| IVOD_ID |
159287 |
| IVOD_URL |
https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/159287 |
| 日期 |
2025-03-17 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼 |
委員會-11-3-15-3 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼:str |
第11屆第3會期內政委員會第3次全體委員會議 |
| 會議資料.屆 |
11 |
| 會議資料.會期 |
3 |
| 會議資料.會次 |
3 |
| 會議資料.種類 |
委員會 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼[0] |
15 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼:str[0] |
內政委員會 |
| 會議資料.標題 |
第11屆第3會期內政委員會第3次全體委員會議 |
| 影片種類 |
Clip |
| 開始時間 |
2025-03-17T12:36:28+08:00 |
| 結束時間 |
2025-03-17T12:50:42+08:00 |
| 影片長度 |
00:14:14 |
| 支援功能[0] |
ai-transcript |
| video_url |
https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/597499b2503050fba37930166384dc3c100c4df18311f68d19c9681c5de8395411aaf748057b52845ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8 |
| 委員名稱 |
黃國昌 |
| 委員發言時間 |
12:36:28 - 12:50:42 |
| 會議時間 |
2025-03-17T09:00:00+08:00 |
| 會議名稱 |
(變更議程)立法院第11屆第3會期內政委員會第3次全體委員會議（事由：一、審查委員賴士葆等22人擬具「紀念日及節日實施法草案」案。二、審查委員高金素梅等18人擬具「紀念日及節日實施條例草案」案。三、審查委員陳瑩等16人擬具「國假暨文化節日實施條例草案」案。四、審查委員伍麗華Saidhai Tahovecahe等17人擬具「國家紀念日及節日實施法草案」案。五、審查委員牛煦庭等22人擬具「紀念日及節日實施條例草案」案。六、審查委員陳玉珍等16人擬具「中華民國國定紀念日與節日實施法草案」案。七、審查台灣民眾黨黨團擬具「紀念日及節日實施條例草案」案。八、審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等18人擬具「國家紀念日及節日實施法草案」案。九、審查委員王鴻薇等19人擬具「國家紀念日及節日實施法草案」案。十、審查委員許宇甄等19人擬具「紀念日及節日實施法草案」案。十一、審查委員楊瓊瓔等31人擬具「紀念日及節日實施條例草案」案。十二、審查委員林思銘等20人擬具「紀念日及節日實施條例草案」案。十三、審查委員翁曉玲等18人擬具「紀念日及節日實施條例草案」案。十四、審查委員葉元之等21人擬具「紀念日及節日實施條例草案」案。十五、審查委員林倩綺等20人擬具「國家紀念日及節日實施法草案」案。十六、審查委員許智傑等30人擬具「國定紀念日及節日實施條例草案」案。十七、審查委員魯明哲等16人擬具「紀念日及節日實施條例草案」案。十八、審查委員羅廷瑋等23人擬具「紀念日及節日實施條例草案」案。十九、審查委員洪孟楷等16人擬具「國定假日法草案」案。二十、審查委員張智倫等18人擬具「紀念日及節日實施條例草案」案。二十一、審查委員萬美玲等19人擬具「紀念日及節日實施條例草案」案。二十二、審查委員黃健豪等16人擬具「紀念日及節日實施條例草案」案。二十三、審查委員李彥秀等16人擬具「國定紀念日及節日實施條例草案」案。二十四、審查委員廖偉翔等16人擬具「紀念日及節日實施條例草案」案。二十五、審查委員高金素梅等29人擬具「紀念日及節日實施條例草案」案。二十六、委員徐欣瑩等22人擬具「紀念日及節日實施條例草案」案。
【僅詢答及宣讀條文；第二十一及第二十二案，如未經各黨團簽署不復議同意書不予審查；第二十三至第二十六案，如未經院會交付本會審查或未經各黨團簽署不復議同意書不予審查。】） |
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謝謝主席,事事麻煩有請我們原民會的主委曾主委有請也請內政部的部長,劉部長有請主委好,部長好,先請教主委之前原民會辦一個原住民族人口基礎資料規劃還有建制研究這個研究執行到什麼時候? |
| transcript.whisperx[1].start |
39.053 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].end |
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112年你們在112年的時候執行到112年那112年的預算為什麼還有這個建制研究因為這個還要做一些收尾的工作所以有收尾嗎?有執行嗎? |
| transcript.whisperx[2].start |
67.984 |
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後來就是有弄到我們的智慧治理的這個部分來做什麼來你先針對問題回答我們在變預算的原則你有計畫所以要有經費我現在的問題是這個計畫早就終止了為什麼這個計畫終止後面還有變預算剛剛你說到112年來我們來看一下 |
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96.429 |
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112年就沒有再執行這是白紙黑字審計部的調查報告出來現在我非常的困惑我們的園民會預算到底是怎麼編的從112年就沒這個計畫這個計畫到111年就結束了我們再回去看一下 |
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121.567 |
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你們園民會的預算書啊112年113年每一年都還有這個計畫執行每一年都在編經費那現在出現的問題是什麼現在出現的問題是你們在虛編預算執行幽靈計畫嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].start |
141.766 |
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143.57 |
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這個計畫111年就終止了為什麼112年113年的預算數還出現這個計畫主委可不可以說明一下 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].start |
155.106 |
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170.495 |
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這怎麼回事啊我們還有一些維運的計畫 仔細再做不是嘛 我已經白紙黑色亮出來了你還要在這邊強辯還要在這邊撒謊這審計不下去 審計的結果啊111年計畫就結束了112年開始 沒有再辦理該計畫 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].start |
180.26 |
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結果112年的預算書113年的預算書繼續編根本就不存在的計畫聯名會預算書可以這樣編嗎用幽靈的計畫來騙預算這樣對嗎來請教主委我們還有一些違印的計畫所以才有這樣子編違印的計畫主委我已經白紙黑字亮出來給你看了 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].start |
211.755 |
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233.551 |
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你還繼續在台上鬼扯啊這是審計部交來的審計報告啊我現在的問題很簡單啊這兩年邊在這個企劃向下的錢花到什麼地方去邊在這個企劃向下的錢花到什麼地方去這是我的問題 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].start |
