| IVOD_ID |
150469 |
| IVOD_URL |
https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/150469 |
| 日期 |
2024-03-27 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼 |
聯席會議-11-1-15,23-1 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼:str |
第11屆第1會期內政、交通委員會第1次聯席會議 |
| 會議資料.屆 |
11 |
| 會議資料.會期 |
1 |
| 會議資料.會次 |
1 |
| 會議資料.種類 |
聯席會議 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼[0] |
15 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼[1] |
23 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼:str[0] |
內政委員會 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼:str[1] |
交通委員會 |
| 會議資料.標題 |
立法院第11屆第1會期內政、交通委員會第1次聯席會議 |
| 影片種類 |
Clip |
| 開始時間 |
2024-03-27T10:25:54+08:00 |
| 結束時間 |
2024-03-27T10:36:16+08:00 |
| 影片長度 |
00:10:22 |
| 支援功能[0] |
ai-transcript |
| 支援功能[1] |
gazette |
| video_url |
https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/9baf490faf5eb4d58a4a5bbce268a063e53fb40122520aebf8ba9b0039caa7a6092a24a2ed30116a5ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8 |
| 委員名稱 |
王美惠 |
| 委員發言時間 |
10:25:54 - 10:36:16 |
| 會議時間 |
2024-03-27T09:00:00+08:00 |
| 會議名稱 |
立法院第11屆第1會期內政、交通委員會第1次聯席會議（事由：審查「行人交通安全設施條例草案」(一)行政院函請審議「行人交通安全設施條例草案」案。(二)委員黃捷等16人擬具「行人交通安全設施條例草案」案。【上開議案如經院會復議，則不予審查】） |
| gazette.lineno |
456 |
| gazette.blocks[0][0] |
王委員美惠：（10時26分）部長，我們直接來討論，你也知道我來自哪裡，嘉義市，因為你們規劃永續經營做一個人行道專用區，所需經費總total聽起來，全臺灣平均分配，400億不算很多，不過對嘉義市來說，很需要關愛的眼神。在這裡本席要跟部長和署長探討，在這個過程當中，剛才我們有同事說人行道有大、小條之分，依照你們的規定，差不多在1.5公尺的範圍之內，本席在嘉義市的時候，對中央的補助，王美惠給讚，不過，在這個過程當中其實很擾民，百姓很不方便，因為嘉義市大部分市民都騎摩托車，有人行道規範之後，有的不習慣，變成摩托車和汽車在那邊爭道行駛，政府的美意不要被打折了，因為百姓陳情的時候都說：「王美惠，這是你們中央說的，要做這樣。」我說中央是補助地方，希望把人行道做好一點，不是要讓汽車、機車駕駛人難行。署長，你應該知道是哪一條嘉義市的道路吧？來，你解釋一下。 |
| gazette.blocks[1][0] |
吳署長欣修：跟委員報告，確實過去道路沒有人行道的時候，我們有設機車專用道，設計人行道之後，市政府就把機車專用道撤掉，變成人行道。 |
| gazette.blocks[2][0] |
王委員美惠：你知道嘉義市騎車的人有多少嗎？ |
| gazette.blocks[3][0] |
吳署長欣修：瞭解。 |
| gazette.blocks[4][0] |
王委員美惠：所以你被罵死了。 |
| gazette.blocks[5][0] |
吳署長欣修：我向委員報告，當然這是一個過程，在這個過程中大家要互相學習，過去因為沒有人行道，你也可以說沒人行道走路不方便，加上大家都騎摩托車習慣了，自然會覺得沒人行道沒什麼，但現在變成有人行道之後，確實可能有人會覺得走路比較方便，這是一個過程。第二…… |
| gazette.blocks[6][0] |
王委員美惠：對啦，署長，我現在要跟你探討的是，交通規則大家都要遵守啦，包括走路的人、騎摩托車的人、開車的人都是要遵守這些規矩，我現在是跟你說，你要做的時候，人行道做得這麼大，老實說一天沒幾個人會走，只有機車跟汽車在那邊，尤其上下班的時候，在興嘉公園附近，非常危險，這不是習慣不習慣的問題，而是你要建設的時候，你要想到嘉義市的鄉親騎摩托車的有多少，包括本席也騎摩托車，我去那邊看的時候，他們說：「王美惠，不要說你騎摩托車，你也要想到我們騎摩托車載小孩的人。他們有時候開車來，門一開多危險！」 |
| gazette.blocks[6][1] |
署長，因為今天我們所講的是要讓人行道做得更好，據本席瞭解，這幾年在你們的報告裡面，嘉義市的交通沒有變好，反而更差，事故一年一年一直增加。署長，我們花這些錢是希望我們的交通能改善，但我卻看不到成效，有的人罵的要死，說你們要尊重行人走的路，這是百分之百要尊重的，我們的長輩走斑馬線，我們也要尊重他，這就是尊重。不過最重要的是你尊重我、我尊重你，最近走斑馬線的人慢慢走，在那裡滑手機、看手機。所以每一個單位都環環相扣，你們也要知會教育部，你們所有的設施，以嘉義為例，學校附近的人行道就只有國小一間、國中一間，既然你們要做，也做多間一點，儘速改善。 |
| gazette.blocks[7][0] |
吳署長欣修：第一，我們會加強。第二，向委員報告，設計上，我覺得嘉義市政府就要去考慮這邊用路人的習慣，所以這個設計的調整，確實過程中要多聽一些民眾的意見，以中央政府來說，我雖然補助給你，過去我們是用一年一年在算績效，我是覺得給地方多一點時間，跟民眾做一個溝通…… |
| gazette.blocks[8][0] |
王委員美惠：當然啊！ |
| gazette.blocks[9][0] |
吳署長欣修：所以在中央的部分已經改成兩年，就是讓你多一些時間溝通，做出比較好的設計。 |
| gazette.blocks[10][0] |
王委員美惠：署長，本席就是要跟你說，要聽地方的聲音和專家的聲音，我們都要聽，這是沒錯，只是我覺得你錢這樣花，以嘉義市來說，有發生車禍的地方，我相信中央的補助要讓它改善，有時候也是補貼到百分之百，不過如果常常發生車禍，卻沒有提出改善的時候，尤其A1的地方，你要怎麼處理？署長你回答一下，A1應該聽得懂吧？ |
| gazette.blocks[11][0] |
吳署長欣修：聽得懂。 |
| gazette.blocks[12][0] |
王委員美惠：因為你是內行的、做道路的。 |
| gazette.blocks[13][0] |
吳署長欣修：我跟委員報告，我們過去這幾年做的危險路口，我自己有統計過，有做過的其實肇事率都減少百分之四十幾，但是…… |
| gazette.blocks[14][0] |
王委員美惠：可是那些沒做的地方車禍更多、更嚴重啦！ |
| gazette.blocks[15][0] |
吳署長欣修：第一，我們會再向市政府要求，應該要將這些肇事率高的、有A1死亡車禍的優先列入來改善。 |
| gazette.blocks[16][0] |
王委員美惠：部長，如果當地縣市不提出，譬如嘉義的忠孝路口、保健街，還有在友愛路、民族路、博愛路的轉角，他們如果不提出改善的時候，要怎麼做？ |
| gazette.blocks[17][0] |
林部長右昌：我們會把相關的資訊公開，讓社會知道這個狀況。 |
| gazette.blocks[18][0] |
王委員美惠：好，你們要說來申請對大家都好，對安全也好，地方也出一點…… |
| gazette.blocks[19][0] |
林部長右昌：地方政府要積極。 |
| gazette.blocks[20][0] |
王委員美惠：我要跟部長、署長說，你們要和教育部多聯繫，本席去年有提到學校旁邊人行道的改善，到目前為止，有很多學校都不知道，當嘉義市有的不知道的時候，你們也要去聯絡教育部，這樣這些錢才可以發揮到最好。 |
