| IVOD_ID |
16057 |
| IVOD_URL |
https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Full/1M/16057 |
| 日期 |
2024-07-03 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼 |
委員會-11-1-22-18 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼:str |
第11屆第1會期教育及文化委員會第18次全體委員會議 |
| 會議資料.屆 |
11 |
| 會議資料.會期 |
1 |
| 會議資料.會次 |
18 |
| 會議資料.種類 |
委員會 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼[0] |
22 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼:str[0] |
教育及文化委員會 |
| 會議資料.標題 |
第11屆第1會期教育及文化委員會第18次全體委員會議 |
| 影片種類 |
Full |
| 開始時間 |
2024-07-03T08:30:15+08:00 |
| 結束時間 |
2024-07-03T13:01:00+08:00 |
| 影片長度 |
04:30:45 |
| 支援功能[0] |
ai-transcript |
| video_url |
https://h264media01.ly.gov.tw:443/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1M/3832c314c43c373dae5f17226264b1aaad9f551ce5fa921f4f242ceca957783999075d7beb762f925ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8 |
| 會議時間 |
2024-07-03T09:00:00+08:00 |
| 會議名稱 |
立法院第11屆第1會期教育及文化委員會第18次全體委員會議（事由：邀請文化部部長李遠列席就「『文化資產保存法』施行40年有餘，修復體系翻新升級」進行專題報告，並備質詢。） |
| 委員名稱 |
完整會議 |
| 委員發言時間 |
08:30:15 - 13:01:00 |
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| transcript.whisperx[0].start |
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報告委員會出席委員13人以足法定人數現在開會首先進行報告事項我們請議事人員宣讀上次會議議事錄立法院第11屆第1會期教育及文化委員會第17次全體委員會議事錄時間中華民國113年6月24日上午9時3分至11時31分中華民國113年6月6日上午9時至12時38分定點本院群憲樓10會議室 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].start |
1822.405 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].end |
1848.842 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].text |
初期委員．孟凱委員等15人．內席委員．鄭振淺委員等21人．內席人員．6月24日．教育部中務次長．張亮萬堅說同有關人員．內政部．國土管理署．建築管理組專門委員陳威成．金融監督管理委員會保險局專門委員王啟華．6月26日．教育部部長鄭英耀說同有關人員．法務部．法律司調部辦事檢察官陳思麗．內政部民政司專門委員劉立芳． |
| transcript.whisperx[2].start |
1850.203 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].end |
1879.37 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].text |
衛生福利部新乙健康司副司長鄭淑欣行政院人事行政總處組編人力處專門委員谷元林行政院主席總處公共醫生處專門委員李一柔主席科召集委員之恩6月24日報告事項宣讀上次會議事務決定事務確定討論事項1.繼續審查委員科之恩等18人凝聚偏遠地區學校教育發展條例相關修正草案等4案2.繼續審查委員科之恩等17人凝聚國民體育法相關修正草案等4案 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].start |
1880.15 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].end |
1900.681 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].text |
進行逐條審查．議．廣泛討論完畢．對委員質詢．要求提供相關資料或未及答覆部分．及相關機關技術．以順便答覆。．三,偏遠地區學校教育發展條例相關修正草案．並定期繼續審查．不再進行詢答。．四,國民體育法相關修正草案全部審查完畢．不需交由黨團協商．並在凝聚審查報告提請院會討論。 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].start |
1902.202 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].end |
1919.569 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].text |
因為討論時由科召集委員之恩補充說明審查結果如下1.第5條照委員科之恩等17人提案通過2.增訂第20條之一修正通過3.第23條修正通過4.委員何先淳等20人提案第20條之二及第20條之三不予增訂 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].start |
1921.149 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].end |
1923.151 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].text |
5.通過附帶決議三項5. |
| transcript.whisperx[6].start |
1923.151 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].end |
1948.827 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].text |
在不影響條文文藝前提下,文字條次標的符號未統一提令,授權意識人員修改,未予以採納條文授權意識人員確認,通過臨時提案2項6月26日討論事項,依審查委員範圍等17項凝聚學生輔導法部分條文修正草案案等26案,僅進行詢討。本人議程採證回詢答由委員黃孟凱等20人提出質詢,軍政教育部部長鄭英耀及相關人員及其答覆說明, |
| transcript.whisperx[7].start |
1949.267 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].end |
1970.554 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].text |
另一委員．林毅君等四人提出書面質詢。決議一報告及詢答完畢行政院版編案審查時不再進行詢答二委員所提書面質詢後相關資料列入紀錄並刊登公報三對委員質詢要求提供相關資料或未及答覆部分請相關機關建樹以書面答覆四學生輔導法相關修正草案另定期繼續審查通過臨時提案而詳詢的完畢 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].start |
1979.026 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].end |
2001.999 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].text |
在場委員未達議決人數3人所以我們意識陸陸戰不確定那今天議程我們是邀請文化部部長李遠部長列席就《文化資產保存法》施行40年有餘．修復體系翻新升級進行專題報告．並備質詢那我們首先先來介紹在場的委員洪孟楷委員 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].start |
2006.178 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].end |
2028.488 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].text |
那我們今天與會的官員有我們李遠部長還有我們王石思政務次長徐怡君常務次長還有我們文資局陳敬明局長那我們現在就請文化部李部長進行報告報告時間5分鐘 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].start |
2035.408 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].end |
2058.853 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].text |
主席、各位委員、各位先進大家好我今天很深感榮幸來到這裡大院教育及文化委員會的邀請就文化資產保存法施行了40年有餘．修復體系翻新升級提出報告並且備詢我在這裡代表文化部同仁感謝各位委員 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].start |
2060.333 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].end |
2089.219 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].text |
對於文化施政的協助與支持．以下報告．敬請各位委員指教．在文治法中．建築類的文化資產類別．包括古蹟．歷史建物．紀念建物．及聚落建築群等．隨著臺灣文化保存的意識高漲．文化資產的保存．以及相關人才的培育．是我們努力的目標． |
| transcript.whisperx[12].start |
2090.475 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].end |
2114.9 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].text |
我們從法治面、制度面還有教育面等三個大面向說明我們一直以來的推動情況首先法治面隨著文資專法的施行我國開始有系統性的進行文資保存工作特別在執法過程我們也不斷的參考世界遺產的保存觀念 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].start |
2115.942 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].end |
2138.572 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].text |
技術與方法和國際接軌同時我們也考量臺灣文化資產的傳統性與在地性透過徵修法令讓文化資產的修復保存更貼近實際的需求不依現代工程法令而受限讓專業的修復人員能夠發揮最大的修復品質 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].start |
2144.093 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].end |
2159.81 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].text |
在制度面．我們透過積極爭取經費．推動文資修復工程．擴大修復市場的規模．積極培育人才．期待建構出文化資產的．修復產業鏈 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].start |
2164.195 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].end |
2186.313 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].text |
但是隨著傳統工匠的逐漸凋零﹐還有社會變先導致傳統師徒制的勢為﹐願意投入文化資產修復的人員越來越少﹐特別是年輕人﹐所以我們積極建立人才培育的機制﹐包括成立文資船匠工坊﹐ |
| transcript.whisperx[16].start |
2188.851 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].end |
2215.196 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].text |
作為技術培訓保存傳習的人才培育基地同時建置專業的人才庫每個具有傳統降師資格的師傅進入修復現場工作另外我們也辦理了古蹟規劃修復與建造的培訓班培養更多優秀的古蹟修復人員為了讓更多 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].start |
2216.781 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].end |
2234.148 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].text |
新的世代投入台灣文化資產我們將持續透過傳統技術與現代科技的整合讓文化資產的修復保存以及活化運用走向產業化讓投入的人才更具有榮耀感 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].start |
2235.953 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].end |
2265.302 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].text |
最後在教育方面．我們會和教育部、勞動部合作．透過學校的教育、在職的進修．強化產學供需的媒合．提升文資修復的品質．打造出屬於臺灣的文化資產的產業．讓我們的文化資產走向永續發展．懇請各位委員持續鼎力支持．並給予我們指教謝謝大家 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].start |
2273.01 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].end |
2285.157 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].text |
謝謝,謝謝李部長的口頭報告那報告我們現在進行詢答那每位出席委員質詢8分鐘,必要時延長2分鐘列席委員質詢時間為4分鐘,發言人登記的截止時間為10點30分 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].start |
2293.342 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].end |
2311.84 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].text |
那委員如有臨時提案．我們請於10點30分以前提出．並於本會委員．吳春成委員質詢結束後即進行處理．處理提案時若提案委員及聯署委員均不在場．原力不予處理首先我們就請發言登記第一位．洪孟楷委員質詢謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].start |
2324.36 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].end |
2327.903 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].text |
主席謝謝,麻煩請李部長好,有請李部長部長好,我們先請教一下上禮拜才剛落幕的金曲獎當然金曲獎大家也都非常關心因為三金其實也是我們的年度盛事但是在這次金曲獎裡面反而大家會覺得是說有一些 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].start |
2352.841 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].end |
2354.783 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].text |
整體來講我們那個已經跟台視當時轉播的是台視公司我們跟他問整個過程他們也對外 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].start |
2379.741 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].end |
2400.193 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].text |
公布了幾個幾個重要的關鍵就是其實是硬體的硬體的問題就整個技術問題主要是麥克風的設備但是故障但之前沒有彩排嗎相信也都有啊都有可是我覺得現場的那個狀況應該是他們的人員不足然後應付不夠反應不夠快所以發現電池 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].start |
2402.034 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].end |
2421.825 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].text |
不良的時候馬上換新的麥克風可是旁邊那個場控人員又報錯了麥克風的號碼我想在現場這種狀況是非常凌亂的所以未來我們會改善做法包括慎選我們的硬體跟協力廠商確實掌握這個麥克風設備狀況增加一些無線訊號監控跟技術人員條度跟作業的SOP |
| transcript.whisperx[25].start |
2428.669 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].end |
2437.95 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].text |
看起來都是技術性層面問題那未來譬如說像這樣子的一個招包相關的承辦廠商是不是也應該要把它列為考核的項目 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].start |
2442.996 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].end |
2460.5 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].text |
報告委員關於政策的整個部分我們有跟台視做過檢討那我們是一定會依照契約來做究責然後跟包括扣款那我們也會依照契約的相關規定然後做未來後續典禮以後成辦的相關的檢討跟參考好來那再請教部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].start |
2461.699 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].end |
2485.299 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].text |
部長現在有看到是說居然說得獎者上台致詞的部分也有說被這個粉磚給消失那你當然也有受到這個媒體的一個詢問其實本期還是強調重要的影視頒獎典禮得獎者上台致詞就屬於得獎者的我們每一個人都應該要尊重因為榮耀時刻要說什麼就是言論自由嘛 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].start |
2485.899 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].end |
2514.625 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].text |
那尤其關心國際大事這也是一個高尚人道的一個關懷但是為什麼會在這個情況下還是會讓大家去有一些這種互相的一個討論那甚至本席也看到好像我們現在已經就變成是說有點高度對立居然還講到是說我們有高傑這個藝人說實在高傑這個藝人也算是我們台灣資深的藝人他講一句說晚上好也被網友酸爆 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].start |
2515.711 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].end |
2530.356 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].text |
那部長 上一次本席也才這邊才質詢您請教是說如果說用孤寂一詞會不會覺得是不是用大陸用語你那時候講說文化是包容的所以針對這樣子文化部辦這樣子的一個獎項然後網友這樣討論您自己怎麼看 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].start |
2531.069 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].end |
2547.462 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].text |
好 我覺得我沒有想到這件事情會鬧那麼大的原因是其實每一次的頒獎過去也有完全不會把那個得獎人的得獎得獎者即時打出來不管得獎者 不管頒獎者他們的言論是不是應該都要尊重 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].start |
2547.822 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].end |
2571.078 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].text |
要尊重所以我們這次的方式為什麼出差錯就是因為現場的速度很快那負責打這個打字的小編大概打到50個字到100個字就馬上上傳因為馬上進到下一個節目所以第一他絕對是無心之過因為他他就跟著打字跟著打字打到差不多50個字到100字之後就上傳那帕奈最後講這個天安門事件 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].start |
2572.387 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].end |
2589.528 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].text |
這件事情用現在來思考他絕對不會敏感那個小編大概從來沒有覺得這件事情那麼重要就直接跳過去下一個節目所以當我們發現不對的時候他已經晚上傳了那我也不曉得這件事情怎麼會被大家想成是自我審查因為 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].start |
2590.769 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].end |
2591.25 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].text |
其實本席要說 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].start |
2620.413 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].end |
2641.572 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].text |
三金的這個獎項都是高度大眾視但是不管是得獎者不管是頒獎者他們的言論都應該接受尊重所以不管是說巴奈的一個發言或是高潔的發言本席都認為是說不應該有任何人去覺得是說你的政治意識形態然後加注在他們身上我想這是應該互相尊重的部分部長你可以同意吧 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].start |
2641.832 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].end |
2669.037 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].text |
我在現場我覺得有的時候很奇怪這個社會很怪現場有幾位立委也跟我們一起在現場看那個表演其實我每次聽到那個有原住民的歌有客家語言的歌有華語的歌然後有台語的歌大家混在一起比過去那個多元而且歌手變多我跟你講我當場的感覺我非常感動那現場聽的觀眾也非常的嗨可是最後會 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].start |
2670.878 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].end |
2695.579 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].text |
會討論的東西是我沒有想像到的說是某個言論怎樣怎樣我真的憑良心講在我的經驗中不曾有過好很好那言論的部分是一回事那一樣上禮拜有發生另外一個事件就是說有傳出有平面媒體報導是說有中國官媒記者介入台灣的政論節目那陸委會居然講是說協同文化部來查米那請教一個禮拜過去了文化部有沒有去查米這個我們有繼續玩下 |
| transcript.whisperx[37].start |
2698.161 |
| transcript.whisperx[37].end |
2705.968 |
| transcript.whisperx[37].text |
現在有瞭解現在的狀況嗎?平面媒體講的是哪一家電視台?跟委員報告我們現在是依照我們的規定的程序進行行政調查所以我們兩個對象需要調查第一個就是邀請單位那邀請單位是聯合報那第二個就是這個當事的單位就是新華社那因為新華社還有兩位記者還在台灣所以我們也進行了約訪 |
| transcript.whisperx[38].start |
2725.024 |
| transcript.whisperx[38].end |
2727.806 |
| transcript.whisperx[38].text |
這個禮拜以前會對對外有一個公開說明今天禮拜三了所以明天或後天是不是這個禮拜以內 |
| transcript.whisperx[39].start |
2751.786 |
| transcript.whisperx[39].end |
2766.599 |
| transcript.whisperx[39].text |
一個禮拜以內一個禮拜以內但是已經過去一個禮拜啦上禮拜發生的事情到現在那本席只想確認平面媒體報導有講是說真的因為這種事情如果說發生任何人身上我們都沒有辦法接受 |
| transcript.whisperx[40].start |
2767.119 |
| transcript.whisperx[40].end |
2785.873 |
| transcript.whisperx[40].text |
怎麼會有外國的人可以到我們台灣的新聞電視台然後去看說哪一個政論節目那被影射的政論節目有沒有看到上禮拜他也大動作聲明覺得是說根本不是啊只需烏有啊根本沒有這種事啊那所以說我們行政機關調查到底有沒有確認有沒有電視台 |
| transcript.whisperx[41].start |
2787.045 |
| transcript.whisperx[41].end |
2810.494 |
| transcript.whisperx[41].text |
有沒有這個情況目前為止我們還在確認當中那也要跟委員說明所以你們會找那個電視台來詢問嗎我們要先從當事人開始因為我們當事人是指誰是指邀請的單位跟住台的單位住台的單位就新華社新華社那新華社他們邀請你們詢問了沒 |
| transcript.whisperx[42].start |
2812.059 |
| transcript.whisperx[42].end |
2825.162 |
| transcript.whisperx[42].text |
已經約訪了那他們有承認這個事情嗎還沒說因為一個禮拜嘛所以約他然後跟他約時間說什麼時候可以來已經約了但他還沒有來還沒來對對對有在進行中那跟委員說因為我們畢竟行政調查權並不是司法權啦也不是自信的法務的權利部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[43].start |
2837.429 |
| transcript.whisperx[43].end |
2865.207 |
| transcript.whisperx[43].text |
文化部其實沒有...你剛剛答詢喔本席也給你很多時間來回答那一樣就是說你講到說現在的台灣像我們中華民國我們法治社會我們沒有辦法想像說有人會做這個言語調查思想調查那一樣的道理你覺得這樣的一個狀況因為上禮拜平面媒體他指正立立啊大動作但是我們真的去看裡面有寫哪一家電視台嗎沒有他就寫沒有寫哪一家電視台只有影社 |
| transcript.whisperx[44].start |
2866.175 |
| transcript.whisperx[44].end |
2888.542 |
| transcript.whisperx[44].text |
那有寫說是什麼節目嗎?沒有但就變成是說人人自為阿好像被潑到髒水的被影射到的然後大家就在以兒傳兒然後網路上鋪天蓋地在配合側翼來去帶風向哇 那個電視台好像就被帶風向了本期沒有要問哪一家電視台講話但本期很沒有辦法接受就是用這種帶風向式的以兒傳兒的故意抹紅的 |
| transcript.whisperx[45].start |
2890.407 |
| transcript.whisperx[45].end |
2909.698 |
| transcript.whisperx[45].text |
那一樣的道理啊我剛剛問了如果說我們行政調查有屬實因為陸委會要跟文化部持續查明嘛有屬實把他給抓出來該犯什麼法令國安法還是什麼法把他揪出來但沒有屬實是不是也應該還相關人的一個公道 |
| transcript.whisperx[46].start |
2910.498 |
| transcript.whisperx[46].end |
2913.959 |
| transcript.whisperx[46].text |
文化部的確是負責發記者證如果他的行為違反了我們發證的條件我們可以把它取消我們的功能是這樣子 |
| transcript.whisperx[47].start |
2935.97 |
| transcript.whisperx[47].end |
2939.513 |
| transcript.whisperx[47].text |
昨天卓院長在另外一個立法院的那個會議中他也被問到這一題 |
| transcript.whisperx[48].start |
2958.587 |
| transcript.whisperx[48].end |
2980.088 |
| transcript.whisperx[48].text |
部長最後本席今天也看到這個新聞啊臺南我想朝偉是臺南人啊大家很關注啊真善美戲院2018年其實他才剛重新開幕但是到現在2024年不過6年的時間他又在熄燈了那部長您之前上任的時候外界給您一個評語啊叫做真正懂電影的部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[49].start |
2981.489 |
| transcript.whisperx[49].end |
2994.942 |
| transcript.whisperx[49].text |
所以您既然是一個真正懂電影部長看到這樣子國內電影院的狀況不管是現在這個市場越來越萎縮不管是國片的一個市場您有什麼樣的一個作為能夠更積極的來協助 |
| transcript.whisperx[50].start |
2996.781 |
| transcript.whisperx[50].end |
3020 |
| transcript.whisperx[50].text |
是的 委員您問得很好 這也是我最憂心的部分因為整體的電影市場不是因為國片而是連戲片都開始跌那是因為整個消費方式大家很少願意走進戲院那整體來講已經發展出兩種東西一個是電影院的戲院電影院的電影一個是在Netflix這種平台上算流平台的電影所以我們作為一個 |
| transcript.whisperx[51].start |
3021.909 |
| transcript.whisperx[51].end |
3022.45 |
| transcript.whisperx[51].text |
主席 |
| transcript.whisperx[52].start |
3039.005 |
| transcript.whisperx[52].end |
3062.236 |
| transcript.whisperx[52].text |
國發會再重新開會希望多用第二個100億另外我們的黑曹計畫也跟行政院要了一個專門針對臺灣的文化內容包括科技包括電影包括電視還有文學等等也變成100億用4年來用所以作為一個文化部長我唯一能做就是我們預助更多的資源協助他們能夠把這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[53].start |
3063.317 |
| transcript.whisperx[53].end |
3063.757 |
| transcript.whisperx[53].text |
文化部部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[54].start |
3081.229 |
| transcript.whisperx[54].end |
3106.535 |
| transcript.whisperx[54].text |
我答應每部電影都去看而且我們也答應馬上就要宣布一個文化幣鼓勵大家看國片的一個政策我明天就要宣布了就是鼓勵大家用文化幣去看國片而且指定就是國片而且那個給的點數非常高就是我做我全力可以做的事情而且我也自己會每部電影去看我覺得有的時候是一個氣氛就是自己的電影自己看那這一點當然是我會 |
| transcript.whisperx[55].start |
3107.535 |
| transcript.whisperx[55].end |
3133.135 |
| transcript.whisperx[55].text |
就我所有可能去協助的部長我覺得這是一個大問題本期只是提出一個點因為過去到現在我也都在這邊很關心我們的不管是影視產業或是國片的相關的發展但我只提醒兩個點第一過去有人感嘆說前幾任部長對於文化的重視其實追根究柢到最後都只剩傻錢業界雖然高興但是影視文化難以紮根這個是媒體報導對於過去幾任部長的一個講法 |
| transcript.whisperx[56].start |
3137.498 |
| transcript.whisperx[56].end |
3157.571 |
| transcript.whisperx[56].text |
所以剛剛雖然聽到你有講說有兩個計畫但是本期還是要強調除了這個資源投入以外更重要的是要做什麼那還有第二個部分商業影片戲劇當然他們有他們各自的發展譬如說引進更新的技術環繞音響IMAX或是那個 |
| transcript.whisperx[57].start |
3159.273 |
| transcript.whisperx[57].end |
3187.493 |
| transcript.whisperx[57].text |
相關4DX等等的讓很多追求這些影視娛樂的可以去做但是另外一個部分對於這種真善美戲院他們的定位可能是文化藝術相關片型他們可能缺的不只是資源而是更重要是怎麼樣能夠跟國際上不同的電影來結合更方便的引路我覺得這才是不同特色影戲院應該要求的生存好不好我請部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[58].start |
3188.314 |
| transcript.whisperx[58].end |
3194.698 |
| transcript.whisperx[58].text |
後續我們還會再繼續針對這個議題來做討論本次也會跟您更深入的討論好不好謝謝謝謝謝謝洪夢凱委員謝謝替我們台南政善美戲院幾張熄燈發聲謝謝那我們先來確認議事錄議事錄有無錯誤跟遺漏之處沒有好那議事錄確定我們接下來請柯之恩召委 |
| transcript.whisperx[59].start |
3217.056 |
| transcript.whisperx[59].end |
