| IVOD_ID |
159341 |
| IVOD_URL |
https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/159341 |
| 日期 |
2025-03-19 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼 |
委員會-11-3-26-3 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼:str |
第11屆第3會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第3次全體委員會議 |
| 會議資料.屆 |
11 |
| 會議資料.會期 |
3 |
| 會議資料.會次 |
3 |
| 會議資料.種類 |
委員會 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼[0] |
26 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼:str[0] |
社會福利及衛生環境委員會 |
| 會議資料.標題 |
第11屆第3會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第3次全體委員會議 |
| 影片種類 |
Clip |
| 開始時間 |
2025-03-19T10:26:09+08:00 |
| 結束時間 |
2025-03-19T10:37:04+08:00 |
| 影片長度 |
00:10:55 |
| 支援功能[0] |
ai-transcript |
| video_url |
https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/8d8da86eec6b25b8c19e7790e68f5d9f39fe1519e09d1f6f8962b2f3400241f679b5a1982509e2505ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8 |
| 委員名稱 |
王育敏 |
| 委員發言時間 |
10:26:09 - 10:37:04 |
| 會議時間 |
2025-03-19T09:00:00+08:00 |
| 會議名稱 |
立法院第11屆第3會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第3次全體委員會議（事由：一、邀請勞動部部長列席報告業務概況，並備質詢。
二、處理113年度中央政府總預算附屬單位預算決議有關勞動部預算凍結報告案19案。【報告事項】【如經復議則不予處理】
三、繼續審查114年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算關於勞動部主管部分。
【3月17日、19日及20日三天一次會】） |
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| transcript.whisperx[0].start |
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好 謝謝主席 我們有請洪部長來 請部長謝謝王委員部長這個勞工高喊還我七天假你之前也去參加過他們的活動 對不對有沒有去參加過七天假嗎對 他們的訴求我記得有一次你有去參加過你自己都忘記了 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].start |
33.245 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].end |
54.678 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].text |
應該是去年 你有代表民進黨去參加過去接受陳情 接受訴求所以你完全知道勞工他的訴求那這個在內政委員會也排了這個恢復國定假日期先假的這個議案那內政部部長是公然的反對 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].start |
55.939 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].end |
70.093 |
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所以他是不贊成甚至說這不是真正的議題內政部部長反對還給勞工7天假請問勞動部部長你是支持還是反對跟花園說明第一個你只要直接回答支持或反對就好 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].start |
78.71 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].end |
104.799 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].text |
這是一個立場的表態在國定假日的法規的主管機關是內政部那當然從勞動部的立場我們認為國定假日的調整的這個議題那如果可以在一致性跟公平性的原則下面做討論的話我們覺得有正向討論的空間你的回答很模糊正向討論的空間代表你是支持嗎我們覺得有正向討論的空間 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].start |
106.448 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].end |
113.993 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].text |
你不敢講出支持兩個字 洪部長你是勞動部部長勞動部部長站在全國千萬勞工的立場然後支持他們還給他們七天假這件事情有這麼困難嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].start |
123.559 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].end |
146.818 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].text |
王委員 我還是要說這一個法規的主管是在內政部當然啦 我是問勞動部部長你是贊成還是反對嘛對 我們覺得有正向討論的空間那是支持喔 我可以這樣講嗎我們覺得有正向討論的空間你怎麼一直在重複因為你的問題一直重複我叫你回答支持或反對這麼簡單的問題 我們的部長竟然回答不出來還是你根本就不敢回答 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].start |
148.178 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].end |
173.138 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].text |
你也不敢講支持你也不敢講反對我很清楚說了我們勞工部認為有正向討論的好那我就解讀說洪森漢支持還給勞工7天假那個我們覺得我們在政策討論的時候我覺得都應該要這個語意上面可以更精準這是我是希望說政策的討論要明確啊語意精準然後盡量不去做各種講話那我說洪森漢反對還給勞工7天假 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].start |
176.355 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].end |
199.785 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].text |
這個一樣也是這個不精準的簡化的詮釋啊其實部長你這樣子讓人家還蠻失望的大家說你從基層上來你最了解勞工的心聲結果在這種應該要表態的立場上面你還是用一種模糊以對不敢完全的表達自己站穩自己的立場如果勞動部部長都不敢站穩自己的立場 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].start |
201.065 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].end |
207.066 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].text |
內政部反對那請問行政院團隊裡面有哪一個內閣是支持還給勞工七天假的當勞動部都不敢幫勞工發聲那請問勞工要依靠誰為什麼我們歷任的這個勞動部部長都是往資方靠攏呢然後當時說換你上來會比較好因為你是從基層上來最理解勞工我看也沒有這樣子啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].start |
226.55 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].end |
241.443 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].text |
你該表態的時候你現在是不是當了官之後也不太敢表態了還要看上億還是你要看內政部的臉色因為人家內政部部長已經不同意了你就不敢站在勞動部部長立場大聲的說我跟他立場不一樣我認為應該再還給勞工七天假 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].start |
245.206 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].end |
265.698 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].text |
勞動部也是大的執政團隊議員 該表達的事情我們會表達但這個議題的主管 法規主管單位是內政部所以我們有我們的態度 那我們的態度就是覺得這個議題有正向討論的空間那就是要增加七天假嘛 應該就可以下這樣的標嘛 你不反對吧 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].start |
267.821 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].end |
289.418 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].text |
正向討論的空間是什麼就是你支持嘛我們覺得這個議題有討論的空間好那就是你支持我要讓你看一下那個數據我們現在的年總工時其實是不降反升近五年來從108年到現在它呈現的幅度本來有跌到谷底了就是不到這個一年不到 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].start |
