| IVOD_ID |
153643 |
| IVOD_URL |
https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/153643 |
| 日期 |
2024-06-05 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼 |
委員會-11-1-15-22 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼:str |
第11屆第1會期內政委員會第22次全體委員會議 |
| 會議資料.屆 |
11 |
| 會議資料.會期 |
1 |
| 會議資料.會次 |
22 |
| 會議資料.種類 |
委員會 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼[0] |
15 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼:str[0] |
內政委員會 |
| 會議資料.標題 |
第11屆第1會期內政委員會第22次全體委員會議 |
| 影片種類 |
Clip |
| 開始時間 |
2024-06-05T12:31:03+08:00 |
| 結束時間 |
2024-06-05T12:37:19+08:00 |
| 影片長度 |
00:06:16 |
| 支援功能[0] |
ai-transcript |
| 支援功能[1] |
gazette |
| video_url |
https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/18e54f584c581c98ebd3304636052256155b271690f57e8efc6f3e651eb00659828b4faf1e99e5f65ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8 |
| 委員名稱 |
楊瓊瓔 |
| 委員發言時間 |
12:31:03 - 12:37:19 |
| 會議時間 |
2024-06-05T09:00:00+08:00 |
| 會議名稱 |
立法院第11屆第1會期內政委員會第22次全體委員會議（事由：一、「詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案」：(一)審查行政院函請審議「詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案」案。(二)審查台灣民眾黨黨團擬具「詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案」案。(三)審查委員陳亭妃等16人擬具「詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案」案。【第(二)案、第(三)案如未經各黨團簽署不復議同意書則不予審查。】二、「宗教團體以自然人名義登記不動產處理暫行條例」：(一)審查委員張嘉郡等21人擬具「宗教團體以自然人名義登記不動產處理暫行條例第五條條文修正草案」案。(二)審查委員吳琪銘等19人擬具「宗教團體以自然人名義登記不動產處理暫行條例第五條條文修正草案」案。(三)審查委員王美惠等17人擬具「宗教團體以自然人名義登記不動產處理暫行條例第五條條文修正草案」案。(四)審查委員林岱樺等18人擬具「宗教團體以自然人名義登記不動產處理暫行條例第五條條文修正草案」案。(五)審查委員陳亭妃等16人擬具「宗教團體以自然人名義登記不動產處理暫行條例第五條條文修正草案」案。【第(二)案至第(五)案如未經各黨團簽署不復議同意書則不予審查。】三、「海洋保育法草案」：(一)繼續審查行政院函請審議「海洋保育法草案」案。(二)繼續審查委員楊瓊瓔等20人擬具「海洋保育法草案」案。(三)繼續審查委員伍麗華Saidhai Tahovecahe等16人擬具「海洋保育法草案」案。(四)繼續審查委員王美惠等17人擬具「海洋保育法草案」案。(五)繼續審查委員黃捷等18人擬具「海洋保育法草案」案。(六)繼續審查委員羅廷瑋等18人擬具「海洋保育法草案」案。(七)繼續審查委員鄭天財Sra Kacaw等19人擬具「海洋保育法草案」案。(八)繼續審查委員蘇巧慧等16人擬具「海洋保育法草案」案。(九)繼續審查委員羅美玲等17人擬具「海洋保育法草案」案。(十)繼續審查委員許宇甄等20人擬具「海洋保育法草案」案。(十一)繼續審查委員莊瑞雄等20人擬具「海洋保育法草案」案。(十二)繼續審查委員洪申翰等16人擬具「海洋保育法草案」案。(十三)繼續審查台灣民眾黨黨團擬具「海洋保育法草案」案。(十四)繼續審查委員賴瑞隆等18人擬具「海洋保育法草案」案。(十五)繼續審查委員高金素梅等22人擬具「海洋保育法草案」案。(十六)繼續審查委員陳亭妃等16人擬具「海洋保育法草案」案。(十七)繼續審查委員蔡易餘等19人擬具「海洋保育法草案」案。(十八)繼續審查委員吳琪銘等18人擬具「海洋保育法草案」案。） |
| gazette.lineno |
1233 |
| gazette.blocks[0][0] |
楊委員瓊瓔：（12時31分）謝謝主席，楊瓊瓔發言，我們再請部長。 |
| gazette.blocks[1][0] |
主席：請部長。 |
| gazette.blocks[2][0] |
劉部長世芳：楊委員你好。 |
| gazette.blocks[3][0] |
楊委員瓊瓔：部長好。打詐讓我們很憂心，政府成立打詐國家隊，打詐四法也一直在研擬，但是我們似乎發覺口號越多，案件越多，甚至連看守所、監獄裡頭所增加的人大多是以詐欺犯為主，讓我們很憂心，這是從末端來看整個過程，那這怎麼辦呢？謝謝今天主席的安排，直接來討論打詐四法要怎麼去做，我們可以看到，從111年6月份實施打詐綱領開始，我們發覺到這個問題的嚴重性，除了在你們所說的宣導教育面堵詐，然後從電信系統再來阻詐，追查贓款的流向，再來是懲詐，也就是偵查打擊面。我們希望刑罰增加，但是抓到了這個人，他卻沒錢，我抓到人，檢警調很辛苦的抓到了，但是他沒錢，對於民眾來講是一大損失，抓到了他沒錢也沒用。監獄的人越來越多是詐欺犯，在這樣的情況之下，本席要請教，在111年我們全面認知到這個問題的嚴重性，112年開始推動人口販運的防制、洗錢防制法、個人的個資保護、證券投資信託及顧問法，這一些法律訂出來，就是為了因應目前社會所需要。我們也看到你們所提出的1.5版以減害為主，本席認為這非常消極。針對你們的三面減政策，也就是減少接觸、減少誤信、減少損害，甚至剛剛部長所回答的，要讓志工到偏鄉去告訴這一些歐巴桑、歐吉桑，讓他知道打詐專線165怎麼打。數位部也努力在推動，預計要有專案出來，app很快就會出來。在這樣的情況下，本下還是要請教部長，目前的社會面向是非常非常的嚴謹，無孔不入，我們要怎麼辦？ |
| gazette.blocks[4][0] |
