| IVOD_ID |
162772 |
| IVOD_URL |
https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/162772 |
| 日期 |
2025-06-23 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼 |
委員會-11-3-36-21 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼:str |
第11屆第3會期司法及法制委員會第21次全體委員會議 |
| 會議資料.屆 |
11 |
| 會議資料.會期 |
3 |
| 會議資料.會次 |
21 |
| 會議資料.種類 |
委員會 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼[0] |
36 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼:str[0] |
司法及法制委員會 |
| 會議資料.標題 |
第11屆第3會期司法及法制委員會第21次全體委員會議 |
| 影片種類 |
Clip |
| 開始時間 |
2025-06-23T10:46:20+08:00 |
| 結束時間 |
2025-06-23T11:00:55+08:00 |
| 影片長度 |
00:14:35 |
| 支援功能[0] |
ai-transcript |
| video_url |
https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/b58c4cf52db2e91ace8cfe70fcc5aaf57f2aef3382ea3fb0da6ae3643212cc5ff0fba3fac4fb75495ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8 |
| 委員名稱 |
沈發惠 |
| 委員發言時間 |
10:46:20 - 11:00:55 |
| 會議時間 |
2025-06-23T09:00:00+08:00 |
| 會議名稱 |
立法院第11屆第3會期司法及法制委員會第21次全體委員會議（事由：邀請法務部部長、法務部矯正署署長、司法院及衛生福利部就「現行獄政與受刑人處遇機制之制度檢討」進行專題報告，並備質詢。） |
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主席我們請黃次長還有周署長周署長我也好次長好剛才在前面莊委員的質詢最後的時候有提到真的很巧就提到我接下來要談的問題剛才有提到說我們的有關行刑累進處遇條例 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].start |
38.769 |
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你有提到說我們將來是要廢止的是對那這個基本上齁這個行刑累進今天我們討論的主題就是行刑累進處遇條例的相關的這些規定現在這些這些累進處遇的這個機制那其實這個行刑累進處遇條例除了制度上問題其實已經 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].start |
62.659 |
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已經其實丟在放在那裡已經很久沒有都沒有進行修正了我們最後一次修正好像是2006年19年前做了修正以後就丟在那裡丟到然後放在那裡在制度繼續再用但是其實照理講就算在廢止之前也還有很多其實是應該要在廢止之前也要修正不過剛剛市長的意思是不是就是說我們現在就是 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].start |
90.441 |
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108.515 |
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不管他有什麼問題他就放在那裡但是我們未來就是要等他廢止我們行政上可以處理的有一些部分其實不用動到修法用行政上面就可以處理但是還是有一些我們念法律的看了就有點刺眼的地方在第一條本法依照監獄刑刑法第20條 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].start |
114.981 |
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137.448 |
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這個受累金處理者適用本條是規定齁那其實他應該是第18條第二項的這個授權啦齁那他就確實說這個立法他就說第20條如果我們這個法還要繼續用的話這一條我就覺得因為接應刑刑法在109年有大修過對啦有大修過但是這個沒有相對的修嘛當時沒有一併處理其實照理講我們現在就應該我如果要拼這個拼這個這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].start |
141.03 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].end |
160.897 |
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這個國會評鑑我就應該要趕快再提一個按修法來這個但是我知道說我們法務部的態度基本上就是想要就是這個就不再修了就是把它等到它廢除廢止之前其他要改要改革的事項能夠用行政手段處理的都用行政規定去處理對不對那這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].start |
162.324 |
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169.239 |
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所以我現在就回到說我們這個我們這個儲育機制的這個改革的方向我仔細看你們法務部的這個報告這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].start |
172.816 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].end |
199.464 |
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其實這個有關於這個儲育機制的改革在2017年的司改會其實就有提到2017年司改會在這個這個第五分組裡面有關育成制度的改革其中第二次會議的決議裡面就在第四項就有提到說慎重考慮廢除累進儲育的制度這是司改會的這個但是我們看這個司改會這樣子的決議其實 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].start |
201.598 |
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224.177 |
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他也不敢說應該要廢除啦他還是說應該慎重考慮那所以這個就是一個為什麼這樣寫齁其實這個累進廚藥的制度齁雖然說在第二次世界大戰之後很多大部分的國家都已經就是盡量的把這個累進廚藥的方式齁改成這個所謂膳食制啦齁這按照個別風險評估下去做齁 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].start |
225.489 |
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242.616 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].text |
但是我們看到現在有實施這些風險評估機制的國家包括像是美國的德州、加州、加拿大、英國、日本這些國家他們其實都沒有像我們台灣現在這種就是這種超額收容的情況嚴重 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].start |
244.395 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].end |
260.852 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].text |
還有有關於這個教化人員跟受刑人比例的懸殊了這部分是我們目前要廢除這個我們想要改革目前儲育機制最大的問題就在於我們目前我們的這個收容超額收容的情況很嚴重 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].start |
