674].end |
19195.607 |
| transcript.whisperx[674].text |
所以算起來就是整個對健保的意志大概有712億就是假如要達到1.0.95必須要增加700多億原先算是差不多要700億我們現在整個712億 |
| transcript.whisperx[675].start |
19212.228 |
| transcript.whisperx[675].end |
19238.345 |
| transcript.whisperx[675].text |
就是說看怎麼樣來幫忙那你現在公務預算一百多億那還有六百多億從哪裡來從那個健保總部長現在講的七百多億是總數還是增加的你們預估要保障點值到0.9增加的七百一十二億是比以前多出來的比以前多出來的 |
| transcript.whisperx[676].start |
19240.805 |
| transcript.whisperx[676].end |
19244.209 |
| transcript.whisperx[676].text |
那得出來的動員你怎麼樣去處理這712億就是變成 |
| transcript.whisperx[677].start |
19248.28 |
| transcript.whisperx[677].end |
19264.929 |
| transcript.whisperx[677].text |
還是跟點子有關係那這個不是那公務預算100多億那其他呢其他有最少還有500多億啊增加了我們因為我們健保總額增加了531億喔531億然後加上111億齁我總原來這總額我會把它移出來齁這個這算起來齁還加上寒病齁寒病本來是 |
| transcript.whisperx[678].start |
19277.66 |
| transcript.whisperx[678].end |
19283.585 |
| transcript.whisperx[678].text |
所以大概全部都給100去年就是今年的總額增加了712億成長了8.13% |
| transcript.whisperx[679].start |
19290.529 |
| transcript.whisperx[679].end |
19309.222 |
| transcript.whisperx[679].text |
沒有啊,我只是不知道你增加這裡700多億的裁員就比較明確的是一個裁員是一個行政院移住公務我們有兩個大部分一個是行政院有移住那行政院移住又有分兩大部分那個原來的 |
| transcript.whisperx[680].start |
19319.703 |
| transcript.whisperx[680].end |
19344.114 |
| transcript.whisperx[680].text |
總額移出來的有100多億那另外還有行政院譬如說我們現在那個癌症心藥基金還有其他的罕病的補助所以那個加起來所以行政院total連那個移出去的是300多億330幾億那另外一個是我們總額裡面的總額裡面的額度是由部長這邊來核定的今年會有比較高的額度所以他成長會比較高 |
| transcript.whisperx[681].start |
19346.539 |
| transcript.whisperx[681].end |
19363.032 |
| transcript.whisperx[681].text |
就是有一些是公務預算阿有一些是成長阿我剛才副市長講的其實有的我們沒有算在政府裡面那個就是有些對支出面有影響的我們才算進來那大概是 |
| transcript.whisperx[682].start |
19367.247 |
| transcript.whisperx[682].end |
19391.477 |
| transcript.whisperx[682].text |
111就突然點子要保障了所以就多出很多收入這個我也覺得很奇怪報告委員因為那個健保總額他每年會有一個成長率低推估成長率是今年是2點就是114年是2.652然後高推估會到5.5所以他前面有一筆錢就是如果我們今年真的把明年的114年的總額 |
| transcript.whisperx[683].start |
19393.038 |
| transcript.whisperx[683].end |
19422.228 |
| transcript.whisperx[683].text |
拉到最高的推估5.5的時候那筆也會產生一筆錢就是推估的啊推估的不是實際現在就一定有那個就是成長率他就是未來的就明年的成長率如果我們用掉真的用到5.5的話我們會有391億就是含低推估累積上來的在這個總額裡面那再來就是剛剛部長有提到的111億就是以前我們可能有些政策先用在健保來做總額支出 |
| transcript.whisperx[684].start |
19422.708 |
| transcript.whisperx[684].end |
19441.324 |
| transcript.whisperx[684].text |
現在也感謝行政院給我們爭取到用公務預算繼續做可是它可以移出一個空間那裡又有111億以上這樣補充因為我時間的關係我跟部長建議一下我覺得你們要不要考慮調整保費 |
| transcript.whisperx[685].start |
19448.283 |
| transcript.whisperx[685].end |
19471.253 |
| transcript.whisperx[685].text |
或者是補充保費然後呢或者是跟行政院做溝通把特定的稅收來挹注健保因為我剛剛就講過了我實在不願意看到未還三個部會裡面日後就有兩個部會有兩個大棟必須要補 |
| transcript.whisperx[686].start |
19474.912 |
| transcript.whisperx[686].end |
19492.967 |
| transcript.whisperx[686].text |
而且可能會一直公務預算的支出因為勞保現在已經很慘了那健保我真的是不大想再看到又有另外一個坑洞必須要一直補所以應該調整保費就調整保費 |
| transcript.whisperx[687].start |
19497.131 |
| transcript.whisperx[687].end |
19498.832 |
| transcript.whisperx[687].text |
應該找特定的稅收當作專款來預注 |
| transcript.whisperx[688].start |
19511.227 |
| transcript.whisperx[688].end |
19536.357 |
| transcript.whisperx[688].text |
就朝這個方向那你們必須要做的這個是開源節流的部分我覺得你們醫療分歧確實做得不夠踏實然後另外一個我現在講的是公部門還沒有牽扯到社會大眾就是就醫的觀念就是一個醫療分歧 |
| transcript.whisperx[689].start |
19538.058 |
| transcript.whisperx[689].end |
19559.436 |
| transcript.whisperx[689].text |
一個就是醫學中心無止境的增加我覺得這個都是都會讓剛剛我們講的是開源現在講的是節流你們假如說一方面開源也不去應該增加保費我想 |
| transcript.whisperx[690].start |
19560.7 |
| transcript.whisperx[690].end |
19579.559 |
| transcript.whisperx[690].text |
主動跟國人同胞講清楚大家會接受應該找特定的財源來預注我也不相信行政院找不出來這是開源的部分節流的部分我覺得醫療分級假如說 |
| transcript.whisperx[691].start |
19580.74 |
| transcript.whisperx[691].end |
19591.76 |
| transcript.whisperx[691].text |
若實了也可以減少你們的支出醫學中心假如不要像之前漫無止境的一直增加 |
| transcript.whisperx[692].start |
19593.854 |
| transcript.whisperx[692].end |
19623.235 |
| transcript.whisperx[692].text |
也不會造成資源的浪費好不好我當然這樣子的這麼大的一個題目不會只有今天的質詢講可是我比較重要的題目大概都已經先給部長了我最後跟部長講一個觀念大家都在討論波波牙醫我不知道為什麼你們會想出來把波波牙醫送到 |
| transcript.whisperx[693].start |
19624.807 |
| transcript.whisperx[693].end |
19651.473 |
| transcript.whisperx[693].text |