3220.738 |
| transcript.whisperx[59].text |
好,謝謝主席,我們請李遠部長。好,有請部長。特緣,你好。你好,我想我持續剛剛的問題,特別是三經。為什麼對這問題特別關切?因為我35年前也曾經是金鐘獎的教育文化的主持人,好不好?不過知道這件事情,大概年紀都不小了,好不好?那已經是非常久的事情了。 |
| transcript.whisperx[60].start |
3242.867 |
| transcript.whisperx[60].end |
3268.655 |
| transcript.whisperx[60].text |
那我還是你小時候OK好那我其實你剛剛已經對宏孟凱的委員的問題已經做了一些我必須要說因為這520你才上任所以金曲獎的承辦幾乎是在你上任之前就已經確定了嘛所以說呢很多的小編我也相信對於你過去的一貫的一個立場對於自由的這樣的一個定義應該是小編在這個過程裡面應該輸了小的瑕疵我比較在乎的是 |
| transcript.whisperx[61].start |
3269.595 |
| transcript.whisperx[61].end |
3297.986 |
| transcript.whisperx[61].text |
說實在的這個三金過去可以說是華人圈的一個盛事所以你剛剛特別提到的非常的多元但是呢對於整個影響力跟我那個年代比起來其實是下降的這點部長你應該是同意吧你當初在金馬獎為李安為這個徐發行人還有等等這些的風功其實現在已經是風光不再這是我們必須要接受的事實我比較關切的是接下來金鐘獎特別是你非常熟悉的金馬獎你有信心辦好嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[62].start |
3298.746 |
| transcript.whisperx[62].end |
3304.25 |
| transcript.whisperx[62].text |
臺灣的影視發展,比如金鐘獎臺灣的劇集這幾年非常精彩我們接受的除了電視之外也接受在OTT上的節目金馬獎的部分你覺得你有信心嗎?金馬獎我也很有信心 |
| transcript.whisperx[63].start |
3322.402 |
| transcript.whisperx[63].end |
3327.726 |
| transcript.whisperx[63].text |
長期以來金馬獎那個單位經過了李安丹主席張愛佳到現在李平平安丹主席他們已經有能力對待募款的產值好 我就是特別提醒因為目前如果說金曲獎因為一些技術問題還有一些政治上面的問題有一些的紛擾 |
| transcript.whisperx[64].start |
3337.714 |
| transcript.whisperx[64].end |
3350.207 |
| transcript.whisperx[64].text |
你自己也個人受了非常多的一個委屈我希望在這個所謂的未來的二斤當中可以繼續教訓因為今天主席排的是有關於這個古跡的部分我想中正紀念堂也絕對是我們國定的一個古跡那這個顧立雄已經宣布了這個已經跟文化部協調好要把這個三軍移到我們自由廣場來細節是由文化部來拍板這是事實嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[65].start |
3362.401 |
| transcript.whisperx[65].end |
3377.328 |
| transcript.whisperx[65].text |
因為我們臺灣的有關這個重症經驗堂它是個非常敏感的問題我了解 所以說這是部長你的決定嗎還是國防部的決定我只問這個問題簡單說我們其實誰都不能決定因為我們有一個那個行政院有一個這個所以是行政院決定的重症經驗堂這個轉型正義的匯報 |
| transcript.whisperx[66].start |
3380.37 |
| transcript.whisperx[66].end |
3384.073 |
| transcript.whisperx[66].text |
所以是他們決定的所以說把這個所謂的儀隊移出去到廣場部長我是為什麼要特別我沒有那麼多政治思考我只覺得這些儀隊你要知道他們曾經在這個曾經有過這個昏倒的記錄你在室內沒有辦法你把他移到廣場這個這麼高溫之下面這是一個非常嚴重的一個問題所以你剛剛說不是你也不是顧立松決定的是你更上層的那個委員會所決定的是不是 |
| transcript.whisperx[67].start |
3407.574 |
| transcript.whisperx[67].end |
3408.134 |
| transcript.whisperx[67].text |
請問這句話還算數嗎?徹底一對是全民共識嗎? |
| transcript.whisperx[68].start |
3439.135 |
| transcript.whisperx[68].end |
3461.593 |
| transcript.whisperx[68].text |
謝謝你給我這個機會回答我在5月22回答的東西跟現在想法完全一樣因為全世界經過威權統治的法西斯統治的國家非常多他們如何處理那個很敏感的那個紀念碑或者是一個建築物那個東西如果處理得不好的話是繼續撕裂族群所以我會 |
| transcript.whisperx[69].start |
3464.255 |
| transcript.whisperx[69].end |
3480.227 |
| transcript.whisperx[69].text |
非常小心翼翼的處理不是部長你的重點你或許你認為一樣可是我們聽起來重點不一樣因為每個人都會選擇性的去理解選擇性的去暴露然後會選擇性的去接受你上次回答我說你覺得民眾休閒是比較重要的我當時要跟你比較肯定而且呢你那時候好特別提到說這個以人道的立場來說三金魚隊不是被大家在政權當中轉來轉去這是你當初的一個立場 |
| transcript.whisperx[70].start |
3492.016 |
| transcript.whisperx[70].end |
3501.098 |
| transcript.whisperx[70].text |
這個立場其實跟你現在所提到的大家對於這個威權制度各方面部分其實有很大的改變的一個月還是有很大的改變的 |
| transcript.whisperx[71].start |
3501.735 |
| transcript.whisperx[71].end |
3516.504 |
| transcript.whisperx[71].text |
沒有 如果你願意給我多一點時間的話我沒有那麼多時間給你我只覺得你是有一些而且我只要提醒你部長我比較在乎的跟你前次所回應的比較知道這是人民休息的一個地方而且你可能不知道中山盡量遊客過去曾經比故宮還要多曾經是320萬在這個所謂疫情之前兩岸觀光還交流的時候還曾經達到六七百萬曾經算掉709萬的這樣的人次 |
| transcript.whisperx[72].start |
3528.692 |
| transcript.whisperx[72].end |
3556.111 |
| transcript.whisperx[72].text |
大家在去那個地方的時候呢就是看到儀隊但是對於這個蔣介石的功過大家自有一些的一個解讀不會因為你參觀了一下然後呢就對於這樣的一個偉人開始是崇拜或是摧毀基本上面現在目前自由開放訊息太多所以我只能說在你任內當中你過去的一般的一個立場跟你現在所講的部分我個人覺得還是有一些落差我只問一個你覺得你在任內當中你要對中共進行的轉型 |
| transcript.whisperx[73].start |
3557.512 |
| transcript.whisperx[73].end |
3583.881 |
| transcript.whisperx[73].text |
你要發揮什麼樣的一個角色我覺得有三個面向如果你願意讓我講一點一分鐘因為等一下還有因為我覺得第一個我覺得我們最近有設計到一個讓全台灣年輕人來設計中央紀念堂我覺得歷史是要把它翻過去舊的歷史要翻過去可是不能遺忘翻過去之後大家重新面對新的時代所以我最近我會巡迴全台灣展覽所有年輕人對中央紀念堂想像的那個建築物那第二個 |
| transcript.whisperx[74].start |
3586.229 |
| transcript.whisperx[74].end |
3601.332 |
| transcript.whisperx[74].text |
中正經常要如何解決一個去威懸跟去個人崇拜有幾個方式一個就是我們從周邊的剛剛講到民眾休閒那個環境的改造這是我第二個想法第三個至於我們的這個儀隊如何操 |
| transcript.whisperx[75].start |
3602.073 |
| transcript.whisperx[75].end |
3602.513 |
| transcript.whisperx[75].text |
文化部長李遠列席 |
| transcript.whisperx[76].start |
3632.193 |
| transcript.whisperx[76].end |
3661.206 |
| transcript.whisperx[76].text |
我想強化保全吧這一點我覺得的確要顧及到不同族群對同一件事情有不同的看法從過去歷史上看到這種有經過威權是 所以你的保全應該就跟國防部的這樣的保護就完全是沒有關係就對了對 作為一個政府態度應該是讓它不要衝突不要撕裂我剛才一直強調說我從近年來講的話到現在的話還是一樣的最重要一件事情就是我們要慎重處理過去的歷史不要遺忘它但是我們也不能夠 |
| transcript.whisperx[77].start |
3668.289 |
| transcript.whisperx[77].end |
3688.88 |
| transcript.whisperx[77].text |
我完全同意這個部分只是你上次所講的重點所畫的一個重點跟你現在你把它講得更清楚但是我還是要懇請部長真的大家那時候一剛開始對你寄予厚望就是因為你一本初衷對很多事情你是還保有一個過去的一個想法我還是希望文化部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[78].start |
3689.52 |
| transcript.whisperx[78].end |
3708.269 |
| transcript.whisperx[78].text |
就是以文化為基準點不要被政治給凌駕然後接下來跟一個比較政治的一個問題就像我們剛剛說的這個清華社你剛剛已經特別提到是聯合報來做一些邀請的那目前大陸駐台大概有6家媒體7名的記者部長就你所理解的部分來說過去清華社到台灣來有或者是從過去跟大陸的媒體到這邊來估計到現在有多少是違規的比例是多少 |
| transcript.whisperx[79].start |
3717.816 |
| transcript.whisperx[79].end |
3726.166 |
| transcript.whisperx[79].text |
有多少是違規的?跟委員報告新華社的部分並沒有其他的違規情形目前為止並沒有其他違規的一個狀況出現大陸入台那大陸其他大陸駐台的記者嗎?有沒有這樣子的一個記錄? |
| transcript.whisperx[80].start |
3734.155 |
| transcript.whisperx[80].end |
3739.137 |
| transcript.whisperx[80].text |
大陸的駐台機車如果在台灣有識別上的需求像是要租攝影棚或是SNG車在文化部的規定當中是可不可以? |
| transcript.whisperx[81].start |
3754.862 |
| transcript.whisperx[81].end |
3780.68 |
| transcript.whisperx[81].text |
其實可以只是看狀況因為他進來的目的是進行注點的採訪那是依據這個採訪的需求而衍生的如果沒有牽涉到其他的情形就是看他的實際的狀況來做所以攝影棚看你的實際狀況當然你有前提設在那個地方嘛所以攝影棚的租借或SNG車在目前來說是在法規上面是OK的如果他符合他的在台的活動目的是OK我只是說目前為止很多人想了解台灣的一些的訊息透過這樣的傳輸的管道 |
| transcript.whisperx[82].start |
3782.461 |
| transcript.whisperx[82].end |
3811.205 |
| transcript.whisperx[82].text |
不要把每個人都當匪諜好不好我真的覺得我們台灣現在已經處處都是匪諜又回到我35年前的時代了不只喔更早以前的時代了因為我們要對台灣的民主要有相當的信心不要把一些事情都把它擴大解讀影射是最傷害的好 謝謝最後我要問一下有關於大家非常關切的這個國定古籍龍山寺鹿港龍山寺的彩繪工程到底什麼時候會再來一次的把它復原這是鹿港人非常在乎的 |
| transcript.whisperx[83].start |
3811.706 |
| transcript.whisperx[83].end |
3814.176 |
| transcript.whisperx[83].text |
這個我要請文資局局長跟你解釋一下 |
| transcript.whisperx[84].start |
3815.4 |
| transcript.whisperx[84].end |
3839.169 |
| transcript.whisperx[84].text |
委員陸港龍山市的彩繪我們在4月份做終止契約的這個決定那現在在進行那個結算的工作結算之後我們會再...局長既然你都上來了我還是要讓部長瞭解一下我真的不想發生什麼事情我們這個局長任國美副館長的時候典藏庫房是解約我們要再次的發保文件會第二處長的時候又是解約再發保 |
| transcript.whisperx[85].start |
3841.99 |
| transcript.whisperx[85].end |
3842.95 |
| transcript.whisperx[85].text |
傳譯中心主任、高雄中山堂說服工程解約再發報 |
| transcript.whisperx[86].start |
3857.149 |
| transcript.whisperx[86].end |
3876.124 |
| transcript.whisperx[86].text |
為什麼伊聯商一直在粗暴?為什麼?到底是什麼樣的問題?我覺得台灣的文資修復是一個非常復雜的問題中央給錢然後地方來修復齁這個我們還在真的還在學習中因為台灣有文字概念是很後面的事情我了解可是局長這次發生在你任內你不需要做一些解釋 |
| transcript.whisperx[87].start |
3876.724 |
| transcript.whisperx[87].end |
3878.605 |
| transcript.whisperx[87].text |
委員 龍山市這個案子主要是團隊那之前的案子有沒有再重復發生 |
| transcript.whisperx[88].start |
3903.218 |
| transcript.whisperx[88].end |
3914.899 |
| transcript.whisperx[88].text |
跟這每個案例都不一樣每個案例都不一樣但是結果都一樣就叫做解約再發報我想都是按照我們的合約的規定如果不解約那我覺得那是失職 |
| transcript.whisperx[89].start |
3916.64 |
| transcript.whisperx[89].end |
3922.105 |
| transcript.whisperx[89].text |
這麼多次的狀況部長我今天特別提出來條列這個部分或許你剛上任但是我覺得你一直強調從過去歷史當中學到教訓然後往前走不能回顧過去起碼可以往前看這麼多的例子擺在這個地方特別是鹿港崙山市是承載的非常多鹿港人對於文化的上面的一個精神的一個寄託現在已經延宕兩年了同樣的問題還是在存在請問什麼時候可以讓這個彩排工程 |
| transcript.whisperx[90].start |
3946.024 |
| transcript.whisperx[90].end |
3954.109 |
| transcript.whisperx[90].text |
正式的完工給我們一個數字局長或部長這個我想程序還是繼續照走了什麼時候可能我們要再再什麼時候可以告訴我一個答案我一個禮拜之內一個禮拜告訴我好不好還有所發生的一個問題等等之類請給請告訴本席到底問題真正所在還有過去的這些問題當中我們如何從過去的教訓當中得到一個學習的經驗我覺得這才是最重要的好 謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[91].start |
3977.304 |
| transcript.whisperx[91].end |
3977.764 |
| transcript.whisperx[91].text |
李遠列席 |
| transcript.whisperx[92].start |
4000.994 |
| transcript.whisperx[92].end |
4003.095 |
| transcript.whisperx[92].text |
我必須跟你承認我第一次參加金曲獎 |
| transcript.whisperx[93].start |
4025.771 |
| transcript.whisperx[93].end |
4041.347 |
| transcript.whisperx[93].text |
所以這一次的進取獎在你的心目中成功嗎打了幾分我給他80分但是因為發生這些事情我給他扣5分75分這一次這個進取獎相關的出包剛才您的回答是說有硬體的問題有設備的問題有小編的問題那我整個看起來 |
| transcript.whisperx[94].start |
4046.092 |
| transcript.whisperx[94].end |
4071.871 |
| transcript.whisperx[94].text |
其實這些出的包其實都是非常低級的錯誤都是不應該出的包那看起來是一個小地方但影響都甚巨所以才會造成您剛剛所說的在今天典禮的現場您看到所有多元文化的表演你覺得非常的感動但沒有想到落幕以後是這麼多的沸沸揚揚就是這些小地方我們沒有注意的時候帶來的就是巨大的一個影響跟嚴重的結果那您知道這是哪一個單位承辦的嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[95].start |
4073.08 |
| transcript.whisperx[95].end |
4078.826 |
| transcript.whisperx[95].text |
臺灣電視公司臺視好這是他第幾次成辦第幾次啊我問一下這幾年我們經過公開招標之後這幾年都是臺視成辦的第幾次成辦應該是從25屆到現在都是臺視成辦所以第幾次成辦好局長應該是第11年 |
| transcript.whisperx[96].start |
4097.692 |
| transcript.whisperx[96].end |
4099.914 |
| transcript.whisperx[96].text |
所以我只問一下臺市連續幾年來承辦?他總共辦過幾次了? |
| transcript.whisperx[97].start |
4114.97 |
| transcript.whisperx[97].end |
4123.604 |
| transcript.whisperx[97].text |
其實他是在21屆到23屆你告訴我他總共辦過幾次幾次嗎對 台市14次14次所以台市辦金曲獎其實有高達14次部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[98].start |
4129.414 |
| transcript.whisperx[98].end |
4149.46 |
| transcript.whisperx[98].text |
部長 這個問題就嚴重囉其實他出包不是今年才出包因為您是今年可能才接了部長這個位置您有在現場去看他往年就出過很多次包了去年不知道您記不記得就在第34屆的金曲獎因為頒獎卡片他排版不佳就主持人唸錯有沒有那還造成了大家很多的尷尬 |
| transcript.whisperx[99].start |
4150.12 |
| transcript.whisperx[99].end |
4172.993 |
| transcript.whisperx[99].text |
那甚至於這可能還有一些就是大家是心理上的不舒服還有一些面子理直的問題其實是一份嚴重的錯誤那如果說還是從過去到現在第一個他經驗豐富還屢屢出錯那屢屢出錯又屢屢得標這是為什麼那第二個去年已經出錯今年還是繼續再犯那請問一下他是用什麼樣的方式我們去圍給他來承辦這個活動我想請教部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[100].start |
4178.382 |
| transcript.whisperx[100].end |
4178.702 |
| transcript.whisperx[100].text |
政府採購法公開 |
| transcript.whisperx[101].start |
4196.613 |
| transcript.whisperx[101].end |
4196.893 |
| transcript.whisperx[101].text |
市長徐市長徐市長 |
| transcript.whisperx[102].start |
4220.115 |
| transcript.whisperx[102].end |
4238.566 |
| transcript.whisperx[102].text |
跟委員報告 我們都是用公開招標的方式來用什麼樣的標 最低標 最有力標 哪一種標我們是用那個 準用最有力標最有力標 好 最有力標就是評選嘛那何以十幾年來 他有經驗 然後還出錯出錯以後又再得標 得標以後再出錯 出錯又再得標可以告訴我為什麼嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[103].start |
4239.646 |
| transcript.whisperx[103].end |
4253.775 |
| transcript.whisperx[103].text |
其實這幾年都只有台式一家公司來投標那因為我們這案子我跟委員簡單報告因為我們整個金曲獎不是只有頒獎典禮我們要整個案子裡頭是從25號開始我們有個金曲獎這我理解來部長所以他的工作項目比較繁雜一點部長有一個問題喔剛才呢回答說因為只有一家來所以這麼多年下來我們都只有一家來這中間的問題其實不小第一個為什麼只有一家來什麼原因 |
| transcript.whisperx[104].start |
4269.437 |
| transcript.whisperx[104].end |
4294.228 |
| transcript.whisperx[104].text |
有沒有去理解過 了解過那這個只有一家來有沒有一些人謀不當在裡面或者是有沒有一些疏忽在裡面或者是我們這個整個典禮活動預算經費不夠高沒有人要來您總要找出問題來嘛您不能老是一直給台式做然後呢平行形式的這樣給他做然後不斷去出錯最後是什麼最後就是部長您的感動到後來變成要去承接面對這些沸沸揚揚啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[105].start |
4296.161 |
| transcript.whisperx[105].end |
4314.241 |
| transcript.whisperx[105].text |
副部長我們要怎麼去解決這樣的問題我會整體檢討一下因為據我個人了解他這個費用真的是不高所以來飆的非常少因為飆的時候他會虧那台視是台灣第一家電視公司後來民營化之後他們很想要有那個形象所以他其實是 |
| transcript.whisperx[106].start |
4315.683 |
| transcript.whisperx[106].end |
4342.339 |
| transcript.whisperx[106].text |
很想要有形象現在這樣形象好嗎?所以我想部長這件事情我們還是真的要做出一個懲處那如果說您都知道說假設是因為預算經費太低沒有人要來那你就要去思考怎麼樣辦好一個典禮在足夠的經費之下讓更有能力的人來去承接那如果已經是不斷在犯錯不斷在出包造成這個典禮去蒙羞那甚至於引起這樣沸沸揚揚你就要去思考 |
| transcript.whisperx[107].start |
4342.679 |
| transcript.whisperx[107].end |
4342.879 |
| transcript.whisperx[107].text |
委員會主席 |
| transcript.whisperx[108].start |
4361.583 |
| transcript.whisperx[108].end |
4364.204 |
| transcript.whisperx[108].text |
文資保存、修復最需要人才但現在人才缺乏、人才斷層非常嚴重從教育面上來看大家都往AI方向走 |
| transcript.whisperx[109].start |
4382.009 |
| transcript.whisperx[109].end |
4384.372 |
| transcript.whisperx[109].text |
部長,您知不知道現在文化部的文化資產人才庫裡面有多少人? |
| transcript.whisperx[110].start |
4402.642 |
| transcript.whisperx[110].end |
4430.019 |
| transcript.whisperx[110].text |
細節我不清楚,但是我們最近才開過一個會,您剛剛講的問題是非常嚴重所以您不知道有多少人是嗎?那我告訴部長,我們現在的文資登錄的總數是3237人包括保存者、傳統匠師、醫生、古蹟修復、工程工地、負責人等但是部長,這個資料是文化部的資料庫但是我們有另外一個網站,這個網站是要提供給需要文資人才找尋的資料網站,您知道有這個網站嗎? |
| transcript.whisperx[111].start |
4431.22 |
| transcript.whisperx[111].end |
4431.42 |
| transcript.whisperx[111].text |
李遠列席 |
| transcript.whisperx[112].start |
4452.313 |
| transcript.whisperx[112].end |
4468.389 |
| transcript.whisperx[112].text |
而且這個2617個人這個網站當中啊這個人才庫竟然還有這個登錄已經過世的人啊所以我不理解第一個為什麼會有數字的落差第二個為什麼有過世的人我們還把他登錄在上面這是因為網站屬於更新還是美化數字 |
| transcript.whisperx[113].start |
4476.029 |
| transcript.whisperx[113].end |
4487.099 |
| transcript.whisperx[113].text |
這兩個數字可能我們在認定上面定義上面有一點落差就像剛才講到有的過世了但是我們要遵從它所以我們還是把它保留在上頭 |
| transcript.whisperx[114].start |
4487.719 |
| transcript.whisperx[114].end |
4511.781 |
| transcript.whisperx[114].text |
你說為什麼把他保留在上面?就是因為對他的尊崇啦,因為這是很好看的部長,我想這個回答你也聽到了來部長,我們在這個網站上面叫做人才庫人才庫是要供給有需要的人來這個人才庫來找人才,您同意我的說法嗎?我同意那我們把過世人放在這上面,那找人才的人來這個網站上面看有意義嗎?我想喔 |
| transcript.whisperx[115].start |
4513.622 |
| transcript.whisperx[115].end |
4525.454 |
| transcript.whisperx[115].text |
當時其實我們在調資料的時候文字局的答覆其實本席非常地不滿意他說這個是文字局的答覆他說文化部依照《文化資產法》第89條91條的登錄認定這個無形文化資產的這個保存者他這個過世之後基於剛回答的 |
| transcript.whisperx[116].start |
4533.482 |
| transcript.whisperx[116].end |
4550.763 |
| transcript.whisperx[116].text |
尊重其殊榮：所以保留於國家文化資產的網站人才庫啊結果呢 部長 您會不會去看一下89條 91條 完全沒有提到這個部分你們建文化部文資局給資料怎麼可以亂講亂答啊非常不尊重自己 更不尊重委員啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[117].start |
4551.684 |
| transcript.whisperx[117].end |
4578.78 |
| transcript.whisperx[117].text |
對不對?你對得起自己的專業嗎?亂講易通89條、91條哪有就這個來講好!本行上去找在93條可能還有一條比較相關的喔他是說這個93條規定保存者因為死亡變更解散或其他特殊理由無法執行前條之無形文化資產保存維護計畫主管機關得廢止該保存者之認定所以這個是說文化部是可以來廢止的喔那我們必須要講 |
| transcript.whisperx[118].start |
4579.82 |
| transcript.whisperx[118].end |
4604.235 |
| transcript.whisperx[118].text |
這個人才庫是要給有需要的人去找人才的但是我們對於剛剛所說的這個文資人才的殊榮的尊重我們要紀念他我們可以比如說在一些網站啦、史冊啦或者什麼樣的形式啊我們特別去紀念他讓大家想了解想看的那我們可以在這個地方來看所以不應該啊為了去美化這個數字前後數字都不攏給我們的法條啊這個也不對這樣有對嗎部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[119].start |
4607.488 |
| transcript.whisperx[119].end |
4629.534 |
| transcript.whisperx[119].text |
當然是不對,我想說非常感謝萬委員今天講這些細節,其實我一直覺得我們的文資保存要改變的地方還是蠻多,因為我自己有開過會,發現它也蠻多很嚴重的地方,包括為了我們能不能在制度面上鼓勵年輕人加入我們的修復,因為我們對於文資保存的工作給它一種榮耀感, |
| transcript.whisperx[120].start |
4630.474 |
| transcript.whisperx[120].end |
4649.84 |
| transcript.whisperx[120].text |
好 部長剛才說希望年輕人加入 我們就要講嘛你看喔 你現在真的非常缺人喔如果按照剛才你那個資料庫裡面說2617人扣掉已經過世寫在上面還有一些身份重疊的在裡面恐怕連2500都不到啦 本席認為啦那但是我們現在總共登錄的這個文化資產保存有6380件啦那2500人不到 |
| transcript.whisperx[121].start |
4653.681 |
| transcript.whisperx[121].end |
4654.141 |
| transcript.whisperx[121].text |
這個學院不曉得部長您知不知道 |
| transcript.whisperx[122].start |
4684.093 |
| transcript.whisperx[122].end |
4708.373 |
| transcript.whisperx[122].text |
這個學院我們透過這個計畫這個經費的補助的方式來補助那說號稱啊104年到112年有一萬多人次去上課但是呢部長上完課以後看起來很澎湃那上完課以後我們有沒有給他做認證再來培育出來的這個學員我們有沒有列入文資人才庫的數量是多少您知道嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[123].start |
4709.811 |
| transcript.whisperx[123].end |
4731.23 |
| transcript.whisperx[123].text |
對我真的搞不清楚我告訴您好不好這個數字啊您要不要自己說有多少人這個文資學院的人才他的性質跟我們你只要告訴我從這個文資人才您剛剛說這個文資學院出來的人有多少我們把它列入文資人才庫裡面有多少沒有沒有好部長0啊0 |
| transcript.whisperx[124].start |
4735.051 |
| transcript.whisperx[124].end |
4739.507 |
| transcript.whisperx[124].text |
是只有零也就是說我們有一萬多個人來上課上完課以後煙花一場 |
| transcript.whisperx[125].start |
4741.245 |
| transcript.whisperx[125].end |
4766.334 |
| transcript.whisperx[125].text |
編劃一場所以部長這些問題您剛接觸到您也重視了我覺得非常欣慰因為我們要面對問題喔所以我們如果啊找不到年輕的學生然後我們要那麼缺文資人才結果我們自己做的文資學院經費也變下去了最後進到人才庫只有零喔那我們也沒有去做相關的追蹤所以部長我想今天因為時間也到了喔那我希望啦齁我們不要有一些喔不管是我們金學長也好 |
| transcript.whisperx[126].start |
4766.914 |
| transcript.whisperx[126].end |
4784.036 |
| transcript.whisperx[126].text |
或者是我們在這個文資學院也好經費下去了那煙花一場過後我們留不下任何的東西我覺得這樣是不行的所以希望呢部長在人資的培育上面那能夠我們更嚴謹那才能夠跟得上我們現在需要文資人才的速度可以嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[127].start |
4784.797 |
| transcript.whisperx[127].end |
4791.898 |
| transcript.whisperx[127].text |
最後一句 文化部自己要重視好不好不要連那個數字都前後都不攏謝謝部長 謝謝謝謝你 謝謝謝謝 謝謝萬美玲委員好 部長請回接下來我們請羅廷維委員 |
| transcript.whisperx[128].start |
4822.234 |
| transcript.whisperx[128].end |
4824.456 |
| transcript.whisperx[128].text |
臺灣的歷史建物網友總是會這麼認為之前很常都會發生離奇的火災部長有稍微了解一下這個部分嗎? |
| transcript.whisperx[129].start |
4848.649 |
| transcript.whisperx[129].end |
4868.023 |
| transcript.whisperx[129].text |
我知道 早期一直有這個問題好 那國內古蹟歷史建築物主要火災的原因分為四項用火不慎、人為縱火、施工不當以及電氣因素廣義的來說就是自然跟人為的因素那人為的因素部分我們就會推測說是不是當我們老舊建物準備被評定為古蹟的時候 |
| transcript.whisperx[130].start |
4868.763 |
| transcript.whisperx[130].end |
4897.205 |
| transcript.whisperx[130].text |
就會受到文資法的保護周邊的建築物一併會受到影響連帶出現疑似人為縱火的案件出來也就是自然事件我們都知道108年4月巴黎聖母院發生火災以後起火的原因有兩說一個是電氣的故障一個是香煙的引燃那當然在這件事情出現以後文化部也很重視我們就成了就形成了一個有形文化資產防災守護方案目前還在辦理嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[131].start |
4898.641 |
| transcript.whisperx[131].end |
4924.496 |
| transcript.whisperx[131].text |
有具體的成效可不可以跟大家分享一下是不是請局長仔細報告一下這個有形化資產防災我們是跟相關部會像消防署還有那個警政署我們就這樣的方案我們定期做消防的演練還有聯繫的匯報大概都是會召開這樣子那對於所有各種可能的狀況包括我們現在已經協調各警局在各個文字點設置那個巡邏箱還有 |
| transcript.whisperx[132].start |
4927.498 |
| transcript.whisperx[132].end |
4953.783 |
| transcript.whisperx[132].text |
還有我們加強就是所有人跟管理人怎麼樣做維護管理就是守護這些文化資產那近幾年確實有相對的減少失火的一個頻率我們有感受到但是聖母願知大火之後很快的在7月文資局和國家地震工程研究中心國家災害防救科技中心等相關單位建置了文化資產災害情資網於是我看了這個網站的內容 |
| transcript.whisperx[133].start |
4955.043 |
| transcript.whisperx[133].end |
4956.184 |
| transcript.whisperx[133].text |
有掌握嗎?那為什麼沒有列入?沒有想到 |
| transcript.whisperx[134].start |
4972.844 |
| transcript.whisperx[134].end |
4991.839 |
| transcript.whisperx[134].text |
我們可以來考慮把它納進去我舉最近的一個例子就是2023年屏東空訊中心大武營區的正氣樓就發生了人為縱火木造的屋頂木窗等燒毀面積約100坪但我在網站上從頭到尾都找不到相關的資料然後我把縣市的數據從屏東縣拉回到 |