| gazette.blocks[21][0] |
林部長右昌：這個事情可能不是從教育部下去，後來我上任之後，因為這個事情我給每一位縣市長寫一封信，直接讓市長知道有這些地方你必須要做改善，然後你沒有改善、沒有提案。 |
| gazette.blocks[22][0] |
王委員美惠：有時候縣市長沒說，包括本席去學校找校長，他不知道這件事情可以補助，所以本席在這裡跟你說，一定要由教育部去聯繫學校，若能做的要做啦！ |
| gazette.blocks[23][0] |
林部長右昌：這個是要由市政府提案，所以…… |
| gazette.blocks[24][0] |
王委員美惠：我知道啦！提案就是跟學校說有這些錢，你們要提出建議。 |
| gazette.blocks[25][0] |
林部長右昌：我們去年就是從教育局下去。 |
| gazette.blocks[26][0] |
王委員美惠：去年當發生這個問題的時候，學校拿出地方教育處的，但有很多間不知道，我的意思是說，就算你們編了400億，若是不知道、不做的，也是沒用啦！以上。 |
| gazette.blocks[27][0] |
主席：謝謝王美惠委員的質詢。現在休息5分鐘。 |
| gazette.blocks[27][1] |
休息（10時36分） |
| gazette.blocks[27][2] |
繼續開會（10時43分） |
| gazette.blocks[28][0] |
主席：現在繼續開會。 |
| gazette.blocks[28][1] |
請黃健豪委員質詢。 |
| gazette.agenda.page_end |
152 |
| gazette.agenda.meet_id |
聯席會議-11-1-15,23-1 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[0] |
吳琪銘 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[1] |
黃捷 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[2] |
黃建賓 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[3] |
蘇巧慧 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[4] |
李昆澤 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[5] |
張宏陸 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[6] |
牛煦庭 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[7] |
麥玉珍 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[8] |
許宇甄 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[9] |
王美惠 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[10] |
黃健豪 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[11] |
林俊憲 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[12] |
蔡其昌 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[13] |
徐富癸 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[14] |
何欣純 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[15] |
林沛祥 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[16] |
楊瓊瓔 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[17] |
徐欣瑩 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[18] |
廖先翔 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[19] |
吳思瑤 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[20] |
黃珊珊 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[21] |
游顥 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[22] |
洪申翰 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[23] |
李柏毅 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[24] |
陳冠廷 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[25] |
吳沛憶 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[26] |
陳素月 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[27] |
魯明哲 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[28] |
黃仁 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[29] |
劉建國 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[30] |
林國成 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[31] |
張智倫 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[32] |
丁學忠 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[33] |
林月琴 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[34] |
張雅琳 |
| gazette.agenda.page_start |
1 |
| gazette.agenda.meetingDate[0] |
2024-03-27 |
| gazette.agenda.gazette_id |
1132101 |
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1132101_00002 |
| gazette.agenda.meet_name |
立法院第11屆第1會期內政、交通委員會第1次聯席會議紀錄 |
| gazette.agenda.content |
審查「行人交通安全設施條例草案」(一)行政院函請審議「行人交通安全設施條例草案」案；
(二)委員黃捷等16人擬具「行人交通安全設施條例草案」案 |
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| transcript.whisperx[0].start |
0.049 |
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0.57 |
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主席,我們這裡... 喔! |
| transcript.whisperx[1].start |
0.57 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].end |
0.73 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].text |
失敗了! |
