| IVOD_ID |
15771 |
| IVOD_URL |
https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Full/1M/15771 |
| 日期 |
2024-03-28 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼 |
委員會-11-1-36-10 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼:str |
第11屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第10次全體委員會議 |
| 會議資料.屆 |
11 |
| 會議資料.會期 |
1 |
| 會議資料.會次 |
10 |
| 會議資料.種類 |
委員會 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼[0] |
36 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼:str[0] |
司法及法制委員會 |
| 會議資料.標題 |
第11屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第10次全體委員會議 |
| 影片種類 |
Full |
| 開始時間 |
2024-03-28T08:30:31+08:00 |
| 結束時間 |
2024-03-28T13:04:00+08:00 |
| 影片長度 |
04:33:29 |
| 支援功能[0] |
ai-transcript |
| video_url |
https://h264media01.ly.gov.tw:443/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1M/8d241381c4f8c7fca91999d46b611e449e2506b9d78cd73c3be8d109af184be4fde045edf55b257f5ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8 |
| 會議時間 |
2024-03-28T09:00:00+08:00 |
| 會議名稱 |
立法院第11屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第10次全體委員會議（事由：一、邀請司法院、法務部、教育部、衛生福利部、內政部警政署就「青少年法治教育與犯罪防制成效」進行專題報告，並備質詢。
二、審查及處理113年度中央政府總預算關於法務部及所屬主管預算凍結項目共6案。
【其中各案如經院會復議，則不予審查、處理】） |
| 委員名稱 |
完整會議 |
| 委員發言時間 |
08:30:31 - 13:04:00 |
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報告委員會出席委員9人以足法定人數請主席宣布開會現在開會進行報告事項宣讀上次會議議事錄立法院第11屆第1會期司法及法制委員會第9次全體委員會議議事錄實驗中華民國113年3月27日星期三上午9時至12時7分立聯本院紅樓302會議室出席委員黃文國昌等13人列席委員葛委員盧君等9人 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].start |
1798.306 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].end |
1815.596 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].text |
列席官員、行政院人事行政總處人事長、蘇俊榮等人、主席、中、召集委員嘉賓。報告事項一、宣讀上次會議事錄決定確定。二、邀請行政院人事行政總處人事長及行政院相關機關含事業單位列席就政府機關推動人事服務數位轉型進行專題報告．並備質詢。決定報告及詢答完畢。 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].start |
1819.338 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].end |
1841.53 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].text |
第三案至第八案行政人事行政總署函為113年度中央政府總預算決議檢送決議113-51-53-54級公務人力發展學院決議一預算凍結順便報告請查詔案等6案。決定第三案至第八案均准予被查提報院會討論事項行政人事行政總署函為113年度中央政府總預算決議檢送決議52預算凍結順便報告請查詔案本次為委員黃國昌等13人提出質詢決議一報告及詢答完畢二本案准予動之提報院會 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].start |
1848.294 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].end |
1873.82 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].text |
三委員質詢時要求提供相關資料或以順便答覆者請相關機關請速送到個別委員及本會。宣讀完畢。請問各位,上次會議議事錄有無錯誤或遺漏?沒有?好,那我們議事錄確定。接著介紹到場委員及應邀列席官員首先介紹在場委員我們黃總召國參委員以及省委員發會 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].start |
1876.357 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].end |
1900.411 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].text |
謝謝。還有謝委員、龍志、龍介。接著介紹應邀列席官員。我就要依照順序。法務部蔡金祥部長檢察司郭勇發司長保護司林哲慧督導參事 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].start |
1904.774 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].end |
1929.885 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].text |
綜合規劃司王文德司長、會計處郭怡芳處長、最高檢察署邢太昭檢察總長、法務部廉政署莊榮松署長、矯正署周輝煌署長、司法院少年及家事廳謝金惠廳長、 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].start |
1932.574 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].end |
1957.619 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].text |
教育部學生事務及特殊教育司吳林輝司長﹖歡迎您﹖以及國民及學前教育署學務校安主葉信春組長﹖歡迎您﹖衛生福利部保護服務司林春彥檢認視察﹖歡迎您﹖內政部警政署刑事警察局周祐偉局長﹖歡迎您﹖ |
| transcript.whisperx[7].start |
1959.898 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].end |
1986.125 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].text |
行政院主計總處、公務預算處、理培園檢任視察。歡迎您。好,那本次議程除邀請司法院、法務部、教育部、衛生福利部、內政部警政署就青少年法治教育與犯罪防制成效進行專題報告．並備質詢外另有報告事項一案及討論事項五案 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].start |
1988.206 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].end |
2006.545 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].text |
之113年度法務部主管預算解凍案。那麼會議進行程序我們邀請機關代表就專題報告及預算解凍案一併報告。詢答時則採綜合詢答。詢答完畢後再照議程報告事項及討論事項依序進行處理。 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].start |
2008.271 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].end |
2016.236 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].text |
好那現在進行報告那麼今天報告當然比較多有請法務部蔡部長報告請就專題報告及預算解凍案引並報告發言時間6分鐘 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].start |
2030.138 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].end |
2050.449 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].text |
主席、各位委員、各位先進今天奉邀列席貴委員會就青少年法治教育與犯罪防治成效代表本部列席報告並被質詢進行指教司法院為落實兒童權利公約那在112年間提出少年事件處理法的修正草案 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].start |
2051.109 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].end |
2078.736 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].text |
本部也積極地派員與會並提供法治意見共同維護青少年健全發展並確保社會大眾生活安全有關刑事犯罪偵查部分少年處罰行為是由少年法院行使先議權不管是司法警察或是檢察官於偵辦案件過程中發現少年有處罰行為時應就少年處罰行為部分已由少年法院先行處理 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].start |
2079.756 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].end |
2092.835 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].text |
少年法院就《少年處罰事件》依調查或審理的結果認為有《少年事件處理法》27條第一項第二項鎖定情形才會將案件移送給該管檢察署的檢察官 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].start |
2094.306 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].end |
2121.441 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].text |
檢察官才開始進行偵查。檢察官對於少年刑事案件的偵辦．除積極偵辦查明事證外．另因兒少涉事未深．亦淪為成年人或集團的犯罪工具．為遏止利用兒少犯罪徹底查緝共犯或犯罪集團．針對少年刑事事件的偵辦．本部分別從法規面、查緝面跟組織面加以精進。 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].start |
2122.481 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].end |
2146.597 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].text |
法規面依兒童及少年福利及權益保障法成年人教唆幫助或利用兒少犯罪或與兒少共同實施犯罪或故意對兒少犯罪者是加重其刑二分之一另外組織犯罪防治條例還有人口販運防治法毒品危害防治條例等都是對於兒少 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].start |
2148.539 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].end |
2170.739 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].text |
能夠而少的利用而少或與而少共犯罪都有加重期刑的規定。至於查緝面．檢察官如知有成年人教說幫助利用而少犯罪或與而少共同實施犯罪或故意對而少犯罪的都指揮司法警察機關本部調查局人員依法進行偵查作為。 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].start |
2173.623 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].end |
2202.057 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].text |
從組織面最高檢察署及各地檢署對於侵入校園吸收利用在學學生實施犯罪等列為指標性犯罪組織案件那高檢署也會督導各地檢積極地偵辦相關的案件向上溯源追查例如少年藥頭的查緝那積極地防堵毒品入侵校園也會督導各地檢加強收證黑道幫派份子 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].start |
2202.617 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].end |
2210.519 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].text |
以威脅利誘、欺騙等手段利用兒少從事販賣運送持有轉讓毒品、違禁物品等不法行為。 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].start |
2212.506 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].end |
2232.457 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].text |
就少年矯正的法治教育部分在少年矯正學校方面本部設有敦品中學、城鎮中學、麗智中學跟明陽中學其中明陽中學是以收容少年受刑人因少年受刑執行期限較長採用綜合型高中 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].start |
2233.177 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].end |
2251.372 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].text |
那端品中學、城鎮中學跟荔枝中學是收容感化教育處分的少年因此採技術型高中高時的形式那上開4個矯正學校都依照教育部12年國民基本教育課程綱要規定於各領域課程設計 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].start |
2252.553 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].end |
2276.024 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].text |
適切融入性平、人權及法治等議題。再來少年關護所因為少年關護所是收容少年保護事件以及羈押少年被告的刑事案件為避免少年因不按法律而觸法並讓少年於收容期間建立法治觀念將守法精神內化成少年的價值觀。 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].start |
2277.705 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].end |
2302.163 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].text |
那辦理情形因為針對不同教育階段的少年依其認知發展與生活經驗逐步拓擴法治教育內容在國小教育階段認識責任與兒少保護與國中與高中教育階段介紹少年的法律地位及民行行政法的基本原則跟學生權利跟校園法律的出探 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].start |
2303.851 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].end |
2317.97 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].text |
那對於少年角質教育辦理的情形我們會依教育部頒布的課程綱要規定安排法制教育第二會辦理我們在電影院上課觀影體驗教育活動 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].start |
2319.031 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].end |
2336.234 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].text |
第3會轉化轉嫌防止再犯．少年法院應與少年保護官定期探視少年．並與執行感化教育處所隨時保持聯繫．共同輔導少年．並提供少年就學、就醫、就業 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].start |
2337.015 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].end |
2362.222 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].text |
致力生活或後續追蹤輔導．辦理少年復學就業與致力生活適應協助的相關事宜．在少年矯正學校方面．學生入校後學校會視各案需求轉介衛福部由逆境少年方案的專責社工強化少年家庭支持連結．追蹤少年在校情形及家庭功能狀況． |
| transcript.whisperx[25].start |
2363.643 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].end |
2372.341 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].text |
學生出校後會持續追蹤一年。在學生出校前三個月也會進行各案執案規劃及出校轉嫌協助。 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].start |
2374.583 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].end |
2395.918 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].text |
就施用毒品防害性自主的案件會轉介當地的毒品危害防治中心跟家庭暴力及性侵防治中心協助少年順利的復歸社區家庭為使罹患精神疾病且有多元需要的也會跨單位的合作協助學生順利的復歸社會 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].start |
2398.072 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].end |
2409.619 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].text |
在少年關戶所方面也會在入所後3日內及通知原學級學校出所也會儘速通報原學級學校單一窗口 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].start |
2410.751 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].end |
2432.771 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].text |
至於各局校園的法治教育．各地檢署因應地方或校園宣導需要．積極提供施肢及支援．協助提升少年法域職能第二會根據青少年收視喜好．製作合適的宣導素材．運用多元宣導管道提升執行效率 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].start |
2433.872 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].end |
2461.681 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].text |
辦理全國學生犯罪預防漫畫及創意短片增進活動來法治教育向下查根另外舉辦全國法規資料庫的競賽活動提升學生的法治觀念公司協力共同推廣法治教育例如與職藍、職棒還有慈濟基金會合作宣導反毒另外跟地方政府辦理法律營隊等 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].start |
2462.941 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].end |
2488.786 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].text |
第六、辦理施改前進校園講座活動推廣施改政策．在112年總共辦了7場足跡深入全國北中南部的院校．未來我們也會再深入到高中．還有連結教育與校園誠信宣導也由廉政署來積極協同各級學校推展品德教育． |
| transcript.whisperx[31].start |
2490.565 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].end |
2519.244 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].text |
在司法保護與犯罪防制方面．司法保護中心會加強需求各案的通報轉介．還有全能康復推進計畫提供藥引家庭支持服務。最後,策進作為一會定期舉辦教育訓練提升檢察官偵辦案件的專業資能第二、拓展多元宣傳管道持續推廣法治教育第三、施改前進校園講座 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].start |
2519.904 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].end |
2542.623 |
| transcript.whisperx[32].text |
活動深耕校園往下雜耕。第四加強宣導司法保護機制結合網絡支援改善犯罪風險環境預防成年犯罪保護青少年以上報告進行主席各位委員指教謝謝好謝謝部長請司法院少年及家事廳謝廳長報告發言時間3分鐘請 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].start |
2549.837 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].end |
2566.228 |
| transcript.whisperx[33].text |
國務委員還有各位機關代表還有各位媒體朋友大家早安。司法院在犯罪預防的國家政府一體的扮演的角色來做一個簡要的報告其他的就如我們的書面的報告。 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].start |
2568.129 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].end |
2584.416 |
| transcript.whisperx[34].text |
目前在警察法或者是法院法務部的組織法大概都把犯罪預防跟法治教育分配給國家的重要的行政部門那司法院呢從少事法民國51年制定的時候就制定了4款的預算 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].start |
2586.136 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].end |
2601.523 |
| transcript.whisperx[35].text |
與犯呢其實在過去扮演的就是預防犯罪的角色那103年我國把這個就是兒童權利公約國內法化之後那也把這個與犯進行了一部分的檢討就是在664號解釋之後那我們廢除了與犯 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].start |
2602.223 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].end |
2606.948 |
| transcript.whisperx[36].text |
改從少年行為的特徵顯示暴露在風險當中。所以108年的修正,我們把廢除的愚犯進入暴險少年時代。去年7月開始由內政部、轄下的犯罪預防、在各地方政府設置的少年輔導委員會來進行行政輔導先行。 |
| transcript.whisperx[37].start |
2624.105 |
| transcript.whisperx[37].end |
2644.188 |
| transcript.whisperx[37].text |
那目前執行情形大概就是有如書面那簡單來說從去年7月1號開始到目前有13件的曝險少年是經過少年輔導委員會輔導之後認為有需要移送到少年法院的那我簡要的說一下少年法院的功能呢其實是問題解決司法 |
| transcript.whisperx[38].start |
2644.648 |
| transcript.whisperx[38].end |
2673.161 |
| transcript.whisperx[38].text |
那跟過去的刑法是確認這個就是行為人的犯罪事實進入良情是不一樣的那少年法院呢要透過嫌疑權制度還有我們配置有調查官制度去了解少年的行為客觀的顯現以下他有哪些行為的成因他是教育的問題家庭功能的問題或者少年有身心特殊需求的問題尤其在心理健康問題在青少年時代已經非常非常的一個嚴重 |
| transcript.whisperx[39].start |
2674.522 |
| transcript.whisperx[39].end |
2690.243 |
| transcript.whisperx[39].text |
配合將來媒體時代的需求。那少年法庭透過這個部分的一個這個就是了解之後呢會決定要不要轉向就是divergent或者是司法有介入處理的必要。介入處理的時間呢分成介入時間短比如說給他教育生活輔導 |
| transcript.whisperx[40].start |
2691.044 |
| transcript.whisperx[40].end |
2708.947 |
| transcript.whisperx[40].text |
那或者是呢時間長就是保護管束3年以下有必要呢就讓他離開原生家庭的生活的範圍就透過調整環境讓他安置到別的地方透過安置輔導的處分那要不然就是讓他短暫的隔離社會讓他送進矯正學校去進行這個矯正教育 |
| transcript.whisperx[41].start |
2709.528 |
| transcript.whisperx[41].end |
2734.983 |
| transcript.whisperx[41].text |
那所以在108年修法之後呢我們在805號解釋其實也都透過對被害人這個權益的關照那配合法務部主管的犯罪被害人權益保障法那同步也更新了少子法對於過去在被害人的一個權益保障這一塊在程序上的不足還有在整個被害人的復原的這個路上那少年法庭在這個部分也都有這個就是我們的職責所在 |
| transcript.whisperx[42].start |
2736.294 |
| transcript.whisperx[42].end |
2765.737 |
| transcript.whisperx[42].text |
那而在108年修法之後呢我們更看到了司法院跟行政院必須要兩院必須要透過不斷的協商針對這些資源的整合還有行為科學的深化那必須要把這些在掃帚化的台灣如何面對他們行為背後的這成因能夠及政府國家的力量非洲諺語有一句話說如果要養一個孩子要靠一個尊子的力量今天21世紀的台灣2024年必須要靠政府 |
| transcript.whisperx[43].start |
2766.337 |
| transcript.whisperx[43].end |
2789.495 |
| transcript.whisperx[43].text |
我們為這些將來的少子化的臺灣要把每一個孩子的行為問題設法能夠解決他們的問題所以我們應該要請這個國家社會的力量這也是兒權公約裡面就是我們要盡最大的可能的努力以上謝謝好謝謝謝廷長語重心長那接下來我們請教育部學生事務及特殊教育司吳司長報告發言時間3分鐘請選單二要謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[44].start |
2795.018 |
| transcript.whisperx[44].end |
2823.759 |
| transcript.whisperx[44].text |
主席、各位委員、女士先生大家好今天應邀列席貴委員會就青少年法治教育與犯罪防制成效進行專題報告那簡單地說目前在法治教育的部分我們從編制法治課程教材還有推動學校法治措施增進教師法治的智能以及宣導侵止法治教育的幾個面向持續在努力當中那我們跟警政 |
| transcript.whisperx[45].start |
2824.56 |
| transcript.whisperx[45].end |
2845.327 |
| transcript.whisperx[45].text |
警政署每3個月固定會定期召開教育跟警政的聯繫匯報就有關於青少年犯罪防制的問題．定期研討針對遭遇到的困難以及跨部會的合作持續的來做討論那同時我們針對法治教育的推動也經常結合警方以及地檢署來各地方的這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[46].start |
2847.488 |
| transcript.whisperx[46].end |
2866.562 |
| transcript.whisperx[46].text |
相關法律司法專長人員,就少年犯罪的常見形態以及可能涉及到的刑責等,跟各地方政府及各級學校合作,邀請進入校園來做相關法律宣導,讓孩子了解觸犯各種法律的刑責可能會有涉及到的責任及問題。 |
| transcript.whisperx[47].start |
2868.243 |
| transcript.whisperx[47].end |
2888.209 |
| transcript.whisperx[47].text |
那我想在未來精進的這個部分我想我們會持續的來做努力尤其在法治教育落入課程實施的部分我想法治教育需要提早來做起所以從國小、國中到高中各階段如何來融入到各領域的課程當中我們鼓勵老師來研發相關的教材那也延請這些法律專業人員 |
| transcript.whisperx[48].start |
2889.969 |
| transcript.whisperx[48].end |
2913.103 |
| transcript.whisperx[48].text |
律師、檢察官等及警方偵辦人員結合學校的力量共同來進入校園來做宣導。另外就是少事法修法之後對各縣市的少府會的運作結合警方、社政跟教育的力量共同來對於這些處罰或者是預防需要提早做處理的部分會透過少府會的討論機制促進跨 |
| transcript.whisperx[49].start |
2915.865 |
| transcript.whisperx[49].end |
2927.414 |
| transcript.whisperx[49].text |
系統的一個整合,大家共同來預防這個犯罪。以上報告,謝謝。好,謝謝市長。接下來有請內政部警政署刑事警察局州局長報告,發言時間3分鐘。 |
| transcript.whisperx[50].start |
2934.065 |
| transcript.whisperx[50].end |
2948.236 |
| transcript.whisperx[50].text |
主席、各位委員、女士先生大家好。今天應邀列席貴委員會進行工作報告並備質詢請就本署青少年法治教育與犯罪防制成效組織項目報告如下進行質詢。 |
| transcript.whisperx[51].start |
2949.761 |
| transcript.whisperx[51].end |
2975.664 |
| transcript.whisperx[51].text |
近10年少年犯罪案例以竊盜占18.75%是最高．其次預示為詐欺3.69%．毒品11.22%．傷害11.17%等以上4類案件合計約占55%．針對少年犯罪防制部分．本屬協同、衛福、教育．法務等網絡單位以司法院協力合作共同防制． |
| transcript.whisperx[52].start |
2977.145 |
| transcript.whisperx[52].end |
2997.561 |
| transcript.whisperx[52].text |
並於112年12月15日函班修正警察機關防制少年犯罪工作計畫．請各地方政府、警察局強化防制少年犯罪專案工作．以應應少年輔導委員會行政先行新制．並配合少年事件處理法的修法．辦理法治輔導人員的培訓與重點工作． |
| transcript.whisperx[53].start |
3000.885 |
| transcript.whisperx[53].end |
3021.881 |
| transcript.whisperx[53].text |
本屬於暑假執行青春專案期間查獲少年涉詐欺案件有879人、毒品案件有119人、組織犯罪案件有139人及兒少性剝削案防害性隱私部分有552人、犯罪預防宣導部分各地方政府 |
| transcript.whisperx[54].start |
3022.321 |
| transcript.whisperx[54].end |
3043.561 |
| transcript.whisperx[54].text |
警察局自辦或結合其他單位辦理有益青少年之實體活動共計有517場．舉辦網路互動直播或影音宣導計有422則及製作圖文宣導素材．並利用警察或非警察機關的管道播放計有1016則。 |
| transcript.whisperx[55].start |
3045.623 |
| transcript.whisperx[55].end |
3071.217 |
| transcript.whisperx[55].text |
另外本署針對維護校園安全工作也已建立教警校園安全聯繫機制並加強上放學及大型活動安全維護防制幫派跟毒品入侵校園及持續辦理校園安全環境檢測評估工作策進作為部分除積極入校宣導以防制新型態詐欺犯罪外 |
| transcript.whisperx[56].start |
3072.217 |
| transcript.whisperx[56].end |
3088.066 |
| transcript.whisperx[56].text |
亦與行政院相關會議中提出警察機關及少年輔導委員會在實務上所見的問題進行跨部會的共同延伸跟防治的對策。以上報告進行各位委員以先進視教職。謝謝。好,謝謝周局長。那麼 |
| transcript.whisperx[57].start |
3095.23 |
| transcript.whisperx[57].end |
3109.545 |
| transcript.whisperx[57].text |
機關代表報告完畢相關書面報告內容請各位參閱並列入公報記錄那另外先做會議程序之宣告上午會議時間於詢答結束後繼續進行至議程所列 |
| transcript.whisperx[58].start |
3110.506 |
| transcript.whisperx[58].end |
3127.041 |
| transcript.whisperx[58].text |
預算解凍案均處理完畢為止。現在開始進行詢答本會委員詢答時間為8分鐘必要時得延長2分鐘非本會委員詢答時間為5分鐘並不再延長。上午10點30分截止發言登記請登記第一位的黃總召國昌委員請 |
| transcript.whisperx[59].start |
3144.713 |
| transcript.whisperx[59].end |
3146.235 |
| transcript.whisperx[59].text |
請蔡部長跟檢察總長請 |
| transcript.whisperx[60].start |
3161.879 |
| transcript.whisperx[60].end |
3188.297 |
| transcript.whisperx[60].text |
