| IVOD_ID |
159627 |
| IVOD_URL |
https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/159627 |
| 日期 |
2025-03-26 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼 |
委員會-11-3-20-4 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼:str |
第11屆第3會期財政委員會第4次全體委員會議 |
| 會議資料.屆 |
11 |
| 會議資料.會期 |
3 |
| 會議資料.會次 |
4 |
| 會議資料.種類 |
委員會 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼[0] |
20 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼:str[0] |
財政委員會 |
| 會議資料.標題 |
第11屆第3會期財政委員會第4次全體委員會議 |
| 影片種類 |
Clip |
| 開始時間 |
2025-03-26T11:27:49+08:00 |
| 結束時間 |
2025-03-26T11:39:22+08:00 |
| 影片長度 |
00:11:33 |
| 支援功能[0] |
ai-transcript |
| 支援功能[1] |
gazette |
| video_url |
https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/8cb7ec0b2cd1ea34f1acf6edc81e708a9336bc333af6bdb0320df3df7f6ba36d7778f5872ee59a395ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8 |
| 委員名稱 |
羅明才 |
| 委員發言時間 |
11:27:49 - 11:39:22 |
| 會議時間 |
2025-03-26T09:00:00+08:00 |
| 會議名稱 |
立法院第11屆第3會期財政委員會第4次全體委員會議（事由：邀請金融監督管理委員會彭主任委員金隆率所屬機關首長暨中央存款保險股份有限公司、監管相關機構有關之財團法人、臺灣證券交易所股份有限公司、臺灣期貨交易所股份有限公司、臺灣集中保管結算所股份有限公司等董事長、總經理列席業務報告，並備質詢。
【3月24日及26日二天一次會】） |
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| gazette.lineno |
817 |
| gazette.blocks[0][0] |
羅委員明才：（11時27分）主席、各位委員、出列席官員，大家好。主席，可否請金管會彭主委？ |
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主席：請彭主委。 |
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彭主任委員金隆：委員好。 |
| gazette.blocks[3][0] |
羅委員明才：彭主委你好。請問金管會是全民的金管會，還是金融業界的金管會？ |
| gazette.blocks[4][0] |
彭主任委員金隆：我們是政府的一員，當然是國家的金管會。 |
| gazette.blocks[5][0] |
羅委員明才：既然是國家的金管會，幾位委員所提的，事實上要多多站在民眾，特別是未來民眾的需求考量，多多來思考、怎麼樣協助。比如說，剛剛委員講到有的保險，明明他就可以保，但是他不能保，每次保險公司大概都是要「保贏」，沒有「保輸」的，看你健康活活跳跳、情況很好，它就希望你多保一點，可是社會上大家都知道保險是一個安全的、重要的架構，大家互相cover，重點不是光光只有業者賺錢，而是照顧民眾分散風險的概念，讓社會更安定、祥和，主委，是不是這樣？ |
| gazette.blocks[6][0] |
彭主任委員金隆：當然是，保險本身是集合眾人風險分散的機制。不過，剛剛委員提到有個稍稍的不同，我簡單補充一下，因為商業保險跟社會保險還是有點不同，商業保險強調是風險公平的分攤，社會保險會強調世代公平跟正義的移轉，這還是不太一樣，但是我剛才講說，商業保險某種程度也不能完全的純粹以獲利為主要的考量，剛剛委員也提到公平待客，還有像普惠金融的部分，某種程度就是在商業保險的一些跟政策保險，或是這些領域部分還是要有一些社會公平的色彩…… |
| gazette.blocks[7][0] |
羅委員明才：聽說現在產險，特別是風力、太陽能等等，因為臺灣市場很小，要再出去再保、再保，現在是不是都保不出去？ |
