| video_url |
https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/6c9ad41bd34b9fe1e095734c473695d7042f85579c7bbf09eea424d6e3fa09885d0c75dcc8d4630c5ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8 |
| 委員名稱 |
劉建國 |
| 委員發言時間 |
14:15:56 - 14:29:47 |
| 影片長度 |
831 |
| 會議時間 |
2024-12-09T09:00:00+08:00 |
| 會議名稱 |
立法院第11屆第2會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第13次全體委員會議（事由：一、邀請勞動部部長列席報告業務概況，並備質詢。
二、審查中華民國114年度中央政府總預算案關於勞動部主管預算。(公務及基金預算)
三、審查勞動部函送財團法人職業災害預防及重建中心114年度預算書案。
【所列預算案，僅詢答，113年12月9日下午5時截止收案】
【業務報告及討論事項綜合詢答】） |
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委員發言。請留言。好,謝謝主席。這是變場喔。這是變場是給身高的比較高的委員好用,不是大聲用的。這個要列入紀錄。這是我建議的。院會那個也是我建議的。你看這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].start |
29.116 |
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33.133 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].text |
遭到我們比較高人多久的時間。好,謝謝主席,要請部長。好,請部長。 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].start |
41.653 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].end |
67.123 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].text |
六人好。部長好。部長辛苦了齁。那要在知己前齁我先向委員報告有關於這個EAP的員工協助方案各位可以看一下這個相關的一些資料齁。台灣對於EAP的推廣是依據勞動部的公開資料最早可以追溯到1950年到1980年。那30個年代啦齁當時大概是一個觀念與這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].start |
68.744 |
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88.097 |
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出行的一個建立。然後在1994年勞委會時代台灣的員工協助方案的具體才來成型。從2009年一直到這個2013年勞動部開始推動員工協助方案並在2014年起每兩年針對民間企業舉辦相關的這個表揚。同時在2015年 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].start |
95.659 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].end |
120.405 |
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勞動部也喊請行政院、辦部、行政院所屬及帝王主管機關推動員工協助方案的成效力的評估計畫。所以這個EAP的員工協助方案不是這幾年才突然冒出的東西。也這陣子所有出租單位每一個都喊要啟動員工協助方案也證實這個不是一個非常不重要的事情。那 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].start |
122.901 |
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144.132 |
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平常沒有人重視,等到出事情才千瘡百孔。我要在這邊特別提醒,然後也回顧一下,在之前我在審查立法院的預算,立法院本院的預算的時候,我在質疑說為什麼預算書沒有員工協助方案。當時立法院對我的答覆是這樣,醫護是有開精神科門診。 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].start |
146.787 |
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173.119 |
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這是立法院本院對我的答覆,這個都有匯率記錄基本上就是目前公部門也就是當時這個公部門對這個EAP的一個態度那勞動部推這個EAP到現在已經十幾年過去如果今天連勞動部在執行上都做了亂七八糟那難怪立法院敢這麼回答嘛醫護是有精神科的這個門診所以我要請部長就上週在諮詢在諮詢這個EAP的員工協助方的時候 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].start |
175.22 |
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202.288 |
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要求勞動部提一個初步的一個改善計畫給委員會做參考。我不曉得這個報告部長有沒有看過。你當過立委,所以這個報告兩頁,你覺得這樣及格嗎?我是請問部長﹖ 現在是不夠的。你還沒有看過?我有看,我有看過一下,但是送出去我覺得應該是不夠的。不夠格,好。那我們就不要對這個報告再討論了,因為你覺得不夠格就不需要討論,讓大家彼此時間嘛齁。 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].start |
203.459 |
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231.189 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].text |
但是這個報告中他還是有提到一段我覺得還是有抓到問題這個是要給予肯定的就是要擴增諮商的時數勞動部員工的協助方案目前是每年每個人一年五次然後一次時間是60分鐘然後我要請教部長如果到114年的員工協助方案一個人可以增加到幾次還是必須要依照情況 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].start |
233.328 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].end |
251.935 |
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簡單回應我就很好各位我其實已經有跟部內指示了第一個現在看起來確實在預算不當時預算編列的時候經費是相對比較有限的但如果有因為這個預算不足的部分我們會在部內再找經費的資源來做補助會往上調看會這是第一點第二點是 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].start |
256.337 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].end |
285.452 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].text |
我覺得重點是我們要怎麼讓這個EAP的基金設計的更好用。因為有一種可能是因為設計的不夠完善所以變成想要用的人不多看起來需求就不大是用的經費就不多所以重點是怎麼把它設計的更實用上面更更加的完善那所以不能不要讓說因為是你使用設計的不好用或者是你經費預算的上限讓員工想要使用的時候遇到限制這是我 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].start |
286.112 |
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298.627 |
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我就是我們覺得這都要把它打開的事情對所以所以部長已經在打呼我等一下問的問題了嗎那我們就直接聊當進入到重點嗎先來講就是說那你到底要怎麼設計你依據什麼設計怎麼設計多久時間可以設計出來能不能簡單打呼我 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].start |