兩位好兩位應該是我們在整個刑事司法體系當中負責偵辦犯罪不管是政策面還是檢查系統指揮面的大家長有好幾個案子因為牽涉到我們在具體的執行上面的時候不管是偵查不公開還是廉政的要求今天有機會一併請教兩位這樣子是看在誰的權責範圍內 |
| transcript.whisperx[61].start |
3192.859 |
| transcript.whisperx[61].end |
3211.706 |
| transcript.whisperx[61].text |
加以回答2021年我回到公民社會以後我開始協助一些吹哨者接挖弊案這些吹哨者會害怕他們會害怕什麼當他們是內部的吹哨人的時候他們提供重要的犯罪證據 |
| transcript.whisperx[62].start |
3213.346 |
| transcript.whisperx[62].end |
3240.471 |
| transcript.whisperx[62].text |
但問題是當他身份如有被揭露他擔心會被清算會被報復所以我們一直強調催少者保護法的重要性這個在院會跟部長跟院長都交換過意見我在2020年6月告發了這個案子我從來沒有讓任何人知道這個案子是我告發的我就一直靜靜的等因為我當初告發的時候 |
| transcript.whisperx[63].start |
3241.551 |
| transcript.whisperx[63].end |
3258.881 |
| transcript.whisperx[63].text |
我準備的證據非常齊全連裡面會計傳票、內部的帳我全部都整理好了送給檢察官請求檢察官偵辦犯罪我一直到上個禮拜週末看到這個案子終於發動 |
| transcript.whisperx[64].start |
3260.342 |
| transcript.whisperx[64].end |
3287.527 |
| transcript.whisperx[64].text |
搜索了當然對我來講我會覺得很好奇我當初準備這麼多證據結果竟然拖了3年才動但沒有關係該偵辦的犯罪就偵辦但讓我驚訝的是什麼讓我驚訝的是我看了報紙以後我大驚失色幾乎每一篇報紙都說這是前立委黃國昌向北檢告發我想要請教一下部長記者怎麼會知道 |
| transcript.whisperx[65].start |
3290.563 |
| transcript.whisperx[65].end |
3291.524 |
| transcript.whisperx[65].text |
從我們偵查實務來講 |
| transcript.whisperx[66].start |
3312.044 |
| transcript.whisperx[66].end |
3328.047 |
| transcript.whisperx[66].text |
這個的確是最讓人痛心疾首的不過這個原因非常多這個我就要問好了啦剛剛檢察總長用到四個字叫痛心疾首嘛那如果這個是檢察官跟記者說的應該嗎?應該嗎?我現在在討論的是規範上的問題這個事情我不會追求責任我更在乎的是規範上的問題因為這個人是我 |
| transcript.whisperx[67].start |
3342.366 |
| transcript.whisperx[67].end |
3371.113 |
| transcript.whisperx[67].text |
我其實沒有在怕的啦但這個牽涉到其他的案件如果是這樣子在對待的話我們一直在講崔少哲保護到底在保護什麼啊這個案子現在還在刑事偵查中喔還沒有做起訴不起訴的處分喔在刑事偵查中喔結果記者直接是把這個事情是誰檢舉的每一個報紙幾乎都寫出來了我當然是要有些了解嘛 |
| transcript.whisperx[68].start |
3372.808 |
| transcript.whisperx[68].end |
3400.998 |
| transcript.whisperx[68].text |
你們怎麼知道是我告發的?如果是檢察官講的應該嗎?總長這個是基本態度的問題這個如果是有人洩漏出去的話這個因為接觸案件人相當多這有各種的管道不過我們在基層沒有我只問一個問題如果是檢察官講的應不應該當然不應該當然不應該嘛那總長因為你可以指揮監督整個檢查系統嘛 |
| transcript.whisperx[69].start |
3402.065 |
| transcript.whisperx[69].end |
3428.591 |
| transcript.whisperx[69].text |
是不是可以承諾去了解這件事情到底怎麼發生的我再強調一次齁我沒有要追究責任但總長了解這件事情怎麼發生了以後就拜託他們以後不要再發生因為我檢舉的人家怕曝光所以來找我我據名幫忙檢舉我老實講我就沒有在怕沒有在怕得罪這些人 |
| transcript.whisperx[70].start |
3430.077 |
| transcript.whisperx[70].end |
3458.625 |
| transcript.whisperx[70].text |
但不是每一個人都沒有在怕很多人會怕這是為什麼我一直強調這件事情的重要性第二個IMB的案子我上次請教部長嘛一樣我帶秘密證人去做筆錄結果秘密證人做的筆錄變成靜州刊獨家的內容上次部長提了說這個不是在您所詳的範圍當中嘛來我今天請教一下總長 |
| transcript.whisperx[71].start |
3460.499 |
| transcript.whisperx[71].end |
3487.135 |
| transcript.whisperx[71].text |
總長你覺得這件事情應該嗎當然不應該當然不應該嘛那上次部長的意思是說這個要怎麼處理要交給北檢那顯然部長是感覺起來啦就北檢這不是他所匣的範圍是不是可以請總長承諾要求北檢回去徹查這是怎麼回事因為這件事情我公開喊話喊一年了啦那台北地檢署似乎啦我人為言輕啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[72].start |
3488.206 |
| transcript.whisperx[72].end |
3495.364 |
| transcript.whisperx[72].text |
我公開喔一直質疑這件事情到底怎麼發生的完全不理會欸可以這樣嗎總長 |
| transcript.whisperx[73].start |
3500.392 |
| transcript.whisperx[73].end |
3526.674 |
| transcript.whisperx[73].text |
這個委員所提到的我們會去了解就是依照委員所提到的我這樣說齁總長我跟您交換一下意見我們大家都是法律人依法就論法這件事情該怎麼處理就怎麼處理但我覺得這個事情不能一而再再而三的發生一而再再而三的發生你等於是告訴整個社會喔不要吹哨啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[74].start |
3528.066 |
| transcript.whisperx[74].end |
3545.255 |
| transcript.whisperx[74].text |
不要當秘密證人啊你什麼時候被翻出來啊你都不知道啊那個對一般民眾的心理壓力有多大啊這絕對不是我們在邁向年齡國家的道路上面我們所期待看到的狀況嘛總長您同意嗎第三個事情喔是八八會館的行政調查報告我之前請教部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[75].start |
3556.814 |
| transcript.whisperx[75].end |
3570.689 |
| transcript.whisperx[75].text |
說高檢署所作的八八會館的行政調查報告必中就清我講的嚴重一點是說謊我為什麼敢說他說謊在那個調查報告裡面在那個調查報告裡面 |
| transcript.whisperx[76].start |
3577.503 |
| transcript.whisperx[76].end |
3595.379 |
| transcript.whisperx[76].text |
他明明就知道招待檢警的人就是那個洗錢犯郭澤民也知道現場是有人提供服務的但是在我們的高權署裡面的調查報告裡面就完全不是這樣子寫寫說沒有場所經理或業者進入現場沒有服務人員 |
| transcript.whisperx[77].start |
3596.46 |
| transcript.whisperx[77].end |
3608.286 |
| transcript.whisperx[77].text |
我那時候看了高檢署的調查報告我不敢置信啊那等於是什麼等於是有人拿著鑰匙自己去開門自己去開冷氣自己去倒酒水自己服務自己這可能嗎招待所是這樣運作的嗎我後來就去追啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[78].start |
3614.265 |
| transcript.whisperx[78].end |
3629.341 |
| transcript.whisperx[78].text |
終於讓我追出了訪談的證詞訪談的證詞那個操帶所現場管理的人就說有啊只要招待高階的檢警都是小民招待的啊我們會有兩三個人啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[79].start |
3630.422 |
| transcript.whisperx[79].end |
3654.816 |
| transcript.whisperx[79].text |
在那邊倒茶水啊在那邊提供酒啊在那邊服務啊高警署的調查報告怎麼會做出來的品質是這個樣子如何請教如何取信社會大眾啊因為這個事情我一樣我大概公開問了一年但我們的台灣高等檢察署就是沒有要回應總長這樣應該嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[80].start |
3659.795 |
| transcript.whisperx[80].end |
3679.528 |
| transcript.whisperx[80].text |
就刑事來講齁 這個八八會館這個案子我們一直持續的調查從來沒有停止過我現在在講的是行政調查的部分因為這個不是我的職權啦齁可是台灣高等檢察署不是你所轄的嗎我這個是刑事 刑事調查齁所以行政調查的部分是歸部長 來請部長呃 |
| transcript.whisperx[81].start |
3683.356 |
| transcript.whisperx[81].end |
3707.748 |
| transcript.whisperx[81].text |
高檢署的初步報告雖然完成但是他沒有對外詳細的說明如果需要詳細的說明我會要求他們這不是詳細的說明啊這內容根本虛有不實啊剛剛我這樣子的描述有錯嗎那我不曉得委員講的是哪一個片段那我們回去我上面不是秀了嗎第一個我回去告訴高檢署把委員的質疑再詳細的去了解 |
| transcript.whisperx[82].start |
3710.796 |
| transcript.whisperx[82].end |
3732.127 |
| transcript.whisperx[82].text |
當第一個時間事情發生的時候為什麼會希望高端檢察署做行政調查報告因為這已經嚴重的衝擊了社會大眾對於我們整個檢查體系的信心了結果出了這份行政調查報告一樣避重就輕甚至以客觀事實不符大家都是用混的 |
| transcript.whisperx[83].start |
3733.88 |
| transcript.whisperx[83].end |
3759.43 |
| transcript.whisperx[83].text |
風頭過了以後新聞熱度過了以後以為沒有人會再追究沒有人會再在意但我必須要很沉痛的講絕對不應該這個樣子絕對不應該這個樣子高等檢察署是一個如何重要的機構全國的地檢署上面的高等檢察署做出來的行政調查報告品質是這個樣子 |
| transcript.whisperx[84].start |
3762.691 |
| transcript.whisperx[84].end |
3789.337 |
| transcript.whisperx[84].text |
這是在包屁嗎在我眼中看來這就是在包屁時間的關係最後一個問題來請行政長因為之前就有關於縱放洗錢犯的責任新北地檢小明到了機場結果承辦的檢察官接到海關那邊的電話竟然說放人我一直在追 |
| transcript.whisperx[85].start |
3790.615 |
| transcript.whisperx[85].end |
3819.984 |
| transcript.whisperx[85].text |
新北地檢署說這個調查要等到形勢癥結那我就很耐心的等形勢癥結現在形勢癥結了去年就形勢癥結了我上一次發函給新北地檢署結果新北地檢署回函說這個行政調查程序仍在進行當中尚未結案沒有辦法提供行政調查結果請問這個行政調查拖了這麼久還要多久 |
| transcript.whisperx[86].start |
3821.577 |
| transcript.whisperx[86].end |
3843.229 |
| transcript.whisperx[86].text |
這個是部長的還是總長的說瞎如果是行政調查按照總長的意思應該是屬於部長吧是嗎因為我上次問部長部長說這個要新北地檢署回答所以我有點搞不清楚了所以今天總長來兩位都在這邊誰的權責給他講清楚這個行政調查新北地檢還要拖多久 |
| transcript.whisperx[87].start |
3844.578 |
| transcript.whisperx[87].end |
3850.179 |
| transcript.whisperx[87].text |
根據新北地檢的回覆他刑事調查還在進行當中嗎?所以你的意思是說當他的刑事偵查只要一天不終結這個行政調查一天沒有辦法進行是這樣嗎? |
| transcript.whisperx[88].start |
3865.043 |
| transcript.whisperx[88].end |
3867.186 |
| transcript.whisperx[88].text |
那就由新北定解署來判斷 |
| transcript.whisperx[89].start |
3881.365 |
| transcript.whisperx[89].end |
3906.438 |
| transcript.whisperx[89].text |
由他們自己來判斷所以一年也沒有關係兩年也沒有關係三年也沒有關係是這樣嗎不是話不能這樣講我們按照檢察官他偵辦案件的進度在不違反行事偵查不公開的情況下行政調查依然可以進行所以嘛按照你的說法嘛大家就不能問嘛不能質疑嘛連什麼時候行政調查 |
| transcript.whisperx[90].start |
3907.518 |
| transcript.whisperx[90].end |
3936.617 |
| transcript.whisperx[90].text |
要出來他說那我們就按照整體刑事案件偵查的狀況我們慢慢磨慢慢拖慢慢混可以這樣嗎那是你的解讀啦對那你的解讀是什麼嘛解讀是檢察官有按照他既有的程序在進行那刑事偵查還在進行當中當然行政調查在不違反的情況下可以做但是如果影響到刑事偵查所以嘛按照你的答案是他要做多久都沒有關係嘛 |
| transcript.whisperx[91].start |
3938.359 |
| transcript.whisperx[91].end |
3938.839 |
| transcript.whisperx[91].text |
請部長簡短答覆 |
| transcript.whisperx[92].start |
3961.713 |
| transcript.whisperx[92].end |
3987.32 |
| transcript.whisperx[92].text |
我們誰負責誰就會要來努力的來完成對那所以是誰負責我們共同負責嘛你跟總長共同負責行政的部分當然是我負責行事的部分他負責嘛那我們也是要彼此合作尊重嘛沒有關係啦我們繼續看下去看還要拖多久這麼離譜的事情看還要拖多久才要給社會大眾一個交代好謝謝黃總召謝謝部長謝謝檢察總長 |
| transcript.whisperx[93].start |
3991.311 |
| transcript.whisperx[93].end |
4017.974 |
| transcript.whisperx[93].text |
接下來有請審委員發會質詢。主席有請蔡部長有請蔡部長部長早 |
| transcript.whisperx[94].start |
4020.39 |
| transcript.whisperx[94].end |
4045.384 |
| transcript.whisperx[94].text |
這個今天我們安排這個有關青少年法治教育及犯罪防制成效的一個專題報告那這這麼巧在我看到你們的這個書面報告裡面也有提到這個有關有關這個少年矯正學校的相關的問題這麼巧就在昨天下午我們的這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[95].start |
4047.293 |
| transcript.whisperx[95].end |
4059.011 |
| transcript.whisperx[95].text |
頓品中學,即是我們世間矯正學校之一,這個頓品中學所發生的這樣子騷動的事件請問部長你這邊就它相關的處置你有什麼樣的對社會的說明 |
| transcript.whisperx[96].start |
4062.94 |
| transcript.whisperx[96].end |
4087.728 |
| transcript.whisperx[96].text |
謝謝委員的關心第一時間矯正署他也有去了解了解的結果是因為學生對於課程他有意見那本來學校是安排是自習在教室內自習但是學生希望到教室外去打籃球那所以在溝通上產生了一些問題而且造成學生的這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[97].start |
4090.349 |
| transcript.whisperx[97].end |
4118.841 |
| transcript.whisperx[97].text |
稍動。大概是狀況是這樣。詳細的情形,矯正署署長有來,要不要請他再詳細的說明。我們這個署長一起,請這個署長一起上來。來,請周署長。不過部長齁,我,我想我還,昨天這個事情齁,從發生,我看,我這都是依媒體報導啦,我沒有看到你們相關的報告。依然媒體報導從兩點半開始到五點四十,將近三個多小時。三個多小時的事件齁。那這個, |
| transcript.whisperx[98].start |
4121.833 |
| transcript.whisperx[98].end |
4136.109 |
| transcript.whisperx[98].text |
這個看起來這個也是好像是突發的事件但是事實上在20天前3月7號一樣就在敦品中學也發生了相關的騷動事件對不對部長說明一下 |
| transcript.whisperx[99].start |
4138.905 |
| transcript.whisperx[99].end |
4155.396 |
| transcript.whisperx[99].text |
跟委員報告、委員提及的上一次的那個事件跟昨天的是不同生活區、不同的區域那上一次是因為我們的同仁要求那個施工的廠商工人不能繳金郎這個媒體有報導但是在3月7號的時候發生 |
| transcript.whisperx[100].start |
4162.486 |
| transcript.whisperx[100].end |
4187.262 |
| transcript.whisperx[100].text |
我們這個這個端平中學的校方表示齁這個我們第一時間齁通報警方對然後這個已派員前往關心慰問齁要加強法際教育及行為輔導要杜絕杜絕類似事件的發生結果杜絕了20天杜絕了20天就又發生昨天的這樣的事件 |
| transcript.whisperx[101].start |
4188.851 |
| transcript.whisperx[101].end |
4210.977 |
| transcript.whisperx[101].text |
那我再看昨天這個算第二次發生了嗎?你們應該是不是有什麼樣的檢討跟說明?你們是學校已召集學校同仁全面檢討事故發生始末安排加強輔導並加派警力強化校園安全避免事件再發生這一次不敢說凍結了部長我們有關相關的這樣子的處理有什麼樣的SOP? |
| transcript.whisperx[102].start |
4216.628 |
| transcript.whisperx[102].end |
4238.01 |
| transcript.whisperx[102].text |
有如果學生他有意見應該要充分的溝通尤其對於青少年不能用強壓的方式所以我們現在著重的是教育的目的我們原來是少年府醫院改制為學校就是希望用教育的手段來達到教化他們的目的 |
| transcript.whisperx[103].start |
4239.01 |
| transcript.whisperx[103].end |
4263.675 |
| transcript.whisperx[103].text |
這個齁,你們有一個少年矯正學校設置及教育實施通責啦齁,你們實施通責。事實上你們對於相關這樣子的學生,這些學生你們的有關的獎懲,其實手段工具並不多啦。齁,你們就是,看起來就是第一告誡,第二就是勞動服務一至五日,就這樣。請問部長,昨天發生這樣的事情對於這些相關學生他們的累進處遇有沒有影響? |
| transcript.whisperx[104].start |
4265.046 |
| transcript.whisperx[104].end |
4273.291 |
| transcript.whisperx[104].text |
因為昨天這樣的事件其實規模是蠻大的其實是一件規模蠻大的事件你們總共調動了多少警力沒有那是在外圍戒備而已 |
| transcript.whisperx[105].start |
4290.103 |
| transcript.whisperx[105].end |
4316.376 |
| transcript.whisperx[105].text |
那主要還是靠輔導老師你們就臨近你們調了臺北監獄、桃園監獄、巴德監獄的矯正所有的這些警力都到場這是我們有SOP啦就是發生狀況的時候要叫區域聯防的方式附近的監所要來支援但是都在外圍不會馬上就進入主要學生還是要靠老師來溝通矯正學校的這個設置跟教育實施通則事實上檢察官 |
| transcript.whisperx[106].start |
4317.304 |
| transcript.whisperx[106].end |
4336.509 |
| transcript.whisperx[106].text |
跟這個地方法院他就有關刑法感化教育執行事項得隨時考核、矯正學校呢?這個我們有沒有在做?有,主要因為這是少年法庭的法官他預知來受感化教育的所以他們也會繼續的來關切來幫忙輔導 |
| transcript.whisperx[107].start |
4340.131 |
| transcript.whisperx[107].end |
4361.362 |
| transcript.whisperx[107].text |
好,這個事情我就具體做要求就校內的部分我希望這些教導員跟輔導教師要怎麼樣加強對於我們的這些教導員跟輔導教師的考核這是第一件事第二件事目前的警衛隊他的應變程序我希望能夠更加的我們能夠更加完備他的應變程序 |
| transcript.whisperx[108].start |
4362.782 |
| transcript.whisperx[108].end |
4383.115 |
| transcript.whisperx[108].text |
就外部的部分希望說這個法務部跟教育部能夠針對甚至包括教育部針對這個相關的這些事件加強督導這部分那個我們矯正署長請回謝謝委員的指教我覺得建議很好我們會來努力來做好那部長請我請這個刑同長部長你可以先來請檢察總長 |
| transcript.whisperx[109].start |
4392.086 |
| transcript.whisperx[109].end |
4394.028 |
| transcript.whisperx[109].text |
委員好新總長早這個齁有關這個我們民國105年所起訴的齁在今年1月24號 |
| transcript.whisperx[110].start |
4408.753 |
| transcript.whisperx[110].end |
4430.493 |
| transcript.whisperx[110].text |
判刑定讞有關退役軍官崔醫生、李慶賢、葉瑞璋的這些刺探、收集、交付情報、收受報酬的這個案子。請總長你對於這相關案件有所了解吧?大概知道。判刑的結果怎麼樣? |
| transcript.whisperx[111].start |
4435.277 |
| transcript.whisperx[111].end |
4461.156 |
| transcript.whisperx[111].text |
總長我跟你講啦 這個判刑的結果齁 這個 這個崔醫生8個月啦 葉瑞璋8個月啦 這個李慶賢他7個月7個月1年2年欸 這個1年2個月啦齁 總長這個 這個涉及涉及退役軍官涉及刺探收集情報最後判刑的結果跟偷一台摩托車的刑期差不多啦 |
| transcript.whisperx[112].start |
4464.817 |
| transcript.whisperx[112].end |
4478.129 |
| transcript.whisperx[112].text |
總長,這個部分是不是總長你有什麼樣的看法?這個的確,這些涉及到國家安全,其實從性質上講起來有些案件事實上就是叛國,它的內涵就是叛國。 |
| transcript.whisperx[113].start |
4479.568 |
| transcript.whisperx[113].end |
4499.187 |
| transcript.whisperx[113].text |
那判刑現在普遍講起來齁,量刑一般齁,不管從我們國人的反應,還有從我們這個刑事上的,我們實質的這個刑事實務的工作者我們來看啦,都是過低啦。那這裡面原因很多啦齁,原因很多。包括齁,我們這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[114].start |
4502.249 |
| transcript.whisperx[114].end |
4528.065 |
| transcript.whisperx[114].text |
從施政面還有這個法院平時的量刑還有這些立法總長事實上有曾經對社會有做過這樣的說明是是是針對這些國安案件的這個量刑普遍過低你又表示你的意見了是那這個最新的齁我們在2月29我們這次我們在這個我們修正過後的國安法到目前好像第一個案子是哪一個案子 |
| transcript.whisperx[115].start |
4530.267 |
| transcript.whisperx[115].end |
4551.028 |
| transcript.whisperx[115].text |
我們起訴起訴的第一個案子那個國安法修正之後這個國安法這個委員只要是哪哪一方面的111年修正之後因為這種類型很多啊好有關這個這個何建華何建華何建華你知道嗎我知道我知道他在他在 |
| transcript.whisperx[116].start |
4552.276 |
| transcript.whisperx[116].end |
4564.464 |
| transcript.whisperx[116].text |
上個月一審判決,判決結果是什麼?無罪。你有沒有仔細看他的判決書?有,我跟那個常辦檢察官也研究過。後來你們有上訴嗎?會上訴,這個案子會提上訴。我看這個判決書齁,這個大概整個 |
| transcript.whisperx[117].start |
4572.049 |
| transcript.whisperx[117].end |
4597.075 |
| transcript.whisperx[117].text |
之所以判決無罪當然一方面有對於這個構成要件的一些看法跟檢方不同但是滿主要的一個部分其實就是直接講你們檢方的收證不足就是證據不足你沒有辦法證明他那個現金的來源你沒有辦法證明簡單我看好幾個判決理由都是因為證據不足未能證明來源 |
| transcript.whisperx[118].start |
4599.949 |
| transcript.whisperx[118].end |
4610.956 |
| transcript.whisperx[118].text |
所以在相關辦理案件我們除了說我們一直認為說目前的法院的判決良心普遍過低但是另外一方面我們自己 |
| transcript.whisperx[119].start |
4612.383 |
| transcript.whisperx[119].end |
4635.731 |
| transcript.whisperx[119].text |
我們的這個檢察官在辦理相關的案件的時候在整個收證的程序是不是應該更加嚴謹?是委員我大概因為時間我長話短說喔第一個這個法律的要件還要再更完備另外設置12它的困難性我跟委員說喔大概有三點因為資金流還有人流還有資訊流完全斷掉都在大陸所以我們檢察官辦這種案子非常非常的困難這點跟委員報告 |
| transcript.whisperx[120].start |
4638.279 |
| transcript.whisperx[120].end |
4654.319 |
| transcript.whisperx[120].text |
但是就是因為困難啦齁這個困難所以我們這個對於相關的這樣修正齁我覺得我們這個我們這個檢察官系統齁我們應該要就這樣的案件的我們的修正齁以及我們的相關的怎麼樣來突破 |
| transcript.whisperx[121].start |
4656.885 |
| transcript.whisperx[121].end |
4679.397 |
| transcript.whisperx[121].text |
這個在他的證據力的問題我覺得應該要大家要來討論,而不是雙手一攤說就沒辦法收證啊。所以這個法律上還請這個我們國會在支持我們,否則現在很多案件都靠我們國人的愛國心在幫忙破案。這樣真的是不夠,可是在法制裡面還需要大家的,尤其國會的支持。那當然,那當然。好,謝謝。謝謝委員。好,謝謝沈委員,謝謝蔣常長。接下來有請謝委員榮屆發言。 |
| transcript.whisperx[122].start |
4704.22 |
| transcript.whisperx[122].end |
4723.223 |
| transcript.whisperx[122].text |
主席我請那個部長還有教育部我希望那個什麼詐騙請有請蔡部長還有教育部的教育部跟那個警政署還有警政署我們局長局長對好委員好老丈齁 |
| transcript.whisperx[123].start |
4727.668 |
| transcript.whisperx[123].end |
4727.828 |
| transcript.whisperx[123].text |
本身齁 |
| transcript.whisperx[124].start |
4758.393 |
| transcript.whisperx[124].end |
4763.115 |
| transcript.whisperx[124].text |
我希望那個什麼詐騙修法可以修得快一點我覺得 |
| transcript.whisperx[125].start |
4788.995 |
| transcript.whisperx[125].end |
4816.252 |
| transcript.whisperx[125].text |
每天都看到這麼多人都被詐騙實在是看了有點難過像我自己也有被騙剛開始那個法官他叫我去打那個民視庭然後我覺得說你們詐騙集團把錢騙走然後要我們去打民視庭我就覺得有點太操控了吧你這個是犯罪所得欸你還叫我去打那個什麼民視庭我覺得然後我當庭的時候我就跟你被騙多少錢 |
| transcript.whisperx[126].start |
4817.469 |
| transcript.whisperx[126].end |
4818.029 |
| transcript.whisperx[126].text |
兩三百塊啊?兩三百萬? |
| transcript.whisperx[127].start |
4843.789 |
| transcript.whisperx[127].end |
4848.395 |
| transcript.whisperx[127].text |
二十幾歲怎麼會有兩三百萬被騙?第二個案例齁,這個案例大概就是三道活指的一生了,這個翻版。 |
| transcript.whisperx[128].start |
4864.193 |
| transcript.whisperx[128].end |
4884.379 |
| transcript.whisperx[128].text |
所以這裡的主任公司齁一台車很簡單讓你坐這中間延伸出來的詐騙第一個案例呢是他去騙一百六十幾萬齁結果呢 這麼厲害他可以拖一百三十萬回來我所有住在的詐騙就對了就在這間拖太多錢回來來 拖的時候發現說你要去泡民宿啦叫他去泡民宿過時就對了犯罪所定他要拖就要叫他去泡民宿過時啦齁這一個 來 |
| transcript.whisperx[129].start |
4893.7 |
| transcript.whisperx[129].end |
4900.944 |
| transcript.whisperx[129].text |
因為凍結的關係我剛才請教你說凍結及早期有關係有關係有夠大這局長你知道你在台南市做局長我在台南市的時候所有每一年的警察局長來我都要求說好行的凍結有夠嚴重大家都知道很嚴重都沒有辦法去查 |
| transcript.whisperx[130].start |
4919.329 |
| transcript.whisperx[130].end |
4924.451 |
| transcript.whisperx[130].text |
警方便心憂於內部教育三民因為教育部整個學校不愛讓警方入理啊!校園不給警方入理查!所以警方只能在外圍監控啊!就像這樣啊!報告委員,那個是有校園自治啦!但事實上我們有三級的那個聯繫管道啊!沒有啦!不能再校園自治啦!你剛才跟我說校園聯繫機制就對了啦!那完全失效啦! |
| transcript.whisperx[131].start |
4946.482 |
| transcript.whisperx[131].end |
4950.104 |
| transcript.whisperx[131].text |
若有效就在於今天效應的突變不會這麼煩惱。我們坦白說,要勇敢面對嘛。這個問題法務部、經濟署、教育部大家沒有要面對。你們看保肥有怎樣處理嗎?效應若沒有要改進啦。近況的經歷、近況的氾濫絕對沒辦法進去。阿在效應出聲之後,我要講,它就變成了頭髮。 |
| transcript.whisperx[132].start |
4973.34 |
| transcript.whisperx[132].end |
4991.825 |
| transcript.whisperx[132].text |
有頭阿伯出社會就炸棄啊、殺人啊。你看看你們的報告就對了,好像古年喔。古年青少年的憲法就增加16%了。如果算到12月到18月就12.94%了。那種快速的行動。我們的年輕人靠…孩子出事是一個低減。結果 |
| transcript.whisperx[133].start |
5002.799 |
| transcript.whisperx[133].end |
5003.74 |
| transcript.whisperx[133].text |
因為今早官司府這個犯罪偵查 |
| transcript.whisperx[134].start |
5022.216 |
| transcript.whisperx[134].end |
5043.072 |
| transcript.whisperx[134].text |
啊犯...青少年法治教育要加強啊這就要扣分了你的診察我...我也...司法院來我也跟他說了嘛對不對檢察官遭到會扣結不可以啊抓一大堆警察抓一大堆三年來都是欽判嘛你看不看那扣分的說叫我們就要修法看兩檔醫生的時候有夠久的尤其啦第一篇第二篇差不多都叫回去都不用說了 |
| transcript.whisperx[135].start |
5052.344 |
| transcript.whisperx[135].end |
5067.376 |
| transcript.whisperx[135].text |
所以已經開始處理的車手越來越多了他的兵員是源源不斷啦我們國軍的募兵這幾個都募不到詐騙集團的募兵就對了每天一半不用看報紙主動報名有夠多我們的國軍一個位三十幾K啦兵啦募兵制啦詐欺業的車手一個位七十幾K啦 |
| transcript.whisperx[136].start |
5080.956 |
| transcript.whisperx[136].end |
5083.297 |
| transcript.whisperx[136].text |
啊你看你要去做那個兵還要做這個兵所以這是一個很重要的問題你們今天來報告青少年犯罪的風地嘛不然你比較有經驗嘛你比較有機會啦 看補費啦針對經濟事務法務部及法務的特聘有什麼具體的做法嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[137].start |
5104.496 |
| transcript.whisperx[137].end |
5124.535 |
| transcript.whisperx[137].text |
高檢署是負責執行,我們都會針對每一波的緝毒專案,看是要針對什麼,也要針對校園的藥頭做一個掃蕩,所以我們也要持續來做這項抗議。績效不沾嘛,搞不好你們的建築沒有要經歷入口風,我就突破無了。 |
| transcript.whisperx[138].start |
5128.035 |
| transcript.whisperx[138].end |
5132.939 |
| transcript.whisperx[138].text |