| transcript.whisperx[135].start |
4992.219 |
| transcript.whisperx[135].end |
5008.368 |
| transcript.whisperx[135].text |
不拘縣市．得到的也都是淹水、建物結構傾斜、裂縫等．人來沒有看到火災的部分．是防災中心勾結不到文化部的一個資訊．還是文化部根本從頭到尾都沒有將資訊列管．以至於無法提供相關資料給防災中心 |
| transcript.whisperx[136].start |
5010.365 |
| transcript.whisperx[136].end |
5025.151 |
| transcript.whisperx[136].text |
委員剛才那個防災中心那個網站啊主要是以天然災害為主天然災害為主像地震啊颱風等等那我想如果人為的部分我可以考慮把它在另外再把它拉進去我個人認為人為的他也應該要列入讓大家能夠知道 |
| transcript.whisperx[137].start |
5026.755 |
| transcript.whisperx[137].end |
5047.611 |
| transcript.whisperx[137].text |
可以認同嗎?我想當時公共政策網路參與平台民眾提出了建議希望能夠立法規定遭遇火災的文化資產及其用地100年不得做修復原狀以外的用途以杜絕有心人士藉由縱火進行炒地的事情部長您知道這件事情嗎? |
| transcript.whisperx[138].start |
5050.357 |
| transcript.whisperx[138].end |
5069.834 |
| transcript.whisperx[138].text |
網路所發起的這個活動知道文化部回應希望透過有形文化資產防災守護方案推動降低各為人為疏失還有災害的因應未來日益劇烈的一個氣候變遷的挑戰守護國家無可替代的一個重要文化資產用這樣子的一個方式來做一個回應 |
| transcript.whisperx[139].start |
5070.535 |
| transcript.whisperx[139].end |
5095.225 |
| transcript.whisperx[139].text |
如果說自然災害和國家地震工程研究中心國家災害防救科技中心等單位要列管的話那文化部也應該要把火災的部分羅列進去部長您覺得呢應該是那而不是說今天你提報了一個有形文化資產的一個防護手一個方案但只做了半套部長能夠承諾本席盤點將相關的一個資料一併列入嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[140].start |
5096.207 |
| transcript.whisperx[140].end |
5122.128 |
| transcript.whisperx[140].text |
是沒問題接下來我想要跟部長再探討的是接下來我們有關心這個文化資產價值的一個評估問題有三個層次第一個層次是法律面我想文資保護法第15條公有建築物我們在這個部分簡單來跟大家分享就是公有建物公有土地的建築物在新建完50年後如果有要處分例如拆除都應該要進行文化資產的評估價值 |
| transcript.whisperx[141].start |
5123.809 |
| transcript.whisperx[141].end |
5149.249 |
| transcript.whisperx[141].text |
但是去年呢我們7月文化部就遭到監察院的糾正全台灣2萬棟50年工有建築物只有353棟提送文化價值的一個評估這6年來拆掉的有兩成都是沒有辦理文化價值評估根本就是違法拆除被監察院認定這個有重大疏失那有要求確實的檢討部長您覺得這個嚴不嚴重我們是不是應該要做一個 |
| transcript.whisperx[142].start |
5153.632 |
| transcript.whisperx[142].end |
5154.693 |
| transcript.whisperx[142].text |
50年公有建築物貸補償高達99% |
| transcript.whisperx[143].start |
5181.932 |
| transcript.whisperx[143].end |
5205.537 |
| transcript.whisperx[143].text |
所以我想這個文化資產我們不是只是法律面訂定而已我們實際的執行面的確看起來是有很大的一個差距我想這個部分我們是不是應該檢討一下部長您覺得呢是 因為它那個執行面真的是很困難因為它量那麼大的一個50年的建築在台灣來講非常多我覺得在鑑定上跟人力上可能相當不足所以這個要檢討 |
| transcript.whisperx[144].start |
5206.337 |
| transcript.whisperx[144].end |
5231.58 |
| transcript.whisperx[144].text |
我想問執法第14條主管機關應定期普查程序的檢查列冊追蹤到底有沒有涵蓋到50年工有建築物卻兩次獲得不同的一個說法111年12月16日回復說法令上無規範112年2月15日又回復說包含在裡面各縣市根本無法追蹤那部長你可不可以給我一個確定的答案你覺得呢50年工有建築物到底是不是用第14條 |
| transcript.whisperx[145].start |
5234.466 |
| transcript.whisperx[145].end |
5252.047 |
| transcript.whisperx[145].text |
要不要補查?定期檢查要多久一次?這14條跟15條其實兩個是不同性質的那個內容解釋是不一樣的那15條我先補充一下第15條完檢察院的糾正裡面最主要現在是縣市政府的各局處的橫向聯繫不夠我們已經是一個一個通韓各縣市 |
| transcript.whisperx[146].start |
5252.748 |
| transcript.whisperx[146].end |
5253.688 |
| transcript.whisperx[146].text |
公有建築物是否使用第14條 |
| transcript.whisperx[147].start |
5278.319 |
| transcript.whisperx[147].end |
5280.162 |
| transcript.whisperx[147].text |
我們現在普查跟定期檢查你們有訂定一個內部的規範嗎? |
| transcript.whisperx[148].start |
5293.235 |
| transcript.whisperx[148].end |
5315.804 |
| transcript.whisperx[148].text |
50年建築物要普查定期追蹤我們有沒有去訂定然後要求我們的下面的各縣市主管機關去處理我們有跟一些行政指導的一些規範都有去跟他們做溝通但是目前我們看到普查率還有高達99%因為剛才部長講的確是人力地方縣市政府的人力還有橫向溝通的確這方面是實質上是有一些困難 |
| transcript.whisperx[149].start |
5316.184 |
| transcript.whisperx[149].end |
5342.194 |
| transcript.whisperx[149].text |
那我希望是不是未來有機會有這樣子的一個招募能力的一個計畫能夠來銜接這樣子的人力讓我們這50年的建築物趕緊來做一個普查有沒有這個計畫可以來產生我們的補助我們很多的補助案件裡面都包含了這一些相關的機制包括有一些像考古遺址的巡查、古蹟的巡查還有專案服務團隊這一方面都是一些補充人力的還有專業技術的一種做法 |
| transcript.whisperx[150].start |
5342.794 |
| transcript.whisperx[150].end |
5361.89 |
| transcript.whisperx[150].text |
我們希望在這個各縣市能夠在文化部的一個督導下有一個執行層面的一個問題我想包括雲林縣人力辦理的一個統計南投縣嘉義縣表示他們根本沒有相關的數據也就是在拆除之前他們根本不清楚自己拆的到底是不是50年的一個建築物所以這就是橫向聯繫的一個問題我希望文化部能夠有所作為能夠來協助處理 |
| transcript.whisperx[151].start |
5366.994 |
| transcript.whisperx[151].end |
5390.956 |
| transcript.whisperx[151].text |
我想執行面有這樣的一個狀況我們文化部應該要痛定思痛去想辦法協助處理那當然第三個我們應借盡國外建築物遺產價值評估的一個系統我希望文化部能夠做到我想文資法的施行細則指出啊處分前要通知主管機關進行文化的價值評估具體的做法就是邀請學者或審議委員辦理勘查做成一個結果記錄 |
| transcript.whisperx[152].start |
5392.697 |
| transcript.whisperx[152].end |
5418.337 |
| transcript.whisperx[152].text |
那主管機關再來判定是否列冊追蹤登錄審查或其他的事故來列冊來做一個列管實施然而目前對於專家學者的定義專案一個內容以及他的職業倫理職務的執行細則都沒有明確的做一個規範比如說怎麼樣算是有價值以目前的股期指定及廢止的審查辦法為例現在寫的只要廣泛 |
| transcript.whisperx[153].start |
5420.163 |
| transcript.whisperx[153].end |
5444.262 |
| transcript.whisperx[153].text |
範圍具高度的歷史、藝術及科學價值表現各時代營造技術的流派特色者具稀少性不易再現者這三條基準且符合其一之一舉例來說張化縣的大興鳳梨商市會社是典型的文資爭議事件部長您知道這個事件嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[154].start |
5447.403 |
| transcript.whisperx[154].end |
5467.556 |
| transcript.whisperx[154].text |
我想當時文資委員做現場的勘察的時候認定這個大興商市外觀形式簡潔臨街立面無繁複的一個裝飾常見於彰化市區的主要道路不具稀少性特殊性但文資團體認為大興鳳梨商市會社為彰化市 |
| transcript.whisperx[155].start |
5471.559 |
| transcript.whisperx[155].end |
5498.035 |
| transcript.whisperx[155].text |
竟存聯動式現代風格折衷樣式的一個解無具有稀少珍貴藝術的價值同樣是稀少性主管機關跟文字團體的解讀完全相反無法就客觀來而引發了一個爭議我想這個部分我們是不是可以參考國外的建築價值評估系統例如加拿大建築他們有一個 |
| transcript.whisperx[156].start |
5499.178 |
| transcript.whisperx[156].end |
5515.017 |
| transcript.whisperx[156].text |
建築史、歷史、環境、使用、相關的價值、真實性的價值五項指標來作為分級評分分為A、B、C也就是所謂的75到100分、50到74分相關的一個分組來做一個四個組別 |
| transcript.whisperx[157].start |
5519.502 |
| transcript.whisperx[157].end |
5519.522 |
| transcript.whisperx[157].text |
委員會長 |
| transcript.whisperx[158].start |
5536.115 |
| transcript.whisperx[158].end |
5557.763 |
| transcript.whisperx[158].text |
我想羅委員你剛才講這些東西,我想我們一定要痛聽思痛的來檢討,因為剛才你講的那幾個建,長來的專家委員他們每個人都不同的專業,所以他們評定方式是不一樣的,那這點我很謝謝你的建議,我們應該是參考一些更科學的一些制度跟方法,讓那個評定比較有根據。 |
| transcript.whisperx[159].start |
5558.763 |
| transcript.whisperx[159].end |
5578.798 |
| transcript.whisperx[159].text |
好,謝謝部長正面的回應我想就是我剛剛說的接近國外的建築物遺產的一個價值評估系統希望更有效的去做這樣子的一個評估我們當然尊重不管是文史團體或者是學者去做的一個評估但是我們希望的是在這個過程當中能夠更謹慎小心的去做評估不要讓我們任何遺留 |
| transcript.whisperx[160].start |
5579.278 |
| transcript.whisperx[160].end |
5579.918 |
| transcript.whisperx[160].text |
謝謝羅廷偉委員謝謝部長請回 |
| transcript.whisperx[161].start |
5608.874 |
| transcript.whisperx[161].end |
5624.292 |
| transcript.whisperx[161].text |
我們接下來請葛如君委員謝謝主席 有請部長有請部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[162].start |
5630.172 |
| transcript.whisperx[162].end |
5659.292 |
| transcript.whisperx[162].text |
各位委員你好部長好今天艷陽高照但是我們的文化在AI的世界裡頭卻可能見不得光我想先請教一下部長我們今天文化資產我相信應該是大家都同意對內具有教育跟歷史的意義對外則有提升台灣國際的知名度發展觀光的重要功能我想請教你假設國外的朋友想要到台灣進行文化的深度旅遊 |
| transcript.whisperx[163].start |
5660.292 |
| transcript.whisperx[163].end |
5660.953 |
| transcript.whisperx[163].text |
請問我們台灣目前有多少國定古蹟 |
| transcript.whisperx[164].start |
5678.573 |
| transcript.whisperx[164].end |
5700.941 |
| transcript.whisperx[164].text |
那以下我們找了這個華爾街日報比較各個評比比較熱門的幾個AI加上我們的台德我們讓他做了一些回覆那我們想請教一下部長當中何者的答覆比較是正確答案或者比較接近正確的答案部長要不要感受一下AI跟人類的差距有沒有哪一個是比較接近正確的 |
| transcript.whisperx[165].start |
5706.633 |
| transcript.whisperx[165].end |
5707.293 |
| transcript.whisperx[165].text |
請舉出幾個台灣的國定古蹟 |
| transcript.whisperx[166].start |
5733.505 |
| transcript.whisperx[166].end |
5750.283 |
| transcript.whisperx[166].text |
這是AI的答覆看看部長您覺得這幾組答案裡面有哪幾個AI的工具回答是完全正確的嗎前面四個就是國際在評比的時候經常在使用的那下面最後這個台德是我們台灣自己做的 |
| transcript.whisperx[167].start |
5751.164 |
| transcript.whisperx[167].end |
5771.225 |
| transcript.whisperx[167].text |
三跟四比較對三跟四比較對是不是Cobiler跟Gemini這個我想文化部對於文資保存的這個主題顯然是做了非常多的功課沒有錯在三跟四的答案是完全正確的那有點可惜我們這個台灣自己做的台德答覆是錯誤的故宮博物院並不是我們的國定古蹟 |
| transcript.whisperx[168].start |
5772.486 |
| transcript.whisperx[168].end |
5789.595 |
| transcript.whisperx[168].text |
那我想部長我相信你也相當了解啦其實我自己從進到立法院以來就一再強調開放資料的重要性您答對了文化部也答對了但我們AI竟然答錯了表示什麼呢表示他們得到的資訊可能不夠完整 |
| transcript.whisperx[169].start |
5790.835 |
| transcript.whisperx[169].end |
5808.306 |
| transcript.whisperx[169].text |
我一直在講如果我擁有蒙娜麗莎這幅畫我會作為擁有者會做出來最錯誤的決定就是禁止它被印在T恤或馬克杯上面因為這樣再過50年或再過500年全世界就沒有人再知道蒙娜麗莎這幅畫 |
| transcript.whisperx[170].start |
5809.646 |
| transcript.whisperx[170].end |
5835.687 |
| transcript.whisperx[170].text |
開放是文化唯一的生存之道開放越多人知道才有越多的人想要一清方擇並且認識它、擁抱它從前面我們詢問AI兩個問題裡面我們其實就已經發現了AI工具的回答不完全正確一部分的原因可能是資料過久沒有更新另外一部分的原因其實很可能是我們的相關部會對於AI去開放 |
| transcript.whisperx[171].start |
5836.087 |
| transcript.whisperx[171].end |
5861.763 |
| transcript.whisperx[171].text |
文化資產保存的資料讓他去學習可能不夠完整不夠主動不夠積極導致有一些相關的錯誤部長我想請教您手中正有握有著全世界或者文化部握有全世界獨一無二的瑰寶就是我們台灣的文化資產您是否願意更主動積極的向全世界以及全世界的AI開放台灣豐富的文化涵養 |
| transcript.whisperx[172].start |
5862.443 |
| transcript.whisperx[172].end |
5863.746 |
| transcript.whisperx[172].text |
這點我要先了解一下法例 |
| transcript.whisperx[173].start |
5872.216 |
| transcript.whisperx[173].end |
5893.908 |
| transcript.whisperx[173].text |
因為我個人的意願好像我還得考慮這個法律問題制作權等等我想法律是要隨著時代改變我們現在就在立法院所以如果您覺得法律有什麼希望我們可以一起來協作部長如果您也同意這樣的方向是不是能夠提出具體的像AI開放文化資料的期程 |
| transcript.whisperx[174].start |
5894.688 |
| transcript.whisperx[174].end |
5912.825 |
| transcript.whisperx[174].text |
法律哪裡有問題我們一起來努力嘛尤其台德我們剛剛看到的一個答錯的是台灣開發的第一個深層式的AI我個人非常支持政府也應該全力支持但是從回答內容來看台德自己作為台灣我們自己開發的AI資料卻是AI裡面最舊的 |
| transcript.whisperx[175].start |
5913.866 |
| transcript.whisperx[175].end |
5914.227 |
| transcript.whisperx[175].text |
我們會研究這部分 |
| transcript.whisperx[176].start |
5929.063 |
| transcript.whisperx[176].end |
5944.02 |
| transcript.whisperx[176].text |
接下來談到文資保存,其實文化部依《文化資產保存法》委託成立的國定股基分區專業服務團隊想請教一下部長是否有掌握目前國定股基分區專業服務團隊的成員人數一共有幾人? |
| transcript.whisperx[177].start |
5948.763 |
| transcript.whisperx[177].end |
5974.65 |
| transcript.whisperx[177].text |
這個32個很好齁32人的團隊要負責全國111處的國定古蹟的巡檢輔導建立個案資料還要定期更新人力非常的吃緊齁其實目前國內外我們剛剛只是講說我們可以主動提供資料給AI可是AI也可以主動積極的來幫助我們我們來看一下國內外有幾個用AI工具運用文資保存的案例 |
| transcript.whisperx[178].start |
5975.95 |
| transcript.whisperx[178].end |
6001.975 |
| transcript.whisperx[178].text |
日本在2020年起日本的文化廳運用AI來檢查城樓、寺院、古宅等等文化廳也說他們也面臨到人員緊縮、老齡化的問題希望透過AI用數據累積的方式不只協助巡查還協助預判未來什麼樣的情況、什麼樣的氣候可能會面臨到需要修理的情況 |
| transcript.whisperx[179].start |
6002.995 |
| transcript.whisperx[179].end |
6029.854 |
| transcript.whisperx[179].text |
再來我們看法國2019年一把大火讓800多年歷史的聖母院複製一具但是還好我作為一個阿宅真的覺得還好我們有玩遊戲遊戲公司之前在做遊戲的時候有做了全面3D VR的掃描導致這個高解析度的巴黎聖母院有被虛擬化AI化使得聖母院得以進行更快速的災後修復的工作 |
| transcript.whisperx[180].start |
6030.695 |
| transcript.whisperx[180].end |
6054.943 |
| transcript.whisperx[180].text |
在臺灣,2021年嘉義市政府有跟雲科大合作去建置這個所謂的戶外AI智慧古物監測保存系統,透過AI來進行變形或者傾斜狀況的紀錄以及監測。那2022年雲科大的團隊更開發出全台首部AI文物智慧巡檢機器人,跟苗栗縣政府合作。想請教一下部長, |
| transcript.whisperx[181].start |
6055.603 |
| transcript.whisperx[181].end |
6061.606 |
| transcript.whisperx[181].text |
近5年來,文化部有沒有推動有關運用AI科技協助文資保存的計畫?現在有沒有? |
| transcript.whisperx[182].start |
6083.399 |
| transcript.whisperx[182].end |
6095.555 |
| transcript.whisperx[182].text |
確實我們詢問貴部說近5年這個文資局雖然尚無使用AI進行保存的計畫但也希望未來可以來做評議為什麼文化部向行政院爭取到歷史與文化資產維護發展計畫第5期 |
| transcript.whisperx[183].start |
6097.937 |
| transcript.whisperx[183].end |
6121.449 |
| transcript.whisperx[183].text |
6年的計劃總經費高達160億從今年開始施行那我是希望能不能請部長來研議一下能夠運用AI科技來協助文化保存納入這一次的跨年期的計劃當中這個有沒有機會來研議我想我們會沒有問題委員你的建議非常好我們會納入那個優先 |
| transcript.whisperx[184].start |
6121.969 |
| transcript.whisperx[184].end |
6122.309 |
| transcript.whisperx[184].text |
文資保存部門 |
| transcript.whisperx[185].start |
6141.758 |
| transcript.whisperx[185].end |
6160.938 |
| transcript.whisperx[185].text |
做起至少禁用一名AI的人才並且用AI協助文資保存讓我們古蹟服務團隊的人力可以變成33加N等於是多一個AI的人才再運用AI等於去擴大人類的能力甚至無限擴增有沒有機會來研議 |
| transcript.whisperx[186].start |
6162.99 |
| transcript.whisperx[186].end |
6164.591 |
| transcript.whisperx[186].text |
接下來要看部長談一個很重要的議題 文化平權我們剛剛講的只是普及 但是我們現在要來講平權 |
| transcript.whisperx[187].start |
6183.104 |
| transcript.whisperx[187].end |
6203.152 |
| transcript.whisperx[187].text |
近年來文化部致力於推動文化平權每年花費約7億元的預算想請教一下部長除了消米實體世界中的歧視和偏見文化部對於虛擬世界對AI世界的文化平權有沒有提出相關的政策規劃有沒有計劃要投入相應的經費這點我想請資產來講 |
| transcript.whisperx[188].start |
6208.676 |
| transcript.whisperx[188].end |
6235.387 |
| transcript.whisperx[188].text |
委員好那謝謝委員的指教那目前我們文化平權這個預算的推動確實是比較著重在一些實體的場域跟活動那委員這個部分的話我們會納入我們今年至於往後的一個推動的一個重點謝謝在這邊想提醒各位官員我們在社群媒體的時代已經見證了Digital Media社群媒體對人類的認知產生的影響是巨大且快速的 |
| transcript.whisperx[189].start |
6236.247 |
| transcript.whisperx[189].end |
6257.806 |
| transcript.whisperx[189].text |
AI絕對不會更慢指揮更快而且更隱性歐盟已經講了會有輕推的作用這個輕推會是微小但是巨大的影響而且我們看不見為什麼會來提醒部長除了實體世界以外我們也要重視虛擬世界AI世界的平權呢在這邊我們特地準備了幾張AI繪製的圖片我們首先請AI繪製了兩張醫生的圖片 |
| transcript.whisperx[190].start |
6263.01 |
| transcript.whisperx[190].end |
6289.88 |
| transcript.whisperx[190].text |
我們再請AI繪製了兩張護理師的圖片我們再請AI再畫了兩張公車司機的圖片我們再請AI畫了兩張空服人員的圖片我們再請AI畫了兩張保姆的圖片我們再請AI畫了兩張副總統的圖片我們用中文大家可以看一下 |
| transcript.whisperx[191].start |
6290.839 |
| transcript.whisperx[191].end |
6300.317 |
| transcript.whisperx[191].text |
最後我們還讓他來了一張剛剛所有角色的大合照請教一下部長有沒有發現這些圖片有沒有奇怪的地方有就是性別上大家有些偏見嘛 |
| transcript.whisperx[192].start |
6304.087 |
| transcript.whisperx[192].end |
6324.656 |
| transcript.whisperx[192].text |
沒錯,首先這些圖片帶有性別刻板印象醫生被預設為男性護理師被預設為女性而且一向面容較好公車司機一定是男性空服人員保姆則一定是女性還有副總統我們畫的四張全部是男性其實這些圖片很可能還隱藏了種族歧視 |
| transcript.whisperx[193].start |
6325.296 |
| transcript.whisperx[193].end |
6345.572 |
| transcript.whisperx[193].text |
所有的職業．除了建築工人．有色人種以外．幾乎全部是白人．圖片當中亞洲人的身影寥寥無幾．明顯與真實世界的情況．當然也跟台灣的情況不符．部長您可以稍微思考一下．AI的偏見是如何產生．我們再來看一下文化的部分．請教一下部長以下的圖片．能不能分辨出哪一位是新娘．中間的事實上全部都是 |
| transcript.whisperx[194].start |
6353.581 |
| transcript.whisperx[194].end |
6374.922 |
| transcript.whisperx[194].text |
地球上明明有那麼多元的文化每種文化都有風格獨具的儀式但是我們如果請AI畫出新娘禮服的話連畫恩賜全部都長一個樣子所以我想其實史丹佛大學研究已經發現AI在開發的階段他所學習的數據跟文化大多不包括亞洲國家 |
| transcript.whisperx[195].start |
6376.241 |
| transcript.whisperx[195].end |
6397.461 |
| transcript.whisperx[195].text |
這會導致他們對這個世界的認知是有偏差的我們認為AI帶有偏見的情況應該要受到政府相關部門尤其文化部門的重視歐美國家想要藉由AI工具將西方的文化塑造成主流文化未來可能會有所謂的AI文化殖民引發在之後 |
| transcript.whisperx[196].start |
6398.522 |
| transcript.whisperx[196].end |
6420.134 |
| transcript.whisperx[196].text |
我們在今天也看到了中研院院士孔祥崇先生有提到台灣擁有民主、多元、自由的價值我們認為AI應該要結合文化、要結合民主、要結合平權黃恩勳先生說台灣是AI的中心這雖然是一句褒獎但何嘗不是一種提醒 |
| transcript.whisperx[197].start |
6421.266 |
| transcript.whisperx[197].end |
6439.959 |
| transcript.whisperx[197].text |
只有文化開放只有提供資訊讓文化AI來學習才能夠落實虛擬世界AI世界的文化平權讓台灣不要淪落為所謂文化的邊陲我們台灣不要只做AI的機房90%的AI的機器是台灣做的 |
| transcript.whisperx[198].start |
6440.419 |
| transcript.whisperx[198].end |
6466.954 |
| transcript.whisperx[198].text |
我們未來有沒有可能：文化裡面有90%的華文化是由臺灣來提供出來的部長能不能承諾接下來文化部將會投入資源進行虛擬世界AI世界的文化普及、文化平權我們能不能一起來努力消彌虛擬世界裡頭一切大、七、小、文化殖民、AI殖民的刻板印象跟歧視有沒有機會我們一起努力謝謝葛委員這個真的非常重要我們會列入我們未來的施政的一些考慮 |
| transcript.whisperx[199].start |
6471.09 |
| transcript.whisperx[199].end |
6479.659 |
| transcript.whisperx[199].text |
開放資料,讓AI認識真正的台灣,認識真正的人類文化謝謝部長,我們一起為文化平權的努力,感謝謝謝,謝謝葛委員好,謝謝葛如君委員,部長請回那等一下在吳佩奕委員質詢完,我們休息五分鐘我們接下來請陳培宇委員 |
| transcript.whisperx[200].start |
6499.394 |
| transcript.whisperx[200].end |
6502.917 |
| transcript.whisperx[200].text |
謝謝主席 那有請部長 謝謝好 有請部長陳委員好部長雖然我的題目沒有含剛剛葛委員的題目可是我想要echo一下之前我們在跟國科會談泰的模型的時候我們就有拜託國科會一定要協同文化部來協助開發台灣的泰的模型因為剛剛葛委員所舉的例子 |
| transcript.whisperx[201].start |
6525.339 |
| transcript.whisperx[201].end |
6540.647 |
| transcript.whisperx[201].text |
有很大一部分是因為我們人類在下關鍵字的時候我們自己就被自己單一的思維所侷限了例如說我要叫他產生一個副總統的圖像我其實可以多給他一點關鍵字例如說女性40到50歲 |
| transcript.whisperx[202].start |
6542.328 |
| transcript.whisperx[202].end |
6560.071 |
| transcript.whisperx[202].text |
亞洲人膚色什麼透過我對這件事情的認識是我去教會那個生成模型所以這個部分我也要提一下不是AI本身出了問題是在使用它的人有沒有意識到自己正在用什麼樣的邏輯跟他對話所以台灣的TED模型真的需要文化部給予協助所以 |
| transcript.whisperx[203].start |
6561.232 |
| transcript.whisperx[203].end |
6578.138 |
| transcript.whisperx[203].text |
之前我們跟國科會談過但我不確定國科會找你們了沒有那我想後續我們辦公室也會持續透過跨部會的協調希望在這件事情上讓臺灣的態度模型可以做得更好做得更多這個部分請問一下部長可以簡單回應一下嗎?他們需要資料他們需要繁中的資料我想他們可能自己在這件事情上的認知還需要更多文化部的協助那我們辦公室也會積極的追蹤 |
| transcript.whisperx[204].start |
6590.903 |
| transcript.whisperx[204].end |
6592.243 |
| transcript.whisperx[204].text |
這點我想請文智集團回答好 謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[205].start |
6617.976 |
| transcript.whisperx[205].end |
6633.967 |
| transcript.whisperx[205].text |
委員現在目前各地的這種工程開發的案子遇到了疑似考古遺址也是案件也不少這裡面當然在程序上還是要按照文資法的規範裡面有些要先停工這個我都知道我想問就這個case來說你們有什麼規劃嗎或者是目前你們跟他們當地因為目前他們是委託臺大團隊來協助嘛那臺大團隊這邊會不會回報任何訊息給你們因為過往曾經有一個比較近的案例是後來就開成了南科館 |
| transcript.whisperx[206].start |
6645.134 |
| transcript.whisperx[206].end |
6645.574 |
| transcript.whisperx[206].text |
文化資產保存法施行事項 |
| transcript.whisperx[207].start |
6675.1 |
| transcript.whisperx[207].end |
6676.821 |
| transcript.whisperx[207].text |
我們看到新聞說若實轉型正義中正紀念堂一對要撤出要從所謂的在裡面操演改到自由廣場上來操演 |
| transcript.whisperx[208].start |
6699.469 |
| transcript.whisperx[208].end |
6699.909 |
| transcript.whisperx[208].text |
主要是大家一直 |
| transcript.whisperx[209].start |
6722.731 |
| transcript.whisperx[209].end |
6739.219 |
| transcript.whisperx[209].text |
整個中正紀念壇的轉型正義的方式其實我們文化部已經進行很久了包括裡面的展示內容包括整個台灣的自由民主的過程等等那是內容的部分可是在外觀上大家一直對三軍儀隊在組團裡面對那個 |
| transcript.whisperx[210].start |
6744.401 |
| transcript.whisperx[210].end |
6767.138 |
| transcript.whisperx[210].text |
對同向致敬這件事情有不同的意見認為說我們不應該像一個有威權但有威權的一個同向致敬它的確是一個問題但是我們又考慮到觀光客很喜歡看到這樣的過程那是不是不應該在同向前面看到把它換個地方有更多人可以看到而且他們本身三軍一隊也不會走得更遠更麻煩 |
| transcript.whisperx[211].start |
6769.44 |
| transcript.whisperx[211].end |
6796.136 |
| transcript.whisperx[211].text |
其實我們這個怎麼走怎麼來我們已經來去我們文化部跟國安部已經試了好多路線最終最終我們要考慮一個這些三軍儀隊本身的表演很自然第二還是能夠更吸引觀光客第三也是考慮民眾上的觀感他能接受基本上我剛剛前面有講到說歷史上留下來的一些威權的建築 |
| transcript.whisperx[212].start |
6797.762 |
| transcript.whisperx[212].end |
6819.043 |
| transcript.whisperx[212].text |
每一個社會都有不同的族群對它兩極的看法作為一個政府尤其是文化部在處理這種事情的時候我們必須非常小心的處理否則的話它會變成是一個簡單言之我不希望處理之後變成是一個撕裂族群的一個更嚴重的事情我希望處理得很好以後 |
| transcript.whisperx[213].start |
6820.011 |
| transcript.whisperx[213].end |