劉部長世芳：在預防面的部分，其實真的是要全民一起來防止才有用，相信楊委員也非常清楚，不是只有偏鄉，包括在很多都會地區，尤其是善用網路的人，他們都會接收到這種詐欺或詐騙的電話，或是網路或是其他LINE的訊息，所以我們推出新的詐欺四法，最主要就是我們的行政系統怎麼樣利用法律授權的部分，形成一個好的聯防網路，這才是我們目前最大的重點。 |
| gazette.blocks[5][0] |
楊委員瓊瓔：部長，你所講的還有一個重點，你有注意到嗎？所有的系統，比如說警政署的刑案資訊系統、智慧分析的決策等支援的系統，還有你們自己165反詐騙系統的平臺，這一些資料如果流出去，那更嚴重喔！有沒有圍堵？ |
| gazette.blocks[6][0] |
劉部長世芳：這邊的資料會流出去？不會啊！我們只是收案的窗口啊！ |
| gazette.blocks[7][0] |
楊委員瓊瓔：部長，你新聞都沒在看啊！所以我提出這一點，AI的系統可以去正面偵防詐騙，但是它也有一個反向，所以建議部長，當你在思考問題的時候，要思考根源從哪裡來？您剛剛一再回答說怎麼可能會流出去…… |
| gazette.blocks[8][0] |
劉部長世芳：不是這個意思…… |
| gazette.blocks[9][0] |
楊委員瓊瓔：有流出去啊，社會新聞你知道啊！所以在這樣的情況之下，就誠如你說的，我們希望大家一起來、全民一起來全面的圍堵，這樣才是真正的全面圍堵，您的看法呢？警政署要不要說一說？ |
| gazette.blocks[10][0] |
張署長榮興：剛剛委員所提的不管是我們的e化、刑案的資料系統或者165，這些都是我們公務的資料，這絕對嚴禁流出，流出去就違法了，所以這部分我們會非常嚴謹，絕對不會把我們的這些資料流出去。未來打詐四法通過之後，各部會會協同讓打詐這件事讓人民有感。 |
| gazette.blocks[11][0] |
楊委員瓊瓔：對，因為警察很辛苦，所以我要跟部長說的是希望你們正面、反面你都要去思考，因為在你還沒就任部長以前，我相信你擔任民意代表的時候，你也認知到這種情況真的很普遍，民眾很傷腦筋，所以我們也希望藉由你在行政及民意基礎上面都非常的充足，可以進行正面、反面的思考，讓民眾真正有感，要不然我看到連監獄、看守所的人數增加都是以詐騙犯、詐欺犯為主，民眾情何以堪呢？所以我們一起加油，好不好？謝謝。 |
| gazette.blocks[12][0] |
主席：謝謝楊瓊瓔委員的質詢。 |
| gazette.blocks[12][1] |
下一位請張嘉郡委員、張嘉郡委員、張嘉郡委員不在。 |
| gazette.blocks[12][2] |
鍾佳濱委員、鍾佳濱委員、鍾佳濱委員不在。 |
| gazette.blocks[12][3] |
林楚茵委員、林楚茵委員、林楚茵委員不在。 |
| gazette.blocks[12][4] |
鄭正鈐委員、鄭正鈐委員、鄭正鈐委員不在。 |
| gazette.blocks[12][5] |
李柏毅委員、李柏毅委員、李柏毅委員不在。 |
| gazette.blocks[12][6] |
請黃國昌委員質詢。 |
| gazette.agenda.page_end |
302 |
| gazette.agenda.meet_id |
委員會-11-1-15-22 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[0] |
吳琪銘 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[1] |
黃珊珊 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[2] |
王美惠 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[3] |
陳亭妃 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[4] |
蘇巧慧 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[5] |
張宏陸 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[6] |
牛煦庭 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[7] |
麥玉珍 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[8] |
黃建賓 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[9] |
許宇甄 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[10] |
黃捷 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[11] |
高金素梅 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[12] |
張智倫 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[13] |
丁學忠 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[14] |
徐欣瑩 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[15] |
李坤城 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[16] |
王鴻薇 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[17] |
鄭天財Sra Kacaw |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[18] |
洪孟楷 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[19] |
羅廷瑋 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[20] |
沈伯洋 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[21] |
黃秀芳 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[22] |
楊瓊瓔 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[23] |
黃國昌 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[24] |
鍾佳濱 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[25] |
李柏毅 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[26] |
