| video_url |
https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/01ebf86bd82083609855ebdbf3998186e45dd5fe0ad21242f169037e582a320606b889c0fce998ee5ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8 |
| 委員名稱 |
邱鎮軍 |
| 委員發言時間 |
10:23:27 - 10:37:27 |
| 影片長度 |
840 |
| 會議時間 |
2024-12-04T09:00:00+08:00 |
| 會議名稱 |
立法院第11屆第2會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第12次全體委員會議（事由：邀請勞動部部長針對「勞動部勞動力發展署北基宜花金馬分署事件及如何完善申訴管道之具體策進作為及期程」進行專題報告，並備質詢。） |
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主席好,我們有請我們的洪部長。部長好,現在還習慣嗎? |
| transcript.whisperx[1].start |
24.652 |
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就像剛才委員說,其實我知道我沒有蜜月期我想請問,部長你11月25號上任10月27號發的這個業務報告時程表上面就說資料在12月3號中午彙整給你所以你一直都知道12月4號以後才會排勞動部的報告是嗎跟邱鎮軍報告當然因為 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].start |
52.455 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].end |
54.947 |
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我們很清楚知道國會的監督是無縫接軌的 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].start |
57.256 |
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85.168 |
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所以當時其實我部內同仁也讓我知道說應該要盡快的來跟我做業務報告的細節那因為上週真的是我們大部分的心力跟時間都花在處理大家非常高度的法令案上面你如果是12月2號排報告的話你要員工12月3號中午給你資料就不合理那你當初在6日要主管跟你匯報的時候就不是因為我們召委排案啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].start |
86.689 |
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是想要立威結果火燒到自己嗎?我完全沒有要立威的意思。我的意思是說你明知道是4號嘛,4號才到勞動部來報告,可是你叫他們要2號,你跟他們講說2號要排報告,3號給你資料嘛。那個邱鎮軍 |
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109.184 |
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123.718 |
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我們原本是希望說第一個因為知道立法院會監督我的意思我知道你很想趕快把事情做好對所以你的做法不要牽扯到我們這個未還委員會的排案的這個這個議程嘛對不對不要把責任推到這邊來 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].start |
124.999 |
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138.178 |
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所以當天禮拜四就像剛剛蘇委員有講其實禮拜四的時候我跟蘇委員確認禮拜一不會來排我到立法院以後我其實有跟蘇委員打電話有跟他致謝所以給我們 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].start |
139.72 |
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158.155 |
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我們召委給你的時間是夠的嘛對不對他也沒有急著在禮拜一就給你排我跟蘇召委有講說也謝謝他給我一個相對比較充裕的時間可以來做相關的準備我覺得部長你還是要注意一下啦就是你上行下效在樹立典範齁把連續上班合理化 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].start |
158.815 |
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173.041 |
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那我就用你自己在11月20號質詢勞動部的話來問你來請教你你要勞動部怎麼去做勞檢這個部分我請你們自己拿捏好那再來我想 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].start |
175.031 |
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191.79 |
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你們你你你今天會發生這種狀況你們的側翼你們的網軍要多溝通一下不要到處放火讓你這個好好做事情可以嗎因為這個事情都是他們先燒出來我們才會才會有這麼多人去注意這件事情 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].start |
193.451 |
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215.233 |
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就是在這個過程的溝通上面我說我是謝謝所有人有給我多一點的時間來去做相關的準備的那卓榮泰院長給你的第一個任務是重新調查謝毅榮的案子吧對那卓院長說給你一周調查那在11月20號我們就要求勞動部針對謝毅榮的案子兩周內要給出新的調查報告 |
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216.474 |
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224.414 |
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可是就在期限到昨天嘛可是你昨天給我們委員的這份報告裡面就是調查報告還沒完成無可奉告 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].start |
226.38 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].end |
248.042 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].text |
如果你是還是立委的時候你覺得你這樣你可以接受嗎跟邱委員報告齁在重啟調查的方面其實我們上週我在我一上任之後其實就我們就在處理重啟這個調查小組的準備工作尤其是我們也檢討上一份報告為什麼引起社會高度的爭議 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].start |
249.063 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].end |
278.323 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].text |