6840.086 |
| transcript.whisperx[213].text |
他會成為一個歷史的過程好像翻一本書我們又翻到新的一頁去了我們不要再糾結在這些兩極的看法所以我上次為什麼會在一上任就講說他的生活方式他的改造對於中央經濟團未來的想像他有各種想像 |
| transcript.whisperx[214].start |
6840.686 |
| transcript.whisperx[214].end |
6865.664 |
| transcript.whisperx[214].text |
他不是一定是現在這個狀況他有各種可能的改變那這個都列入我們未來的思考好 謝謝部長我剛剛保留了這麼多時間用掉我自己的時間讓部長談這件事情就是我覺得論述這件事情整體的一致性或者是整體的全面關照這件事情部長您剛舉了幾個族群一個是觀光客一個是台灣一般民眾的觀感 |
| transcript.whisperx[215].start |
6866.204 |
| transcript.whisperx[215].end |
6881.252 |
| transcript.whisperx[215].text |
那一旦談到觀光是不是文化部要跟觀光局去討論觀光客到底喜歡看什麼那喜歡看儀隊表演我可以理解可是儀隊的表演在全世界各種樣態如果文化部是為了照顧觀光的需求甚且要去想像儀隊內容是不是要改變 |
| transcript.whisperx[216].start |
6881.972 |
| transcript.whisperx[216].end |
6899.149 |
| transcript.whisperx[216].text |
如果是為了照顧族群大家可以一致的對話站在一個可對話的平台上可討論的平台上來看待這個那又回到另外一個面向要去做的事情所以對於把這個一對操演移到戶外這件事情我更關注的就是文化部自己整體的論述一定要站得住腳 |
| transcript.whisperx[217].start |
6899.75 |
| transcript.whisperx[217].end |
6927.171 |
| transcript.whisperx[217].text |
因為如同部長您說的過去大家習慣在兩邊的光譜上極左跟極右大家各自對話各自發述但是可能沒有對話的空間我很感謝部長你想要促成對話而一旦要促成對話相關的論述又請文化部要發展得更完整那才有機會再促成觀光也好造成大家更多的對話造成大家更多的討論大家更團結以致為台灣那我都覺得這是好事可是相關的論述我覺得這樣聽起來文化部還要更加油好嗎好 謝謝部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[218].start |
6930.946 |
| transcript.whisperx[218].end |
6957.098 |
| transcript.whisperx[218].text |
前一陣子 文化部辦了媒體查會 裡面就有記者談到了圖書折扣秩序制因為我不在那個查會現場 我只有看到相關的報導我相信當場的媒體 絕對不會只有問這個問題但是這個問題 被好幾個媒體 特別拿出來寫那當天呢 次長跟部長都有各自回答我很感謝部長你說 這可能有公平交易的問題但是我想要說的是 其實圖書統一定價制或是折扣秩序制這件事情 |
| transcript.whisperx[219].start |
6958.118 |
| transcript.whisperx[219].end |
6974.395 |
| transcript.whisperx[219].text |
在文化部過往10年前曾經有過研究去年也發報做相關研究但是這個研究背後我想要提出我自己的觀點有一些問題我們來說每次只要提到問卷然後有消費者反應不想要被定價綁住這件事情但我很好奇 |
| transcript.whisperx[220].start |
6974.955 |
| transcript.whisperx[220].end |
6997.826 |
| transcript.whisperx[220].text |
我們的問卷真的有告訴消費者其實臺灣的圖書出版業者早在10年前為了應付消費者喜歡買打折書這件事情早早在10幾年前就已經把圖書定價提高了嗎為了配合消費者就連在我自己辦的公聽會上有一個專門賣折扣套書的出版社都在公聽會上說啊這臺灣人很愛CP值啊我把書訂到6000然後打折變2000消費者買單買得不得了 |
| transcript.whisperx[221].start |
7004.089 |
| transcript.whisperx[221].end |
7022.877 |
| transcript.whisperx[221].text |
這個事情大家早就知道但是在文化部的問卷裡面我很好奇當我們去問一個消費者說你喜不喜歡書有打折你看到書沒有打折你有什麼心情我們根本沒有告訴一般消費者這個背景知識再往下看韓國開始實施圖書定價制之後其實他們整體的業績只上升了兩億 |
| transcript.whisperx[222].start |
7023.777 |
| transcript.whisperx[222].end |
7049.064 |
| transcript.whisperx[222].text |
其實並沒有很多可是他們卻造成了另外一個意外的現象就是他們圖書出版的書種變多圖書的市場變得更多元有大眾的主流的主題有小眾的單獨的市場也需要被照顧到而且在圖書出版也被照顧到了前兩天在中國的直播平台上有一個諾貝爾獎的得獎他的書在直播間好像不到4個小時賣出了11萬本 |
| transcript.whisperx[223].start |
7052.245 |
| transcript.whisperx[223].end |
7058.334 |
| transcript.whisperx[223].text |
可是出版社已經告訴大家我們不是要透過直播間賣出11萬本的書來賺錢我們其實是賠錢的也就是說打折去賣書這件事情出版社很痛很賠錢可是他想要造成的是廣告效應 |
| transcript.whisperx[224].start |
7068.328 |
| transcript.whisperx[224].end |
7082.414 |
| transcript.whisperx[224].text |
所以我想要告訴部長也想要拜託部長您來自出版界來自相關的基層藝術表演界你一定知道打折這件事情對所有的文化產業內容的創作者是多麼大的打擊絕對不是只有在出版產業 |
| transcript.whisperx[225].start |
7083.354 |
| transcript.whisperx[225].end |
7096.748 |
| transcript.whisperx[225].text |
更何況文化部一直想要推廣臺灣的影視音想要推廣臺灣的IP但部長如果你研究臺灣最喜歡拿的韓國來舉例韓國有非常多的IP所有的content都是來自出版產業而一旦我們用這樣的方法繼續摧殘圖書產業我真的不知道臺灣自己的作家還有多少人願意投入 |
| transcript.whisperx[226].start |
7103.215 |
| transcript.whisperx[226].end |
7103.656 |
| transcript.whisperx[226].text |
我可請部長簡單回應一下 |
| transcript.whisperx[227].start |
7117.067 |
| transcript.whisperx[227].end |
7138.037 |
| transcript.whisperx[227].text |
謝謝陳委員在我過去的經驗中一個國家的文學作品很重要然後出版也非常重要因為它是所有文化的開始如果有一個很好的文學作品它變成一個很好的IP變成電影電視遊戲等等音樂等等在我那個年代我是非常鼓勵這樣子的所以 |
| transcript.whisperx[228].start |
7138.897 |
| transcript.whisperx[228].end |
7166.523 |
| transcript.whisperx[228].text |
一定要保有台灣在文學包括出版的這個利基才能夠發展出更好的文化產業這點我非常相信所以未來我想我會有關這些折扣也好圖書館的借宿也好這些我們的訪問服務在研擬了我希望多聽一點出版界本身他們的建議還有剛剛講到消費者他們喜歡的折扣這些消費行為我們都一併討論 |
| transcript.whisperx[229].start |
7167.763 |
| transcript.whisperx[229].end |
7175.133 |
| transcript.whisperx[229].text |
我相信有非常多社會溝通的工作當然落在產業本身產業本身很積極在做這件事情可是從非常多圖書統一定價制的國家市場看來一旦有推行圖書統一定價制的好處會是什麼就是圖書出版的樣態會非常多元 |
| transcript.whisperx[230].start |
7184.065 |
| transcript.whisperx[230].end |
7213.565 |
| transcript.whisperx[230].text |
甚至連我們認為有所謂言論管制的中國他們都有發現這個現象更何況是韓國、法國、日本相關的國家只要推行突出定價制其實書的樣態會非常非常的多元言論跟文化不再會是單一化大家不會只看到所謂的主流暢銷書這些事情在市場上所以我覺得站在台灣過往曾經有文化多元這個黃金的市場上我們必須要回來看這件事情如果現在它不再發生如同部長你說的現在這個世代不再發生到底原因是什麼 |
| transcript.whisperx[231].start |
7214.125 |
| transcript.whisperx[231].end |
7238.107 |
| transcript.whisperx[231].text |
到底跟折扣的關係又是什麼到底跟台灣人的閱讀閱聽習慣的改變關係又是什麼其實非常需要你們的政策配套我舉最後一個例子韓國為了振興所謂出版產業他們做了政策配套做了市場調查做了閱讀推廣做了數位升級做了人才培育做了國際合作做了文化輸出而且所有他們的政策都有相關的法源依據作為配套 |
| transcript.whisperx[232].start |
7238.607 |
| transcript.whisperx[232].end |
7238.907 |
| transcript.whisperx[232].text |
謝謝主席 謝謝部長 謝謝委員 |
| transcript.whisperx[233].start |
7266.427 |
| transcript.whisperx[233].end |
7268.049 |
| transcript.whisperx[233].text |
陳培鈺委員林德福委員 |
| transcript.whisperx[234].start |
7292.799 |
| transcript.whisperx[234].end |
7306.627 |
| transcript.whisperx[234].text |
林委員你好部長你好我想少子化的問題嚴重很嚴重日前行政院長卓榮泰提議護證單位將未婚未生的民眾資料勾結給相關單位介紹 |
| transcript.whisperx[235].start |
7311.29 |
| transcript.whisperx[235].end |
7332.264 |
| transcript.whisperx[235].text |
這個獎勵政策．本席對卓院長的提議．我持保留的意見．這牽涉到個人隱私的問題．但是少子化的確是一個國安的問題．那文化部辦理國家兒童未來館新建的計劃．本席建議國家應該減輕．撫養兒童家庭的負擔．多給予門票優惠 |
| transcript.whisperx[236].start |
7337.327 |
| transcript.whisperx[236].end |
7363.707 |
| transcript.whisperx[236].text |
你有什麼看法?非常謝謝林委員的建議因為這個國家兒童未來館我們還在設計中未來裡面的內容還有如何經營票價多少這一點沒有問題沒有問題嗎?對全國12歲兒童入館應享優待那場館周遭的居民更應該享有門票的優惠撫養多派 |
| transcript.whisperx[237].start |
7367.227 |
| transcript.whisperx[237].end |
7384.205 |
| transcript.whisperx[237].text |
等於是這個多胞胎的民眾路館享有優待以鼓勵國人多多使用來加惠撫養兒童之家庭那本期要提醒李部長未來在規劃國家兒童未來館門票上收 |
| transcript.whisperx[238].start |
7385.146 |
| transcript.whisperx[238].end |
7408.355 |
| transcript.whisperx[238].text |
等於是收費上必須針對這個少子化的問題設計門票相關的優惠以減輕父母育兒的壓力你有什麼看法我覺得這個觀念蠻正確的我們未來會考慮如何經營這個場館但是最希望就是所有的兒童都能夠享受這個對啦 不要以盈利為目的啦不會不會那個李部長美國藝術四大獎 |
| transcript.whisperx[239].start |
7411.616 |
| transcript.whisperx[239].end |
7432.082 |
| transcript.whisperx[239].text |
外界認為分別是劇場東尼獎、電影奧斯卡金像獎、電視有艾美獎、音樂有葛萊美獎那國內對於電影、金馬、電視金鐘與音樂金曲皆有重要的獎項唯獨舞台劇的劇類缺少 |
| transcript.whisperx[240].start |
7435.143 |
| transcript.whisperx[240].end |
7458.569 |
| transcript.whisperx[240].text |
那這些指標的講像來鼓勵他如何去創作因此這個臺北市文化局踏出第一步這個設立臺北戲劇獎預計明年6月頒獎本席我也希望文化部與藝文界攜手合作共同來催生等同三金等級的舞台戲劇 |
| transcript.whisperx[241].start |
7460.369 |
| transcript.whisperx[241].end |
7487.368 |
| transcript.whisperx[241].text |
的這些獎項讓國內劇場更加蓬勃發展以提升民眾這個去欣賞劇場表演藝術的意願你有什麼看法那李部長就像那個電影我們中央有金馬獎臺北市有臺北電影節它各有特色金馬獎是華人以華人電影臺北電影節只能臺灣電影所以剛剛非常謝謝委員的建議我們正在研擬中 |
| transcript.whisperx[242].start |
7488.068 |
| transcript.whisperx[242].end |
7496.872 |
| transcript.whisperx[242].text |
我希望你要去重視這個問題本席另外也跟李部長探討公共藝術的推廣根據預算書資料藝術銀行112年6月底完成了432件作品的出租 |
| transcript.whisperx[243].start |
7505.875 |
| transcript.whisperx[243].end |
7509.12 |
| transcript.whisperx[243].text |
租金收入119萬元111年作品出租1,005件租金收入299萬元藝術銀行111年獲得3,079萬預算補助 |
| transcript.whisperx[244].start |
7525.1 |
| transcript.whisperx[244].end |
7541.436 |
| transcript.whisperx[244].text |
該年度租金收入僅有299萬本席是希望說藝術銀行早日能夠靠租金收入來維持營運李部長你有什麼看法有關詳細的數字我想請次長回答好嗎好啊 可以 |
| transcript.whisperx[245].start |
7543.632 |
| transcript.whisperx[245].end |
7572.451 |
| transcript.whisperx[245].text |
跟委員報告藝術銀行一直在提升他出租可以獲利的這個可以得到的收益那現在最重要就是我們跟內政部的社社就是社宅來做合作所以在社宅的這間合作上我就是要問社宅的問題其實你要自給自足啦去年文化部與內政部開始推動社宅異想計畫以新台幣10億元的公共藝術基金規模來達成10年的合作由藝術銀行操刀 |
| transcript.whisperx[246].start |
7574.072 |
| transcript.whisperx[246].end |
7587.276 |
| transcript.whisperx[246].text |
為社會住宅規劃藝術展示的服務那我請問李部長目前藝術銀行收藏的作品有多少件?3092件那已經開始在社會住宅展覽數量 |
| transcript.whisperx[247].start |
7601.271 |
| transcript.whisperx[247].end |
7601.351 |
| transcript.whisperx[247].text |
委員會主席 |
| transcript.whisperx[248].start |
7622.894 |
| transcript.whisperx[248].end |
7642.162 |
| transcript.whisperx[248].text |
社區管理委員會也來申請租借藝術作品嗎會不會朝這個方針會會因為社宅大概要蓋10年所以我們還有足夠的時間來我是希望李部長你心冷但是好好的去規劃朝這方面的理想去實現好不好謝謝好謝謝林德福委員部長請回我們接下來請吳佩奕委員 |
| transcript.whisperx[249].start |
7658.967 |
| transcript.whisperx[249].end |
7661.851 |
| transcript.whisperx[249].text |
謝謝主席 我請文化部部長好 有請部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[250].start |
7667.094 |
| transcript.whisperx[250].end |
7672.817 |
| transcript.whisperx[250].text |
吳委員你好部長好大家都很關心我們這一屆金曲獎典禮的辦理那一天我也在現場觀賞從頭做到尾那我要坦言說因為在典禮進行的過程當中我沒有太多時間在看手機我蠻專注在欣賞表演所以直到典禮結束我們司長 |
| transcript.whisperx[251].start |
7689.266 |
| transcript.whisperx[251].end |
7690.306 |
| transcript.whisperx[251].text |
大眾對於當時巴奈在台上的發言我們的 |
| transcript.whisperx[252].start |
7710.186 |
| transcript.whisperx[252].end |
7724.466 |
| transcript.whisperx[252].text |
關網可以說是官方的臉書第一時間沒有完整的結錄其實大家有很多的質疑認為說這個是不是涉及到政治的審查那包含剛剛部長的回答以及文化部第一時間的說明 |
| transcript.whisperx[253].start |
7725.948 |
| transcript.whisperx[253].end |
7735.31 |
| transcript.whisperx[253].text |
我們知道說這不是經過一個內容實質審查造成的結果可是我還是要說我們確實有要檢討之處也許部長你還記得上一次也是在這個地方我正在跟你討論也就是我們文化部所俠館的台灣館的抄襲事件在社群平台上面的發布當時我就提醒文化部現在這個時代每一篇小編的發文都等同於文化部的新聞稿 |
| transcript.whisperx[254].start |
7756.206 |
| transcript.whisperx[254].end |
7778.221 |
| transcript.whisperx[254].text |
大眾會認為這是我們文化部的態度以及立場所以當時也請文化部去進行了盤點究竟我們有多少的社群平台帳號你們在6月17號回覆給我的公文當中還說明現在文化部所屬的社群帳號有三種一種是官方社群一種是為了推廣業務使用第三種也就是各類獎項我想就包括這次金曲獎當中 |
| transcript.whisperx[255].start |
7779.602 |
| transcript.whisperx[255].end |
7782.664 |
| transcript.whisperx[255].text |
所以我還是要問這個重點是在於流程當時我有強力的要求部長你們要去建立這個發文、審文然後刊出的這個流程我們這一次事件發生是當天晚上的9點23分PO出了第一篇文章那因為內容是揭露的因為每一個得獎人你們都是揭露發言但是因為他的發言內容有涉及到了政治 |
| transcript.whisperx[256].start |
7805.976 |
| transcript.whisperx[256].end |
7826.093 |
| transcript.whisperx[256].text |
所以當你選擇刊登或不刊登其實它本身確實是一種主觀上面的認定所以大家都開始質疑了為什麼有些被刊登有些沒有被刊登那我想問第一篇發文有沒有經過我們文化部的承辦人員或是你們相關內部人的審核或者同意 |
| transcript.whisperx[257].start |
7826.894 |
| transcript.whisperx[257].end |
7827.875 |
| transcript.whisperx[257].text |
所以在發出的時候我們文化部沒有任何人看過可以確定 |
| transcript.whisperx[258].start |
7855.376 |
| transcript.whisperx[258].end |
7875.548 |
| transcript.whisperx[258].text |
好部長但是你們在6月17號回覆給我的公文就是我過去詢問你們文化部對於我們所管轄的這些帳號社群帳號你們建立的SOP流程是什麼你們告訴我說以上我剛所上述的三種帳號包含了辦理各類獎項社群這三種發文都須經過機關內主責單位同意發布 |
| transcript.whisperx[259].start |
7884.588 |
| transcript.whisperx[259].end |
7899.174 |
| transcript.whisperx[259].text |
這是你們回覆給我的公文也就是說這一次的這個小編發布文章按照你們文化部應該要的流程是需要你們內部的人員有看過並且同意的部長我的理解有錯誤嗎好我想請次長解釋一下 |
| transcript.whisperx[260].start |
7904.07 |
| transcript.whisperx[260].end |
7904.51 |
| transcript.whisperx[260].text |
部長,之所以要建立SOP流程 |
| transcript.whisperx[261].start |
7931.494 |
| transcript.whisperx[261].end |
7937.332 |
| transcript.whisperx[261].text |
就是你不能有太多的例外嘛你討論每個都是個案每個都是例外我們不需要流程啦 |
| transcript.whisperx[262].start |
7938.575 |
| transcript.whisperx[262].end |
7963.695 |
| transcript.whisperx[262].text |
對 對 |
| transcript.whisperx[263].start |
7964.798 |
| transcript.whisperx[263].end |
7967.121 |
| transcript.whisperx[263].text |
所以我們這一個流程什麼時候可以徹底的檢討?是 |
| transcript.whisperx[264].start |
7973.551 |
| transcript.whisperx[264].end |
7999.047 |
| transcript.whisperx[264].text |
這個7月底以前我們完成一個徹底的檢討好不好好那另外呢就是關於這個音響設備技術層面也很多人討論過了那我還是要講說我認為這件事情的嚴重性因為我也去參加過我們文化部跟北流高流一起推動的記者會我們現在很大的一個任務就是要把我們台流台灣的影視音人員及產業 |
| transcript.whisperx[265].start |
8000.668 |
| transcript.whisperx[265].end |
8017.079 |
| transcript.whisperx[265].text |
這麽優秀的內容文化可以輸出到國際我們要出海但是我們國家辦的典禮出現這麼嚴重的技術錯誤這不只是我們社會大眾在看國際的產業市場也都在看 |
| transcript.whisperx[266].start |
8018.42 |
| transcript.whisperx[266].end |
8035.889 |
| transcript.whisperx[266].text |
這是我們的文化軟實力的其中之一演唱會它絕對不只是臺上的表演者整個團隊都非常的重要那我們這次的承辦廠商臺視也有發表一個公開的聲明其中有兩點我認為是很重要也希望文化部後續要持續來督促的 |
| transcript.whisperx[267].start |
8036.949 |
| transcript.whisperx[267].end |
8039.271 |
| transcript.whisperx[267].text |
一個是有來說明說這一次的影響承辦公司出了哪些技術層次的錯誤第二個是臺市提到了未來對於協力廠商會更加的嚴謹 |
| transcript.whisperx[268].start |
8051.311 |
| transcript.whisperx[268].end |
8052.291 |
| transcript.whisperx[268].text |
委員會主席 |
| transcript.whisperx[269].start |
8072.017 |
| transcript.whisperx[269].end |
8095.007 |
| transcript.whisperx[269].text |
相關的這些單位的檢討也是要請你們再提出來好接下來要跟部長討論的是中正紀念堂因為已經有提到說我們國防部有提到要把我們的這個三軍的崇敬儀式撤除來移到廣場那我想請問部長你的看法 |
| transcript.whisperx[270].start |
8096.964 |
| transcript.whisperx[270].end |
8122.321 |
| transcript.whisperx[270].text |
這個事情其實講了很多年關鍵卡在國防部那最近國防部表達說他不堅持不堅持這個絕對不能動那就給了我們一個可以討論的空間我前面也講過對於中央紀念館最重要的是未來的到底我們要把它變成一個怎麼樣的東西可是在目前大家最關心的就是對於威權對於去 |
| transcript.whisperx[271].start |
8123.737 |
| transcript.whisperx[271].end |
8123.877 |
| transcript.whisperx[271].text |
委員會主席 |
| transcript.whisperx[272].start |
8133.959 |
| transcript.whisperx[272].end |
8161.968 |
| transcript.whisperx[272].text |
已經被討論了很久那最近我非常積極的跟國防部已經討論了很多遍到底他們要怎麼樣改成另外一種方式在中正經常的廣場或者是考慮這些已對他們的動線觀眾的看法已經非常多次了我想雖然我們本來是轉型正義的會議是在10月份我個人希望快一點有決定然後做出一個讓大家覺得還算滿意的一個結論 |
| transcript.whisperx[273].start |
8163.627 |
| transcript.whisperx[273].end |
8189.637 |
| transcript.whisperx[273].text |
是 這個三軍是不是要取消重慶儀式這當然國防部的看法至關重要這其實文化部也無法決定但是你們主管的是整個園區啊因為現在有一種討論是說把他們移到廣場也可以來促進我們的觀光但是我想要講的是國軍是不是最適合來做文化展演推動觀光的主體呢因為最近我們國防部才在討論取消這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[274].start |
8192.577 |
| transcript.whisperx[274].end |
8202.219 |
| transcript.whisperx[274].text |
演習的劇本取消踢正部就是要進行國軍裡面的形式主義的廢除需要讓他們是朝向更有功能性的實戰來訓練所以呢在我們的文化部的兩廳院廣場裡面其實我們過去也有相當多的藝文演出也有商業合作但是它不如兩廳院內部我們是一整年檔期通通排滿的我認為我們對於這個兩廳院的廣場 |
| transcript.whisperx[275].start |
8222.369 |
| transcript.whisperx[275].end |
8246.664 |
| transcript.whisperx[275].text |
的文化展演如何也來結合城市的觀光我們文化部應該可以有更積極更多的規劃部長你認同嗎我認同但是他的操演是屬於中正紀念壇這一邊的然後另外兩庭的文化館長又是另外一個不同單位所以我們現在考慮的只有中正紀念壇這一塊所以他在哪裡操演我們還在考慮中 |
| transcript.whisperx[276].start |
8247.905 |
| transcript.whisperx[276].end |
8269.385 |
| transcript.whisperx[276].text |
是,但是我要講的是整個我們園區的轉型不能只靠去移動我們這個議隊的位置我們文化部本身我知道你們最近這個關於中正紀念堂一百種想像展覽在各地在巡迴演出那個展覽我也去看過我覺得非常好因為我們園區本來就應該要更天際我們當代的都市計畫 |
| transcript.whisperx[277].start |
8270.846 |
| transcript.whisperx[277].end |
8270.926 |
| transcript.whisperx[277].text |
最後的... |
| transcript.whisperx[278].start |
8282.352 |
| transcript.whisperx[278].end |
8287.276 |
| transcript.whisperx[278].text |
一分鐘的時間是今天我們也要關心的是文資保存那我的選區呢臺北市中正萬華區是佔了臺北市的古蹟大概有將近一半那一般我們想到說歷史古蹟哪裡最多都會以為是我們昭緯選區臺南結果呢其實一算下來其實臺北才是最多的尤其中正萬華區又佔了一半 |
| transcript.whisperx[279].start |
8307.333 |
| transcript.whisperx[279].end |
8320.764 |
| transcript.whisperx[279].text |
部長因為過去你也在臺北市文基會也服務過所以我想要有一個提議是在我們的中正區裡面因為古蹟非常的多那有非常多中央的文化場館比如說我們臺博館我們時博館那也有很多我們臺北市政府俠館的文化場館我認為這裡非常適合來推動一個國家級的藝文郎道 |
| transcript.whisperx[280].start |
8328.61 |
| transcript.whisperx[280].end |
8346.387 |
| transcript.whisperx[280].text |
例如說我們各個單位在舉辦管方的活動的時候是不是可以結合社區或是不是可以不是有單點的而是點加點可以連串連成一個一個帶狀的形成這個部分我希望我們中央文化部是不是可以跟我們地方政府臺北市文化局有更積極的討論未來可以來推動相關的合作 |
| transcript.whisperx[281].start |
8350.017 |
| transcript.whisperx[281].end |
8369.695 |
| transcript.whisperx[281].text |
這個沒有問題其實跟委員報告我自己就出生在萬華我對於萬華四周的那個有什麼宮廟我都很熟然後中正區現在很多日本房子也在重建它的確是已經變成是一個這個古蹟跟歷史建物最多的一個地方所以我想我們 |
| transcript.whisperx[282].start |
8370.416 |
| transcript.whisperx[282].end |
8371.577 |
| transcript.whisperx[282].text |
謝謝吳佩奕委員部長請回讓我們接下來先休息5分鐘 |
| transcript.whisperx[283].start |
8417.803 |
| transcript.whisperx[283].end |
8418.004 |
| transcript.whisperx[283].text |
主席 |
| transcript.whisperx[284].start |
8695.25 |
| transcript.whisperx[284].end |
8697.851 |
| transcript.whisperx[284].text |
委員會主席 |
| transcript.whisperx[285].start |
8718.063 |
| transcript.whisperx[285].end |
8736.51 |
| transcript.whisperx[285].text |
響鐘 |
| transcript.whisperx[286].start |
8747.554 |
| transcript.whisperx[286].end |
8761.384 |
| transcript.whisperx[286].text |
法定人數不足 |
| transcript.whisperx[287].start |
8805.47 |
| transcript.whisperx[287].end |
8808.592 |
| transcript.whisperx[287].text |
好 我們繼續開會我們接下來請郭育晴委員質詢 |
| transcript.whisperx[288].start |
8818.655 |
| transcript.whisperx[288].end |
8818.835 |
| transcript.whisperx[288].text |
郭文貴議員 |
| transcript.whisperx[289].start |
8828.188 |
| transcript.whisperx[289].end |
8853.059 |
| transcript.whisperx[289].text |
部長早安不用擔心我拿麥克風是因為感冒的關係不是為了要大吼大叫部長我想這個上個禮拜最受爭議的其實就是金曲獎的部分那我想愛之勝責之切在這裡其實還是要請教部長幾個問題就是關於這次的金曲獎那就是有不少的一個爭議包含我們的 |
| transcript.whisperx[290].start |
8854.619 |
| transcript.whisperx[290].end |
8878.471 |
| transcript.whisperx[290].text |
巴奈上台的整個所有的感言是在一個小時一個半小時之後才完整的補上那這個部分其實引起了大家很多的聲音那我想台灣向來就是一個自由民主的一個國家那我們對於文化對於藝術上的一個創作的尊重那包含得獎者他們的一些他們的發言 |
| transcript.whisperx[291].start |
8879.091 |
| transcript.whisperx[291].end |
8902.279 |
| transcript.whisperx[291].text |
其實都不應該要被審查但是在這個地方其實我們看到文化部雖然在當天的半夜也緊急的發了一些聲明稿但是我發現了一個小問題我們不是在自己的文章上面就是我們的金曲獎的官網的FB上面並不是在上面直接一篇文章來做這樣子的說明 |
| transcript.whisperx[292].start |
8902.819 |
| transcript.whisperx[292].end |
8926.23 |
| transcript.whisperx[292].text |
而是放在留言底下來做這樣子的一個反應那這個部分我個人是覺得本席還是希望能夠建議在這個文化部的部分是不是能夠在最快最短的一個時間點趁這兩個禮拜其實大家都還在討論這個話題我想金曲講的是我們非常重要的一個盛事 |
| transcript.whisperx[293].start |
8928.15 |
| transcript.whisperx[293].end |
8955.141 |
| transcript.whisperx[293].text |
當然其實言論不應該被箝制也不應該被限縮尤其是得獎者他們的一個感言雖然我們做了補救但我個人認為誠意跟歉意似乎還是有一點點不夠雖然我們知道其實提到六四天安門的事件在過去比方說在1989年趙少康先生他還召集了台灣的四家唱片一百多個藝人 |
| transcript.whisperx[294].start |
8956.521 |
| transcript.whisperx[294].end |
8984.111 |
| transcript.whisperx[294].text |
作了一首歌叫做是《歷史的傷口》那我想我們沒有應該是說我們對這一次金學獎的這樣子的一個事件引發這麼大的一個爭議我覺得文化部是不是在這個地方應該還是要再做一個更正式的對民眾的一個說明跟我們真的在跟所謂的這個協辦的單位協辦的單位台式來做一個責任的追溯這個部分是不是 |
| transcript.whisperx[295].start |