262.25 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].end |
281.663 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].text |
那我們的這個教化人員跟受刑人比例也非常懸殊甚至缺額我們上個禮拜就討論這個目前缺額的狀況教化人員不足那這個相關的這些社工、心理背景的專業人員我們也幾乎都人數都付諸缺乳了所以 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].start |
282.743 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].end |
308.494 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].text |
現在所以這也是為什麼私改會那時候說要慎重評估他也不敢做結論說我們應該就要廢止北京處理條例這是目前我們這些狀況但是我們也不能說因為這個狀況我們就繼續下去我們也就不改革了那我看這個2017年私改會之後我們這個在我們的報告裡面提到就是說我們也在 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].start |
310.191 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].end |
332.253 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].text |
2018年2019年我們也分別就委託了中央警察大學委託了中正大學我們有做研究針對這個累進處理條約做研究研究一直到這個2022年我們提出了一個正式的回應再有看是我們2022年就是民國111年提出了一個深化受刑人個別處遇的實施計畫 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].start |
333.649 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].end |
347.425 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].text |
就是說把過去的這個累進儲育我們未來我們在完全廢除累進儲育之前我們要我們先深化個別的儲育是不是這個方向是我們現在有在做對有啦齁那這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].start |
348.986 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].end |
374.2 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].text |
這個部分就是我接下來要比較關注我們的這個個別儲育的計畫裡面我們把這個儲育方式我們把它有一個叫做個別儲育的三軸計畫這部分是不是請鄒組長來可能比較清楚就是說我們把這個受刑人在監獄儲育的期間應該受的繳制教育我們把它分成三種 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].start |
375.34 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].end |
403.671 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].text |
一種是一般性的,一種是保護性的,一種是治療性的這個就是我按照你們的矯正期刊裡面還有你們的這個個別儲育這個深化的這個計畫的內容裡面找出來的就你們有把它分成三軸的儲育了那這個個別儲育的這個三軸計畫其實我整個看起來它最大的問題還是同樣跟剛才同樣的問題就是我們人力的配置 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].start |
405.176 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].end |
428.602 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].text |
還有資源的落差還有風險的這個份額處遇能力的這些限制這是我們目前整個不用改革最大的問題這個像資源的落差我們現在這些我想知道說我們現在進行的這些包括社工、心理師、教化人力現在是不是足以支撐這套制度現有的 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].start |
429.946 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].end |
457.955 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].text |
我們的新設人力我們近幾年有跟人總來爭取啦那人總也給我們核定從勞務承攬變成A用人員那明年我們會提出我們事辦之後的一個成效來再報行政會明年才會提出是不是這個本來就是我要問的就是你們實施你們的這個成效評估到底在哪裡明年明年初提出這些這個這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].start |
460.537 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].end |
476.717 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].text |
這個評估包括你這些個別處遇之後的這些人他們的這個回歸社會之後我們要長期追蹤他的災犯率包括針對他復歸社會的適應情形我覺得這個都是應該是我們整個這個個別處遇實施之後的評估成效評估的重要的 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].start |
477.658 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].end |
505.919 |
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是 我們會綜合評估但是我們是以爭取新設人力為主因為我們的新設人力他不只是做這個所謂的個別處役他也有可能是會做毒品犯的處役性侵家暴處役都會協助這個部分就是我接下來大概會跟你比較深入的討論有關於治療性處役的部分尤其是毒品的部分 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].start |
506.9 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].end |
519.335 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].text |
但是我在看到你們有實施一個示範一個我個人認為非常好那我也想知道它的成效跟你們推廣計畫就是我目前齁在這個台南第二監獄有示範這個受刑人個別處遇的自主管理卡 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].start |
521.543 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].end |
536.628 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].text |
這個自主管理卡的這個計畫讓這個受刑人他在這個本於這個受刑人在他面對需要這些行政這個他能夠這個自主管理他的這個個別處遇的情況 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].start |
537.848 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].end |
556.887 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].text |
讓受刑人能夠擔任自己專案的管理師讓這個教誨師轉化成一個督導的角色我個人認為說這個制度實施是非常好但是我知道現在好像只是在台南第二監獄裡面的業讀專班在實施是不是 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].start |
562.234 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].end |