| gazette.blocks[8][0] |
彭主任委員金隆：現在整個風電的部分，因為它每一個案場都非常大，而且主要是過去的經驗也比較少，所以國內的這些capacity，就是它的能量確實比較不夠。還有個問題，就是國際上面對於大型風場的保險也沒有那麼完備，所以…… |
| gazette.blocks[9][0] |
羅委員明才：國內金融機構貸款給這些風力發電和太陽能部分的總金額大概有多少？ |
| gazette.blocks[10][0] |
彭主任委員金隆：抱歉，我沒有這個數字，現在也記不得，不過我待會兒可以請同仁提供給委員。 |
| gazette.blocks[11][0] |
羅委員明才：這個循環上面會不會出問題？ |
| gazette.blocks[12][0] |
彭主任委員金隆：不過我想，一個貸款是不是一定要有保險來cover？這是兩回事，它有各自的風險管控措施。有保險當然是最好，它有重複的風險管控，但這是一個國際上的問題。 |
| gazette.blocks[13][0] |
羅委員明才：我們看到這些綠能業者賺飽飽，它賺飽飽，台電就苦哈哈，它的荷包飽飽，結果台電每天來跟我們要錢，接著電價要漲了，水費也在討論，請問一下主委，你所監管的銀行、證券、保險相關產業，最近會不會也趁機調漲它的服務費、轉帳費、保管費，或者是巧立名目，偷偷增加一些費用？ |
| gazette.blocks[14][0] |
彭主任委員金隆：據我所知，當然，比如說個別的業務行為我無法完全掌握，但是以臺灣這樣高度競爭的社會，在高度競爭的金融市場裡面，加上很多費率是在我們的管制下，我覺得這個情況比較不容易發生，而且我們比較…… |
| gazette.blocks[15][0] |
羅委員明才：你當主委，你可以控制住？ |
| gazette.blocks[16][0] |
彭主任委員金隆：不，就是這個部分我們有一套費率監控…… |
| gazette.blocks[17][0] |
羅委員明才：其實銀行、證券、保險業去年已經賺很多了啊！ |
| gazette.blocks[18][0] |
彭主任委員金隆：賺很多是因為很多…… |
| gazette.blocks[19][0] |
羅委員明才：賺一兆多嘛！表示這個行業是很健康的，對不對？ |
| gazette.blocks[20][0] |
彭主任委員金隆：應該是去年很多比如說不管利率或匯率是比較有利的方向。 |
| gazette.blocks[21][0] |
羅委員明才：我們希望百工百業、在任何行業好的時候要盡一些社會責任…… |
| gazette.blocks[22][0] |
彭主任委員金隆：這也是我們在推動的事情。 |
| gazette.blocks[23][0] |
羅委員明才：比如說ESG的概念。 |
| gazette.blocks[24][0] |
彭主任委員金隆：對！ |
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羅委員明才：坦白講，棒球是我們的國球，籃球也是我們最喜歡的，還有乒乓球等等，可是這些金融機構真的跳進來支持體育活動的多不多？ |
| gazette.blocks[26][0] |
彭主任委員金隆：其實滿多的。比如說我們的桌球、羽球，還有棒球、籃球，大家耳熟能詳的就是很多隊伍都跟我們金融機構有關。 |
| gazette.blocks[27][0] |
羅委員明才：所以都覺得滿多的嘛！ |
| gazette.blocks[28][0] |
彭主任委員金隆：應該是…… |
| gazette.blocks[29][0] |
羅委員明才：是否有沒贊助這些球隊的？ |
| gazette.blocks[30][0] |
彭主任委員金隆：那當然有。我們金融機構很多耶！ |
| gazette.blocks[31][0] |
羅委員明才：現在問題就是出在這邊，我覺得不要為富不仁，我們整個體系讓這些金融機構賺得盆滿缽滿，你們是不是可以循循善誘，一起來加入一些社會關懷的活動？ |
| gazette.blocks[32][0] |
彭主任委員金隆：當然、當然，為善的方向不限於或是只有運動項目，像我們金管會正在推動一個金融大回饋計畫，就是希望有系統地導引金融業的獲利除了對股東和經理人以外，能夠回饋到基層員工、消費者和社會，我們也正在做這個計畫，這也是呼應剛剛委員的想法，就是金融業應該是所謂的社會事業，除了獲利照顧自己的成長和股東以外，整個相關的stakeholders也要好好地去兼顧。 |
| gazette.blocks[33][0] |
羅委員明才：主委，現在詐騙何其多，每天都發生在你我周邊，請問詐騙排行榜的第一名是跟什麼有關？ |
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彭主任委員金隆：最近一直在波動，購物和投資這兩個一直都是最重要的…… |