8984.411 |
| transcript.whisperx[295].end |
8984.531 |
| transcript.whisperx[295].text |
主席 |
| transcript.whisperx[296].start |
9001.278 |
| transcript.whisperx[296].end |
9019.253 |
| transcript.whisperx[296].text |
除了這幾個技術上的問題以後我們會做個整個的檢討做為我們下一次再怎麼樣發包然後怎麼樣可以監督他還有包括未來如果繼續有這樣子發文我們如果有個政治的應變我想我們都會一起考慮 |
| transcript.whisperx[297].start |
9021.014 |
| transcript.whisperx[297].end |
9037.569 |
| transcript.whisperx[297].text |
除了要周延的考慮我覺得就是部長可以跟著承辦單位我們再做一個更正式的記者會甚至對外的一個說明這是我本席的一些意見我不曉得部長您覺得可能會比媒體私下來受訪因為不見得每個人都會看臉書 |
| transcript.whisperx[298].start |
9038.93 |
| transcript.whisperx[298].end |
9062.848 |
| transcript.whisperx[298].text |
也不見得每一個人都會看新聞但是如果說是由部長這邊跟承辦單位我們把整件事情說明清楚臺灣其實還是接納多元崇尚自由創作尊重創作的這樣子的一個好地方這個部分我希望其實我來考慮一下因為整個真相從當天發生到第二天越來越激烈 |
| transcript.whisperx[299].start |
9063.951 |
| transcript.whisperx[299].end |
9064.111 |
| transcript.whisperx[299].text |
《文化資產保存法》 |
| transcript.whisperx[300].start |
9084.542 |
| transcript.whisperx[300].end |
9086.463 |
| transcript.whisperx[300].text |
接下來有關於中國媒體疑似介入臺灣政論的節目這件事情我想到目前為止 |
| transcript.whisperx[301].start |
9108.552 |
| transcript.whisperx[301].end |
9132.07 |
| transcript.whisperx[301].text |
就是我們文化部這個地方有沒有什麼樣的一個說法那之後可能要跟這個陸委會還有這個移民署我們是不是跨部會來針對這件事情所引發可能後續因為我們知道其實對岸對於台灣真的是無孔不入啦那我想呢他們也可能會從政論節目上面下手這個是絕對有可能的事情這個部分我們怎麼樣來防範呢 |
| transcript.whisperx[302].start |
9133.451 |
| transcript.whisperx[302].end |
9142 |
| transcript.whisperx[302].text |
整個過程我想請因為我們去跟陸委會還有約談那個幾個對象的過程我想請王次長跟委員報告詳細一點 |
| transcript.whisperx[303].start |
9146.42 |
| transcript.whisperx[303].end |
9160.186 |
| transcript.whisperx[303].text |
跟委員做說明目前這個案子我們就是在進行行政調查當中所以對於邀請單位以及駐台的單位都跟路委會協同路委會一起在進行事實內容了解但因為到目前為止這一則事件是基於媒體的報導那這個報導並沒有指證出實質的 |
| transcript.whisperx[304].start |
9164.028 |
| transcript.whisperx[304].end |
9164.268 |
| transcript.whisperx[304].text |
主席主席主席 |
| transcript.whisperx[305].start |
9187.876 |
| transcript.whisperx[305].end |
9192.72 |
| transcript.whisperx[305].text |
如果他的行為跟他申請的目的活動不符的話第一個當然可以廢止或者撤銷他的執照第二個當然就是請他離境 |
| transcript.whisperx[306].start |
9211.937 |
| transcript.whisperx[306].end |
9212.057 |
| transcript.whisperx[306].text |
主席 |
| transcript.whisperx[307].start |
9224.488 |
| transcript.whisperx[307].end |
9254.251 |
| transcript.whisperx[307].text |
我們自從有文資法定定40年來40幾年來那其實真的因為毀損而被重刑或者是入獄的幾乎是沒有任何一件那我們在台灣其實真的也很遺憾的會看到很多人在講說只要是你的土地上有一個古蹟如果他自然可能就是因為都更有這樣子的一個都市傳說那2020年的6月其實台中的這個刑務所的 |
| transcript.whisperx[308].start |
9255.171 |
| transcript.whisperx[308].end |
9282.977 |
| transcript.whisperx[308].text |
官社群被活吻那當然其實也引發了所謂的這個自然的一些問題那我想在舊文資法的這個修法的部分其實我們是不是應該要怎麼樣去再做更進一步或者是說再怎麼樣去防範這些我們的古蹟遭到人為的一個破壞但是真的被人為破壞之後卻真的沒有辦法去落實文資法的這些刑責的部分 |
| transcript.whisperx[309].start |
9284.117 |
| transcript.whisperx[309].end |
9286.118 |
| transcript.whisperx[309].text |
這個部分部長您怎麼看? |
| transcript.whisperx[310].start |
9296.343 |
| transcript.whisperx[310].end |
9317.475 |
| transcript.whisperx[310].text |
在《文治法》裡面人為破壞的話有106條都有相關的刑法或者行政法那目前像最近的兩個像花蓮玉里、鐵道的宿舍還有屏東大五園區裡頭的那些縱火案件都已經移送法辦現在都在審判當中 |
| transcript.whisperx[311].start |
9318.055 |
| transcript.whisperx[311].end |
9320.037 |
| transcript.whisperx[311].text |
每年台灣幾乎都有古蹟會自燃的這個現象能夠真的降低我想這個文化的保存對於台灣來講其實是非常重要的 |
| transcript.whisperx[312].start |
9337.371 |
| transcript.whisperx[312].end |
9354.261 |
| transcript.whisperx[312].text |
前年我們2022年臺南的火車站跟鹿港的龍山寺他們陸續發生了所謂的修壞了的事件我想這個部長應該也大概清楚原本的一個窗框到後來變成一個彩繪的窗框或者是在古蹟當中的廁所 |
| transcript.whisperx[313].start |
9355.512 |
| transcript.whisperx[313].end |
9369.569 |
| transcript.whisperx[313].text |
明明是古蹟但他真的就被拆掉了那針對這個部分當然我們有一個文資傳匠的一個攻防那我想目前在這個修復的人力上面 |
| transcript.whisperx[314].start |
9371.551 |
| transcript.whisperx[314].end |
9385.559 |
| transcript.whisperx[314].text |
目前有93人是通過了這個所謂的傳統的降師的一個資格的審查但是呢真正能夠在從事這個修復的工作的人是不到三分之一的一個人力是只有299人 |
| transcript.whisperx[315].start |
9387.56 |
| transcript.whisperx[315].end |
9408.996 |
| transcript.whisperx[315].text |
那我想這個部分是不是真的在我們的古蹟的修復上面在人力的部分是真的明顯的不足這個部分我們怎麼樣來做補救那另外呢像是台灣雖然沒有所謂的國家修復的一個體制但是有幾個所謂的商業的修復的中心包含政修科大雲林科大還有我們的這個國立台南藝術大學 |
| transcript.whisperx[316].start |
9409.957 |
| transcript.whisperx[316].end |
9412.898 |
| transcript.whisperx[316].text |
委員講古蹟修復人才的問題我們最近才開過一個會議就是我們要強化傳統匠師他的薪水保障 |
| transcript.whisperx[317].start |
9435.467 |
| transcript.whisperx[317].end |
9460.463 |
| transcript.whisperx[317].text |
另外我們為了要讓年輕一代的可以進入這個修復的工作我們就訂了一個降師的分級制度然後擴大我們這個傳降課程的培訓還有跟教育部我們會進行可不可以這方面的科系多一點科系的開設另外我們也必須輔導地方政府傳統修復人才因為我們中央本身 |
| transcript.whisperx[318].start |
9461.924 |
| transcript.whisperx[318].end |
9462.104 |
| transcript.whisperx[318].text |
委員會主席 |
| transcript.whisperx[319].start |
9478.456 |
| transcript.whisperx[319].end |
9507.58 |
| transcript.whisperx[319].text |
因為我們建立一個回訊制度就是在工地負責人的技術這些人員再回來受訓就是謝謝委員剛剛提的那個的確是我們最近面臨很大的問題所以我們也一直在開會尤其是現在因為少子化的關係所以其實包含我們的科系能不能夠招滿這些學生或者這些學生他們在畢業之後是不是真的能夠投入這個台灣古今修復的一個能力的行業其實這次都需要很快速的能夠 |
| transcript.whisperx[320].start |
9508.2 |
| transcript.whisperx[320].end |
9508.58 |
| transcript.whisperx[320].text |
郭玉琴議員張雅琳議員 |
| transcript.whisperx[321].start |
9539.163 |
| transcript.whisperx[321].end |
9558.97 |
| transcript.whisperx[321].text |
張委員您好部長早安首先我在這次看金曲獎的時候我在看到這個表演的時候有這個台文而且是正字正確的我其實真的非常感到高興但很不幸的在接下來我又看到了另外一個片段同樣一段的表演 |
| transcript.whisperx[322].start |
9559.95 |
| transcript.whisperx[322].end |
9574.512 |
| transcript.whisperx[322].text |
就出現了快快快 領袖賣K孩賣K孩這個正字應該要寫成是這個樣子所以我想要了解就是說其實因為 |
| transcript.whisperx[323].start |
9575.666 |
| transcript.whisperx[323].end |
9604.365 |
| transcript.whisperx[323].text |
文化部,其實其他的語言都有相關的組織單位那文化部是台語唯一的組織單位是非常需要大家來謹慎的照顧我們的台語所以我只是在想在我們這個台語的歌詞雖然它可能是老歌的歌詞大家過去對台文不了解可能也沒有那個機會學習所以會用可能空耳或是火星文或是我們自己認為的語言去把它拼寫出來但是因為我們現在都在推廣台文了 |
| transcript.whisperx[324].start |
9605.646 |
| transcript.whisperx[324].end |
9623.751 |
| transcript.whisperx[324].text |
我們在這樣大型的典禮其實也是一個很好的宣傳機會我們是不是應該要來確保我們寫出來的臺文是正確的嘛我們才能讓大家知道臺語也是有語言的才不會出現像之前可能有委員質詢這個問題嘛所以我在想請教 因為接下來還有金鐘跟金馬 |
| transcript.whisperx[325].start |
9624.471 |
| transcript.whisperx[325].end |
9650.894 |
| transcript.whisperx[325].text |
我們是不是可以記取這次的教訓我有兩個建議第一個我們是不是可以因為我們已經有專家學者治療庫了我們是不是可以請臺文專家來協助如果有些相關的歌詞是臺語的部分我們可以提供證字可以提供一些刊物的協助那再來就是說可能大家也會擔心說要是不是有點不尊重我們原本的創作者那我們是不是有另外一個方式我們把原歌詞跟正確的歌詞併成我不曉得說部長您的看法如何 |
| transcript.whisperx[326].start |
9651.57 |
| transcript.whisperx[326].end |
9678.256 |
| transcript.whisperx[326].text |
因為這個部分涉及到那個原作者他用的一些著作權如果能夠溝通比如說跟他講說你願不願意改他如果願意改我想就我們就改因為剛剛委員提到這個用字用語沒有一個標準這個我們剛好最近文化部成立了一個國家語言發展研究中心想要做的事情可能就這一部分是一個蠻重要的部分就是各種不同的語言它的 |
| transcript.whisperx[327].start |
9679.364 |
| transcript.whisperx[327].end |
9679.384 |
| transcript.whisperx[327].text |
委員會議 |
| transcript.whisperx[328].start |
9701.326 |
| transcript.whisperx[328].end |
9701.726 |
| transcript.whisperx[328].text |
接下來就是有關於不義遺址的 |
| transcript.whisperx[329].start |
9727.952 |
| transcript.whisperx[329].end |
9729.135 |
| transcript.whisperx[329].text |
發言委員．修復體系翻新升級 |
| transcript.whisperx[330].start |
9739.568 |
| transcript.whisperx[330].end |
9759.029 |
| transcript.whisperx[330].text |
這一個字不易以止我想要了解就是說已經也一年了大概什麼時候呢我們會送進立法院來做審查呢好據我所知已經送到立法院了那詳細情況行政院對不起我們說到行政院但是還沒有送到立法院請那個承辦這個整個事情比較了解的黃市長來好謝謝跟你報告 |
| transcript.whisperx[331].start |
9762.762 |
| transcript.whisperx[331].end |
9790.814 |
| transcript.whisperx[331].text |
跟委員說明其實後來在去年5月9號之後大概我們在跟行政院由政委來主持會又經過了幾次的條文的修正所以在去年的12月28號有修到最後的版本進到行政院那後來行政院跟立法院應該是在協調立法院排案的進度那這個部分我們大概就尊重行政院協調的結果所以什麼時候會排進立法院大概還是要看行政院跟貴院協調的的最終時程來定定 |
| transcript.whisperx[332].start |
9791.494 |
| transcript.whisperx[332].end |
9818.237 |
| transcript.whisperx[332].text |
好 我了解那我想就是說因為其實我們之前其實也有跟文資局來做一些討論那他就有講到不義遺址因為其實在之前的轉型生意、兔轉會的時代大家就一直有講這件事情非常的重要如何保留這個不義遺址來做一些人權教育啊來活化這些基地都是傳承台灣過去這一個過程的一個歷史那但是當時呢文資局告訴我們說就是說因為不義遺址他沒有辦法因為在現在的他沒有遺構 |
| transcript.whisperx[333].start |
9819.158 |
| transcript.whisperx[333].end |
9842.572 |
| transcript.whisperx[333].text |
他也沒有見誤這種狀況他很難去認定他是一個不遺址他很難做一些活化保存啦應該是這樣講所以他非常需要這個專法可是現在聽起來我又沒有這個專法那我們針對這些潛在的不遺址現在還有這麼多處我們已經有相關的審議會議來做審定他的資格沒有錯但是呢到底我們要如何來活化他呢我們沒有相關的一個計畫 |
| transcript.whisperx[334].start |
9844.073 |
| transcript.whisperx[334].end |
9861.523 |
| transcript.whisperx[334].text |
不然就會變成爹不疼娘不愛他變成一個孤兒到底誰來照顧他可是他就日漸的凋零所以我現在是看到就是說我們是不是可以有一些相關的計畫的方式或者是用一些要點管理要點的方式來做這個相關的活化的工作呢 |
| transcript.whisperx[335].start |
9861.863 |
| transcript.whisperx[335].end |
9885.875 |
| transcript.whisperx[335].text |
跟委員說明大概分成幾個部分第一個是已經審定的不移植42處那這42處因為已經建立了它的已經指定了已經確定它是不移植所以這個部分是以內容的充實史料的完整來為主那第二部分所謂潛在的部分那潛在的部分雖然不移植的這個法案還沒有通過但是我們開始進行所謂的預審我們就先把這些潛在的不移植有可能應該是變成不移植再做審定 |
| transcript.whisperx[336].start |
9887.056 |
| transcript.whisperx[336].end |
9902.409 |
| transcript.whisperx[336].text |
現在是活化的工作,身份有,但是活化的工作呢?現在的問題是因為現在的不移植分屬於不同的地方,譬如說它如果是公有的,譬如說有的像這一次在臺南的民生綠園那裡也有一個,它現在就在使用的狀態,就比較沒有活化的問題。那有一些譬如它在國防的機敏地帶,那它就有沒有辦法活化的問題。 |
| transcript.whisperx[337].start |
9907.373 |
| transcript.whisperx[337].end |
9934.486 |
| transcript.whisperx[337].text |
那有一些是在私人的部分那他就也有說他可能不願意讓大家知道這是所謂的不義遺址還要進行溝通但是這是一部分的問題但是既也有一些是比如說像集美人權園區或者是像安康接待所像這些我們就是已經把它列入所謂活化的內容就是說我們把它變成是人權園區或者是像綠島人權園區這些其實也都是所謂的不義遺址所以他大概有分不同的階段如果是公有的沒有爭議的 |
| transcript.whisperx[338].start |
9935.566 |
| transcript.whisperx[338].end |
9957.725 |
| transcript.whisperx[338].text |
然後已經被審定的歷史的資料也相對完整的這個大概就會進入首部的活化好沒關係我了解齁我了解喔但是我想那我們就直接進到這一個就是說因為相關的工作其實是人權管的工作嘛齁那我也看到就是人權管從2012年到現在你也可以看到這張表格我們他的人權推廣活動的補助預算占整體的比例是逐年下降 |
| transcript.whisperx[339].start |
9958.425 |
| transcript.whisperx[339].end |
9987.523 |
| transcript.whisperx[339].text |
那我想要了解這個原因是什麼因為其實我也知道有非常多是既有其實也沒有任何爭議的但是我現在看到我們相關的內容其實還是非常的少這是第一個比例經費的下降第二個不易移植的教案從2019年之後時光就凍結了沒有再更新而且高中、國中、國小都只有一個教案那我覺得這對活化這件事情是相對的不積極所以我想要了解說我們有沒有更積極的方式從第一個先幫我解釋一下預算的部分 |
| transcript.whisperx[340].start |
9989.704 |
| transcript.whisperx[340].end |
10005.258 |
| transcript.whisperx[340].text |
跟文說明對於不移植的教案這個部分其實要繼續的開發中我們這個部分一定會積極來做提升不會讓它停留在只有三個教案那至於補助案的部分據我的了解是這樣因為它的補助案它會因為補助的需求跟項目而減少 |
| transcript.whisperx[341].start |
10006.119 |
| transcript.whisperx[341].end |
10029.42 |
| transcript.whisperx[341].text |
但是它的經費其實整體經費並沒有減少它可能用在自辦或者是像自辦旅行這一類的方式人權小旅行這一類的方式或者是做人權這個巡迴車的這個推廣所以它不一定是以補助的形式展現但是如果有哪些做人權的但是我們因為沒有補助而導致它沒有辦法進行推動的也請委員不吝提供我們這樣的資訊我們會非常樂意來進行這一類的補助 |
| transcript.whisperx[342].start |
10032.062 |
| transcript.whisperx[342].end |
10049.393 |
| transcript.whisperx[342].text |
好,因為我想啊,因為你剛剛講的那些部分,可能有部分是用促轉基金做的,對嗎?但是因為這個促轉基金到底有多少的預算可不可以也提供給我們?因為我們之前還沒有拿到,之前我跟你們說一句啦,那之後再匯報補給我們。好,因為促轉基金是每年申請的,所以它的額度也都不相同。 |
| transcript.whisperx[343].start |
10050.113 |
| transcript.whisperx[343].end |
10066.83 |
| transcript.whisperx[343].text |
對對對那我就說你們從去年開始有申請嘛對不對那這個實際的金額也提供給我們但是我想說促轉基金之外我覺得我們可以回到這一張來看我們人權推廣補助案整體的經費的確是下降的但是你剛剛有說有些是自辦的那這些費用也相關的一起整理給我們我們來看看到底 |
| transcript.whisperx[344].start |
10068.632 |
| transcript.whisperx[344].end |
10088.573 |
| transcript.whisperx[344].text |
民間是有在回應,他們覺得補助案的金變少了我們來請人權管做一個總整理剛有講到教案可以來積極的處理,那我想要了解規劃進度是何時我們一樣可以通過委員我們的規劃進度因為這個教案的部分是我們主力的在做人權推廣的一個主要的內容 |
| transcript.whisperx[345].start |
10089.468 |
| transcript.whisperx[345].end |
10117.384 |
| transcript.whisperx[345].text |
因為他們現在做的是比較多是把原有的教案複製提供給更多的學校那至於在內容的充實上我想這就是我們持續來進行就是除了去擴散學校以外同時也在內容上增加更多的教案對 因為我這個這件事情我真的非常的希望大家可以重視啦因為其實這個教案就是提供給老師們或是家長們可以讓在家裡或在學校裡自己操作嘛可是如果都做一個案子的話變成它操作性上面難度非常高可能要有不同的地點 |
| transcript.whisperx[346].start |
10119.165 |
| transcript.whisperx[346].end |
10119.886 |
| transcript.whisperx[346].text |
中正經驗堂教案 |
| transcript.whisperx[347].start |
10142.507 |
| transcript.whisperx[347].end |
10167.157 |
| transcript.whisperx[347].text |
民間的偵檢我過去在民間都有在做這件事情那我今天要講這個中正紀念堂就當時我做的這個教案我們邀請了一堆來一些來自於深藍家庭的或是外省第二代的家庭那他們聽完我們的故事之後呢他就講了這一段話我覺得非常的重要就是說他雖然很早就知道講中正的真實版本但當時改名叫自由廣場的時候他會覺得是不是太沒事早試做了 |
| transcript.whisperx[348].start |
10168.547 |
| transcript.whisperx[348].end |
10191.399 |
| transcript.whisperx[348].text |
改的名字也沒有原來的響亮畢竟他是外省第二代但是那天他聽我們講完這整個走讀的故事之後他突然覺得改名真的很重要所以希望這裡可以成為一個兼具歷史的有意義的又親民的一個場地所以這個教案其實就是在幫我們做很多很多民間的鬆動跟凝聚民間的共識讓不同的視角可以一起來對話 |
| transcript.whisperx[349].start |
10193.26 |
| transcript.whisperx[349].end |
10199.575 |
| transcript.whisperx[349].text |
所以這件事情真的是非常需要積極的來做所以相關的一些計畫規劃的內容我們就在會後約個時間來詳細討論好嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[350].start |
10203.62 |
| transcript.whisperx[350].end |
10223.191 |
| transcript.whisperx[350].text |
最後抱歉,我快快講一句,昨天今年的談判其實大家有非常多的爭議在講衛兵交接的儀式到如何進行我這邊也可以提供一個想法供部長來參考當然要對威權致敬這是一個非常荒謬的事情 |
| transcript.whisperx[351].start |
10223.951 |
| transcript.whisperx[351].end |
10240.239 |
| transcript.whisperx[351].text |
現在大家在討論說但是它又是一個很重要的觀光的一個儀式就很像是可能白金漢宮啊 都有這種儀式大家想要去看但是我覺得我們是不是就應該把它定定為它就是一個觀光的表演大家也可以來思考是不是就是一個觀光的表演 |
| transcript.whisperx[352].start |
10241.199 |
| transcript.whisperx[352].end |
10241.48 |
| transcript.whisperx[352].text |
提供給部長來做個參考謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[353].start |
10268.476 |
| transcript.whisperx[353].end |
10268.796 |
| transcript.whisperx[353].text |
張雅玲議員 |
| transcript.whisperx[354].start |
10292.13 |
| transcript.whisperx[354].end |
10310.495 |
| transcript.whisperx[354].text |
李委員你好部長辛苦部長在上週二本席的總質詢裡我質詢顧林雄部長那他很明確的說國防部的態度就是三軍一隊可以移到自由廣場那最終拍板的就是文化部 |
| transcript.whisperx[355].start |
10311.255 |
| transcript.whisperx[355].end |
10340.062 |
| transcript.whisperx[355].text |
那我想而且要強調國防部會完全的配合那在這樣的狀況之下當然文化部的態度就是關鍵喔那我想藉這個機會因為早上有很多的委員都有垂詢就藉這個機會也請部長來說明就第一個三軍儀隊離開堂體是否已經是文化部的最終定案那第二個就是說三軍儀隊是不是會如同國防部的建議改到自由廣場去操練那再來就是說文化部 |
| transcript.whisperx[356].start |
10341.143 |
| transcript.whisperx[356].end |
10345.571 |
| transcript.whisperx[356].text |
還會不會再思考對於三軍一隊有什麼其他的安排?部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[357].start |
10348.485 |
| transcript.whisperx[357].end |
10372.434 |
| transcript.whisperx[357].text |
好 謝謝這個問題就是其實關於三菁儀隊要離開堂體之後他要用什麼方式操練這件事情我們其實非常慎重的已經跟國防部開過很多次會議然後那個路線怎麼走要考慮到那個本身這些軍人的方便還有觀光客的方便還有他要用什麼方式在 |
| transcript.whisperx[358].start |
10373.214 |
| transcript.whisperx[358].end |
10396.609 |
| transcript.whisperx[358].text |
離開團體之後他有什麼理由在外面操演等等他都是一個非常慎重的儀式但是我可以跟委員講就是文化部的態度非常清楚因為我們在一年前就已經設定一個這個中正經濟團轉型條例的一定要做的幾個動作包括去除威權去除個人崇拜 |
| transcript.whisperx[359].start |
10397.449 |
| transcript.whisperx[359].end |
10397.549 |
| transcript.whisperx[359].text |
主席 |
| transcript.whisperx[360].start |
10413.526 |
| transcript.whisperx[360].end |
10426.331 |
| transcript.whisperx[360].text |
今天早上推動轉型正義會報了小組成員有跟我們辦公室透露我們文化部的最新規劃就如同這個圖一樣那我想堂體不再設置這個禮賓執行的衛紹操演會 |
| transcript.whisperx[361].start |
10430.512 |
| transcript.whisperx[361].end |
10448.79 |
| transcript.whisperx[361].text |
移到戶外來進行．且比照中列詞的模式．予以就取消勤務我想這個規劃看起來還蠻清楚的那我是困惑的是說那既然文化部是主管機關．而且早就規劃好了那為什麼還要推給行政院推動轉型正義匯報來做同意 |
| transcript.whisperx[362].start |
10452.453 |
| transcript.whisperx[362].end |
10466.203 |
| transcript.whisperx[362].text |
據中正紀念堂轉型推動專案小組他們其實也早在去年就已經對於儀隊的撤離做成決議所以我想請部長說明說文化部對於這樣的 |
| transcript.whisperx[363].start |
10468.825 |
| transcript.whisperx[363].end |
10479.94 |
| transcript.whisperx[363].text |
規劃那你們未來就是真的還要再送所謂的轉型匯報嗎那還是說你們自己就可以來決定這件事情然後來交代國防部去實施 |
| transcript.whisperx[364].start |
10483.167 |
| transcript.whisperx[364].end |
10508.25 |
| transcript.whisperx[364].text |
這個路線連我都沒有清楚我覺得可能是裡面有些人的想法像這個路線我是文化部長我都不知道這是最後定案這或許是規劃是規劃它可能是規劃之一最新的規劃就是因為我希望這次做完之後就維持這個狀態不要再改來改去所以必須是要國安部本身也接受文化部也 |
| transcript.whisperx[365].start |
10509.051 |
| transcript.whisperx[365].end |
10509.091 |
| transcript.whisperx[365].text |
主席 |
| transcript.whisperx[366].start |
10528.219 |
| transcript.whisperx[366].end |
10550.072 |
| transcript.whisperx[366].text |
對 這個轉型正義會報其實在去年就是很多的成員都已經決議就是說所謂的這個三軍一隊居使是要撤離堂體這件事情那所以這個已經是決議的事情沒有被決議好像在一年前有這個決議然後半年後沒有結論可見這件事情是非常難的他決議後很難執行所以經過兩次會議 |
| transcript.whisperx[367].start |
10556.946 |
| transcript.whisperx[367].end |
10559.798 |
| transcript.whisperx[367].text |
我自己去翻閱上一次會議是沒有結論 |
| transcript.whisperx[368].start |
10561.468 |
| transcript.whisperx[368].end |
10588.187 |
| transcript.whisperx[368].text |
上一次會議沒有結論到了我們開始國防部表達說他有不堅持的一個可能的時候我們才可能往下做所以我是非常感謝國防部說他們不堅持了給了我們文化部一個可能性那這個過程中我們其實來來回回開了很多次會路線怎麼走推翻了再改過來其實就表示我們真的要做了但是又希望做到一個大家都能比較能接受的 |
| transcript.whisperx[369].start |
10588.683 |
| transcript.whisperx[369].end |
10603.844 |
| transcript.whisperx[369].text |
好,那就是到9月份送轉型這一位報告．也許不用到9月啦因為我心裡也蠻急的因為這樣的題目你如果一直講但是又沒有做會引起更大的一個反彈所以我心裡面會希望越快越好 |
| transcript.whisperx[370].start |
10604.805 |
| transcript.whisperx[370].end |
10628.067 |
| transcript.whisperx[370].text |
我贊成部長這樣講因為說真的這個轉型正義匯報的成員到8月就已經到期那9月是一個新的成員我們過去都是這些舊的成員在討論這件事情最清楚所以如果說這件事情拖好9月讓新的成員去決定那我看可能所以還是儘快最好我會儘快 |
| transcript.whisperx[371].start |
10630.669 |
| transcript.whisperx[371].end |
10644.457 |
| transcript.whisperx[371].text |
另外我們回到今天的專報主題文資修復臺南火車站原本預計今年的6月要辦理新的修復工程的發包那預計2025年底要完工 |
| transcript.whisperx[372].start |
10645.618 |
| transcript.whisperx[372].end |
10661.931 |
| transcript.whisperx[372].text |
目前部長不曉得進度如何那再來就是說那如果沒有辦法如期發包那到底困境在哪裡那有信心在2025完工嗎因為這件事情拖很久那如果遲遲沒有辦法辦理建築師的這個設計、建造或者營造廠的這個發包那最後 |
| transcript.whisperx[373].start |
10667.555 |
| transcript.whisperx[373].end |
10687.283 |
| transcript.whisperx[373].text |
文化部有打算要接手嗎?因為現在是目前都是台鐵的事可是台鐵對於文資修復真的很外行那所以這件事情要如何處理?部長因為文資修復是一個非常重要的事情因為他修復的那個能力還有能不能回到原來那個樣子其實不能夠很草率的做所以會事實上有那個 |
| transcript.whisperx[374].start |
10688.063 |
| transcript.whisperx[374].end |
10696.47 |
| transcript.whisperx[374].text |
委員我先提一下這個案子我們文化部從他停工到現在在行政的協調還有這個專業的諮詢還有我們這個行政的協處上面我們盡了很大的力量那尤其像上個月我們就有兩次找了專家學者現行他現在的問題就是第一個他結算的部分 |
| transcript.whisperx[375].start |
10717.247 |
