| 影片長度 |
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| 委員名稱 |
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| transcript.whisperx[0].start |
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主席有請郭智慧部長請郭部長委員好 郭部長好 國部長你最近的言論受到外界許多的矚目對菲律賓的綜綠電輸入台灣的方式我個人其實是深表贊同 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].start |
33.277 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].end |
50.869 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].text |
如果能夠再搭配這一個部分的這一個半導體低階的半導體的輸出甚至科學園區的這個輸出減少台灣內部的這個用電負擔我覺得從這戰略佈局來看的話應該是有一個通盤的經濟安全保障的概念吧部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].start |
51.932 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].end |
71.453 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].text |
是 報告委員 我想在談這個議題的時候說話不夠精準這一點造成大家的誤會 非常抱歉部長你不用跟我抱歉我認為這個構想其實值得討論的我是肯定的 不用抱歉 真的 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].start |
72.179 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].end |
98.993 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].text |
我覺得站在一個部長裡頭有一個宏觀的思考是正確的而且呢你如果有搭配一些的作為的話那是更好譬如講有一部分的情況底下在我們沒有辦法負載的這個產業當中可以建立一個科技外交然後同時部分的低階的產業的輸出可以達到全球的分工沒有影響到本地的這個產業競爭那何樂不為本來就是共享經濟不是嗎是謝謝委員 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].start |
101.325 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].end |
126.741 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].text |
對 然後部長我覺得你這個部分可以再深再進一步去思考一下更完整的時候我們再推出來好不好那相對於國內來說前兩 上個禮拜我本席在跟你質詢的問題當中我所在的你在新建這個天然氣發電廠的部分用自給率的部分本席無法贊同如果是用自給率的部分最低的話就是台北市那應該從台北市開始建才對啊不是嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].start |
127.722 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].end |
156.373 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].text |
而且本席調出來我不曉得你們經濟部哪一位是自己大做主張明明在電業登記規則當中你要登記電業要簽PPA的部分要有五項規定喔電業登記規則裡頭第三條裡頭寫得很清楚結果呢你們像大豬大魚啊就給他放寬成三項就可以了簽了PPA之後呢好像這個業者呢就一直往前抽 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].start |
157.318 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].end |
183.614 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].text |
也就造成現在這個爭議一個很重要的源頭我慎重的再度的提醒這個部長不要重蹈天然氣只有KPI的這個覆測會引起更多的民怨你以後到時候天然氣你更難推動部長你有沒有像剛剛有些委員質詢的感同身受我是不是可以請這個能源署長不要我不要請他回答這都是KPI小組的啦 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].start |
184.875 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].end |
201.065 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].text |
對阿 我就說你可能還搞不清楚狀況阿我就提醒你阿 是下面的人在害你阿 對阿他在害我們阿 對阿怎麼可以亂設 對這要達到標準以後他們升官了欸結果是倒楣的是你跟我欸 對阿 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].start |
209.392 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].end |
230.525 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].text |
老實講大部分的天然氣都是工業用電75%一般的民眾他其實用電只有佔25%以台南來說就你要叫一般的生活在那邊來承擔這不公平嘛那以前的自給率比較高的部分呢那是什麼時代相對是威權的時代啊現在要蓋一個電廠有那麼容易嗎 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].start |
231.69 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].end |
257.255 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].text |
是不是?部長所以說呢再來說的話以台南的市集率最近又增加了深壩二期也開始啟動了而且增加1.1GW這種情況底下他的整個能源承擔沒有增加嗎?更何況原來的水庫高雄都沒有水庫全部的水庫都在台南水的支援也是一種負擔啊太陽能氣股也是啊也是一種負擔啊不是嗎? |
| transcript.whisperx[10].start |
258.561 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].end |
276.998 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].text |
都負擔那麼多了更何況再講白一點以興達發電廠距離台南市政府14公里距離高雄市政府40公里含怪了整個康沃範圍30公里台南沒有分攤到這一個能源的負擔嗎也有啊誰在誤導你你知道嗎誰在誤導你是左邊右邊是誰前面還是後面 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].start |
286.684 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].end |
315.754 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].text |