偏鄉我只講觀念我沒有任何的立場只是說你們推了一個計畫讓大家直接承認波波牙醫我不是說我的立場喔就是說你們把波波牙醫送到偏鄉直接就是表示你們的立場已經覺得波波牙醫矮人一傑 |
| transcript.whisperx[694].start |
19653.203 |
| transcript.whisperx[694].end |
19671.274 |
| transcript.whisperx[694].text |
另外一個面向就是你們把離島偏鄉的居民當作次等的國民我知道你們沒有那個意思啦但是你們的論述我在選區就被罵死了 |
| transcript.whisperx[695].start |
19672.815 |
| transcript.whisperx[695].end |
19691.897 |
| transcript.whisperx[695].text |
我說過我對哪一國的醫生我基本上沒有很大的意見可是是你們的計畫推出然後在做說明的時候導致了對於這些醫生跟對於偏鄉居民 |
| transcript.whisperx[696].start |
19693.601 |
| transcript.whisperx[696].end |
19701.567 |
| transcript.whisperx[696].text |
都很不公平謝謝部長 謝謝主席謝謝委員指教謝謝楊委員 謝謝部長接下來我們請王振旭委員質詢謝謝主席還是有請邱部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[697].start |
19723.686 |
| transcript.whisperx[697].end |
19741.851 |
| transcript.whisperx[697].text |
委員好部長好今天經過這麼長的時間雖然有20分鐘的休息不過有時候沒好睡覺這個勞勤要繼續謝謝大家共商國事大家都是為了我們臺灣社會民眾的健康還有要怎麼處理好大家用心不一樣 |
| transcript.whisperx[698].start |
19751.793 |
| transcript.whisperx[698].end |
19775.28 |
| transcript.whisperx[698].text |
我們也知道打造健康臺灣慢性病的防治是很重要因為我們慢性病防治可以做好的話也能更久也能更好所以今天就利用這個機會來跟部長討論一下有關於這個健康檢查來好好的整理好那個資料怎麼樣去統合才能夠落實這個預防醫學是 |
| transcript.whisperx[699].start |
19778.61 |
| transcript.whisperx[699].end |
19793.899 |
| transcript.whisperx[699].text |
那2024年的健康研連的建言書來的第三個議題就是要針對疾病防治癌症治療跟確認照顧理念真的是要好好的去擴展健康檢查來落實預防醫學我想這大家都很清楚現在北京一直堅持 |
| transcript.whisperx[700].start |
19795.02 |
| transcript.whisperx[700].end |
19809.486 |
| transcript.whisperx[700].text |
包括賴總統也期待透過這樣的方式來讓民眾不要因為身體有疾病以後才開始注意自己的身體這個是我們很能夠理解的可是到底 |
| transcript.whisperx[701].start |
19810.666 |
| transcript.whisperx[701].end |
19827.689 |
| transcript.whisperx[701].text |
之前的經驗是怎麼樣我們可以從這個資料看得出來這是2021年國民健康國民健康署這邊對不起打錯一個字我們是健康署署一署二的署這是國民健康署 |
| transcript.whisperx[702].start |
19828.976 |
| transcript.whisperx[702].end |
19850.347 |
| transcript.whisperx[702].text |
那個時候他們做了調查發現說過去3年來40到64歲有做過健康檢查才只有61.2%65歲他胸口比較皺只有45.7那大部分的原因都是因為自己都很健康啊根本沒這個需要那在座 |
| transcript.whisperx[703].start |
19852.067 |
| transcript.whisperx[703].end |
19868.455 |
| transcript.whisperx[703].text |
看起來很少人是40歲以下在座各位多少人遇到這個比例可能有一半不去做健康檢查沒有去做過健康檢查可能就不知道自己覺得自己的身體健康很好這是真的嗎還是有什麼風險存在 |
| transcript.whisperx[704].start |
19870.516 |
| transcript.whisperx[704].end |
19886.289 |
| transcript.whisperx[704].text |
這個就是我們期待部長很希望能夠打造健康臺灣的這個過程裡面有更好的誘因或更好的方法那我們可以看得出來這個包括說補助費用要翻倍 |
| transcript.whisperx[705].start |
19889.871 |
| transcript.whisperx[705].end |
19891.152 |
| transcript.whisperx[705].text |
那可是我們也想要了解的是說那 |
| transcript.whisperx[706].start |
19918.903 |
| transcript.whisperx[706].end |
19939.695 |
| transcript.whisperx[706].text |
如果真的做了健康檢查的話就變成是一個重要的議題分布在不同的地方來收集這些資料如果這個資料沒有辦法統整的話我們就沒有辦法建立一個大的數據庫那這樣就很可惜 |
| transcript.whisperx[707].start |
19940.695 |
| transcript.whisperx[707].end |
19965.609 |
| transcript.whisperx[707].text |
那我們目前看到的就是不同的這個對象的類別可以分勞工學生公務人員跟一般的民眾國人那這個都有一些法源依據來要求這些對象進行健康的檢查那這些健康檢查當然他會產出相關的資料那我們也知道勞工的部分呢透過一般勞工雇主 |
| transcript.whisperx[708].start |
19966.509 |
| transcript.whisperx[708].end |
19989.314 |
| transcript.whisperx[708].text |
來提供費用來做檢查所以理論上他可以擁有資料可是目前的法院裡面只有針對高危或結果異常的人才會透過主管機關來核備就是說這個來備查放在這個僱主那邊那學生的話透過學生衛生學校衛生法 |
| transcript.whisperx[709].start |
19990.194 |
| transcript.whisperx[709].end |
20009.237 |
| transcript.whisperx[709].text |
由學校來紀錄建檔這個建檔可能一般是維持7年這個建檔的直接的內容需求我們很期待如果能夠統整的話對於學生這邊也能夠有比較好的一些照顧公務員員用不同的方式 |
| transcript.whisperx[710].start |
20010.078 |
| transcript.whisperx[710].end |
20037.548 |
| transcript.whisperx[710].text |
那部分的對象來去提報服務機關那就跟一般的勞工的這個勞安法是一樣的處理過程那一般的國人的話這些健康檢查資料事實上都是存在個人的這個他的需求裡面就沒有好的方式來做統整這是我們目前看到的這些健康檢查的資料持有的散佈在各個地方這一個人怎麼長啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[711].start |
20039.388 |
| transcript.whisperx[711].end |
20056.974 |
| transcript.whisperx[711].text |
現在有沒有好的方法或者是未來如何能夠把這些東西統整起來我們也知道事實上這些健康檢查他都有不同的這些經費所以我們如何能夠讓受檢者如果在現有的法源之下未來能夠 |
| transcript.whisperx[712].start |
20058.334 |
| transcript.whisperx[712].end |
20069.474 |
| transcript.whisperx[712].text |
好的方式透過這些受檢者的同意能夠把這個資料釋出來以後由國家或者是有哪一個單位來統籌我這就是今天要跟部長討論的地方 |
