| video_url |
https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/01ebf86bd8208360b7a6eea21e44788aca1a359a53f99ce194948cb68dbf16ab37e0100f850ec7665ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8 |
| 委員名稱 |
黃健豪 |
| 委員發言時間 |
10:50:32 - 11:02:48 |
| 影片長度 |
736 |
| 會議時間 |
2024-12-04T09:00:00+08:00 |
| 會議名稱 |
立法院第11屆第2會期交通委員會第13次全體委員會議（事由：一、邀請數位發展部部長黃彥男列席報告業務概況及立法計畫，並備質詢。
二、審查114年度中央政府總預算案關於數位發展部單位預算。
【僅進行詢答；委員預算提案於12月20日中午12時前截止收件】） |
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謝謝主席我們先請數位部黃部長黃部長跟任性建設師鄭明宗司長鄭司長 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].start |
19.678 |
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委員好來部長好市長好這個一開始當然還是要關切一下我想我們這新聞上事件看到了這個數位部職場霸凌案的問題我想今天市長來我覺得還是先給肯定市長你願意勇於負責相較於先前這個勞動部那位分組長直接消失不見了我想市長的這個態度還值得肯定那我想先請教一下這個市長你被指控的這些事情是事實呢還是這是你們這個內部的這個職場鬥爭 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].start |
49.005 |
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部長當然是這樣啦 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].start |
74.178 |
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我可以知道你要愛護這個同仁的心情而且但是這個事情是這樣之前包含總統也好院長也好都已經下令說要各單位來清查這個事情那但是的確下令之後很多委員都收到各式各樣的投訴跟各式各樣的爆料那今天這個新聞也上了檯面了 |
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94.429 |
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123.649 |
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拜託在,市長也在,我們希望利用這個機會我也不會關太久,我只想請市長簡單說明這個是事實呢還是說涉及到內部的這個鬥爭因為其實我們去講一個另外面向的確霸凌案發生之後我們也收到很多的檢舉案但是有些並不是事實,有些是內部的這個爭議所以我今天想要請市長有機會可以把話講清楚一下這個你被指控被爆料被投訴的這個東西第一個它是不是事實你認為這樣做那第二個 |
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124.729 |
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這樣做的原因會不會爆料出來有沒有涉及到你們內部的這個爭鬥鬥爭的問題謝謝委員給我這個機會我想這個事情造成整個部裡面整個還有對我們部的形象的傷害深感抱歉那我會甚至檢討然後接受調查因為部裡面已經成立專案調查小組我會接受調查上好市長謝謝市長請回 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].start |
155.597 |
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173.667 |
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市長,我還是要再次強調我們肯定市長至少今天願意出席比起不願意面對這個之前的謝憤組長好太多了所以我想後續不管他的調查結果怎麼樣本期今天還是要肯定說市長願意在這個數位部質詢的時候他願意來出席這個這個隨時被可能被問到的問題好那進到主題 |
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174.946 |
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202.631 |
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政府長我們過去常常很多次已經跟數位部溝通過到底你們第三方支付怎麼管理那之前你們跟我提說你們有這個能量登錄的問題能量登錄之後那如果沒有登錄的業者他跟銀行之間的這個金流銀行端也會去處理但是我們從這個重大的新聞看到之前這個數支付之前也曾經在這個能量登錄的這個清單上面當然先被廢止了我想問一下什麼時候被廢止了 |
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203.893 |
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208.123 |
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報告委員,我們現在正在進行基合的工作,那是不是請署長做個說明? |
| transcript.whisperx[9].start |
210.703 |
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235.911 |
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謝謝委員給我們這個機會說明那我們在事前的話部長已經指示了以後要登錄一定要徵信那在事中的話一定要現地審查不是只有會議審查那事後的話一定要會同國稅局以及調查局去查核這個部分的經濟我們正在推行當中部長跟署長你看之前這個大概有第三次再第四次質詢問這個所謂第三方支付你們到底怎麼管理的問題跟後端金流的問題 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].start |
237.171 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].end |
252.381 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].text |
拜託說如果今天因為這個都是你們曾經放上所謂的能量登錄的審和通過名單的所以可能有業者或民眾不知情他甚至搜尋新聞都是正面新聞搜尋官方文件他也在上面那表示說你們這個能量登錄 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].start |
253.602 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].end |
279.363 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].text |