| transcript.whisperx[375].end |
10738.538 |
| transcript.whisperx[375].text |
有送到文化部的審議會裡面審議會還有一些意見要退請他再修正另外我們也在上個月有找了專家學者現勘之後給他建議希望他能夠先提出修復的原則還有一些怎麼樣進行的方案也都在持續進行的確是比較慢因為這種事情只要是終止結束契約之後後面的程序比較冗長我們一定會盡全力來協助 |
| transcript.whisperx[376].start |
10741.979 |
| transcript.whisperx[376].end |
10761.732 |
| transcript.whisperx[376].text |
實際上關於台南火車站的修復狀況我也跟建築師公會做過很多的討論那建築師都認為其實增結的點還是在所謂修復人才真的不夠那我想不僅修復人才不夠整個的契約也應該合理化去年11月2號本席有跟史哲部長在教育委員會討論過這個問題公共工程技術服務契約的範本 |
| transcript.whisperx[377].start |
10767.316 |
| transcript.whisperx[377].end |
10789.572 |
| transcript.whisperx[377].text |
本來是採用總包價法在這個文資修復案件中會造成很多的履約爭議那使則部長當時有說文化部對這項問題是有意識的那所以他認為文資修復工作就如同局長剛剛講的變數很大那無法一開始就精準的估量那通常是在進行中才發現說這個設計要改 |
| transcript.whisperx[378].start |
10791.713 |
| transcript.whisperx[378].end |
10792.274 |
| transcript.whisperx[378].text |
請局長回答 |
| transcript.whisperx[379].start |
10818.459 |
| transcript.whisperx[379].end |
10841.096 |
| transcript.whisperx[379].text |
總包價法,我們在去年10月已經召開會議,邀請了全國建築師公會,還有各縣市政府,還有委員辦公室,您的同仁也有去。大家後來發覺說,總包價法,有一些建築師公會原來想要用建造百分比法,但是大家覺得有的時候建造百分比法比總包價法建築師拿到的金錢還要少。 |
| transcript.whisperx[380].start |
10841.816 |
| transcript.whisperx[380].end |
10860.505 |
| transcript.whisperx[380].text |
後來我們在今年2月也邀集全國建築師公會也在商議就照現有的工程會的契約範本裡面增訂經費表的範本用這種方式這種方式我們已經有把這個草案在4月份已經提供給全國建築師公會參考 |
| transcript.whisperx[381].start |
10862.346 |
| transcript.whisperx[381].end |
10862.646 |
| transcript.whisperx[381].text |
我想談到文資修復的建築師的人才不足 |
| transcript.whisperx[382].start |
10878.838 |
| transcript.whisperx[382].end |
10879.018 |
| transcript.whisperx[382].text |
文化部議員 |
| transcript.whisperx[383].start |
10909.259 |
| transcript.whisperx[383].end |
10911 |
| transcript.whisperx[383].text |
上述政策預計會辦理多少年,未來會常態性推動嗎? |
| transcript.whisperx[384].start |
10934.83 |
| transcript.whisperx[384].end |
10936.852 |
| transcript.whisperx[384].text |
我想文資修復建築師就是要鼓勵年輕人來投入 |
| transcript.whisperx[385].start |
10954.369 |
| transcript.whisperx[385].end |
10970.51 |
| transcript.whisperx[385].text |
在這裡我也有個倡議就是說希望文化部來支持那就是修正這個古蹟修復及再利用辦法第19條我們明定領有建築師執照並且在古蹟修復設計及建造培訓班受過培訓的 |
| transcript.whisperx[386].start |
10971.351 |
| transcript.whisperx[386].end |
10996.783 |
| transcript.whisperx[386].text |
人員就可以進行所謂的歷史建築啊紀念建築以及文化景觀的修復及再利用可以這樣來處理嗎因為現在的規定是你有國定古蹟的這個資格才可以修這個歷史建築那當然修歷史建築是不需要任何的資格可是地方政府都會害怕所以就會還是都會有資格的人才會 |
| transcript.whisperx[387].start |
10998.764 |
| transcript.whisperx[387].end |
11024.422 |
| transcript.whisperx[387].text |
讓他能來招標那可是問題卡在這樣子的話就會一直延宕那所有發報常常發報不出去所以如果說有參加這個培訓班的人是不是就可以來進行這個修復資格是這點沒有問題因為我們也看到那個嚴重性所以我們就在未來我們會朝著比如說將士分級制然後他也不一定要做到有執照那個程度他就可以投入這個現場因為我們 |
| transcript.whisperx[388].start |
11026.423 |
| transcript.whisperx[388].end |
11041.114 |
| transcript.whisperx[388].text |
後來了解現場也有蠻多人沒有執照他會做所以這些問題我們文資局都掌握得很清楚所以委員你剛才講這條就是我們未來會一定會往這邊方向去修法的好 |
| transcript.whisperx[389].start |
11041.414 |
| transcript.whisperx[389].end |
11041.674 |
| transcript.whisperx[389].text |
表演者上台 |
| transcript.whisperx[390].start |
11062.25 |
| transcript.whisperx[390].end |
11083.8 |
| transcript.whisperx[390].text |
第一次麥克風出現問題已經很扯可是換過之後居然還沒有聲音我想流行音樂這種盛世發生這種低級錯誤那中段歌手的表演整段重來我覺得這個很多音樂人看了都很心痛那也覺得丟盡了台灣身為科技大國的這個國家顏面部長我想這一次的金曲獎 |
| transcript.whisperx[391].start |
11085.08 |
| transcript.whisperx[391].end |
11103.596 |
| transcript.whisperx[391].text |
陳英工程設備的負責公司據很多音樂人反映說無論是器材的更新保養或者技術人員過去都出現很多的問題這並不是這一次金曲榜才出包他們早在業界就被大家頭痛許久 |
| transcript.whisperx[392].start |
11104.356 |
| transcript.whisperx[392].end |
11133.425 |
| transcript.whisperx[392].text |
所以我想說是不是要有實質的改革作為那特別是我在這邊再強調一下這一次我們委託這個所謂的穩利音響它以前是一個非常大的廠商那幾十年過去了他們確實對他們的器材也好對他們技術也好技術人才也好都沒有做一些更新或所以他們很多技術人才都流失所以他們品質的維持已經是沒有辦法可是為什麼還是會標到案因為他們都用低價去標到 |
| transcript.whisperx[393].start |
11134.385 |
| transcript.whisperx[393].end |
11148.095 |
| transcript.whisperx[393].text |
可是你看接了案子然後搞砸了所以我覺得這個事情可能要再好好的做檢討那是不是我們要要求這整個業界要針對這個事情我覺得這個事情出包確實是很大的遺憾 |
| transcript.whisperx[394].start |
11152.267 |
| transcript.whisperx[394].end |
11152.387 |
| transcript.whisperx[394].text |
主席 |
| transcript.whisperx[395].start |
11185.669 |
| transcript.whisperx[395].end |
11187.19 |
| transcript.whisperx[395].text |
陳秀寶委員蔡英文總統曾經說過如果沒有當年的823的勝利就沒有今天的台灣請問部長您肯定這樣的說法嗎? |
| transcript.whisperx[396].start |
11212.98 |
| transcript.whisperx[396].end |
11239.426 |
| transcript.whisperx[396].text |
當然當然張嘉安也更還原了1958年八二三炮戰的歷史是因為台灣美國及日本聯合對抗共軍來取得勝利本席認為說歷史可以原諒但是不可以忘記當我們持續的努力還原歷史的真相推動轉型正義祈願我們台灣世世代代的子民不但要了解真實的歷史更要彰顯民主自由高舉人權正義因為這是台灣人堅定的信仰也是台灣人的根本 |
| transcript.whisperx[397].start |
11240.006 |
| transcript.whisperx[397].end |
11254.566 |
| transcript.whisperx[397].text |
但是前幾天本席看到一則新聞覺得很難過也非常的擔心曾經參與戰役的這個唯一現存的工訓艦就是中海軍艦那長期閒置在其境的碼頭 |
| transcript.whisperx[398].start |
11255.527 |
| transcript.whisperx[398].end |
11262.249 |
| transcript.whisperx[398].text |
在各方的爭取下,文化部司機有指定中海建設重要的穀物海軍並且也編列了7200萬維護及調查的經費但是國防部在上週的商力院提交的預算解凍報告顯示說,海軍說 |
| transcript.whisperx[399].start |
11270.652 |
| transcript.whisperx[399].end |
11287.949 |
| transcript.whisperx[399].text |
如果仍然沒有地方政府接管、接收、活化再利用將請文化部解除中海建的古物列管我想請教部長這是我們文資保存的做法嗎本席真的很擔心文化部是可以這樣做會這樣子做你們真的會解除列管嗎不會不會 |
| transcript.whisperx[400].start |
11291.137 |
| transcript.whisperx[400].end |
11313.069 |
| transcript.whisperx[400].text |
因為其實對於我們過去這些文物的保存我們一直覺得說我們有把它指定了之後但是後續到底我們如何實質的落實在這些文物保存上面其實很多民眾都非常的關心那中海建未來如果被拆除不但是浪費執行的預算也是顯示文化部我們沒有做文資保存的決心 |
| transcript.whisperx[401].start |
11313.669 |
| transcript.whisperx[401].end |
11314.05 |
| transcript.whisperx[401].text |
部長您說是,一定會 |
| transcript.whisperx[402].start |
11325.188 |
| transcript.whisperx[402].end |
11350.629 |
| transcript.whisperx[402].text |
那有沒有你們有沒有一個怎樣的期程自己本身的規劃期程我想問一下這個文資局局長在過程當中我們都是跟海軍也都保持密切的包括在經費的補助上面也都有編列一定的預算那未來就是後續海軍一定要拿起他負責依照文資法裡面他是所有人必須要負起這個保存修復的責任文化部會在這個相關專業 |
| transcript.whisperx[403].start |
11351.63 |
| transcript.whisperx[403].end |
11352.951 |
| transcript.whisperx[403].text |
文化資產保存法實施40多年來民間甚至是戲稱說文化資產是修一個壞一個 |
| transcript.whisperx[404].start |
11376.269 |
| transcript.whisperx[404].end |
11401.596 |
| transcript.whisperx[404].text |
有時候甚至會出現說專業者之間會互相批評因為大家的論點或想法是不太一樣那有一些主持修復的專家官員們會把提供意見的民眾視為是妨礙修復的鬧事者所以彼此之間會形成對立跟對抗那我想請教部長您真的覺得說對文資修復有意見的民間人士真的一定是恐怖的鬧事者嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[405].start |
11402.076 |
| transcript.whisperx[405].end |
11405.057 |
| transcript.whisperx[405].text |
對於文資修復的這些相關的意見我們去整合它去充分溝通不是我們文字局本來就應該要做的嗎? |
| transcript.whisperx[406].start |
11418.482 |
| transcript.whisperx[406].end |
11444.657 |
| transcript.whisperx[406].text |
是委員你問的問題非常好有兩個層面其實早期台灣比較沒有文資概念的時候都是靠少數人站出來去呼籲說比如說我們現在看到台北好多那個那個幾個最大的園區都是靠少數人提出來的因為當時沒有文資概念所以第一個層面我們不能夠忽略所有對文資有研究的人的意見第二個層面就是 |
| transcript.whisperx[407].start |
11445.802 |
| transcript.whisperx[407].end |
11464.876 |
| transcript.whisperx[407].text |
如果換到文化部去做這些事情的時候我們就碰到有一些法律問題因為他不會那麼單純的只要保留他可能有都更的問題他有那個土地的問題還有這個擁有人的問題所以我們會去盡量溝通是我們的責任所以我不會認為他們是恐怖分子 |
| transcript.whisperx[408].start |
11468.039 |
| transcript.whisperx[408].end |
11488.526 |
| transcript.whisperx[408].text |
謝謝部長李念這樣子肯定就是說願意提供相關訊息相關資料相關意見人其實對於文資保存他就是有這樣的關心而且可能有他本身有這樣的記憶或有這樣子的意見可以來提供我們來協助文資的修復但本席剛有提到就是說充分的溝通其實就是文資局這邊本來就應該要做的 |
| transcript.whisperx[409].start |
11489.386 |
| transcript.whisperx[409].end |
11509.163 |
| transcript.whisperx[409].text |
文化資產的再利用有時候會面臨一些功能性的需求要進行調整那目的就是為了讓建權軟硬體相關的功能讓建築能夠更符合現代需求但建築物本身的新建政見改建修繕遷移或是拆除或其他外型內部的變更都是經過主管機關的審查同意之後才會辦理 |
| transcript.whisperx[410].start |
11512.546 |
| transcript.whisperx[410].end |
11530.661 |
| transcript.whisperx[410].text |
但是看一下最近的例子臺中的歷史建築大屯俊藝所跟臺北的國立歷史博物館在修站工程中明明也經過了相關的文資的審議但是還是遭受爭議還有就是剛才有多位委員非常關心的我們鹿港龍山市的這個修復的這個爭議 |
| transcript.whisperx[411].start |
11532.543 |
| transcript.whisperx[411].end |
11553.016 |
| transcript.whisperx[411].text |
我公司在我們教育委員會質詢追蹤關於龍山市這個修復也追蹤了很多次那整個工程的延宕在鹿港人眼中看起來是非常的焦急因為我們意見無法整合那不管是地方的意見沒有辦法進來或是說得標廠商他受到的為難跟委屈這個部分我們都沒有妥善的處理所以這邊我想請教 |
| transcript.whisperx[412].start |
11554.577 |
| transcript.whisperx[412].end |
11577.838 |
| transcript.whisperx[412].text |
在文化資產保存的這個過程裡面如何能夠做到即使不能人人滿意但是都可以接受文化部在這麼多次的爭議之後有沒有正視這個問題你們如何來處理因為這個標準真的很難定比如說你修到的程度地方不滿意可是我們覺得又符合這個這個標準很難定我想是不是可以請文字局的局長回答好 局長 |
| transcript.whisperx[413].start |
11579.298 |
| transcript.whisperx[413].end |
11581.959 |
| transcript.whisperx[413].text |
所以我會一直強調就是意見的整合跟充分溝通充分溝通真的真的非常的重要 |
| transcript.whisperx[414].start |
11599.366 |
| transcript.whisperx[414].end |
11612.06 |
| transcript.whisperx[414].text |
那這個部分我也希望說你們在這麼多次的經驗之後呢我們面對這樣子的文資的這個保存的部分在會議上充分溝通的重要性你們要去正視而且將來遇到這樣的問題都一定要廣納各方的意見那接下來我想請教部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[415].start |
11617.145 |
| transcript.whisperx[415].end |
11635.432 |
| transcript.whisperx[415].text |
文化部說根據產業調查研究的成果．在廣州產生學院的意見．2022年以高於一般公共工程的工匠薪資．制定傳統匠師每日最低薪資參考基準是3922元．使第一線的傳統匠師受重視有使命感．並希望吸引更多的年輕人．優秀的傳統匠師來投入這個領域 |
| transcript.whisperx[416].start |
11639.614 |
| transcript.whisperx[416].end |
11651.687 |
| transcript.whisperx[416].text |
但是我想請教部長在所有文資修復的案件中每天最低薪資的參考基準傳統教師是不是真的都可以領導?文化部有沒有認真的去查核過?得標的廠商是不是真的都照規定? |
| transcript.whisperx[417].start |
11654.22 |
| transcript.whisperx[417].end |
11672.211 |
| transcript.whisperx[417].text |
我們也知道這個問題因為最低薪資3922可是他一個禮拜只工作兩三天我們在今年年底會讓這個東西落實到讓他們可以領到甚至於我們最近在研擬就是薪資的提高還有分級制因為這個問題我們文化部有警覺到非常嚴重 |
| transcript.whisperx[418].start |
11673.36 |
| transcript.whisperx[418].end |
11689.188 |
| transcript.whisperx[418].text |
對,因為其實我看了一下你們的招標規範其實沒有辦法嚇阻所謂借牌登記的疑慮那我們要保障傳統教師每天有最低薪資的基準其實很難達成所以我希望說文化部這邊你們對這個事情既然你已經有感受到說其實這個是有問題的 |
| transcript.whisperx[419].start |
11691.189 |
| transcript.whisperx[419].end |
11706.479 |
| transcript.whisperx[419].text |
你們也要研議一個相關的方案來真正的落實來保障這些傳統的將士而且呢本席認為說除了薪資之外讓第一線的傳統將士感受到被重視有使命感那年輕的人才願意投入呢也應該有一些相對的一些獎勵一些鼓勵那相對說我們台灣技職教育它有全國技能競賽 |
| transcript.whisperx[420].start |
11712.202 |
| transcript.whisperx[420].end |
11716.827 |
| transcript.whisperx[420].text |
文資修復的部分文化部有沒有辦法研議傳統匠師的競技競賽活動或者一些相關的一些讓一些願意投入的這些傳統匠師他們能夠靠著自己的技能靠著自己的技術來取得這樣子的榮耀有沒有辦法研議有相關的 |
| transcript.whisperx[421].start |
11734.844 |
| transcript.whisperx[421].end |
11759.605 |
| transcript.whisperx[421].text |
我們正在做就是要把優良傳統匠師納入國家文化資產保存的獎項提高他的尊榮感因為我們也辦理修復技術全國技能大賽吸引年輕人投入非常高興委員提這些事剛好就是我們正在做的因為我們覺得年輕人如果能夠投入這個行業讓他薪水夠他生活讓他有榮耀感 |
| transcript.whisperx[422].start |
11760.205 |
| transcript.whisperx[422].end |
11763.626 |
| transcript.whisperx[422].text |
這是非常重要的部長您也點出了足夠的薪資來維持他的生活之外他本身對這一份工作是有使命的是有榮耀感的因為其實傳統教師的培育養成對我們整個的文資修復的重要性我想你們都知道我們需要有這樣的人才 |
| transcript.whisperx[423].start |
11779.81 |
| transcript.whisperx[423].end |
11802.069 |
| transcript.whisperx[423].text |
而且隨著時間的推移需要修復的這些保存的穀物、文物越來越多也越來越急迫所以對於這個國立人才這個部分也希望文化部這邊能夠再多做努力那接下來我想請教一下關於國立台灣大學創立近百年但是被我們監委翻訊息調查的這個報告 |
| transcript.whisperx[424].start |
11803.911 |
| transcript.whisperx[424].end |
11806.993 |
| transcript.whisperx[424].text |
他調查發現說臺大未有效編文化資產分級分類分級修復的整體藍圖那文化資產的疲惫嚴重公有文化資產容積轉移轉的規制尚未健全而且其中臺大一號館的屋齡達92年 |
| transcript.whisperx[425].start |
11821.741 |
| transcript.whisperx[425].end |
11839.736 |
| transcript.whisperx[425].text |
雖然是在2002年有列冊追蹤．但是沒有審慎的修繕．已經喊請臺大及文化部檢討改進．那這邊我要請教部長．文化部如何明確的規範呢．文資執行的事項．並且建立通報系統．讓公有的建造物的所有或管理單位有所平一還是局長您要回答 |
| transcript.whisperx[426].start |
11844.684 |
| transcript.whisperx[426].end |
11846.946 |
| transcript.whisperx[426].text |
我們是有這樣子的程序沒錯但是我們如何明確的規範或者說如何落實這些相關的通報機制 |
| transcript.whisperx[427].start |
11864.818 |
| transcript.whisperx[427].end |
11893.001 |
| transcript.whisperx[427].text |
有的 這個現在目前一個我們現在跟各縣市政府也已經也去跟他們的有進行的一些聯繫要建立一些尤其是這個尤其所謂的所謂的大家提到就會有誤猜的方式這種可能就是在地方縣市地方應該要有一個橫向聯繫所以文資局現在正在做正在跟地方政府這個聯繫中那這個部分我也請你如果有一定的進度的時候你一份報告給我辦公室好嗎可以好 以上 謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[428].start |
11895.469 |
| transcript.whisperx[428].end |
11910.4 |
| transcript.whisperx[428].text |
好 謝謝 謝謝秀邦委員部長請回我接下來請吳春成委員我知道我知道好 有請這個部長好 有請部長吳委員你好那個部長好那個 |
| transcript.whisperx[429].start |
11929.186 |
| transcript.whisperx[429].end |
11933.738 |
| transcript.whisperx[429].text |
這個部長看到我今天這個標題你有什麼感想? |
| transcript.whisperx[430].start |
11937.27 |
| transcript.whisperx[430].end |
11960.338 |
| transcript.whisperx[430].text |
文化亂了套我覺得蠻容易亂了套還容易亂套因為我覺得文化是一個太複雜的一個太複雜的問題那個大家都在談經期講但是我也有出席啦去看啦但是我覺得辦的事情還是主辦單位還是很辛苦啦大家這個但是我現在舉這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[431].start |
11962.538 |
| transcript.whisperx[431].end |
11979.4 |
| transcript.whisperx[431].text |
那天晚上有位大陸藝人高潔講了一句大家晚上好然後就被出征了這個部長覺得這是這樣子是什麼回事 |
| transcript.whisperx[432].start |
11980.482 |
| transcript.whisperx[432].end |
12003.619 |
| transcript.whisperx[432].text |
我覺得我跟高杰還蠻熟的他是台灣藝人專門演黑道他那天講大家晚上好的時候我也有一點覺得他怎麼會講這個因為他以前是跟我們那個時代的人那個時代真的不會講大家晚上好可見的這個語言的傳播透過網路他其實很嚴重那至於你說他講這個對不對我覺得只有一種 |
| transcript.whisperx[433].start |
12004.74 |
| transcript.whisperx[433].end |
12029.628 |
| transcript.whisperx[433].text |
聽得舒不舒服感覺好不好而已我覺得好像沒有對不對啦因為語言這個東西我上次也講過這也是一個問題啦這也是一個問題人都會這樣子嘛你到一個地方開久了你就會有那些的口音啦你會有那些口音啦但是我們現在好像把這些因為這都是中文很容易這樣子混的大家會不會搞得太緊張了 |
| transcript.whisperx[434].start |
12031.694 |
| transcript.whisperx[434].end |
12039.462 |
| transcript.whisperx[434].text |
問候一下也需要出征嗎?你覺得台灣是怎麼回事?台灣的文化是哪裡出問題?這個部分我覺得 |
| transcript.whisperx[435].start |
12043.837 |
| transcript.whisperx[435].end |
12060.025 |
| transcript.whisperx[435].text |
我覺得台灣某方面大家好像蠻對立的就是那個對立到我覺得蠻讓別人不太好會嚇一跳的結果就像我這次進去講如果是一個天安門事件在台灣現在講話很緊張你知道嗎真的是講話我覺得不是好現象對很緊張我覺得我們 |
| transcript.whisperx[436].start |
12067.589 |
| transcript.whisperx[436].end |
12084.755 |
| transcript.whisperx[436].text |
民主運動當中政治是戒嚴的但是現在變成文化戒嚴文化戒嚴我們真的是一個文化戒嚴的國家動不動就思想犯就出征人家就質疑忠誠質疑對方的忠誠包括你講的語言包括你講的台灣這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[437].start |
12086.075 |
| transcript.whisperx[437].end |
12110.667 |
| transcript.whisperx[437].text |
台灣是一個文化大國耶台灣是一個充滿本來文化是我們的優勢耶現在文化互相殘殺然後互相指責對方互相戴帽子這文化部應該要好好來想辦法解決這個問題啦我不是說這是文化部的問題啦但是要解決當然還是要靠文化部啦文化部絕對不能在天流家畜啦然後再來看 |
| transcript.whisperx[438].start |
12112.643 |
| transcript.whisperx[438].end |
12138.431 |
| transcript.whisperx[438].text |
這裡是哪裡 這不是日本喔 這台灣喔我們台灣每次到溫泉祭的時候喔 那個意象表演一定會穿和服 穿彩目機 對不對然後跳了這些這是什麼 這個魅力嗎還是說溫泉只能是有日本的文化台灣溫泉這麼的發達為什麼不能有台灣自己的概念 |
| transcript.whisperx[439].start |
12140.731 |
| transcript.whisperx[439].end |
12141.615 |
| transcript.whisperx[439].text |
這個問題我覺得問得很好 |
| transcript.whisperx[440].start |
12144.942 |
| transcript.whisperx[440].end |
12166.617 |
| transcript.whisperx[440].text |
臺灣是一個被動的在這個這個歷史上都是被動的被別人統治那只要統治50年他的文化就進來了包括語言包括服裝包括一切還有現在是世界化大家年輕人是看看網路看日劇看韓劇他會朝著流行去這件事情說起來是蠻複雜的 |
| transcript.whisperx[441].start |
12175.123 |
| transcript.whisperx[441].end |
12177.225 |
| transcript.whisperx[441].text |
這是什麼?文化是這樣的選擇性跟對立嗎? |
| transcript.whisperx[442].start |
12181.058 |
| transcript.whisperx[442].end |
12205.072 |
| transcript.whisperx[442].text |
您的問題非常好因為我覺得文化基本上應該是認同吧就是譬如說我認同這個東西我就覺得它非常好我不認同它我就覺得非常不好所以我覺得現在這樣子啦我自己的比如說像日本啦日本的是葫蘆吞草的文化啦它不管像我們現在包括哇你用這個比如說大魚治水啦他們在問說大魚是誰啦 |
| transcript.whisperx[443].start |
12207.834 |
| transcript.whisperx[443].end |
12232.273 |
| transcript.whisperx[443].text |
大禹如果你不知道這個故事你講這個成語就沒意義嘛所以當他在運用這語言的時候一定要了解他的歷史那我們現在在排除他的歷史的時候連我們的語言都會被排除就會造成很多的衝突啦那所以呢通常怎麼處理這種文化問題像日本他就是土藻他不管是哪一國的文化他都混混吞藻吞下去 |
| transcript.whisperx[444].start |
12233.354 |
| transcript.whisperx[444].end |
12244.606 |
| transcript.whisperx[444].text |
不用擔心這種事情文化呢會自己消化消化適合庶民生活會被留下來有的就會被排泄掉 |
| transcript.whisperx[445].start |
12245.93 |
| transcript.whisperx[445].end |
12272.658 |
| transcript.whisperx[445].text |
他自然會這樣子我們國家不要那麼的緊張好不好我很怕什麼文化入侵很大什麼所以這邊要戒嚴這邊要擋住門這邊要講這話然後很多的事情包容一個多元文化臺灣應該包容多元文化我不管是怎麼樣文化特別跟我們極大關係這麼密切的中文文化你如果再去排擠它的話稍微一個字眼的話我們自己會自己會業業那個啦好 |
| transcript.whisperx[446].start |
12275.342 |
| transcript.whisperx[446].end |
12275.853 |
| transcript.whisperx[446].text |
接下來呢 |
| transcript.whisperx[447].start |
12278.419 |
| transcript.whisperx[447].end |
12279.479 |
| transcript.whisperx[447].text |
臺灣的多元文化在消失 |
| transcript.whisperx[448].start |
12307.618 |
| transcript.whisperx[448].end |
12317.81 |
| transcript.whisperx[448].text |
人家不把我們看在眼裡了啦台灣已經變成文化小國了啦我們本來是一個文化大國變成文化小國啦這是怎麼造成的 |
| transcript.whisperx[449].start |
12318.939 |
| transcript.whisperx[449].end |
12347.822 |
| transcript.whisperx[449].text |
部長你覺得我覺得我們自己本身忽略了自己文化的重要還有在政策上比韓國晚了覺醒韓國從1998年開始金大中上台他就知道文化立國直接立法在法律上直接立法投入很多的錢那是1998年到了2000年之後韓流就起來了然後2003年有一個導演叫李昌東被聘為文化部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[450].start |
12348.602 |
| transcript.whisperx[450].end |
12377.496 |
| transcript.whisperx[450].text |
在他手上把整個行流做起來這個部長我覺得我們這個當然不能透露我們是自己就是文化政治化文化為政治服務政治大力的干預到過去當國民黨時代的時候當然是文化的民進黨起來的時候也是一樣統治文化然後排組其他都互相的對立了其實這個搞的其實這才是最大根本原因以前也沒有說政府這麼多的補助現在也沒有說比以前補助的少以前為什麼這麼的 |
| transcript.whisperx[451].start |
12378.416 |
| transcript.whisperx[451].end |
12392.652 |
| transcript.whisperx[451].text |
現在不僅不補助 現在還會追殺你知道嗎現在還會追殺異己耶這才是文化墮落最大的原因啦文化墮落最大的原因只容許跟自己意識概念相同的文化 |
| transcript.whisperx[452].start |
12393.493 |
| transcript.whisperx[452].end |
12419.113 |
| transcript.whisperx[452].text |
主促這種狹隘的文化然後對包括我們現在大家推崇原住民我也非常推崇原住民你知道我們在國際大看板當中在做台灣的介紹看板都有很多原住民的圖示所以很多國際有人以為我們是非洲國家你知道嗎以為台灣的意向就是原住民你知道就是但是為什麼因為台灣找不到自己現在的用原住民最安全 |
| transcript.whisperx[453].start |
12420.554 |
| transcript.whisperx[453].end |
12429.061 |
| transcript.whisperx[453].text |
原住民是最安全的意象你用任何的圖像下來都會引起內部的一種糾紛包括以前小學踢踐子都會被指證這個媚中一幫大隊隨便的亂指責這一點 |
| transcript.whisperx[454].start |
12438.408 |
| transcript.whisperx[454].end |
12453.23 |
| transcript.whisperx[454].text |
這一點我很期待因為我知道你是一個文化人 真正的文化人就給我們委員解釋一下文化部差不多至少這10年他在補助的時候他不會看這個他請來一群委員完全不會看這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[455].start |