警方如果查獲都會通報校園我們針對查獲他就是在外面跟社會人士交接你聽到嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[139].start |
5146.668 |
| transcript.whisperx[139].end |
5172.393 |
| transcript.whisperx[139].text |
這個部分其實就是跟委員剛才談報告一樣其實分局跟學校都有在聯絡那有問題的話 那個聯絡機會你聽我們在台南我已經都討論過了嘛效衡他就不願意效衡發生這個事情叫媒體報出來嘛大家都說保護核心保護核心那是騙的 那是害核心一個家長很放心的跟孩子送去學校是最安全的地方結果孩子在學校去買一個毒品 |
| transcript.whisperx[140].start |
5178.373 |
| transcript.whisperx[140].end |
5191.857 |
| transcript.whisperx[140].text |
我們不能對他交代。你的叫我的叫都有可能遇到的。合法是最安全的地方。不然這個看補費沒有討論,這個沒有突破啦。這個凍結的犯罪,尤其是青少年的凍結後變成早期的集團,會完完不斷,因為我們沒有辦法改革,有一個具體的辦法沒有。 |
| transcript.whisperx[141].start |
5203.154 |
| transcript.whisperx[141].end |
5223.8 |
| transcript.whisperx[141].text |
呃,再來跟司法院來參詳啦齁,在判我上齁,不要想再輕啦,啊,這個好好的事情齁,我們也跟教育部來聯絡啦,齁,大家共同來努力來補貨啦。您提一個案,我們提一個案啦,齁,針對好風毒品的訪地,沒有用配那個手段,我告訴你,這條我跟大廠直接給他討論過了。 |
| transcript.whisperx[142].start |
5225.834 |
| transcript.whisperx[142].end |
5237.545 |
| transcript.whisperx[142].text |
大家都很重視,但是大家如果卡到告就報告候群,報復起來,都沒有辦法,包括司法機關,包括經濟署、警察,都沒有辦法入獄。啊現在一個社會人士出來講,哦,候群組織,候群是要組織什麼?我把,孩子上來我認為最安全的地方,孩子就去罰罪了,還叫候群組織。你看多少卡到外面聽到心? |
| transcript.whisperx[143].start |
5252.403 |
| transcript.whisperx[143].end |
5274.769 |
| transcript.whisperx[143].text |
您有願意跟政府共同提出一個方案嗎?我們立法院在這裡有什麼方案可以建議不過我還是要跟行政院來統合啦跨部會的協調還是由行政部這有一個溫馨的就了解因為六年前在台南的時期覺得這很合理結果做行政議長時也是沒辦法執行現在凍算總統了 |
| transcript.whisperx[144].start |
5281.728 |
| transcript.whisperx[144].end |
5295.501 |
| transcript.whisperx[144].text |
我們沒有直接去做法律的手段就對了沒有去對抗一部分人的壓力就對了 毫無犯罪 尤其這個最大宗的毒品就對了我再跟你講 南台灣比北台灣比較嚴重南台灣比北台灣比較嚴重 啊這個黑素 黑素都沒有出來 黑素都沒有出來 |
| transcript.whisperx[145].start |
5305.196 |
| transcript.whisperx[145].end |
5311.387 |
| transcript.whisperx[145].text |
而家中審判五月十月﹐孩子送入於校園﹐以前是最安全的﹐車載到校園門口差不多就放審了﹐現在不是了聽到學校的電話的審判噼噼錯了 |
| transcript.whisperx[146].start |
5317.182 |
| transcript.whisperx[146].end |
5336.387 |
| transcript.whisperx[146].text |
否定我們共同來勞力,你看到嗎?好!你多久?多久你一個車輛出來?好啊,我跟其他的部會大家參詳嘛!三個月啦!三個月啦!不一定要那麼久啦!我們有空緩!三個月來嘛!我等幾十年也沒差,三個月來好不好? |
| transcript.whisperx[147].start |
5338.368 |
| transcript.whisperx[147].end |
5339.189 |
| transcript.whisperx[147].text |
接下來有請陳委員、俊宇發言 |
| transcript.whisperx[148].start |
5383.732 |
| transcript.whisperx[148].end |
5394.6 |
| transcript.whisperx[148].text |
好,謝謝主席。那主席請蔡部長。又請蔡部長。保證,保證。保證,我們故意列席的修訂,大家好。 |
| transcript.whisperx[149].start |
5401.328 |
| transcript.whisperx[149].end |
5412.802 |
| transcript.whisperx[149].text |
我想先請教一下我們部長針對我們這個各部會對於這個青少年的法治教育還有犯罪的防制我們都提出了許多的這個專題報告 |
| transcript.whisperx[150].start |
5414.922 |
| transcript.whisperx[150].end |
5437.647 |
| transcript.whisperx[150].text |
即便各部會都具有具體的這個政策跟措施但不可否認的事實是少年犯的這個相關問題還是存在的許多可以改善的一個空間除了犯罪人口率的這個節節上升還是持續在上升的情況之下我們要如何去防止再犯這個也是大眾所關心的 |
| transcript.whisperx[151].start |
5438.134 |
| transcript.whisperx[151].end |
5464.771 |
| transcript.whisperx[151].text |
那在這個少年事件處理法的第一條有提到說我們立法的精神是為了要保障少年健全的自我成長那調整其成長環境並矯正其這個性格所以我們期待這些少年在經過矯正感化這個教育之後都能夠回歸正途不要再犯罪但是從我們這個矯正學校的數據上來看 |
| transcript.whisperx[152].start |
5467.811 |
| transcript.whisperx[152].end |
5475.764 |
| transcript.whisperx[152].text |
這些同學除了矯正學校的第一年有一半的人數恐怕還會再犯 |
| transcript.whisperx[153].start |
5478.208 |
| transcript.whisperx[153].end |
5494.521 |
| transcript.whisperx[153].text |
有違我們矯正機關的這個功能也是社會的一大隱憂過去也曾經有這個監察委員提出青少年因為處罰進入司法體系若在矯正機構沒有獲得妥善的輔導反而接觸更多負面的人際網絡將會一再處罰形成這個旋轉門的效應陷入這個惡性循環 |
| transcript.whisperx[154].start |
5505.977 |
| transcript.whisperx[154].end |
5520.722 |
| transcript.whisperx[154].text |
我再次我想請教一下部長對於這樣的情況是因為我們感化教育的問題這個銜接輔導的機制不足還是因為我們事前防範的不夠周延所以才會導致各縣市的這個少年這個輔導會沒有實際的發揮相關的這個作用 |
| transcript.whisperx[155].start |
5525.785 |
| transcript.whisperx[155].end |
5541.386 |
| transcript.whisperx[155].text |
當然有很多委員,委員剛剛所提的幾個原因都是我們要改善,要希望能加強的,包括我們在矯正機關、矯正學校裡面的輔導還有教化工作要落實。 |
| transcript.whisperx[156].start |
5542.527 |
| transcript.whisperx[156].end |
5560.292 |
| transcript.whisperx[156].text |
來避免他未來回到學校或回到社會的時候再犯這也是我們在加強的那我們過去少年福利院改為學校化以後那確實都是用教育的方式來幫忙這些學生讓他了解說他以前所犯的那未來不要再犯 |
| transcript.whisperx[157].start |
5561.272 |
| transcript.whisperx[157].end |
5561.452 |
| transcript.whisperx[157].text |
則不足。 |
| transcript.whisperx[158].start |
5578.756 |
| transcript.whisperx[158].end |
5598.865 |
| transcript.whisperx[158].text |
部長,我們矯正署,矯正顧名思義就是要希望能夠導正他,讓他能夠錯誤的這種行為能夠回歸正常。那我也希望說因為經過這個矯正之後,如果進入社會或是未來他在任何一個職場的這個關係,應該是要能夠 |
| transcript.whisperx[159].start |
5603.339 |
| transcript.whisperx[159].end |
5603.639 |
| transcript.whisperx[159].text |
提供詳情報告． |
| transcript.whisperx[160].start |
5621.909 |
| transcript.whisperx[160].end |
5645.326 |
| transcript.whisperx[160].text |
無法達到效果。所以我還是希望說我們針對這個部分應該要再去想加這個研究看看是不是還有改善的空間。是。謝謝委員的指教。對於進入到我們矯正學校的這些同學我們會分他到底是要未來繼續就學還是要就業。我們會安排不同的課程。那如果要繼續就學的話我們會跟 |
| transcript.whisperx[161].start |
5647.767 |
| transcript.whisperx[161].end |
5647.807 |
| transcript.whisperx[161].text |
此外, |
| transcript.whisperx[162].start |
5672.95 |
| transcript.whisperx[162].end |
5700.032 |
| transcript.whisperx[162].text |
那個部長我請教就是端品中學的這個案子那因為看起來在短期間內已經發生兩次了是不是我們在管理上有什麼疏失我們也會深切檢討啦尤其跟這些學生的溝通應該要強化那因為上課那你本來就應該要遵照這個課程的安排那如果真的學生有其他意見如何的能夠 |
| transcript.whisperx[163].start |
5701.233 |
| transcript.whisperx[163].end |
5719.512 |
| transcript.whisperx[163].text |
教導或是溝通這也是很重要的啦我們也會了解那至於前一陣子發生的因為外來包工啊他違反我們校園的規定嘛那當然學生就起來做一些指責或是引起口角等等 |
| transcript.whisperx[164].start |
5720.312 |
| transcript.whisperx[164].end |
5739.489 |
| transcript.whisperx[164].text |
這個都是應該要利用事件的發生來檢討來要求學生從這個事件裡面要體會到要什麼樣守法律規定要遵守紀律以兩次的連續發生的情況來看我還是要建議我們 |
| transcript.whisperx[165].start |
5741.977 |
| transcript.whisperx[165].end |
5757.645 |
| transcript.whisperx[165].text |
法務部這邊對於這個端品中學的相關管理應該是要深切的去檢討如果有任何的瑕疵應該要趕快來導正避免這個相關的事情再發生因為畢竟在那個環境裡面我們只是希望說讓他們能夠在裡面學到正能量 |
| transcript.whisperx[166].start |
5758.385 |
| transcript.whisperx[166].end |
5783.882 |
| transcript.whisperx[166].text |
那你在裡面還能夠資深事情的話或許在整個過程裡面我們要輔導他們的這個作用就沒辦法發揮了這部分還是請我們部長這部分再交辦我們所有相關的部會針對這部分應該要去做這個適當的去做更好的關心是謝謝委員指教那另外就是這個借選的部分借選 |
| transcript.whisperx[167].start |
5785.168 |
| transcript.whisperx[167].end |
5814.001 |
| transcript.whisperx[167].text |
我想請教就是說我在這個我們法務部的解凍報告裡面有談到就是說有關選舉期間介入選舉的部分不管是會選或是這個選舉賭盤都會對選舉結果有直接的影響那從我們這一份資料的表格上來看近幾年這個會選案件的獎金合法情況似乎這個件數跟金額都下降了那我想請教部長這是因為我們執行的成效不佳還是因為會選的情況真的有減少了 |
| transcript.whisperx[168].start |
5815.697 |
| transcript.whisperx[168].end |
5835.028 |
| transcript.whisperx[168].text |
合法的金額我的理解並沒有下降我們還是鼓勵檢舉該發的獎金我們都要盡快的來發放但是也許因為預算的限制今年度的預算不夠可能會跨年度才發有點耽擱但是基本上看起來 |
| transcript.whisperx[169].start |
5836.749 |
| transcript.whisperx[169].end |
5839.691 |
| transcript.whisperx[169].text |
我還是建議我們法務部對於查查會選一定要落實去執行因為選舉我們應該最痛惡的就是這種會選的情況 |
| transcript.whisperx[170].start |
5862.89 |
| transcript.whisperx[170].end |
5871.456 |
| transcript.whisperx[170].text |
因為用會選的方式所導致的選舉結果常常是會讓這個真的要服務的人員服務的這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[171].start |
5874.164 |
| transcript.whisperx[171].end |
5897.17 |
| transcript.whisperx[171].text |
為民眾獲得候選人無法達成理想的方式所以查查會選我還是請我們法務部要積極的去查辦那對於說我們現在看起來這個賭盤的部分我們在選舉期間不管是這個新聞媒體還是網路上討論或多或少都有看到這個選舉賭盤的情況那我們現在檢舉的獎金也提高到500萬了那有罰 |
| transcript.whisperx[172].start |
5902.679 |
| transcript.whisperx[172].end |
5917.606 |
| transcript.whisperx[172].text |
有法則那這個獎金也提高了有沒有真正的嚇阻到這個開盤的莊家那在剛結束的2024的大選中有沒有比較大的案件還是這個事務上的經驗開罰的金額方面這方面的這個賭盤有沒有相關的這個資料 |
| transcript.whisperx[173].start |
5922.116 |
| transcript.whisperx[173].end |
5940.896 |
| transcript.whisperx[173].text |
有我們這一次在選舉查查也特別把賭盤借選列為一個重點所以在總長的指揮之下各地的地檢署都非常的賣力查查這個賭盤不管是大盤小盤我們都是向上溯源希望能夠真正能夠來查緝 |
| transcript.whisperx[174].start |
5942.759 |
| transcript.whisperx[174].end |
5959.408 |
| transcript.whisperx[174].text |
好那另外我們這個基層地方組織的部分齁那個被中國邀請去參訪那在去年選舉期間各地都有傳出相關的這種團體接受中國安排代團到中國去旅遊或這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[175].start |
5961.906 |
| transcript.whisperx[175].end |
5966.691 |
| transcript.whisperx[175].text |
在非選舉期間中國也會利用這樣的方式來滲入我們台灣的這個選舉有沒有可能? |
| transcript.whisperx[176].start |
5982.617 |
| transcript.whisperx[176].end |
6001.018 |
| transcript.whisperx[176].text |
中國是無孔不入啦希望要影響我們的選舉但是我們要加以防範所以這一次啊對於這個有到大陸去到中國去那邊接受招待的那跟選舉有沒有關係我們都會深入的去了解但是經過我們很努力的去查辦的話 |
| transcript.whisperx[177].start |
6002.339 |
| transcript.whisperx[177].end |
6024.038 |
| transcript.whisperx[177].text |
是有惡主效果啦大家有些本來打算要去的後來發現我們都很積極的在偵辦啦很多都撤團了就不去了所以這也是有發生惡主的效果啦好那這部分也是請我們法務部應該要積極的查辦啦避免相關的情勢再發生啦好以上謝謝好謝謝陳委員謝謝部長接下來有請莊委員瑞選法諮詢 |
| transcript.whisperx[178].start |
6040.428 |
| transcript.whisperx[178].end |
6050.108 |
| transcript.whisperx[178].text |
謝謝主席,有請我們法務部蔡部長,還有我們總長,還有我們刑事警察局局長有請蔡部長、檢察總長及周局長 |
| transcript.whisperx[179].start |
6053.285 |
| transcript.whisperx[179].end |
6079.773 |
| transcript.whisperx[179].text |
部長請教就是上個月這個228紀念日裡面同時也是我們民主進步黨前主席林奕雄家宅一個血案屆滿的44週年我看這個歷史我就不贅述了但是在監察院在上週四裡面也發出新聞稿來指出說去年的2月21號審議通過的林宅血案的一個結案的一個報告裡面據說 |
| transcript.whisperx[180].start |
6081.113 |
| transcript.whisperx[180].end |
6104.6 |
| transcript.whisperx[180].text |
警總是這一次情緒系統介入司法偵查、誤導方向、阻撓偵辦、操弄媒體、包庇嫌犯、運用黑道等6項的重大為師也提出了5項應該繼續追查的事項並且糾正了行政院也含請國安會督導國安局去檢討改善除了這個以外 |
| transcript.whisperx[181].start |
6105.404 |
| transcript.whisperx[181].end |
6132.169 |
| transcript.whisperx[181].text |
他也特別去提到所以已經喊請我們法務部研議籌組專案小組來重啟調查林宅的一個血案那從監察院發案到現在也經歷了一個多月本席上就叫部長或者兩位就是說對於籌組專案小組的意見怎麼樣然後這個進度到底會如何我們都清楚時間真的是非常久遠也非常的一個困難增加了破案的一個 |
| transcript.whisperx[182].start |
6132.689 |
| transcript.whisperx[182].end |
6133.949 |
| transcript.whisperx[182].text |
任何事項都必須通知法務部及法律部長。 |
| transcript.whisperx[183].start |
6158.207 |
| transcript.whisperx[183].end |
6176.765 |
| transcript.whisperx[183].text |
對於這個個案我們還在偵查當中地檢署這個案子並沒有整個完全結束有任何的資訊或是有線索他們都還在持續的在偵查當中所以這個案子還是在有效的在努力的在查證部長可以理解 |
| transcript.whisperx[184].start |
6178.024 |
| transcript.whisperx[184].end |
6188.477 |
| transcript.whisperx[184].text |
你的立場一定會這樣講但是我的意思就是說這個案子經歷過了這麼長的一個時間如果我們政府單位都只是去講說我們都持續在偵辦的定義 |
| transcript.whisperx[185].start |
6191.899 |
| transcript.whisperx[185].end |
6212.226 |
| transcript.whisperx[185].text |
偵查當然是不公開但重點是說就像我們偵查不公開我們例外規定社會重大矚目的一個案件這個就標準的社會重大矚目幾十年的一個懸案總是其實要讓社會多一點點的資訊也合理啦不能說你們一直持續在偵辦你覺得呢 |
| transcript.whisperx[186].start |
6214.774 |
| transcript.whisperx[186].end |
6219.098 |
| transcript.whisperx[186].text |
是,那給社會的一點點的一個交代社會大眾關心很合理喔很合理喔像這種重大案件社會關心很合理喔 |
| transcript.whisperx[187].start |
6241.434 |
| transcript.whisperx[187].end |
6269.57 |
| transcript.whisperx[187].text |
不然要做監護的大家都說有在辦有在辦你不可以說偵查不公開這也不對我認為這也不對那另外就是說社會上現在在矚目的就今天我們看到那個敦平這整個這個在監獄裡面發生的這樣的一個案件大家也矚目所以我是非常感慨矯正學校裡面的教化的功能到底要發揮到什麼樣的一個程度那以目前台灣我們是一次總長請回 |
| transcript.whisperx[188].start |
6270.771 |
| transcript.whisperx[188].end |
6290.416 |
| transcript.whisperx[188].text |
就是說四所矯正學校裡面有三所是施行感化教育跟收容教青犯罪的一個桃園的一個端品中學新竹城鎮還有彰化的一個麗智另外第四所就是說比較重型的那昨天這個是收容比較輕型的嘛這個我就特別來做大意見就是說 |
| transcript.whisperx[189].start |
6292.516 |
| transcript.whisperx[189].end |
6303.824 |
| transcript.whisperx[189].text |
這個有時候最新本行在5年以下受裁定3年的感化教育這個部分我相信那個邢志勤邢大局局長你這個應該很有經驗對那個很兇的你很厲害啦對這個小孩子你就沒辦法了啦大家都說要 |
| transcript.whisperx[190].start |
6310.475 |
| transcript.whisperx[190].end |
6334.74 |
| transcript.whisperx[190].text |
要改改化改改化可是呢本席都一直認為說你近10年來不管是觸犯少年或者說曝險少年的教育程度上來看人數高中職異業最多佔5成國中異業次之畢業最少這個表示什麼呢在我們矯正學校裡面都已完成12年國民教育跟108年的新課綱 |
| transcript.whisperx[191].start |
6336.44 |
| transcript.whisperx[191].end |
6353.692 |
| transcript.whisperx[191].text |
那這一些學生原來在學校裡面其實都已經受過這些教育了你不要把這一群人全部都放在那裡不然我保證你不可以管 矯正主事長你也很難管這差不多叫周偉偉局長你去 你就比較好管但是現行的法律局你又不可以像以前那樣放下了你又不可以再牽 又不可以再講 還要對他要付出愛心我們以前說的說這硬爆先拿掉 這個對這麼小的要感化 |
| transcript.whisperx[192].start |
6366.235 |
| transcript.whisperx[192].end |
6385.616 |
| transcript.whisperx[192].text |
來再教育但是我問的是說我們他你再給他同樣的課程你真的有辦法達到他矯正的一個教育的一個效果嗎這第一個問題第二個問題說你說近5年來你說新入校的學生犯罪列別已經從過去毒品啊竊盜啊轉為詐欺又變罪大宗 |
| transcript.whisperx[193].start |
6390.199 |
| transcript.whisperx[193].end |
6403.653 |
| transcript.whisperx[193].text |
我們這幾個假設我們全部我們在這個委員會裡面的我們都已經不是什麼什麼什麼以前是重大犯罪的都已經轉成這種詐欺犯的我們每天你叫我們在台前一定大家一定開始在那切磋啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[194].start |
6404.42 |
| transcript.whisperx[194].end |
6421.617 |
| transcript.whisperx[194].text |
切磋高尾啊,出來後大家都變詐欺技術精進的一個大會。你說,別說越關越大尾啊,功夫越精進啊,會不會達到他真正假裝的效果?那個,那個署長,署長,署長,來,看你,問你一下。總會有一定,總會有一定拍攝講的,你給他加一點工夫啦。 |
| transcript.whisperx[195].start |
6423.77 |
| transcript.whisperx[195].end |
6445.275 |
| transcript.whisperx[195].text |
跟委員報告,針對少年矯正學校我們會強化個別化的處意,因為每個少年他背後的故事都不一樣,個別化的處意。包括說三所少年矯正學校當是技術型的高中,剛剛我們部長也有提到以他的意願來加強他的考證照 |
| transcript.whisperx[196].start |
6446.215 |
| transcript.whisperx[196].end |
6456.032 |
| transcript.whisperx[196].text |
還有一些職業訓練他要就學的話那我們也會跟當地的教育主管機關等他出校的時候加強轉型我不相信 |
| transcript.whisperx[197].start |
6458.151 |
| transcript.whisperx[197].end |
6478.878 |
| transcript.whisperx[197].text |
部長 我覺得這件事我沒有什麼相信我們那個地方真的變成去到那裡我們矯正學校我們全部都在社會裡面是一群最有愛心的人在那裡在趕這個青少年我不是否定我們在整個矯正學校裡面這個機關裡面這些人的付出啦人總是這樣啦剛才比較正常的你就總是 |
| transcript.whisperx[198].start |
6482.919 |
| transcript.whisperx[198].end |
6504.074 |
| transcript.whisperx[198].text |
處理會不一樣,總是那個地方進去以後你說他沒有被標籤化,我也不相信。但怎麼樣去拿捏,我講的是說怎麼樣去拿捏,可以避免像這種狀況。這禮拜年喔,寮部去,會給你妹妹而已啊。妹妹你若不聽啊,要是我輸電話走、補電話走,我也不知道要怎麼辦。去高雄,下次如果再發生呢? |
| transcript.whisperx[199].start |
6504.744 |
| transcript.whisperx[199].end |
6517.636 |
| transcript.whisperx[199].text |
你說會不會再發生?很有可能啊,不就很有可能啊。但如何去想一個辦法,也不要只因為說他是青少年,所以每天都要照顧他,要不然不是體育時間我就要打籃球,要不然我要替他暴動。今天他如果跟你說吃飯時間,他如果跟你說我沒出來散步一下不行,我也要替你暴動,要替你暴動理由就一堆了。 |
| transcript.whisperx[200].start |
6529.943 |
| transcript.whisperx[200].end |
6557.989 |
| transcript.whisperx[200].text |
有更好的方法嗎?不是向你們求責啦就是說總是要有一個辦法說看這個監獄裡面這個監獄、廚藥裡面八八款嘛,你們是專家嘛但是這個砰一聲出來之後社會其實是矚目啦他也未必會譴責你們啦,說實在話啦這這這這普通的這個最恐怖的什麼的這個譴責矯正機關、譴責法務部我的想法倒不會是如此但只是說如何去精進,這總是要有,確實要有一個做法出來喔這普通的我理解看法是什麼 |
| transcript.whisperx[201].start |
6559.909 |
| transcript.whisperx[201].end |
6560.75 |
| transcript.whisperx[201].text |
你說他學生也不對 |
| transcript.whisperx[202].start |
6587.432 |
| transcript.whisperx[202].end |
6589.033 |
| transcript.whisperx[202].text |
他也不是單純的學生他那個到那個地方喔在那受矯正教育你說他單純你說要把他有愛心把他當成學生來教導感化這個我接受那都期待讓他趕快回歸到這個社會可是你說只有去那裡嘖也不會這樣 |
| transcript.whisperx[203].start |
6609.776 |
| transcript.whisperx[203].end |
6617.385 |
| transcript.whisperx[203].text |
否則法務也不會這樣你說那國中、高中他也不會說最久最晚一半說不讓我出去學校給你暴動佔據校長室也不會這樣 |
| transcript.whisperx[204].start |
6620.475 |
| transcript.whisperx[204].end |
6642.86 |
| transcript.whisperx[204].text |
因為這些學生都是少年法庭的法官他所判決、教育、這個感化教育的嘛所以他們可能對這個比較特別的想法啦今天有廳長在下不來請教他看有沒有什麼方法好嗎這個再想一下啦三位請問我請我們今天教育部好像也有來嘛教育部我們的師長師長不好意思師長起來一下我快速 |
| transcript.whisperx[205].start |
6645.2 |
| transcript.whisperx[205].end |
6648.341 |
| transcript.whisperx[205].text |
三位法務系統請回,部長及局長請回。我想請教司長,台北市某公立學校霸凌事件有一件持續兩年,受霸凌者三人成立調查委員會,從該小學去調查。 |
| transcript.whisperx[206].start |
6663.886 |
| transcript.whisperx[206].end |
6679.664 |
| transcript.whisperx[206].text |
倒覺得離譜的結果我們也從媒體看到了這是疑似霸凌者啊那變成被推舉變成一個模範生那以至於校方在調查霸凌事件的時候是不是會秉公處理啊就變成說遭受霸凌者家屬的一個質疑啦那透過本案啦 |
| transcript.whisperx[207].start |
6681.126 |
| transcript.whisperx[207].end |
6696.081 |
| transcript.whisperx[207].text |
呃本期想要請教就是說我們現行校園的霸凌的防制準則裡面主要是因應小組都是校長副校長你這招召集人成員是教師代表沒有明定參與人的人數的比例這個師長你有感覺這有什麼要改進的所在嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[208].start |
6696.856 |
| transcript.whisperx[208].end |
6717.45 |
| transcript.whisperx[208].text |
先說明因為在過去處理的過程當中比較著重在參與的部分所以可能也會有包括老師、家長代表都會有但是確實過去沒有明定人數那很大一個問題是因為他這個準則要從國小、國中、高中到大學所以那個不同教育階段還有學校規模差一代太大 |
| transcript.whisperx[209].start |
6718.05 |
| transcript.whisperx[209].end |
6734.65 |
| transcript.whisperx[209].text |
也怕明定的話將來在小型學院運作上是不是會有困難那這個議題我們有發現了所以這一次在檢討準則修訂的時候已經有把人員人數有明定應該補正就把它補正了我相信外界要看的就是說你這個程序到底 |
| transcript.whisperx[210].start |
6735.211 |
| transcript.whisperx[210].end |
6761.529 |
| transcript.whisperx[210].text |
有沒有公平：是然後呢你選的這個人到底有沒有受到信任：是這個才是重點：是阿不然你這個社會會發燃阿什麼霸凌者到要你把他弄成模範生這個也看起來也好奇怪：是那再來就是說這些疑慮你除了要去把他化解以外阿你調查程序你說4個月申復一個個月然後申復審議又一個月一個程序你完成至少然後半年起跳那些學生就被抓起來了 |
| transcript.whisperx[211].start |
6764.491 |
| transcript.whisperx[211].end |
6783.004 |
| transcript.whisperx[211].text |
這也好怪所以本席認為調查程序公正跟廢死這樣的一個狀況如何去做一個改善那你在整個現前校園霸凌因應小組的一個成員的一個選定上增加學者專家代表或輔導人員的一個代表這個部分那我相信人數的部分應該 |
| transcript.whisperx[212].start |
6785.286 |
| transcript.whisperx[212].end |
6800.919 |
| transcript.whisperx[212].text |
已經查明訂的方式在處理應該趕快去把它做一個讓它更完善那你讓調查的成員的校內跟校外這兩個有一定的一個比例你才可以降低這個未來的整個霸凌事件雙方家屬這樣的一個疑慮 |
| transcript.whisperx[213].start |
6801.599 |
| transcript.whisperx[213].end |
6819.145 |
| transcript.whisperx[213].text |
是那也會減少後續的身負審議這行政成本你都可以減少是你調查成績可以順利這個才有一個叫做社會的公道是不完整的地方我們盡速把它做一個補正好不好是謝謝委員指教謝謝市長謝謝莊委員接下來請羅委員志強質詢 |
| transcript.whisperx[214].start |
6834.591 |
| transcript.whisperx[214].end |
6842.829 |
| transcript.whisperx[214].text |
主席有請部長、檢察總長、矯正署署長以及刑事警察局局長。好,請點到名的各位首長請就備詢台。 |
| transcript.whisperx[215].start |
6848.803 |
| transcript.whisperx[215].end |
6876.838 |
| transcript.whisperx[215].text |
部長好委員長在談我們今天的報告之前我想還是要關切一下目前一個重大的一個食安事件就是這個保齡茶室這個食品中毒案那我也要反映我們選區的選民就我有選民來跟我反映說事實上他在信義區逛的時候這個因為他是素食者所以基本上素食餐廳的選項向來是比較少一些 |
| transcript.whisperx[216].start |
6877.558 |
| transcript.whisperx[216].end |
6894.607 |
| transcript.whisperx[216].text |
所以他如果到信義區那邊去逛的時候他常常就是到A13的寶林茶室去用餐所以目前其實民眾非常擔心也非常關心就是說到底這個目前產生這個中毒案是基於什麼原因 |
| transcript.whisperx[217].start |
6895.928 |
| transcript.whisperx[217].end |
6921.98 |
| transcript.whisperx[217].text |
我看到大概是兩個方向嘛一個就是說衛福部目前我們的衛福部的推測是認為是米酵菌栓中毒的可能性比較高但我也看到有一些討論是講說有沒有千面人下毒的可能性那這一點我想現在全國民眾都非常關切我想了解一下法務部檢查機關目前對於這個案件目前的作為到什麼程度呢 |
| transcript.whisperx[218].start |
6923.549 |
| transcript.whisperx[218].end |
6938.37 |
