| IVOD_ID |
159018 |
| IVOD_URL |
https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/159018 |
| 日期 |
2025-03-11 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼 |
全院委員會-11-3-2 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼:str |
第11屆第3會期第2次全院委員會會議 |
| 會議資料.屆 |
11 |
| 會議資料.會期 |
3 |
| 會議資料.會次 |
2 |
| 會議資料.種類 |
全院委員會 |
| 會議資料.標題 |
第11屆第3會期第2次全院委員會會議 |
| 影片種類 |
Clip |
| 開始時間 |
2025-03-11T14:46:48+08:00 |
| 結束時間 |
2025-03-11T15:03:08+08:00 |
| 影片長度 |
00:16:20 |
| 支援功能[0] |
ai-transcript |
| video_url |
https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/a37056a99b6ff728abe359369920760d31125bfab2e25e2581efae1376afe49b96fa539d5614b54a5ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8 |
| 委員名稱 |
洪孟楷 |
| 委員發言時間 |
14:46:48 - 15:03:08 |
| 會議時間 |
2025-03-11T09:00:00+08:00 |
| 會議名稱 |
第11屆第3會期第2次全院委員會會議（事由：一、「中華民國114年度中央政府總預算案」覆議案（3月11日）。二、「財政收支劃分法」第八條、第十六條之一及第三十條條文覆議案（3月12日）。） |
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| transcript.whisperx[0].start |
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主席謝謝麻煩請卓院長還有衛福部邱部長麻煩再請卓院長衛福部邱部長請 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].start |
29.841 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].end |
54.506 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].text |
紅委員好好 院長好 部長好來 部長我想先請教我這過年結束之後最近我要先幫我們的醫護人員來講講話因為醫護人員真的非常的辛苦尤其疫情期間的時候我們看到很多醫護人員在地線那撐過之後到現在我們也持續希望能夠給醫護人員合理的一個待遇可是 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].start |
55.406 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].end |
73.932 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].text |
醫護人員的短缺跟勞動的條件其實是很大的一個問題它跟預算來講沒有那麼直接的關係因為最大的離職潮其實是在疫情之後跟去年的六月所以醫護人員他希望的是能夠改善醫護的勞動空間勞動條件是不是是的我想改善醫護 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].start |
79.212 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].end |
97.132 |
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工作條件其實是政府一直在努力的那行政院在所以他是長期以來的一個問題過去您擔任立法委員的時候也很關心是對不對是那就沒有存在是說因為說什麼刪預算凍結預算而造成醫護人員的這個負擔嘛 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].start |
99.975 |
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122.364 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].text |
因為過去預算一樣是照常給你們使用啊過去八年民進黨政府不是每一次國會多數的時候都支持衛福部的預算但是最大的離職潮就在疫情之後跟去年的六月那醫護人員的辛苦到底誰來幫他們發聲報告委員如果預算受到凍結或者是 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].start |
124.027 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].end |
146.715 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].text |
其實還是有影響到醫護人員環境的改善我現在在講的是之前的狀況你剛剛也已經承認了嘛是不是之前就已經有離職潮這是不是長期的問題所以我們是不是應該要一起努力來解決長期的問題當然當然是來部長我再請教一下我一定要利用這個機會讓你說明清楚醫護人員的月薪有7萬塊平均嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].start |
150.228 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].end |
153.992 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].text |
我們的衛福部的粉專講說護理師的月薪有七萬 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].start |
155.604 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].end |
181.023 |
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結果雞成整個大炸鍋我們看一下新聞裡面報導講說醫護人員紛紛表達不滿認為衛福部是誘導誤導而且這樣反而是汙名化好像讓醫護人員覺得是說他們坐領高薪讓外界覺得是有對立覺得說他們坐領高薪但實際上他們薪水有那麼多嗎所以甚至有人講這不知道是哪一個大腦袋想出來的來 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].start |
184.666 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].end |
212.265 |
