| IVOD_ID |
157735 |
| IVOD_URL |
https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/157735 |
| 日期 |
2024-12-03 |
| 影片種類 |
Clip |
| 開始時間 |
2024-12-03T15:47:58+08:00 |
| 結束時間 |
2024-12-03T16:08:34+08:00 |
| 影片長度 |
00:20:36 |
| 支援功能[0] |
ai-transcript |
| video_url |
https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/28156fb6ec38ead31c00748154af1c1c13383a67259e81584a235b3e6ccfe5f4f2c2abc92875f3cc5ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8 |
| 委員名稱 |
林月琴 |
| 委員發言時間 |
15:47:58 - 16:08:34 |
| 會議時間 |
2024-12-03T09:00:00+08:00 |
| 會議名稱 |
第11屆第2會期第1次全院委員會（事由：總統咨，為考試院第十三屆院長、副院長及考試委員任期於113年8月31日屆滿，茲依據憲法增修條文第6條第2項規定，提名周弘憲為考試院第十四屆院長，許舒翔為考試院第十四屆副院長，邱文彥、鄧家基、王秀紅、呂秋慧、柯麗鈴、黃東益、伊萬．納威Iwan Nawi 7位為考試院第十四屆考試委員，咨請同意案。） |
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麻煩我們的柯麗鈴被提名來麻煩請柯院長請備選謝謝院長委員好柯檢察官你好目前現職身兼最高檢察署的檢察官以及代理司法官學院的院長 |
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那我剛看見你的報告你過去也在富有保護跟人口販運領域裡邊有非常多的參與那如果你成功出任考試委員將會是司法體系第一個轉任為考試院的第一人那外界當然對你有非常高的期待那所以想請問就是說從司法體系轉任到考試院如果你的優勢是什麼國家為什麼要把這個職務交托給你 |
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| transcript.whisperx[2].end |
87.085 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].text |
我想重複我剛才報告的就是我這幾年是在就是在從事有關司法官的培訓所以對於訓練中所遭遇到的看到的一些問題還有這個就是應該有一些經驗可以分享 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].start |
89.206 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].end |
111.253 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].text |
我覺得我們法律人的訓練就是我未必什麼樣都會精通可是我們的強項是我們很可以分析事實所以如果有一個制度我在評估各種資料之後我們在歸納分析上會比較強 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].start |
112.711 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].end |
132.522 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].text |
那我想由於法律人的訓練那加上我自己過去在公務體系服務那麼久的經驗大概不管是當檢察官或者是檢察行政或者單純的行政事務或者檢察首長我想這些累積的經驗大概對於我 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].start |
133.422 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].end |
153.013 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].text |
我希望將來在考試院所要面臨的﹐包括考選﹐或者是公務人員的文官制度﹐或是保障等等﹐我想﹐我也希望能夠奉獻一點心力所以就這樣續問﹐那如果陳主任剛剛講的﹐你有這樣子的一個擔任的優勢﹐那對於你 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].start |
156.38 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].end |
185.851 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].text |
考試院的這個委員的職務你應該有事先的規劃那你上任之後有哪些工作是你認為在你任內要達成的目標我當然第一個部裡頭希望我奉獻的就是這個我剛剛有報告的法律專業人員資格任用條例在規劃上可不可以在 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].start |
186.601 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].end |
187.101 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].text |
主席主席主席 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].start |
209.534 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].end |
230.837 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].text |
所以我希望我的文官的背景可以在這方面能夠發揮一點就是作用那另外考選的部分雖然我之前所關切的是比較重在司法官的考選不過在瞭解的過程當中也確實發覺到在考選的方式 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].start |
231.657 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].end |
248.007 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].text |
其實還有很多我們可以參考的因此在考選的業務方面我也希望能夠用我所累積的經驗來提供跟考試院的同仁一起來研究 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].start |
249.656 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].end |
267.013 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].text |
我也希望說未來在你的努力底下我們的考試院有另外一番風貌那在今年5月31號的時候那總統提名第十四屆的考試院院長跟副院長跟考試委員可是一直到6月24號才排入院會其中又經過了幾 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].start |
268.775 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].end |
296.888 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].text |