| gazette.blocks[35][0] |
羅委員明才：對！投資啊！就是跟你講說這個利潤很高、機會很多，這個是第一名啦！ |
| gazette.blocks[36][0] |
彭主任委員金隆：件數來講不一定，但是金額來講，因為投資的部分通常金額會比購物的詐騙金額來得大，一件可能就幾千萬或上億，所以會把那個金額推高。 |
| gazette.blocks[37][0] |
羅委員明才：金額感覺就很多！ |
| gazette.blocks[38][0] |
彭主任委員金隆：對、對、對。 |
| gazette.blocks[39][0] |
羅委員明才：對於這一方面，有沒有什麼好的方式可以讓它降低或者消失？ |
| gazette.blocks[40][0] |
彭主任委員金隆：我必須非常務實的講，要讓詐騙消失不可能，但是我們一定要儘量遏止這樣的趨勢，所以最近我們其實也做了非常非常多的事情，當然有些適合講、有些不適合講，但是這已經成為我們金融業的常態，我們把它列入到日常活動裡面，持續去做阻詐的工作，我想所有金融業…… |
| gazette.blocks[41][0] |
羅委員明才：所以我們要跟病毒共存，也要跟詐騙共存？ |
| gazette.blocks[42][0] |
彭主任委員金隆：也不是，應該是講我們不能容忍，我們必須盡我們最大的努力去降低這件事情。 |
| gazette.blocks[43][0] |
羅委員明才：主委，投資詐騙集中最多的大概在三十六歲到四十幾歲，原因改天再講，這些人工作了半天、努力了半天，就砰！一次就50萬，然後他會有誘因，可能帳面上說你賺了多少錢，然後就繼續再加碼投入，一出場買單可能100萬、200萬的損失，這都是工作者辛辛苦苦的血汗錢，好不容易累積了五年、十年、十幾年，一次就被騙走了，你覺得這會讓人感到同情嗎？ |
| gazette.blocks[44][0] |
彭主任委員金隆：那當然，任何受害者，我們都是基於最大的關懷，但是站在金融機構，特別是銀行的角度，我覺得現在所著力的重點，應該在帳戶的管理，以及受詐金額要怎麼讓它增加追回的可能性等等，當然，這整個犯罪過程非常複雜，甚至可能跟檢調警，還有整個社會氛圍、社會狀況都有關係…… |
| gazette.blocks[45][0] |
羅委員明才：現在看起來有很多也是透過所謂的投資虛擬貨幣或是冷錢包等等，請問什麼是冷錢包？ |
| gazette.blocks[46][0] |
彭主任委員金隆：冷錢包就是它的儲存沒有上網連接的儲存設備。 |
| gazette.blocks[47][0] |
羅委員明才：這占很大一部分，主管機關要不要面對？臺灣到底可不可以買賣虛擬貨幣？什麼時候可以真正上到管理的正軌？ |
| gazette.blocks[48][0] |
彭主任委員金隆：其實現在我們已經在逐步…… |
| gazette.blocks[49][0] |
羅委員明才：因為你沒有管理，變成有很多漏洞可以詐騙，以訛傳訛，大家也搞不清楚。 |
| gazette.blocks[50][0] |
彭主任委員金隆：這點要稍微澄清，我們現在不是沒有管理，我們是從洗錢防制的角度一步一步管理，我們現在已經有洗防聲明，接下來是洗防登記，然後我們也開始研擬虛擬資產服務商管理法，這部分我們接下來會…… |
| gazette.blocks[51][0] |
羅委員明才：所以主委的意思是虛擬貨幣可以買賣囉？ |
| gazette.blocks[52][0] |
彭主任委員金隆：其實現在虛擬貨幣在市場上就已經有交易，只是說我們現在沒有對…… |
| gazette.blocks[53][0] |
羅委員明才：那主委我請教你，我是沒買過，很多人大概都沒買過，只是聽過，因此大家也不清楚到底規範在哪裡，其實你越不管理，問題就越多，請問主委，你可不可以教我去買一顆比特幣？我要跟誰買？怎麼樣才不會被詐騙？ |
| gazette.blocks[54][0] |
彭主任委員金隆：這個當然我沒辦法教委員，但是我覺得…… |
| gazette.blocks[55][0] |
羅委員明才：沒關係，你的管理單位是誰？ |
| gazette.blocks[56][0] |
彭主任委員金隆：可以跟我們期局聯絡，但是上網看就有很多教學影片。 |
| gazette.blocks[57][0] |
羅委員明才：證期局？ |
| gazette.blocks[58][0] |
彭主任委員金隆：對。 |
| gazette.blocks[59][0] |
羅委員明才：我覺得還是要導正，因為當美國總統川普上臺以後，他已經認可了虛擬貨幣，你要跟著世界走嘛！ |
| gazette.blocks[60][0] |
彭主任委員金隆：其實我們也沒有不認可，只是我們現在在逐步納管中。 |
| gazette.blocks[61][0] |