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月薪是行情價嗎是灌水灌到離譜的價格還有現在有沒有看到護理師在網上發起什麼運動發起他貼出他的薪資單他把他的薪資單貼出來每一個護理師都講說抱歉我拉低了平均抱歉我沒有達到7萬那我們將請教如果護理師沒有達到7萬的話衛福部是不是要編列預算補足 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].start |
213.41 |
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235.195 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].text |
部長給你一個機會澄清一下護理師的待遇有平均月薪7萬元嗎報告委員醫護同仁真的工作非常辛苦他們的待遇如果能夠一直提升是我們很期待的事情第二個這個網站上面所呈現的是一個人收入除以12他是由在112年11月的時候由 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].start |
238.995 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].end |
263.958 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].text |
縣市衛生府邀請各地的醫院他把他的整個說他們護理人員的一個就是薪資包括固定跟非固定當然這裡面可能有包括獎金年終獎金等等的除以12出來的一個數目那我問過幾乎問過所有的重要的尤其是北部不管我問台大北醫什麼都滿些場跟說你們的你們這個報告的 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].start |
265.579 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].end |
274.743 |
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薪資是不是真實的他們也說絕對是真實的我昨天有問新光醫院的院長他說他絕對是真實的所以現在就是這些護理人員他們說話他是一種雷霜而且這是 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].start |
280.024 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].end |
296.729 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].text |
等於是平均值那有不同的第一個這是醫院的那可能醫院本身有不同的病房以外所以也有不同病房的狀況也有不同病房的狀況也有不同人班的狀況也有日班夜班的狀況 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].start |
298.37 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].end |
325.88 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].text |
我們現在只要問的是護理人員他現在被貼上一個標籤了這個標籤是從衛福部來的衛福部告訴大家是說護理人員平均月薪有7萬請教有嗎我想這是醫院爆出來的一個整個整個年初的時候這是衛福部的粉絲專頁貼的那你現在要推給醫院公開的大家都可以上去查如果醫院有不遵時的他就有他可能就會有問題而且這個當時的目的不是說去比 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].start |
326.68 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].end |
343.638 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].text |
當時的目的是希望說我們衛福部有沒有去查證護理人員如果說知道每一家醫院他的待遇是多少我們衛福部有沒有去查證我們衛福部有沒有去理解現在我怎麼感覺你好像站在知方的立場在講話我現在希望的是幫我們衛福人員來爭取應有幫助力不應該被污名化 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].start |
348.603 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].end |
372.083 |
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我完完全全就是希望把醫護跟著政府一直努力把醫護的工作環境弄好就是因為這樣子所以說才不應該用衛福部的粉絲專業來這樣做部長我時間有限我覺得你剛剛沒有辦法回答問題因為這是衛福部的粉絲專業貼出來的而你現在居然全部都推給醫院醫院的報告是資方的報告 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].start |
373.733 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].end |
394.801 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].text |
講不客氣的 資方給你們的資料你有沒有去調查讓牢方 代表牢方的醫護人員他們都說他們沒有 那中間的落差在哪裡我們不停的在跟護理師公會或者公會做溝通我想不要讓我們的院長在那裡我們一定會很清晰來努力改善本席很認真的跟您說 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].start |
396.348 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].end |
410.022 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].text |
看得到這是你衛福部部長的態度但是很實在的話過去到現在本席也非常多的護理工會也來跟我澄清絕對他們的月薪沒有到這樣子甚至所謂的 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].start |
411.892 |
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440.19 |
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五萬塊六萬五都沒有辦法達到一個月平均是四萬多塊而這樣的狀況其實他們是用他們的熱情他們的時間來去支撐但我們更希望的是給他們更好的勞動條件我最後請教一下三班互併比我們的草案修正本會期能不能提出來行政院的版本有關三班互併比我們現在是用獎勵的 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].start |
441.141 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].end |