12454.432 |
| transcript.whisperx[455].end |
12454.592 |
| transcript.whisperx[455].text |
委員相信我們 |
| transcript.whisperx[456].start |
12478.713 |
| transcript.whisperx[456].end |
12492.449 |
| transcript.whisperx[456].text |
我相信你啦我相信你是一個文化人我們繼續在這方面努力啦來端正這個給文化人尊嚴給文化人台灣真的很可惜台灣是一個文化非常文化跟金融一樣 |
| transcript.whisperx[457].start |
12493.57 |
| transcript.whisperx[457].end |
12495.611 |
| transcript.whisperx[457].text |
臺灣要有文化包容度、文化的吸引力 |
| transcript.whisperx[458].start |
12527.791 |
| transcript.whisperx[458].end |
12530.332 |
| transcript.whisperx[458].text |
主席有請部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[459].start |
12549.543 |
| transcript.whisperx[459].end |
12573.862 |
| transcript.whisperx[459].text |
議長委員好 我們又見面了對 部長好 謝謝我們今天談文化資產保存因為我們板橋有林家花園應該是國定古蹟最近因為那個菜刀坊零四零三地震之後有毀損然後地方政府有跟中央申請補助不知道下來沒有核准啊核准多少錢核准多少錢 我想知不清我自己計算回答一下 |
| transcript.whisperx[460].start |
12575.93 |
| transcript.whisperx[460].end |
12589.628 |
| transcript.whisperx[460].text |
委員我們再查一下因為我們才發生在第一週我們才去看這個會全額補助嘛對不對我們那個速度可不可以快一點好不好因為這個林家花園是我們板橋很重要的地標 |
| transcript.whisperx[461].start |
12591.109 |
| transcript.whisperx[461].end |
12591.589 |
| transcript.whisperx[461].text |
文化資產保存法 |
| transcript.whisperx[462].start |
12613.557 |
| transcript.whisperx[462].end |
12633.407 |
| transcript.whisperx[462].text |
文化資產它被提報它被提報成為要變成文化資產的時候它的保存維護修繕都要仰賴文化部所給的B類補助嘛對不對但是B類補助是不是預算有限所以導致於說很多補助它沒辦法及時也沒辦法達到比如說 |
| transcript.whisperx[463].start |
12634.668 |
| transcript.whisperx[463].end |
12652.482 |
| transcript.whisperx[463].text |
相當的額度所以就會造成一個狀況就是他那個文化資產因為沒有辦法及時修繕造成他的價值不斷的減損那這個問題其實蠻嚴重的那我不知道說文化部有沒有想要針對這個問題做提出一些對岸策略出來有沒有 |
| transcript.whisperx[464].start |
12654.465 |
| transcript.whisperx[464].end |
12680.418 |
| transcript.whisperx[464].text |
請文字局局長回答業務委員第一個我們當然是積極的爭取預算像跟誰爭取跟像行政院像我們我剛才提到的全國的古蹟歷史建築的修補助的一些修復經費大概都是我們有一個忠誠計畫叫做歷史與文化資產維護發展計畫的忠誠計畫已經18年了今年第19年都是靠這個計畫去年在第5期6年計畫不用講那麼細因為我們沒有那麼多時間所以 |
| transcript.whisperx[465].start |
12681.318 |
| transcript.whisperx[465].end |
12708.061 |
| transcript.whisperx[465].text |
我只是跟你講問題很嚴重啦是是 了解完全了解我們不然取高可寡啦講的好像文化資產我們都重視但實際上在地方很多破損要申請補助拿不到嘛然後他他不斷的毀損價值遞減你到時候要修繕的時候你要花更多的錢啊所以這部分我覺得是比較急的問題要解決第二個問題是很多我們的民眾啊他們家的家產啊如果被劃定為文化資產的時候其實都不高興 |
| transcript.whisperx[466].start |
12709.076 |
| transcript.whisperx[466].end |
12735.292 |
| transcript.whisperx[466].text |
你有發現這件事嗎?很少人是說我很高興我們家被化文化資產主要就是給的獎勵太少了嘛那給的獎勵少又影響到他去處分這個財產嘛所以他們都不高興那常常在地方就造成很多對立啊那這個部分我不曉得能不能解決比如說在修法或者是在給相關的獎勵方面可以多一點讓他覺得做這個事情很好願意配合 有可能嘛 |
| transcript.whisperx[467].start |
12737.708 |
| transcript.whisperx[467].end |
12761.751 |
| transcript.whisperx[467].text |
好 委員就是現有的話我們有一些獎勵措施這不夠啊對 也不夠你有沒有去了解一下那些被列為文化資產的那些人他們的心情如何是 委員講的的確是事實那你們都視而不見啊我想我們現在要這是我長期觀察到的問題啦剛好今天是這個主題我就反映給你們我希望說不管是在補助的額度跟速度 |
| transcript.whisperx[468].start |
12762.672 |
| transcript.whisperx[468].end |
12776.564 |
| transcript.whisperx[468].text |
還有包括就是有人如果他的家產被劃為文化資產相對應的獎勵我覺得一定要提高啦不然就是取高合寡講得好像講得很厲害的樣子我們很重視實際上更無法落實 |
| transcript.whisperx[469].start |
12777.985 |
| transcript.whisperx[469].end |
12784.229 |
| transcript.whisperx[469].text |
接下來我要來關心一下黃牛票的事張學友演唱會剛結束劉德娃又要來了張學友那時候的票很多人都很多抱怨因為黃牛的問題 |
| transcript.whisperx[470].start |
12801.428 |
| transcript.whisperx[470].end |
12808.082 |
| transcript.whisperx[470].text |
我上次也關心過 文化部因為打黃牛成立了一個打黃牛辦公室10個月花了800萬 |
| transcript.whisperx[471].start |
12810.016 |
| transcript.whisperx[471].end |
12831.573 |
| transcript.whisperx[471].text |
當時是由常會律師事務所得標那計畫主持人叫袁秀慧他的顧問叫蘇孔志後來我們有跟你們調資料你們有給我看他因為我非常好奇為什麼打黃牛要成立一個黃牛辦公室啊所以八百萬怎麼分配呢我就看了一下結果發現真的很奇怪這個案子 |
| transcript.whisperx[472].start |
12832.273 |
| transcript.whisperx[472].end |
12857.406 |
| transcript.whisperx[472].text |
第一 光人力 包括計畫主持人 協同主持人 專案經理 還有辦公室督導加上辦公室的人員五位 成立這個辦公室有九個人就是說文化部為了打黃流 成立一個打黃流國家隊然後另外呢 又請了九個人來做這個事情第二 非常就是說你已經請了人 然後那些人的業務範圍內的工作還要另外再付他錢 |
| transcript.whisperx[473].start |
12858.775 |
| transcript.whisperx[473].end |
12874.698 |
| transcript.whisperx[473].text |
舉例來講 我有一個紅色畫起來叫做客訴報表會診他每個月他要出一個民眾打來的客訴的報表可能是一個Excel你一個月還要給他3萬塊阿我不是已經請人來做這個事了嗎我還要他做的事情我還要額外給他錢 |
| transcript.whisperx[474].start |
12875.899 |
| transcript.whisperx[474].end |
12897.915 |
| transcript.whisperx[474].text |
好比說我今天請了一個國會助理我一個月給他五萬結果他每次幫我寫質詢稿還要給我案件記酬這感覺非常不合理啊然後另外我們再來看什麼電腦處理費裡面還有一個叫電腦使用時間費就是說欸我們已經給了他這個錢了但是呢他只要有用到他辦公室電腦我另外還要再給錢 |
| transcript.whisperx[475].start |
12899.778 |
| transcript.whisperx[475].end |
12923.816 |
| transcript.whisperx[475].text |
還有付一個瓷片的費用我不知道我們這個年代還有人在用瓷片也是讓我覺得很奇怪那另外還有一個行政管理費就已經付錢給他們那麼多的薪水了然後還要再給他行政管理費所以這個預算的編列我真的覺得非常奇怪剛剛我們在講文化資產保護都說沒錢可是打黃牛的錢是可以這樣隨便給 |
| transcript.whisperx[476].start |
12925.765 |
| transcript.whisperx[476].end |
12951.208 |
| transcript.whisperx[476].text |
那我不知道部長你這樣乍看之下你覺得有沒有很奇怪?乍看?對,乍看有沒有很奇怪?或者是我剛剛聽我這樣講完我請一個助理然後我那個助理幫我寫一個諮詢稿還要另外跟我收錢或者是他幫我準備一些PP PowerPoint還要跟我收錢就會合理嗎?我覺得我請次長回答好不好?等一下部長你回答啦好不好? |
| transcript.whisperx[477].start |
12952.478 |
| transcript.whisperx[477].end |
12952.758 |
| transcript.whisperx[477].text |
委員會主席 |
| transcript.whisperx[478].start |
12970.522 |
| transcript.whisperx[478].end |
12988.188 |
| transcript.whisperx[478].text |
部長你沒關係你先稍微看一下後面還有其他資料我秀一下那這個標案的人全部都綠油油比如說這個顧問蘇孔志他就是民進黨的政策會副執行長之前的然後袁常惠律師以前是也是這個謝長廷的子弟兵 |
| transcript.whisperx[479].start |
12988.868 |
| transcript.whisperx[479].end |
12989.008 |
| transcript.whisperx[479].text |
主席 |
| transcript.whisperx[480].start |
13008.205 |
| transcript.whisperx[480].end |
13022.25 |
| transcript.whisperx[480].text |
這個...然後我們辦公室也有跟你們去要這個案子的結案報告結案報告就是說他到底打了多少黃牛多少黃牛是因為他的關係被抓到然後讓很多本來買不到張學友票的人買到了我看不到這個結案報告書 |
| transcript.whisperx[481].start |
13024.315 |
| transcript.whisperx[481].end |
13027.656 |
| transcript.whisperx[481].text |
原秀會是綠油油這件事我稍微給我一點機會假如我沒有記錯他是柯文哲時代法律的那個主管 |
| transcript.whisperx[482].start |
13040.842 |
| transcript.whisperx[482].end |
13067.039 |
| transcript.whisperx[482].text |
那也有可能現在跟柯文哲不好啦但是他的現在律師事務所上面的網站是講說他跟謝長廷很好其實我覺得我們台灣最糟糕就是把一個人貼標籤說他是綠還是藍還是白這是他標榜的他標榜的他標榜如果說因為我也很少看到律師事務所他的訴求是他是綠油油我也沒看過但他的網站上就是這樣我印象中他應該 |
| transcript.whisperx[483].start |
13067.739 |
| transcript.whisperx[483].end |
13068.66 |
| transcript.whisperx[483].text |
黃牛專案防制人力勞務採購黃牛專案防制人力勞務採購 |
| transcript.whisperx[484].start |
13089.838 |
| transcript.whisperx[484].end |
13114.904 |
| transcript.whisperx[484].text |
又來做這個黃牛專案防治人力勞務採購今天沒有時間我先把這些問題都點出來你事後再給我報告然後再來我們來看今年因為剛剛那個案子原常會律師事務所的案子是10個月800萬今年呢我們把那個標案延長了變成一年半同樣的標案打黃牛國家隊的案子把它變成一年半然後費用也增加變1500萬 |
| transcript.whisperx[485].start |
13116.624 |
| transcript.whisperx[485].end |
13121.345 |
| transcript.whisperx[485].text |
那 有人跟我講說得標廠商叫普華律師事務所是嗎是普華嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[486].start |
13123.96 |
| transcript.whisperx[486].end |
13152.619 |
| transcript.whisperx[486].text |
是普華嘛對普華裡面有一個合夥人叫賴芳玉只是跟民進黨很多立委是好朋友那再來我們來看一下普華最近的案子他得到113年到114年18個月1500萬的打黃牛辦公室然後他112年也有得到文化部一個法律諮詢服務案148萬這讓我覺得非常奇怪你知道嗎就是我們已經 |
| transcript.whisperx[487].start |
13154.139 |
| transcript.whisperx[487].end |
13180.914 |
| transcript.whisperx[487].text |
為了我們已經有了這個法律諮詢的服務案然後我們打黃油又要再找別的律師來諮詢這已經有一個統整的法律諮詢案然後針對特定項目又要再委託別的法律顧問來諮詢我覺得文化部是不是真的錢很多如果錢真的這麼多的話可不可以把一部分的錢撥到文化資產那邊去就是說我們現在文化資產很缺費用 |
| transcript.whisperx[488].start |
13182.177 |
| transcript.whisperx[488].end |
13200.062 |
| transcript.whisperx[488].text |
因為今天時間關係,我現在把這些問題點出來,就像說事後部長可不可以了解一下,因為你也是剛上任嘛,了解一下,因為感覺文化部錢真的非常多,可以這樣花的很多啦,我覺得這些就很多,我剛剛隨便念就很多嘛, |
| transcript.whisperx[489].start |
13200.862 |
| transcript.whisperx[489].end |
13202.023 |
| transcript.whisperx[489].text |
今天由委員提出臨時提案一案請宣讀 |
| transcript.whisperx[490].start |
13230.069 |
| transcript.whisperx[490].end |
13247.9 |
| transcript.whisperx[490].text |
本屆金曲獎表演者麥克風無聲事件引發各界嘩然不僅傷害流行音樂聲勢金曲獎聲譽亦丟盡臺灣作為科技大國之國家顏面更有音樂人反映成因工程設備負責公司已非首次出包無論是器材的更新保養 |
| transcript.whisperx[491].start |
13248.8 |
| transcript.whisperx[491].end |
13272.739 |
| transcript.whisperx[491].text |
又或者技術人才品質皆遭業界質疑．文化部應於一個月內以書面形式．對立法院教育及文化委員會提出報告．說明實質改革作為．以使對經取獎承辦單位．與相關廠商之審查標準得以提升．透露私同經濟整體作業．提案人林一景．連署人陳培宇．吳佩玉范雲軒的完畢 |
| transcript.whisperx[492].start |
13275.424 |
| transcript.whisperx[492].end |
13276.465 |
| transcript.whisperx[492].text |
黃國昌委員 |
| transcript.whisperx[493].start |
13317.027 |
| transcript.whisperx[493].end |
13318.309 |
| transcript.whisperx[493].text |
臺灣社會充滿了詐騙的事情 |
| transcript.whisperx[494].start |
13335.103 |
| transcript.whisperx[494].end |
13356.78 |
| transcript.whisperx[494].text |
在這些詐騙集團的詐騙犯可以得逞的過程當中有一些不肖的媒體甚至是假冒的媒體扮演著推波助瀾的效果因為有很多人在一個新的所謂的虛擬貨幣或是交易平台剛上線的時候大家資訊不足 |
| transcript.whisperx[495].start |
13358.061 |
| transcript.whisperx[495].end |
13381.473 |
| transcript.whisperx[495].text |
就開始去找有沒有這個虛擬貨幣或是這個平台相關的報導或者是新聞結果這些詐騙集團越搞越誇張越搞越誇張為了要在資訊上面讓更多的人受騙能夠上車他們自己在外面搞假的媒體公司 |
| transcript.whisperx[496].start |
13382.659 |
| transcript.whisperx[496].end |
13408.416 |
| transcript.whisperx[496].text |
搞假的媒體公司是因為表面上是媒體公司實際上面看出來的新聞全部都是在幫這些詐騙集團promote出來的新聞這種假媒體公司一定要徹底掃蕩他已經成為整個社會的亂源了媒體不是文化部管的 |
| transcript.whisperx[497].start |
13409.266 |
| transcript.whisperx[497].end |
13418.852 |
| transcript.whisperx[497].text |
我今天會提這個質詢是因為我看了我心裡很難過因為中央通訊社是我們國家的通訊社 |
| transcript.whisperx[498].start |
13420.154 |
| transcript.whisperx[498].end |
13448.868 |
| transcript.whisperx[498].text |
中央社如果寫出來的東西成為詐騙集團犯罪計畫的一環的話這件事情很嚴重部長同不同意完全同意接下來的事情有一點複雜我簡單的跟部長講一下在媒體上面現在現實上已經造成了一堆人受害的王牌交易所王牌交易所的結構 |
| transcript.whisperx[499].start |
13450.861 |
| transcript.whisperx[499].end |
13470.147 |
| transcript.whisperx[499].text |
兩個祖先 吸金用沒有流通性的虛擬貨幣 吸了二十幾億甚至去利用蓮池金色 這個宗教團體母女兩個人之間 用不法犯罪所得 層層的 |
| transcript.whisperx[500].start |
13472.248 |
| transcript.whisperx[500].end |
13487.725 |
| transcript.whisperx[500].text |
成立了一堆人頭公司來幫忙洗錢那其中有一家公司我覺得很奇怪叫做移賺股份有限公司在檢察官偵辦整個犯罪的過程當中起訴的過程當中發現了 |
| transcript.whisperx[501].start |
13489.387 |
| transcript.whisperx[501].end |
13515.221 |
| transcript.whisperx[501].text |
這一個人頭謝詩穎女性她現在正在被法院羈押當中她當人頭用不法犯罪所得用不法犯罪所得所成立的其中一家其中一家人頭公司是在整個犯罪集團當中的一環她公司登記的地址在三立集團的大樓裡面舊中路那個大樓的三樓 |
| transcript.whisperx[502].start |
13516.141 |
| transcript.whisperx[502].end |
13544.366 |
| transcript.whisperx[502].text |
其中有40%的持股是三立集團下面的創造智能股份有限公司共同持有這個一賺股份有限公司這個一賺股份有限公司到底是在幹嘛的涉入整個詐欺的罪行扮演什麼角色還有帶檢察官進一步的釐清這個跟部長我今天要請教部長的事情一點關係都沒有但我要告訴部長的事情是什麼 |
| transcript.whisperx[503].start |
13546.301 |
| transcript.whisperx[503].end |
13566.746 |
| transcript.whisperx[503].text |
裡面現在一樣同樣被起訴的兩位資深媒體人一位叫做江建良一位叫做李燕蘭他們兩個都涉入了整個詐騙集團的範圍當中那這兩位跟三立集團也有關係但這也不是我今天要跟部長講的重點但我要請部長看齁 |
| transcript.whisperx[504].start |
13568.226 |
| transcript.whisperx[504].end |
13597.144 |
| transcript.whisperx[504].text |
他們的犯罪手法是什麼明明知道銷售沒有實際應用價值沒有實際價值的垃圾幣然後呢他們要鑄造NFT跟Shabob平台合作這個Shabob平台是這個詐欺犯的主弦整個犯罪結構當中其中的一環他騙大家什麼你買這個虛擬貨幣未來到這個Shabob平台上面有交換價值可以質押借款 |
| transcript.whisperx[505].start |
13597.924 |
| transcript.whisperx[505].end |
13622.673 |
| transcript.whisperx[505].text |
但問題是什麼這個平台本身就是詐騙集團的一環我剛剛跟部長講的那個狀況我們現在這些詐騙集團厲害到什麼他去成立媒體公司叫做民生科技傳媒他上面怎麼講的Shabot NFT藝術平台上架然後可以怎麼樣成為治理代幣 |
| transcript.whisperx[506].start |
13624.386 |
| transcript.whisperx[506].end |
13641.919 |
| transcript.whisperx[506].text |
治理代幣成為焦點在promote在promote整個詐騙集團不管是NFT還是剛剛我所講的那個shabot平台我把它圈起來部長您看一下這位記者徐維存這個徐維存這個徐維存 |
| transcript.whisperx[507].start |
13644.338 |
| transcript.whisperx[507].end |
13666.495 |
| transcript.whisperx[507].text |
是一個假人根本不存在他所發的所有的稿子全部都是那詐騙集團寫的好最後一張slide是我今天要拜託部長回去請中央社徹查的為什麼因為在整個詐騙的進行過程當中來看一下我們的中央社2023年3月28號 |
| transcript.whisperx[508].start |
13669.148 |
| transcript.whisperx[508].end |
13689.974 |
| transcript.whisperx[508].text |
2023年3月28號正是整個詐欺的範型最嚴重的時候最多人受害的時候我們的中央社發了什麼新聞創造智能與三立合作發行NFT首創影視娛樂通行證我不要造成任何誤會我今天沒有站在這邊指控 |
| transcript.whisperx[509].start |
13691.034 |
| transcript.whisperx[509].end |
13706.893 |
| transcript.whisperx[509].text |
說三立是這個詐騙集團的議員沒有我沒有提出這樣的指控但請部長看最後一段這稿子是怎麼寫的對於NFT的流通性與保值創造智能此次與NFT平台Shabot合作 |
| transcript.whisperx[510].start |
13707.714 |
| transcript.whisperx[510].end |
13724.833 |
| transcript.whisperx[510].text |
使用者可以在Shopbo平台直押NFT避免當NFT流通性枯竭時產生有含無適的風險最終目標是讓企業和品牌的NFT產生明確價值幫助使用者保值這一段描述 |
| transcript.whisperx[511].start |
13726.178 |
| transcript.whisperx[511].end |
13750.906 |
| transcript.whisperx[511].text |
跟我們前面所講的詐騙集團在外面成立空殼公司用假的記者所發出的詐騙新聞稿的描述啊一模一樣小報平台就是這整個王牌交易所詐騙集團當中的一環我要請部長拜託回去徹查我們的國家通訊社中央社怎麼發這種新聞啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[512].start |
13753.806 |
| transcript.whisperx[512].end |
13781.704 |
| transcript.whisperx[512].text |
怎麼發這種新聞啊在幫這個詐騙集團他們所promote負責拿來欺騙人的平台竟然在幫他們什麼用中央社的招牌在幫他們背書promote這是一件很嚴重的事情因為在檢察官起訴的犯罪事實裡這種假新聞稿已經成為詐騙檢察官起訴犯罪行為當中的一環了 |
| transcript.whisperx[513].start |
13784.107 |
| transcript.whisperx[513].end |
13803.184 |
| transcript.whisperx[513].text |
背後這個假記者背後的人在寫稿的人也一起被起訴了但我真的很痛心的是你如果是那種莫名其妙的公司莫名其妙的記者寫的東西就算了這個是我們中央通訊社2023年3月28號的發稿現在整個王牌交易所全部 |
| transcript.whisperx[514].start |
13805.114 |
| transcript.whisperx[514].end |
13816.864 |
| transcript.whisperx[514].text |
大部分的人被羈押的羈押 被起訴的起訴結果這個在幫這個已經被偵破的詐騙集團在Promote的新聞竟然還掛在我們中央社上面這個新聞到底怎麼出來的這是廣編嗎這個是收錢嗎還是有人委託 |
| transcript.whisperx[515].start |
13831.448 |
| transcript.whisperx[515].end |
13849.124 |
| transcript.whisperx[515].text |
要中央社的記者看這種幫詐騙集團Promote的新聞部長可不可以承諾徹查沒有問題如果是涉及到跟文化部有關的中央社我來瞭解而且我們會這個新聞怎麼產製出來的是稿子誰提供的是這很嚴重欸 |
| transcript.whisperx[516].start |
13850.645 |
| transcript.whisperx[516].end |
13854.227 |
| transcript.whisperx[516].text |
謝謝黃國昌委員 部長請回我們接下來請范雲委員謝謝昭偉 有請部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[517].start |
13879.684 |
| transcript.whisperx[517].end |
13880.232 |
| transcript.whisperx[517].text |
好 有請部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[518].start |
13885.812 |
| transcript.whisperx[518].end |
13904.505 |
| transcript.whisperx[518].text |
報議員你好部長午安辛苦了因為剛剛已經很多人就是檢討了我們的金曲獎的頒獎而且我們今天已經有個臨時提案已經通過了所以我就不再多講那我本來是一周但我想配合大家那我還想再提一個就是除了小編剛剛吳佩儀委員有把小編就是這個絕對不是只是小編可以處理的因為就跟這次巴奈講的 |
| transcript.whisperx[519].start |
13912.571 |
| transcript.whisperx[519].end |
13924.438 |
| transcript.whisperx[519].text |
音樂本身不是跟政治無關所以金曲獎的頒獎過去已經有非常多跟政治相關的議題所以我想那個SOP沒有執行真的應該要好好的檢討那怎麼看待金曲現場的這個小編的服務 |
| transcript.whisperx[520].start |
13928.9 |
| transcript.whisperx[520].end |
13948.124 |
| transcript.whisperx[520].text |
另外我想我再補充一下當天的麥克風不是只有那個就是MC Hotdog上場的時候那整個高度都一直還好幾度遮掩了我們重要致詞人的臉部我在現場看到都覺得很尷尬所以這些檢討那就是也請都一併進入好嗎因為這是我們這麼重要的一個文化活動那當天現場我是覺得 |
| transcript.whisperx[521].start |
13952.265 |
| transcript.whisperx[521].end |
13952.765 |
| transcript.whisperx[521].text |
文化部發言更謹慎 |
| transcript.whisperx[522].start |
13974.713 |
| transcript.whisperx[522].end |
13996.96 |
| transcript.whisperx[522].text |
那就是我們剛剛部長有講到之前文化部說因為是國防部阻撓嘛那顧立雄部長我精彩知道是我們領域委員去質詢的就非常精彩的內容他已經說了可以不要在同項旁那再來就是文化部主管的事那可惜我們文化部次長的回應讓人感覺說 |
| transcript.whisperx[523].start |
13998.28 |
| transcript.whisperx[523].end |
14026.091 |
| transcript.whisperx[523].text |
是說是跨部會活動不是單一部會說的算好像給人感覺一個怎麼又互踢皮球了所以我覺得那最近又有剛剛林經緯也有提到的就是行政院專界長轉型推動專案小組成員的發言說已經做出撤出的決議當然部長剛剛有澄清說您有看到這個記錄可是我的感覺是今天部長才有在現場把這個價值態度講得比較清楚 |
| transcript.whisperx[524].start |
14026.932 |
| transcript.whisperx[524].end |
14040.485 |
| transcript.whisperx[524].text |
我之前也有質詢過說其實你們給我們教育委員的報告都已經講了中正紀念堂促轉會解散後文化部作為主責機關負責中正紀念堂轉型這個轉型當然是轉型正義的轉型 |
| transcript.whisperx[525].start |
14043.588 |
| transcript.whisperx[525].end |
14064.054 |
| transcript.whisperx[525].text |
那可以理解因為前面有委員提到部長又講到歷史記憶的事情我是想找一個解套讓我們這條路走得更順我先請問部長部長你有沒有聽過你知不知道臺灣民主紀念園區我知道那它是哪裡您知道臺灣民主紀念園區對應該就是有好幾個地方所以部長顯然也不熟悉跟部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[526].start |
14074.562 |
| transcript.whisperx[526].end |
14102.977 |
| transcript.whisperx[526].text |
這個名字沒有太流行吧就是說你把中文紀念場叫做臺灣民主園區的確是一般人不知道好一般人不知道但是部長您要知道啊為什麼因為中文紀念場有兩種文資身份2007年是國定的國定的就是登錄為國定的這個文資身份它的名稱就叫做臺灣民主紀念園區那部長您知不知道臺灣民主紀念園區是我們現在圖上的藍色塊還是粉紅色塊 |
| transcript.whisperx[527].start |
14104.285 |
| transcript.whisperx[527].end |
14104.305 |
| transcript.whisperx[527].text |
藍色塊 |
| transcript.whisperx[528].start |
14106.072 |
| transcript.whisperx[528].end |
14134.465 |
| transcript.whisperx[528].text |
那您就錯了那個藍色塊是台北市政府核定的那個可見大家都不了解台北市政府核定它是叫做市定文化景觀然後呢中間的粉紅色是台灣民主紀念園區那最核心那個堂體深藍的那您知不知道有被哪一塊框頂有被我們台灣民主紀念園區框頂嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[529].start |
14138.576 |
| transcript.whisperx[529].end |
14164.451 |
| transcript.whisperx[529].text |
這是已經被定為國境古蹟吧這一塊好那沒關係喔因為時間喔這個堂體喔非常有意思的兩塊都有框定就台北市喔框定的市立文化景觀是包最大的那他們有他們的一個官方的理由那2007年喔就是當時的是叫做文建會嘛框定的是粉紅色包含兩個藍的所以那 |
| transcript.whisperx[530].start |
14166.832 |
| transcript.whisperx[530].end |
14191.882 |
| transcript.whisperx[530].text |
那再來我們就看他框定的理由是什麼那民主紀念園區裡面有一點就是剛剛部長講的有呼應本股積為臺灣重要之政治空間存在多數臺灣著名二戰後的各種政治記憶有足夠的代表性那名稱叫做民主的就認為就一個民主紀念園區要記得這種政治記憶很多著名的 |
| transcript.whisperx[531].start |
14192.482 |
| transcript.whisperx[531].end |
14217.361 |
| transcript.whisperx[531].text |
那這個是在陳水扁擔任總統2007年合訂的那至今沒有被改過馬英九擔任總統的時候也沒有改這個部分所以他台灣民主紀念園區是不變的地位那我們來看一下不同政黨的好龍兵他的官方他們這個都有開過會的官方的文字是什麼建築兩邊都有講到你看他第二點他兩個理由第二點中間說 |
| transcript.whisperx[532].start |
14219.022 |
| transcript.whisperx[532].end |
14229.925 |
| transcript.whisperx[532].text |
廣場部分多年來為重要集會或民主運動抗議表達場所從學運到燈會以及選舉、造勢晚會等等與民眾集體記憶及認同意義深遠故全區具文化性紀念園區之價值已成為市民休閒藝術及公民歷史之共同活動與記憶 |
| transcript.whisperx[533].start |
14244.284 |
| transcript.whisperx[533].end |
14268.746 |
| transcript.whisperx[533].text |
我想請問部長這兩個版本一籃一綠聽起來你覺得最大的共識是什麼?那就是走過歷史的共同記憶但是大家解釋歷史的方式不同啊這裡面還沒有涉及到怎麼解釋不同喔他解釋也許有不同沒有說出來但是相同的部分就是肯認它是重要的地方然後就是民主記憶的一個過程 |
| transcript.whisperx[534].start |
14270.627 |
| transcript.whisperx[534].end |
14270.667 |