235.799 |
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258.447 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].text |
趴到哪裡去因為確實啦確實過去的編列不太妥當但是就是說我們有一些這個先兩個部分嘛第一個你剛剛承認一件事情我肯定你啊過去的編列不太妥當啊這個不是用不太妥當四個字就可以形容啊這根本在胡搞瞎搞啊計畫已經終結了結果用幽營計畫來騙預算 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].start |
261.392 |
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281.546 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].text |
這個審計部的報告寫得很清楚啦現在我的第二個問題是錢花到哪裡去啊錢花到哪裡去牽涉到兩個年度你編在這個計畫項下面原民會把錢花到什麼地方去嗎針對這件事情一個禮拜之內給我書面回覆好嗎好可以嗎可以好 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].start |
282.574 |
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305.148 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].text |
那第三個事情跟這個有關係的事情是審計部的報告上面也說原民會這樣亂搞不對那我現在的問題來啦那接下來原民會這件事情打算要怎麼辦就算了反正錢都花了錢要追回來嗎不是我們現在跟審計部我們也在做一個檢討需要檢討多久 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].start |
308.837 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].end |
326.552 |
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這沒有什麼好檢討的啦,我老實跟你講啦這個就是一個幽靈計畫嘛錢花到哪裡去了一個禮拜回復我我現在接下來的問題是要花掉這些錢接下來現在要怎麼辦要追回來嗎還是錢花了就花了,這是我的問題 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].start |
328.971 |
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354.722 |
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因為我們現在跟審計部也有在跟他們做說明假設就是審計部怎麼樣來指示或者是怎麼樣來要我們檢討我們會依照他的意思來做檢討你們回文審計部了嗎回了回的內容會後可不可以提供給我好如果審計部要把錢追回來你們就會把錢追回來對不對對這件事情很重要下一個問題崔榮浩上任以後提了幾次覆議你知道嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].start |
357.235 |
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385.045 |
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應該是五次吧應該是五次嘛我們上次修了原住民族委員會組織法三讀後你們原民會發聲明說要提復議提了沒有這個跟委員報告我們就是這個部分我們要研議後來我們研議的結果我們沒有提奇怪了聲明不是嗆得很大聲說要提復議到最後也沒有提怎麼樣是昨天他不支持嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].start |
386.297 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].end |
414.375 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].text |
是院長不支持嗎不是後來我們就沒有對嘛我當然知道你客觀上沒有提嘛那我現在的問題就很清楚啊奇怪我們的園民會是把婦役當兒戲嗎在臉書上貼還發了新聞稿嗆聲嗆得很大聲結果搞到後來虎頭蛇尾什麼都沒有做是你要提婦役卓榮泰不支持嗎說清楚啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].start |
418.769 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].end |
438.215 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].text |
有人會可以這樣幹喔?蛤?我們後來就是我們自己內部就是研議就是我們研議之後我們就沒有提所以當初發這個聲明然後寫臉書嗆聲是什麼?私律不周嗎?你內部還沒有研議完就急著發臉書嗆聲啊? |
| transcript.whisperx[17].start |
442.591 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].end |
469.713 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].text |
不是啊!這個臉書是假的嗎?這個新聞稿是假的嗎?我有說錯嗎?哇!我跟主委講啊三思而後行啊想清楚啦想清楚啦不要以後讓大家不把圓明會的聲明當一回事啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].start |
470.919 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].end |
481.528 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].text |
你講了以後又沒有執行到底讓人家看破手腳覺得很遺憾來接下來再請一下部長請部長部長有請 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].start |
485.29 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].end |
502.623 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].text |
不好意思部長我們那個進度我要繼續追一下我上一次的時候我要請教你針對極有法修正的進程目前進度如何目前我們警政署已經討論完畢但是跟其他單位之間還需要多久 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].start |
504.209 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].end |
526.569 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].text |
可能會有困擾 因為行政院會要求我們所謂的復建裡面的禁制區域禁制區域包括像醫院 或者是像司法機關前面這些每個人的看法都不一樣所以現在行政院的立場是要繼續維持禁制區嗎現在還是需要考量禁制區但是呢來 我們先一個一個具體的來看剛剛你講到禁制區嘛 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].start |
529.393 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].end |
545.12 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].text |
這個是內政部在1996年所公告的禁制區國外破區化得非常的大,我的在地圖上全部把它框出來這個是1996年內政部公告的禁制區從1996年到現在2025年,這個禁制區的範圍有檢討過嗎? |
| transcript.whisperx[22].start |
550.247 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].end |