461.853 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].text |
那不管是醫學中心當初在選舉的時候是誰講說一定要入法才有效力因為這個當初在選舉的時間是誰講兩年拚入法 四年拚實行那現在我這個會期因為醫療的院所也需要一個這個會期能不能出來 我只問能不能 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].start |
462.968 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].end |
482.659 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].text |
跟委員報告 三方貨幣比剛剛部長說我們先用獎勵的方式在制度完全形成之前獎勵的方式達到直接給護理人員再來就是獎勵達標的意願所以看起來是沒有辦法出來未來我們是朝向更完整的一個法制面不過我今天肯定委員這樣的質詢的內容 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].start |
485.78 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].end |
502.067 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].text |
統計數字最怕的就是沒有達到這個數字的會覺得被剝奪了但是這個7萬塊他到底是中位數還是什麼方式計算應該要標示清楚他所說的是一年的收入除以12所以有很多固定跟非固定但是一定要說明清楚 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].start |
502.907 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].end |
518.465 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].text |
收入高於7萬塊的護理人員不會有意見不過我覺得那個是比較少的比較多的人他是沒有辦法達到但是平均下來看他會達到接近這樣的數字但是還是要說明清楚讓我透過今天這樣的方式請衛福部要跟護理人員 護理師們 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].start |
519.566 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].end |
543.325 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].text |
充分說明清楚這個不是用這樣的數字來跟社會做一個假象的宣示而是大家要有一個共鳴您講的完全就是本席為什麼要求部長你用粉絲專業帶風向讓外界標籤汙名其實這個是不道德的本席更希望的是看到真真實實的我們一起努力好 部長請回 院長感謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].start |
544.775 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].end |
549.591 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].text |
本席現在要講的是過去到現在我擔任五年的立法委員 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].start |
551.038 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].end |
578.14 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].text |
資歷沒有很深但是我每一次部會首長來我辦公室討論預算的時候我一定告訴他們一件事情預算當用則用 當審則審但我身為在野黨的立委我不會要馬而好 又要馬而不吃草該給的預算 合理的預算我們會支持但重點是預算要花在刀口上來 院長今天早上我也聆聽了您的報告也看了早上的一個質詢 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].start |
579.738 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].end |
598.861 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].text |
很遺憾你還是提出了復議你一直強調說這是憲政給你的一個權利但是在今年的二月的時候賴清德總統召開的五院的院長的會議時候韓國院長江啟臣副院長也代表立法院出席並且也都有釋出善意 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].start |
599.341 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].end |
622.288 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].text |
包括韓國院長也特別提到說其實可以用追加預算的方式我們讓現在已經通過預算能夠先行如果真的有自愛難行或說真的有不足之處用追加預算的方式大家互相來溝通溝通溝通我們互相的來討論可以心平氣和對話但很顯然的你還是不願意接受所以還是提了復議 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].start |
623.368 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].end |
645.873 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].text |
那也許明天才化法的詢答完畢之後再投票有可能這兩個復議案總預算跟才化法復議案也沒有辦法通過到時候你的任內還不到一年的任期已經五次復議失敗了院長你自己怎麼看五連敗的院長這樣子好看嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].start |
646.849 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].end |
665.874 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].text |
所以我說過這是富裕最多的行政院但是富裕不是好不好看的問題而是我們身為憲政機關唯一可以提出富裕的機關來 院長 那我再請教如果說每一次你都講自愛難行每一次都富裕沒有通過那你還是好官我自為之 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].start |
667.452 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].end |
683.244 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].text |