羅智強 |
| gazette.agenda.page_start |
1 |
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2024-06-05 |
| gazette.agenda.gazette_id |
1135901 |
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1135901_00002 |
| gazette.agenda.meet_name |
立法院第11屆第1會期內政委員會第22次全體委員會議紀錄 |
| gazette.agenda.content |
一、「詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案」：(一)審查行政院函請審議「詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案」
案、(二)審查台灣民眾黨黨團擬具「詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案」案、(三)審查委員陳亭妃等16
人擬具「詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案」案；二、「宗教團體以自然人名義登記不動產處理暫行條
例」：(一)審查委員張嘉郡等21人擬具「宗教團體以自然人名義登記不動產處理暫行條例第五條
條文修正草案」案、(二)審查委員吳琪銘等19人擬具「宗教團體以自然人名義登記不動產處理暫
行條例第五條條文修正草案」案、(三)審查委員王美惠等17人擬具「宗教團體以自然人名義登記
不動產處理暫行條例第五條條文修正草案」案、(四)審查委員林岱樺等18人擬具「宗教團體以自
然人名義登記不動產處理暫行條例第五條條文修正草案」案、 ( 五) 審查委員陳亭妃等16 人擬具
「宗教團體以自然人名義登記不動產處理暫行條例第五條條文修正草案」案（後接第二冊） |
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二、三、四、五、六、七、八、八、九、十、九、十、九、十、九、十、九、十、九、十、九、十、九、十、九、十、九、十、九、十、九、十、九、十、九、十、九、十、九、十、九、十、九、十、九、十、九、十、九、十、九、十、九、十、九、十、九、十、九、十、九、十、九、十、九、十、九、十、九、十、九、十、九、十、九、十、九、十、九、十、九、十、九、十、九、十、九、十、九、十、九、十、九、十、九、十、九、十、九、十、九、十、九、十、九、十、九、十、九、十、九、十、 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].start |
32.348 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].end |
36.412 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].text |
連這個監獄裡頭所增加的人數以詐欺犯為主。 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].start |
38.102 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].end |
64.94 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].text |
這個讓我們用心末端來看整個過程那這怎麼辦呢本席也看到今天謝謝今天的主席來直接來討論這個打詐無法要怎麼去做打詐釋法要怎麼去做所以我們看到從111年6月份開始打詐綱領開始我們發覺到這個問題的嚴重性除了在你們所說的宣導教育面、賭詐 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].start |
66.821 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].end |
76.771 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].text |
審查委員陳亭妃等16人擬具:「詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案案件、詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案件、詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案件、 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].start |
87.847 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].end |
101.593 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].text |
我抓到這個人我們很辛苦的警察檢警調抓到了但是沒錢對於民眾來講是一大損失是一大損失抓到了沒錢沒用 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].start |
102.731 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].end |
112.045 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].text |
審查委員陳亭妃等16人擬具:「詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案案件、詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案件、詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案件、詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案件、詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案件、 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].start |
118.908 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].end |
141.776 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].text |