301.69 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].end |
329.863 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].text |
那個跟我覺得我們對於這個機制的操作的使用可不可以給我們多一點時間當然當然當然當然可不可以給我們一個月的時間可以啊可以啊那讓我們有一個月的時間來做這部分機制的檢討這樣子對那如果有因為預算不夠的部分我們會來找錢來補充更多的經費所需部長這樣的一個態度就會讓我覺得比較安心那也不是比較基於在 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].start |
330.623 |
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359.645 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].text |
在做這個事情的一個很重點式的一個回應我之前是針對司法院的員工寫書案的時候在2022年也被我檢討過那當時司法院員工寫書案只局限給司法官用一年八次那後來就是因為坦白講就是有跟他ㄉㄧㄤ過所以他現在一體試用提高到12次那我現在講的也不是叫次數的問題是如果一個員工他在年初的時候就把五次用完了所以他就不能再用了 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].start |
360.475 |
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364.979 |
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公務及基金預算案關於勞動部主管預算案關於勞動部主管預算案關於勞動部主管預算案關於勞動部主管預算案關於勞動部主管預算案 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].start |
384.775 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].end |
404.93 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].text |
會來找這個願意來找更多的經費,如果經費不夠的話來補上去。 我知道,你感覺這不已經盲目,我就聽了就可以覺得安心,但是我實際在反映一件事情就是說當你知道有這樣的狀況的情況之下,更匡論說如果真的有個員工他卻有在年初就用了5次之後,那反而你後面的機制要怎麼去銜接,怎麼去做處理。 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].start |
405.811 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].end |
411.235 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].text |
我希望員工的協助方案的美意是當員工有狀況的時候我們是可以馬上接觸嗎? |
| transcript.whisperx[17].start |
411.235 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].end |
423.565 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].text |
這個在上次的會議我也特別提到這個提醒我會請我們包括人事單位我們把這部分給考慮進去那如果他還需要更多的時數的使用的話那我們怎麼樣更多的來支持 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].start |
425.026 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].end |
445.611 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].text |
所以這個評估這個要怎樣計算出來的方式我覺得他是要透過一個科學啦然後還是要透過透過一個是不是一個專家的會議大家一起來討論啦齁你跟我講一個月時間是你講的我覺得一個月時間可能還不太夠啦齁你看嘛齁多少員工需要多少的量能服務怎樣的行業比 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].start |
446.391 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].end |
464.886 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].text |
要怎樣,現在當然是討論勞動部啦齁,但勞動部還有相關的所屬的相關的機關,都不一樣的狀況喔。而且員工的那個分配,協助方案的分配額都不一樣,那上次就講過比較贅述。然後要著重,著重哪些員工的有什麼比較特殊性的一個協助的一個方案。 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].start |
465.273 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].end |
466.513 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].text |
公務及基金預算：一、邀請勞動部主管預算：僅 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].start |
491.778 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].end |
519.252 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].text |
是知道說部有在關心所屬單位有在關心他們確實有積極要協助他們我以為你現在講的就意思是說不是用完就算了啦等於是如果使用這個資源之後那後續有沒有其他更多接軌到我們所需要後面更大幫助的機制這部分我們也希望把它給設計進去好不好但是你知道嗎這麼多年來沒有明確的指引跟辦法 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].start |
521.499 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].end |
530.672 |
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完全沒有欸有嗎?你們有訂指引嗎?我們有訂規定我們有訂我們勞動部即所屬機關的相關的規定 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].start |
533.47 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].end |
554.071 |
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是你們勞動部部本部直接有我們是依據行政院行政院他的定班的一個法規規定行政院怎麼會有一般的法規你把行政院法規拿出來看你們怎麼依據那個法規來定如果依據行政院法規來定那就真的很糟糕了人事處處長講的應該是行政院整體EAP的規定 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].start |
555.868 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].end |
583.342 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].text |
我還是覺得這是要經過很嚴密的一個精算嘛對不對所以我才想說部長不要說一個月啦我可以給你兩個月我甚至也可以給你三個月但是把這個事業做好嘛對不對詳細的評估精算嘛把相關的指引辦法定的更明確更清楚嘛來不及要負起這個責任那我們會訂一個我們來訂一個內部的這個操作的指引好不好所以在整預算的時候我會給你凍結部分看你什麼時候訂的出來然後我們就來解凍好 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].start |
584.555 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].end |
594.942 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].text |