你說你沒有辦法做那你又不願意換別人來做你還是持續在這個位置上如果換了任何一位有沒有任何的政治責任五次的復議失敗你認為你自己有沒有任何政治責任如果換任何一位院長面對的是 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].start |
684.105 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].end |
708.409 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].text |
破壞憲政分際的法案 侵害人民的法案 自然難行的法案議員長 立法院是多數決我們經過民主的程序 合法 合規 合憲的情況送出來議員長 理性的溝通 我現在只請教的是說如果復議再次失敗 明天投出來 兩個復議案都沒有辦法通過有沒有政治責任 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].start |
709.96 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].end |
725.039 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].text |
我們的政治責任在於說復議案如果沒有通過之後我們如何來挽救這個國家不會因為憲政分立被破壞人民權利被傷害以及沒有經過充分討論違反程序正義的這種法案 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].start |
725.76 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].end |
746.709 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].text |
能夠對國家上都經過充分討論院長你這樣講我就非常的遺憾說實在話本席今天真的是很心平氣和因為討論到預算我還是強調我的觀念喔我是認為當用則用當省則省大家把錢花在刀口上我會支持但是重點在於是現在你們提出來的預算年增率是超過10% |
| transcript.whisperx[34].start |
749.712 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].end |
775.072 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].text |
兩兆九千三百多億的預算是中華民國總預算史上最高比去年的預算還多增加了七百億比二零一六年馬政府時代要卸任的時候還增加了將近一兆的預算如果說有那麼多的預算中華民國政府史上最高預算你們都還認為說自愛難行的話那不是非常荒謬嗎我們必須再說明一次再來這個預算裡面有兩千八百零六億是新增去年沒有的 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].start |
775.572 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].end |
801.86 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].text |
但是大家把它當作空氣存在2000多億就是你年增10%我剛剛已經說了2000多億是剛剛新增的10%但是整個TOTAL全部結束之後還比去年多增加了700億這是不是事實但是你把它塞三減就但你要扣掉這2806億啊那去年沒有的啊沒關係你不想要這樣子你故意想要模糊焦點 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].start |
803.839 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].end |
825.649 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].text |
來 院長我們再來討論去年的數字你再扣掉院長你要故意要模糊焦點我現在再來討論的是另外一個部分民進黨現在執政黨說要來發動所謂的全台大宣講那也看到你會帶著部會首長一起來下鄉宣講這些預算都不會用到我們中央政府總預算嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[37].start |
827.216 |
| transcript.whisperx[37].end |
853.129 |
| transcript.whisperx[37].text |
宣講是誰要花錢我不應該在這裡談黨務但是民進黨有沒有你會不會出席民進黨有沒有權利在發動出席出席宣講 會嘛外界報導是說你每一場都要參加我早上有說過了 復議案的結果我們有必要向外界說明 必須執行如果有適當的時間機會 有任何邀請這個宣講 我們政府官員會不會出席 |
| transcript.whisperx[38].start |
854.912 |
| transcript.whisperx[38].end |
881.966 |
| transcript.whisperx[38].text |
如果我需要政策一半跟著我一起做說明也會出席如果需要政策一邊一邊做說明一邊這些政府官有些不是民進黨籍也會出席所以這個不是參加民進黨活動而已看起來就是民進黨活動還是民進黨發起的還中央黨部規劃咧來最後這個錢是誰要出一個任何團體這個宣講的活動是誰要出錢行政院已經沒有這個經費在 |
| transcript.whisperx[39].start |
883.444 |
| transcript.whisperx[39].end |
911.552 |
| transcript.whisperx[39].text |
出這個錢沒有這個經費所以說我們部會首長下鄉前往包括說院長要出發的時候會有隨戶多增加的這個警務的同仁的開銷支出誰要出錢誰要買單在參加非公務的活動的時候我們自有分寸公私分明是所以你要自己掏腰包你如果說有隨戶的話自己掏腰包需要的時候就是自己掏腰包是這樣子嗎確定去參加的活動是什麼性質 |
| transcript.whisperx[40].start |
913.19 |
| transcript.whisperx[40].end |
935.293 |
| transcript.whisperx[40].text |
來最後院長呂秀蓮前總統也是民進黨籍他講過一句話中央編了那麼多預算但是綠營到底做了什麼沒有人有印象所以呼籲有權者應該要下面閉嘴別再講自愛難行癱瘓國家不如端出政績院長你認同嗎就是這樣子我有必要 |
| transcript.whisperx[41].start |
937.435 |
| transcript.whisperx[41].end |
956.147 |
| transcript.whisperx[41].text |
所以說你再認識什麼人我都會有意義的跟他說院長 再過兩個月你就是主惡靈你就是一年本席很由衷的希望看到當一年你的就職成績當然就是可以真真正正抬起重大向國人報告而不是到最後只是變成說我提了幾個 |
| transcript.whisperx[42].start |
969.458 |
| transcript.whisperx[42].end |
975.302 |
| transcript.whisperx[42].text |
好 謝謝好 謝謝洪孟凱為的詢問 謝謝卓院長的答詢 |