| transcript.whisperx[713].start |
20071.109 |
| transcript.whisperx[713].end |
20098.329 |
| transcript.whisperx[713].text |
那目前我們知道資料的嫁接有幾個可能性我們剛剛講過不同的這些受檢的對象還有受檢的這個過程基本上又分為公立跟私立的這些醫療院所來協助那這邊我們可以看得出來公立的部分就有包括教育部衛福部退福會國防部還有很多的地方政府 |
| transcript.whisperx[714].start |
20098.869 |
| transcript.whisperx[714].end |
20108.705 |
| transcript.whisperx[714].text |
那這個事實上都是由主管機關在處理的那私立的各個醫療院所大家就各自處理保管相關的資料 |
| transcript.whisperx[715].start |
20109.881 |
| transcript.whisperx[715].end |
20136.156 |
| transcript.whisperx[715].text |
那想要請教部長的就是如果在國人能夠有好的這個授權過程我們也了解這個是很重要的一個個資那這個個資目前都有好的一個個人保護法在保護個資的部分那我們也非常清楚的知道我們必須要嚴守這個個資的處理模式 |
| transcript.whisperx[716].start |
20137.737 |
| transcript.whisperx[716].end |
20160.397 |
| transcript.whisperx[716].text |
我們目前從這個個人資料保護法也瞭解說健康檢查的這些資料有哪一種情形之下是可以透過好的方式來應用這個個人資料來讓國人的健康可以得到更大的保護所以我們在昨天也透過勞動部的這個討論裡面也希望把勞工健檢的資料 |
| transcript.whisperx[717].start |
20162.158 |
| transcript.whisperx[717].end |
20182.503 |
| transcript.whisperx[717].text |
能夠有機會跟衛福部這邊做一個間接跟能夠善於好好的利用這些內容那請問部長未來我們有什麼好的方式可以來間接相關的資料怎麼去做研議那這個有沒有講到一些期程可以讓本席來做參考 |
| transcript.whisperx[718].start |
20185.865 |
| transcript.whisperx[718].end |
20209.839 |
| transcript.whisperx[718].text |
非常感謝那個委員關心這個部分的確是能夠更照顧國人的健康而且從預防醫學方面然後有點個人的健康管理能夠落實到健康管理這樣對病人能夠早期來預防然後早期診治這樣的一個遠景非常敬佩 |
| transcript.whisperx[719].start |
20210.526 |
| transcript.whisperx[719].end |
20233.161 |
| transcript.whisperx[719].text |
那這因為都牽涉到不同的從這幾十年來我們在醫療的資料的整理就已經就是說怎麼連結其實都花了很多的心也很困難但是我們已經從實務上經會上還有法制上包括我們在通過相關的法令現在就在行政院研議 |
| transcript.whisperx[720].start |
20235.142 |
| transcript.whisperx[720].end |
20260.077 |
| transcript.whisperx[720].text |
一個專法資料庫的專法當然剛剛也提到各支法這個部分各支這個也是要病人也同意嘛同意以後我們會把那個委員的這張的想法我們來看怎麼樣來落實好不好我們那個可能來跟各個部會來互動那你說委員剛剛有提到勞動部已經有 |
| transcript.whisperx[721].start |
20262.27 |
| transcript.whisperx[721].end |
20275.496 |
| transcript.whisperx[721].text |
有願意處理我們衛福部過去跟勞動部在很多的資料裡面是連結的相當都很有誠意要連結的都連結的不錯提醒部長你剛剛說這個病人這不是患者這不是病人 |
| transcript.whisperx[722].start |
20279.037 |
| transcript.whisperx[722].end |
20296.253 |
| transcript.whisperx[722].text |
這是健康的檢查,這是健康民眾所能夠提供的一些資料所以我們很期待,不然你如果說衛福部這邊有需要我們來一起處理的話也非常歡迎我們一起來討論對於國有的健康很重要 |
| transcript.whisperx[723].start |
20299.035 |
| transcript.whisperx[723].end |
20322.003 |
| transcript.whisperx[723].text |
好 再來就是簡單 把那個部長請教一個兒童健康檢查的部分很簡短的請教一下我們可以看得出來在小朋友7歲之前他有7次的這個健康檢查的機會或者是有這方面的這種可以去掌握到小朋友成長過程當中的健康的問題不過那個次數切變結果是421 |
| transcript.whisperx[724].start |
20328.224 |
| transcript.whisperx[724].end |
20355.2 |
| transcript.whisperx[724].text |
所以分佈相當的不平均就是這個可能是之前已經有過非常深入的討論知道說一歲就是半個半歲之前的小朋友需要有4次的檢查還有2歲3歲可是3到7歲好像一輩子這部分是不是有機會能夠再研議看看好我們就會優化這個新生兒跟老童做健康檢查我們會會來研議 |
| transcript.whisperx[725].start |
20358.262 |
| transcript.whisperx[725].end |
20385.085 |
| transcript.whisperx[725].text |
OK 再來就是現在大家想反對腸病毒腸病毒最近單週就有2.2萬人次所以看起來可能會更嚴重因為這個天氣已經在改變了所以針對這個冬季的流感針對於包括RSV的防治尤其是這個6個月以下這些嬰幼兒不知道目前有沒有更好的對策來減少家長的擔心 |
| transcript.whisperx[726].start |
20387.126 |
| transcript.whisperx[726].end |
20413.982 |
| transcript.whisperx[726].text |
市委委員我們是不是請那個莊市長報告委員那長命毒疫情的部分主要是因為它現在流行的都是克薩吉A型是6跟A4那我們EV71現在唯一有的疫苗是EV71型那它並沒有叫它保護的作用所以在這個部分ACIP委員會這邊還是以自備的就是民眾認為有自備接種需要就自備接種 |
| transcript.whisperx[727].start |
20414.742 |
| transcript.whisperx[727].end |
20439.541 |
| transcript.whisperx[727].text |
那因為藏民主權也沒有特效藥所以一般我目前都還是用衛教宣導那另外就是預防重症主要就是說只要有看到那些重症的前照那就是由基層醫師來做所以我們事實上因為有這個部分所以目前的重症其實今年我記得只有3例還4例但都比往年少雖然是輕症比較多 |
| transcript.whisperx[728].start |
20440.422 |
| transcript.whisperx[728].end |
20455.944 |
| transcript.whisperx[728].text |
那這是長命族的部分那流感的部分因為我們現在其實孕婦可以打流感那這可以保護新生兒另外那個新手的爸媽6個月以內的因為他也可以打這個流感所以目前這個都在推行 |
| transcript.whisperx[729].start |
20456.425 |
| transcript.whisperx[729].end |
20474.665 |
| transcript.whisperx[729].text |
那RHB的部分比較傷腦筋就是因為這個有某個廠牌的這個RHB的疫苗他打在這個孕婦可以保護新生的部分目前才剛通過藥證應該是明年才會有疫苗進來那另外不過 |
| transcript.whisperx[730].start |
20476.647 |
| transcript.whisperx[730].end |
20501.845 |
| transcript.whisperx[730].text |
