| IVOD_ID |
150198 |
| IVOD_URL |
https://ivod.ly.gov.tw/Play/Clip/1M/150198 |
| 日期 |
2024-03-21 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼 |
委員會-11-1-19-4 |
| 會議資料.會議代碼:str |
第11屆第1會期經濟委員會第4次全體委員會議 |
| 會議資料.屆 |
11 |
| 會議資料.會期 |
1 |
| 會議資料.會次 |
4 |
| 會議資料.種類 |
委員會 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼[0] |
19 |
| 會議資料.委員會代碼:str[0] |
經濟委員會 |
| 會議資料.標題 |
第11屆第1會期經濟委員會第4次全體委員會議 |
| 影片種類 |
Clip |
| 開始時間 |
2024-03-21T09:36:19+08:00 |
| 結束時間 |
2024-03-21T09:47:12+08:00 |
| 影片長度 |
00:10:53 |
| 支援功能[0] |
ai-transcript |
| 支援功能[1] |
gazette |
| video_url |
https://ivod-lyvod.cdn.hinet.net/vod_1/_definst_/mp4:1MClips/1be549810cdc305270e833c62dab89b2e8dac5750a339bf8f8ba9b0039caa7a6f94a74b1c6866ca55ea18f28b6918d91.mp4/playlist.m3u8 |
| 委員名稱 |
陳亭妃 |
| 委員發言時間 |
09:36:19 - 09:47:12 |
| 會議時間 |
2024-03-21T09:00:00+08:00 |
| 會議名稱 |
立法院第11屆第1會期經濟委員會第4次全體委員會議（事由：一、邀請經濟部部長就「當前供水情勢檢討及因應措施」進行報告，並備質詢。
二、審查113年度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算營業部分關於經濟部主管：台灣自來水股份有限公司。(詢答)） |
| gazette.lineno |
239 |
| gazette.blocks[0][0] |
陳委員亭妃：（9時36分）謝謝主席。我們請部長。 |
| gazette.blocks[1][0] |
主席：再請王部長。 |
| gazette.blocks[2][0] |
王部長美花：委員好！ |
| gazette.blocks[3][0] |
陳委員亭妃：部長好！部長，我想先跟你探討三個問題，第一個問題是全國還有多少無自來水的地區？ |
| gazette.blocks[4][0] |
賴署長建信：各縣市都有…… |
| gazette.blocks[5][0] |
陳委員亭妃：對啊…… |
| gazette.blocks[6][0] |
賴署長建信：全國大概是40萬戶左右。 |
| gazette.blocks[7][0] |
陳委員亭妃：40萬戶。 |
| gazette.blocks[8][0] |
賴署長建信：對。 |
| gazette.blocks[9][0] |
陳委員亭妃：全國都有嘛！ |
| gazette.blocks[10][0] |
賴署長建信：對。 |
| gazette.blocks[11][0] |
陳委員亭妃：總共是40萬戶嘛！ |
| gazette.blocks[12][0] |
賴署長建信：對。 |
| gazette.blocks[13][0] |
陳委員亭妃：好，那臺南地區有多少戶？ |
| gazette.blocks[14][0] |
賴署長建信：將近7,000戶左右。 |
| gazette.blocks[15][0] |
陳委員亭妃：將近7,000戶。我們在這一次前瞻預算所謂的水環境有去cover了一些？ |
| gazette.blocks[16][0] |
賴署長建信：對。 |
| gazette.blocks[17][0] |
陳委員亭妃：那還有7,000戶？ |
| gazette.blocks[18][0] |
賴署長建信：對。 |
| gazette.blocks[19][0] |
陳委員亭妃：直轄市耶！六都耶！臺南還有7,000戶喔！ |
| gazette.blocks[20][0] |
賴署長建信：這個是我們在努力的目標，臺南市的戶數在六都裡面是相對比較少的。 |
| gazette.blocks[21][0] |
陳委員亭妃：比較少的。 |
| gazette.blocks[22][0] |
賴署長建信：對，包括還有一些偏鄉，我們要努力。 |
| gazette.blocks[23][0] |
陳委員亭妃：在六都裡面相對比較少，所以其他五都還有很多無自來水，你看，大家可能很難想像，怎麼可能？臺灣，尤其還是六都，還有這麼多無自來水，很難想像！但是只有我們自己知道，真的很多！而且我們還看到有很多老舊管線，對不對？是不是？ |
| gazette.blocks[24][0] |
賴署長建信：是。 |
| gazette.blocks[25][0] |
陳委員亭妃：那些有的都已經30、40年了，我也很感謝！這一次在我自己的選區其實做了很多，就是汰舊換新的部分，為什麼要汰舊換新？因為你知道那個加壓馬達一顆比一顆大，越水尾的地方越大顆，結果抽完之後，前面所有的水都被抽走了，所以為什麼要做汰舊換新？因為不得不做，水管的直徑真的40年前與現在相比差太遠了！以前用戶數也沒那麼多，現在用戶數很多，一個接一個，一個接一個。關於我們的汰舊換新，我要問，我不要問全國，全國的那個數字可能很恐怖，臺南的老舊管線超過30、40年的有多少？老舊管線，你們有去統計過嗎？ |
| gazette.blocks[26][0] |
李董事長嘉榮：跟委員報告…… |
| gazette.blocks[27][0] |
陳委員亭妃：董事長，你說。 |
| gazette.blocks[28][0] |
李董事長嘉榮：我們臺南地區逾齡的管線大概54%左右，這個逾齡就是正常的塑膠管…… |
| gazette.blocks[29][0] |
陳委員亭妃：所謂54%是什麼意思？ |
| gazette.blocks[30][0] |
李董事長嘉榮：就是我臺南地區的總管線長度有54%是…… |
| gazette.blocks[31][0] |
陳委員亭妃：是30、40年的。 |
| gazette.blocks[32][0] |