| transcript.whisperx[218].text |
發生死亡結果以後我們就立即相驗初步相驗完畢今天上午兩位死者我們都解剖要查明死因那這個法醫研究所也派法醫去大概預估什麼時候會有結果出來 |
| transcript.whisperx[219].start |
6939.385 |
| transcript.whisperx[219].end |
6967.071 |
| transcript.whisperx[219].text |
會盡快因為今天解剖完了以後會一般一般像我們這樣這種情況他們會加班處理大概大概有而且要配合這些藥物的檢驗機構專家大家來判定所以我想會有最快的速度好那希望能夠盡快因為原因查清楚我們才知道他影響範圍嘛就追溯過去嘛所以這部分真的也是代表我們的這個民眾以及包括我自己選區的選民 |
| transcript.whisperx[220].start |
6968.671 |
| transcript.whisperx[220].end |
6993.573 |
| transcript.whisperx[220].text |
也拜託檢察機關及中央及地方衛生單位一起攜手努力因為很多人在擔心是不是這個中毒不是只有保齡茶室而已很多人擔心這個問題如果說我們不能夠確定是食品中毒還是千面人下毒或是食品中毒是什麼樣太陽的話我們就很難去溯源或是去追查到底它的影響範圍多大這一點你認同嗎 對不對 |
| transcript.whisperx[221].start |
6995.134 |
| transcript.whisperx[221].end |
7007.6 |
| transcript.whisperx[221].text |
是我們一定會全力而且盡快查明這速度真的要快因為真的我覺得也拖不得好那我想再請教一下我們那個部長我們這個你知道明天什麼節日嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[222].start |
7013.759 |
| transcript.whisperx[222].end |
7026.987 |
| transcript.whisperx[222].text |
講經國先生曾說要幫助青年從德業上立志、學術上增盛、事業上成功,使每一個青年都能在公平的立足點上能創造、能發展。你認同這樣的說法嗎? |
| transcript.whisperx[223].start |
7028.001 |
| transcript.whisperx[223].end |
7054.845 |
| transcript.whisperx[223].text |
我們非常重視青年不管是教育或是就業我想這都是政府應該要努力的可是很不幸的實際上我要問一下我們的局長我們的周局長你知道我從本席從刑事局歷年的統計來看近5年的少年嫌疑犯人數又有逐年攀升的現象局長可以告訴我為什麼嗎近5年 |
| transcript.whisperx[224].start |
7056.988 |
| transcript.whisperx[224].end |
7081.826 |
| transcript.whisperx[224].text |
這個最重要增加的就是因為這個詐騙的案件車手的這個答對了是還有很多的是因為這個三四級毒品這個施用者也有這個增加對我看到的數字就是說青少年的這個詐欺的數字成長非常可怕了非常巨大20而且是在2023年達於新高是從 |
| transcript.whisperx[225].start |
7084.87 |
| transcript.whisperx[225].end |
7093.327 |
| transcript.whisperx[225].text |
662件那一直升高到2193件那這個詐欺的青少年的涉案的狀況為什麼會有這樣的一個情況 |
| transcript.whisperx[226].start |
7095.141 |
| transcript.whisperx[226].end |
7122.844 |
| transcript.whisperx[226].text |
最重要他們就是參與這個詐騙集團的車手的這個狀況那因為車手目前來講是我們有權利在查緝那所以只要是有在跟詐騙集團被利用來當車手的部分我們都會全力來查那查到的話所以他的數據會變高因為我為了要追查下一手的這個車手所以我們會對這個部分會特別盡力來查緝所以這個車手的數量 |
| transcript.whisperx[227].start |
7123.504 |
| transcript.whisperx[227].end |
7153.067 |
| transcript.whisperx[227].text |
可能會有增加因為這少年又因為他有免責的其實我常常聽到就我們的打在國家隊都說啊詐欺案件為什麼高是因為我們查器很努力嗎你認為是這個原因嗎那這個也不見得因為網路的發達是很多但是這個人數的部分特首確實是因為我覺得局長的態度就很好啊你也覺得不見得不純粹的我們不只詐騙案件變多詐騙的金額也是不斷的創下新高而且事實上我就看過一個民調嘛 |
| transcript.whisperx[228].start |
7153.387 |
| transcript.whisperx[228].end |
7166.746 |
| transcript.whisperx[228].text |
就是96%的人都接過詐騙訊息各種各樣詐騙訊息臺灣人啦我不知道局長你自己有沒有接過我自己當時真的沒接過哇那您厲害您是那96%的你沒有看過詐騙的那個臉書廣告 |
| transcript.whisperx[229].start |
7169.289 |
| transcript.whisperx[229].end |
7194.322 |
| transcript.whisperx[229].text |
有沒有看過詐騙的那個LINE訊息或是簡訊我講詐騙訊息啦對嘛你也有嘛所以現在詐騙正以普遍氾濫到說真的不是誰看過問題而是我們多久會看到一次的問題吧像我覺得我自己喔我自己幾乎每個月每半個月大概就要受一個很大的困擾你知道是什麼嗎每半個月我都要做一件事情你知道是什麼嗎局長 |
| transcript.whisperx[230].start |
7196.243 |
| transcript.whisperx[230].end |
7224.136 |
| transcript.whisperx[230].text |
我要去檢舉去下架想辦法下架冒我的名來詐騙的粉專阿真是層出不窮所以現在的詐騙的狀況非常嚴重那我接下來想請教您喔你聽聽看這故事勵不勵志有一個26歲的黑手從很年輕的時候從學徒做起基層做起到26歲的時候就開創了自己的工作室招募學徒你覺得像這樣的故事勵不勵志 |
| transcript.whisperx[231].start |
7225.771 |
| transcript.whisperx[231].end |
7227.836 |
| transcript.whisperx[231].text |
當然滿勵志的嘛齁可是我跟你講齁當你把這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[232].start |
7230.506 |
| transcript.whisperx[232].end |
7255.18 |
| transcript.whisperx[232].text |
黑手把他改變成車手,你覺得還是個勵志的故事嗎?當然不是。抱歉,就現實發生啊。我們就看到一個案子啊,對不對,前兩天發生的啊。有一個26歲的車手升級當老闆,因為他從青少年的時候就開始有很多的一些案件嘛。然後他招募青少年組織詐騙車手集團犯案。 |
| transcript.whisperx[233].start |
7259.122 |
| transcript.whisperx[233].end |
7275.002 |
| transcript.whisperx[233].text |
然後就變成自己當老闆了這顯示一件很嚴重的問題說這一個所謂的車手升格成詐騙集團的重要幹部甚至首腦他是經過一個犯罪養成過程對不對 |
| transcript.whisperx[234].start |
7277.573 |
| transcript.whisperx[234].end |
7302.617 |
| transcript.whisperx[234].text |
對於這個部分就是因為我們會對這些在犯的這些人我們有次會重複查緝會對他們的部分我覺得我們的做法端跟所謂的程度端都真的要加強否則我現在都詐騙集團都要變成國民教育的一環了你知道嗎以照目前看到的數字那嚴重程度是觸目驚心我相信局長你應該也有感吧 |
| transcript.whisperx[235].start |
7304.111 |
| transcript.whisperx[235].end |
7329.087 |
| transcript.whisperx[235].text |
報告委員這部分確實有但是剛剛講說有冒名的部分其實我們去年就到現在已經有下架因為時間因素我想要請部長幫我一個忙就是我們對於這類型青少年犯罪再犯的比例有多高有沒有去追蹤你會後用書面的方式來提供我們辦公室來追蹤好不好就再犯率的部分那另外就是說 |
| transcript.whisperx[236].start |
7330.356 |
| transcript.whisperx[236].end |
7353.022 |
| transcript.whisperx[236].text |
我們看到少年詐欺犯逐年增加變成治安的隱憂那全國已經進入法院審理的青少年詐騙人數2017年首度超過1萬人到2019到2022年也都還在9000人以上那這些其實都跟我們現在真的詐騙那種橫行的環境有很大的關係 對不對 |
| transcript.whisperx[237].start |
7355.435 |
| transcript.whisperx[237].end |
7380.733 |
| transcript.whisperx[237].text |
對而且我跟部長講還有一點啦現在年輕人真的謀之不利然後他們在又受到這個詐騙集團的詐騙跟誘惑就變得相對又更大所以這變成某種惡性循環才會導致我們今天這個青少年的詐騙的問題越來越嚴重那接下來我要請教我們的那個署長我們的矯正署署長 |
| transcript.whisperx[238].start |
7381.954 |
| transcript.whisperx[238].end |
7406.274 |
| transcript.whisperx[238].text |
那我想請問你為什麼端品中學內會發生這個學生的那個暴動呢?或是他學生的集體的那個事件呢?跟委員報告主要是因為在自習課的時候那學生想到外面去打籃球那因為這個原因造成一些騷動說是無法打籃球 |
| transcript.whisperx[239].start |
7408.223 |
| transcript.whisperx[239].end |
7411.377 |
| transcript.whisperx[239].text |
但是媒體報導說3個小時才將事件平息是這樣嗎? |
| transcript.whisperx[240].start |
7413.038 |
| transcript.whisperx[240].end |
7439.513 |
| transcript.whisperx[240].text |
花了多久把事件平息?平息時間是大概到昨天的下午5點40分差不多大概就3個小時對為什麼花這麼長的時間?報告委員這個時間應該是不算長因為我們要依照一定的SOP然後啟動區域聯防那我們也順利的把這個事件平息署長我問齁你覺得單純是因為無法打籃球而集體滋擾嗎? |
| transcript.whisperx[241].start |
7442.4 |
| transcript.whisperx[241].end |
7470.82 |
| transcript.whisperx[241].text |
我跟委員報告我們有去瞭解出了請端品做檢討報告我們也是覺得其中一個重要原因是因為端品中學的教導員的預算嚴格是27名近兩年來他們新進人員有13名所以一些教導員的新進技術在管教技巧上有待加強這個部分我們會透過在職教育以及常年教育來做加強 |
| transcript.whisperx[242].start |
7471.52 |
| transcript.whisperx[242].end |
7495.243 |
| transcript.whisperx[242].text |
我覺得很好我覺得我們的署長就從內部檢討做起就是我們自己內部的管理也是有一些問題那最後我要講我們每年將近有一萬名的少年嫌疑犯人數很多還是進到矯正體系裡面所以就像本席說的我們還是矯正機關的角色非常重要希望署長好好的努力那像這種事件 |
| transcript.whisperx[243].start |
7496.104 |
| transcript.whisperx[243].end |
7511.564 |
| transcript.whisperx[243].text |
要重新要好好檢討到底為什麼發生這個事件除了矯正人員工作人員的一個狀況以外那到底青少年的狀況是如何以上謝謝好謝謝羅志強羅委員接下來我們請林思明委員質詢 |
| transcript.whisperx[244].start |
7521.198 |
| transcript.whisperx[244].end |
7533.755 |
| transcript.whisperx[244].text |
好謝謝主席主席請我們教育部齁這個學特斯市長請教育部好市長好我想市長 |
| transcript.whisperx[245].start |
7535.089 |
| transcript.whisperx[245].end |
7560.324 |
| transcript.whisperx[245].text |
青少年犯罪事件我們想層出不窮從我們警政署刑事警察局的統計資料來看一百一十二年的少年犯人口為一百一十七萬少年人口為一百一十七萬四千五百一十八人少年嫌疑犯就有一萬七百九十人少年的犯罪人口率 |
| transcript.whisperx[246].start |
7561.464 |
| transcript.whisperx[246].end |
7583.785 |
| transcript.whisperx[246].text |
等於說每10萬人口就有921人所以青少年犯罪這個面向我們似乎不是單純的要從形式的角度來思考也要從整體的社會政策來思考每個人的人格的一個養成我想學校家庭還有社會都是環環相扣的 |
| transcript.whisperx[247].start |
7584.733 |
| transcript.whisperx[247].end |
7597.53 |
| transcript.whisperx[247].text |
那麼從學歷前教育到18歲以前每天都是在學校裡的時間佔比最大那也更凸顯說我們學校教育的重要性師長你同意嗎?同意 |
| transcript.whisperx[248].start |
7599.346 |
| transcript.whisperx[248].end |
7627.865 |
| transcript.whisperx[248].text |
那我想少年刑犯就是12歲到18歲那這個時期也是我們孩子的青春期生理的成長變化這個最大也影響了他的一個心理的一個狀態所以稍微有些不良的誘因就容易造成他行為的偏差所以對於這種少年犯罪我想剛才羅志強委員也講逐年在增加那我想我們教育部 |
| transcript.whisperx[249].start |
7629.718 |
| transcript.whisperx[249].end |
7648.399 |
| transcript.whisperx[249].text |
對於專報裏面當然你有做很詳細的說明但是我看到你的書面報告大部分都是偏重在這個我們的法治教育都是偏重在人權公民勞動性平以及強化學生民主法治的觀念素養 |
| transcript.whisperx[250].start |
7649.58 |
| transcript.whisperx[250].end |
7664.482 |
| transcript.whisperx[250].text |
但是對於我們現在我們食物上我們社會上我們少年犯最高的幾種犯罪類型比如說竊盜該提到的詐欺毒品還有這些傷害的等等事件 |
| transcript.whisperx[251].start |
7665.994 |
| transcript.whisperx[251].end |
7692.009 |
| transcript.whisperx[251].text |
這些孩子常常會面臨到在校園裡面遇到很多同儕之間對他做這些行為也是我們最頭痛的這些行為那我看到整個專報裡面對於這會面臨什麼樣的一個法律制裁會有什麼樣的法律責任那如何去避免都沒有列為教材那您認為孩子是否缺乏這方面的一個法治教育 |
| transcript.whisperx[252].start |
7694.735 |
| transcript.whisperx[252].end |
7709.46 |
| transcript.whisperx[252].text |
法治教育其實不是單獨存在的在我們目前中小學的課程當中還會有品德教育會有生命教育他會從價值觀念的是非善惡 |
| transcript.whisperx[253].start |
7710.72 |
| transcript.whisperx[253].end |
7729.464 |
| transcript.whisperx[253].text |
所以你的意思是說你的素養教育是遍佈在各種類科裡面,你們教育部常講的,是不是?應該是整合在課程實施裡面。就整合在整個很多的課程裡面吧,並沒有一個專門的課程來去提升孩子的整個素養教育嗎? |
| transcript.whisperx[254].start |
7729.744 |
| transcript.whisperx[254].end |
7748.466 |
| transcript.whisperx[254].text |
在單純就法律的這一個部分,法治教育的部分,可能重點會放在兩個領域課程,一個是在社會領域裡面,一個是在綜合活動領域裡面。所以並沒有把我剛才講的實務上常發生的這幾種犯罪的類型,你們把它編入在教材裡面嗎? |
| transcript.whisperx[255].start |
7749.087 |
| transcript.whisperx[255].end |
7754.272 |
| transcript.whisperx[255].text |
所以這樣聽來啦你們是認為說這些犯罪我們書上常看到的這些犯罪類型在校園裡面孩子常發生的這些犯罪是我們警察或者法務部的責任喔不是 |
| transcript.whisperx[256].start |
7772.248 |
| transcript.whisperx[256].end |
7792.823 |
| transcript.whisperx[256].text |
我們會因應時事因應法令的變遷在課程教材不足的部分會透過教育訓導的方式所以部長我要建議你們是你看這種犯罪類型每年都在攀升逐年攀升不會斷啦是因為我想我們司法是最後的一個審判的一個手段是 |
| transcript.whisperx[257].start |
7793.664 |
| transcript.whisperx[257].end |
7816.201 |
| transcript.whisperx[257].text |
所以我自己是法律人我也很不贊成說什麼都丟給這個甲官丟給司法院去做最終的一個制裁我們前端就要做好啊所以我看到你的整篇報道裡面對於這些我們常看到的刑事的犯罪類型你有做這方面的法治的教育嗎那你講的都是人權啦民主啦 |
| transcript.whisperx[258].start |
7816.781 |
| transcript.whisperx[258].end |
7834.924 |
| transcript.whisperx[258].text |
委員真的剛才您談到包括了詐騙的案件的部分對啊其實我們跟警政署跟法務部其實都有收集到這些犯罪的形態跟樣態我們也製作懶人包製作短影影音等等會提供給學校在教學上可以運用有做啦有好我是覺得要再加強是 |
| transcript.whisperx[259].start |
7836.165 |
| transcript.whisperx[259].end |
7863.684 |
| transcript.whisperx[259].text |
我再問你 我想我們最近也發生很多校園在校園裏面在課堂教室裏面毆打老師學生毆打老師還有學生被霸凌也被毆打兩個打一個這些事件但是我在流傳的影片當中我看不到說有任何人去制止這件事情甚至也沒有看到我們的老師出面 |
| transcript.whisperx[260].start |
7865.185 |
| transcript.whisperx[260].end |
7882.113 |
| transcript.whisperx[260].text |
請問面臨這種事情那我們在校園裡面發生這種事情難道我們的師長我們的教官都沒有一個通報的機制嗎我看到孩子們都坐在那邊沒有人要管啊還拿著手機在錄沒有人去救他 |
| transcript.whisperx[261].start |
7883.291 |
| transcript.whisperx[261].end |
7903.565 |
| transcript.whisperx[261].text |
到底這個好像如何來這個遏止的即時上不要繼續再打下去啊是跟委員報告其實這個在發生狀況的現在學校的學班級的幹部應該可以立刻跟隔壁班老師說或者立刻跟學務處桌通報其實是有的只是畫面上看不到有嗎有有有有有有 |
| transcript.whisperx[262].start |
7904.426 |
| transcript.whisperx[262].end |
7932.594 |
| transcript.whisperx[262].text |
好那你們如果說是當然你們要有一個通報機制啦那你該說有那你實際上有沒有任何的一個要點或是任何的一個法規上的一個規範我們目前這個部分是有那個作業流程有一個作業流程好您希望您這個就提供給我好提供給我那我想那個請那個刑事局我們周局長那我想同樣的一個同樣這樣的一個案例啦 |
| transcript.whisperx[263].start |
7933.547 |
| transcript.whisperx[263].end |
7953.836 |
| transcript.whisperx[263].text |
那局長你有看過那影片嗎?有看到對那像這種事情發生刑事犯罪在我們校園裡面在課堂裡面公然發生那我也沒看到我們警察介入啊學校要主要跟您通報這個是他們要跟我通報學校要跟我們分局要來通報我們就會來 |
| transcript.whisperx[264].start |
7954.756 |
| transcript.whisperx[264].end |
7979.645 |
| transcript.whisperx[264].text |
通報的機制是請你說明一下就是他會跟我們分局就是學校的那個老師或是他們的這個輔導單位跟我們的分局裡面的這個轄區分局的派出所分局就是分局裡面的這個所以其實我這樣講其實我們看到就是在畫面上都人都已經被打了啦所以我是說如何遏止這一塊我們如何精進啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[265].start |
7980.879 |
| transcript.whisperx[265].end |
7982.26 |
| transcript.whisperx[265].text |
但這個不一定是沒有效還是會有發生啊? |
| transcript.whisperx[266].start |
8002.516 |
| transcript.whisperx[266].end |
8024 |
| transcript.whisperx[266].text |
會有它的效果?事實上這個發生的個案是非常少的,只是你看到了,但事實上不是那麼多常常發生的事。其實我跟你講,我昨天才有一個二十幾歲的年輕人跟我講,他的這個共同服兵役的他的朋友告訴他,他們那個學校啊,他們那個學校有小朋友書包裡面裝槍啊,帶著槍去學校。 |
| transcript.whisperx[267].start |
8028.684 |
| transcript.whisperx[267].end |
8053.432 |
| transcript.whisperx[267].text |
這個部分如果說它是平常就所以所以我意思說其實你剛才講很少不是很少很多欸黑數很多欸那就是有關這個罪行行為所以如何就校園安全的這種防護啊我還是希望說我們的學校還有我們的警察警政單位要這個如何通報的機制要做好我們本來就有你看到下面的留言大家是怎麼罵的 |
| transcript.whisperx[268].start |
8055.598 |
| transcript.whisperx[268].end |
8074.879 |
| transcript.whisperx[268].text |
真的我想這部分要精進啦齁OK好那我要想再談一下我們的一個因為今天的主題招委派的主題啦是青少年法治教育與犯罪防制的成效但是我還是要強調除了法治教育以外我們道德的教育是否更應該被重視 |
| transcript.whisperx[269].start |
8080.655 |
| transcript.whisperx[269].end |
8096.144 |
| transcript.whisperx[269].text |
道德教育應該更重視,不像法律是最後的手段。孩子的品德教育、道德教育才是我們人格發展過程中最重要的。從小有教好他長大就不會這個價值觀就不會扭曲了。與其告訴孩子打人會被抓去關 |
| transcript.whisperx[270].start |
8102.308 |
| transcript.whisperx[270].end |
8123.903 |
| transcript.whisperx[270].text |
為何我們不教孩子帶人處事要蹲後與其告訴孩子偷竊詐騙會被抓去關為何不教孩子要天道酬勤不貪圖急功近利與其告訴孩子少年性剝削會抓去關為何不教孩子應該尊重別人並以禮相待所以我要請問司長您認為 |
| transcript.whisperx[271].start |
8126.124 |
| transcript.whisperx[271].end |
8141.432 |
| transcript.whisperx[271].text |
道德教育是不是也能匡正我們社會風氣而預防犯罪的重要的一個因素?深表贊同所以教育部啊到底對這個道德教育你們做了哪些努力啊? |
| transcript.whisperx[272].start |
8146.226 |
| transcript.whisperx[272].end |
8163.399 |
| transcript.whisperx[272].text |
法治教育與平等教育這幾個不同的面向其實是一起在課程中要來落實的市長我跟您分享一下前陣子那個國中生殺害同學的案件那個乾妹妹事後她在網路上發表了一些怨懟的言辭 |
| transcript.whisperx[273].start |
8164.48 |
| transcript.whisperx[273].end |
8178.951 |
| transcript.whisperx[273].text |
他認為他沒有錯並悲秋傷春地感嘆他的干哥哥為他的付出那個是非價值觀扭曲到這種程度啊是所以我想只靠法治教育這根本是治標不治本啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[274].start |
8179.711 |
| transcript.whisperx[274].end |
8198.661 |
| transcript.whisperx[274].text |
所以我想教育部你真的要努力我們再繼續努力那我們剛才講到詐欺犯的問題我想司法院的一個統計表裡面講說最近5年詐欺犯的這個吸收案件在107年詐欺案件只有3254件112年高達6323件看長了這個double成長 |
| transcript.whisperx[275].start |
8208.416 |
| transcript.whisperx[275].end |
8217.516 |
| transcript.whisperx[275].text |
所以炸棄犯為什麼會那麼多教育部有沒有思考過炸棄犯為什麼而且都是我們青少年犯為什麼那麼多 |
| transcript.whisperx[276].start |
8219.819 |
| transcript.whisperx[276].end |
8241.078 |
| transcript.whisperx[276].text |
如同剛才前面所探討其實網路的因素現在很多資訊容易串聯聯繫是很大的關係所以這些訊息很容易...這個市場不能推給網路現在就是說你們要如何教育我們的下一代這種事情啦做這種事情啦很沒道德的啦不是只有法制很沒有道德啦現在孩子他甚至我騙人家沒有關係啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[277].start |
8242.359 |
| transcript.whisperx[277].end |
8257.106 |
| transcript.whisperx[277].text |
他認為騙人家沒有關係我不是殺人我不是謀財害命沒關係啊我只是騙人的錢啊他認為沒關係啊是非價值觀已經變成這樣所以才有大量的孩子不斷的去從事這種詐欺的這樣的一個行為去當車手 |
| transcript.whisperx[278].start |
8262.392 |
| transcript.whisperx[278].end |
8290.567 |
| transcript.whisperx[278].text |
所以怎麼樣來教育我們的孩子是非道德的觀念很重要所以我要告訴你們你一連詞把他納入課綱否則再這樣下去真的你剛才講什麼素養教育散佈在各個領域有成效嗎沒有成效啊所以我們的這些孩子的一個犯罪率還是持續的升高所以我希望教育部要來檢討我們道德教育的重要性好不好以上謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[279].start |
8293.318 |
| transcript.whisperx[279].end |
8298.344 |
| transcript.whisperx[279].text |
好謝謝林思敏林委員接下來請沈伯陽委員質詢 |
| transcript.whisperx[280].start |
8314.822 |
| transcript.whisperx[280].end |
8325.744 |
| transcript.whisperx[280].text |
好,謝謝主席。那有請這個部長,然後上下、上下廳廳長有。請這部長。嘿。然後可能,呃,警政署。謝謝。警政署像。好來,周局長。 |
| transcript.whisperx[281].start |
8328.018 |
| transcript.whisperx[281].end |
8352.47 |
| transcript.whisperx[281].text |
委員長好委員長好那因為時間有限齁所以我可能會問的稍微快一點齁那因為今天主題最主要是跟青少年有關那青少年現在有這個處罰少年然後又有這一個普遣少年他行為的嗎齁所以我可能這各問一題啦齁那第一個我想先問這一個處罰少年的部分因為我在看這一個報告的部分齁第一個有講到就是說可能是因應之前的案件那我講 |
| transcript.whisperx[282].start |
8353.251 |
| transcript.whisperx[282].end |
8365.652 |
| transcript.whisperx[282].text |
這一個可能有這個觸犯這個有一個三年的類似有點類似像緩刑的一個圖銷的一個條款但因為之前只是一句話帶過然後說可能會參照各國的公約什麼等等之類的不知道現在這個進行的狀況如何 |
| transcript.whisperx[283].start |
8368.165 |
| transcript.whisperx[283].end |
8386.556 |
| transcript.whisperx[283].text |
這部分是司法院比較清楚,是不是請司法院來說。好,沒有問題,沒有問題,謝謝。謝謝委員關注這個問題。這個部分呢是我們大家有考量到86年修法之後徵定的這個前案圖銷。86年之前大家都是透過視為未曾受個該宣告這個擬制型的這個立法。 |
| transcript.whisperx[284].start |
8387.116 |
| transcript.whisperx[284].end |
8407.79 |
| transcript.whisperx[284].text |
那呃那最近呢呃我們有在檢視說少年會受到這些犯罪集團的一個利用去進行這個犯罪那對於這樣的一個前的塗銷的執行的情形我們有再去做一個審慎的評估是不是要讓他在目前的執行三完畢三年內一律塗銷那要去加設一個就是條件 |
| transcript.whisperx[285].start |
8409.45 |
| transcript.whisperx[285].end |
8423.614 |
| transcript.whisperx[285].text |
讓少年在前面的這個保護處分執行或小學執行能夠讓他發揮作用能夠維持他一定的一個就是沒有一個再犯罪的這樣情形但是我們目前在審前評估當中我記得在美國八十幾年的 |
| transcript.whisperx[286].start |
8427.29 |
| transcript.whisperx[286].end |
8445.344 |
| transcript.whisperx[286].text |
五年後來整個拿掉那現在又要放回來三年齁那總之在我之後可能還會再繼續追這件事情的進度那因為時間先問一下這一個少婦會的事情就是說因為現在少事法現在有這個行政先行是這個少婦會現在等於扮演了一個非常重要的角色 |
| transcript.whisperx[287].start |
8446.425 |
| transcript.whisperx[287].end |
8449.967 |
| transcript.whisperx[287].text |
在行政先行的狀況之下他又要配合各式各樣不同的機關現在有沒有一個譬如說分類或SOP說譬如說哪一種負險少年 |
| transcript.whisperx[288].start |
8472.563 |
| transcript.whisperx[288].end |
8493.16 |
| transcript.whisperx[288].text |
找哪一個然後哪一種不顯少年譬如說我優先先找衛福或者社會相關的啊有些我可能找教育相關的現在有沒有這樣的一個極致在少婦會?現在少婦會是等於通案啦就是說我們接的案子裡面並沒有說分哪一個是哪個部分但是我們還是會結合社政機關衛福機關我們會一起來對這些做不顯少年或是偏差行為少年做一個輔導 |
| transcript.whisperx[289].start |
8494.1 |
| transcript.whisperx[289].end |
8516.065 |
| transcript.whisperx[289].text |
對因為我現在問這個問題就是因為現在看起來他會比較雜亂一點雜亂不一定是壞事是因為我們本來為了要接住這些少年我們可能要有各式各樣不同的機關但因為有時候會有點多頭馬車那多頭馬車的狀況之下有時候反而就不好接所以建議是說會不會在少府會這一邊呢因為現在看起來少府會的責任比較重那他有沒有一個比較固定的SOP能夠出來或者一個簡單的分類能夠出來 |
| transcript.whisperx[290].start |
8517.901 |
| transcript.whisperx[290].end |
8544.878 |
| transcript.whisperx[290].text |
因為目前在我們的福島少年裡面除了這些毒品跟這些就是參加幫派或是車手這些人比較多所以針對這個部分我們還是會從這個地方去跟他們做一些教育的法律的教育或者是一些跟他們說明說你出這個法律可能是少年車手或是被黑道吸收這些部分可能都還是有一些法律的責任那是希望說他們把這個共犯或是 |
| transcript.whisperx[291].start |
8545.418 |
| transcript.whisperx[291].end |
8549.819 |
| transcript.whisperx[291].text |
本身是犯罪的分類,但是青少年之所以會加入幫派或會參與詐欺,他的動機其實或他的背景基本上是不太一樣的。 |
| transcript.whisperx[292].start |
8567.785 |
| transcript.whisperx[292].end |
8588.898 |
| transcript.whisperx[292].text |
所以我說是從犯罪的這一個部分來做分類跟後端應該前端他為什麼做這件事情的分類其實不太一樣我講的是這一個部分但因為時間因素再問一下下一個問題就是說接下來就是偏差行為這個部分因為現在少子法86條因為道理我先跳過這一張就是說風險跟催加少年遭社會局勢比較多的 |
| transcript.whisperx[293].start |
8589.238 |
| transcript.whisperx[293].end |
8616.014 |
| transcript.whisperx[293].text |
那偏差行為因為現在少數法的規定所以109年現在有定一個這個偏差行為的這個有列十幾項嘛那現在有學籍的可能在教育局負責比較多沒有學籍的少府會比較多但就變成少府會現在除了暴嫌少年之外他又要處理偏差但照理說少年事件處理法他不應該處理偏差行為因為偏差行為照理說應該是學校輔導法等等值得要負責的所以想問說就是現在少府會如果要處理偏差 |
| transcript.whisperx[294].start |
8616.614 |
| transcript.whisperx[294].end |
8625.031 |
| transcript.whisperx[294].text |
現在偏差目前從7月開始到現在嗎?他大概有多少個案?然後他的進行狀況是如何?他的成效跟以前比起來如何?有沒有這方面的數據? |
| transcript.whisperx[295].start |
8629.604 |