那這個禮拜目前目前到甚至到現在目前從調查報告也正在訪談也增加訪談的對象那我們希望能夠把它做得更周延所以目前會是在下週所以你是覺得卓院長給你時間太短了是這樣嗎我們有一直持續有跟行政院溝通所以這個時間點行政院也知道目前也同意的那北分署的事件不單只是霸凌那還有我們就業安定基金的挪用謝宜榮送禮請客的這個錢那我們政風查得怎麼樣 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].start |
279.184 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].end |
279.464 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].text |
跟邱鎮軍說明 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].start |
286.226 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].end |
312.279 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].text |
目前是針對經費的使用包括採購跟標案的問題現在檢調因為報告裡面都沒說啊現在這個檢調是有在已經在開始在查那我們會全力的配合所以所以不是說謝宜龍手上還有黑資料要報讓你們不敢查當然不是我們沒有我們完全你的沒有什麼好我不知道謝宜龍會說什麼不能查也不能辦會不會這樣子 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].start |
314.366 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].end |
335.118 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].text |
我們當然完全不會考慮現在謝榮芬署長現在對外講的這些話那這個禮拜五可以給嗎?這個報告這禮拜五可以給嗎?下禮拜我們會把重啟調查報告應該會在下禮拜公布出來禮拜幾?跟大家說明我希望盡快可是因為現在我們正在我們正在訪談中部長你在節目上說未完委員會就 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].start |
343.763 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].end |
369.881 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].text |
聽說北分署的鬼故事很多你還很委屈跟大家說你不是吃案你是因為沒有行政權只能建議去了解我只能說民進黨的不分區真的很好當也枉費你當了立法委員這部分你沒有繼續追下去真的是非常遺憾才會造成今天這樣的一個事情那麼現在你是部長了你之前說你收到很多基層跟你反映 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].start |
371.562 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].end |
395.22 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].text |
這個勞發署北分署有打假卡的問題現在怎麼解決這部分分兩個部分第一個事情是確實在我們勞動部下會有一些比較是越僱人員他是適用勞基法的我們會要求絕對按照勞基法不能夠違法加班上面該怎麼記就怎麼記第二個是針對公務人員的正式公務人員的部分確實還有一個加班上限我也已經要求我們相關的主管 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].start |
396.664 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].end |
397.765 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].text |
那你說勞動部高層也很多像謝宜龍這樣的問題那你都知道 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].start |
415.373 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].end |
420.657 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].text |
哪些人有這種狀況?勞動部高層有很多像謝宜龍這樣的一個問題那你都知道是誰?誰有這種狀況?我之前看網路上講的嘛還是查到哪裡就可以說到哪裡? |
| transcript.whisperx[21].start |
434.987 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].end |
463.269 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].text |
我應該沒有說勞動部的高層也很多像憲勇這樣問題但是我要說的是只要有涉及到不法或涉及到問題的我們絕對都會面對問題好那再來我們陳世昌代理署長說外界說陳義隆辦公室花的145萬元那其實只用了救安基金的39000元那我在這邊講的是不管用了多少救安基金是可以這樣用的嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].start |
464.246 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].end |
491.278 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].text |
跟邱鎮軍報告我這邊其實也謝謝你有一個時間讓我說明目前現在當然在外界所謂說的145萬其實在144.6萬這部分的這個綠美化新創本部的這個綠美化工作確實我們經過確認以後他不包括謝永芬署長的自己的辦公室他比較主要是一些公共空間的綠美化但是我要說的是就我們查上去現在大家所謂爭議的那些軌道燈 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].start |
492.498 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].end |
517.312 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].text |
這些軌道燈的確是用小額採購的方式是用勞發基金、就案基金來支付的我認為這是非常非常不妥當的、不能接受的事情這不是金額大小的問題你們都用小額採購那是不是為了規避上網招標的這個金額然後這樣比較好給你們的可以比較容易照顧到你們自己的人 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].start |
518.393 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].end |
526.749 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].text |
謝芬署長他在他辦公室裡面裝了軌道燈為了去照他的職務這件事情我是很不能接受的 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].start |
527.984 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].end |
554.722 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].text |
用小額採購不管是三萬塊還是三十萬目前查起來大概三萬九千塊看起來金額好像不大但也用到了救安基金的錢這也是我們不能接受的所以我希望部長你既然你今天在這邊這樣講希望你能夠把這件事情做一個很好的一個處理當然該送檢調該送證封你都不要手懶檢調現在已經在相關的查查了我們絕對全力配合 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].start |
555.262 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].end |
560.127 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].text |
那我在想就是就案基金餘額大概429億那勞動部辦過這個演唱會花了356萬裝修會議室2250萬修外牆2699萬買咖啡豆22.8萬清垃圾308萬蓋警衛室758萬都可以這樣用嗎? |
