| IVOD_ID |
159684 |
| IVOD_URL |
https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/159684 |
| 日期 |
2025-03-27 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼 |
委員會-11-3-23-4 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼:str |
第11屆第3會期交通委員會第4次全體委員會議 |
| 會議資料.屆 |
11 |
| 會議資料.會期 |
3 |
| 會議資料.會次 |
4 |
| 會議資料.種類 |
委員會 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼[0] |
23 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼:str[0] |
交通委員會 |
| 會議資料.標題 |
第11屆第3會期交通委員會第4次全體委員會議 |
| 影片種類 |
Clip |
| 開始時間 |
2025-03-27T09:37:20+08:00 |
| 結束時間 |
2025-03-27T09:48:15+08:00 |
| 影片長度 |
00:10:55 |
| 支援功能[0] |
ai-transcript |
| video_url |
https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/ae27c1b40c0db9002ded9f7c67d9a10f2ba64e6561398ad01f25d2de176b75bcf710b917354ebcad5ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8 |
| 委員名稱 |
蔡其昌 |
| 委員發言時間 |
09:37:20 - 09:48:15 |
| 會議時間 |
2025-03-27T09:00:00+08:00 |
| 會議名稱 |
立法院第11屆第3會期交通委員會第4次全體委員會議（事由：邀請國家通訊傳播委員會代理主任委員陳崇樹列席報告業務概況，並備質詢。） |
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| transcript.whisperx[0].start |
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謝謝主席請陳代理主委好陳代主委主委早主委我想早上大家應該都很關心因為NCC委員這個通常會員的不足 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].start |
22.372 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].end |
45.775 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].text |
所以導致很多業務啊就國家在執行這個通常會相關業務因為委員不足所以很多業務必須面臨停擺或者必須要有短暫的因應措施那本席覺得這個事情是很嚴重的事情這個齁大家我看你現在到齊的兩家 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].start |
47.272 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].end |
72.984 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].text |
實際的頻道名稱是一個是像MTV Live這樣的一個頻道嘛 對不對那這些都社會啊他在這個階段沒有太大爭議啦換言之他不是社會注目的焦點那如果有一天啊我們大家持續的癱瘓這個國家讓NCC的委員一直不足那未來如果出現了一個社會覺得眾人覺得應該要停照 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].start |
75.933 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].end |
92.805 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].text |
他的犯罪非常明顯他的內容也非常的離譜那我們其實是在現行的架構底下是沒有辦法停止他的因為照還是他還是繼續存在有其他有方法嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].start |
95.277 |
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113.205 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].text |
跟委員報告這塊確實委員說到是重點就是另外一個角度來看那油脂優良的頻道這方面的續存的視聽這種權益都存在那如果是一個比較相對是在光譜另外一端的這種情況這些確實目前的 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].start |
114.065 |
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| transcript.whisperx[5].text |
NCC的處境是比較很尷尬的地方 灰色地帶沒有辦法很明顯處理即便經營權的得上邊跟這一塊確實是委員會目前沒有辦法來處理所以我剛剛會特別提到這個階段大家關心啦 因為國家整體 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].start |
134.888 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].end |
154.537 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].text |
運作的制度上面的一些挑戰所以大家共同關心但還不是最嚴峻的時候所以我必須要提醒這些事情必須要趕快想個方法怎麼來解決那本席今天還有一個很重要的重點這個對於現在我們大家去談到這個透過這個聲音就是所謂的聲微 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].start |
164.432 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].end |
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| transcript.whisperx[7].text |
透過AI進行這個申違這個現在 這個不是未來式的這個不是未來AI發展到一個程度就會出現這種詐騙形態 不是是現在我看這個媒體已經開始報導有人因為這個AI聲音的變造透過AI去變造聲音進行這個詐騙進行詐騙那NCC有沒有注意到這個現象 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].start |
194.039 |
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有注意到所以我們是在這個他睡醒的工具裡頭來著手處理我們負責堵炸這一塊所以如果他即便他是用尾炸的聲音如果他是透過電話所以我們會有在這個打炸的電話裡頭來處理攔阻跟語音警示這一塊那如果說他都躲過我們現在的防禦的一些措施 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].start |
222.015 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].end |
247.396 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].text |
剩餘的部分他在裡頭來用內容的部分那屬於這個我們這個網路上端的內容的部分不管他走網路還是走傳統的PSTN的網路他如果用這個偽造的聲音來處理這一塊電信的部分是比較沒有處理的一個空間空間比較小其實我簡單問你就知道了就譬如說我們以媒體報導的這幾個個案來講 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].start |
250.421 |
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275.433 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].text |
那我們去查過他怎麼處理譬如說他直接透過打電話然後聲音就直接用AI的偽造的方式去處理那這個怎麼防NCC面對這些犯罪型態我們想過要怎麼去防堵沒有我們都是從他工具端來處理如果他這個我的意思是說你從工具端處理那這個工具是因為處理不了這個案子所以他受騙了還是什麼問題 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].start |
276.104 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].end |
281.349 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].text |
就是說他工具所帶就是他這個工具所用的載體是一支電話那電話如果經過165通報我們就會給他阻斷 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].start |
285.06 |
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310.89 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].text |
對那所以換言之其實事後啦等於說有人報案他被騙了那我們再去事後阻斷是那還有沒有其他更積極的做法就是說因為這個未來一定很多啦我跟主席講這個隨著AI的技術發展或許這個叫七成像六成像嘛然後加上被害者心理緊張所以他很容易就六成像七成像他就受騙了那未來一定是99%像 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].start |