部長是你不要被害死還不曉得啊是這業務的狀況你要徹底的去掌握啊所以部長依照這些整個規則你應該恢復到原來的電業電業登記的這些登記規則的第三條沒有五個不能有簽PPA你要給那個能源署說你要跟台電說是誰製作主張的是誰大廚大爺你去查清楚造成民間的困擾 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].start |
318.015 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].end |
343.315 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].text |
已經叫他退了還在重來好像非見不可有那麼大的企圖嗎背後有什麼原因你去調查清楚是不是有不可告人的秘密哪有這種事情而且還不只一個後面還有一個寶村都沒有地方跑了是不是你調來台南不可是不是是誰指示的 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].start |
344.568 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].end |
372.395 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].text |
部長 你去查清楚而且你也不要害那些業者跟著你傻傻的一直衝要有退場機制現在業者之所以不願意退場還會死灰復燃的原因就是有一筆違約金在那邊哪一筆違約金是誰讓他掉入那個陷阱的就是五變成三個規則嘛 到底是誰嘛有沒有退場機制嘛所以說這個東西你要了解清楚啦 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].start |
373.442 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].end |
386.156 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].text |
好的好不好好把這個退場情勢弄清楚不要再讓這些公共議題製造地方的困擾讓所有問題在那邊打轉毫無意義可言阿部長回去好好思考一下謝謝是謝謝 |
| 會議時間 |
2024-10-16T09:00:00+08:00 |
| 委員發言時間 |
11:47:12 - 11:53:38 |
| 會議名稱 |
立法院第11屆第2會期經濟委員會第5次全體委員會議（事由：邀請經濟部部長率台灣電力股份有限公司董事長就「我國電力能源配比執行現況與未來規劃」進行報告，並備質詢。） |
| gazette.lineno |
783 |
| gazette.blocks[0][0] |
郭委員國文：（11時47分）主席，有請郭智輝部長。 |
| gazette.blocks[1][0] |
主席：請郭部長。 |
| gazette.blocks[2][0] |
郭部長智輝：委員好。 |
| gazette.blocks[3][0] |
郭委員國文：郭部長好。郭部長，你最近的言論受到外界許多矚目，對在菲律賓種綠電輸入臺灣的方式，我個人其實是深表贊同，如果能夠再搭配部分的低階半導體的輸出，甚至是科學園區的輸出，減少臺灣內部的用電負擔，我覺得從戰略布局來看的話，應該是有一個通盤的經濟安全保障的概念吧？部長。 |
| gazette.blocks[4][0] |
郭部長智輝：是，報告委員，我想我在談這個議題的時候，說話不夠精準，這一點造成大家的誤會，非常抱歉。我們的構想其實是在於所謂的民主同盟…… |
| gazette.blocks[5][0] |
郭委員國文：部長，你不用跟我抱歉，我認為這個構想其實是值得討論的，我是肯定的，不用抱歉，真的。我覺得站在部長的立場，有一個宏觀的思考是正確的，而且你如果有搭配一些作為是更好，譬如講有一部分的情況底下，在我們沒有辦法負載的產業當中，可以建立各科技外交，然後同時部分的低階產業輸出，可以達到全球分工，沒有影響到本地的產業競爭，何樂而不為？本來就是共享經濟，不是嗎？ |
| gazette.blocks[6][0] |
郭部長智輝：是，謝謝委員。 |
| gazette.blocks[7][0] |
郭委員國文：部長，我覺得你這個部分可以再進一步去思考一下，更完整的時候再推出來，好不好？ |
| gazette.blocks[8][0] |
郭部長智輝：是。 |
| gazette.blocks[9][0] |
郭委員國文：相對於國內來說，上個禮拜五本席在跟你質詢的問題當中，我說實在的，你在興建天然氣發電廠的部分是用自給率，本席無法贊同，如果是用自給率，最低的就是臺北市，應該從臺北市開始建才對啊！不是嗎？而且本席調出來，我不曉得你們經濟部是哪一位自己大作主張啦！明明在電業登記規則當中，你要登記電業、要簽PPA的部分，要有5項規定喔！電業登記規則第三條裡頭寫得很清楚，結果你們不知道是誰「大主大意」，把它放寬成3項就可以了，簽了PPA之後，好像業者就一直往前衝，也就是造成現在的爭議一個很重要的源頭。 |
| gazette.blocks[9][1] |
我慎重地、再度地提醒部長，不要重蹈天然氣只有KPI的覆徹，會引起更多的民怨，到時候天然氣你更難推動，部長，你有沒有像剛剛有些委員質詢的感同身受？ |
| gazette.blocks[10][0] |
郭部長智輝：是，我是不是可以請能源署長…… |
| gazette.blocks[11][0] |
郭委員國文：我不要請他回答，這些都是KPI小組的啦！我是說你可能還搞不清楚狀況，我是在提醒你啊！ |
| gazette.blocks[12][0] |
郭部長智輝：是。 |
| gazette.blocks[13][0] |
郭委員國文：下面的人在害你啊！他還在害我們啊！怎麼可以亂設？這要達到標準以後是他們升官，結果倒楣的是你跟我耶！我們都姓郭，不可以隨便讓它過，你聽懂沒有？ |
| gazette.blocks[14][0] |
郭部長智輝：謝謝委員。 |
| gazette.blocks[15][0] |
郭委員國文：對啊！所以天然氣的部分，老實講，大部分的天然氣都是工業用電75%，一般民眾用電其實只有占25%，以臺南來說，結果你要叫一般生活在那邊的人來承擔，這不公平嘛！以前是在自給率比較高的部分，那是什麼時代？相對是威權的時代啊！現在你要蓋一個電廠有那麼容易嗎？是不是？ |
| gazette.blocks[15][1] |
再來，以臺南的自給率來說，最近又增加了森霸二期，也開始啟動了，而且增加了1.1GW，這種情況底下，它的整個能源承擔沒有增加嗎？更何況高雄沒有水庫，全部的水庫都在臺南，水的資源也是一種負擔啊！太陽能對七股也是啊！也是一種負擔啊！不是嗎？都負擔那麼多了。再講白一點，以興達發電廠為例，距離臺南市政府14公里，距離高雄市政府40公里，涵蓋了整個空污的範圍30公里，臺南沒有分攤到這一個能源的負擔嗎？也有啊！誰在誤導你？你知道嗎？誰在誤導你？是左邊還是右邊？是誰？前面還是後面？部長，你不要被害死還不曉得啊！ |
| gazette.blocks[16][0] |
郭部長智輝：是。 |
| gazette.blocks[17][0] |
郭委員國文：這個業務的狀況你要澈底地去掌握啊！所以部長，整個規則，你應該恢復到原來的電業登記規則第三條，沒有5個不能簽PPA，你要跟能源署說，你要跟台電說。是誰自作主張的？是誰「大主大意」的？你去查清楚。 |
| gazette.blocks[18][0] |
郭部長智輝：好。 |
| gazette.blocks[19][0] |
郭委員國文：造成民間的困擾，已經叫它退了還再重來，好像非建不可，有那麼大的企圖嗎？背後有什麼原因，你去調查清楚。 |
| gazette.blocks[20][0] |
郭部長智輝：是，我們會深入瞭解。 |
| gazette.blocks[21][0] |
郭委員國文：是不是有不可告人的秘密？哪有這種事情！而且還不只一個，後面還有一個寶椿，都沒有地方跑了是不是？一定要來臺南不可，是不是？是誰指示的？部長，你去查清楚。 |
| gazette.blocks[22][0] |
郭部長智輝：好。 |
| gazette.blocks[23][0] |
郭委員國文：而且你也不要害那些業者跟著你傻傻地一直衝，要有退場機制，現在業者之所以不願意退場，還會死灰復燃的原因就是有一筆違約金在那邊啦！那一筆違約金是誰讓它掉入那個陷阱的？就是5變成3個規則嘛！到底是誰嘛？有沒有退場機制嘛？所以說這個東西你要去瞭解清楚啦！ |