建保署這邊他們有針對早產兒啦或是這個有心電性疾病的一歲以下的有提供的單株抗體那這邊是可以用的那不過今年有個好消息是說今天阿斯匹其實沒有很高啦他大概每35週到45週會一個高峰那麼今天還是46週我們看起來是不是今年不是太高好謝謝謝謝署長跟部長說明謝謝主席謝謝委員謝謝謝謝王委員謝謝部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[731].start |
20505.747 |
| transcript.whisperx[731].end |
20519.136 |
| transcript.whisperx[731].text |
繼續我們請陳培宇委員質詢好謝謝主席那有請邱部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[732].start |
20524.181 |
| transcript.whisperx[732].end |
20538.572 |
| transcript.whisperx[732].text |
委員好部長午安今年6月5號應該是您當部長之後首次跟您討論一些議題當時我就提醒部長說其實今年就是兒童權力公約施行法國內法劃的第10年 |
| transcript.whisperx[733].start |
20539.272 |
| transcript.whisperx[733].end |
20559.66 |
| transcript.whisperx[733].text |
那10週年這件事情我覺得非常的重要因為我們其實在這10年當中我們從公部門或者是私立的機關民間單位我們做了非常多的努力想要讓更多人認識兒少公約很可惜部長你知道嗎昨天我們雖然在內政委員會奮戰一整天勞動部這邊也很忙昨天其實是國際兒童人權日 |
| transcript.whisperx[734].start |
20560.76 |
| transcript.whisperx[734].end |
20581.846 |
| transcript.whisperx[734].text |
我們看了衛福部的相關新聞發現只有一些地方政府的活動還有衛福部的部堂醫院但是我認為衛福部作為兒少主管機關CRC的主管機關也是兒少法的主管機關卻沒有更積極的作為或者是活動我認為我們應該要做更多的事情請衛福部要積極把兒少相關權益放在心上好嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[735].start |
20583.746 |
| transcript.whisperx[735].end |
20599.991 |
| transcript.whisperx[735].text |
財閥問題 |
| transcript.whisperx[736].start |
20600.131 |
| transcript.whisperx[736].end |
20604.313 |
| transcript.whisperx[736].text |
左手邊紅色的字是我們發現的問題就是跨部會通報的問題採訪的問題幼少法還有幼教法的採訪的方法很複雜還有中央地方的公告沒有同步我們辦公室花了很多的時間一直在跟衛福部討論 |
| transcript.whisperx[737].start |
20615.478 |
| transcript.whisperx[737].end |
20631.685 |
| transcript.whisperx[737].text |
感謝到了右邊黑色這一塊2024年總算有些進展有了初步的改善我認為這邊要給衛福部的同仁肯定可是其實還是有很多問題沒有解決例如說右邊的紅色下面這邊而上法裁罰公告遭到地方下架的問題 |
| transcript.whisperx[738].start |
20633.366 |
| transcript.whisperx[738].end |
20655.927 |
| transcript.whisperx[738].text |
這個還是沒有解決而少法裁罰沒有辦法即時執行跟公告造成行為人得以利用空窗期繼續對小孩做壞事剛剛老林在旁邊點頭了這個依然沒有解決也就是說我身為一個小孩的家長我其實沒有辦法透過衛福部的平台知道我馬上要把小孩送去的這個營隊的主辦人或相關教練的老師是不是而少法裁處的對象 |
| transcript.whisperx[739].start |
20657.108 |
| transcript.whisperx[739].end |
20677.873 |
| transcript.whisperx[739].text |
那如果他有曾經有被臺北市政府或是新北市政府公告但是因為沒有相關法源依據他的名字就會下架了所以我的小孩還是可能被送去這樣的地方上課我認為對於現在的父母親來說每個孩子真的都是寶貝但如果你們要告訴我只要回到兒少法修正才有法源依據那我就要問我們兒少法什麼時候可以修 |
| transcript.whisperx[740].start |
20679.697 |
| transcript.whisperx[740].end |
20705.846 |
| transcript.whisperx[740].text |
好謝謝委員的關心而上我想我們一起在努力那這個問題是不是那但是因為他需要法規範嘛對不對應該說目前沒有說公告多久照理說他可以辭去公告可是地方政府就下架了那我們之後我們會把這個勾機的部分或者是跟縣市怎麼樣跟中央對接的部分再來做處理這沒有涉及修法的問題好那空窗的部分呢空窗期的部分呢 |
| transcript.whisperx[741].start |
20707.018 |
| transcript.whisperx[741].end |
20707.719 |
| transcript.whisperx[741].text |
委員會主席 |
| transcript.whisperx[742].start |
20736.938 |
| transcript.whisperx[742].end |
20737.459 |
| transcript.whisperx[742].text |
委員會主管委員會主管委員會 |
| transcript.whisperx[743].start |
20759.076 |
| transcript.whisperx[743].end |
20785.82 |
| transcript.whisperx[743].text |
好不好我們會再積極的跟你們討論那接下來看一下衛福部現在今年的預算其實我或者是范雲委員都問過衛福部關於兒少教練證的事情在總質詢的時候也花了很長的篇幅跟部長您討論但是我目前在衛福部114年度的預算規劃中都沒有看到兒少規劃證更不要講相關政策就連前期規劃研議都沒有看到我想問一下衛福部對於兒少工作證這件事情的態度跟進度 |
| transcript.whisperx[744].start |
20786.8 |
| transcript.whisperx[744].end |
20806.647 |
| transcript.whisperx[744].text |
跟委員報告這個我們跟人本開過會是這上目前70%都可以在相關系統就是這個這個不適任人員的這個系統裡頭去勾結沒有問題那還有大概20%到30左右的就是這些教練比較特殊行業的那這個部分的確我們那時候也跟這個人本說明 |
| transcript.whisperx[745].start |
20808.348 |
| transcript.whisperx[745].end |
20816.969 |
| transcript.whisperx[745].text |
我們需要有一些時間那可能就是再放在兒犬法裡頭慢慢來處理哎呦又回到兒犬法那好那我覺得我的兒犬法什麼時候要修 |
| transcript.whisperx[746].start |
20818.781 |
| transcript.whisperx[746].end |
20842.652 |
| transcript.whisperx[746].text |
就是我的最後一張投影片而憲法的部分我們現在我們內部的初步的草案已經整理到一定的程度那時間如果來得及我們希望在今年底之前能夠拿出來預告什麼時候的年底今年底前今年年底今年年底前我們可以開始預計今年底前應該是可以預告然後跟徵求各所有外界所有的意見並且進行進一步的討論今年年底前可以公告 |
| transcript.whisperx[747].start |
20845.231 |
| transcript.whisperx[747].end |
20868.777 |
| transcript.whisperx[747].text |
好吧我們期待喔這麼多場記者會跨黨派每次只要遇到而受的新聞我們就要開記者會但是我覺得開記者會真的沒有用我們開記者會只是友善的提醒但更多實質的監督跟推進我相信有非常非常多立法委員關注可不可以幫我回到前一張頭影片最後我要拜託部長一件事情剛剛您的幕僚說不適任70%的部分系統都可以勾結 |
| transcript.whisperx[748].start |
20870.118 |
| transcript.whisperx[748].end |
20892.558 |