李董事長嘉榮：一般塑膠管是20年就逾齡了。 |
| gazette.blocks[33][0] |
陳委員亭妃：逾齡是20年啦！ |
| gazette.blocks[34][0] |
李董事長嘉榮：對，塑膠管是20年，金屬管大概可以用40年。 |
| gazette.blocks[35][0] |
陳委員亭妃：20年是逾齡，那你們會不會去查比20年還更逾齡的有多少？不要說20年的，20年的要叫你們換是困難啦！比20年還要逾齡的有多少？沒有統計過嘛！把數字統計一下。 |
| gazette.blocks[35][1] |
我在講都是實質的，都是實質的，當時我們安南區汰換就是30、40年的，所以你們用很快的速度去做了處理，安南區還是屬於縣市合併之後比較市區的，如果在我們原臺南縣的地方，我相信那個管線是逾齡還要逾齡還要逾齡，所以我覺得還是要統計一下，因為這關係到我們的生活品質，還會牽扯到管線是不是會漏水的問題，其實整個是串在一起的，你說用了30、40年，那個水管不會漏水，不可能嘛！所以我覺得我們要做一個總盤檢，臺南做總盤檢，這個部分再麻煩一下。 |
| gazette.blocks[35][2] |
然後我們現在其實期待的都是我們的前瞻，我們前瞻真的幫我們的水環境做了很多，我為什麼要特別提到這個？因為時間要到了，後面要怎麼辦？還這麼多，還這麼多，怎麼辦？ |
| gazette.blocks[36][0] |
賴署長建信：報告委員，部長已經指示我們研擬新的計畫…… |
| gazette.blocks[37][0] |
陳委員亭妃：研擬新的計畫。 |
| gazette.blocks[38][0] |
賴署長建信：這個新的計畫已經提出來，已經送到院裡面去了。 |
| gazette.blocks[39][0] |
陳委員亭妃：已經送到院裡面，獨立的計畫？ |
| gazette.blocks[40][0] |
賴署長建信：無自來水的改善，獨立的計畫。 |
| gazette.blocks[41][0] |
陳委員亭妃：獨立的計畫，無自來水獨立的改善計畫…… |
| gazette.blocks[42][0] |
賴署長建信：對。 |
| gazette.blocks[43][0] |
陳委員亭妃：不再是併到誰裡面，是一個無自來水的獨立計畫，那我覺得我們一些盤整的資料就要非常的齊全…… |
| gazette.blocks[44][0] |
賴署長建信：是，當然。 |
| gazette.blocks[45][0] |
陳委員亭妃：這個就要麻煩一下，如果你這些資料沒有齊全，你根本不知道到底要從哪邊先下手，這就會牽扯到大家常常說的自來水管會漏水的問題，所以我覺得這個是一定要做，而且必要做，肯定要優先來做，這關係到我們的水環境及我們的生活品質。 |
| gazette.blocks[45][1] |
再來，馬上要進入我們的枯水期，還好這段時間還有一點雨，可是未來怎麼樣不知道，最好是還是都有持續，而且可以下到我們的水庫，這是我們大家的期待，可是總是沒有辦法那麼如意，我們要講如果枯水的狀況再發生一次，我們準備好了嗎？ |
| gazette.blocks[46][0] |
賴署長建信：準備好了。 |
| gazette.blocks[47][0] |
陳委員亭妃：準備好了，臺南用水是愈來愈多耶！ |
| gazette.blocks[48][0] |
賴署長建信：是。 |
| gazette.blocks[49][0] |
陳委員亭妃：所有的工業，從南科到所有工業區，其實用水量是越來越多，而且我們南科也不斷地擴廠，也不斷地擴大我們的基地，所以在這個部分我們要怎麼樣做調節，才能避免缺水，否則現在農業都休耕，其實現在已經不是很正常的狀態…… |
| gazette.blocks[50][0] |
賴署長建信：沒有、沒有，報告委員，區域的珍珠串計畫在臺南地方曾文與南化今年6月之前會完成，再生水的部分也如計畫進度在做，產業的用水絕對不會排擠到我們農民的用水，今年這個水情雖然氣象局預報是正常偏低，但是我們已經成立了應變小組，而且我們週週在檢討，所以這個部分我們會努力。 |
| gazette.blocks[51][0] |
陳委員亭妃：署長，我們當然都希望所謂水的部分不會影響到我們的民生、農業，一定是這樣，可是每一次只要缺水，農業部就跟你說，又要開始，把整個休耕期延長，要怎麼做調節。大家一定會覺得怎麼又是這個樣子。我不知道是不是剛剛好，要不然怎麼每次你們講不會影響，可是事實上我們在政策當中都要做配套，所以一定是會影響，不會不影響，可是我們要怎麼未雨綢繆，剛剛我們署長有講了，現在白河、曾文相關的一些工程都會陸續完工，對不對？ |
| gazette.blocks[52][0] |
賴署長建信：是。 |
| gazette.blocks[53][0] |
陳委員亭妃：陸續完工之後，整個水庫的狀態就可以比較好，我也只能說比較好，因為這淤積的狀況實在很難去評估，這個部分我們能夠掌握多少？白河、曾文、烏山頭、南化水庫整個清淤的效果我們可以掌握多少？ |
| gazette.blocks[54][0] |
賴署長建信：我提供一個數據，在110年之前，曾文水庫一年清淤差不多60萬，現在我們一年清淤超過300萬立方的淤泥。基本上我們對清淤是加大力度，特別是在這幾年，不管是臺南的水庫──曾文跟白河，其他全國各地也是如此實施，除此之外，曾文水庫也是全國第一個完成防淤隧道的水庫。 |
| gazette.blocks[55][0] |
陳委員亭妃：對於這些工程我們花了重要的工程經費下去，我們就希望真的能夠達到我們預期的。還有我們的再生水，這個再生水很清楚就是給工業區──南科用的，他們在整個擴廠完之後，希望能夠趕快加入，整體提升臺南地區供水的穩定，這個很重要。 |
| gazette.blocks[56][0] |
賴署長建信：對。 |
| gazette.blocks[57][0] |
陳委員亭妃：這個要儘快完成，尤其我們現在希望陸續是113年底，就是今年底，所以在今年是搭不上，因為他們都是年底才會完工，所以今年變成一個關鍵，在這些工程都還沒有到達能夠加入這個供水穩定的系統裡面，我們要怎麼讓人民安心，這個就很重要。所以拜託，工程做了，再生水也加入了，那麼在這一段緩衝期，我們怎麼讓人民安心？再拜託，辛苦了，謝謝。 |
| gazette.blocks[58][0] |
主席：謝謝。接下來請謝衣鳯委員詢答。 |
| gazette.agenda.page_end |
236 |
| gazette.agenda.meet_id |
委員會-11-1-19-4 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[0] |