好幾次的協商直到11月26號本院才正式進入到審查這延拓了很久那也因為這樣的一個延拓當然就有很多人會有點擔心尤其事實上是身心障礙者他們非常關心明年初的身心障礙人員特考是否能夠如期舉行也想問我們的科檢察官甚至就是我們的科備提名人 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].start |
297.526 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].end |
305.898 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].text |
你能否確保身心障礙者的特考如果你進入到考試院如期能夠確保他們如期報名然後如期舉行 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].start |
308.193 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].end |
333.366 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].text |
報告委員就我了解就是在考試院在上一屆的委員屆期之後考試院有一個機動的機制這是如同大家在報紙上有看到的他們有做了一些緊急的處理確保一些比較近期的 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].start |
337.849 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].end |
357.487 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].text |
我必須跟委員報告這個我沒有確定是不是在他們所已經安排好的範圍之內那當然如果我有機會過去的話我想我一定會關切這個問題因為我們很希望對身心障礙者的權益他們要去特考也是他們的權益之一 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].start |
360.123 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].end |
365.211 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].text |
除了身心障礙者特考之外其他將在明年初舉辦的考試都應該如期舉辦那你願意擔當嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].start |
370.453 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].end |
397.588 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].text |
我想我會盡力當然就很期待能夠看到另外一個就是我很關心的一個課題想來跟我們的被提名人討論一下就是社工師的考試改革的相關問題的確你是來自司法體系我想考試的問題大概都一致目前社工師的考取率過低現況只有20%可是實際上其實上是更少的僅有13.64% |
| transcript.whisperx[17].start |
399.529 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].end |
425.852 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].text |
不管是社安網或是民間團體都非常需要這樣的一個專業人員來挹注才可以解決我們的社會問題可是社工私人率需求低推估需要24%那民間團體期待可以到達32%我們的社會問題隨著少子化高齡化問題非常的多可是跟現狀現在我們期待是32%可是實際上只有13.64%所以跟現狀還有一大段的差距 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].start |
426.352 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].end |
452.111 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].text |
入曲率太低也是社工師缺工的原因之一所以除此之外社工師對於我們的應考提行跟配分方式跟應考資格的部分也都持續都有檢討的呼聲希望能夠改革可是在此之前社工師是一直持續跟衛福部協商的但根本的問題不是跟衛福部協商應該法律的主管機關 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].start |
453.18 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].end |
469.333 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].text |
事實上是考試院所以想問被提名人社工師從培訓考取率還有考試內容跟應考資格的爭議都已經在民間討論非常多年了我不知道你是否知情還有你對這樣子有什麼看法 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].start |
472.501 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].end |
491.126 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].text |
對於社工師我自己因為我以前在從事婦幼的這個領域其實跟他們常常有接觸了那知道說他們的工作非常辛苦非常真的人力很缺有時候看他們工作的狀況真的很替他們不捨 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].start |
492.606 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].end |
513.034 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].text |
那在考試部分考試院這邊當然是負責這個就是負責整個考試的規劃那為什麼集合率會太低我想很可能會涉及的就是我找的點字委員他們的出題方向 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].start |
516.455 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].end |
532.664 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].text |
出的題目是不是真的符合用人機關的需求以及實務界的需求有沒有考慮到社工師在培訓端就是在教育端之前他們所受的教育有沒有辦法銜接 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].start |
534.11 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].end |
546.583 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].text |
那我想如果有機會將來有機會到考試院服務的話我想對我所關切的社工事朋友們的這一塊我想我會謝謝委員的提醒我會努力去 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].start |
547.219 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].end |
569.651 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].text |
了解一下他的原因到底是什麼謝謝喔 聽到還蠻放心的因為的確要從前端再能走到後端可是現在需要的人力又非常的多因為我們的就是說隨著少子化高齡化社會的很多問題要解決必須要社公司來協力所以進一步想問你說你上任後願不願意來推動檢討社公司考試制度 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].start |