| transcript.whisperx[748].text |
剩下20%跟30%喔特殊的這些在教學現場不同的教學現場服務我們的孩子這些大人可能是變非常特殊但我認為這是負面表列如果我們臺灣可以正面表列積極什麼樣的條件什麼樣的課程訓練什麼樣增能機制才可以去服務小孩我認為這是對所有父母最最最最最重要的 |
| transcript.whisperx[749].start |
20894.38 |
| transcript.whisperx[749].end |
20895.041 |
| transcript.whisperx[749].text |
謝謝陳委員 謝謝部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[750].start |
20925.621 |
| transcript.whisperx[750].end |
20930.284 |
| transcript.whisperx[750].text |
葉延芝、葉延芝、葉延芝委員不在。 接續我們請劉建國委員質詢。謝謝署長、謝謝召委。有請部長跟長教師。有來嗎?有,市長。市長。委員好。部長好,還有市長好。 |
| transcript.whisperx[751].start |
20956.346 |
| transcript.whisperx[751].end |
20977.024 |
| transcript.whisperx[751].text |
根據衛福部施治防治照護政策綱領暨行動方案2.0中有一個施治友善臺灣777的目標部長知道吧?市長一定知道那一起說7層以上患者獲得診斷及服務7層以上照顧者獲得支持訓練 |
| transcript.whisperx[752].start |
20979.275 |
| transcript.whisperx[752].end |
20995.778 |
| transcript.whisperx[752].text |
7%以上民眾對施治症有正確認識及友善態度沒有錯嗎是好那你們在19號衛福部發了一個新聞稿大致上內容是這樣全臺施治確診比率達67.23一級超過23.3萬名施治家庭照顧者獲得支援社會大眾對施治症正確認識及友善態度達19.6 |
| transcript.whisperx[753].start |
21011.41 |
| transcript.whisperx[753].end |
21036.408 |
| transcript.whisperx[753].text |
今年是113今年所以有達成那個政策綱領的階段性目標這個叫做有達成政策綱領的政策目標是因為今年就是67%好那明年才是70%是是是是所以市長認為已經達標了是今年達標了是那部長你看到他下面這些文字對照上面的777你覺得達標了嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[754].start |
21039.653 |
| transcript.whisperx[754].end |
21061.838 |
| transcript.whisperx[754].text |
我覺得都還有繼續努力的空間只有努力的空間這個空間還有多大部長有沒有去過拉過那個喇叭776就沒有辦法賓果767也沒辦法賓果677也不可能賓果你覺得這樣賓果了嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[755].start |
21063.45 |
| transcript.whisperx[755].end |
21087.745 |
| transcript.whisperx[755].text |
市長答覆是達標了今年度還達標了對不對部長你覺得達標了嗎你的努力的空間還差了幾趴簡單就好好不好如果以他們訂的部門訂的目標是有到達他們目標啦但是我們部長你認定他們有達到他們訂的目標7成以上獲得診斷及服務 |
| transcript.whisperx[756].start |
21090.649 |
| transcript.whisperx[756].end |
21115.459 |
| transcript.whisperx[756].text |
你第一個是全台私自確診比例67.3這是確診比例那反之7成以上照顧者獲得支持訓練你馬上把它轉換成一級超過23.3萬私自家庭照顧者獲得支援可以這樣轉可以這樣換那你的第一個期跟第二個期就不用分做兩個期啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[757].start |
21117.833 |
| transcript.whisperx[757].end |
21138.496 |
| transcript.whisperx[757].text |
跟委員說明我們推估今年的失智症的人數目前是今年是35萬是那所以我們就是依據推估的人數那基本上只要有確診的那我們在相關的服務裡面也包括照顧者會一起來接受這些相關的支持服務 |
| transcript.whisperx[758].start |
21139.717 |
| transcript.whisperx[758].end |
21165.937 |
| transcript.whisperx[758].text |
所以這個標23.3其實也表示有23.3萬的這個失聚症者有被確診不好意思的我現在就要來戳破你這樣講我是有問題的什麼叫做確診率達67.3就預期超過23.3萬得到家庭失職家庭照顧者獲得支援部長11月22在總辭職的時候我有提供資料給你跟院長這個是國際失職協會在9月21號 |
| transcript.whisperx[759].start |
21168.979 |
| transcript.whisperx[759].end |
21183.12 |
| transcript.whisperx[759].text |
今年度9月2日公佈2024全球施政報告中其中臺灣部門參與調查的臺灣照顧者對於社區中有足夠施政者支持服務的認同比例為48.5沒有過半同時一般民眾的認同率更只有3.4 |
| transcript.whisperx[760].start |
21186.897 |
| transcript.whisperx[760].end |
21205.021 |
| transcript.whisperx[760].text |
請你來挑戰國際施政協會因為國際施政協會他其實是用詢問這些相關我們後續也來了解他到底抽樣的10月22的總諮詢你要後續才詢問現在已經11月21號所以你還沒有問還是你要跟我講他是講社區而已還是你要講說他們這樣的調查有問題還是還有辦法答覆我跟答問部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[761].start |
21217.749 |
| transcript.whisperx[761].end |
21238.988 |
| transcript.whisperx[761].text |
因為這個相關的調查確實就像委員說的他是在社區可是事實上我們也有非常多的這個失業症長輩其實是在住宿型機構所以在住宿型機構這邊失智率的比例其實高達八成所以現在各位同意的是住宿型機構是跟社區還是要講社區還是兩個要跟我一起講 |
| transcript.whisperx[762].start |
21239.708 |
| transcript.whisperx[762].end |
21248.762 |
| transcript.whisperx[762].text |
我們的政策綱領訂的是全臺灣所以當時的政策綱領通過的就是114年全臺灣滿一千人是講家庭還是講社區還是講機構 |
| transcript.whisperx[763].start |
21251.043 |
| transcript.whisperx[763].end |
21276.338 |
| transcript.whisperx[763].text |
就是全臺灣全部嗎就包含機構嗎社區嗎家庭嗎可以這麼講嗎現在說明的是委員您拿的國際私事政協會他調查的是社區的所以你的意思就是說你的家庭ok你的機構ok唯獨這個社區不ok所以你家庭加你的機構加起來再扣掉還是再扣掉這個社區你還是有達到六成七 |
| transcript.whisperx[764].start |
21277.779 |
| transcript.whisperx[764].end |
21299.7 |
| transcript.whisperx[764].text |
你要跟我表達是這樣嗎我們確實你有把握嗎6乘7確實都有比對過ID所以這一塊是包括有在我們長照體系使用服務的那你就必須要跟國際私自政協會跟他講說你這麼不公平啊我家庭做好的你要跟我額入啊我機構做好的你要額入啊你怎麼只有把做不好的弄出來你意思是這樣嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[765].start |
21303.144 |
| transcript.whisperx[765].end |