楊瓊瓔 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[1] |
林岱樺 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[2] |
陳亭妃 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[3] |
謝衣鳯 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[4] |
張啓楷 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[5] |
鄭天財Sra Kacaw |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[6] |
呂玉玲 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[7] |
張嘉郡 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[8] |
賴瑞隆 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[9] |
鄭正鈐 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[10] |
陳超明 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[11] |
邱志偉 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[12] |
賴士葆 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[13] |
洪孟楷 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[14] |
徐欣瑩 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[15] |
鍾佳濱 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[16] |
黃珊珊 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[17] |
黃國昌 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[18] |
王鴻薇 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[19] |
何欣純 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[20] |
陳冠廷 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[21] |
蔡易餘 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[22] |
邱議瑩 |
| gazette.agenda.speakers[23] |
劉建國 |
| gazette.agenda.page_start |
169 |
| gazette.agenda.meetingDate[0] |
2024-03-21 |
| gazette.agenda.gazette_id |
1131801 |
| gazette.agenda.agenda_lcidc_ids[0] |
1131801_00008 |
| gazette.agenda.meet_name |
立法院第11屆第1會期經濟委員會第4次全體委員會議紀錄 |
| gazette.agenda.content |
一、邀請經濟部部長就「當前供水情勢檢討及因應措施」進行報告，並備質詢；二、審查113年
度中央政府總預算案附屬單位預算營業部分關於經濟部主管：台灣自來水股份有限公司。（詢
答） |
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1131801_00013 |
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請陳亭妃委員請做詢答謝謝主席我們請部長我們再請王部長 |
| transcript.whisperx[1].start |
25.012 |
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部長,我想先跟你探討三個問題。第一個問題是全國還有多少無自來水的地區?各縣市都有? |
| transcript.whisperx[2].start |
39.082 |
| transcript.whisperx[2].end |
63.371 |
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對阿 全國大概是40萬戶左右40萬戶 對全國都有嘛 對然後總共是40萬戶嘛 對好 那台南地區有多少戶好 將近7000戶左右將近7000戶我們在這一次前瞻預算所謂的這個水環境然後去cover了有一些 對那還有7000戶 對直轄市欸六都欸直轄市台南還有7000戶 |
| transcript.whisperx[3].start |
67.292 |
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93.044 |
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這是我們在努力的目標,在台南市的負數是在六都裡面是相對比較少的。比較少的?對,不過還有一些偏向,包括我們。所以六都相對比較少,所以其他五都還很多,五自來水。所以你看,大家可能很難想像說,哇,怎麼可能台灣尤其還是六都,還有這麼多五自來水。 |
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94.329 |
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103.754 |
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很難想像但是只有我們自己知道真的很多而且我們還看到說有很多老舊管線對不對 |
| transcript.whisperx[5].start |