| transcript.whisperx[295].end |
8632.866 |
| transcript.whisperx[295].text |
其中的大概這個偏差行為還是有幾百件這個數據我不是記得很清楚但是還是有的 |
| transcript.whisperx[296].start |
8647.134 |
| transcript.whisperx[296].end |
8668.47 |
| transcript.whisperx[296].text |
好那我可能再從書面啊可能再要取這些資料是因為畢竟從1月2年7月1號到現在已經一段時間那因為偏差行為到底適不適合由少普會來主責還是到完全應該交由像學校輔導之類我覺得可以做一項相關未來政策的評估嗎但評估之前可能需要少普會這邊相關的一些數據對書面再來大家好謝謝謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[297].start |
8674.114 |
| transcript.whisperx[297].end |
8679.277 |
| transcript.whisperx[297].text |
好謝謝沈伯陽沈委員接下來請翁曉琳翁委員質詢主席好有請邵家廷的謝廷長請謝廷長 |
| transcript.whisperx[298].start |
8706.493 |
| transcript.whisperx[298].end |
8729.332 |
| transcript.whisperx[298].text |
您好。是,謝天祥您好。我想這些年來少年犯罪的事件不斷地攀升。不僅事前的預防防制很重要。那對於就是這個相關的犯罪案件法院人力這裡是否充足的問題那本席也非常關心。那在這邊有幾個問題我想要就叫 |
| transcript.whisperx[299].start |
8733.035 |
| transcript.whisperx[299].end |
8757.124 |
| transcript.whisperx[299].text |
寫聽長好不知道現在司法院的處理狀況如何那首先就是我們知道其實到目前為止除了高雄市有少年法院之外其他各縣市都還是用少年法庭的方式來審理相關的案子是的那據我所了解就是現在司法院似乎也有要 |
| transcript.whisperx[300].start |
8759.004 |
| transcript.whisperx[300].end |
8780.05 |
| transcript.whisperx[300].text |
設置專責的少年法院但是很奇怪的就是說依照我們的少市法的規定應該是要在直轄市設置少年法院但是現在看起來司法院這裡的規劃是打算只成立北部的這個少年法院可不可以請你說明一下為什麼不在直轄縣市設 |
| transcript.whisperx[301].start |
8782.13 |
| transcript.whisperx[301].end |
8801.639 |
| transcript.whisperx[301].text |
我說明一下謝謝委員關注這個專業法院的一個設置的問題那少子法呢這個部分它是在86年就是當時謝啟大立委在國會推動的那當時大概就是99年也做成了一個立法院做成特別局域就希望能夠盡速的在直轄市都設少年法院 |
| transcript.whisperx[302].start |
8802.219 |
| transcript.whisperx[302].end |
8831.699 |
| transcript.whisperx[302].text |
那呃那後來其實呃101年家事事件法上路那目前呢高雄呃少家法院算是管轄高雄地區但經過我們這些年來的運作我們發現說少年家事法院他其實是一個問題解決型的法庭還有跟療癒是司法那跟很多的行政的政策必須配合相關那所以經過這樣一個呃委員你想如果我們每一個指甲室都設一個少家法院 |
| transcript.whisperx[303].start |
8832.399 |
| transcript.whisperx[303].end |
8849.002 |
| transcript.whisperx[303].text |
雖然可以對應每一個直轄市、縣市政府但是非直轄市的縣市政府可能就沒有辦法得到平等的司法的給付。好,謝謝因為按照現在的法律裡面的規定就是直轄市必須要設少年法院而不是說是一個北中南等等這些區域北中南東區去設置這個少年專業法院 |
| transcript.whisperx[304].start |
8856.664 |
| transcript.whisperx[304].end |
8877.849 |
| transcript.whisperx[304].text |
所以我認為說其實司法院應該還是要符合法律原來的規定該在直轄市設就在直轄市設而且我相信可能直轄市裡面的少年犯罪案件的比例也會比其他縣市要來得多那麼如果說是可以就是先在符合我們現在少事法的要求 |
| transcript.whisperx[305].start |
8878.689 |
| transcript.whisperx[305].end |
8893.771 |
| transcript.whisperx[305].text |
朝下在直轄市可以去設置少年法院我覺得會是比較好的一個方式否則你現在北部的話是怎麼樣是這個可以管北北基的這個相關的這個犯罪案件嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[306].start |
8894.392 |
| transcript.whisperx[306].end |
8894.592 |
| transcript.whisperx[306].text |
以北北基桃及 |
| transcript.whisperx[307].start |
8920.321 |
| transcript.whisperx[307].end |
8939.397 |
| transcript.whisperx[307].text |
這五個法院的院區呢去做一個體質性的盤點所以就是北北基桃的地區然後另外一個部分是為什麼把這個就是去考慮評估核設呢因為從人塊桶的角度它其實是有一條邊的這個就是各方面的一個需要的一個業務的評估所以我們大概是朝這方面去做一個多方的評估 |
| transcript.whisperx[308].start |
8940.037 |
| transcript.whisperx[308].end |
8963.069 |
| transcript.whisperx[308].text |
好謝謝那麼除了就是說有關於法院的專業法院的設置之外另外就是有關於原額的配置的問題那麼其實在司法院今年提出的來提出的立法計劃裡面只有講到要增加法院法官助理的這個原額那不知道現在邵家這個聽這邊有沒有已經向司法院有呈報你們希望增加多少的原額 |
| transcript.whisperx[309].start |
8963.829 |
| transcript.whisperx[309].end |
8977.653 |
| transcript.whisperx[309].text |
而根委員報告就是我們在2月份有送到司法法制委員會的一個成立北部少家法院的一個縮帖那其中的光北少家法院我們大概評估就至少需要835個835個對然後還有我們要增 |
| transcript.whisperx[310].start |
8980.514 |
| transcript.whisperx[310].end |
9007.817 |
| transcript.whisperx[310].text |
全國的少掉寶的這些調查保護的補助人力就大概要380個所以這個目前呢依照我們司法院現在剩下的492個元額就是遠遠不足的只是看你們現在實際上的編制應該是大概還有1000多個元額不過就是說是因為你們剛剛講的是要成立這個北部的專業法院所以我建議你們必須要整體的再去思考考是不是還是朝向 |
| transcript.whisperx[311].start |
9008.097 |
| transcript.whisperx[311].end |
9010.46 |
| transcript.whisperx[311].text |
因為我接下來還要問的就是有關於邵家法官的領選的問題依照 |
| transcript.whisperx[312].start |
9023.194 |
| transcript.whisperx[312].end |
9034.378 |
| transcript.whisperx[312].text |
檢察院在110年的時候曾經有做個調查報告當時司法院有表示說一年內會修正相關的法令然後成立少年法官遴選委員會請問一下你們已經成立了這個遴選委員會嗎?這個公委員報告因為這個就是目前的這個遴選辦法我們正在快馬加鞭的在評估當中如果將來北邵家我們要透過這個遴選辦法去遴選4個的這個邵家法官 |
| transcript.whisperx[313].start |
9049.864 |
| transcript.whisperx[313].end |
9059.93 |
| transcript.whisperx[313].text |
是你們動作太慢了111年年底做出來的報告給你們一年的時間理論上都已經戒齊了那麼但是你們現在的這個領選委員會組織也沒有產生然後相關的這個領選還只是個要點那麼同時我也有發現你們要求的這個少年法官的專業訓練 |
| transcript.whisperx[314].start |
9069.855 |
| transcript.whisperx[314].end |
9097.037 |
| transcript.whisperx[314].text |
只是要參加三年之內也就是三年之內要參加60個小時的研習時數就能夠取得少年法官的專業證照證明書這個部分我覺得其實是好像太寬鬆了三年內才進行相關的60個研習時數然後核心的這個課程也只要12個小時其實這個對於培訓少年法官來講是遠遠不足的我也希望邵家廷這邊可以做個整體的 |
| transcript.whisperx[315].start |
9098.698 |
| transcript.whisperx[315].end |
9099.078 |
| transcript.whisperx[315].text |
請教育部的吳司長。謝謝謝廷長。 |
| transcript.whisperx[316].start |
9125.923 |
| transcript.whisperx[316].end |
9140.714 |
| transcript.whisperx[316].text |
我想請吳司長這邊可以看一下我們這個畫面上面所顯示的圖片我們知道其實現在從109年到111年的意外事件裡面學生自殺跟自傷的事件是屢屢攀高 |
| transcript.whisperx[317].start |
9142.515 |
| transcript.whisperx[317].end |
9142.555 |
| transcript.whisperx[317].text |
提供討論﹚ |
| transcript.whisperx[318].start |
9160.703 |
| transcript.whisperx[318].end |
9171.014 |
| transcript.whisperx[318].text |
突發事件的危機介入輔導追蹤機制是非常重要的那這裡面也會涉及到就是說各個學校裡面的專業輔導人員是否配置足夠的問題請問一下您認為說現在我們各級學校裡面的專業輔導人員包含心理諮商師的配置是足夠的嗎? |
| transcript.whisperx[319].start |
9180.951 |
| transcript.whisperx[319].end |
9208.596 |
| transcript.whisperx[319].text |
不是太夠不太夠學生輔導法有規定我們從106年逐年增設人力之後每5年要檢討一次所以我們在111年的時候其實做過一個全面性的檢討當初的檢討就覺得是不夠因為如同剛才委員所說的這些案件一直在攀升求助的人數也在逐漸增加所以其實輔導人力負擔相當重所以目前已經有提出具體的建議在輔導人力的部分要來做增加 |
| transcript.whisperx[320].start |
9209.877 |
| transcript.whisperx[320].end |
9225.049 |
| transcript.whisperx[320].text |
在現在的學生輔導法第11條裡面其實可以看到國中小以下像55班以上要至少設置輔導人員到高中大學等等都各有現在的設置的最低的門檻那麼我認為說其實教育部這邊應該要趕快去檢討看起來現在的人數配置就是明顯不足 |
| transcript.whisperx[321].start |
9235.558 |
| transcript.whisperx[321].end |
9257.814 |
| transcript.whisperx[321].text |
尤其是大學我們剛看的前一張圖就知道其實大學生自殺自傷死亡的比例是非常高的那我在大學教書這些年我也知道其實學校的這個學生求助於資商輔導中心的人數是屢屢攀升由此可見其實薪資資商輔導師是非常他的需求量是非常高的 |
| transcript.whisperx[322].start |
9260.356 |
| transcript.whisperx[322].end |
9289.97 |
| transcript.whisperx[322].text |
那這個部分的話應該要盡快檢討,那你現在已經有什麼樣的方案了嗎?對,現行的法規是1200個學生要設一位,那我們目前已經想要檢討調整變成900個就要設一位。900個?是,那這個輔導法目前已經,修法的條文已經在行政院審查中,那審查通過就會送立法院。那我們有採用行政先行的方式,透過預算補助的方式希望幫助學校提早到位。那目前大專院校已經有50%的學校其實已經提早到, |
| transcript.whisperx[323].start |
9290.23 |
| transcript.whisperx[323].end |
9290.35 |
| transcript.whisperx[323].text |
提早報尾。 |
| transcript.whisperx[324].start |
9306.633 |
| transcript.whisperx[324].end |
9320.958 |
| transcript.whisperx[324].text |
好的我謝謝剛剛吳司長的補充說明我認為說這個問題是非常重要的話與其事後再來這個審理相關的犯罪案件不如事先就應該要提早預防會更為恰當好謝謝謝謝委員好謝謝翁小林翁委員接下來請鍾嘉賓委員質詢 |
| transcript.whisperx[325].start |
9337.748 |
| transcript.whisperx[325].end |
9353.716 |
| transcript.whisperx[325].text |
主席、在場委員、先進、列席的政府局長、市長、官員、會長、工作夥伴、媒體、資深、女士先生。有請蔡部長,也請我們的周署長協助。請蔡部長。周局長。周署長,抱歉。周署長,我們假證署。謝謝。 |
| transcript.whisperx[326].start |
9357.612 |
| transcript.whisperx[326].end |
9379.941 |
| transcript.whisperx[326].text |
部長好部長好部長我星期一在財政委員會關於打造的部分我請教了你們的黃次長報告回去他有沒有跟您報告我請直接問問你最近行政的主改法務部有沒有參加沒有調整有沒有調整法務部很早就調整完了調整完了但是我看法務部的組織法當中其實我們規定中央行政機關組織基準法三級機關一般都成為數你們現在有幾個數 |
| transcript.whisperx[327].start |
9385.475 |
| transcript.whisperx[327].end |
9409.531 |
| transcript.whisperx[327].text |
行政執行署、临政署、矯正署,對不對?是。那為什麼調查局不叫調查署?因為它傳統就一直都是調查局這樣的一個策略法。因為該法也同時同意啦,剪掉經院會復席,可是我想請教的後面是其實呢,我這邊很關心的是,可不可以比照我們刑事警察局喔,我們打炸,你們設有一個什麼?知通安全處,你知道他做什麼事情了嗎? |
| transcript.whisperx[328].start |
9410.64 |
| transcript.whisperx[328].end |
9439.185 |
| transcript.whisperx[328].text |
它是資訊安全就是打擊犯罪嘛是我希望說能夠把它擴大為資訊安全防治中心你覺得你會支持嗎我們現在有治安站然後局本部有指通處我們打詐有沒有幫助它其實不是只有限於打詐啦我知道啦只問你說這個資訊安全防治中心有沒有幫助很少說首長齁要跟你們擴充編制你們在那邊 |
| transcript.whisperx[329].start |
9440.575 |
| transcript.whisperx[329].end |
9464.56 |
| transcript.whisperx[329].text |
不是,我要尊重他們調查局對,那你個人上你覺得這個方向你覺得可以接受嗎?可以考慮啦可以考慮,好謝謝那如果是這樣的話我們再看看速發部有一個方法呢如果他們要聘請資通安全科技人才呢他們可以用聘用人員任用條例有助於吸引外部人才你覺得如果讓法務部或調查局可以用這個管道來進入一些可以專門來辦秩序犯罪的這個科技專業人才你覺得有沒有幫助? |
| transcript.whisperx[330].start |
9465.64 |
| transcript.whisperx[330].end |
9485.425 |
| transcript.whisperx[330].text |
增加人才絕對有幫助好謝謝但是要不要改名稱改名稱那個是在說我是問你的立場有沒有覺得這是可以考慮的可以增加的我們當然非常樂意好那我來問今天的題目啦齁剛剛大家就問了敦品中學這個學生鬧事啦有的寫得很嚴重要暴動你覺得啦敦品中學學生鬧事他們需要什麼 |
| transcript.whisperx[331].start |
9487.222 |
| transcript.whisperx[331].end |
9487.402 |
| transcript.whisperx[331].text |
祈求安慰﹖ |
| transcript.whisperx[332].start |
9510.089 |
| transcript.whisperx[332].end |
9536.168 |
| transcript.whisperx[332].text |
中學的孩子正是血氣方剛人生還很長這個進入人生末段生命如風中蟾燭他們有個共同的需求是不是就是需要被關愛你同意嗎同意很好那等一下其實處法少年呢都屬於脆弱的家庭高他們的父母的婚姻狀況跟他們的這個情況呢我們都可以看得到他們要從家庭找到歸屬感少年向外尋求你也同意這樣的一個研究的一個結論嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[333].start |
9537.645 |
| transcript.whisperx[333].end |
9545.368 |
| transcript.whisperx[333].text |
在美國監獄他們針對獸型人成年的收容人有個監獄犬不是把狗關起來是讓獸型人去訓練這些狗狗讓他可以來協助比如說陪伴犬比如說導盲犬你有沒有聽到或知道這樣的一個國外的做法 |
| transcript.whisperx[334].start |
9567.538 |
| transcript.whisperx[334].end |
9587.725 |
| transcript.whisperx[334].text |
有,我們國內也有,我們監所也有。好,來,所有組長,來問到你,國內有做過類似的狀況嗎?在之前新竹監獄有新竹監獄犬,那桃園栗子監獄也曾經有一段時間,疫情前有陪伴犬那你覺得監獄犬的或者陪伴犬的功能對您的矯正 |
| transcript.whisperx[335].start |
9589.225 |
| transcript.whisperx[335].end |
9609.264 |
| transcript.whisperx[335].text |
所屬的機關有沒有幫助?將來我們會高齡化的問題將來對於高齡受刑人或是身心比較障礙的這一些我知道你們這些受刑人訓練出來的犬呢他是只有在監獄裡面沒有到外面去從事一些服務嗎?有沒有?沒有還沒有?好部長之後再往前看 |
| transcript.whisperx[336].start |
9611.406 |
| transcript.whisperx[336].end |
9637.477 |
| transcript.whisperx[336].text |
其實呢動物治療剛剛講的是對內的部分讓獸型人、收容人或少年或癌末病人他透過動物的輔導他可以控制情感、精神性的關係讓他情緒穩定你同不同意這樣的一個研究的結論同意同意好那我們來看一看啦我問過你們的這個明陽中學的校長我上次在教育委員會問他說你們這些進來的都是一些比較重刑度的嘛對不對 |
| transcript.whisperx[337].start |
9639.738 |
| transcript.whisperx[337].end |
9661.274 |
| transcript.whisperx[337].text |
民洋中學是刑罰比較重的他說這個孩子其實進來都很難改了如果早一點接觸10歲之前就要接入教育部也很同意投入一把輔導資源往前到國小的階段就幫助他們從私能家裡面找到可能的曝險趕快及早你覺得這樣的及早接入有沒有幫助 |
| transcript.whisperx[338].start |
9662.116 |
| transcript.whisperx[338].end |
9677.901 |
| transcript.whisperx[338].text |
有好我們還問校長呢說欸你們學校呢提到動物這個事情他說啊他們學校有一些流浪狗進來他把他收容了讓他跟這些學生的一起生活結果校長就告訴我說笑狗的效果不錯 |
| transcript.whisperx[339].start |
9679.637 |
| transcript.whisperx[339].end |
9707.76 |
| transcript.whisperx[339].text |
很拗口啊請問部長你覺得笑狗的效果會在哪裡對我想對孩子的教育對學生的教育絕對有幫助的哪方面的幫助包括他怎麼樣保護動物還跟還有感情的抒發等等讓這些來自孩子覺得他對象看到一個流浪狗被他們照顧活得好好的很受歡迎他們覺得很開心是不是這樣 |
| transcript.whisperx[340].start |
9708.34 |
| transcript.whisperx[340].end |
9735.898 |
| transcript.whisperx[340].text |
是好讓他們覺得他的人生有價值有意義往下看那所以呢根據一個研究調查呢動物治療用於司法少年在12到17歲的青少年用寵物治療的實驗有對照組跟沒有狗的跟實驗組有狗陪伴的你覺得效果有沒有顯著的差別研究的結論有沒有呃我相信會有啦我也願意啊來鼓勵我們這四所這個矯正學校啊來試辦那你要不要告訴署長請他開始著手 |
| transcript.whisperx[341].start |
9737.295 |
| transcript.whisperx[341].end |
9757.904 |
| transcript.whisperx[341].text |
蘇長有聽到嗎?有聽到嗎?願意幫忙嗎?願意來做嗎?可是有一個問題啊你們都沒有經驗狗狗從哪裡來?動物從哪裡來?我們可以跟外界來聯繫吧主席在笑了他就收了好幾隻狗外界聯繫齁我跟你講你有沒有聽說過屏東科技大學一個工作犬訓練中心?有沒有聽過?我第一次聽 |
| transcript.whisperx[342].start |
9762.891 |
| transcript.whisperx[342].end |
9770.179 |
| transcript.whisperx[342].text |
請署長可以折騰屏東監獄去打聽看看因為屏東監獄有一個很有名的平科大的薄鹽醬油有沒有 |
| transcript.whisperx[343].start |
9772.185 |
| transcript.whisperx[343].end |
9792.305 |
| transcript.whisperx[343].text |
主長,您有沒有請部長喝過平科大的薄煙醬油,是你們工廠生產的,有沒有?平東建立的醬油有對,平東建立的,就是用平科大的技術移植的好,來部長,平科大跟平東建立的關係不錯,他們研發的薄煙醬油提供給平間的壽行人,他們工廠來生產,很受歡迎,都供不應求,您知道這個吧? |
| transcript.whisperx[344].start |
9793.265 |
| transcript.whisperx[344].end |
9816.302 |
| transcript.whisperx[344].text |
對對謝謝很好所以呢這個平科大的工作犬訓練中心呢他幫我們國家訓練棄屍犬防疫犬那未來他們可能要擴大導盲犬是不是也可以考慮醫院所需要的治療犬你覺得可不可以跟他們來合作可以啊那你知不知道屏東還有一個屏東縣警察消防局有一個特收大隊你知道他們會有什麼犬嗎特收犬啊對 |
| transcript.whisperx[345].start |
9820.197 |
| transcript.whisperx[345].end |
9844.831 |
| transcript.whisperx[345].text |
救難犬那個救難犬當時是我當理事長的時候協助他們特殊大會建立的好所以講結論了所以既然部長這麼肯定我們往下看到結論是不是可以請指示你們的矯正學校能夠引入動物治療出其幫孩子甚至到監獄幫受刑人穩定心情適合比較長的時間讓他們具有這樣的技能用他們的技能 |
| transcript.whisperx[346].start |
9846.64 |
| transcript.whisperx[346].end |
9873.692 |
| transcript.whisperx[346].text |
訓練狗﹖好,署長請教一下你們的新竹監獄你們的收容人有把訓練者有成效嗎?之前是有鎮養這個監獄犬那現在因為疫情關係目前新竹監獄已經停辦那因為這個有涉及到資源還有一些經費的問題你要長久之計必須要有一些相關的配套好部長提到 |
| transcript.whisperx[347].start |
9875.297 |
| transcript.whisperx[347].end |
9894.843 |
| transcript.whisperx[347].text |
矯正署想做但是需要什麼經費需要技術需要資源那部裡面願意在未來的年度上支持矯正署做這個計畫嗎不管是在成人監獄裡面的監獄犬或是在矯正學校裡面提供給這個笑狗我聽到笑狗的效果很好我就很想笑 |
| transcript.whisperx[348].start |
9895.723 |
| transcript.whisperx[348].end |
9916.61 |
| transcript.whisperx[348].text |
但是呢這個是個事實部長您說一下要怎麼來做委員的建議很好我想我們會結合社會資源共同來推動先從事辦開始效果很好我們再把它擴大好那我建議呢你可以先從一個評估計畫開始那我是覺得呢是不是你們可以給個一個評估計畫的一個報告給本席跟委員會 |
| transcript.whisperx[349].start |
9919.731 |
| transcript.whisperx[349].end |
9939.36 |
| transcript.whisperx[349].text |
就台灣目前的矯正、矯制機構導入動物治療或是矯正教育引入類似像美國這樣的做法協助這些收容人或者青少年或者這些處罰少年能夠早日復歸社會讓他們覺得對社會有貢獻有幫助甚至我看美國的例子 |
| transcript.whisperx[350].start |
9940.08 |
| transcript.whisperx[350].end |
9962.198 |
| transcript.whisperx[350].text |
受刑人出獄之後第一個跑去幹嘛去探視他的狗狗有沒有在寄養家庭好好的幫他們倒忙好好的陪伴你願意不這樣做一個月提個報告可以嗎可以因為這個建議非常好我們會延續我們在新竹建議所做過的建議卷建議卷的話這樣子再把它擴大再來延伸好謝謝部長謝謝署長 |
| transcript.whisperx[351].start |
9965.302 |
| transcript.whisperx[351].end |
9976.707 |
| transcript.whisperx[351].text |
好,謝謝總裁民委員。狗狗去念書授訓很貴捏。來,換人。貴到要死。好,那麼因為上午到現在都沒有休息齁。那麼稍後在盧委員、庭委詢答完畢後休息五分鐘。那接續下來請牛許庭委員進行詢答。 |
| transcript.whisperx[352].start |
9995.888 |
| transcript.whisperx[352].end |
9996.808 |
| transcript.whisperx[352].text |
法務部長及警政署局長 |
| transcript.whisperx[353].start |
10012.421 |
| transcript.whisperx[353].end |
10036.259 |
| transcript.whisperx[353].text |
本席先問一個個案因為昨天出新聞的敦炳中學在本席的選區這個衝突的背後個案的處理狀況聯繫資源的速度還算快看起來事態是沒有擴大但是我想從這個事情裡面去問後續背後發生的原因我們在這些執行所謂趕快教育的這些學校裡面平常的人力是否充足 |
| transcript.whisperx[354].start |
10037.779 |
| transcript.whisperx[354].end |
10057.152 |
| transcript.whisperx[354].text |
人員確實是不太夠,不過我們會充分地來利用現有的人力,也會爭取來增加員額。對,我照理來講,作為一個感化教育執行的機關,比如平常的人力是充足的,學生跟老師的比例以及等等,他應該要比一般的學校更充足的人力,因為 |
| transcript.whisperx[355].start |
10057.632 |
| transcript.whisperx[355].end |
10057.752 |
| transcript.whisperx[355].text |
提供書面。 |
| transcript.whisperx[356].start |
10082.686 |
| transcript.whisperx[356].end |
10107.328 |
| transcript.whisperx[356].text |
謝謝部長好再來要討論一下今天是講少婦會今天應該有蠻多委員對這個題目提出意見跟看法現在在新制的少婦會上任這個上場執行之後現在看起來是要先走少婦會的流程然後才能轉少年法院嘛對不對那以舊制來講舊制的少婦會就比較單純也就是警政體系用管訓的邏輯直接處理嘛 |
| transcript.whisperx[357].start |
10108.389 |
| transcript.whisperx[357].end |
10123.318 |
| transcript.whisperx[357].text |
這件事可能跟現代大家對於人權等等標準有所不合所以新制就立了新的法有相關的一個規定但現在問題就是包括我剛剛在下面的時候我都在想我要叫誰上來備詢這個新制的少府會現在到底到底由誰來主管 |
| transcript.whisperx[358].start |
10125.782 |
| transcript.whisperx[358].end |
10141.512 |
| transcript.whisperx[358].text |
報告委員本來新制的少年委員會應該是成立在這個縣市政府的這個底下的一級單位但是因為地方自治法沒有辦法再容納新的這個委員會或者是局處所以他就在目前還是在跟警察局少年隊友配合 |
| transcript.whisperx[359].start |
10142.014 |
| transcript.whisperx[359].end |
10170.87 |
| transcript.whisperx[359].text |
所以這個按照法理上應該是交給地方政府處理嘛然後地方各就成立各自的少府會然後委員大概就可能市長兼任這個主委然後副市長就是副主委然後這個局長就大概就排排座是這樣對不對那它變成一個類似任務編組的一個方式喔然後大部分是以兼職的方式來處理喔這本期擔心啦然後實務上剛剛警政署已經講很清楚它實務上還是交給警察來做處理喔那以現在中央政府的了解喔各地少府會的運作這樣子的模式是順利的嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[360].start |
10171.69 |
| transcript.whisperx[360].end |
10193.78 |
| transcript.whisperx[360].text |
還是其實是變成換湯不換藥呢目前來講因為他是有一個新的想法叫做行政先行對行政先行嘛避免這個偏差行為少年或是這個一些他等於有個預防機制在那邊預防機制就是這裡嘛那我們就是目前來講因為剛開始實施那我們看數有1200多件那現在的人力大概260幾個人目前來講應該是還好全國全國對全國的這個260幾個人力服務多少 |
| transcript.whisperx[361].start |
10199.662 |
| transcript.whisperx[361].end |
10224.973 |
| transcript.whisperx[361].text |
需要被輔導的少年目前開案數是1200多人1200多人是是是這跟當初立法的時候期待的數字有沒有落差那當然應該是慢慢的會增加但是目前來講就是這個狀況如果說按照法的精神去執行的時候實際上這個案量暴增的時候會不會造成基層警力的負擔那當然會啊其實會齁但是其實我們就是這個單位的話還是要跟教育單位還有社政單位還有一些這個衛福單位會有配合 |
| transcript.whisperx[362].start |
10226.71 |
| transcript.whisperx[362].end |
10242.992 |
| transcript.whisperx[362].text |
這個就是本集今天特別要提這個這個題目的原因因為新制之後大家就對於少府會有就輔導方面的期待一定是更高的嘛因為我們等於就是預防機制但相關來講以現行的這樣子的一個組織編制好像很難有權利去整併相關的資源對不對你實務上到最後還是變成變成 |
| transcript.whisperx[363].start |
10244.534 |
| transcript.whisperx[363].end |
10268.66 |
| transcript.whisperx[363].text |
由警察單位來執行、輔導對象跟職責,然後又很難抗拒司法機關的一些請求,我是覺得有點擔心啦。相關的這些人力增補跟權責劃分有沒有更進一步的思考跟考慮呢?那這是如果是能夠提升到這個縣政府的一級單位,那這個話可能就會整合更多的像社會安全網的這個資源,他們可能就會做更多事,而不是只是限制在警察這個預防的部分。好,這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[364].start |
10270.188 |
| transcript.whisperx[364].end |
10284.646 |
| transcript.whisperx[364].text |
我是覺得還有可疑之處啦但是慢慢討論嘛因為親自上路總是執行之後那今天至少有個初步了260位人力服務1000多個案量那順著這個大家我們再持續來做觀察再來我問一下就是少府會移送法院的標準現在很明確的標準嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[365].start |
10285.752 |
| transcript.whisperx[365].end |
10300.163 |
| transcript.whisperx[365].text |
有他有一定的標準就是說他這個少年的話如果他已經沒有辦法在這個輔導機制裡面那他會就移送少年法院來處理在法院會來對決以前實務上來講有沒有遇到少年法庭認為移送不當然後退回來這種 |
| transcript.whisperx[366].start |
10301.324 |
| transcript.whisperx[366].end |
10316.794 |
| transcript.whisperx[366].text |
有否遇過這種狀況?目前並沒有,沒有這樣的案例。就是我們目前接的案例並沒有這樣的案例。我們接的就是已經受這個角質學校那他出來又有這個少年調查官的部分,他少年保護官的部分來交給我們輔導還有兩個。 |
| transcript.whisperx[367].start |
10318.837 |
| transcript.whisperx[367].end |
10337.925 |
| transcript.whisperx[367].text |
那實務上有沒有說因為曝險行為以外,處罰或偏差行為,然後反而導致說法庭認為說他應該先走少婦會的流程,有沒有這樣的狀況?這個是有的。這個也是有的。這樣數量占那1200個案例裡面占多數嗎?就不多。不多?大概多少?有數字嗎?這個部分是因為我們目前沒有這個數據。 |
| transcript.whisperx[368].start |
10340.706 |
| transcript.whisperx[368].end |
10364.874 |
| transcript.whisperx[368].text |
好這本期要提這個就提醒就是說以人力編制或什麼來講我們不希望說既然要有輔導的機制先行我們不就不希望他一樣是像過去一樣換當不換一樣還是有警力的警政單位來負擔有的時候也要稍微降低一下這個警察弟兄的一些一些這個勤務然後讓更多的也許是社政也好也許教育單位來做支援這一部分丟給地方我希望大家有一個長期追蹤的機制 |
| transcript.whisperx[369].start |
10365.194 |
| transcript.whisperx[369].end |
10378.48 |
| transcript.whisperx[369].text |