21325.263 |
| transcript.whisperx[765].text |
我們有機會可以跟國際施政協會這邊來聯繫我們其實有幾年前有邀請那個理事主席到臺灣來有來協助做是這樣我要提醒齁如果說你們這樣的一個新聞稿是不是過於樂觀啦齁我是要提醒這樣然後你們這樣的計算方式是不是過於阿Q |
| transcript.whisperx[766].start |
21326.451 |
| transcript.whisperx[766].end |
21352.036 |
| transcript.whisperx[766].text |
我覺得是有問題的啦你如果覺得沒有那好那我們就到時候再拜託召委針對施政的整個全部面向來做一個專案的討論我們再逐一把相關的數據提供給您來做參考跟委員說明其實我們的推估其實是國衛院協助幫我們做了失智流平調查再把國衛院再拉下來這一塊所以我要把它是說我們現在推估出來的 |
| transcript.whisperx[767].start |
21353.396 |
| transcript.whisperx[767].end |
21360.981 |
| transcript.whisperx[767].text |
國務院嚴謹我知道啦但國務院有時候我會揣摩嘛國務院在實行國家級高齡醫學技機關或是研究所中心的相關成果報告裡面竟然把學校的離年齒4個字放在這一個成果報告裡面的活動之一啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[768].start |
21384.52 |
| transcript.whisperx[768].end |
21411.197 |
| transcript.whisperx[768].text |
你聽過嗎?你了解嗎?你要再把國務院拉進來是不是?裡面這次總預算跟你講會有問題啦請回來請回來市長你回去再好好思考一下昨天居股聯盟辦的記者會你因為要參與會議先行離開我沒有意見嘛對不對那你離開完之後你留下來的人你離開之後他也就跟著離開了 |
| transcript.whisperx[769].start |
21414.36 |
| transcript.whisperx[769].end |
21435.746 |
| transcript.whisperx[769].text |
一個居胡聯盟跟這麼多的委員都還在現場在針對這個長照3.0要提出相關的建言他們連朗讀連播放影片連跟你們有對話機會都沒有我們長照是沒有半個人留在現場理由是要去參加那個去參加那個所以 |
| transcript.whisperx[770].start |
21436.986 |
| transcript.whisperx[770].end |
21453.983 |
| transcript.whisperx[770].text |
如果你們在面對第一線的團體的建言是如此還有很多委員 跨黨派的都還在現場你們已經沒有半個人在那個地方你們這樣是不是會出問題啊我提醒你 |
| transcript.whisperx[771].start |
21455.722 |
| transcript.whisperx[771].end |
21474.794 |
| transcript.whisperx[771].text |
謝謝委員提醒因為事先有跟那個單位有溝通過就是我們本來就是同仁有需要到那個前瞻那他要求的是說這大概就是遞交陳情書的時候人在場接那個陳情書是事先有溝通過跟陳雪惠這個女士這邊溝通過 |
| transcript.whisperx[772].start |
21476.297 |
| transcript.whisperx[772].end |
21499.021 |
| transcript.whisperx[772].text |
也要再講下去齁好那我們就找時間再好好講不然我是要讓你知道有這個狀況齁你也參考一下啦齁因為施治2.0在明年底就要結束了對不對你請回啦我不請他站的時候他把你牽拖的齁你為什麼要找他算帳但是我剛才說的事情你可能要洗衣啦齁 |
| transcript.whisperx[773].start |
21503.142 |
| transcript.whisperx[773].end |
21520.653 |
| transcript.whisperx[773].text |
李廉恥會在你高齡醫學及健康物質研究中心的成果裡面的活動之一這個實在是國家衛生研究院國家講到國家是何等神聖重要一件事情市長請回落我現在對不起你先留著還有你的事情 |
| transcript.whisperx[774].start |
21522.234 |
| transcript.whisperx[774].end |
21542.646 |
| transcript.whisperx[774].text |
那我當然是期待說因為坦白講賴總統一直在講長照3.0不是現在才講競選時間然後就任了也一直在講長照3.0明年的長照基金又高達到930億嘛對不對那勢必長照3.0的期程要提早了啦要提早嘛那相對的你的失智證這一個2.0要變成3.0也應該一併提早才對嘛 |
| transcript.whisperx[775].start |
21548.309 |
| transcript.whisperx[775].end |
21574.121 |
| transcript.whisperx[775].text |
應該未從某個月跟我講說執行到明年底結束我們才來提前這沒有道理啦不管什麼樣的情況之下我當然希望我們部長到有新的思維跟做法然後積極應應來這個長照相關面向的事情要趕快來加緊找部嘛食藥署有審查通過一個叫阿茲海默症的新藥是首款可以延緩這個患者的退化 |
| transcript.whisperx[776].start |
21574.761 |
| transcript.whisperx[776].end |
21576.244 |
| transcript.whisperx[776].text |
新藥通過對施政的治療帶來重大突破 |
| transcript.whisperx[777].start |
21587.475 |
| transcript.whisperx[777].end |
21608.153 |
| transcript.whisperx[777].text |
這款新藥需支援1.約切10萬這對一般家庭的負擔其實不小啦對不對我想大家期盼這麼久終於有這樣的新藥然後延緩施政患者的病程這坦白講這也可以大幅減少醫療成本的支出嘛然後又是次長對外的一個說明對不對那這款新藥何時可以納入健保集會不定有時無空喔 |
| transcript.whisperx[778].start |
21610.236 |
| transcript.whisperx[778].end |
21625.161 |
| transcript.whisperx[778].text |
我想只要對病人而且是醫師覺得他是有效的我想都是列入審核的那個審核列入健保的一個行列我這邊距離要求不長好不好 |
| transcript.whisperx[779].start |
21626.161 |
| transcript.whisperx[779].end |
21629.464 |
| transcript.whisperx[779].text |
昨天在這個委員會和部長發生什麼狀況大家非常清楚 |
| transcript.whisperx[780].start |
21653.644 |
| transcript.whisperx[780].end |
21679.885 |
| transcript.whisperx[780].text |
因為因為發生了憾思之後是11月4號11月8號才讓這副組長請假接受調查然後隔過10天才在這個才在前天才公佈昨天接受備詢各位可以想個是什麼狀況我就不再贅述為什麼同樣CDC遇到霸凌的事件我們的機關署的副組長第一個時間對外說明需要調查兩個月誰授權 |
| transcript.whisperx[781].start |
21682.948 |
| transcript.whisperx[781].end |
21693.745 |
| transcript.whisperx[781].text |
誰指示為什麼要等到院長震怒之後說必須各機關一個月內因為一星期內所有的辦理事件必須調查完成才再改口 |
| transcript.whisperx[782].start |
21694.788 |
| transcript.whisperx[782].end |
21706.401 |
| transcript.whisperx[782].text |
報告委員那原來是因為依據我們機關署有一個員工職場霸凌的防治跟處理作業的辦法規定兩個月還是在兩個月內啦兩個月內對對對對早上才什麼狀況你們下午還一樣要講兩個月內是那你為什麼不跟院長講說你們現在之前有這樣的一個作業準則 |
| transcript.whisperx[783].start |
21716.338 |
| transcript.whisperx[783].end |
21720.962 |