105.879 |
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106.94 |
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是不是? |
| transcript.whisperx[6].start |
106.94 |
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126.011 |
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那位已經都三四十年了,我也很感謝啦在這一次在我自己的選區其實做了很多啦就是這個太舊換新的部分啦為什麼要太舊換新?因為你知道那個水壓馬達一顆比一顆大越水沒的地方越大顆還要抽到的時候我頭上整個水都會有抽到 |
| transcript.whisperx[7].start |
134.795 |
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162.296 |
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所以為什麼要做太久換薪因為不得不做那個水管水管的直徑真的過去40年前到現在差太多了啦以前用護手也沒那麼多現在用護手很多所以一個接一個一個接一個所以我們的太久換薪我要問有趣我不要問專家專家放那個手裡很恐怖啦台南 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].start |
163.53 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].end |
172.022 |
| transcript.whisperx[8].text |
台南這個老舊管線,那超過三四十年有多少?老舊管線你有去統計過嗎? |
| transcript.whisperx[9].start |
181.229 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].end |
198.915 |
| transcript.whisperx[9].text |
我們台灣地區液磷的管線大概54%左右。這個液磷就是說正常的塑膠管。所謂54%是什麼意思?我台灣地區的總管線長度有54%是三四十年的。液磷一般是20年塑膠管20年就液磷。 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].start |
200.973 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].end |
202.114 |
| transcript.whisperx[10].text |
二十年還要易領的有多少? |
| transcript.whisperx[11].start |
226.037 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].end |
226.057 |
| transcript.whisperx[11].text |
韓國瑜議員 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].start |
249.684 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].end |
274.805 |
| transcript.whisperx[12].text |
現實合併之後比較市區的那如果在我們原台南線的地方我相信那個管線是一零還要一零還要一零啊所以我覺得還是要統計一下因為這關係到我們的生活品質然後還會牽扯到管線是不是會漏水的問題其中 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].start |
276.127 |
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305.223 |
| transcript.whisperx[13].text |
整個是串在一起的你做一零的三、四十年以他的水供沒漏水不可能嘛所以我覺得我們要做一個總盤檢台南做總盤檢所以這個部分再麻煩一下然後我們現在其實期待都是我們的前瞻其實我們前瞻真的幫我們的這個水環境做了很多啦 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].start |
306.488 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].end |
308.229 |
| transcript.whisperx[14].text |
所以為什麼要特別提到這個? |
| transcript.whisperx[15].start |
308.229 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].end |
326.296 |
| transcript.whisperx[15].text |
有時間要搞啊?啊後面要怎麼辦?還這麼多?還這麼多怎麼辦?報告委員部長已經指示我們研擬新的計畫,這個新的計畫已經提出來,然後已經送到院裡面去了。已經送到院裡面?獨立的計畫? |
| transcript.whisperx[16].start |
328.276 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].end |
353.004 |
| transcript.whisperx[16].text |
無自來水的改善 獨立的計畫無自來水獨立的改善計畫不再是病到水裡面是一個無自來水獨立的計畫那我覺得我們的一些盤整的資料就要非常的齊全是當然這個就要麻煩一下如果你這些資料沒有齊全你根本不知道我到底要從哪邊先下手 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].start |
354.653 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].end |
380.666 |
| transcript.whisperx[17].text |