這邊我先提醒這件事情因為我對這件事情絕對非常的在意跟care嘛齁那我再請教部長上週啦齁我在質詢的時候特別強調勞動部是回答我各所屬的錢費成大約在180萬 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].start |
597.655 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].end |
618.845 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].text |
統一承包給張老師基金會嗎?目前是這樣。對。好。所以委員工大概是500塊。那明年2、3、5、9啦吼。115年度會再增加。那陳副部長又講了如果N真的不夠還會再找相關預算來支持。是。好。謝謝。但是我還是要用一個實際數據來請教部長。勞動署及所屬的職員加約聘僱 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].start |
622.487 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].end |
633.154 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].text |
共計1805人,所以這1805人他確定能使用一年五次的這個員工協助方案,那勞工署及所屬另外的1941的承攬人員怎麼處理? |
| transcript.whisperx[28].start |
636.553 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].end |
665.325 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].text |
那個跟留言報告上禮拜其實我就請相關同仁來做一個檢討確實有發現其實我們目前設計的範疇只有限於我們正式的人員其實承攬的人員不在裡面但對我當勞動部長來說承攬人員也好或者是運用人員也好其實也都是勞動部非常重要的一份子所以我會希望要讓朝向是涵蓋全體勞動部下面的工作者都可以來做使用 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].start |
667.196 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].end |
691.142 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].text |
對阿那如果你想要就是說部長你剛才這樣打我我覺得我聽起來倒還是很安慰啦齁但是另外一個角度那這樣你的五百塊就不夠了是嘿而且你看這個省超過超過百分之一百的這個預算比例喔所以我很清楚知道我們是應該是很有機會要來找經費來往上增加這個這個EAP的計畫的經費的支持的 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].start |
693.543 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].end |
701.973 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].text |
我再講一個數據啦齁 你看 你看我看看 比如說現在人員有75加月平估是180嘛 總共是255但是同時這個承攬人員就已經高達410人了 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].start |
707.118 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].end |
730.599 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].text |
我們的承攬確實在分屬裡面承攬的人是比正式的人多很多的不只貴部貴署其他單位交通部經濟部等都這個問題非常嚴重所以如果勞動部願意把這個承攬人員都概括承受起來以身作者這是美式衣裝但是也應該要影響到其他的部會一併來做這樣處理不然是往後都是會問題一堆 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].start |
732.987 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].end |
751.258 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].text |
我們願意帶頭來往這個方向做。好,謝謝。所以這個撐懶人員的員工協助方案就是我們用人的單位來處理的啦。應該是勞動部的立場就是這個樣子嘛。是,就是把原本只限於,原本確實只限於正式人員的部分,正式公務員的部分,然後我們希望來把它擴大。 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].start |
752.264 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].end |
763.917 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].text |
好,那我希望是不是這樣啦,往後勞動部要函請各單位嘛,在訂定這個承攬企業的時候也必須要把這個提供員工協助方案列為要件之一,可以嗎? |
| transcript.whisperx[34].start |
765.299 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].end |
773.185 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].text |
當然當然當然當然當然當然當然還沒完成啦我們會努力做啦對我說我現在是把我們的態度宣示出來那我們會努力往這個方向來做但我自己知道不是講完就完不是講完就算完成啦對 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].start |
794.037 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].end |
795.558 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].text |
我,我有講完成嗎? |
| transcript.whisperx[36].start |
795.558 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].end |
802.861 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].text |
你剛剛講完成了。就完成開始要走這個方向了,對不對,帶頭來做這件事情。 是。應該是這麼講嗎? |
| transcript.whisperx[37].start |
802.861 |
| transcript.whisperx[37].end |
817.348 |
| transcript.whisperx[37].text |
是,當然。 而且我還給你時間嘛。 對。 你講一個月嘛,我覺得一個月可能做不起來嘛,對不對。 所以我才想說是不是,這個是承攬的部分啦齁,包含這個怎麼去計算到底要怎麼去做這個員工協助的相關的 |
| transcript.whisperx[38].start |
817.568 |
| transcript.whisperx[38].end |
821.914 |
| transcript.whisperx[38].text |
公務及基金預算案關於公務及基金預算案關於公務及基金預算案關於公務及基金預算案關於公務及基金預算 |
| IVOD_ID |
158061 |
| IVOD_URL |
https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/158061 |
| 日期 |
2024-12-09 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼 |
委員會-11-2-26-13 |
| 會議資料.屆 |
11 |
| 會議資料.會期 |
2 |
| 會議資料.會次 |
13 |
| 會議資料.種類 |
委員會 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼[0] |
26 |
| 會議資料.標題 |
第11屆第2會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第13次全體委員會議 |
| 影片種類 |
Clip |
| 開始時間 |
2024-12-09T14:15:56+08:00 |
| 結束時間 |
2024-12-09T14:29:47+08:00 |
| 支援功能[0] |
ai-transcript |