如果到最後是換湯不換藥的時候也許我們從法制面再來做檢討那當然如果可以運作順利各地方政府找出方案的話那當然是最好這一點我希望中央政府來持續追蹤可以嗎?謝謝卿委員好辛苦了謝謝謝謝林委員謝謝部長謝謝局長接下來有請柯委員致恩質詢謝謝主席我們是不是請法務部有請法務部蔡部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[370].start |
10396.772 |
| transcript.whisperx[370].end |
10420.981 |
| transcript.whisperx[370].text |
委員好部長好我想今天在這個委員會當中大家對於端品中學的這個事件都已經討論非常多了我就跳過去我是想了解一下我們我查一下的歷史在跟有關於少年就是在我們矯正學校裡面聚眾的這個姿勢的話比較大的就在1996年大概就是在新竹然後呢接下來成年甲齒典獄長大概在2015在我們高雄然後現在就是端品 |
| transcript.whisperx[371].start |
10421.781 |
| transcript.whisperx[371].end |
10448.015 |
| transcript.whisperx[371].text |
部長你知道嗎青少年的受刑人跟成年受刑人他們要集體擾事你覺得他們的差異點在哪裡青少年當然比較衝動一點所以有時候可以事先做防範那成年的當然他的威脅性會更高所以我想他們還是有不同的特質還有我們要管理上的不同那我想部長你可能對青少年就不太清楚 |
| transcript.whisperx[372].start |
10448.655 |
| transcript.whisperx[372].end |
10452.956 |
| transcript.whisperx[372].text |
因為目前來說的話青少年為什麼以昨天蹲餅來看的話三個小時的處理你知道青少年常常就發展心理學來臉裡面來說的話他們除了有一些以自我為中心之外他們還有假想性的觀眾這樣的一個情節更何況說是從眾所以他們其實在叫囂在聚眾的時候對他們來說是他們英雄化的一個化身 |
| transcript.whisperx[373].start |
10472.142 |
| transcript.whisperx[373].end |
10486.787 |
| transcript.whisperx[373].text |
所以他們是從眾他們會非常的希望能夠引撫非常大的一個一個注意力跟成年人成年人目的性的想要越獄那個是完全不一樣的方法我接下來再請問部長如果你沒有搞清楚青少年為什麼會犯罪永遠我們只是他犯罪完之後你從後續的行為表現來看看我們要做怎麼樣的處理做怎麼樣懲戒你永遠沒辦法解決問題接下來我們來看下面一個 |
| transcript.whisperx[374].start |
10496.79 |
| transcript.whisperx[374].end |
10525.261 |
| transcript.whisperx[374].text |
雖然是我們這個犯罪的這個已經是少年犯不斷的一個增加這些我想這個數據會來說法數據增加有他的背景那你有沒有看過有沒有去分析過他犯罪的樣態有沒有不一樣跟1996年跟今天你們有沒有去做一個分析樣態有沒有什麼不一樣確實有不同那現在的樣態炸氣犯反而是增加了多的那過去的話是像毒品會比較嚴重 |
| transcript.whisperx[375].start |
10526.523 |
| transcript.whisperx[375].end |
10551.099 |
| transcript.whisperx[375].text |
還有青少年如果再陷入在一個比較是對傷人的話次傷人傷人的話他們的殘酷的指數跟過去來說是完全不一樣的就像是我們一般來說目前如果說你有憂鬱或幹嘛你的自殘他會看著血的流出他會覺得比他的心痛來說更能夠紓解所以我只是說不是只有人數增加你要分析他們不同的樣態那個殘酷指數就像我就要回歸到我們有關於割喉案的部分 |
| transcript.whisperx[376].start |
10553.621 |
| transcript.whisperx[376].end |
10553.821 |
| transcript.whisperx[376].text |
即準、又快速﹖ |
| transcript.whisperx[377].start |
10572.901 |
| transcript.whisperx[377].end |
10588.847 |
| transcript.whisperx[377].text |
他們以自我為中心：他們假想形成觀眾：所以他們發生事情的時候：他們是需要透過這個部分來英雄化這個部分：然後呢你沒有辦法好好在這個地方做預先的反犯了解他們的心理我告訴你我們法務部對於這些人的這些方式來說真的是有點落伍了 |
| transcript.whisperx[378].start |
10589.727 |
| transcript.whisperx[378].end |
10604.577 |
| transcript.whisperx[378].text |
那接下來我們就來看看很多人就是要以歌喉案為案的話我記得教育部部長馬上就說我們中間有個銜接點我們立刻應該給他回到學校部長你認為如果是一個非常嚴重而且已經是到歌喉這樣的案件當中你覺得讓他 |
| transcript.whisperx[379].start |
10605.938 |
| transcript.whisperx[379].end |
10621.266 |
| transcript.whisperx[379].text |
類似像這樣比較殘酷的這個暴力的行為你認為從少官因為少官所最多只能給我關個三個月吧然後呢矯正學校大概最多兩年而且兩年還很少以這樣子的一個類別的人回到學校去或回到後續的接觸你覺得同意嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[380].start |
10622.876 |
| transcript.whisperx[380].end |
10639.246 |
| transcript.whisperx[380].text |
實現因為這是法律規定法官所判決的但是對於他回歸以後的銜接這是很重要的是對他出校以前你覺得應該放回學校嗎在這個樣態上面比較殘忍的狀況你覺得適合回學校嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[381].start |
10640.887 |
| transcript.whisperx[381].end |
10655.08 |
| transcript.whisperx[381].text |
也要尊重他到底他是要救學還是要他要回學校又可以英雄化的象徵你不知道他只要是被能夠懲處你把他懲處得最嚴重他是更英雄的表徵啊青少年啊你知不知道這個心態啊他回學校去又可以 |
| transcript.whisperx[382].start |
10655.58 |
| transcript.whisperx[382].end |
10656.06 |
| transcript.whisperx[382].text |
有可能嗎?你有24小時的嗎?要設在哪裡? |
| transcript.whisperx[383].start |
10679.44 |
| transcript.whisperx[383].end |
10684.062 |
| transcript.whisperx[383].text |
部長我只覺得每一次犯罪這個問題出來你們就講了一大堆像剛剛提到的那些什麼有關於這個少府會少府會做的事情又是要包括資商、要輔導、要社會安全法靠柯領所以這是我所點出最大的問題你們都是從行為發生之後來看看怎麼防堵、怎麼樣來戒備你們沒有看到行為之前他們整個的一個發展他不適合回學校 |
| transcript.whisperx[384].start |
10705.351 |
| transcript.whisperx[384].end |
10715.361 |
| transcript.whisperx[384].text |
這個東西你如果沒有好好的來做一些評估的話他是這樣這種暴力犯罪的話你真的需要有一個更終極的地方但是我求教育部真的是很困難因為你們現在目前連地點連做了什麼地方有沒有24小時都沒有還要寄望民間團體來做這種事情靠我顆臉 |
| transcript.whisperx[385].start |
10723.328 |
| transcript.whisperx[385].end |
10741.46 |
| transcript.whisperx[385].text |
所以法務部你應該承擔起這個部分我還是強烈的要求評估心理的評估不見得學校就是最終他們可以的也不是尊重的問題只有專業的評估不要因為他想學校造就他的英雄傾向而讓我們其他人反而變成狗熊好不好總教育委員剛剛提到了這絕對不是養幾隻小狗可以來撫慰他們受傷創傷的心靈這是兩碼事情 |
| transcript.whisperx[386].start |
10747.765 |
| transcript.whisperx[386].end |
10749.407 |
| transcript.whisperx[386].text |
謝謝柯委員、謝謝蔡部長。接下來有請羅委員、庭委發言、質詢。謝謝主席。有請蔡部長。 |
| transcript.whisperx[387].start |
10769.898 |
| transcript.whisperx[387].end |
10791.507 |
| transcript.whisperx[387].text |
主席謝謝也謝謝我們部長那我們現場呢因為時間有限對不起我們就就近談一下那這是我跟您的第一次對話我想犯罪類型在這一個專案報告裡面我想都寫得很清楚近10年的少年犯罪竊盜最高再來詐欺再來是毒品那我想這裡面的你們也都非常清楚毒品的日漸嚴重 |
| transcript.whisperx[388].start |
10792.828 |
| transcript.whisperx[388].end |
10816.219 |
| transcript.whisperx[388].text |
那再來就是我要跟您探討一下因為我們大家都知道K他命三級毒品對吧那現在網路上有在倡議說希望能夠改列為二級想請問一下部長您的觀點呢法務部設有一個毒品審議委員會裡面有很多的專家那我們如果毒品要列為一級、二級、三級、四級啊都透過這個審議委員會來討論那K他命 |
| transcript.whisperx[389].start |
10819.06 |
| transcript.whisperx[389].end |
10841.665 |
| transcript.whisperx[389].text |
有沒有必要身為二級啊我們可以在這個審議委員會討論好這是網路上的一個倡議但網路為什麼會有這樣的倡議是因為我們在看到很多的新聞包括我們自己也遇過有這樣子的警察同仁跟我們分享就是有所謂的年輕人持有K他命5公克以下只需要行政裁罰我沒有說錯吧是 |
| transcript.whisperx[390].start |
10842.526 |
| transcript.whisperx[390].end |
10858.385 |
| transcript.whisperx[390].text |
對那這樣子的一個部分就衍生出一些社會事件就是他查獲了但是剛好他所持有的是5公克以下只需要罰款那我曾經很好奇行政裁罰完以後有多少人會去繳納這樣子的罰款你有掌握嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[391].start |
10859.786 |
| transcript.whisperx[391].end |
10876.859 |
| transcript.whisperx[391].text |
如果他不繳納的話我們還有行政執行署可以來強制執行當然是強制但是就我曾經當過議員我們去調台中市的一個記錄行政裁罰完以後我們發現繳納罰款的大概只有3、40%其實是不高的 |
| transcript.whisperx[392].start |
10877.259 |
| transcript.whisperx[392].end |
10893.078 |
| transcript.whisperx[392].text |
那後面要用到強制執行那當然去做我們當然支持但是我要點出的一個問題是我們希望作為一個三寶吧我們覺得現在的毒品真的非常嚴重那校園毒品的問題已經變成是我們感受到 |
| transcript.whisperx[393].start |
10893.988 |
| transcript.whisperx[393].end |
10909.189 |
| transcript.whisperx[393].text |
已經不可挽回的地步我覺得已經涉入到校園太過於頻繁太多這樣的事件那有沒有機會再下修這一個K他命毒品所持有的一個敬重他的功課數 |
| transcript.whisperx[394].start |
10910.371 |
| transcript.whisperx[394].end |
10932.794 |
| transcript.whisperx[394].text |
這部分法務部有沒有做這樣：我可以來討論也尊重審議委員會如果願意把它提升為二級不只是就是說如果它維持三級但是它現在是持有五公克以下是裁罰那這個就要修法對行政裁罰那法務部願不願意去提出一個版本零公克一公克 |
| transcript.whisperx[395].start |
10933.354 |
| transcript.whisperx[395].end |
10958.216 |
| transcript.whisperx[395].text |
我們再繼續更嚴格呢?您怎麼看?更嚴格我非常同意那我們會尊重專家的意見來做一個研修的研討我必須跟您很坦白的報告我今天會站在這裡有一部分是因為這方面我非常的不滿意武功課以下持有只需要行政裁罰我在地方上不斷的倡議之後很多的民眾認同 |
| transcript.whisperx[396].start |
10959.497 |
| transcript.whisperx[396].end |
10971.698 |
| transcript.whisperx[396].text |
禁而把選票投給我讓我能夠有這麼高的選票那選不選票我是想要告訴你其實很多人認同武功課以下行政裁罰是太過於寬鬆 |
| transcript.whisperx[397].start |
10973.972 |
| transcript.whisperx[397].end |
10996.327 |
| transcript.whisperx[397].text |
我們希望能夠讓他有更嚴謹的、更慎重的去看待這件事情我必須還要坦白報告有警察同仁告訴我們一台車攔下4個年輕人收出19公克的ケタミ只要當他們異口同聲說出了我們都是自己持有當然每個人都會這樣說他不會說他販賣 |
| transcript.whisperx[398].start |
10998.724 |
| transcript.whisperx[398].end |
11022.655 |
| transcript.whisperx[398].text |
19公克平均一個人不到5公克這四個人就是統一一樣行政裁罰我想這樣子的一個案件我們從警察同仁轉述給我們我們作為民眾作為民意代表我們感到不可思議所以我們希望不只是看到我們的法治觀念希望在校園不斷的宣導有做這樣子的一個教育但我們更希望在法的部分 |
| transcript.whisperx[399].start |
11023.175 |
| transcript.whisperx[399].end |
11049.834 |
| transcript.whisperx[399].text |
可以再更嚴謹更慎重我希望這個部分法務部剛剛您有提到是願意朝向更嚴重的部分來看待是嗎是我們同意委員的見解我們一起來努力這個部分好不好好謝謝在部分就是要跟您報告就是我相信一定會有一些所謂的上員上頭或者是他們的組織管理者在販賣這些東西的時候一定會告訴年輕人教他們作戰 |
| transcript.whisperx[400].start |
11050.795 |
| transcript.whisperx[400].end |
11077.478 |
| transcript.whisperx[400].text |
受責。我叫他們一定要出去秤重一下五公克一下甚至我在網路上都還有看過這樣子的一個圖片喔他們只要你搜尋啊三級毒品律師他上面都會寫二三級毒品刑法刑責案免費諮詢爭取無罪緩刑上百件的成功案例 |
| transcript.whisperx[401].start |
11078.058 |
| transcript.whisperx[401].end |
11105.798 |
| transcript.whisperx[401].text |
我想這些東西都好像在告訴我們的年輕人好像這個部分有機會無罪那他們的作戰守則就可能會去做變化會去告訴這些青少年不用擔心持有沒關係我想當然我們都知道販賣是一定有罪但是持有的部分就可以讓他們作為教戰守則去做這個部分的一個教壞孩子的一個擔憂所以我希望我們一起來努力也希望 |
| transcript.whisperx[402].start |
11106.238 |
| transcript.whisperx[402].end |
11128.793 |
| transcript.whisperx[402].text |
法務部在未來能夠提出自己的版本能夠朝向毒品能夠以K他命為主因為真的很很多的事件都是以K他命為主是不是能夠把這個下修他的功課數我們一起來加油謝謝好謝謝委員指教好謝謝蔡部長謝謝羅委員依先前宣告在羅委員庭委詢答後休息5分鐘現在休息 |
| transcript.whisperx[403].start |
11436.949 |
| transcript.whisperx[403].end |
11465.626 |
| transcript.whisperx[403].text |
現在繼續開會請紅委員孟凱進行詢答主席謝謝麻煩我們請請法務部部長跟我們司法院好不好好請蔡部長那司法院竊聽長請稍後因為馬上就回來了來 |
| transcript.whisperx[404].start |
11470.706 |
| transcript.whisperx[404].end |
11480.957 |
| transcript.whisperx[404].text |
委員部長那司法院呢?聽掌聲等一下因為剛剛那個洗手間比較擁擠我們立法院要改善性別平權的廁所空間 |
| transcript.whisperx[405].start |
11482.315 |
| transcript.whisperx[405].end |
11510.241 |
| transcript.whisperx[405].text |
好來那一樣部長我先跟您就教我想今天很多的這一些大家都在討論就是說我們這個少年犯罪的一個問題那現在在針對就是說調保官的人力不足的部分可能看到是說很多的案件量會非常的多然後沒有辦法來去處理我先請教一下我們現在少年保護官跟少年調查官有多少人這在司法院還是法務部下司法院來司法院會議 |
| transcript.whisperx[406].start |
11511.741 |
| transcript.whisperx[406].end |
11538.127 |
| transcript.whisperx[406].text |
我們現在的調保官目前大概全國應該是200出頭個200出頭個那平均一年我們有交付保護處分的案件有多少這個我手上平均一年平均每個人他會分擔到多少案件量舉例來說現在新北的那個個案那個保護官手上就有90個保護管署不包括其他的調查跟其他的保護處分的執行是 |
| transcript.whisperx[407].start |
11538.627 |
| transcript.whisperx[407].end |
11556.935 |
| transcript.whisperx[407].text |
所以說這也是外界會質疑或外界會認為是說是不是調保官的人員不足沒有辦法負荷龐大的一個案件尤其是每一個案件其實本來我們的理想或是我們希望的是說是保護官跟調查官各自任務分工將調查跟保護的工作分開嘛但目前國內的調保 |
| transcript.whisperx[408].start |
11558.576 |
| transcript.whisperx[408].end |
11584.865 |
| transcript.whisperx[408].text |
有辦法分開嗎?我們當年因為少年保護官其實是台灣很早大概就有但當年為了精簡人力其實是要他們一人先做調查跟保護那長期下來對於像新北或者是桃園台中這種案量很大的法院基本上大概就是做不到是您提到重點了就是新北台北因為像新北市本席所在的一個地方400萬的人口那相對來說他的一個案件量其實也比較大 |
| transcript.whisperx[409].start |
11585.385 |
| transcript.whisperx[409].end |
11589.469 |
| transcript.whisperx[409].text |
二月提出一個縮帖就是說我們希望可以在未來的就是盡快可以在兩年內能夠希望能夠增補就是 |
| transcript.whisperx[410].start |
11605.385 |
| transcript.whisperx[410].end |
11630.301 |
| transcript.whisperx[410].text |
最好能夠增補380個以他們的合理的案件負荷那我們希望在兩年內至少可以增補這個就是150個到200個左右的人力那不過這個部分就會牽涉到我們的總原法所以可能也要請行政院能夠配合來修正提升我們的總原法的第11條的第三類的司法原本的條件所以其實這追根究柢還是整體政府的思考範圍跟 |
| transcript.whisperx[411].start |
11632.382 |
| transcript.whisperx[411].end |
11652.208 |
| transcript.whisperx[411].text |
應應嗎?當然就是說你認為說到底這個少年犯罪是不是嚴重以及是不是能夠釜底抽薪的去改變這個現況當然好那如果說這樣的話我們到底今天除了不管是司法院不管是這一些我們法務部過來我們也沒有人事總署我們也沒有我們行政院更高的一個機關來那這樣怎麼辦狗吠火車對牛彈琴 |
| transcript.whisperx[412].start |
11655.798 |
| transcript.whisperx[412].end |
11678.799 |
| transcript.whisperx[412].text |
所以希望委員可以協助我們有提出縮帖希望可以修正總原法我覺得這是第一個部分啦就是說重點在於是根本如果說人力不夠我們每一個不管是保護官不管是調查官我們都希望是說能夠讓他真真正正做到他原本應該我們修法之後負責的案件或負責的工作內容但實際上實務上來講就是保護官跟調查官其實都還要 |
| transcript.whisperx[413].start |
11679.56 |
| transcript.whisperx[413].end |
11694.355 |
| transcript.whisperx[413].text |
各自負責各自的工作而且還要相對的這個一人身兼百案啊所以你剛剛講光新北一個人就有90案保護管數是不是最多的還有沒有更多的新北是全國案量最高的法院所以新北的一個人90案是 |
| transcript.whisperx[414].start |
11695.196 |
| transcript.whisperx[414].end |
11695.576 |
| transcript.whisperx[414].text |
新北市建樹最高的 |
| transcript.whisperx[415].start |
11712.688 |
| transcript.whisperx[415].end |
11727.481 |
| transcript.whisperx[415].text |
本席這邊有看到資料是說警政署統計去年7月到11月少府會收到541案裡面302案開案輔導但是5個月內少年法院交付的保護管數就有1753件 |
| transcript.whisperx[416].start |
11730.103 |
| transcript.whisperx[416].end |
11743.497 |
| transcript.whisperx[416].text |
所以其實換言之這1753件裡面有那麼多的保護管束但是真正能夠給這個少府會的這個部分開案輔導的只有302案那剩下的這個1000多案到哪去了 |
| transcript.whisperx[417].start |
11744.647 |
| transcript.whisperx[417].end |
11771.862 |
| transcript.whisperx[417].text |
這部分可能要請這個內政部就是代表說明我跟委員報告一下目前少府會能夠接受轉介輔導的除了少司法的三條一項二款的那個三款的曝險事由之外那其他如果說法院處法的案件那經過法院評估認為說他情節輕微也可以轉介給少府會去輔導那還有兒權法的第四章的保護措施他有十幾項都可以交給少府會輔導 |
| transcript.whisperx[418].start |
11772.782 |
| transcript.whisperx[418].end |
11796.933 |
| transcript.whisperx[418].text |
因為現在看到就是少府會在行政體制上面屬於縣市政府的警政警察局少年隊所以位階是相對低嗎?其實在少司法18條的設計它其實由地方政府的首長擔任少府會委員會主席但是它編列編列這個編列員還是在這個少年隊裡面不是嗎?是目前其實是在社安網下行政院是這樣的設計 |
| transcript.whisperx[419].start |
11799.254 |
| transcript.whisperx[419].end |
11801.655 |
| transcript.whisperx[419].text |
當然希望委員支持那另外我也拜託 |
| transcript.whisperx[420].start |
11825.999 |
| transcript.whisperx[420].end |
11844.166 |
| transcript.whisperx[420].text |
若司法院希望委員支持的話報告就不要糊弄阿不要糊弄阿來 庭長不用講那麼快喔本席講阿第10頁你回去看一下拿109年的新聞稿直接複製貼上是幹嘛 |
| transcript.whisperx[421].start |
11846.741 |
| transcript.whisperx[421].end |
11862.327 |
| transcript.whisperx[421].text |
第10頁本席就看到我還想說奇怪你們在寫作文啊進入司法程序的少年出生時也曾有過純真笑容是什麼樣的禁慮讓他們的笑容消失需要溫暖跟呵護的他們落入司法最後保護網中 |
| transcript.whisperx[422].start |
11863.487 |
| transcript.whisperx[422].end |
11887.016 |
| transcript.whisperx[422].text |
是寫作文是不是?寫劇本啊?還是這是深層式AI寫的?本席也覺得好奇跟納悶奇怪怎麼會突然變那麼有文青的文字在裡面我打進去Google發覺這就是2019年司法院的新聞稿一模一樣文字直接複製貼上2019年新聞稿拿來今天2024年的3月的報告好意思嗎?那好意思嗎? |
| transcript.whisperx[423].start |
11891.816 |
| transcript.whisperx[423].end |
11905.108 |
| transcript.whisperx[423].text |
這是真實的狀態文清司的語言是真實的狀態我都不想講說 朝委不知道能不能同意啊你拿第9屆立法院那個時候的新聞稿複製直接貼上然後來到今年第11屆的立法院來搪塞幫個忙 |
| transcript.whisperx[424].start |
11907.884 |
| transcript.whisperx[424].end |
11930.224 |
| transcript.whisperx[424].text |
要人我都同意跟支持我們應該要有足夠的緣分但是不要用這種不要以為說你們交出來的書面資料我沒有看今天抱歉部長讓您這邊站了5分鐘法務部的報告我有看司法院的報告我有看內政部的報告我有看但是就沒有看過這種拿過去文字直接複製貼上的報告 |
| transcript.whisperx[425].start |
11932.025 |
| transcript.whisperx[425].end |
11932.165 |
| transcript.whisperx[425].text |
以上,謝謝。 |
| transcript.whisperx[426].start |
11965.493 |
| transcript.whisperx[426].end |
11987.556 |
| transcript.whisperx[426].text |
主席請部長還有我們司法院的謝廷長有請蔡部長有請謝廷長吳司長還有教育部司長請各位好幾位長官請教一下對我們面對這麼多的青少年的犯罪 |
| transcript.whisperx[427].start |
11989.425 |
| transcript.whisperx[427].end |
12007.129 |
| transcript.whisperx[427].text |
不能說是層出不窮幾乎所有的學校都有霸凌事件而且越來越嚴重不管是我們的教育出問題還是我們的法治出問題還是我們的觀念出問題部長給你15秒請你回答一下如何防制 |
| transcript.whisperx[428].start |
12010.879 |
| transcript.whisperx[428].end |
12011.879 |
| transcript.whisperx[428].text |
那過去法務部做了什麼? |
| transcript.whisperx[429].start |
12028.377 |
| transcript.whisperx[429].end |
12052.395 |
| transcript.whisperx[429].text |
法務部很努力跟校園的法治教育深入到各個學校裡面法務部做了什麼法務部做了很多在預防方面我們也跟學校合作那如果犯了罪有送到我們的法務部跟哪一個學校合作我們各地都有各地的地檢署檢察官都到各學校去演講講法治國中國小嗎國中國小也有 |
| transcript.whisperx[430].start |
12057.165 |
| transcript.whisperx[430].end |
12084.063 |
| transcript.whisperx[430].text |
你把你所有執行的狀況寫份報告給本席。好。那您覺得有沒有成效?呃,成效是一定有,但是是不是還有可以再加強的地方?是整體提升還是再下降?應該是有幫助啦。有幫助。所以認為現在從法務部來關心青少年犯罪之後到現在從校園做起 |
| transcript.whisperx[431].start |
12085.117 |
| transcript.whisperx[431].end |
12109.495 |
| transcript.whisperx[431].text |
部長認為是有成效?多少有?我不敢說絕對是所以是降低還是提升?青少年犯罪是在不斷地下降還是在逐步提升?犯罪當然從數字來看是增加不過這增加因素很多所以部長是不是要來跟司法院跟教育部一起來討論為什麼成效不髒?要對症下藥對不對? |
| transcript.whisperx[432].start |
12113.689 |
| transcript.whisperx[432].end |
12115.79 |
| transcript.whisperx[432].text |
現在我們的犯罪已經往下延伸到 |
| transcript.whisperx[433].start |
12144.062 |
| transcript.whisperx[433].end |
12170.069 |
| transcript.whisperx[433].text |
甚至國小過去在社會上只要吸毒連黑社會組織都要把他趕出來現在吸毒是各黑社會組織最主要的經濟來源法務部跟司法院到底做了多少努力現在吸毒人口已經向下到國小警長知道嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[434].start |
12171.588 |
| transcript.whisperx[434].end |
12198.17 |
| transcript.whisperx[434].text |
我們跟委員報告其實在行政院在反讀政策2.0那司法院的少年法庭也一直跟行政院大概也在法務部下本期瞭解嘛你又開始在開始照你們的章程又開始正義宣導一次問題你們效果在哪裡呢跟委員報告我們越是偏鄉現在稀土人口越來越多 |
| transcript.whisperx[435].start |
12200.506 |
| transcript.whisperx[435].end |
12219.811 |
| transcript.whisperx[435].text |
我們的整治的成效到底在哪裡?請你不要再剪貼,送一份這10年你們努力的成果以及跟實際產生有沒有效果,送一份資料給本市。好的,沒有問題,謝謝委員。來,請教一步。委員好。 |
| transcript.whisperx[436].start |
12223.673 |
| transcript.whisperx[436].end |
12237.349 |
| transcript.whisperx[436].text |
請問教育部跟法務部司法院橫向聯繫．對於預防犯罪往下宣導。市長你們做的情況怎麼樣? |
| transcript.whisperx[437].start |
12238.083 |
| transcript.whisperx[437].end |
12239.123 |
| transcript.whisperx[437].text |
市長本期聽你這樣講真的滿難過的因為現在 |
| transcript.whisperx[438].start |
12267.95 |
| transcript.whisperx[438].end |
12295.438 |
| transcript.whisperx[438].text |
施道之不存也久矣。如果現在我們的校園裡面連對老師的尊重都不是普羅的常識,何來有同儕之間的尊重?校園暴力不斷的發生,北京現在隆重的請你回去跟部裡面、跟部長好好商量,要怎麼樣重新落實 |
| transcript.whisperx[439].start |
12297.193 |
| transcript.whisperx[439].end |
12322.038 |
| transcript.whisperx[439].text |
我們教育往下雜耕我們的四維八德禮義廉恥應該讓我們的孩子重新來認識弟子規該了解的讓他們去了解市長可以嗎跟委員報告那個有關品德教育這個部分確實非常重要重要的一些核心價值應該你們現在四維八德還有沒有 |
| transcript.whisperx[440].start |
12323.558 |
| transcript.whisperx[440].end |
12327.2 |
| transcript.whisperx[440].text |
市長,你是一個教育工作者,尤其在教育部。本期問你一個這麼簡單的問題,視為巴德李一連齒,要不要把他找回來,要不要? |
| transcript.whisperx[441].start |
12352.864 |
| transcript.whisperx[441].end |
12362.09 |
| transcript.whisperx[441].text |
您贊同請要落實現在的孩子都不知道什麼叫四維八德什麼叫禮義廉恥人家校園裡面一個最基本的一個教育的園區裡面就是讓孩子好好的去學習 |
| transcript.whisperx[442].start |
12381.758 |
| transcript.whisperx[442].end |
12410.641 |
| transcript.whisperx[442].text |
你們的教科書不要再把孩子洗腦了應該給他們的文化教給他們自由去灌溉不要把一些政治邏輯擺進去從教科書教開始注意現在14歲以下不罰現在的小孩子說我14歲以下不罰怎麼樣大人又在講 |
| transcript.whisperx[443].start |
12413.434 |
| transcript.whisperx[443].end |
12442.695 |
| transcript.whisperx[443].text |
廢死小孩子又在講14歲不罰讓更多的幫派組織現在小孩子發育得快小學畢業就相當於在我們那個年代高中生的題材到了國一國二還沒餵滿14歲已經成為幫派吸收最主要的對象不罰什麼都可以做 |
| transcript.whisperx[444].start |
12444.008 |
| transcript.whisperx[444].end |
12471.46 |
| transcript.whisperx[444].text |
這就是台灣教育的悲哀啊所以今天部長到現在為止自私欲憤啊現在我們的孩子到底怎麼辦教育不斷用錯誤的方向在倒影該有的尊師重道現在已經忘記了有這回事大人又在講廢死不要有死刑 |
| transcript.whisperx[445].start |
12474.491 |
| transcript.whisperx[445].end |
12490.919 |
| transcript.whisperx[445].text |
犯罪者無所懼怕。反正不會判死刑部長你對廢死的看法怎麼樣法務部的立場是依法執行依法執行是你們執行的情況怎麼樣 |
| transcript.whisperx[446].start |
12492.213 |
| transcript.whisperx[446].end |
12519.933 |
| transcript.whisperx[446].text |
我們還要看上頭臉色是嗎?照法律的程序來走520到了是不是要開兩槍給大家聽一聽看?下來就是如此是嗎?我們不是用這種態度來看待這個死刑的執行一定要依法那讓所有的救濟程序走完依法到現在為止有多少還沒有執行?37位確定的判決死刑為什麼還沒有執行?因為他還有一些救濟的程序在進行當中 |