| transcript.whisperx[783].text |
主要還是要縮短那整個調查的過程關於我們各機關自己的心境比較麻煩署長是你下令的嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[784].start |
21738.611 |
| transcript.whisperx[784].end |
21756.983 |
| transcript.whisperx[784].text |
呃應該是說我們我本來是想要快一點的但是但是我們有副組長不想快一點要照座位準則跟副組長沒有關係跟副組長沒有關係啊不然副組長為什麼講那些話沒有沒有呃兩個月內這當然就是說兩個月內早上在這個委員會乒乒乓乓你們下午看那個記者會你們完全 |
| transcript.whisperx[785].start |
21760.58 |
| transcript.whisperx[785].end |
21765.784 |
| transcript.whisperx[785].text |
提醒各位謝謝謝謝劉建國 倚重心長署長要注意接續我們請 最後一個好不好陳穎委員質詢好 謝謝教委 那麻煩請那個部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[786].start |
21794.437 |
| transcript.whisperx[786].end |
21815.247 |
| transcript.whisperx[786].text |
委員好部長好部長這兩天我不曉得你有沒有注意到一件事情因為我看到這個很有趣一定要跟你分享一下這兩天有一個非常知名的反菸團體就是董事基金會他們在媒體上宣稱全面禁售止菸是不切實際的做法 |
| transcript.whisperx[787].start |
21816.047 |
| transcript.whisperx[787].end |
21840.896 |
| transcript.whisperx[787].text |
那我看到這個之後我就忽然覺得很困惑了因為畢竟在很多年前我也曾經出席參加了他們這個董事基金會在立法院舉辦的記者會那這個記者會呢他是一個戒菸的記者會我非常清楚的記得這個記者會有一個重要活動就是報名參加戒菸的朋友 |
| transcript.whisperx[788].start |
21841.576 |
| transcript.whisperx[788].end |
21847.469 |
| transcript.whisperx[788].text |
可以有成功的話可以獲得數十萬元的高額高額獎金那 |
| transcript.whisperx[789].start |
21849.397 |
| transcript.whisperx[789].end |
21874.886 |
| transcript.whisperx[789].text |
很怕菸味的我還特別在致詞的時候表示就是說我希望我們的柯總召可以拿到這個獎金所以我對這個記者會我印象非常的深刻結果回過頭來時至今日董事基金會的一位非常重要的靈魂人物竟然對外宣稱說全面禁售指菸是不切實際的做法 |
| transcript.whisperx[790].start |
21875.606 |
| transcript.whisperx[790].end |
21903.855 |
| transcript.whisperx[790].text |
那身為一個臺灣重要的反菸團體突然這樣的倡議我不禁要問部長請問什麼樣才是最實際的做法呢部長你怎麼看這個事情啊包委員其實我跟你一樣是很怕二手而已所以你會不會覺得也忽然困惑了起來你如果覺得困惑沒關係在原來有他的一個講可能有他的一個背景我想董事記就是一直在 |
| transcript.whisperx[791].start |
21907.136 |
| transcript.whisperx[791].end |
21913.478 |
| transcript.whisperx[791].text |
反菸團體說青少年現在已經沒有怎麼抽脂菸了這句話你認同嗎你怎麼看這件事情現在的青少年真的沒有怎麼抽脂菸了嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[792].start |
21934.158 |
| transcript.whisperx[792].end |
21935.319 |
| transcript.whisperx[792].text |
吳趙欣署長 |
| transcript.whisperx[793].start |
21953.667 |
| transcript.whisperx[793].end |
21974.572 |
| transcript.whisperx[793].text |
各位謝謝委員關心我想青少年抽任何一個菸品我們都不建議那目前其實子菸在青少年的吸菸率是有下降但是還是有相當大的部分你講這樣就對了嘛所以這個沒怎麼抽子菸這件事情是不對的嘛那所以部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[794].start |
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所以現在剛剛那句話 根本叫做睜眼說瞎話署長是不瞎的欸 署長很專家好 那根據國建署自己的調查喔高中生止煙吸煙率7.2%電子煙使用率8.8%加熱煙使用率1.9%那 所以 |
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所以到底是哪裡來的青少年現在已經沒怎麼抽指煙了到底是誰在哄人說這種話還是他們自己瞎掰的我不知道因為部長你覺得7.2%的這個指煙吸煙率是非常低的嗎低到可以當作是沒有的概念嗎可以嗎 |
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還是相當高吧是啊我等一下換算給你看喔因為部長對於一個年年拿國建署補助款的這個反菸團體來說呢對於國建署調查的數據你把它當作沒有看到然後大剌剌的對外在那邊講說青少年現在已經不怎麼抽沒怎麼抽紙菸了 |
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然後接著轉頭要倡議說全面禁售職業是不切實際的做法我覺得這個邏輯我完全沒有辦法理解部長你可以理解這樣的邏輯嗎還是你贊同這樣的一個邏輯嗎還是署長你贊同 |
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那部長7.2%的這個止煙吸煙率到底有多高我來換算成人數給你看我們也參考了教育部112年高中職總人數是557600人來計算喔7.2%呢就等於多少人4100人你覺得4100個青少年抽煙這個人數是很少的嗎 |
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應該是很多好那部長一個團體反菸反到最後竟然是去力挺止菸這個是令大家嚴重錯愕的事情欸雖然我們不知道背後到底發生了什麼事但我們還是不希望說你衛福部到最後也出現同樣的問題然後大家反菸反到去挺止菸這個是很恐怖的事啊所以 |
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我這邊有一個我看一下有一個簡報好來我們來看一下 |
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11月18日ETtoday新聞雲所做的民調臺灣健保財源面臨挑戰那我們的健保署署長石崇良他很辛苦考慮再三透過這個我不知道是他個人建議還是還是 |
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還是其他人建議就是說未來考慮調高證券交易或者房屋交易作為補充財源那同時也有專家建議說我們來仿效這個日本把這個消費稅也就是營業稅從目前的5%調高到10% |
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結果這個一投票不得了了總共有6233票的這個反對票同意的呢只有79票那這個沒有意見的32票這個就是這一題的調查結果那我們再來看看另外一個民調 |
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為了要籌措百億癌症基金政府也考慮建議開徵糖捐、酒捐等稅捐來增加財源但是修法需要耗時費日這個緩不及急所以題目是是否贊成此類的新措施 |
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結果這個調查也是很好玩我們看一下6294票反對那同意的有225票那只有11票是沒有意見的那為何我剛剛講的這兩題喔這個民眾投票都一面倒害我看到我也忍不住去按反對票因為畢竟這些稅一調高大家很清楚嘛就萬物皆長了啊那誰要幹這種事情對不對那 |