人口販運的防治、洗錢防治法、個人的個資保護、證券投資信託以及他的顧問法,這一些的法律出來也就因應目前社會所需要,真的是所需要。我們也看到你們所提出的 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].start |
144.134 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].end |
167.205 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].text |
這個1.5版以減害為主本席認為這非常的消極因為你的三面檢政策減少接觸減少誤信減少損害甚至剛剛部長你回答的要到偏鄉讓志工去告訴這些歐巴桑歐里桑他知道165怎麼打打詐的這個要怎麼打數位部也努力在推動預計要有這個 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].start |
170.026 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].end |
176.634 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].text |
二、三、四、五、六、七、八、八、九、十、九、十、九、十、九、十、九、十、九、十、十、九、十、十、十、十、十、十、十、十、十、十、十、十、十、十、十、十、十、十、十、十、十、十、十、十、十、十、十、十、十、十、十、十、十、十、十、十、十、十、 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].start |
184.588 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].end |
200.369 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].text |
我們要怎麼辦請教部長在預防面的部分其實真的是要全民一起來防止才有用跟楊偉永也非常清楚不是只有偏鄉包括很多在都會地區尤其是善用這個網路的人 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].start |
201.05 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].end |
209.754 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].text |
審查委員陳亭妃等16人擬具:「詐欺犯罪危害防制條例草案案件事宜、詐欺犯罪案件事宜、詐欺犯罪案件事宜、詐欺犯罪案件事宜、詐欺犯罪案件事宜、詐欺犯罪案件事宜、詐欺犯罪案件事宜、詐欺犯罪案件事宜、詐欺犯罪案件事宜、詐欺犯罪案件事宜、詐欺犯罪案件事宜、詐欺犯罪案件事宜、 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].start |
227.501 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].end |
252.956 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].text |
智慧分析的決策支援的系統還有我們自己165反詐騙系統的一個平台那這一些如果資料流出去哇那更嚴重喔有沒有圍堵有沒有圍堵這邊的資料會流出去不會啊這個是我們只是收案的窗口啊普黨你新聞都沒在看啊新聞都沒在看啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].start |
254.372 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].end |
281.265 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].text |
所以我提出這一點也就是陳儒AI的系統可以去正面偵防詐騙但是他也有一個反向所以當建議給部長當你在思考問題的時候根源從哪裡來您剛才一直回答說怎麼可能會流出去有流出去啊社會新聞你知道啊所以在這樣的一個情況之下 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].start |
282.409 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].end |
297.756 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].text |
我們希望就陳寧你說的,全面大家一起來,全面一起來,全面的圍堵。這才可以,才是真正的這個,這個全面的圍堵。您的看法呢?警政署你要不要說說? |
| transcript.whisperx[14].start |
299.397 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].end |
328.158 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].text |
那剛剛委員所提的就是不管我們的異化啦、刑案的這個資料系統或者是165這個都是我們的這個公務的資料絕對嚴禁流出,流出就違法了所以這部分我們事實是會做嚴謹的絕對不會把我們的這些資料流向出去那未來那我們這個打詐是否過之後我們各部委會協同來讓打詐這件事讓人民有感 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].start |
329.478 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].end |
353.271 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].text |
對,因為警察很辛苦所以我給部長說的就是說希望正面反面你都要去思考因為從你還沒就任部長以前我相信你當了民意代表的時候你也認知到真的很普遍民眾很傷腦筋所以我們也希望介於您在行政在 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].start |
354.875 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].end |
374.98 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].text |
民意基礎上面都非常的充足可以正面反面的一個思考讓民眾真正的是有感要不然真的我看到連監獄、看守所的人數增加都以詐騙犯、詐欺犯為主那民眾情何以堪呢 對不對所以我們一起加油好不好 謝謝好 謝謝楊瓊英委員的資訊 |