| transcript.whisperx[534].text |
陳水扁議員 |
| transcript.whisperx[535].start |
14291.582 |
| transcript.whisperx[535].end |
14292.944 |
| transcript.whisperx[535].text |
鄭麗君部長的任內做的事情是停播講功紀念歌 |
| transcript.whisperx[536].start |
14307.142 |
| transcript.whisperx[536].end |
14333.52 |
| transcript.whisperx[536].text |
把據威權意向的中正義郎屆時廳改為一展廳二展廳等中性的名稱李永德部長當時我也要求了做相關轉型正義的小旅行等等那有去文化部都有去努力辦理相關活動然後增設獨裁者vs自由的靈魂長社展等等使則部長展出了想像中正經驗100種方式特展那 |
| transcript.whisperx[537].start |
14334.401 |
| transcript.whisperx[537].end |
14361.251 |
| transcript.whisperx[537].text |
再來就是我們李部長了所以部長可以好好的思考一下在這個藍圖上您的目標是什麼那對我們來講的話我想今天幾位委員都有提到我想我們一個月內至少可以有一個三軍一隊徹離同向旁您的規劃跟想法剛剛你有說到九月嘛那如果您覺得一個月不夠我覺得不管是到自由廣場如果是國家一隊三軍一隊的話它應該保護的是 |
| transcript.whisperx[538].start |
14363.712 |
| transcript.whisperx[538].end |
14365.634 |
| transcript.whisperx[538].text |
部長這個可以一個月或者是您覺得不夠兩個月可以給我們一個您初步的規劃好嗎? |
| transcript.whisperx[539].start |
14393.59 |
| transcript.whisperx[539].end |
14393.63 |
| transcript.whisperx[539].text |
主席 |
| transcript.whisperx[540].start |
14408.55 |
| transcript.whisperx[540].end |
14410.332 |
| transcript.whisperx[540].text |
不知道部長有沒有看到這個新聞? |
| transcript.whisperx[541].start |
14431.229 |
| transcript.whisperx[541].end |
14454.144 |
| transcript.whisperx[541].text |
有,不但有看到,而且我非常重視,因為其中曹永和先生跟陳其路先生我都認識,而且我曾經在學習歷史的過程中跟他們學習過,所以這個過程我非常注意。那謝謝,很高興部長知道,而且他其實不只是個人的居,那個建築群就是日治時代的那個,就是台大有保留一部分的這個建築群, |
| transcript.whisperx[542].start |
14455.145 |
| transcript.whisperx[542].end |
14456.986 |
| transcript.whisperx[542].text |
他曾經在106年當時就受理所以後來就是因為有文資潛力會刊之後云與列冊的 |
| transcript.whisperx[543].start |
14484.645 |
| transcript.whisperx[543].end |
14488.367 |
| transcript.whisperx[543].text |
107年開會都是持續列冊,有保存價值,竟然4年後被突襲,111年被突襲,而且過程中都沒有依照文化部的相關行政命令跟手冊,沒有規定通知提報人,最誇張的是他解列 |
| transcript.whisperx[544].start |
14506.316 |
| transcript.whisperx[544].end |
14525.131 |
| transcript.whisperx[544].text |
從此不再列管了就是不被認為有文資地位那個會議跟我們立法院很像沒有討論所以也沒有民主變成報告案那我們看了文化部的函式很明確說這種案子解列管解列冊是非常重要的解列案應該要實質討論 |
| transcript.whisperx[545].start |
14526.772 |
| transcript.whisperx[545].end |
14527.273 |
| transcript.whisperx[545].text |
《文化資產保存法》 |
| transcript.whisperx[546].start |
14544.634 |
| transcript.whisperx[546].end |
14555.142 |
| transcript.whisperx[546].text |
五次現刊都沒有進入屋內依照文化部的指示屋內一定要進去戶外戶內進去然後也沒有依規定通知提報人因為這些委員不斷的在換對不對過了幾年之後提報人最知道文史價值然後呢在會議裡面決議不具文資價值 |
| transcript.whisperx[547].start |
14563.027 |
| transcript.whisperx[547].end |
14563.107 |
| transcript.whisperx[547].text |
所以這幾個問題 |
| transcript.whisperx[548].start |
14581.014 |
| transcript.whisperx[548].end |
14593.529 |
| transcript.whisperx[548].text |
當然這個是臺北市政府的不在我的質詢範圍內但我想文化部有責任要了解那今天的時間的緣故我們可以看到這也不是我第一次發現地方政府有類似的問題那我想請文化部做兩件事 |
| transcript.whisperx[549].start |
14597.594 |
| transcript.whisperx[549].end |
14597.934 |
| transcript.whisperx[549].text |
這第一個可以嗎?那個部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[550].start |
14616.494 |
| transcript.whisperx[550].end |
14635.884 |
| transcript.whisperx[550].text |
我們目前的法規是沒有究責沒有 它就不遵照你們的規定我剛講了對 讓搶救文史的人連通知都沒有被通知好 第一個那第二個這裡面涉及到了剛剛那個主角是也是我很熟悉的台灣大學那其實不只是台大據說他們現在有很多都更案 |
| transcript.whisperx[551].start |
14636.604 |
| transcript.whisperx[551].end |
14640.425 |
| transcript.whisperx[551].text |
對他們來說,好像覺得已經保存一部分了,是不是不需要再保存?我覺得這個當然是跟他主事者認為的臺大的利益,他可能覺得有一些衝突,但我覺得這個部分我們蠻困擾的,因為像剛剛臺鐵也有委員看到被罰200萬的事,這些擁有 |
| transcript.whisperx[552].start |
14659.029 |
| transcript.whisperx[552].end |
14677.081 |
| transcript.whisperx[552].text |
眾多歷史有文資潛力的老建築的臺大、臺堂、臺電、臺鐵這一類的公家機關是不是文化部想想看如何協助鼓勵他們主動盤點跟保存因為私人的話我們可以講到那個是財產的問題那這些臺大、臺電、臺堂、臺鐵都是國家的資產 |
| transcript.whisperx[553].start |
14684.105 |
| transcript.whisperx[553].end |
14708.396 |
| transcript.whisperx[553].text |
是不是應該更率先要好好的保存保護我們這些文資潛力好不好那否則就在就是說財務自主的壓力下大家想出各種方式我覺得會讓文資所有關心的人跟我們的後代子孫哪天知道我們沒有努力的話會非常失望的那這兩個部分部長是不是可以您看多少時間內可以給我們一個報告好嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[554].start |
14709.585 |
| transcript.whisperx[554].end |
14712.447 |
| transcript.whisperx[554].text |
主席 各位委員 有請部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[555].start |
14739.053 |
| transcript.whisperx[555].end |
14740.394 |
| transcript.whisperx[555].text |
北戴古瑞在今期獎得獎感言﹚ |
| transcript.whisperx[556].start |
14765.689 |
| transcript.whisperx[556].end |
14786.954 |
| transcript.whisperx[556].text |
近期講感言天安門事件也是剛好35年大陸的很多的都對這個這樣的發言不滿意我用比較中性的不滿意在臺灣的很多人很滿意是不是這樣應該是吧好我來說對原住民族而言對原住民族而言 |
| transcript.whisperx[557].start |
14795.148 |
| transcript.whisperx[557].end |
14824.24 |
| transcript.whisperx[557].text |
大陸的漢人不滿意,臺灣的漢人很滿意這是原住民族的角度好,我們看這個發言原住民族所看到的是什麼呢?本來古瑞他的發言得獎感言是說剛剛結束了7年在凱道的抗議為了原住民族群傳統領域的事情 |
| transcript.whisperx[558].start |
14825.239 |
| transcript.whisperx[558].end |
14853.207 |
| transcript.whisperx[558].text |
我們看到的是這個我們非常感謝他這樣的一個得獎感言然後他後面提到天安門事件對原住民族而言他這一句話我們都不要忘記天安門事件不要忘記凱道事件也不要忘記對原住民族而言是這樣所以台灣要加油 |
| transcript.whisperx[559].start |
14853.803 |
| transcript.whisperx[559].end |
14879.048 |
| transcript.whisperx[559].text |
因為對於原住民族而言都是統治者然後對原住民族而言還有台語專輯獎榮獲最佳台語專輯獎對原住民族而言包括客家人對於用台語這兩個字其實是很有意見的因為 |
| transcript.whisperx[560].start |
14881.929 |
| transcript.whisperx[560].end |
14903.182 |
| transcript.whisperx[560].text |
臺灣的原住民臺灣的語言臺灣的語言簡稱臺語應該包含著在臺灣的各個族群的語言好這個是一個好因為為什麼呢你看這個本來骨髓他在凱道一樣是被欺凌 |
| transcript.whisperx[561].start |
14904.505 |
| transcript.whisperx[561].end |
14925.95 |
| transcript.whisperx[561].text |
在台灣是被警察欺禮在大陸是軍方欺禮這個是讓大家也了解一下今天的主題無化資產成功以外教會我質詢了很多次 |
| transcript.whisperx[562].start |
14928.558 |
| transcript.whisperx[562].end |
14935.883 |
| transcript.whisperx[562].text |
這個宜灣教會它是一個被列為歷史建築這樣的一個外牆這整個仍然一直到現在你看這個歷史古蹟 |
| transcript.whisperx[563].start |
14956.055 |
| transcript.whisperx[563].end |
14972.168 |
| transcript.whisperx[563].text |
《文化資產保存法》第11條規定,中央主管機關應寬列預算、專款辦理、援助民族文化資產的保存維護。部長,你剛上任,我從107年7月30日就質詢,甚至去會刊, |
| transcript.whisperx[564].start |
14982.192 |
| transcript.whisperx[564].end |
15008.807 |
| transcript.whisperx[564].text |
實地會堪．質詢了這麼多次．一直到去年的5月22號好,文化部也開了一個線上會議這個理由都不充分不能說因為有前面的那條道路有爭議就不處理這不應該是成為一個理由了這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[565].start |
15014.929 |
| transcript.whisperx[565].end |
15038.677 |
| transcript.whisperx[565].text |
地主把這個其實也不是他的啦他已經是繼承道路鄉公政公所也把他列為繼承道路他黨就不應該黨所以你不要修這個歷史建築對不對當然可以啊對不對不能受到任何的影響所以這個部分要請這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[566].start |
15041.84 |
| transcript.whisperx[566].end |
15067.435 |
| transcript.whisperx[566].text |
前面的已經拆除了黨的也沒有了現在沒有理由了吧什麼時候可以執行報告鄭委員您這個教堂非常重要也非常漂亮然後我們已經開始處理了之前有一些產權問題還有其他問題全部寫到完畢我跟您保證我們會解決因為真的是很久很久了 |
| transcript.whisperx[567].start |
15069.589 |
| transcript.whisperx[567].end |
15070.089 |
| transcript.whisperx[567].text |
主席主席 |
| transcript.whisperx[568].start |
15098.186 |
| transcript.whisperx[568].end |
15115.809 |
| transcript.whisperx[568].text |
好 謝謝 謝謝鄭天才委員 還部長請回我們接下來請鄭振淺 鄭振淺 鄭振淺委員不在我們請楊瓊英 楊瓊英 楊瓊英委員不在我們現在請徐富奎委員謝謝主席 我們有請李部長好 有請李部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[569].start |
15132.034 |
| transcript.whisperx[569].end |
15153.669 |
| transcript.whisperx[569].text |
徐委員你好部長午安辛苦了部長我想今天我們是針對這個文資資產的保護的部分一個議題我想我們本期的選區屏東縣我們也有100多處的一個文化資產那也很感謝我們近幾年我們文化部對這個文化資產一個保護 |
| transcript.whisperx[570].start |
15154.429 |
| transcript.whisperx[570].end |
15174.084 |
| transcript.whisperx[570].text |
那從我們的潘賢縣長到周縣長任內我們屏東縣政府一直致力於這些文化資產的一個保護跟活化但是我們最怕就是遇到火災啦齁那最近我們屏東潮州的一個郡所官社就是因為在文資審議之前發生了一個火災的事故那 |
| transcript.whisperx[571].start |
15174.924 |
| transcript.whisperx[571].end |
15201.354 |
| transcript.whisperx[571].text |
請教文化部後續針對這樣的一個資源的一個挹注怎麼來協助屏東縣政府因為像本席我們昨天也約了文智所的同仁去看了我們萬巒的劉氏宗祠我想這部長也很清楚一百多年的歷史但是我們文智所的同仁也吐湖水說他們現在也沒有相關的經費來可以做協助那針對這樣的一個困境我們文化部怎麼後續來協助我們地方好我請文智局回答 |
| transcript.whisperx[572].start |
15203.42 |
| transcript.whisperx[572].end |
15221.338 |
| transcript.whisperx[572].text |
現在目前各地的這些文資的需要保存修復的這些相關的申請案現在就送到部裡面來文資局了我們現在盤整因為明年度預算現在那個行政院那邊還沒有那個完全定案我們最後會把這些所有的案子那這個案子我們也會來納到那裡面來做協助 |
| transcript.whisperx[573].start |
15222.659 |
| transcript.whisperx[573].end |
15245.29 |
| transcript.whisperx[573].text |
因為我想我們李部長也很有理想很有抱負但是他一上任就面臨自己手邊好像沒有籌碼可以運用了這樣子未來做事情也很辛苦這點可能要趕快去盤領一下那部長我想我們屏東縣的勝利新村跟我們的平原1936都是一個活化成功的一個歷史再造的場域我記得部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[574].start |
15246.01 |
| transcript.whisperx[574].end |
15246.31 |
| transcript.whisperx[574].text |
《文化資產保存法》 |
| transcript.whisperx[575].start |
15269.682 |
| transcript.whisperx[575].end |
15277.606 |
| transcript.whisperx[575].text |
所謂的一個文資活化的一個後續的營運管理上面能不能建立一個相關的一個支援的平台來協助這個文化資產的一個維護請部長回答 |
| transcript.whisperx[576].start |
15280.64 |
| transcript.whisperx[576].end |
15281.001 |
| transcript.whisperx[576].text |
文化部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[577].start |
15310.5 |
| transcript.whisperx[577].end |
15324.894 |
| transcript.whisperx[577].text |
那我想過去部長這個還沒有到部裡面服務之前我們一個很重要的一個身份是我們指縫車基金會的一個董事長那也感謝部長在這個董事長的任內對我們屏東的偏鄉 |
| transcript.whisperx[578].start |
15325.435 |
| transcript.whisperx[578].end |
15346.988 |
| transcript.whisperx[578].text |
﹚議員﹚ |
| transcript.whisperx[579].start |
15347.568 |
| transcript.whisperx[579].end |
15375.718 |
| transcript.whisperx[579].text |
在我人生中的理想就是我一直在做的事情就屬於這種因為在文化上都會的孩子享受文化體驗比較容易偏鄉的孩子可能一輩子如果你不表演給他看他可能看不到所以我人生的理想為什麼會做斑斑齒風車走遍全台灣甚至於離島還有我自己也做千里步道也是很辛苦的在建立步道也走遍全台灣那這個理想我會堅持的 |
| transcript.whisperx[580].start |
15376.958 |
| transcript.whisperx[580].end |
15398.001 |
| transcript.whisperx[580].text |
我想我們跟部長的心情都一樣當我們在偏鄉表演的過程裡面看到小朋友臉上的笑容非常的燦爛那非常的期待非常的渴望或許還有這樣的一個表演那我也跟部長分析一下以我們目前掌握到的一個狀況那屏東縣的藝文表演的活動的數量 |
| transcript.whisperx[581].start |
15399.082 |
| transcript.whisperx[581].end |
15414.786 |
| transcript.whisperx[581].text |
是全台灣各縣市的第15名但是實際上我們鄉親參與藝文演出的這個參與的人數是排名第9所以我們屏東的鄉親是很熱衷來參與這些藝文活動的但是往往這個辦一場這個活動要花很多錢 |
| transcript.whisperx[582].start |
15417.327 |
| transcript.whisperx[582].end |
15445.355 |
| transcript.whisperx[582].text |
那我想未來文化部怎麼樣針對一個偏鄉巡演能夠提高藝文團體的一個表演的誘因還有部長把過去這個在指縫車董事長任內對偏鄉的關懷能夠這個初衷帶到文化部來能夠讓我們這個文化的種子散播到屏東每一塊的土地上面我想部長這可以共同來努力好不好沒有問題真的我們屏東非常需要部長關愛的眼神是好 謝謝部長謝謝你 謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[583].start |
15447.349 |
| transcript.whisperx[583].end |
15476.078 |
| transcript.whisperx[583].text |
好 謝謝徐富奎委員部長請回我們接下來請林楚英委員林楚英林楚英委員不在我們請蘇清泉蘇清泉蘇清泉委員不在我們請何欣淳何欣淳何欣淳委員不在我們請黃珊珊黃珊珊黃珊珊委員不在我們請吳思瑤吳思瑤吳思瑤委員不在我們請林倩琦委員 |
| transcript.whisperx[584].start |
15487.383 |
| transcript.whisperx[584].end |
15494.271 |
| transcript.whisperx[584].text |
謝謝莊委,我們是不是先請文資局的陳局長好,有請陳局長這個部分也請部長這邊來稍微關注局長先請坐是這樣,因為剛才其實委員有講過有關於入港國定古蹟的龍山市彩繪的修復也有很多的狀況跟問題 |
| transcript.whisperx[585].start |
15509.546 |
| transcript.whisperx[585].end |
15525.333 |
| transcript.whisperx[585].text |
本席這邊有很逐帆不及備載的這樣一個抱怨受到的抱怨收到民眾的這個抱怨所以我想會後這個部分是不是請你書面的詳細的解釋那本席在這邊簡單講幾點那是不是請你就為什麼會解約 |
| transcript.whisperx[586].start |
15530.896 |
| transcript.whisperx[586].end |
15552.091 |
| transcript.whisperx[586].text |
然後究竟是為什麼你們在原標案的數量不明確規範不明確而導致一些爭議那你們的自我檢討是什麼好然後另外第二點就是是不是會再重新發包修復還是會再延宕兩年好那這個部分請你待會用很簡單的很簡短的30秒鐘給本席做一個回應 |
| transcript.whisperx[587].start |
15552.671 |
| transcript.whisperx[587].end |
15553.752 |
| transcript.whisperx[587].text |
臺灣美術館副館長任內典藏庫房工程 |
| transcript.whisperx[588].start |
15570.342 |
| transcript.whisperx[588].end |
15570.462 |
| transcript.whisperx[588].text |
中山堂修復 |
| transcript.whisperx[589].start |
15594.17 |
| transcript.whisperx[589].end |
15603.833 |
| transcript.whisperx[589].text |
本席在會後給你相關的書面那你就書面的部分做一個回覆那但是為什麼這個龍山市會解約然後又會解約收場 |
| transcript.whisperx[590].start |
15605.287 |
| transcript.whisperx[590].end |
15626.466 |
| transcript.whisperx[590].text |
那還會再重新發報嗎?那結約的原因是因為我們的委託廠商雲科大的團隊沒有修復規劃的系不規劃的那些計畫沒有通過審查四次沒有通過依照我們的契約就把它結束終止契約是終止契約那謝謝那一般來講這個學校單位 |
| transcript.whisperx[591].start |
15627.947 |
| transcript.whisperx[591].end |
15628.107 |
| transcript.whisperx[591].text |
主席 |
| transcript.whisperx[592].start |
15653.189 |
| transcript.whisperx[592].end |
15659.131 |
| transcript.whisperx[592].text |
本席是在表演藝術的專業所以昨天非常感謝您也承諾在有關於原住民族的這個國家表演藝術樂舞團 |
| transcript.whisperx[593].start |
15672.756 |
| transcript.whisperx[593].end |
15673.436 |
| transcript.whisperx[593].text |
建議您可以仿照英國的Tony獎 |
| transcript.whisperx[594].start |
15700.71 |
| transcript.whisperx[594].end |
15727.507 |
| transcript.whisperx[594].text |
本席其實在英國的西區至少40幾個劇院已經去過20幾個那看到的劇當然也非常的多所以在這邊給您提供一些那個想法跟意見今天我們談的是文資 文化資產那事實上表演藝術跟文化資產的這個結合也是一個世界的趨勢那我們看以下的這個PPT那這個是Illdiva對不起Illdivo這樣一個團在這個La Pushka Arena |
| transcript.whisperx[595].start |
15728.788 |
| transcript.whisperx[595].end |
15753.484 |
| transcript.whisperx[595].text |
在克萊西亞這樣一個國家那他們跟文化資產的一個結合是有很好的一個效果那這個假設未來的這個國家樂舞團原住民的國家樂舞團能夠有這樣一個規劃那我想這樣一個國家級跟文化資產會讓這個文化資產在活化利用等等的議題上不僅是跟上國家國際的趨勢那也是一個非常好的一個活化利用的 |
| transcript.whisperx[596].start |
15755.564 |
| transcript.whisperx[596].end |
15756.965 |
| transcript.whisperx[596].text |
本席要談的是錢跟人不知道部長對於全國財力的分配 |
| transcript.whisperx[597].start |
15778.188 |
| transcript.whisperx[597].end |
15786.413 |
| transcript.whisperx[597].text |
的這個比例財力狀況的等級有沒有了解就全國的財力各縣市的這個財力比例分為五個等級 |
| transcript.whisperx[598].start |
15788.665 |
| transcript.whisperx[598].end |
15808.12 |
| transcript.whisperx[598].text |
如果這個部分本席直接跟您做個提醒這個1到5級的財力其實有12個縣市是在第5級那這個第5級的這個縣市其實如果沒有中央的挹注真的很難持續跟做到長遠所以全國總共有5300個有形文化資產 |
| transcript.whisperx[599].start |
15809.761 |
| transcript.whisperx[599].end |
15834.25 |
| transcript.whisperx[599].text |
從本席開始在做相關的觀察跟研究到現在已經有五千三百多個有形文化資產還不包括無形文化資產那文化資產呢我們經常來講說不能以投資報酬來談這件事情但是很多時候大家就是收盲票撩背一格的來湊數那也很難成為長期的活水那本席知道在2023年文化部這邊有提出文化資產維護發展計畫的第五期要從2024年到2029年 |
| transcript.whisperx[600].start |
15838.411 |
| transcript.whisperx[600].end |
15852.592 |
| transcript.whisperx[600].text |
那或者行政院目前已經合訂了159.44億元那已經是歷年來補助之罪所以這個要如何分配 怎麼樣做到雨露金瞻那部長這邊有概念或者是有想法了嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[601].start |
15854.787 |
| transcript.whisperx[601].end |
15855.007 |
| transcript.whisperx[601].text |
文資應該要注意到的這個問題 |
| transcript.whisperx[602].start |
15881.067 |
| transcript.whisperx[602].end |
15882.749 |
| transcript.whisperx[602].text |
人﹚在報告裏面談了好多的細項本席未來希望能夠針對這個細項在跟部裏面討論但是我們這邊談一點就是3922元這個最低薪資 |
| transcript.whisperx[603].start |
15896.184 |
| transcript.whisperx[603].end |
15897.525 |
| transcript.whisperx[603].text |
本期在這邊做一個提醒 |
| transcript.whisperx[604].start |
15919.797 |
| transcript.whisperx[604].end |
15933.51 |
| transcript.whisperx[604].text |
最後本席這邊談一下這個文化資產很忌諱被政治駕馭或意識形態影響本席其實在這裡面本身在文化的領域我覺得其實蠻寬廣的而且很自由 |
| transcript.whisperx[605].start |
15935.712 |
| transcript.whisperx[605].end |
15950.099 |
| transcript.whisperx[605].text |
在文化資產的這個部分它的本質就是你希望能夠不分區域不拘大小也不限年代跟不計輕重的朝著保存情感跟共同記憶去保存連結跟延伸 |
| transcript.whisperx[606].start |
15951.819 |
| transcript.whisperx[606].end |
15972.784 |
| transcript.whisperx[606].text |
但是本席真的有感受到最近的政治氛圍讓本來很寬廣的一個文化空間感覺有點受到擠壓跟方向上的一個推動所以本席這邊分享過去一個經驗但是在分享這個經驗前本席先請教一下您知道這個圖是哪一個地方嗎? |
| transcript.whisperx[607].start |
15976.643 |
| transcript.whisperx[607].end |
16002.729 |
| transcript.whisperx[607].text |
如果不知道可能像台灣像這樣子的和洋式的建築有很多那本席這邊提醒一下他是基隆的敘秋指揮所那敘秋呢在過去這個林右昌市長的任內獲到了硬體方面很多的補助但是到了現任呢因為可能不同的政黨可能相關的補助也非常的微弱所以也沒有辦法對外開放然後就變成所謂的文職管其實這個共業應該我們共同要來 |
| transcript.whisperx[608].start |
16003.729 |
| transcript.whisperx[608].end |
16006.33 |
| transcript.whisperx[608].text |
本席,想要請教您一下您對建成館有 |
| transcript.whisperx[609].start |
16029.488 |
| transcript.whisperx[609].end |
16032.89 |
| transcript.whisperx[609].text |
本席在高雄縣政府文化局有經歷過鳳山縣新城這樣一個概念 |
| transcript.whisperx[610].start |
16054.525 |
| transcript.whisperx[610].end |
16056.087 |
| transcript.whisperx[610].text |
佛山縣舊城在左營 |
| transcript.whisperx[611].start |
16069.542 |
| transcript.whisperx[611].end |
16070.042 |
| transcript.whisperx[611].text |
《文化資產保存法》 |
| transcript.whisperx[612].start |
16089.476 |
| transcript.whisperx[612].end |
16117.468 |
| transcript.whisperx[612].text |
這個概念是不是也是很有趣的一個探討那是不是部長您回去可以想一想這個建成我在想他是因為當時有一個計劃叫做這個建成的這個計劃建到的成我本來以為是建立了建因為有這個計劃結果它後來叫做建成館所以本席在這邊要講的是本席非常同意您剛才講的所有發生的事都是歷史的過程這一頁看完了 |
| transcript.whisperx[613].start |
16118.268 |
| transcript.whisperx[613].end |
16125.317 |
| transcript.whisperx[613].text |
就翻到下一頁吧是是我們不要一直留在那邊我們看看這一頁然後再往前走 |
| transcript.whisperx[614].start |
16126.476 |
| transcript.whisperx[614].end |
16131.278 |
| transcript.whisperx[614].text |
本席很喜歡過去在高雄縣跟的一個首長叫做楊秋興縣長他跟本席經常講教育跟文化是人類思想的境地 |
| transcript.whisperx[615].start |
16153.648 |
| transcript.whisperx[615].end |
16159.872 |
| transcript.whisperx[615].text |
我們作為一個文化人,請我們共同好好的守護人類思想的境地。 |
| transcript.whisperx[616].start |
16165.755 |
| transcript.whisperx[616].end |
16166.696 |
| transcript.whisperx[616].text |
蔡奕宇委員 |
| transcript.whisperx[617].start |
16186.179 |
| transcript.whisperx[617].end |
16202.752 |
| transcript.whisperx[617].text |
報告及詢答完畢委員所提書面質詢及相關資料列入紀錄並刊登公報對委員質詢要求提出相關資料及未及答覆部分請相關機關競訴以書面答覆報告委員會今天議程處理完畢現在散會謝謝各位 |
| transcript.whisperx[618].start |
16215.426 |
| transcript.whisperx[618].end |
16232.071 |
| transcript.whisperx[618].text |
我們等一下回新莊嗎?我們在徐州,下午要去臺北觀 |
| transcript.whisperx[619].start |
16236.512 |
| transcript.whisperx[619].end |
16236.813 |
| transcript.whisperx[619].text |
有關事項 |
| transcript.whisperx[620].start |
16275.606 |
| transcript.whisperx[620].end |
16297.875 |
| transcript.whisperx[620].text |
議員議員議員議員 |
| transcript.whisperx[621].start |
16300.83 |
| transcript.whisperx[621].end |
16301.051 |
| transcript.whisperx[621].text |
主席響鐘 |