| transcript.whisperx[447].start |
12521.021 |
| transcript.whisperx[447].end |
12537.092 |
| transcript.whisperx[447].text |
究竟程序結束以後呢?該執行就執行。確定嗎?當然法務部一定是依法。那部長除了依法以外現在對於啊廢死這個議題部長的看法究竟如何? |
| transcript.whisperx[448].start |
12539.289 |
| transcript.whisperx[448].end |
12566.579 |
| transcript.whisperx[448].text |
我還是依法律的規定來做法律認為我們所有的就緒程序都已經完畢了那該要執行的時候我就要執行所以沒有修法的話你就按現有法律執行就對了當然希望部長挺直腰桿把該做的事做清楚另外對青少年犯罪的問題現在越來越嚴重還是從而燒而虐的部分 |
| transcript.whisperx[449].start |
12567.677 |
| transcript.whisperx[449].end |
12596.018 |
| transcript.whisperx[449].text |
教育部跟司法院跟法務部本希望希望你們密切的密切的一起來針對防制而虐的部分先做起如果一個孩子自幼就被嚴重的虐待他未來對整個國家社會的一個人生觀是完全扭曲的他當時受到多少虐待未來會多少輩子在報復這個社會 |
| transcript.whisperx[450].start |
12598.015 |
| transcript.whisperx[450].end |
12627.721 |
| transcript.whisperx[450].text |
完完全全是社會的未報單會造成國家多麼嚴重的一個問題所以我們本席現在本黨團也提出了對於青少年兒虐的部分幼兒兒虐的部分要加重提醒一定要用重點來克制這樣的不斷的這種歪風希望未來對於青少年在校園的部分的 |
| transcript.whisperx[451].start |
12628.243 |
| transcript.whisperx[451].end |
12654.736 |
| transcript.whisperx[451].text |
犯罪防制能夠把他的趨勢下降不過部長你該給本席的報告你還是要送來本席會仔細的拜讀研讀看一下法務部到底做了哪些還有司法院聽長也請你把你們的成效如何過程如何措施如何清楚的寫一份報告給本席不要用剪貼的不要用剪貼政經宣導不用送給我 |
| transcript.whisperx[452].start |
12658.611 |
| transcript.whisperx[452].end |
12671.88 |
| transcript.whisperx[452].text |
市長就拜託啊,這個教育啊,如果我們再沒有把它做好,台灣的社會會成為什麼樣的亂象。好不好,謝謝。好,謝謝副總召,謝謝部長、廳長跟吳市長。接下來有請吳委員私謠質詢。 |
| transcript.whisperx[453].start |
12694.651 |
| transcript.whisperx[453].end |
12704.581 |
| transcript.whisperx[453].text |
謝主席,有請部長跟周署長。好,有請蔡部長跟教政署周署長。委員好。 |
| transcript.whisperx[454].start |
12706.464 |
| transcript.whisperx[454].end |
12729.252 |
| transcript.whisperx[454].text |
兩位早安一加一大於二監獄友善犬貓yes or no我跟我們的嘉賓總召心有靈犀有志一同我們今天同時都藉由這個寶貴的質詢機會拋出一個非常正向的要求我們全面來評估而且我希望是制度化讓監獄的友善犬貓能夠上路那 |
| transcript.whisperx[455].start |
12735.774 |
| transcript.whisperx[455].end |
12762.571 |
| transcript.whisperx[455].text |
國會實在非常充滿暴力所以可愛動物區我們不應當是野獸動物區國會應當是可愛動物區教育很重要大家都心中要有祥和跟溫暖所以今天就教於大家有一些例子跟內容剛剛嘉賓焦偉也已經分享過那我就盡量從其他的案例來補充我的論述好下一頁部長你是貓派還是狗派 |
| transcript.whisperx[456].start |
12764.43 |
| transcript.whisperx[456].end |
12783.432 |
| transcript.whisperx[456].text |
我比較傾向狗派所以家裡有養狗有養貓有養狗以前有以前有所以狗是人類最忠實的朋友那下一頁五四要我本人呢我既是貓奴也是狗婆而且我曾經在立法院有一隻立法院非常有名的狗狗叫ZAZA |
| transcript.whisperx[457].start |
12784.264 |
| transcript.whisperx[457].end |
12808.483 |
| transcript.whisperx[457].text |
那中間這個插畫呢是社群上的年輕朋友為我畫的因為吳思瑤、思瑤姐姐有三貓一狗我的Zaza、Luna、Sunny跟Happy三隻貓那都非常謝謝年輕朋友為我畫畫還把貓狗一起入畫我們真的希望讓國會不要有暴力之氣如果國會能夠有更多的貓狗 |
| transcript.whisperx[458].start |
12809.491 |
| transcript.whisperx[458].end |
12820.737 |
| transcript.whisperx[458].text |
其實不會有人在咆哮不會有人在拍桌因為動物就是有這麼神奇的療癒的正向的力量好下一頁透過專業的訓練 |
| transcript.whisperx[459].start |
12823.297 |
| transcript.whisperx[459].end |
12842.397 |
| transcript.whisperx[459].text |
服務權的多元功能可以貢獻社會服務權包括治療權治療病痛中的人們包括我們都很熟悉的助聽權跟導盲權他有非常明確的訓練項目還有對於心理健康的自閉症的治療權 |
| transcript.whisperx[460].start |
12845.24 |
| transcript.whisperx[460].end |
12854.15 |
| transcript.whisperx[460].text |
還有借助犬借助犬就是幫助行動不便的人協助他來打理日常的生活所以狗是可以透過訓練發揮更多貢獻社會的能量下一頁 |
| transcript.whisperx[461].start |
12859.447 |
| transcript.whisperx[461].end |
12875.544 |
| transcript.whisperx[461].text |
剛剛我們的召委也分享了因為這是本席的選區臺北榮總的歐巴那臺北榮總陳為民院長常常會傳歐巴的故事給我每一個故事都太感人了狗狗可以做到人類做不到的事 |
| transcript.whisperx[462].start |
12876.57 |
| transcript.whisperx[462].end |
12898.701 |
| transcript.whisperx[462].text |
歐巴這隻狗狗是全國唯一經過完整訓練注點在醫院的安寧病房所以在榮總的大德安寧病房由這個他曾經是退役的導盲犬那真的陪伴了很多人臨終的生命寶貴的時光所以歐巴治療犬可以在醫院裡頭下一頁 |
| transcript.whisperx[463].start |
12901.462 |
| transcript.whisperx[463].end |
12930.202 |
| transcript.whisperx[463].text |
國際的權威期刊這是英國的權威期刊他們透過長時間的觀察就以校園的服務權那經過長時間的觀察可以降低學生族群60%的焦慮感以及他們的壓力所以這是有科學實證的我右手邊秀出來的也是在本席的選區知山國小一支非常有名的特教犬 |
| transcript.whisperx[464].start |
12931.303 |
| transcript.whisperx[464].end |
12937.255 |
| transcript.whisperx[464].text |
知山國小這隻犬後來他是travel到各個學校去服務有特教需求的孩子。下一頁。 |
| transcript.whisperx[465].start |
12939.033 |
| transcript.whisperx[465].end |
12968.453 |
| transcript.whisperx[465].text |
校園友善選我可能做的比嘉賓委員多一點點因為我是教育委員會過去在教育委員會我這裡露出露出的就是我士林北投我深入每一個校園去推銷推廣請每一個學校去認養流浪動物帶進學校實踐生命教育益仙國小的Mango新名國中的Bingo文林國小的Happy天母國小的Happy蘭雅國中也有一隻Happy |
| transcript.whisperx[466].start |
12969.333 |
| transcript.whisperx[466].end |
12973.477 |
| transcript.whisperx[466].text |
蘭雅國小有一隻米魯然後有一隻青江國小的骷髏已經離開我們了學校還幫他辦了一個 |
| transcript.whisperx[467].start |
12976.621 |
| transcript.whisperx[467].end |
12977.762 |
| transcript.whisperx[467].text |
提供任何任何任何任何任何任何任 |
| transcript.whisperx[468].start |
13000.424 |
| transcript.whisperx[468].end |
13013.085 |
| transcript.whisperx[468].text |
我要告訴您的是校園友善犬也好或是未來能夠上路的監獄友善犬貓也好我希望的他不是試點他不是試辦他應當是有一個制度化的政策支持 |
| transcript.whisperx[469].start |
13013.891 |
| transcript.whisperx[469].end |
13034.028 |
| transcript.whisperx[469].text |
就以這本書他的協力單位政府部門有農業部給經費有教育部去媒合學校提供教材還有共同編輯的也就是協力這個計畫的民間單位有台灣動物保護行政監督聯盟還有世界愛犬聯盟 |
| transcript.whisperx[470].start |
13034.688 |
| transcript.whisperx[470].end |
13053.422 |
| transcript.whisperx[470].text |
台灣有非常強大的公民團體台灣有非常具有關懷力、行動力的動保團體都可以是讓這個制度予以制度化的重要協力所以我稍後把這本書分享給您就以我在推動校園友善權的經驗下一頁 |
| transcript.whisperx[471].start |
13055.526 |
| transcript.whisperx[471].end |
13079.005 |
| transcript.whisperx[471].text |
有預算有經費有專業的支持我媒合了農業部跟國教署只要學校有意願是新認養動物之家裡面的流浪犬貓給5萬塊每年如果是校園周遭本來就有的流浪犬貓不是去動物之家認養的協助解決在地的流浪貓狗的問題是給4萬塊 |
| transcript.whisperx[472].start |
13081.526 |
| transcript.whisperx[472].end |
13094.87 |
| transcript.whisperx[472].text |
以此類推所以這幾年來經過吳斯堯的努力四年多來補助了463校次農業部跟教育部共同出資1242萬在2023年成功又補助了143個學校認養流浪動物就是這一本裡面寫的 |
| transcript.whisperx[473].start |
13103.832 |
| transcript.whisperx[473].end |
13112.28 |
| transcript.whisperx[473].text |
每一個流浪犬貓在校園都發生了非常重要的教育意義生命教育以及教化的意義所以監獄友善的犬貓可行嗎?讓我多論述一點 |
| transcript.whisperx[474].start |
13120.599 |
| transcript.whisperx[474].end |
13137.591 |
| transcript.whisperx[474].text |
這是我們希望矯正教化受刑人的幾個正向的意義。我想監獄友善犬或貓can help。國際經驗我多分享一點。左邊這個圖是歐洲巴爾幹半島的塞爾維亞。 |
| transcript.whisperx[475].start |
13138.953 |
| transcript.whisperx[475].end |
13165.846 |
| transcript.whisperx[475].text |
他們的監獄是歐洲最擁擠的監獄之一。空間很小,獸型人很多,但是他們想方設法的引進了犬貓,主要是犬,給予了這些獸型人一個互助共生的關係。甚至塞爾維亞的政府說這是他們國家推動過最有意義也最成功的社會化計劃。 |
| transcript.whisperx[476].start |
13167.487 |
| transcript.whisperx[476].end |
13195.61 |
| transcript.whisperx[476].text |
這是一個正向的案例右邊的是美國的印第安納監獄大哥、那個恰靈恰好的大哥也變暖男他們把流浪的動物尤其是受虐的貓咪送到監獄裡這些大哥變暖男這些流氓、黑道都一夕之間變成最有關懷心的人這都是國際的案例有貓有狗的經驗下一頁 |
| transcript.whisperx[477].start |
13197.318 |
| transcript.whisperx[477].end |
13217.156 |
| transcript.whisperx[477].text |
美國華盛頓女子監獄我是看了這個研究報告我才知道哦原來女性進入受刑人進入社會他其實再犯率是高的因為他被貼上的這個污名化的標籤很嚴重他在社會化的過程比男性還要辛苦所以呢他們把貓狗送到監獄裡頭訓練這些女性 |
| transcript.whisperx[478].start |
13220.53 |
| transcript.whisperx[478].end |
13241.558 |
| transcript.whisperx[478].text |
首很巧的專材：訓練這些女子受刑人成為寵物護理技術師、高級美容師、服務犬的訓練師。美國政府投入了1130萬美元。參與計劃的結果是什麼?三年內再犯率只有3%。這是一個正向的案例。下一頁。 |
| transcript.whisperx[479].start |
13242.418 |
| transcript.whisperx[479].end |
13269.135 |
| transcript.whisperx[479].text |
我再分享一個美國經驗就是跟民間團體合作臺灣有太多民間團體可以協助這樣的計畫他們把這些訓練犬送進俄亥俄州監獄、肯德基監獄然後呢訓練這些獸型人成為訓犬員未來出了社會就帶著在獄中跟他一起陪伴的狗狗一起去服務更多人他學得一技之長 |
| transcript.whisperx[480].start |
13270.478 |
| transcript.whisperx[480].end |
13291.925 |
| transcript.whisperx[480].text |
我分享了國際景演下頁。國內行不行下頁。剛剛嘉賓趙偉也分享過了桃園的太原監獄他們收留了監獄旁邊23隻流浪貓然後去教化這些監獄中的受刑人23隻流浪貓全部送養成功很多都跟著受刑人回家 |
| transcript.whisperx[481].start |
13292.725 |
| transcript.whisperx[481].end |
13315.325 |
| transcript.whisperx[481].text |
下一頁而這個你們大家都非常津津樂道的新竹監獄犬訓班因為疫情的關係從2006年開始到2022年停了這個計畫非常的成功前前後後47名受刑人訓練出84隻流浪犬而這些受刑人再犯率是零 |
| transcript.whisperx[482].start |
13316.775 |
| transcript.whisperx[482].end |
13330.655 |
| transcript.whisperx[482].text |
所以下一頁我知道你們會說有困難空間是不是足夠因為超收的問題很嚴重但是我要告訴你們剛剛塞爾維亞的那個案例他們是全歐洲最擁擠的監獄可是他們可以實踐 |
| transcript.whisperx[483].start |
13332.695 |
| transcript.whisperx[483].end |
13352.636 |
| transcript.whisperx[483].text |
機關人力不足嗎?我也以我剛剛制度化的經驗分享給你們。我們有獸醫師公會可以合作。現在教育部的校園有篡權,無資料已經媒合各縣市政府的獸醫師公會協助進到學校裡頭幫忙學校如果犬貓發生任何的疾病或是定期的健康檢查,獸醫師都進駐到學校。 |
| transcript.whisperx[484].start |
13354.818 |
| transcript.whisperx[484].end |
13375.848 |
| transcript.whisperx[484].text |
定期,未來監獄也可以。我們有太多的專業團體,包括剛剛嘉賓教委分享的屏東、屏科大的這些專業學系。經費會不會不足呢?也不是問題。我們也可以去跟農業部合作,就以校園友善權制度化的經驗來做一些經費的分擔。 |
| transcript.whisperx[485].start |
13377.589 |
| transcript.whisperx[485].end |
13394.632 |
| transcript.whisperx[485].text |
所以事在人為下一頁最後一頁我希望剛剛嘉賓委員壓了一個月的時間我就尊重你們一個月的時間去提出言議不只對於矯正學校可以引進友善犬貓各個監獄你們可以優先評估哪些在空間比較available |
| transcript.whisperx[486].start |
13395.333 |
| transcript.whisperx[486].end |
13421.448 |
| transcript.whisperx[486].text |
哪些可能是有這樣比較就近就有大學可以支援就近就有很強的獸醫師公會可以協力或是哪一些動保團體我都很樂意幫您媒合動保團體一加一大於二農業部也已經成立為部現在有一個專責的動物保護司他們有更強大的量能一加一大於二幫助獸型人也協助流浪動物 |
| transcript.whisperx[487].start |
13422.929 |
| transcript.whisperx[487].end |
13432.817 |
| transcript.whisperx[487].text |
兩個委員同一個論述跟主張給你們double的壓力。部長綜合回應。不會有壓力。我們非常認同這樣的看法。我們會積極的來推動。 |
| transcript.whisperx[488].start |
13435.123 |
| transcript.whisperx[488].end |
13457.001 |
| transcript.whisperx[488].text |
我們希望不是只有試點而已喔,它要制度化。唯有制度化這樣一個校園友善犬貓也好推廣到監獄友善犬貓,它可以成為一個長長久久的永續政策。好不好,我們一起加油,謝謝。好,謝謝吳委員,謝謝蔡部長,謝謝周署長。接下來,有請陳委員培育質詢。 |
| transcript.whisperx[489].start |
13465.253 |
| transcript.whisperx[489].end |
13473.427 |
| transcript.whisperx[489].text |
好謝謝主席那這邊要有請教育部還有矯正署謝謝有請教育部吳司長和矯正署的周署長 |
| transcript.whisperx[490].start |
13479.38 |
| transcript.whisperx[490].end |
13505.454 |
| transcript.whisperx[490].text |
好我們就先開始好了昨天新聞事件我相信我就不再多說教育部跟矯正署應該都知道我們的學校出事了但是我要說因為這個學校在一個月內有兩次相關新聞事件我們今天來提出這個問題我要首先強調我們沒有要苛責第一線的同仁因為我們知道在矯正學校裡面所有的老師跟行政人員工作壓力都非常非常的大 |
| transcript.whisperx[491].start |
13506.414 |
| transcript.whisperx[491].end |
13524.97 |
| transcript.whisperx[491].text |
但是我們也尊重假設事後有任何的檢討機制跟討論的會議我們都絕對尊重可是我要提醒目前我們知道矯正署在跟教育部合作關於這個矯正學校裡面各式各樣的事情其實兩個部會看起來應該有一些落差導致於其實矯正學校現場不是我們看起來這麼樂觀我們先來看第一個事情在110 |
| transcript.whisperx[492].start |
13530.714 |
| transcript.whisperx[492].end |
13553.607 |
| transcript.whisperx[492].text |
110年監察院有一個糾正的條文那我們後續去查了到目前為止這個案子都是屬於未結案發生了什麼事情呢對於疑似或者是具有身心障礙學生毫無任何輔導處置方法甚至警示與借據約制名為保護學生但是監察院說這是一種拘禁而且未曾請求專業協助 |
| transcript.whisperx[493].start |
13555.528 |
| transcript.whisperx[493].end |
13555.709 |
| transcript.whisperx[493].text |
有所為師。 |
| transcript.whisperx[494].start |
13571.664 |
| transcript.whisperx[494].end |
13586.623 |
| transcript.whisperx[494].text |
目前的進度是?首先說明一下這個監察院糾正之後教育部的國教署跟法務部矯正署這邊其實都有定期召開這個指導委員會定期召開那最近一次是什麼時候? |
| transcript.whisperx[495].start |
13589.485 |
| transcript.whisperx[495].end |
13604.114 |
| transcript.whisperx[495].text |
一月份一月份那我們可以跟你們要相關的開會報告嗎因為我們很想要知道矯正學校雖然我們剛剛舉的新聞是短評但是我們知道目前有四所矯正學校其實他們有非常非常多的困境喔都需要教育部跟矯正署這邊來積極的合作我們來看一下 |
| transcript.whisperx[496].start |
13606.175 |
| transcript.whisperx[496].end |
13606.195 |
| transcript.whisperx[496].text |
〔廣告〕 |
| transcript.whisperx[497].start |
13639.197 |
| transcript.whisperx[497].end |
13654.725 |
| transcript.whisperx[497].text |
在少年的部分他最需要的是關懷跟陪伴那也是很感謝教育部的國教署一直有挹注一些資源包括心理師、社工師到今年年底 |
| transcript.whisperx[498].start |
13655.545 |
| transcript.whisperx[498].end |
13673.848 |
| transcript.whisperx[498].text |
他支援4所,矯正學校有12名新設人員,心理師9名,3名是社工師。我們希望說這12名新設人員不要,因為他預定是在今年年底就要退場了。我們是希望 |
| transcript.whisperx[499].start |
13675.209 |
| transcript.whisperx[499].end |
13692.547 |
| transcript.whisperx[499].text |
就沒有希望說能夠再繼續兩位現在在我面前很好我謝謝那個腳上鼠告訴我我相信在場所有人聽到應該都會覺得更加擔心12月就要退場所以預算的關係還是年度計劃的關係還是退場之後其實會再有其他的安排還是目前未定 |
| transcript.whisperx[500].start |
13694.635 |
| transcript.whisperx[500].end |
13707.987 |
| transcript.whisperx[500].text |
請國教署幫忙好謝謝國教署報告那到107年開始我們都有對四個小學生學校沒有我要問12月底以後12月底以後他們如果有再來申請我們再試情況會來做繼續協助因為 |
| transcript.whisperx[501].start |
13709.548 |
| transcript.whisperx[501].end |
13723.971 |
| transcript.whisperx[501].text |
他們一定會來申請我告訴你因為發生這些事情而且大家現在要拿著這些孩子開刀所有人都在問孩子後續出了事情但是我們要問孩子被送進學校我告訴你他們一定會來申請對吧腳站署你們一定會去申請可是國教署的態度是視情況嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[502].start |
13728.421 |
| transcript.whisperx[502].end |
13741.58 |
| transcript.whisperx[502].text |
我們可不可以更具體的要求是因為經費的關係現在人員不足的關係還是因為沒有老師沒有社工師沒有心理師有意願進去因為我要講的很大的嚴重的問題就是 |
| transcript.whisperx[503].start |
13743.106 |
| transcript.whisperx[503].end |
13759.239 |
| transcript.whisperx[503].text |
我想要再次說我覺得我們真的必須要回頭去想一想其實名陽中學跟城鎮中學他們在改制後這20多年來的雙軌磨合其實已經有還蠻多不錯的經驗甚且我們在跟這些學校校長跟主任老師溝通的時候他們都知道後續 |
| transcript.whisperx[504].start |
13760.78 |
| transcript.whisperx[504].end |
13782.881 |
| transcript.whisperx[504].text |
他們其實是很願意做經驗分享的可是有沒有機會為端平跟麗智兩個學校做專業的研習分享校園治理經驗我覺得這個部分矯正署也許可以就這四所學校進行溝通另外就是其實教育部跟國教署、國教署跟學特司這邊必須要給予大力的支持我真的不知道現在的困境是什麼可是如果我們都只想著懲罰這些孩子如同剛剛您說的這些孩子需要的關懷跟陪伴 |
| transcript.whisperx[505].start |
13785.923 |
| transcript.whisperx[505].end |
13809.666 |
| transcript.whisperx[505].text |
為什麼他們特別需要關懷跟陪伴所有人都知道大部分的孩子會走上這條路都是因為原生家庭的匱乏不管是關懷的匱乏資源的匱乏導致他們進入學校之後再度走上這條路然後最後走進這四所矯正學校所以我時間有限我想要後續拜託國教署還有矯正署持續協助這些孩子把相關資源帶進學校這個部分我們也會跟你們持續討論可以嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[506].start |
13811.127 |
| transcript.whisperx[506].end |
13815.388 |
| transcript.whisperx[506].text |
好,謝謝,謝謝主席,謝謝。好,謝謝陳委員,謝謝市長、署長。好,接下來有請張委員、雅玲質詢。謝謝張委員。有請那個署長跟那個教育部。請周署長和吳市長。委員好。 |
| transcript.whisperx[507].start |
13842.366 |
| transcript.whisperx[507].end |
13870.354 |
| transcript.whisperx[507].text |
你好我接續了剛剛那個培瑞委員的問題我繼續問就是我關於國教署這次的事件裡面國教署因為我支援這相關能力只有到年底嘛那這大概什麼時候可以給我們一些相關的訊息告訴我們到底有沒有辦法延續因為我知道就在這個4個學校裡面目前還有缺額55個那我也不曉得說我們現在的規劃是預計在什麼時候會聘主呢還是現在在聘的時候有什麼樣子的問題可不可以說明一下 |
| transcript.whisperx[508].start |
13872.786 |
| transcript.whisperx[508].end |
13887.094 |
| transcript.whisperx[508].text |
跟委員報告一下切合55名的部分我們有聘用代理教師那經我們的一個調查在民洋中學他已經有聘用兩名 |
| transcript.whisperx[509].start |
13888.535 |
| transcript.whisperx[509].end |
13902.258 |
| transcript.whisperx[509].text |
代理教師切額8名、城鎮以聘用4名、切額5名、端品以聘用15名、切額15名、吏治以聘用7名、切額27名等。而城鎮及名養教師各切額2名。 |
| transcript.whisperx[510].start |
13912.04 |
| transcript.whisperx[510].end |
13933.193 |
| transcript.whisperx[510].text |
對,我想知道說我們接下來,因為我知道有缺額啦,那我知道說我們接下來要怎麼去補足這一塊,因為還是回到剛剛培語委員講的嘛,我們到底投歸什麼樣的資源給他們,協助他們,讓他們未來離開之後不要再回來嘛,所以這個部分我們的規劃是什麼?現在是因為薪資不夠嗎?還是因為怎麼樣,大家為什麼還會有這麼大的缺額? |
| transcript.whisperx[511].start |
13934.976 |
| transcript.whisperx[511].end |
13950.278 |
| transcript.whisperx[511].text |
當然代理教師他的薪水沒有像編制那麼好但是我們也會積極來招募剛剛也有提到我們會再跟教育部再好好來做一個研商 |
| transcript.whisperx[512].start |
13951.92 |
| transcript.whisperx[512].end |
13971.44 |
| transcript.whisperx[512].text |
這是不是大概什麼時候可以提供給我們你們一些相關的計畫跟規劃然後這件事情我也要特別要求就是這一件事情啊小孩子過去應該非常清楚知道有這個自習課的規律才對但是為什麼這一次會要求我一定要出去打籃球這部分是不是也可以有一些詳細的調查是不是都可以在一個月內給我相關的報告呢 |
| transcript.whisperx[513].start |
13973.015 |
| transcript.whisperx[513].end |
13978.76 |
| transcript.whisperx[513].text |
我看到這個報告裡面就是我們在112年的工作報告目前是沒有特教編制的而且特教相關的業務都是由特教教師來兼任業務承辦人 |
| transcript.whisperx[514].start |
13996.577 |
| transcript.whisperx[514].end |
13997.319 |
| transcript.whisperx[514].text |
我們現在到底有多少的輔導老師呢? |
| transcript.whisperx[515].start |
13997.319 |
| transcript.whisperx[515].end |
13997.579 |
| transcript.whisperx[515].text |
在這個端品中選裡面? |
| transcript.whisperx[516].start |
14009.499 |
| transcript.whisperx[516].end |
14027.087 |
| transcript.whisperx[516].text |
登委員報告齁在燉品其實他在編制上有3名食物上呢?食物上呢?那個OK他他並沒有這個缺額啦缺額在城鎮跟民養我剛才報告是各缺兩個他們比較當務之急 |
| transcript.whisperx[517].start |
14029.608 |
| transcript.whisperx[517].end |
14058.279 |
| transcript.whisperx[517].text |
那我想我們也是在做一個評估就是說我們現在如果小孩子狀況比較不穩定的時候在特教的部分我們怎麼處理然後我們怎麼樣來協助這部分是不是也可以再做一些比較詳細的我們人力上面是不是要再做一些調整我的意思是這樣心腹人力是不是要調整這部分也可以再給我們一些相關的資料做一些討論那再來就是說我要講的是青少年的犯罪的問題就是說我們再從毒品這個角度來看我們的整體的犯罪率犯罪率是下降的 |
| transcript.whisperx[518].start |
14060.049 |
| transcript.whisperx[518].end |
14081.762 |
| transcript.whisperx[518].text |
那校安通報的藥物濫用也是下降的所以看起來我們好像做得很不錯對不對但是呢我這再讀了一下一個食藥署所公佈的數據藥物濫用案件紀檢驗統計資料我發現我們的數據前面的前五名的物質濫用比例是從97降到了81% |
| transcript.whisperx[519].start |
14083.743 |
| transcript.whisperx[519].end |
14097.014 |
| transcript.whisperx[519].text |
我覺得這份數據在告訴我們什麼告訴我們說青少年使用的物質其實是多元化越來越多元了所以呢而且這裡面其中特別我想要講的是咖啡包和笑器 |
| transcript.whisperx[520].start |
14098.993 |
| transcript.whisperx[520].end |
14113.78 |
| transcript.whisperx[520].text |
這兩個特質是第一個他非常便宜而且很容易取得第二個他很方便攜帶那也就是說他在哪裡都可以使用第三個他目前的管制機制還不成熟也就是說像那個咖啡包他的效力很快就消失了被通報警察根本抓不到他 |
| transcript.whisperx[521].start |
14114.64 |
| transcript.whisperx[521].end |
14142.875 |
| transcript.whisperx[521].text |
所以這個是一個很大的問題那或者使用校期他也只能以社會秩序維護法來處理而是這三點呢就是因為讓青少年覺得說反正我也沒有什麼要擔負的責任他就更容易使用所以我看到2018年我們食藥署也有做一個全國物質使用調查他們在哪裡使用為什麼外面都抓不到因為他們都在學都在家裡或是朋友家使用所以這個部分我覺得我們也是必須的積極的去面對 |
| transcript.whisperx[522].start |
14144.881 |
| transcript.whisperx[522].end |
14164.011 |
| transcript.whisperx[522].text |
所以我想要請法務部還有教育部還有衛福部和警政署可以來告訴我說我們要如何應對剛剛所謂的物質濫用多元化的現象以及它使用地點這麼分散我們要如何的去處理還有物質的管制上不成熟的這些是不是可以給我一個簡單的一個說明呢 |
| transcript.whisperx[523].start |
14167.628 |
| transcript.whisperx[523].end |
14193.547 |
| transcript.whisperx[523].text |
跟委員說明了其實那個新興毒品是我目前在校園裡頭在毒品宣導的部分最著力的部分因為各種不管軟糖也好咖啡包也好他就是想要誘騙孩子容易被騙不小心誤用那我想這個部分我們都有模型而且現在國中小的部分都強調要入班宣導百分之百每一個班都要進行宣導知道如何不要去用同時知道他對身體可能造成哪些傷害 |
| transcript.whisperx[524].start |
14194.209 |
| transcript.whisperx[524].end |
14212.318 |
| transcript.whisperx[524].text |
好 那沒關係 因為時間有限我想我們可以針對這個反讀的文宣上面是不是真的貼近了青少年使用的情境來給他一些說法因為就我來看我覺得這其實是非常不符合他面對朋友的誘惑的時候或是勸說的時候他要怎麼去應對所以這個我們是不是可以在會後約約詳細的討論 謝謝好 謝謝張委員 謝謝市長、署長接下來有請吳佩奕委員質詢 |
| transcript.whisperx[525].start |
14227.837 |
| transcript.whisperx[525].end |
14255.509 |