| transcript.whisperx[2].start |
0.73 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].end |
1.491 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].text |
阿偉請你開,你再開啦! |
| transcript.whisperx[3].start |
21.158 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].end |
24.299 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].text |
來來來,這樣來,我們直接來討論。在這裏面喔,你也知道我來自哪裡嘛,嘉義市嘛。因為我們的區委裏面有說永續去經營做一個人行道的專用區嘛,在這裏面的經費。 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].start |
44.751 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].end |
55.324 |
| transcript.whisperx[4].text |
當然是總統都聽起來﹐若轉台灣來本﹐不說很多事罷了﹐要不然對自己來說﹐就需要關愛的眼神﹐在這裏面本是要把我們保證﹐ |
| transcript.whisperx[5].start |
61.943 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].end |
64.065 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].text |
探討,我們的署長探討,在這個規定當中,我們的人行道一走的時候,有剛才我們的董事說的,有人行道大小條, |
| transcript.whisperx[6].start |
77.216 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].end |
80.659 |
| transcript.whisperx[6].text |
在審查的當中,您的規定就說,我們就差不多做到1.5個月這個範圍嘛。在本席第12期的時候,對於中央的部署,王美惠2戰。 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].start |
96.527 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].end |
104.132 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].text |
然而在這個規定當初的時候,是很流氓的,又覺得說擺盛會不方便。因為當時台北人都騎摩托車很多,在你的人生到來,幾返年後,再來,有的沒習慣,你擺盛摩托車,跟他去車,在那小鎮就下去騎。 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].start |
124.79 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].end |
128.138 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].text |
男人免疫不要被打折了。 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].start |
129.178 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].end |
137.004 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].text |
別去抱著你啦!因為若被審在前面的選,就說王美惠這你們中央說的,要做這樣,跟我說中央是補助給他們的黨啦!聯席黨做好!不是要去這裡跟去這裡的人!你不要站起來啦!在這兩天,稍後你應該聽到本席講待一條假日期的道路吧!來你解說一下! |
| transcript.whisperx[10].start |
158.161 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].end |
159.583 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].text |
向委員報告啦,確實啦,都過去我們這個道路沒進行道的時候,我們有轉設這個機車的轉用道啦。 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].start |
168.939 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].end |
168.959 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].text |
議員黃碧雲 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].start |
189.201 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].end |
192.144 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].text |
委員黃捷等16人擬具:「行人交通安全設施條例草案：立法院第11屆第1會期內政、交通委員會復議 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].start |
214.304 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].end |
214.324 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].text |
議員黃碧雲議員 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].start |
231.229 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].end |
233.971 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].text |
在那裡,尤其你如果上下班的時候你去看,尤其在現場跟公務員會議,那是非常危險的,這不是習慣跟沒有習慣的,這是你要建設的時候,你也要想到,家裡自己的鄉親騎摩托車有多少,包括平時也騎摩托車。 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].start |
253.639 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].end |
260.41 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].text |
我去那邊的時候跟王美惠不要說你去澳大利亞你也想到我們去澳大利亞的在地人他會有時候開車來 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].start |
264.246 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].end |
266.407 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].text |
委員黃捷等16人擬具:「行人交通安全設施條例草案．則不予審查則不予審查 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].start |
284.585 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].end |
285.465 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].text |