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我們最後再來看一下相較於調高消費稅營業稅跟這個交易稅或者增設糖捐增設民眾負擔的這些方案目前加熱菸已經修法通過那卡在國建署的無限拖延 |
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的健康風險評估還有造成你們這個走失猖獗那百億的煙圈流失你們看看從上面看左邊看右邊看這個空氣中瀰漫著我們看不到抓不到的百億這個稅就這樣子隨風而去所以 |
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這一題就是問說您是否認為最有效最快速的方式是增加加速核准加熱菸產品上市然後立即開增加熱菸稅菸捐作為健保財源財務的這個緊急支援結果同意的嚇死我了高達7501票不同意的只有44票那沒意見的48票 |
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這個特別提出來這裡給大家參考你們如果不趕快把這個百億的這個菸捐把它好好的這個讓政府入袋的話呢我想我們接下來就是我們全這個我們全國的納稅人就要多繳錢這也是很不合理的事情啊 |
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好所以這個部長根據媒體所做的民調結果我不知道您是不是也就是認同啦就如同就是媒體最後的結論所說的因為本席畢竟從這個部長你上任到現在呢不斷的呼籲再呼籲國建署你不要一直故意在那裡技術性的拖延卡關 |
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那我們也都知道就是美國跟日本韓國大部分的國家也都有開放加熱菸了難道我們的國建署你是有能力還是有什麼本事去否定這些國家FDA所做的這些研究這些決定呢或者是說我們不了解的是執意卡關的 |
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這些人﹐少數人﹐到底有何難言之隱﹐或者有受到什麼樣的壓力﹐逼得我們石崇良署長必須要到處去找錢﹐然後也逼得我們政府﹐就像有如坐在百億黃金堆上的﹐卻像民眾討錢的乞丐﹐ |
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這是很奇怪的事情我不知道部長你到底有什麼樣的看法因為這個被公務人員這樣如此的公務人員去延宕這樣的事情像話嗎百億幾年了一年是減少百億多的稅收我們現在都延宕多久了 |
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我跟委員報告一下分兩點第一點就是剛剛ETtoday那個調查那個其實是假設性的問題我們並沒有要去研議那個剛剛講的消費稅啦、堂、捐什麼沒有這回事我們研議的真的是現在在研議是補充保惠這個部分對啦因為你先說明一下你有現成的百億你收不到那第二個這個部分其實非常謝謝委員一直關心跟催省 |
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我想我們也一直在瞭解到整個國建署在審查這個加熱源這個進度我想那個是不是請吳司長跟委員報告一下我們現在的一個我們努力在審查的進度 |
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謝謝委員我想我們不會因為大家因為我想社會都很關心這件事情那我們也按照我們所立的一些規範還有健康風險評估的一些機制那也尊重相關委員的一個審查的方式那根本也不知道目前美國並沒有加熱菸的上市那韓國跟日本他是沒有審查就可以直接上市包括歐盟他是沒有審查的那唯一有審查就是美國跟我們那美國並沒有目前並沒有加熱菸 |
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那所以我們就是繼續卡關那有的不值得參考我想是這樣齁我們在我上次質詢之後齁你們聽說你們國健署又開了一次健康風險評估的這個審查會議應該是第38次了吧 |
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我們已經開了44次了所以上次給我的數據是錯的?你們自己算錯?因為數據是你們給的那後面到底這個審查會議可以公開了沒有?結論可以公開了沒有?我們大概審查了有的結果就會公開 |
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還有一個就是目前還不能公開你公開就要公開全部你不要又像那個那個假的地下署長在那裡跟我囉哩巴說的那個因為是這樣子我們其實除了那個審查的那個過程結果要不到之外呢我們還有一樣東西也是要不到這個很奇妙不是我要不到而已不管各黨的各黨派的這個 |
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的辦公室都要不要這個看起來不像機密的資料齁就是因為因為齁我剛回到我們的那個反菸團體喔就是衛福部跟國健署每一年齁給反菸團體跟接菸團體這不包含的意願的這個獎捐補助款大概是多少補助補助款對啊 |
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主席我問完這一題我就會解釋我們大概每兩年會舉辦一個戒菸救營比賽那是對外委託的一個案應該是委託案那個大概是將近不到800萬只有這樣子嗎 |
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衛福部有沒有要求他們做任何KPI來檢視這些或你們自己有沒有做任何KPI來檢視這些獎捐補助款的效果? |
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我們這個比賽從過去的每一次大概有將近2萬多組那因為疫情的關係以後那疫情後大概目前都維持在1萬到1萬5組每一次辦理的時候那它的接驗成功6個月的接驗成功率大概是40% |
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所以這個只有這樣子簡單的一個那你們預期達到的目標我們一般的一般的戒菸就是一般多元服務的戒菸服務的成功率大概是以去年為例大概是33.1 |
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好 我想這個部分齁 我在這裡要要求就是說你們要把近5年給反菸團體以及建菸團體的獎捐補助款明細提供給本委員會那同時要註記了這些團體領的這些錢之後達到什麼樣的KPI因為剛剛講的是很rough啦 |
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總共開了40幾次的審查會議也要一併公開給大家那如果有哪些國家加熱因的部分他們可以沒有審查就上路那我想他們還是有一個基本的一個參考的依據 |
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韓國人也不是神經病嘛,他們不可能就是我就搭拉拉沒有審查就上屋,他們還是有一個參考的依據啦,不可能沒有比較啦所以這個部分我們要求這兩項東西麻煩你們提供,好謝謝好謝謝陳英文,謝謝部長 |
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鄭振淺 鄭振淺 鄭振淺委員不在本日會議詢答全部結束所提書面資料列入紀錄刊登公報 |
| transcript.whisperx[829].start |
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現在做以下決議說明及詢答完畢委員執行會及答覆或請補充資料者請相關機關以兩週內以書面答覆委員另要求期限者從其所定中華民國114年度中央政府總預算案關於衛生福利部主管預算公務及基金預算另則其繼續審查 |
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本次會議到此結束現在散會 |
| IVOD_ID |
16293 |
| IVOD_URL |
https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Full/1M/16293 |
| 日期 |
2024-11-21 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼 |
委員會-11-2-26-10 |
| 會議資料.屆 |
11 |
| 會議資料.會期 |
2 |
| 會議資料.會次 |
10 |
| 會議資料.種類 |
委員會 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼[0] |
26 |
| 會議資料.標題 |
第11屆第2會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第10次全體委員會議 |
| 影片種類 |
Full |
| 開始時間 |
2024-11-21T08:31:37+08:00 |
| 結束時間 |
2024-11-21T14:51:00+08:00 |
| 支援功能[0] |
ai-transcript |