578.031 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].text |
有沒有要擴大到先不要說擴大到全國啦你再除了戒毒專辦是不是整個這個台南至少在台南第二監獄有沒有擴大報告委員這個部分是由南二監他自己去擬定計畫去試辦的 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].start |
579.932 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].end |
592.177 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].text |
將來我們可以看到事辦完之後的結果請藍二間來我們署本部報告它的成效如何如果可以的話我們再來討論相關的擴大我要講的就是說不要說將來現在他們其實辦理這段時間已經有相當我個人認為有相當的成果是不是現在我們就來進行評估請他們現在就來報告他們辦理的 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].start |
603.462 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].end |
622.898 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].text |
的狀況那是不是能夠擴大到能夠推廣到其他的全國的其他的地方我們是可以請他盡快來署裡面報告這個評估之後我希望你們三個月裡面提出報告不過三個月後署長已經退休了不過你們署裡面三個月提這個報告給我可以嗎因為我們要先確認他事辦的成效怎麼樣結果到什麼階段 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].start |
629.864 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].end |
658.572 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].text |
第一個就是三個月的時間你們先了解他們現在示範的狀況是不是讓我們會後來了解實際的情況再跟委員回覆我就是要求三個月啦那你們你們去這三個月裡面你們去了解他現在示範的成效那去了解去評估他是不是有推廣的可能好不好那接下來我就是再講的就是剛剛所提到的這個有關毒品這個治療性處於裡面的這些毒品戒營的部分這個部分其實 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].start |
659.983 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].end |
688.176 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].text |
其實這個我看到現在目前的統計我們的這個受刑人幾乎有將近四成都是這個毒品危害防治法也就是說我們如果不解這現在這個其實是很負擔很大這個到四成的受刑人都是因為這個毒品危害防治條例所以這個台灣毒品戒營的這種儲育體系他確實是有具是一個很大的挑戰他也是我們改革這個儲育機制的一個很重要的關鍵 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].start |
689.617 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].end |
694.599 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].text |
但是我們目前全台的我們這些職能治療師還有相關的這些人力其實都不夠 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].start |
701.223 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].end |
719.551 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].text |
我們在目前我們是希望說我們跟衛福部能夠有一個合作的機制跟平台那這個部分現在我們目前有沒有這樣的狀況有沒有跟衛福部就在我們自己人力這些職能治療人力不足的情況之下我們有沒有跟衛福部來合作有相關的機制嗎有相關的平台嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].start |
722.359 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].end |
743.917 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].text |
我們相關的毒品的處理 包括之前所謂的減害計畫美沙東替代療法 我們都有跟以前叫做衛生署 現在衛福部來做合作我們目前也都有跟衛福部的相關司處來做相關的精進 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].start |
745.443 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].end |
767.281 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].text |
這個部分其實他也會牽涉他除了這個人力不足以外他更也會牽涉到他處於的資源的分配不均你在都市跟在其他的縣市這個這些資源也會分配不均我希望說這些機制能夠建立起來台南你不解決這個問題你要所有處於機制的改革都會卡到因為有4成的受刑人士 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].start |
768.622 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].end |
788.837 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].text |
是這些毒品防治法的這些受刑人所以這部分會是很關鍵最後我提一個這個上個禮拜但是大家社會上並沒有很注目但對我們來講是一個很重要的事情就是上個禮拜這個我們通過這個跟司法院會前之後通過少年事件處理法的這個修正 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].start |
789.818 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].end |
816.266 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].text |
的修正啦齁那這個是行政院應該是行政院院會通過啦齁那這個基本上這整個少年事件處理法它這個修法的重點齁就是讓這個少年事件的這些處遇齁能夠它的保護處分齁它能夠轉換它之間有多元化它可以轉換機制啦齁這是第一個重點另外一個重點就是有關於檢討這個修正前案塗銷的一些相關規定啦齁 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].start |
817.326 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].end |
833.634 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].text |
因為這個修法會涉及到包括法院的部分包括檢查體系包括社政包括教育包括警政有很多不同的主管機關其實它這個配合這個修法它都必須要同步的修訂一些相關規定所以我希望說你們這個應該要同步的修正這個少年保護官的手冊跟處遇的評估工具 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].start |
841.818 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].end |
857.167 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].text |
那也需要盤點相關的配套啦市長這部分因為我們準備要進行這樣的修正行政院會已經通過了我需要相關的配套跟委員報告齁因為這個少年事件處理法還有剛剛委員提到的少年保護官齁都是司法院的權責 |
| transcript.whisperx[37].start |
858.347 |
| transcript.whisperx[37].end |
864.47 |
| transcript.whisperx[37].text |
那所以我們會配合提出我們這邊你們這邊包括有一些相關的盤點要盤點你們相關的這些配套你們還是要進行這些配套的修正我們會提出來 |