現在才要再做審核那表示現在放在名單上的公司是不是都可能變成詐騙集團洗錢的工具那你們到底要怎麼辦呢已經講了這麼久了結果現在被媒體爆出來說這個數支付曾經被你們放在這個審核上數支付曾經就在這個能量登錄上審核通過名單在前期版他都在上面但是他卻是詐騙集團洗錢的工具 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].start |
280.806 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].end |
287.238 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].text |
表示能量登錄沒有意義了嘛那你們一直說要去跟銀行端去做這個背書去做審查我想問一下 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].start |
288.414 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].end |
312.021 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].text |
數位部有能力去管銀行嗎那像這樣子而且這是你們通過的這個是你們放在能量登錄的網站上面所以說實在當然依照你們的說法還合法合理的去跟銀行去做交涉銀行也覺得說你是通過數位部認證的還去通過這個國際FIDO聯盟這FIDO聯盟不只這個公司有加入啊你們數位部也有加入啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].start |
315.297 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].end |
340.236 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].text |
所以你們共同等於是在形象上面第一個你們有名單上有這個公司那FDI聯盟裡面數字部也獲他們邀請然後數位部也在這FDI聯盟裡面那變成好像他是個很合法很合理的公司結果他就私底洗錢所以我今天要講的是當然你們要去做徵信這個一定要做的嘛但我今天問題是說之前一直提到一件事情詐騙最嚴重的問題是後續的金流怎麼走那結果今天我在這個名單裡面 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].start |
342.133 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].end |
356.867 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].text |
被放上名單的公司他居然可以去涉及洗錢那是不是還有其他的未報單數位部要怎麼稽查你們跟財政部或是你們跟機管會到底要怎麼合作還是這件事情是各推各的我們現在就是在精進這個整個計劃的機制我再請署長說個說明 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].start |
358.547 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].end |
376.098 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].text |
那三個面向來回復委員的問題第一個是查核我們幾乎已經快全部查核了所以以後這樣出資戶這樣的會機率其實是很低的我們都要限定而且找資安專家跟法律專家去查核這是第一點第二點的話我們跟我們讓檢警調去查詢 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].start |
376.838 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].end |
395.552 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].text |
我們現在有一個快訊的查,市長方似乎那個訊息上的快訊快速的查詢那個可以很快的就全存了這個是第二點第三點數字會claim他他那個那個FIDO那個是錯的我們跟FIDO聯盟的主席已經確認過了那個是比較錯誤的資訊以上他們發假新聞是不是錯誤的對他們發佈假新聞是不是這個意思他其實已經邀請好像已經找他進 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].start |
406.135 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].end |
412.98 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].text |
拜託聯盟主席除了這間公司還有沒有其他台灣現在第三方支付看起來可能有問題的公司在裡面目前我們會再跟他確認不過那時候只有這一家這樣 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].start |
430.717 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].end |
448.433 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].text |
那銀行端有沒有回答我啊?到底銀行端怎麼處理?他們是誰去做徵信?是你們做徵信還是銀行做徵信?還是財政部還是金管會?因為今天還是核心問題嘛。你們一開始跟我保證的。這是這個會期講的事情。說放上去能量登錄的這些第三方支付都是合法。 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].start |
449.312 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].end |
472.934 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].text |
合理的合法的公司但是實際上就沒有實際上就是你們放上去的公司5月5、6月5、6月份還在上面的公司今天9月份爆發這個被檢點查獲他為詐騙集團洗錢那你現在還把它撤掉那我現在問你們就算以現在台北商這幾間公司來講你們到底要怎麼去稽查那到底你們曾經背書過了 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].start |
474.819 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].end |
475.279 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].text |
委員會委員會委員會委員會委員會委員會委員會 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].start |
496.733 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].end |
507.825 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].text |
那12月又被騙上百億一月再騙上百億二月再騙上百億那都是通過這種第三方支付公司去做洗錢的工作那我想問一下數位部的功能你們做這個所謂的能量登錄的功能在哪裡 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].start |