| gazette.blocks[24][0] |
郭部長智輝：好的。 |
| gazette.blocks[25][0] |
郭委員國文：好不好？ |
| gazette.blocks[26][0] |
郭部長智輝：好！ |
| gazette.blocks[27][0] |
郭委員國文：把這個退場機制弄清楚，不要再讓這些公共議題製造地方的困擾，讓所有問題在那邊打轉，毫無意義可言啊！部長，回去好好思考一下，謝謝。 |
| gazette.blocks[28][0] |
郭部長智輝：是，謝謝。 |
| gazette.blocks[29][0] |
主席：請賴士葆委員質詢。 |
| gazette.agenda.page_end |
304 |
| gazette.agenda.meet_id |
委員會-11-2-19-5 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[0] |
呂玉玲 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[1] |
林岱樺 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[2] |
邱議瑩 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[3] |
張嘉郡 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[4] |
羅智強 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[5] |
楊瓊瓔 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[6] |
鄭正鈐 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[7] |
陳亭妃 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[8] |
賴瑞隆 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[9] |
張啓楷 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[10] |
鄭天財Sra Kacaw |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[11] |
邱志偉 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[12] |
謝衣鳯 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[13] |
陳超明 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[14] |
郭國文 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[15] |
賴士葆 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[16] |
萬美玲 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[17] |
蔡易餘 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[18] |
洪孟楷 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[19] |
黃國昌 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[20] |
王育敏 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[21] |
陳昭姿 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[22] |
高金素梅 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[23] |
廖偉翔 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[24] |
黃健豪 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[25] |
葉元之 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[26] |
翁曉玲 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[27] |
牛煦庭 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[28] |
涂權吉 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[29] |
何欣純 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[30] |
徐富癸 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[31] |
徐欣瑩 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[32] |
林思銘 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[33] |
陳冠廷 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[34] |
王鴻薇 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[35] |
傅崐萁 |
| gazette.agenda.page_start |
209 |
| gazette.agenda.meetingDate[0] |
2024-10-16 |
| gazette.agenda.gazette_id |
1138401 |
| gazette.agenda.agenda_lcidc_ids[0] |
1138401_00009 |
| gazette.agenda.meet_name |
立法院第11屆第2會期經濟委員會第5次全體委員會議紀錄 |
| gazette.agenda.content |
邀請經濟部部長率台灣電力股份有限公司董事長就「我國電力能源配比執行現況與未來規劃」進
行報告，並備質詢 |
| gazette.agenda.agenda_id |
1138401_00017 |
| IVOD_ID |
155566 |
| IVOD_URL |
https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/155566 |
| 日期 |
2024-10-16 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼 |
委員會-11-2-19-5 |
| 會議資料.屆 |
11 |
| 會議資料.會期 |
2 |
| 會議資料.會次 |
5 |
| 會議資料.種類 |
委員會 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼[0] |
19 |
| 會議資料.標題 |
第11屆第2會期經濟委員會第5次全體委員會議 |
| 影片種類 |
Clip |
| 開始時間 |
2024-10-16T11:47:12+08:00 |
| 結束時間 |
2024-10-16T11:53:38+08:00 |
| 支援功能[0] |
ai-transcript |
| 支援功能[1] |
gazette |