| transcript.whisperx[525].text |
謝謝主席我請法務部我請法務部蔡部長委員好部長好這個月就是前幾天監察院發布一個彈劾文針對我們臺北地檢署的檢察官陳立儒因為這個新聞稿沒有進行名字的遮蔽所以以下我就直接就這個宣讀這個名字想請問這個案件部長知不知道 |
| transcript.whisperx[526].start |
14256.394 |
| transcript.whisperx[526].end |
14275.676 |
| transcript.whisperx[526].text |
知道因為這個案件它發生的場所就在我的選區萬華區尤其是牽涉到性騷擾我認為對於我們司法人員對我們法界對我們檢察官的形象以及對於我們社會對司法的信任是一個非常大的傷害 |
| transcript.whisperx[527].start |
14277.197 |
| transcript.whisperx[527].end |
14303.766 |
| transcript.whisperx[527].text |
這個案件的發生呢是來自於我們這一位陳麗如檢察官跟一位女性大學生發生了行車的糾紛在這個調解的過程當中這個檢察官向這位女大學生提出說你可以以性行為來去折抵你的賠償金我們台北地檢署是不是也針對這個性騷案件有進行過調查 |
| transcript.whisperx[528].start |
14306.707 |
| transcript.whisperx[528].end |
14332.236 |
| transcript.whisperx[528].text |
有他還送給我們檢察官評鑑委員會來評鑑是在這個調查你們地檢署自己的調查報告當中有提到這個誠信檢察官他跟這個女大生提出以性行為來折抵賠償金的時候這個女大生說因為他非常的害怕不知道要如何應對所以他說但是我未成年 |
| transcript.whisperx[529].start |
14333.726 |
| transcript.whisperx[529].end |
14344.949 |
| transcript.whisperx[529].text |
申訴人自稱未成年．但這位成例如檢察官聽到對方未成年．他竟然說我不管你到底有沒有18歲我想請問部長與未成年人用性行為抵賠償有沒有構成對價關係有沒有構成對價 |
| transcript.whisperx[530].start |
14361.858 |
| transcript.whisperx[530].end |
14374.724 |
| transcript.whisperx[530].text |
具體上他如果有構成刑責的話我們也是一會移送假設與未成年人以對價關係來進行性行為有沒有構成兒少的性剝削如果 |
| transcript.whisperx[531].start |
14378.236 |
| transcript.whisperx[531].end |
14404.196 |
| transcript.whisperx[531].text |
證據充足的話我們一定會依法嚴辦。請問這一位檢察官目前我們對他進行什麼樣的懲處?經過檢評會他的決議是由法務部移送懲戒法院來做審理那懲戒法院最近也做了一個判決那我們當然該做的處罰都要做 |
| transcript.whisperx[532].start |
14405.728 |
| transcript.whisperx[532].end |
14416.918 |
| transcript.whisperx[532].text |
我們做了什麼樣的懲處﹖包括成績法案的審理判決之外我們對於他的職務評定也是把評定為未達良好 |
| transcript.whisperx[533].start |
14420.325 |
| transcript.whisperx[533].end |
14429.792 |
| transcript.whisperx[533].text |
我們扣了他3個月的薪水作為罰款因為他違反了檢察官倫理規範第5條同時違反了公務員服務法的第6條但是我現在想要請問部長我覺得這是非常嚴重的問題這一位檢察官可以說是一位二郎檢察官他未來有沒有可能去辦理到性騷擾、性侵害、兒少性剝削相關的案件有沒有可能 |
| transcript.whisperx[534].start |
14450.467 |
| transcript.whisperx[534].end |
14478.663 |
| transcript.whisperx[534].text |
我會要求臺北地檢署一定要嚴加管束怎麼樣進行管束包括他業務的植物上的分配還有嚴刑的來嚴加的注意針對二郎檢察官想請問部長我們有沒有退場的機制如果合乎規定我們會予以退場這個對社會大眾來講部長我認為是對我們司法信任非常大的傷害 |
| transcript.whisperx[535].start |
14480.447 |
| transcript.whisperx[535].end |
14483.39 |
| transcript.whisperx[535].text |
這一位檢察官他目前還在職務上面未來倘若說我們有這個兒少我們有性騷擾的受害人相關的案件接受到這樣檢察官的審理在這個檢察官的觀念裡面他認為與未成年進行性行為來進行對價是沒有問題的 |
| transcript.whisperx[536].start |
14503.635 |
| transcript.whisperx[536].end |
14505.997 |
| transcript.whisperx[536].text |
我們要讓這樣的檢察官來進行審理案件嗎?部長你剛剛已經提出承諾認為我們一定要去嚴格的來做規範針對這個個案絕對不能讓他來審理到我們相關的案件這是對我們受害人的保護但是我也認為針對相關的機制我們應該要來去研擬 |
| transcript.whisperx[537].start |
14524.691 |
| transcript.whisperx[537].end |
14542.486 |
| transcript.whisperx[537].text |
因為未來這樣的案件有可能還會再次發生希望不會發生這對我們社會來講是對我們司法新任非常大的傷害所以你們才提出懲戒因為你們同時也認為這一位檢察官對我們檢察官的榮譽以及尊嚴有重大的傷害嘛所以我認為我們要嚴禮相關的機制好不好好好謝謝謝謝吳委員謝謝蔡部長接下來有請鄭委員天才質詢 |
| transcript.whisperx[538].start |
14572.464 |
| transcript.whisperx[538].end |
14584.028 |
| transcript.whisperx[538].text |
主席各位委員有請教育部有請教育部吳市長委員好市長好是這我們先看這個影片有嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[539].start |
14606.463 |
| transcript.whisperx[539].end |
14606.683 |
| transcript.whisperx[539].text |
為電梯科格鬥賽 |
| transcript.whisperx[540].start |
14631.558 |
| transcript.whisperx[540].end |
14651.677 |
| transcript.whisperx[540].text |
立法院第11屆第1會期司法院第2會期司法院第3會期司法院第4會期司法院第5會期司法院第6會期司法院第7會期司法院第8會期司法院第8會期司法院第9會期司法院第10會期司法院第11會期 |
| transcript.whisperx[541].start |
14656.38 |
| transcript.whisperx[541].end |
14685.379 |
| transcript.whisperx[541].text |
所以我們看這個從這個影片就可以知道今年發生的這麼嚴重如果沒有處理好就會造成未來的犯罪說不定現在已經算犯罪了所以這個部分這個怎麼樣去相關的法治教育跟這個防制 |
| transcript.whisperx[542].start |
14687.185 |
| transcript.whisperx[542].end |
14706.48 |
| transcript.whisperx[542].text |
教育是最重要的學校是第一線後面才有法務部司法單位你看了這個影片你認為應該怎麼去防範或是怎麼去加強法治的教育 |
| transcript.whisperx[543].start |
14707.028 |
| transcript.whisperx[543].end |
14707.889 |
| transcript.whisperx[543].text |
我一直看了今天的報告當然 |
| transcript.whisperx[544].start |
14736.161 |
| transcript.whisperx[544].end |
14762.398 |
| transcript.whisperx[544].text |
做了都做了那怎麼樣去精進怎麼樣去加強這個因為現在老師他也是有限老師也是有限所以你們也提到這個跟跟警政署的這些合作是到底足不足 |
| transcript.whisperx[545].start |
14765.575 |
| transcript.whisperx[545].end |
14791.097 |
| transcript.whisperx[545].text |
應該是這樣講在學校的老師本來就有限了但是怎麼樣去我們看這個就從這個暴力與偏差行為事件的統計來看逐年上升了這是很嚴重的逐年上升所以 |
| transcript.whisperx[546].start |
14794.198 |
| transcript.whisperx[546].end |
14808.253 |
| transcript.whisperx[546].text |
你們今天的報告裡面所提到的到底是有落實還是沒有落實?那落實了那是不是就是不准?就現況的話是不是就是不准? |
| transcript.whisperx[547].start |
14811.181 |
| transcript.whisperx[547].end |
14831.342 |
| transcript.whisperx[547].text |
委員報告我想這個執行上仍然是需要再繼續加強我想因為現在孩子這些暴力跟平常行為其實受到不管家庭、學校或者來自於媒體其實學生可能會看到很多這種包括譬如說我舉例子看到一些暴力的行為因為現在 |
| transcript.whisperx[548].start |
14833.764 |
| transcript.whisperx[548].end |
14859.987 |
| transcript.whisperx[548].text |
網絡資訊確實非常頻繁學生很可能會﹐敏感度會降低或覺得司空見慣也把事為理所當然我想這個觀念都是需要導正的我們看這個暴力事件以偏差行為國小竟然是最多的然後其次是國中、高中都很多 |
| transcript.whisperx[549].start |
14862.093 |
| transcript.whisperx[549].end |
14890.811 |
| transcript.whisperx[549].text |
大學到成年相關的這些比較但是也不少一千多件也不少這個112年所以這樣的一個數據在呈現在你們的資料上但是防範怎麼樣如何去防範恐怕不是一般的法治教育就能夠顯然不足 |
| transcript.whisperx[550].start |
14895.096 |
| transcript.whisperx[550].end |
14913.874 |
| transcript.whisperx[550].text |
這個回去是不是好好的去跨因為不是你可以決定的了,要怎麼去做很重要的要跟學校的老師來討論要跟學校的老師來討論才能夠得到 |
| transcript.whisperx[551].start |
14916.275 |
| transcript.whisperx[551].end |
14924.058 |
| transcript.whisperx[551].text |
適當的建議甚至是有效的建議。好不好?是,我們會再檢討進進。好,謝謝。好,謝謝政委員。謝謝市長。接下來有請林委員、岳勤質詢。 |
| transcript.whisperx[552].start |
14939.964 |
| transcript.whisperx[552].end |
14957.658 |
| transcript.whisperx[552].text |
主席好,有請我們的那個警政署跟法務部部長這邊。好,請刑事警察局周局長跟法務部蔡部長。我先就叫部長,土城國中那個案子,我們大陸很明顯看到一下把孩子丟出來。 |
| transcript.whisperx[553].start |
14958.619 |
| transcript.whisperx[553].end |
14983.576 |
| transcript.whisperx[553].text |
事實上確實會有問題那過去我自己在民間一直在倡導不要做資料轉嫌最好要做關係轉嫌所謂資料轉嫌是嗎而掃全法的確73條有授權說那要後追一年71條有授權說那事實上是要在孩子離開角質體系的時候的前一個月可是這就是最大的問題會變成學校只是去跟你交接資料 |
| transcript.whisperx[554].start |
14984.497 |
| transcript.whisperx[554].end |
15005.553 |
| transcript.whisperx[554].text |
沒有辦法事實上針對於關係轉嫌可是民間團體一直想要進去是說那是不是可以帶著家長帶著跟著社工一起去跟孩子建立關係不過我覺得整個角質體系裏邊在2022年的時候那CRC國際委員審查的時候他也問我們說 |
| transcript.whisperx[555].start |
15006.926 |
| transcript.whisperx[555].end |
15035.937 |
| transcript.whisperx[555].text |
那個主席Duke還講說你們每次讓孩子去面會的時候大概是怎麼樣去採行的那每一次去30分鐘如果我從台北到桃園我如果見孩子30分鐘的話我大概去的意願不是這麼的高每一次都是看30分鐘根本沒有辦法做關係關係轉嫌那以至於就會變成說一出來我們今天社區的社工要接住孩子比幫派跟藥頭還要難 |
| transcript.whisperx[556].start |
15037.196 |
| transcript.whisperx[556].end |
15065.314 |
| transcript.whisperx[556].text |
因為我們過去都沒有關係嘛所以我不知道就是說部長這邊有沒有針對土城國中這個案子之後如果未來要做關係轉嫌你的看法是什麼我非常的同意委員講的轉嫌不是只有文件的轉接而已應該要更關心那如果未來要接收這個小孩子的這些社工人員願意提早介入來關心的話我們非常樂意 |
| transcript.whisperx[557].start |
15065.834 |
| transcript.whisperx[557].end |
15091.183 |
| transcript.whisperx[557].text |
可是每次面會只有30分鐘我不知道現在有沒有改變因為當時前面回答國際委員的時候是這樣子講的法律規定是這樣的但是如果有必要的時候可以因為韓國都有和宿舍是讓家長在那邊跟他們待有一天的一個晚上時間讓他們有辦法否則孩子回到社區裡邊功能不彰的時候那社工又沒有跟他有關係的話那就很難跟他們 |
| transcript.whisperx[558].start |
15092.843 |
| transcript.whisperx[558].end |
15114.737 |
| transcript.whisperx[558].text |
要頭跟幫派比我們更容易找到小孩更容易跟孩子接觸那就沒有辦法去解決問題所以這個是不是請部裡邊去做評估去做討論我覺得實質上我覺得關係轉弦的話國外甚至有到一年的時間那我不知道這邊你在評估大家可以去做到什麼樣的一個程度是不是也提交報告給這邊給我 |
| transcript.whisperx[559].start |
15116.121 |
| transcript.whisperx[559].end |
15140.248 |
| transcript.whisperx[559].text |
好,我們讓轉型的工作更加的落實有更好的方法能夠確實做到好,謝謝部長那內政部這邊想問的是少府會目前現在看起來我們的那個工作人力什麼時候會到位因為目前少府會預計本來要聘280人那現在只有268人 |
| transcript.whisperx[560].start |
15143.718 |
| transcript.whisperx[560].end |
15148.504 |
| transcript.whisperx[560].text |
有時間期限?因為如果人力拼不足的話,大概沒有辦法把孩子接住。 |
| transcript.whisperx[561].start |
15161.258 |
| transcript.whisperx[561].end |
15175.76 |
| transcript.whisperx[561].text |
因為現在負險少年跟偏差型年都是進入到這體系來做處理嘛而且偏差型年行為的三字一跟三字二的等級又不太一樣尤其事實上是負險少年我們更為關心那是不是我不知道這什麼時候可以到位 |
| transcript.whisperx[562].start |
15177.049 |
| transcript.whisperx[562].end |
15193.488 |
| transcript.whisperx[562].text |
報告委員這部分因為我們也會就是盡量來跟他們那個各縣市請他們快加強來把這個聘除第二個問題要問是這個開案率就為什麼開案率會不到6成什麼樣評估會覺得他不需要開案 |
| transcript.whisperx[563].start |
15194.189 |
| transcript.whisperx[563].end |
15196.851 |
| transcript.whisperx[563].text |
通報到不開案有沒有漏接小孩這也讓我為之擔心所以是不是這一樣 |
| transcript.whisperx[564].start |
15210.422 |
| transcript.whisperx[564].end |
15233.092 |
| transcript.whisperx[564].text |
提出報告來下一頁再來就是整個偏差型少年的未開案這邊法規是講說應轉介相關資源來我們再看下一頁要轉介到哪邊去這張圖完全如果我今天按照你的工作流程來工作的話我不知道這些要轉介到哪裡去 |
| transcript.whisperx[565].start |
15234.812 |
| transcript.whisperx[565].end |
15247.544 |
| transcript.whisperx[565].text |
他如果沒有開案的話要轉到哪裡去又丟到社區去嗎那社區又沒有社工去可以接住他們如果又沒有跟我們的社政單位去連結的話到底孩子去哪邊那就加入幫派囉所以不知道這個圖你們自己有瞭解嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[566].start |
15252.055 |
| transcript.whisperx[566].end |
15275.31 |
| transcript.whisperx[566].text |
我們知道下面還有很長的一個那個流程但這個部分的話我們還是會就是轉給社工單位跟其他的這個政府單位我們會配合還有教育部下一頁這邊曝險剛才是因偏差行為的話是用因可是曝險少年卻用得可轉不可轉都可以曝險少年的問題點 |
| transcript.whisperx[567].start |
15276.611 |
| transcript.whisperx[567].end |
15305.407 |
| transcript.whisperx[567].text |
偏差行為更為嚴重的時候反而是用德轉支援或轉到其他一樣那張圖一樣是沒有寫下一頁所以麻煩這邊除了我前面剛剛講的兩個報告是不是在兩週內給我以外是不是盡數加強我們的少婦會的人力還有這些相關法規可不可以去討論一下調整迫顯少年這麼嚴重的狀態底下你用德然後反而另外一個偏差行為用因以上謝謝 |
| transcript.whisperx[568].start |
15307.488 |
| transcript.whisperx[568].end |
15331.207 |
| transcript.whisperx[568].text |
謝謝林委員、謝謝部長和局長接下來有請吳委員衝線有請吳叉緯你好,我們請部長上台有請蔡部長另外我想也請那個刑事局局長上台周局長請 |
| transcript.whisperx[569].start |
15336.457 |
| transcript.whisperx[569].end |
15363.625 |
| transcript.whisperx[569].text |
部長、局長兩位中午安首先我想要跟你們討論一下就是因為我們這次主要的議題是對於青少年犯罪的部分那這張圖表其實在上次院會質詢的時候我就使用過了也就是說目前對於預防少年犯罪呢法務部是掌握全國目前最多偵查資源的那我們從源頭打擊 |
| transcript.whisperx[570].start |
15365.083 |
| transcript.whisperx[570].end |
15379.822 |
| transcript.whisperx[570].text |
還有從末端的這個矯正教育的補救其實法務部都可以做很多事情那我主要是想要談到的就是目前我國法制面有沒有什麼可以有效這個嚇阻黑幫吸收少年 |
| transcript.whisperx[571].start |
15381.224 |
| transcript.whisperx[571].end |
15407.37 |
| transcript.whisperx[571].text |
在法制面我們組織犯罪防制條例也修法對於吸收青少年作為幫派的成員有一個單獨的處罰規定那本來在原來的很多的法規裡面對於成年利用青少年犯罪的話都有加重期刑的規定是好OK那但這個部分我想先說明一下就是有關黑幫 |
| transcript.whisperx[572].start |
15410.024 |
| transcript.whisperx[572].end |
15437.017 |
| transcript.whisperx[572].text |
受受年輕人的方式其實跟以前有點不太一樣那我上次在院會也有提到以前可能是在撞球間或電動玩具間那現在的話很多時候都是利用通訊軟體或者是用網路的方式去吸收所以這個部分在將來我們在修法的時候可能就要列入一個參考就是對於這個吸收的模式的改變將來我們在修法是不是有辦法去修正一些目前的做法能夠讓效果到更好 |
| transcript.whisperx[573].start |
15438.578 |
| transcript.whisperx[573].end |
15460.694 |
| transcript.whisperx[573].text |
我們現在講到就是部長那你知不知道就是您剛剛說到的是組織條例的第4條第3項就對於吸收未成年人的處罰那我想請教一下那你知不知道這幾年因為這樣的案件成年人被起訴定罪的比例件數你有知道嗎? |
| transcript.whisperx[574].start |
15462.914 |
| transcript.whisperx[574].end |
15483.866 |
| transcript.whisperx[574].text |
統計數字我們可以來提供好沒問題這個會後再提供給我就好了那依照警政署的報告其實這幾年從103年到112年平均少年的犯罪人口數大概每年是1萬人那到112年因為這個什麼擔任車手 |
| transcript.whisperx[575].start |
15489.196 |
| transcript.whisperx[575].end |
15500.571 |
| transcript.whisperx[575].text |
等等的這個其實112年查獲是2193這個真的是不低的一個數字那我是想請問一下部長在這些少年的這個處罰上面 |
| transcript.whisperx[576].start |
15502.694 |
| transcript.whisperx[576].end |
15525.612 |
| transcript.whisperx[576].text |
有一個很大的問題就是現在少年很多都是因為車手而被而出犯刑案可是我們抓車手的時候我們只抓到最基層的車手我們甚至連車手頭都抓不到也就是說你再回過頭去看組織犯罪條例他沒有一個持續性的結構因為你抓不到車手頭你永遠抓到只是最基層的那個行為人 |
| transcript.whisperx[577].start |
15526.773 |
| transcript.whisperx[577].end |
15553.752 |
| transcript.whisperx[577].text |
變成我們這種案直到最後都沒有辦法依現有的證據去勾擊然後讓他去用組織犯罪條例去處罰我不知道部長有沒有發現有這個狀況是,剛剛提到是法制面那另外這個執行面就是說你檢察官在偵辦這個案子的時候怎麼樣收集到相關的證據那向上溯源不能只抓到一個車手這基層的這些犯罪者而已上面的集團性的 |
| transcript.whisperx[578].start |
15554.372 |
| transcript.whisperx[578].end |
15571.479 |
| transcript.whisperx[578].text |
主謀才是更是我們要打擊的對象我再解釋一下部長就是說青少年犯罪我們現在發現很多都是跟車手有關那當然我們會很希望就是去破就是瓦解這些犯罪集團在利用這些未成年人 |
| transcript.whisperx[579].start |
15572.259 |
| transcript.whisperx[579].end |
15595.074 |
| transcript.whisperx[579].text |
可是對於犯罪集團的認定我們必須要有一個持續性的結構但是我們怎麼抓永遠都是只抓到最基層的車手我們連車手頭都抓不到更不要講後面的那個幕後的人也就是說我們抓了再多的這個車手我們也沒有辦法用組織犯罪條例去處罰任何成年人或者是其他的共犯 |
| transcript.whisperx[580].start |
15596.153 |
| transcript.whisperx[580].end |
15619.888 |
| transcript.whisperx[580].text |
就是抓到變成都是各案各案各案這樣子到最後都變成這樣子那我是這個部分我可能就是跟部長建議一下是不是部裡面也可以稍微研議一下這個部分要怎麼處理那再來就是延續我們剛剛說的其實這個組織犯罪條例第4條第3項這個對於未成年人就是招募未成年人的這個處罰 |
| transcript.whisperx[581].start |
15622.637 |
| transcript.whisperx[581].end |
15646.482 |
| transcript.whisperx[581].text |
我自己有去用那個判決去去搜尋關鍵字啊那我用招募未滿跟那個主治犯罪條例第4條我發現從108年到現在只有44件也就是說這個條文的他的立法的原意是不錯但是在執行上面似乎效果很不好 |
| transcript.whisperx[582].start |
15647.563 |
| transcript.whisperx[582].end |
15663.348 |
| transcript.whisperx[582].text |
否則你看現在嘛很多都是用未成年人去犯罪可是就像部長您剛說的我們現在確實有法制可以去處罰成年人招募未成年人來實施犯罪但是呢我們用這個關鍵字去查詢卻發現從108年到現在只有44件 |
| transcript.whisperx[583].start |
15668.47 |
| transcript.whisperx[583].end |
15692.646 |
| transcript.whisperx[583].text |
用這個條文去處罰所以這個效果是很不髒我想部長應該可以認同吧如果這個數字案看起來不是那麼成效好的話我們會來再加強尤其在檢察官的專業訓練上我們會互相來研習分享經驗那另外還有一個就是 |
| transcript.whisperx[584].start |
15693.507 |
| transcript.whisperx[584].end |
15719.635 |
| transcript.whisperx[584].text |
我們剛提到的是這第四條第三項對於招募未成年人的招募者的處罰那我在這邊也跟部長建議一下從書上面的角度我去看我覺得如果僅對於招募者去處罰的話其實是不夠的那是不是法務部能夠去研擬不能只對招募者去處罰而是應該去處罰到他這個犯罪集團的主事者 |
| transcript.whisperx[585].start |
15720.575 |
| transcript.whisperx[585].end |
15745.217 |
| transcript.whisperx[585].text |
因為現在招募者通常都是最底下的幹部比如說我剛剛講的車手那招募者就是車手頭但是車手頭在這個犯罪集團裡面也是一個非常低階的幹部結果高階的那些幹部甚至他這個組織犯罪的幕後金主或者是實際的這個操控者卻不在第4條的處罰範圍內那這個部分是不是麻煩部長能夠 |
| transcript.whisperx[586].start |
15746.818 |
| transcript.whisperx[586].end |
15773.432 |
| transcript.whisperx[586].text |
回去跟就是請同仁研擬討論一下看看有沒有辦法朝這個方向去修正好因為這實務上面我自己以前在辦案的時候我就發現有這個漏洞但是如果他的後面的主謀跟招募者這個是有共犯關係的話我們還是用共犯來處理但是委員的建議說如果除了招募者之上還有一個更嚴重的守摩者的話我們可以加重這個守摩者的處罰因為這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[587].start |
15774.853 |
| transcript.whisperx[587].end |
15791.116 |
| transcript.whisperx[587].text |
在實務上面很明顯嘛車手頭根本就不會是那個犯罪集團的主要的核心幹部那我們到最後處罰組織犯罪條例都變成是針對在那個招募者而漏掉了他背後的金主或者是主要的控制者 |
| transcript.whisperx[588].start |
15792.077 |
| transcript.whisperx[588].end |
15813.529 |
| transcript.whisperx[588].text |
那是不是說我們在法條上面也能夠研擬把這個加進去當然你說共同政法去處理也不是不行但是很多時候如果我們這個車手頭找不出來那你沒有辦法直接把後面主事者直接把他用行為人就直接把他處理嘛這一塊可能就麻煩部長這邊能夠稍微研擬一下 |
| transcript.whisperx[589].start |
15816.988 |
| transcript.whisperx[589].end |
15830.376 |
| transcript.whisperx[589].text |
還有一個就是我想提的一個就是組織犯罪條例第三條其實它其實規範的這些行為的太陽有一點就是我覺得沒有很完善就針對少年的部分 |
| transcript.whisperx[590].start |
15831.638 |
| transcript.whisperx[590].end |
15853.237 |
| transcript.whisperx[590].text |
所以我提供一個建議在兒少福利保障法第49條第一項其實有非常多這個行為人他對未成年的一些行為而去做一些行政法的太陽那將來我們在組織犯罪條例第三條的立法的我們可不可以思考一下是不是可以某程度的把49條這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[591].start |
15856.131 |
| transcript.whisperx[591].end |
15883.646 |
| transcript.whisperx[591].text |
一些行為太陽我們把它轉移植到組織犯罪條例裡面去增加對於未成年人的保障就是我們要去懲罰這些組織對於未成年的利用啦對他們一些行為這個部分我是沒有說很強烈的要求部長要馬上做但是是不是也可以請同仁稍微做一些研擬然後了解一下這個適不適合移植到我們的組織犯罪條例裡面好 |
| transcript.whisperx[592].start |
15885.778 |
| transcript.whisperx[592].end |
15911.708 |
| transcript.whisperx[592].text |
最後我想跟部長講一下時間也不夠了啦就是這個燉品學校這個事情那當然這是法務部這個主要的責任嘛那是不是說也可以去我們想要了解一下這個學校裡面他的一些課表還有目前是不是有這個輔導人員跟這個少年的這個比例 |
| transcript.whisperx[593].start |
15912.308 |
| transcript.whisperx[593].end |
15924.316 |
| transcript.whisperx[593].text |
是不是可以會後能夠給我們這一份資料我會請矯正署來準備好那還有一個就是因為這兩天這幾天有發生那個重大的食案而且導致的那個民眾死亡的案件 |
| transcript.whisperx[594].start |
15925.575 |
| transcript.whisperx[594].end |
15954.275 |
| transcript.whisperx[594].text |
那在偵查不公開的例外就是對於這個公益有重大這個關係的話他是可以適度的公開那因為這個東西對民眾其實有一點造成人心惶惶那是不是部長也可以請偵查機關在不違反不影響辦案的情況下能夠做適度的公開因為這個沒有違反偵查不公開好那這部分也請部長能夠幫忙一下好我們應該做的是好謝謝部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[595].start |
15955.438 |
| transcript.whisperx[595].end |
15966.569 |
| transcript.whisperx[595].text |
好謝謝吳釗偉謝謝蔡部長謝謝局長接下來有請徐委員新迎發言徐委員新迎徐委員不在有請萬委員美玲有請萬委員美玲萬委員美玲不在 |
| transcript.whisperx[596].start |
15968.157 |
| transcript.whisperx[596].end |
15987.775 |
| transcript.whisperx[596].text |
所有登記法院委員均已發言完畢。詢答結束委員質詢時,要求提供相關資料或以書面答覆者,請相關機關儘速提交、送交個別委員及本會。委員劉建國、張雅玲、陳冠廷所提書面質詢均列入記錄刊登公報,並請相關機關以書面答覆。 |
| transcript.whisperx[597].start |
15991.462 |
| transcript.whisperx[597].end |
16004.993 |
| transcript.whisperx[597].text |
好,那麼現在進行議程所列預算解凍案處理前,請議事委員一併宣讀報告事項及討論事項之預算解凍案。宣讀過程中與解凍案無關之列席機關代表可先行離席。請宣讀。 |
| transcript.whisperx[598].start |
16007.063 |
| transcript.whisperx[598].end |
16025.999 |
| transcript.whisperx[598].text |
報告事項第三案．法務部含為113年度中央政府總預算決議檢送最高檢查署決議一檢查業務預算凍結10萬元書面報告請查照案．討論事項第一案之第五案．法務部含為113年度中央政府總預算決議檢送該部決議一法務行政預算凍結200萬元書面報告決議六十三一般行政預 |
| transcript.whisperx[599].start |
16031.024 |
| transcript.whisperx[599].end |
16039.993 |
| transcript.whisperx[599].text |
預算凍結50萬元書面報告．決議六十四．法務行政預算凍結50萬元書面報告．檢訟矯正署及所屬決議一．一般行政預算凍結200萬元書面報告．決議二．一般事務費預算凍結250萬元書面報告請查詐案等5案。宣讀完畢。 |
| transcript.whisperx[600].start |
16055.397 |
| transcript.whisperx[600].end |
16066.902 |
| transcript.whisperx[600].text |
由於現在本會委員還在路途上,那請跟相關機關的代表先請稍坐。我們等到人數到了,我們就馬上進行處理。 |
| transcript.whisperx[601].start |
16316.881 |
| transcript.whisperx[601].end |
16343.956 |
| transcript.whisperx[601].text |
現在進行處理先處理報告事項有關法務部主管113年度預算解凍書面報告案也已列入議程報告並經宣讀作成如下決定準以備查提報院會請問有無異議沒有無異議通過好那麼接續進行討論事項第一至五案法務部主管113年度預算解凍案前以一併宣讀請問各位有無異議 |
| transcript.whisperx[602].start |
16346.411 |
| transcript.whisperx[602].end |
16357.653 |
| transcript.whisperx[602].text |
好那麼如依呢我們做如下決議均准與動之提報院會議程所列事項均已處理完畢會議到此結束現在散會謝謝大家 |