515.373 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].end |
529.786 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].text |
委員回報一下就是銀行當然他也會有自己的集合的程序這個反而他就有一些相關的程序那我們這邊其實是因為資訊來源很大的一部分除了我們徵信以外還有電話局這邊我們跟電話局其實有密切的合作 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].start |
530.467 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].end |
552.143 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].text |
到時候調查局其實為了我們會協同調查局跟國稅局去做集合好那這個你們提書片報告吧因為這個你們講很多次的我之前每次為了你們都跟我講會跟調查局會跟銀行會跟計畫合作但是事實證明就這件事情是無效的那最後一點時間我再問一次齁再問一件事情除了第三方支付公司之外還有一個管道這大家也提醒過很多次就是所謂超商繳費稅務管不到 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].start |
555.008 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].end |
580.705 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].text |
這個數位部超商講會的問題你知道這個國內的這些超商業者他們沒有收到欸還有沒有說沒有收到說這個通知說他們不能跟沒有進行能量能有進行能量登錄的公司合作換句話說沒有進行能量登錄的這些公司他們是在銀行端你們在銀行端這邊有處理的但是這些所謂第三方支付公司他們還是有很多虛擬帳戶有很多虛擬帳戶 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].start |
583.547 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].end |
584.748 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].text |
對,知道,那這已經也有處理,那請你素查說明。 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].start |
601.181 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].end |
619.308 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].text |
各位委員報告就是我們跟經濟部已經聯訪了就是四大超商他們的條代碼都會上到我們虛擬帳號查詢平台檢警掉很快就可以查詢到這個條代碼是屬於哪個跟哪一個第三方職務合作所以很快就可以把這個詐騙的訊息給他去處理這樣子所以這個條代碼這個條代碼跟某個公司對應是確實這樣我知道 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].start |
624.363 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].end |
646.02 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].text |
但是我的問題是說詐騙行為發生的那一刻他是要詐騙行為發生之後檢體掉介入了我才會知道這個錢這個帳戶是被騙的嗎是假的嗎那我說前端呢前端超商我在跟這些第三方支付公司合作的時候我需要怎麼樣認證我需要知道什麼消息我才能夠跟這個第三方支付公司來簽約 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].start |
647.261 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].end |
671.527 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].text |
響鐘響鐘 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].start |
671.943 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].end |
696.563 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].text |
今天要跟某間第三方支付公司合作的時候你們的所謂的能量登錄或是其他的機制能不能跟超商去要求或怎麼樣配合他們去審核還是跟現在一樣就是自由奔放的想跟誰合作就跟誰合作現在就是這樣啊跟委員回報就是我們現在有64家登錄通過的當然超商會找這個64家他們沒有收到通知啊他們說他們沒有收到通知啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].start |
697.436 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].end |
708.227 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].text |
我們會再來跟經濟部這邊再來通知我們上次已經找四大超商那個已經cover台灣大部分的這個這個條代碼的一個代收代付這樣子 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].start |
708.544 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].end |
733.149 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].text |
好 這個也要拜託你們要確實執行因為這個詐騙真的是國人最深惡痛絕也最痛影響人民財產最深的也是稅部最該做的事情啦那這個部分也拜託也要請你們提出報告讓我們委員會瞭解到底你們怎麼樣針對超商、虛擬帳戶跟第三方支付之間的關係怎麼建立這個集合機制可以嗎可以好 謝謝謝謝委員 |
| IVOD_ID |
157774 |
| IVOD_URL |
https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/157774 |
| 日期 |
2024-12-04 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼 |
委員會-11-2-23-13 |
| 會議資料.屆 |
11 |
| 會議資料.會期 |
2 |
| 會議資料.會次 |
13 |
| 會議資料.種類 |
委員會 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼[0] |
23 |
| 會議資料.標題 |
第11屆第2會期交通委員會第13次全體委員會議 |
| 影片種類 |
Clip |
| 開始時間 |
2024-12-04T10:50:32+08:00 |
| 結束時間 |
2024-12-04T11:02:48+08:00 |
| 支援功能[0] |
ai-transcript |