| transcript.whisperx[27].start |
579.621 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].end |
600.81 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].text |
還有楊網軍也花了253萬跟委員說明我其實上週其實就有要求救安基金致用的檢討了我們確實發現裡面有部分的項目是不合宜的這媒體隨便查一下就80萬會讓社會觀感不好的但是也並不是所有現在媒體上面列出來所有的項目都是有問題我想也讓我也知道但是確實裡面是有部分的項目 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].start |
601.87 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].end |
605.131 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].text |
你現在開始查了嗎?從哪裡開始查?從許民村部長還是在之前?我們沒有分從什麼地方,只要有問題我們就查。那什麼時候會有結果? |
| transcript.whisperx[29].start |
619.162 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].end |
638.032 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].text |
現在我們的做法會是當然個案如果不合一的項目我們希望能夠做個案的停損就機制面我們必須把機制面給強化所以現在也邀集一些這方面的專家的外部專家的委員我們要把機制如果還有疏漏的地方這個把關機制有疏漏的地方要補上 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].start |
639.153 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].end |
668.175 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].text |
因為我們現在正在做這件事情大家都覺得是金庫其他部會都想要挖來挖你們這邊的錢當初林佳龍部長當交通部長的時候他就有提到就業安就業安基金要撥3億3億來提升旅行業者的數位能力那你們現在只要我知道你們現在要找第三方外部的專家來檢討強化就業安基就業安定這個基金的用途把關機制對嘛那你們的外部專家 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].start |
669.476 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].end |
679.202 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].text |
我覺得在霸凌這個霸凌案的時候用利益良善來形容謝宜龍你現在要找的第三方會不會變成到時候變成利益良善圖利共犯 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].start |
682.522 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].end |
706.961 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].text |
外部專家當然都會有他的專業所謂的外部是在編制以外嘛對不對對那但是還是你們的人啊對不對我希望部長你這個部分啊你一定要客觀一點把這事情做好希望能夠避免這樣的事情發生可以嗎因為你只要客觀還要專業就會碰到局系的人那賴慶哲有給你總統有給你上房保鮮嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].start |
709.794 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].end |
728.533 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].text |
有嗎?我想從行政院當時邀請我到我知道現在社會大眾對我上任的期待都是要改革這段時間包括有很多基層的員工反映給我們的資訊也是希望我改革所以改革是不可能不走的路 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].start |
729.913 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].end |
749.18 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].text |
這跟誰交代我沒有關係因為時間的問題我最後再問你就是說你在2023年10月1號就說你會支持消防員組工會也會支持有罷工權那現在你是勞動部長你什麼時候要修法剛剛其實有跟其他委員報告過其實關於這個公務員組工會的議題 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].start |
753.444 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].end |
759.193 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].text |
的確現在主要的法規權者看法規權看起來是在勞權團體也恢復齊天的架那當時你也說你會轉達我想這些問題都是你之前講過的話我希望 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].start |
768.948 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].end |
796.699 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].text |
你能夠記得你之前講過的話然後好好的來處理剛剛你講說要時間你是已經講說要時間但我不認為兩個月三個月但是我希望你盡快至少也不能拖到半年因為你是部長你有權力我覺得你應該要好好的把你說過的話把它落實確實我現在是勞動部長所以關於公務員組公會的議題裡面比方說比較沒有爭議的 |
| transcript.whisperx[37].start |
798.444 |
| transcript.whisperx[37].end |
818.734 |
| transcript.whisperx[37].text |
接受權跟協商權這部分這比較沒有爭議的部分比較有共識的部分但我們怎麼權利來跟考試院一起來協助來給大家保障但就像我在這份在這個在這個訪問裡面其實就講到確實現在罷工權的部分社會上面是比較高度爭議的 |
| transcript.whisperx[38].start |
820.547 |
| transcript.whisperx[38].end |
836.997 |
| transcript.whisperx[38].text |
那我希望你部長你趕快把這事情釐清該處理的問題當然要探討的問題會發生的狀況也會有很多希望你把它想清楚把它做好來不要到時候倉促的我也不希望你們倉促推這種法案出來但我希望你們做得完善一點好不好謝謝好謝謝邱委員謝謝部長 |
| IVOD_ID |
157762 |
| IVOD_URL |
https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/157762 |
| 日期 |
2024-12-04 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼 |
委員會-11-2-26-12 |
| 會議資料.屆 |
11 |
| 會議資料.會期 |
2 |
| 會議資料.會次 |
12 |
| 會議資料.種類 |
委員會 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼[0] |
26 |
| 會議資料.標題 |
第11屆第2會期社會福利及衛生環境委員會第12次全體委員會議 |
| 影片種類 |
Clip |
| 開始時間 |
2024-12-04T10:23:27+08:00 |
| 結束時間 |
2024-12-04T10:37:27+08:00 |
| 支援功能[0] |
ai-transcript |