那常常這就牽扯到大家都會說主來水的老水的問題主來水供的老水的問題所以我覺得這個是一定要做而且必要做肯定要優先來做這關係到我們的水環境跟我們的生活品質那再來就是馬上馬上馬上要進入我們的枯水期 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].start |
382.386 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].end |
408.801 |
| transcript.whisperx[18].text |
好到知道這段時間還有稍微好呢可是如果未來怎麼樣不知道最好是還是都有持續啦持續可以落在我們的嘴口這是我們大家期待可是總是沒有辦法那麼如意啊好我們要講如果枯水的狀況再發生一次我們準備好了嗎準備好了 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].start |
410.632 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].end |
434.221 |
| transcript.whisperx[19].text |
大陸人的水是越來越多。 是。稍微感覺從南科到所有工業區其他的用水量是越來越多而且我們南科也不斷的擴廠然後也不斷的擴大我們的基地所以在這個部分我們要怎麼樣做調節才能避免否則你現在農業都休耕啊 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].start |
435.615 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].end |
458.119 |
| transcript.whisperx[20].text |
至於現在其實已經不是很正常的狀態?報告委員那個區域的珍珠串計畫在台南的地方曾文跟南化今年6月之前會完成再生水的部分也在如計畫進度在做那產業的用水絕對不會排擠到我們農民的用水那今年這個水情雖然說氣象局預報是正常偏低 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].start |
458.679 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].end |
462.301 |
| transcript.whisperx[21].text |
蘇長我們當然都希望我們的所謂水的部分不會影響到我們的民生農業一定是這樣可是每一次只要缺水 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].start |
481.654 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].end |
502.651 |
| transcript.whisperx[22].text |
農業部就跟你講我要開始然後把整個休耕期延長然後要怎麼做調解大家一定會覺得說怎麼又是這個樣子所以我不知道是剛剛好啦要不然怎麼每一次你們講不會影響可是事實上我們在政策當中都要做配套所以 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].start |
503.717 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].end |
526.463 |
| transcript.whisperx[23].text |
一定是會影響 不會不影響可是我們要怎麼未雨綢繆剛剛我們署長有講的就是說我們現在白河、真雲這個相關的一些工程都會陸續完工 對不對陸續完工之後我們就可以把整個水庫的狀態比較好 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].start |
529.52 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].end |
543.866 |
| transcript.whisperx[24].text |
比較好我也只能說比較好啦因為這預計的狀況實在很難去評估啦好那這個部分我們能夠掌握多少白河、真雲、烏山頭、南化、水庫整個清淤的效果我們可以掌握多少 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].start |
546.338 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].end |
573.333 |
| transcript.whisperx[25].text |
我提供一個數據在110年之前曾文水庫一年清淤超過60萬現在我們一年清淤超過300萬吨300萬立方的淤泥基本上我們對淤泥清淤是加大力度特別是在這幾年不管是台南的水庫曾文跟白河其他全國各地也是如此實施除此之外曾文水庫也是全國第一個完成防疫隧道的水庫 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].start |
574.574 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].end |
600.755 |
| transcript.whisperx[26].text |
所以我們希望這些工程我們花了重要的重要工程經費下去我們就希望真的能夠達到我們預期的然後還有我們的再生水這再生水清楚就是給江亞空營的啦南科啦好他們在這個整個擴產完之後希望能夠趕快加入我們的整個提升台南地區供水的穩定 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].start |
602.017 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].end |
621.535 |
| transcript.whisperx[27].text |
這個很重要這個要盡快完成尤其我們現在陸續都希望是113年底的今年年底啦所以在今年是搭不上嘛因為他們都是年底才會完工啦所以在這一個我要講的是今年變成是我們一個很關鍵的 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].start |
623.899 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].end |
624.059 |
| transcript.whisperx[28].text |
好避憾 |