571.343 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].end |
585.956 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].text |
我覺得所有的制度都是可以被檢討的那只要委員有提出來這些問題我想我都很樂於就是將來有機會的話跟大家一起來瞭解我很期待為什麼因為我怕考試院不知情 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].start |
586.917 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].end |
610.472 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].text |
本席的辦公室還先前把社公司跟衛福部協商後的結論發函給考試院但不知道考試院是怎麼樣已讀不回還是根本就沒有讀至今到現在都沒有任何回覆所以本席這邊也希望說我們的被提名人能夠承諾若上任後應該儘速瞭解這些癥結點到底是什麼而且給予我們回應 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].start |
612.438 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].end |
630.197 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].text |
我們社公司都在協助社會去解決社會問題然後讓社會可以更進步可是始終考試院這邊好像對我們社公司的權益、考試制度都比較沒這麼積極的去做回應不知道您這邊是不是可以去做這樣的一個承諾 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].start |
631.344 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].end |
653.178 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].text |
是的﹐如同我剛才報告委員﹐我對社會﹐社工是朋友的﹐他們這一塊的﹐狀況也非常關切了﹐那委員所反映的問題﹐我想﹐我個人的行事風格﹐我一向是重﹐溝通﹐所以﹐不管在哪個崗�位上﹐我就認為﹐溝通非常重要﹐那溝通包括﹐跨單位﹐跨機關﹐ |
| transcript.whisperx[29].start |
654.799 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].end |
680.335 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].text |
所以我想如果我有機會到考試院服務的話我願意跟我們的同仁跟相關的機關一起來瞭解看問題到底是出在哪裡可以怎麼樣解決也希望這樣因為一直以來民間團體很難跟考試院對話在這個民主的社會裡面考試院應該要去傾聽民意所以本席要求考試院要開設一個跟民間團體直接對話的管道所以你願意承擔這樣的一個任務嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].start |
681.542 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].end |
682.703 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].text |
11月4日發生勞動部公務人員親身的憾事引發外界高度關注 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].start |
703.542 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].end |
719.868 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].text |
所有人都在質疑勞動部身為勞工的最高主管機關為什麼發生內部公務人員疑似因受虐過勞而輕生的案件令人憤怒也並對同仁感到惋惜所以本席認為這次事件並非特定的機關個案而是整體公務體系內的 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].start |
723.889 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].end |
747.868 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].text |
指向文化的問題公務人員跟國家間本來就存在一個比較特別的權力關係所以公務人員以服從作為忠誠義務的展現可是一旦受到不法事件侵害的時候這勢必讓公務人員因為不敢申訴任事情持續所以我不知道我們的備提名人有沒有針對這樣子案子這個案子你有沒有在關注有 是 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].start |
748.533 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].end |
767.194 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].text |
那我想再進一步問你對於如何去調和公務人員的忠誠義務跟公務人員救濟的問題因為身為法律人你的見解如何我想如果是就霸凌這件來講公務人員當然是要忠誠可是我覺得最重要的是 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].start |
768.482 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].end |
789.178 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].text |
你當一個主管的人你不能這樣就是說你在教育你的你在教導你的同仁的時候你應該是好好的照顧你的員工讓員工可以上班每天都愉悅的上班讓他有很好的心情可以充分的把他能力發揮出來 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].start |
791.019 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].end |
814.753 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].text |
那我自己在檢察官生涯裡面其實我覺得蠻幸運的我碰到了我們檢察的首長其實真的他們都是非常客氣很少看到他們發脾氣那所以我自己當了首長之後我也是期待自己不要成為同仁的壓力源 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].start |
816.207 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].end |
836.525 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].text |
所以我一直也跟我自己的主管勉勵就是把同仁照顧好應該是我們的責任所以我覺得在職場霸凌這一塊我們最近都在講怎麼樣去救濟那我其實想的除了救濟之外怎麼樣防免一先 |
| transcript.whisperx[37].start |
837.762 |
| transcript.whisperx[37].end |
848.147 |
| transcript.whisperx[37].text |
我想說以我在檢察體系看到的我們的長官在挑主管大概尤其像挑檢察長那個大概都有經過慎選也經過打聽經過這個各界的推選 |
| transcript.whisperx[38].start |