313.099 |
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| transcript.whisperx[13].text |
現在這個不叫未雨綢繆,那個不是陰天而已啦未雨綢繆是看到天氣已經烏雨密布可能要下雨現在是已經下毛毛細雨了,不久之後就要傾盆大雨了所以那個雨傘,到底我們的政府準備好沒有因為這個你要防止很困難,因為聲音實在太像了我看到這個新聞我都打電話給我媽媽 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].start |
339.617 |
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361.172 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].text |
這部分我們其實現有的機制就是市長的宣導市長的素養這邊要提升對這個叫做宣導就像我打電話給我媽媽叫她說要注意一下接到一個聲音很像我的只要談到錢你都先暫時等一下再會這叫宣導嘛除了這種宣導之外我們還有在 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].start |
362.353 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].end |
370.463 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].text |
國家面對新的技術的詐騙那我們有什麼樣圍堵或者處理的方法有在做這樣的準備沒有 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].start |
371.584 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].end |
397.407 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].text |
AI部分行政院有在統合在國科會那邊有在統合各個部會包括NCC也有在盤點我們現在我們所掌管業者的不管是傳播業者他在製作的內容或者變性的部分目前都有盤點大致都是要求比方說你資訊要揭露如果說你是使用AI的部分你要揭露他是使用AI生成的等等之類的那如果說是在 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].start |
398.703 |
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427.866 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].text |
通訊傳播事業之外的像這種詐騙集團所用的這是個體都是個人對個人或者詐騙集團對一般民眾的部分那目前看起來還是這個房價市價的素養的能力這邊要提升就是先前行政院打造團隊都有提醒民眾要三不三要就是要警覺要確認這塊的大概要普遍讓民眾有個警覺就是即便是聲音很像自己的親人也要在家確認就確務清醒 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].start |
428.066 |
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440.063 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].text |
好 主委 就是說其實我沒有什麼特別因為我知道現在還沒有方法啦還沒有方法 那我只是先提醒啦就是說 宣導這個我覺得不用再做任何 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].start |
441.485 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].end |
459.879 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].text |
技術再怎麼發展還是要宣導就詐騙集團技術再怎麼研發創新宣導都還是要做但除了宣導之外我只是提醒不是陰天而已啦不是烏雨密布現在是已經萌萌細雨了那接著就要晴蓬大雨了 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].start |
460.399 |
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476.016 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].text |
所以未來像這種身為的詐騙當開始氾濫的時候那個時候恐怕立法院不是蔡其昌一個人在這裡講這些問題而已那時候恐怕又是一個社會國家面臨重大挑戰的一個事情所以這個齁 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].start |
477.657 |
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500.672 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].text |
不是只有NCC嘛 你抒發部 你的警政署 法務部你們怎麼去共同聯合在面對這些打詐的行動裡面怎麼隨著科技的發展所延伸出來的負面就AI的發展大家很期待嘛 很期許然後也覺得可以帶給人類社會很多的方便但同樣的犯罪集團也用這樣的方式來進行更多的詐騙嘛 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].start |
502.079 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].end |
507.653 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].text |
最後我要請教一下我們有一個叫做業者自律就是讓大家 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].start |
510.84 |
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529.206 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].text |
網路內容申訴案件的業者自律這個成績我看了一下好像參加自律的111年30家112年增加31家差不多一年增加30家但是我們的申訴的案件111年2700112年3000113年6100 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].start |
537.318 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].end |
554.431 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].text |
那個NCC要不要說明一下這個自律參加的人為什麼數量其實三十六十就算不要講三十六三百好了啦是這還是很少很少很少的根本的報告這是申訴案件是IWIN受理到的那去年因為隨著這個網路使用的 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].start |
555.632 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].end |
584.932 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].text |
普及所以這個案件預期會增加那去年特別暴增是因為去年有兩個個案都是日本的一個遊戲軟體裡頭有一些個案在有發生IWIN受到大量的一些申訴另外還有一些遊戲軟體的一些都是幼稚園事件其實因為時間到了我不好意思沒辦法再聽你把它詳細講完但我只是提醒你 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].start |
585.652 |
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613.05 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].text |
第一個案件增加的趨勢這個我想應該不是不需要懷疑啦他就因為大家開始有意識了嘛這些違反兒少法的相關的這些在網路上面這些東西很多家長開始習慣要檢舉啊透過怎麼樣的方式去去跟政府說明表達這個對這個的不滿意所以增加這個不需要再多花時間去解釋那更重要的是我們為什麼自律的案件這麼少啦就是說自律的業者 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].start |
613.951 |
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639.549 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].text |
以一個國家來講30家來參加我們的自律這個也未免太看不起NCC了吧所以這個我覺得應該是找出原因來啦為什麼自律的業者大家都不願意來參加這個自律自律都不願意了自律現在講自律現在不是講他們違規我們要去處罰他們連自律參與度都那麼低了所以這第一個我想提醒這為什麼原因把它找出來第二個違反兒少法的 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].start |
640.109 |
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650.905 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].text |
就除了自律之外你對於違反兒少法你們該怎麼處分我覺得應該也要那個法令的執行也要隨時在後啦好不好因為時間的關係我就今天就下一次我們有機會再來討論謝謝委員 |