291.299 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].end |
316.673 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].text |
2000現在去年又回升了到2030了所以在這樣的一個情況底下我們的勞工面對這一個工時過場的情況其實是沒有真正改善的如果可以多給他們這7天假我想是會有效的降低他的年總工時這個是數學的問題一看就知道而你看到這個我們跟日韓的特休日的比較我們對於新進的這個勞工我們現在給的 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].start |
320.035 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].end |
347.806 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].text |
休假天數是比較少的日本在第一年的時候是10天韓國是15天他們其實都很高我們是到後面年資的時候就是你的年資可能超過十幾年的時候我們才往上加所以這個當然對於比較年輕的勞工來講他現在面臨到的情況就是工時長國定假日少然後這個特休日數在第一年的時候也是相對日韓來講是比較低的所以我想勞工團體他們才會提出來嘛 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].start |
349.807 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].end |
375.858 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].text |
希望可以多增加這一個國定假日的7天假那我希望在這件事情上面部長你真的要站穩你的立場你搖擺的時候這個勞工的訴求就不可能達成因為連部長都不挺都不支持你的態度都不明確這個是不會有答案的接下來我要講的是這個防治霸凌專章對於保護勞工也是非常重要我要問你們你們的草案預計什麼時候對外公告 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].start |
378.288 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].end |
391.324 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].text |
我們的草案目前其實已經在最後的收尾的階段那我們希望在這個會期大概我們也希望能夠盡快的把它預告出來然後能夠在這個會期送到立法院 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].start |
392.391 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].end |
408.97 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].text |
對 什麼時候要預告因為最後有些條文我們還在做相關的這一週會對外預告嗎可能沒有辦法到這一週這麼快那我們會盡快那是不是可以下週就對外可以預告我也希望盡快 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].start |
411.612 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].end |
428.643 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].text |
我希望下週就可以預告那這其中有幾個部分我覺得很重要的我希望在你們的草案裡面要去定的更完整一個就是你的申訴機制你現在有沒有要求一定規模的企業他要建立申訴管道比照這個新工法 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].start |
431.467 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].end |
449.149 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].text |
現在是應該是往這個方向就是在申訴調查包括這些相關你們現在是多少規模你們現在初步的草案多少規模要建立申訴法我們是有一定規模的企業的要求但是詳細的內容等到我們預告的時候會讓委員這邊知道你們現在應該有大概的方向有 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].start |
453.49 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].end |
476.105 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].text |
這比較新公法嗎?是30號嗎?比較新公法嗎?因為這個法規大家的討論都會去參考新公法的概念那另外一個霸凌的調查應要透明化你們現在外部委員佔的比例有沒有要求要多少?我要求至少要半數我想現在大家都認為外部委員是很重要的所以會過半嘛對不對?在你們的草案裡面有沒有過半?是 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].start |
478.257 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].end |
507.12 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].text |
有 有過半嗎好 我要求一定要這樣子才不會有關關相互的問題第三個是你的再申訴的管道的機制因為之前你們這個勞動部發生的很不幸的公務人員被霸凌然後致死案之後他遇到的問題就是第一次調查是沒有成立是第二次調查再調查輿論嘩然他才成立所以你們所謂的再申訴機制的救濟管道有沒有納入你們的草案裡面 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].start |
508.025 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].end |
519.677 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].text |
當然救濟的做法這個當然這個都會在我們相關的法規裡面去做有納入嘛對不對我要求一定要這個再申訴的機制就是要納入裡面有嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].start |
522.549 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].end |
547.161 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].text |
細節的部分我想我們預告的時候會讓大家知道這個是方向性的問題有沒有納入再申訴我們有設計有設計對不對我要求就是要設計進去那這個部分是大家很期待的所以我希望你們這個修法的速度也是要加快你們草案也可以盡快在下個禮拜就是對外公告讓外界再給予你們更多的意見我們也希望盡快 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].start |
547.921 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].end |
565.855 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].text |
那最後一個是你的就業安定基金現在這個濫用7000萬這個之前大家已經討論很多你現在有一個測定作為那這個測定作為它其實不是法律它就是你公布的一個做法不是我們是會修訂法規命令 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].start |
566.135 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].end |
581.952 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].text |
好 那我就問你你現在所有的策進作為是不是通通都可以入法你是選擇性的我看你有一些有有要修訂在你的就業安定基金收支保管及運用辦法但有一些其實是沒有你並不是全面性的入法 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].start |
582.458 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].end |
608.932 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].text |
有一些會是行政規則但也有一些用法規命令我是希望你們回去再研議因為這次的整個救安基金所暴露的這些問題代表我們過去在管理跟運作上的確不夠嚴謹那既然你們要入法你如果覺得你這六項策進作為都是很到位而且很重要的你應該要研議每一項都在你的運用辦法裡面就是要加進去就是 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].start |
609.492 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].end |
626.496 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].text |
你應該讓他法治化以免現在是紅部長覺得這個很重要下一次以後可能不知道換哪一位部長上來覺得不重要他就可以做這個該遵守或不遵守他其實是沒有一個法令的要求的這個我希望你們回去你們再解釋這個測定做我們已經在進行中了 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].start |
628.937 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].end |
652.943 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].text |
那對於規範的形式上面當然我們也可以再做一些思考好你們再回去研議好不好我要求的就是說希望這整個可以是更嚴謹的其實我們是把它修進我們的法規命令裡面好很好那你們就是整個你們再給我一份報告就是哪一些是修法規命令哪一些是修到你的運用辦法我希望看到的是你整個是一個很嚴謹的做法好不好好謝謝 |