575.714 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].text |
現在在檢討那但是呢現在在檢討所以從1996最起碼到今天為止沒有任何變更嗎目前為止是沒有但是我想委員非常知道在相關的一些集會遊行活動其實我們採取比較有聯繫的措施非常嚴謹啊當初馬政府時期的時候民進黨發的新聞稿是什麼說的是黑心版本 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].start |
577.032 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].end |
600.258 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].text |
為什麼說那個時候提出來這黑心版本因為他要保留禁制區嘛賴清德主張集遊法禁制區要刪除這個是賴清德在2008年的時候集會遊行法公聽會代表民主進步黨黨團發表的立場這個立場到今天是不是改變了 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].start |
602.928 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].end |
610.891 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].text |
這個立場到現在為止所謂的禁制區的規定予以廢除這個事情其實我們有所保留所以賴清德總統的立場改變了是嗎所以賴總統的立場沒有改變但是內政部有保留是這樣嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].start |
617.893 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].end |
642.28 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].text |
我們的保留是在於執行面會碰到困擾所以當初賴清德在當立委的時候他主張要廢除進治區那個時候醫院的騷擾沒有那麼大對於醫院等安全進治區的騷擾沒有那麼大那時宜進遷我們覺得必須要所以時空環境背景不太一樣了賴清德立委那個時候的主張到賴清德總統現在有改變是嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].start |
643.83 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].end |
654.258 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].text |
如果說我們的主張 譬如說本來是申請制然後變成一部分的報備制那其實是朝著這個方向在處理我們希望是審慎的處理而不是斷崖式的處理所以那時候賴清德的主張是斷崖式的處理嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].start |
661.263 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].end |
677.408 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].text |
沒有 它是它的主張主張跟處理的方式是牽涉到在行政部門的執行的方式那行政部門的執行方式就是剛剛我跟委員報告的部分因為你在司法區域或是相關的司法單位的話不是行政部門而是司法部門 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].start |
678.408 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].end |
698.513 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].text |
然後行政部門包括醫院等這些一受到騷擾會干擾到病患或是干擾到去司法院處理一些他們的司法的業務的部分的話那這個必須要比較多的時間跟他們溝通所以你剛剛講的那些考慮賴清德當初在主張廢除禁制區的時候都沒有想到就對了 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].start |
699.461 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].end |
715.994 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].text |
他是一個原則我們根據這個原則在處理他當初提的原則不就是要廢除經濟區嗎來來來紅色的字啊你要念一下嗎白紙黑字啊寫得這麼清楚的東西啊立場有改變就改變嘛有轉彎就轉彎嘛來 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].start |
719.692 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].end |
744.459 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].text |
這個是當初2008年一路到現在2016年那個時候結果到現在就沒有然後了部長說要演繹某個程度上我並不反對但是一個法案從2016年都是民進黨政府主政行政部門全部都是民進黨政府演繹到現在2025年 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].start |
746.988 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].end |
751.401 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].text |
請問部長還要再研議多久還是一樣沒有時間表,有可能一路研議到2028年 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].start |
754.674 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].end |
778.178 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].text |
我無法在這個地方跟委員會講一件事所以當初在提證件的時候,怎麼提都可以嗎?真的要實現證件的時候,開始問題一堆啊、藉口一堆啊,說要延避大家也都同意重點是什麼?從2016年延避到2025年,接下來還要再延避多久? |
| transcript.whisperx[33].start |
778.658 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].end |
807.458 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].text |
仍然會在研議當中我知道 我了解持續的研議嘛不斷的研議嘛對啊現在你所講的問題啊當初在2008年好像都不存在嘛你現在講的問題在2008年都不存在嘛所以2008年的時候那新北總統才會提出這樣的主張嘛結果搞到現在2025年的時候還是一模一樣嘛彷彿你今天講的考慮2008年都不存在一樣啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].start |
808.888 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].end |
827.843 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].text |
一個政府開了支票就要兌現不是拿來跳票的所以當初2008年賴清德提這個主張就是不審慎就是不嚴謹就是賴清德當初提那樣的主張就是要造成人民的困擾不是嗎所以主張就說得是一套真的可以做的時候就沒有要做 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].start |
837.651 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].end |
851.026 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].text |
沒有 現在有在做只是在考量要更審慎是 你們說現在有在做從2016年做到現在已經2025年了嘛那大家就看你們持續研議下去要研議多久嘛好 謝謝 |