羅委員明才：逐步嗎？那我希望這個會期可以做一件事情，就是你教導我如何買一顆正常、安全、不會被詐騙的比特幣，整個流程讓我知道一下？ |
| gazette.blocks[62][0] |
彭主任委員金隆：我請我們…… |
| gazette.blocks[63][0] |
羅委員明才：那我請問最後一句，買一顆比特幣要花多少錢？ |
| gazette.blocks[64][0] |
彭主任委員金隆：現在大概在八萬多塊美金。 |
| gazette.blocks[65][0] |
羅委員明才：臺幣嗎？ |
| gazette.blocks[66][0] |
彭主任委員金隆：不是，是美金。 |
| gazette.blocks[67][0] |
羅委員明才：美金喔！那我要稍微湊一下，你要教我喔！ |
| gazette.blocks[68][0] |
主席（賴委員士葆）：好啦！你不用湊啦，「壁角掃掃」就有了啦！ |
| gazette.blocks[68][1] |
謝謝羅委員的質詢。 |
| gazette.blocks[68][2] |
下一位請陳玉珍委員質詢。 |
| gazette.agenda.page_end |
478 |
| gazette.agenda.meet_id |
委員會-11-3-20-4 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[0] |
賴士葆 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[1] |
林德福 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[2] |
吳秉叡 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[3] |
顏寬恒 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[4] |
郭國文 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[5] |
賴惠員 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[6] |
李彥秀 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[7] |
鍾佳濱 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[8] |
李坤城 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[9] |
林思銘 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[10] |
黃珊珊 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[11] |
羅明才 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[12] |
陳玉珍 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[13] |
王世堅 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[14] |
張啓楷 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[15] |
徐欣瑩 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[16] |
邱志偉 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[17] |
楊瓊瓔 |
| gazette.agenda.page_start |
419 |
| gazette.agenda.meetingDate[0] |
2025-03-26 |
| gazette.agenda.gazette_id |
1143101 |
| gazette.agenda.agenda_lcidc_ids[0] |
1143101_00008 |
| gazette.agenda.meet_name |
立法院第11屆第3會期財政委員會第4次全體委員會議紀錄 |
| gazette.agenda.content |
邀請金融監督管理委員會彭主任委員金隆率所屬機關首長暨中央存款保險股份有限公司、監管相
關機構有關之財團法人、臺灣證券交易所股份有限公司、臺灣期貨交易所股份有限公司、臺灣集
中保管結算所股份有限公司等董事長、總經理列席業務報告，並備質詢 |
| gazette.agenda.agenda_id |
1143101_00007 |