854.307 |
| transcript.whisperx[38].end |
872.617 |
| transcript.whisperx[38].text |
所以在推選上為什麼會去用到一個可能他EQ不是很高的是選的時候出問題呢還是本來很好可是他在職場上面臨壓力之後他的情緒管控沒辦法做好 |
| transcript.whisperx[39].start |
873.377 |
| transcript.whisperx[39].end |
896.345 |
| transcript.whisperx[39].text |
所以我覺得我們不管是當上司或是當同仁我想我們對於情緒的管控、壓力的調適我想這應該是訓練裡面我們的培訓不管是在職訓練、職前訓練包括我們考試院將來我知道說 |
| transcript.whisperx[40].start |
897.245 |
| transcript.whisperx[40].end |
920.406 |
| transcript.whisperx[40].text |
我去了之後我知道說他們還有一個升官等的訓練我想在訓練的時候這些應該都是重點專業科目當然重要可是像這種很扎實很基本牽扯到一個人格的這些也是很需要被關注的所以這些怎麼樣避免會產生霸凌的我想也是我們必須要去關注的謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[41].start |
923.1 |
| transcript.whisperx[41].end |
940.744 |
| transcript.whisperx[41].text |
不過本期以為這樣的不幸事件 延伸出人力跟勞動條件跟申訴救濟當然我也贊成你剛剛講的說不是走到最後那個所謂只有申訴救濟而已那可是公務人員的業務量非常的大那職務呢背在承辦人員身上所以我們知道 |
| transcript.whisperx[42].start |
941.264 |
| transcript.whisperx[42].end |
956.068 |
| transcript.whisperx[42].text |
公務人員服務法裡邊對於勞動條件有明確的規範可是實際上申請加班就算長官不准你還是要把工作做完所以有很多加班的黑數另外經核准的加班應該要給付的加班費可是礙於預算 |
| transcript.whisperx[43].start |
956.608 |
| transcript.whisperx[43].end |
958.929 |
| transcript.whisperx[43].text |
王秀紅、王秀紅、王秀紅、王秀紅、王秀紅、王秀紅、王秀紅 |
| transcript.whisperx[44].start |
976.693 |
| transcript.whisperx[44].end |
994.665 |
| transcript.whisperx[44].text |
其實在我們檢察署這個其實也是一個大問題大家都知道我們檢察官當檢察官的其實加班是很正常的事情可是你頂多讓他領有固定時數的加班費其他大概只能補休 |
| transcript.whisperx[45].start |
996.286 |
| transcript.whisperx[45].end |
1004.012 |
| transcript.whisperx[45].text |
你就是這麼忙哪有空補修所以我覺得當然就是這些加班的規定 |
| transcript.whisperx[46].start |
1004.943 |
| transcript.whisperx[46].end |
1029.202 |
| transcript.whisperx[46].text |
可以再檢討了那另外一個就是說為什麼會有這麼多的工作讓公務員加班加不完要來做那這也是像我們司法體系法官檢察官都在抱怨說為什麼有這麼多的案件那我想很普遍性的現在在很多公務機關都面臨到業務量太重的問題那這個問題 |
| transcript.whisperx[47].start |
1032.779 |
| transcript.whisperx[47].end |
1053.367 |
| transcript.whisperx[47].text |
如果不能根本解決我覺得再給他再多的加班的福利我覺得其實對公務員也是不見得是很好的保障因為我想對大部分的公務員來講他寧可多休息而不要領這些加班會或是什麼加班補休之類的是 所以我也想 |
| transcript.whisperx[48].start |
1055.454 |
| transcript.whisperx[48].end |
1070.065 |
| transcript.whisperx[48].text |
本席要求考試院要主動去審視公務人員服務法落實的問題所以也期待這個責任由你來承擔你願意承擔嗎當然 如果有機會過去一定盡力去做 |
| transcript.whisperx[49].start |
1076.566 |
| transcript.whisperx[49].end |
1096.076 |
| transcript.whisperx[49].text |
本席認為職場霸凌就是犯罪不管有足夠的證據去控訴霸凌者可是他就是觸犯刑法的犯罪行為所以在法律保障底下被害人具有主張侵權行為損害賠償的權利以外僱主也要負擔起安全義務跟連帶賠償責任 |
| transcript.whisperx[50].start |
1098.513 |
| transcript.whisperx[50].end |
1123.323 |
| transcript.whisperx[50].text |
公務機關也要去做負擔您對於這個見解你有什麼樣的見解我想這個責任就是應該是依照目前的法律的規定來論斷所以我想法律上目前有什麼樣的這個規定我想法院如果在射送的時候法院應該都會去試用 |
| transcript.whisperx[51].start |
1127.079 |
| transcript.whisperx[51].end |
1130.722 |
| transcript.whisperx[51].text |
公務公家機關的內部申訴機制失靈時會變成基層員工申訴無門 |
| transcript.whisperx[52].start |
1140.169 |
| transcript.whisperx[52].end |
1160.692 |
| transcript.whisperx[52].text |
認為是不是應該能夠委託法律輔助基金會也好律師公會也好或民間司改會來成立外部的申訴窗口並且要求允許申訴者在申訴程序當中進行透過這些外部管道指派的律師來擔任輔助人對此你有什麼看法 |
| transcript.whisperx[53].start |
1162.192 |
| transcript.whisperx[53].end |
1181.66 |
| transcript.whisperx[53].text |
我想這個都是可以討論的啦做一個法律人我們是當然期待說所有的申訴都被有效處理那至於到底是外部好還是內部好我覺得各有優缺點我們可以再討論那外部當然大家會覺得比較公正 |
| transcript.whisperx[54].start |
1183.021 |
| transcript.whisperx[54].end |
1201.521 |
| transcript.whisperx[54].text |
內部的好處是我在調查的時候比較有效因為是我內部所以當有一方需要保護的時候我比較可以去發動這些保護措施外部的機構他要進來調查不見得是那麼容易 |
| transcript.whisperx[55].start |
1202.438 |
| transcript.whisperx[55].end |
1230.092 |
| transcript.whisperx[55].text |
那可是就是說可能一般會覺得說我就是內部深宿無門嘛那這樣我們是不是可以再設計一些機制其實我想我們現在其實很多像說首長信箱部長也有部長信箱所以我覺得是可以再討論對所以最後大概請你是不是也願意擔任這個修法的一個責任是因為之前我們的院長候選人也有承諾說他願意來討論我想 |
| transcript.whisperx[56].start |
1235.644 |
| transcript.whisperx[56].end |
1235.748 |
| transcript.whisperx[56].text |
謝謝林院長 |