不予審查．則不予審查．則不予審查．則不予審查．則不予審查 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].start |
312.452 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].end |
317.936 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].text |
斑馬線,我們也要尊重它走,我們這就是尊重,嚴重最重要的,是你尊重我,我尊重你。現在最近,走斑馬線的人,慢慢走,手機在那邊看,在那邊看,所以說,我們這附近每一個單位都款款相扣,你也要智慧, |
| transcript.whisperx[19].start |
341.295 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].end |
342.696 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].text |
委員黃捷等16人擬具 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].start |
367.037 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].end |
372.983 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].text |
總之設計上啦,設計上我認為這在自己自動的要考慮,自己自政府就要去考慮,我們現在這邊擁有人的習慣。所以這個設計的條件確實過程中要給聽過民眾的意見。在中央政府來說啦,我雖然補助給你過去,我們是用一年一年在算你的績效。我是認為讓地方給你一點點時間, |
| transcript.whisperx[21].start |
391.561 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].end |
394.685 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].text |
韓民眾做一個溝通所以我已經在中央立法院是改做兩檔比較靠日子的說給你給一段時間溝通做出比較好的設計 因為師傅我現在就是要跟你說要聽對應的聲音跟專家的聲音我們都要聽這是沒有錯這是我覺得說 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].start |
408.402 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].end |
410.042 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].text |
議員黃捷等16人擬具:「行人交通安全設施條例草案．則不予審查 »: |
| transcript.whisperx[23].start |
435.417 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].end |
440.642 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].text |
委員應該聽到嘛,因為你來行的,做道路的,你來行的我跟委員報告啦,我們過去這幾天做的這個危險路口啦,我自己有統計過啦就是說其實這個造勢率是都減少了40幾%,哪有做過的 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].start |
452.998 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].end |
461.084 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].text |
但是我現在說……但是我現在說……但是我現在說……但是我現在說……但是我現在說……但是我現在說……但是我現在說……但是我現在說……但是我現在說……但是我現在說……但是我現在說……但是我現在說……但是我現在說……但是我現在說……但是我現在說……但是我現在說……但是我現在說……但是我現在說……但是我現在說……但是我現在說……但是我現在說……但是我現在說……但是我現在說……但是我現在說……但是我現在說……但是我現在說……但是我現在說……但是我現在說……但是我現在說……但是我現在說……但是我現在說……但是我現在說……但是我現在說……但是我現在說……但是我現在說……但是我現在說……但是我現在說……但是我現在說……但是我現在說……但是我現在說……但是我現在說……但是我現在說……但是我現在說……但是我現在說……但是我現在說 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].start |
480.797 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].end |
486.561 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].text |
委員黃捷等16人擬具:「行人交通安全設施條例草案．則不予審查則不予審查則不予審查．則不予審查．則不予審查．則不予審查⋯⋯ |
| transcript.whisperx[26].start |
508.254 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].end |
510.595 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].text |
委員黃捷等16人擬具:「行人交通安全設施條例草案．則不予審查則不予審查則不予審查 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].start |
537.469 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].end |
542.212 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].text |
議員黃捷等16人擬具《行人交通安全設施條例草案》案。議員黃捷等16人擬具《行人交通安全設施條例草案》 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].start |
563.948 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].end |
566.431 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].text |
委員黃捷等16人擬具:「行人交通安全設施條例草案：立法院第11屆第1會期內政、交通委員會第1次聯席會議．則不予審查 ．則不予審查 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].start |
583.23 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].end |
586.191 |
| transcript.whisperx[29].text |
委員黃,這個是要由市政府提案。 我知道啦!提案的時候就是我們學校說有我們這裡的資料,你們要提出建議嘛! |
| transcript.whisperx[30].start |
586.191 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].end |
588.651 |
| transcript.whisperx[30].text |
我知道啦!因為本身就是正當發生這個問題的時候,他們的學校提出他們的教育資料啦! |
| transcript.whisperx[31].start |
605.596 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].end |
606.276 |
| transcript.whisperx[31].text |
主席王美惠 |